First I would like to start off with the ecnomic system.
Is anything going to be done about the prices in the game? My friend Is a level 30, and cant afford any good D grade gear at all, because the items are way too expensive on the market, and I am level 34, and cant afford D grade blessed spirit shots, because they cost way too **** much from other players?
One of the things is, Who plays Line Age 2 for fun, and not 100% ecnomics? I play Line Age 2 for fun, but it seems that fighters, and mystics dont make that much adena in this game, and that is a big disadvantage to fighters,and mystics, is anything going to be done about this?
I constantly have to worry about, If i buy D grade spirit shots, I will waste all my adena, and wont make any adena at all, so what do I do? The answer is dont buy them, and spend over 8 hours a day trying to get from 34 to 37 ?
I know that Korea Intended for this game to be hard, but they did not intend for (BOTS) to come into this game and screw it all up, I mean items cost way too much for newbies who being to play the game, what will happen in the future?
Will newbies even want to play this game once the find out what is going on? The answer is probabily not...
The thing about this game, is it is meant to be a hard game to play, It is meant to be fun, It is meant to have parties in it.
However, I notice that because nothing is being done about the ecnomic system, newbies are being forced to buy adena off ebay.com or something like that, and also no one uses the in game party function at all...
If I was level 61 + and wanted the best equipment, what would I have to do? I would have to go to a website, and spend over $500 to get the best stuff in game, and there is no way that I am going to ever do that, and you got to realize that only an insane person would do so...
However the fact still remains, NC soft needs to do something about the games ecnomic system to lower the prices, or put a price limit or something, becuase newbies will continue to buy adena, they will also continue to bot, and something needs to be done about that too,or they could increase the drop rates a lot...
This game Is meant to be a challenge,Fun,and Role Playing game, however, because nothing is being done about the prices, no one is able to have fun, everyone is worried about ecnomics, and so on.
I mean If I am a newbie, and I want to make adena, I would have to afford some decent D grade equipment, I would be forced to play a dwarf, and not even then could I afford decent D grade equipment, What about us who hate playing certain jobs? Doesnt that ruin the (Fun) of the game? For Example, I hate Playing a Dwarf, But I want to play a mystic so bad, and I am a first time player, well If I go to play a mystic, How do I get adena for D grade Gear? Well the answer is I would have to (Buy Adena) !
I know that I can get a party and go hunt raid bosses with a group of people, ect, to make adena, however, how often do you find a raid party?
Divide The money by all the people, buy the time you all split it you get nothing, also think of it this way, How can I kill a raid boss, if I do not have good party members, with good equipment...
I also know that you all are going to hate this Idea here, but I think the whole game needs to be reset, every time the ecnomic system goes too high,newbies cant afford a thing, and there should be like a 30 day warning or more before it is done, so the people can spend their adena on what ever they want before it is wiped out, I hate the idea myself, but Im willing to loose what ever I have as far as adena only, so that everyone may benifit from it, not just me...
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Here are some solutions to this...
#1 Increase All Drop Rates
#2 Increase All Drop Rates, and allow adena on every monster including a level 75 killing a wolf, so that it still drops adena, so that fighters, and mages can earn adena...
#3 Reset Game
#4 We all play Line Age 2 for (Fun) (RolePlay) (PVP) and some of us even play it to earn real life cash (Botting)...
Botting is wrong, we all know it, thats why we need this games ecnomic system fixed...
What fun can we all have if we have to play a dwarf to earn good adena, in this game, we all like different jobs, some of us like mystics, and some of us like Fighters, Some of us dont like certain races, so what fun is it being forced to (Buy Adena), or play something that we dont like just to make adena?
One of the facts is that a level 50 Fighter, or mystic will make over 40% less adena than a level 50 Dwarf will, and to me that sounds very unfair, and unbalnced, thats why something needs to be done about the ecnomic system...
How many of you newbies,and people who arent rich want the price lowered, please post here...
Dude, we've already been through this over and over again, i even posted a thread about this to which you replied, whats the point of making a new one if you dont have anything new to say ???
Are you mental or something ? :p
Thanks for your comment, No I am not mental, yes we have been through it over and over and over, and we all go through it every single day, when is the ecnomic system going to be repaired...
NC soft needs to do something, because sooner or later, another mmo is going to come out that is way better than Line Age 2, and people are going to leave it, because they will probabily be better with the ecnomic system, by learning from other mmo's mistakes with it...
If nothing is done, this game may well sooner or later Die, and new people wont join it.
I mean What would I do with $500 since im not going to buy adena, so I can afford all the best A grade gear later? well lets see, I could go buy a new pc, lots of food, I could go out to eat like 100 times or more, order over 30 pizzas, what would you do with $500 that you are not spending on adena to get some Virtual Items that arent even real?
Note that this price is not to scale, to actually afford the Best a grade gear it would probabily cost you more than $500 Real Life cash, USD ! Now why are we letting this happen?
For all you dwarfs who dont know what your doing...
#1 Dwarf Farmers or (Spoilers) increase prices and sell items to creafters...
#2 Dwarf (Crafters) Increase the production price a lot more...
Hello, We are helping lots of (Ebayers), and (Adena) Sellers here, beucase we are inflating the prices so much newbies will go buy adena, becuase they cant afford anything, and because some of them dont wanna play dwarf, so they go back for 2nd servings...
Another poor excuse I have heard...
Adena builds Adds up, yes it does add up, but thats why this game should be reset when the prices go really high, reset as in reset only everyones adena, and not allowing the resell of items they currently ownd before after the resell, that way they couldnt Inflate the prices again, to fix this, they could give us a 30 day, or more warning before, so we would all spend our adena on items...
Another thing, Join a clan, Clan mates help, Not every clan can help newbies get decent gear, there are over 10 new players, that join the new starting clan, they cant help, when they got items they need themselves, Yes they can help, but only to a certain point, i mean they cant help every single newbie in the game...
I constantly have to worry about, If i buy D grade spirit shots, I will waste all my adena, and wont make any adena at all, so what do I do? The answer is dont buy them, and spend over 8 hours a day trying to get from 34 to 37 ?
Lol. Did you ever read the post you made in the Player section, one you called "Adena" ?
I replyed to it, actually, in it, I said a LOT more than I should have, but saying the above comment is not true at all.
On my nuker, spamming blessed shots for every shot, I made around 13 million adena from lvls 36-44, just by hunting mobs.
But the short answer is, NC will most likely do NOTHING to get economy under "control" as you speak of. They have as little intervention with the game as possible.
Edit: If you check some screen shots from Korea, prices there are not much different than here.
Well when i started to play Lin 2 3-4 months ago i didnt have ANYTHING-just like you.On lvl 15-16 i met a cool guy-he gave me 80k :p I made enough cash to get a mage staff and 3k sps shots from a quest to spamm to all my hearts desire.After i reached 21 i stopped my human wizard and made a dwarf fighter-spoiled 2000 a bones near RoD and made money for demon fangs-from that point i ALWAYS spam bsps shots-im 61 now(i DONT have money for A grade but got around 10m in inventory+TONS of matts in WH).The main reason i didnt go broke is called:Pumpkin Event!All those high lvl rich ppl scream in agony when such good events come but the low lvls really enjoy them :p I made enough cash for 2 symbols+homunkulus(got a crystal for the SA too!)
So in short-just wait for a good event (or stop spamming bsps but i think this is wrong).
Well when i started to play Lin 2 3-4 months ago i didnt have ANYTHING-just like you.On lvl 15-16 i met a cool guy-he gave me 80k :p I made enough cash to get a mage staff and 3k sps shots from a quest to spamm to all my hearts desire.After i reached 21 i stopped my human wizard and made a dwarf fighter-spoiled 2000 a bones near RoD and made money for demon fangs-from that point i ALWAYS spam bsps shots-im 61 now(i DONT have money for A grade but got around 10m in inventory+TONS of matts in WH).The main reason i didnt go broke is called:Pumpkin Event!All those high lvl rich ppl scream in agony when such good events come but the low lvls really enjoy them :p I made enough cash for 2 symbols+homunkulus(got a crystal for the SA too!)
So in short-just wait for a good event (or stop spamming bsps but i think this is wrong).
Lets see, keep in mind, not every one of us like playing dwarf, just because you like to doesnt mean I do, or everyones does...
I am not just posting this topic here, I am sending these to game review website admins, ect, so they can help better rate this game (:
Also keep in mind, It is not every single day I post a topic like this, I usually just start a new one, because the others are days and days old...
Keep in mind these things
#1 Not everyone like playing a dwarf, just because you do.
#2 Something needs to be done.
#3 We play this game for (Fun)(RolePlay)(PVP), What fun is it playing something you dont like, everyone tells me to go with something I like, so I did, but cant afford good stuff, just like all the rest of us newbies cant...
Yes I have read the topic that I posted Click here to vie (http://boards.lineage2.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=questions&Number=509925&Fo rum=f31&Words=adena&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Main=509 925&Search=true&where=bodysub&Name=&daterange=1&ne werval=1&newertype=w&olderval=&oldertype=&bodyprev =#Post509925)
You say I do not need to use them, well no I do not need to use them, all they do is cause more dmg, However I am a mage, and since no one uses the (Party) Function, and no one is looking for party in the area that I was in, and I called out If I could get a party invite, or if anyone was looking for a party, It is kind of hard to solo, because you have to hit mobs a lot, then you really need to rest for mp, and too much down time...
Once again, we all play this game for (Fun)(RolePlay)(PVP) What fun is it to play something we do not like to play?
Ehh you got me wrong :p I made a lvl 15 dwarf fighter(you can make it for 1 day!) After that there is a quest called Grimm Collector in Gludio(nice cash for that lvl) After that there are Shield Skeletons(you must kill them for the quest)that spoil 1-2 A bones+1 coal---they are ALSO weak to blunts!You can also seed them with Red and Chilly coda!There is NO such place till like lvl 40(IT crator :p) so i think even if you dont like playing a dwarf you can make a lvl 15 one to try make some bucks when you first start(you dont make shots or craft things-just go spoiling).
Oh and dwarfs are SUPPOSED to be the money-makers in this game :p They make the money but got no skills AT ALL!
For all you dwarfs who dont know what your doing...
#1 Dwarf Farmers or (Spoilers) increase prices and sell items to creafters...
#2 Dwarf (Crafters) Increase the production price a lot more...
Another Classic. Can't wait to see Kitten's reaction to this new thread. :p
What's your problem with Dwarfs anyway?
My suggestion for you is this, instead of trying to cut corners here and there, start a new Suggestion topic asking NC NA to delete the dwarven race. Reason, cause you don't like em. :p
For all you dwarfs who dont know what your doing...
#1 Dwarf Farmers or (Spoilers) increase prices and sell items to creafters...
#2 Dwarf (Crafters) Increase the production price a lot more...
Another Classic. Can't wait to see Kitten's reaction to this new thread. :p
What's your problem with Dwarfs anyway?
My suggestion for you is this, instead of trying to cut corners here and there, start a new Suggestion topic asking NC NA to delete the dwarven race. Reason, cause you don't like em. :p
(No do not delete Dwarfs) It is not that I do not like Dwarfs, I have dwarf friends that I know all over the server, I just do not like (Playing) them...
Please Do not start being Sarcastic, I do not like to (Play) Dwarf, That doesnt mean that other people dont like it just because I dont, but for those who dont, they should be able to make good adena too...
Ehh you got me wrong I made a lvl 15 dwarf fighter(you can make it for 1 day!) After that there is a quest called Grimm Collector in Gludio(nice cash for that lvl) After that there are Shield Skeletons(you must kill them for the quest)that spoil 1-2 A bones+1 coal---they are ALSO weak to blunts!You can also seed them with Red and Chilly coda!There is NO such place till like lvl 40(IT crator ) so i think even if you dont like playing a dwarf you can make a lvl 15 one to try make some bucks when you first start(you dont make shots or craft things-just go spoiling).
Oh and dwarfs are SUPPOSED to be the money-makers in this game They make the money but got no skills AT ALL!
You are right on this, they are money makers, thats why I dont like playting them, I do want money, but I want to make it with my level 34 Character that is a Wizard. If you have ways to make money with Dwarfs, please do not post it here, This is for people to make money without dwarfs, not with dwarfs...
I do not like Playing them, not everyone does, but that doesnt mean that they should be deleted, just because some people dont like to play them...
Again Everyone, Please Answer my question here...
What fun is it playing a race, or class you dont like, and get so bored with that you fall asleep?
Am I right or am I wrong, that people should play what they like? I mean everyone like something different... Every person in this game tells me, play what I like, and I am playing what I like, but I cant seem to make any good adena in this game for some reason...
If this game is going to be like this, why not just Make everyone start out with a (Dwarf) First, so they can make adena, then at level 75 they can make a new character with what ever they want?
(Why does it give us the choice to choose our race & Class?)
If we all have to play a dwarf to make adena?
While you are all trying to balance this game, balance the ecnomic system, Balance Dwarfs, and Fighters/Mages, so that we can all make decent adena...
Please Do not start being Sarcastic, I do not like to (Play) Dwarf, That doesnt mean that other people dont like it just because I dont, but for those who dont, they should be able to make good adena too...
But here's a problem, there ARE lots of ways to make boat loads of adena, IF you do a lil' research on how and what to do.
Let me point it out for you----dwarfs make money BECAUSE they have not other skills!Crafters get craft---spoilers get spoil.Thats it!Simple eh?You and me are mages-we have TONS of skills(some pretty effective-Sleep Cloud!Aura flare!Decay!Not to mention the combined spells that need seeds!)The downside is we cant make as much money as dwarfs.Understand this-dwafs sacrificed TOO much for money.
Oks here is a VERY easy way to make money with a nuker!
Get to lvl 40(change class also!) kill alot of gargoyles in IT crator(they DROP EMG parts!) Craft EMG for 100k and sell for 1m-easy eh?If you wanted to know HOW you can make a bunch of money just use the search function.Oh and nukers(ppl that kill most mobs in the least time) are awesome money makers when events start.
There is a quest at Hardins Academy that is connected with those gargoyles-with that ques you can get even EWC!Thats 350k right there!(must be lucky though :()
Oh and if you are lvl 34 Human Wizard i hope you are in CT marsh killing weak to fire mobs and doing the Black Lion quest(otherwise this thread should not exist!)
Let me point it out for you----dwarfs make money BECAUSE they have not other skills!Crafters get craft---spoilers get spoil.Thats it!Simple eh?You and me are mages-we have TONS of skills(some pretty effective-Sleep Cloud!Aura flare!Decay!Not to mention the combined spells that need seeds!)The downside is we cant make as much money as dwarfs.Understand this-dwafs sacrificed TOO much for money.
What is the downside to you? Yes this is true, but Dwarfs can sell items worth over 4mil a day, while we only make 100k-200k at my level, or less?
What about a dwarf that sells a high enchanted weapon and makes over 10mil? I cant even make 20% of that in 24 hours...
Yes I do know about everyones race's, and skills, I have tried Dwarf's before, I got a level 15 dwarf, and I dont like playing it, I have tried out almost every race in the game, so I know, I have looked at all the races skills, I know that Dwarf dont get all the skills that fighters do...
NC soft should Fix it so that fighters can earn more adena, without the prices going up on dwarf items, and give Dwarfs some new fighting skills and stuff...
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Yeah I have looked up some ways to make adena...
Sure Join a clan, Hunt raid monsters, Stuff like that...
But how Can you kill a raid monster if you dont got any decent gear...
Yeah I have looked at some repeatable quests, and found one that gives 25k adena per, but what about when I am too high to do the quest and monsters are Dark Blue? What about when I need an item that costs over 1mil? how many times do I have to do the quest?
Sure Join a clan, Hunt raid monsters, Stuff like that...
But how Can you kill a raid monster if you dont got any decent gear...
Yeah I have looked at some repeatable quests, and found one that gives 25k adena per, but what about when I am too high to do the quest and monsters are Dark Blue? What about when I need an item that costs over 1mil? how many times do I have to do the quest?
If that's all you found, than yeah, there's no way in hell you'll get any adena in game.
There are too many posts on this forums board that tell you how or what to do to actually make money.
And by the way, mops that are Deep Deep blue, will still give you quest items.
Edit:
What about a dwarf that sells a high enchanted weapon and makes over 10mil? I cant even make 20% of that in 24 hours...
Just to show you an obvious flaw in your argument, what the world does the above comment have to do with dwarfs? I guess you're saying if one is playing a dwarf, then their success rate at Over Enchanting items is much much better than every one elses, which is not true at all.
Only reason you see a lot of Dwarf sell/buy shops, is they have MORE slots for Buy (5 slots) / Sell functions (4 slots). Every other class has 3 sell, 4 buy slots.
This will change in a week though when C4 comes out.
Yes there are lots of ways to make money, but you cant even make as much as a dwarf? while a dwarf is afk selling items for 10mil adena, you at this level 30 cant even make 3mil a day, thats why I said they were over powered in other posts...
#1 Raid Monsters
#2 Aoe Parties
#3 Clans
#4 Quests
#5 Farming rare drops, in which I am not high enough to do yet...
This is all I have found on making adena really, I havent came across any good posts that tell you how to make good adena, I do not Buy D Grade Blessed Spirit Shots, Only thing I buy is 40 Health Potions, and those last me longer than 1k D Grade Blessed Spirit Shots...
Please stop trying to deny the fact that the games ecnomic system is way out of control, and if newbies were here right now, and If I could get my new friends to come read, they would agree...
While Dwarf Craft Items, and sell them, while afk they can make 10million adena in 1 hour if it sells, while Fighters/Mystics are Busting their [censored] off and cant make 3mil a day...
Tzk tzk-ever heard how you can make an over encahnted homunkulus?I will type it for you-buy dark sceamer from Lux shop(6m adena-need d and c crystals) go buy 5-6 EWC(2m adena) go and swap that +5 +6 homu with mammon(you have 66% to make +4,AFTER that you have 66% to get +5 and AFTER that 66% chance to get +6-these all stack so you can blow 20 dark screamers and not get a single +6 homu) AND after that wait for a few days some mage (like us) to come and buy it.You should know by now that for overenchanting you need TONS of adena-which means those dwarfs you see are playing this game for ALOT of time now.
Oh and you alone cant kill a Raid Boss no matter WHAT items you got!
OMG dwarfs NEED those materials you are not high enough to get yet!They need to a) buy them b)hunt for them(THAT is the reason for 2! Dwarf classes-one is making the materials the other is making the items) The dwarf that sells items for 10 milion adena didnt make them for 1 hour!Oh and ive seen dwarfs with items that cost 500m+ So what?you think he made them for 1 hour?
Tzk tzk-ever heard how you can make an over encahnted homunkulus?I will type it for you-buy dark sceamer from Lux shop(6m adena-need d and c crystals) go buy 5-6 EWC(2m adena) go and swap that +5 +6 homu with mammon(you have 66% to make +4,AFTER that you have 66% to get +5 and AFTER that 66% chance to get +6-these all stack so you can blow 20 dark screamers and not get a single +6 homu) AND after that wait for a few days some mage (like us) to come and buy it.You should know by now that for overenchanting you need TONS of adena-which means those dwarfs you see are playing this game for ALOT of time now.
Oh and you alone cant kill a Raid Boss no matter WHAT items you got!
OMG dwarfs NEED those materials you are not high enough to get yet!They need to a) buy them b)hunt for them(THAT is the reason for 2! Dwarf classes-one is making the materials the other is making the items) The dwarf that sells items for 10 milion adena didnt make them for 1 hour!Oh and ive seen dwarfs with items that cost 500m+ So what?you think he made them for 1 hour?
I know all this stuff already, however even tho dwarf work hard for their stuff, or buy it from another dwarf, or player, dwarf still make more than fighter/mystics, because while a dwarf spends 24 hours, and gets and item and enchants it to +3 and makes 3mil, I am still fighting trying to get 1million adena...
LOL I have done a raid boss party before in a level 30 Party...
I do know about raid bosses, You need to be in big groups, Im not stupid when It comes to this kind of stuff, this isnt my first mmo...
When I played Final Fantasy XI I thought making gil was hard, when I just started 2 character, I could make a big plantation in my moggle house, wait a month, and make over 5mil, if I did it on 10 characters...
No dont be a smart *** lol, if an item costs 500m+ it probabily took him weeks to farm these items, maybe even a month, but what is the chance, that a fighter/mystic will even make 100mil within that time? See how unbalanced it is?
I mean lets say I love Blade Dancer's in this game, It doesnt mean everyone Loves them, or likes th play them, and it does not mean that other people cant be a friend to a blade dancer either, all it means as that they dont like to play it, maybe that person will change their mind later, but its their choice, and their opinion...
I am trying to explain myself why us newbies say the ecnomic system is so screwed up, but you dont seem to see the picture...
While a dwarf makes an Item worth 500+mil, and might take a month,or less if they got help ,how much will a fighter/mage make in a month?
I can play for like 10 hours a day, and I make an average of 50k Profit right now, or maybe a little more, because I have to teleport, because right now my human mage walks so slow, + I have to buy potion's, incase I get ganked...
You guys see what I mean now? Dwarfs Make 500+ mil easy,other than the fact that they have to farm stuff, or get help to farm items, and split adena, we cant even make 50% of that within that time...
Ugh man listen now-dwarfs DONT have fighting skills.What does that mean?They CANT hunt for materials.(even spoilers cant hunt for materials) The spoilers can make materials because every mob has 3 items that can be spoiled.Even if a dwarf has 2 bilion adena what is he gonna do with them?Buy weapons and armor?What for?He doesnt have the skills to kill other players and no amount of adena will help him balance it out.Kill monsters?The XP grind for a dwarf is soooo slow that its rather painfull.The real money method on dwarf crafters is to make crystals/shots.But to get real profit you need a high lvl crafter(b and a grade shots).So shots are in the base of the economy(money sink-in other games weapons and armor got durability for this).So you CANT expect a dwarf lvl 34 to make 3 mils in 24 hours every day 7/7.Crafters are mostly for clans(not so true since private workshops were made posible :() to make items for the clan and shots and in sieges they are the only ones to crush castle walls.So until you join a clan and get to know the ROLE they play you better stop with the anti-dwarf movement j/k :p This game is team based-you cant expect all players to be the same!
You sir are WRONG it wont take him 1 month-it would take him 3-6 months!I want to point out that this dwarf with 500m+ items in sell shop(2 SoM with acumen+3 and 2 other overenchanted A grade weapons) doesnt play from 2 months!Hes a high lvl dwarf that grinded all those ugly(for a dwarf its a pain to lvl up past 52) lvls and has been around for 1 year minimum.Dont expect to make the same money as him!
I do not expect to make the same Adena as a dwarf, but I would expect to at least make 3mil a week at 50+, which I bet I still wont be able to do, Enough talk about how dwarfs play this game, I know it is hard for them, but it is even harder for us new people to play the game, and thats why over 50% of newbies buy adena...
I am not expecting to walk into a dwarf's private store one day, and buy his whole store full of 30 mil or more items really easy, but I do expect to be able to make a little good adena like 2mil a week at 50+ at least... Just an example :eek:
P.S We are the ones who pay for this game,we should be allowed to make some of our own changes, without us this game wouldnt exist if no one played it, and it might loose customers later on, and more of our sugguestions should be added to the game, they should have a voting system going on in the game, where you can press alt+B and vote, and 1 month after the vote, they calculate the percenatege, and or people from all servers, to see if it wins, and if it wins they fix the problem people dont like, but and we all know NC, NA own this server, we we do not own it, it says this in the User Agreement, NC owns our characters, NC could delete our characters if they wanted without any reason, but they wouldn't this is just an example...
When I talk about have enough adena, I am talking about just enough to buy all the Basic D,C,B,A Grade gear when you are the right level for it, without having to spend like 100 mil +.
Example
Buy the Dark Crystal Robe set, and an A Grade Staff max +3 or Regular, and then buy some boots, and stuff that gives Pdef, if its not required in the set, and then buy a necklace, two earrings, and 2 rings that are good, but not something that costs too much, just something that you can kill monsters really easy with untill you can make enough adena to buy the better stuff, thats what all us newbies want to be able to do, but will we ever get to do this? Not for at least next 2 years, if we dont make a dwarf...
If we do not like it I guess we should all just quit, because NC probabily wont do anything about it...
Tzk tzk-ever heard how you can make an over encahnted homunkulus?I will type it for you-buy dark sceamer from Lux shop(6m adena-need d and c crystals) go buy 5-6 EWC(2m adena) go and swap that +5 +6 homu with mammon(you have 66% to make +4,AFTER that you have 66% to get +5 and AFTER that 66% chance to get +6-these all stack so you can blow 20 dark screamers and not get a single +6 homu) AND after that wait for a few days some mage (like us) to come and buy it.You should know by now that for overenchanting you need TONS of adena-which means those dwarfs you see are playing this game for ALOT of time now.
Oh and you alone cant kill a Raid Boss no matter WHAT items you got!
OMG dwarfs NEED those materials you are not high enough to get yet!They need to a) buy them b)hunt for them(THAT is the reason for 2! Dwarf classes-one is making the materials the other is making the items) The dwarf that sells items for 10 milion adena didnt make them for 1 hour!Oh and ive seen dwarfs with items that cost 500m+ So what?you think he made them for 1 hour?
I know all this stuff already, however even tho dwarf work hard for their stuff, or buy it from another dwarf, or player, dwarf still make more than fighter/mystics, because while a dwarf spends 24 hours, and gets and item and enchants it to +3 and makes 3mil, I am still fighting trying to get 1million adena...
LOL I have done a raid boss party before in a level 30 Party...
I do know about raid bosses, You need to be in big groups, Im not stupid when It comes to this kind of stuff, this isnt my first mmo...
When I played Final Fantasy XI I thought making gil was hard, when I just started 2 character, I could make a big plantation in my moggle house, wait a month, and make over 5mil, if I did it on 10 characters...
No dont be a smart *** lol, if an item costs 500m+ it probabily took him weeks to farm these items, maybe even a month, but what is the chance, that a fighter/mystic will even make 100mil within that time? See how unbalanced it is?
I mean lets say I love Blade Dancer's in this game, It doesnt mean everyone Loves them, or likes th play them, and it does not mean that other people cant be a friend to a blade dancer either, all it means as that they dont like to play it, maybe that person will change their mind later, but its their choice, and their opinion...
I am trying to explain myself why us newbies say the ecnomic system is so screwed up, but you dont seem to see the picture...
While a dwarf makes an Item worth 500+mil, and might take a month,or less if they got help ,how much will a fighter/mage make in a month?
I can play for like 10 hours a day, and I make an average of 50k Profit right now, or maybe a little more, because I have to teleport, because right now my human mage walks so slow, + I have to buy potion's, incase I get ganked...
You guys see what I mean now? Dwarfs Make 500+ mil easy,other than the fact that they have to farm stuff, or get help to farm items, and split adena, we cant even make 50% of that within that time...
im overlord.. i need( not need but preffer) having robes and heavy, im in full B grade, got 2 armor sets a dama+3/focus a demon set in stock thousands of mats and a few mill still in my inventory... how do i get that ?
ok lets see... when i started i farmed my *** of on mushroom quest getting 2K a run.. in a few weeks i had enough for even mid D weapon, after that i DID make a dwarf and spoil for money, i didnt like it really but it was good money.. but i also did quests ALL the time. i one time mad 300k in a day on a quest which is ALOT at lvl 23.
i spam SS i spam Bbsps, because atm im doing all sorts of quest and no matter what mob i hunt i always get a quest item after a while worth thousands.
after you hit 40 BE SURE to pick up the coin quest. it made me millions, and plz note that ive been playing since open beta, and theres people started in C2 and are more rich then me.
how do you make money ??
-collect stuff, get a friend dwarf, craft cheap and sell the item
- manor system, people claim its worth the time with a good manor
- overenchating, risky but one of the best ways to make money
- quests quests quests quests simple as that.
- being lucky. hunt mobs and get a drop
- dont SPAM your ss /sps.. i know people who made million by just not spamming every hit
- make a dwarf even if you dont want it :p
- play the market ( by far the best way) buy low sell high
- events, last events netted me ALOT of money, millions
- lvl soulcrystals, still decent money when you can do it solo
these are the main ways of making money. probebly even more when i wanna think about it, but theres no way, no reason, why you shouldnt be able to make atleast a small provit every so often
Dwarves !
The problem with dwarfs is that they athe main cog in ebay machine.
They buy mats cheaper then dirt or bot/farm them<spoiler>
even then they complain <PRICES ARE TOO HIGH>
They suport ebay inflation buy always pushing the prices for their crafted stuff higher & higher untill the market colapses under the weight of inflation.
Ebayer will pay anthing they don't care if the item 10mil or 20mil. they will just buy more ebay!.
Dwarves make more money they don't care till the market colapses.
They will<and i don't blame them> sell at higher & higher prices <suporting ebay> .
They love the status quo <and will fight to keep it!>
What does this mean to use legit players is unless we are lucky we have to wait for events<which the dwarves complain about> to get our top armour/weapon.
We are playing a diffent game <i think the way the game was ment to be played>
The dwarves &ebayers are playing who gets the top armour/weapon first and screw the economy doing it.
Right now it's A gade next week when C4 comes in you will see all the ebayers equip in top S and the dwarf prices will go through the roof!.
But at least you will be able to get your A or B grade cheap till it's turned in to crystal like most D&C is now days.
The best way to fix this is sell All ARMOUR/WEAPONS ECT AT NPC SHOPS it will put a cap on prices say 2x NPC price of the mats +10% would be a good price for stuff.
Allows the dwarves to make a profit<not a obsene profit they make now!>they will also have another 5%-20% to play with from taxes.
Dwarves complain about this segesstion becuase they stop makeing billions in profit.
It will also curb ebaying<not stop it > but slow it down because stuff will be at a resonable price.
There will be fewer farmers mat prices will rise and the econmony will balance with out increaseing inflation.
And one last note dwarves are good fighters don't let them fool you they do as well in pve as anybody else because they get twinked with the best armour & weapons
OMG if a dwarf sells at 100k but if another dwarf can make the same item for 50k then that second dwarf will sell for 90k(not 50k because he will not get anything).I hereby drop my futile attempts to point out why dwarfs are NOT cheaters(they need to stay inside a city alot buying/selling-this means you just do nothin in that time(craft maybe but thats it)).I just want some dwarf to see trhis thread :p gonna be VERY entertaining.
Seems like someone is just too lazy to figure out how to make money >.>
Some ppl said it and I'm gonna say it again: QUESTS
Then to other things: Play the market, buy materials/items when you find extremely cheap ones, and then sell them for their own value= great profit. Craft, you get key materials, recipes, materials as drops from mobs when you kill them. You can also buy them from other players(buy and sellshops, hellooo) and then you can use a private creation workshop to make the materials and items. Then you sit on your *** and sell the item, just like the dwarves do. There is no reason why a non dwarf player couldnt craft stuff or have 500mil worth of stuff in sell shop.
If you make only 50k a day grinding without using shots, maybe its time for you to change hunting grouds... clearly you're killing the wrong mobs. About parties, go to catacombs/necropolises. Lots of ppl out there looking for party. Or if you're in a town, start shouting "LFP *insert class and lvl here*" someone might answer you sooner or later. Make a habit of partying with the same people >.>
Money maker for non dwarves: MANOR. If you're not seeding already, better start doing it now(altho it sucks for ranged classes, atleast if the mob is aggro). You can do tons of adena in 1 day with the use of manor, just need to know what materials are hot on the market and then get seeds that when turned back in as crops give that material = easy adena alongside exping. Best for melee soloers at low lvls, especially LE melees can seed very well since they can use their mp for self heals and thus go on forever(until seeds run out.)
I play a Destroyer, I had Great Sword, Blue Wolf Heavy set, Black Ore jewelry set when I got to 52 cos A. I manored. B. I did event stuff. C. I CRAFTED WITHOUT BEING A DWARF.
Now I'm making money for Majestic Heavy set and Dragon Slayer, takes some time yeah, but it is not impossible. Just use friendly Warsmiths and craft craft craft. (WTS Demons Sword, freshly crafted, 29,5mil ^^)
L2 has so many ways to make adena that everyone has an equal chance. Dwarves dont need as much support in making adena, and they got skills that make earning adena easier, but still you need to use them in the right way. A nuker is perhaps the best money maker while grinding in the long run. It can 2 shot mobs most of the time, and at later lvls that means lots of profit. Add in the high lvl quest items and vola = you're rolling in adena.
You're also not meant to have TOP items when you hit that grade, doh. Thats why there are low, mid and top Sets for grades.
About raidbosses... thats something clans and alliances are for, perhaps you should be looking for a clan ;) They usually help out by telling you ways to make adena too.
And then to the final point: You say dwarves make the prices higher? Think again, if there were no dwarves crafting, you would not have soulshots, spiritshots of blessed spiritshots. You would not have anything past Top Luxury shop unless you were mega lucky and got it as a drop. The more dwarves craft items, the cheaper they become cos there will be more items on the market and demand will be about the same or even less. Without dwarves, there would be really few people even in B-grade. And again, dwarves are only the class that _make_ the item, the crafter can be a necromancer for gods sake, he just happens to use a private workshop to get that item done.
Btw, be prepared to pay alot more than 100mil for A-grade. Teon prices: Dragon Slayer, plain = 55-60mil(bought, not crafted). Majestic circlet =60mil or more(bought, not crafted, applies to all prices ^^) Majestic Heavy armor= 20mil on average. Majestic Boots&Gloves = 9-12mil each. Thats nearly 160mil. Add in the unsealing of the armor parts and you're close to 200mil. Add in the Soulbow or Bop that I need and you're adding 30-80mil more. Now thats a DD destro set for pve and pvp(doesnt include enchants/SAs or tattoos)
Lets take the SPS A-grade set: Sword of Miracles 80-90mil. Dark Crystal helm 55-70mil(helmet prices greatly depend on the seller but they're always expensive T_T) Dark Crystal robes 30mil+. Dark Crystal boots&gloves= 12mil together sometimes.
Nightmare shield or Dark Crystal Shield 3-4mil. Add in unsealing and you're at that 200mil again. Both of these exclude jewelry, and thats some millions more ;) (Prices are rough market estimations based on Giran prices I've seen for the past months)
You can also craft them... get key materials via quests. Get recipes via quests. Manor the materials or buy them/get as drops and then you just pm that friendly warsmith that takes perhaps a few hundred thousand for the effort of making a craft shop. Then you click create and hope it doesnt fail(A-grade = 60% recipes, sucks T_T) This way it might take alot longer, but it will be also alot cheaper and you're making lots of adena during all this too so you might actually buy some and craft some.
Same goes for all grades, you can hunt the key materials, manor/hunt/buy the materials and then use a smith to make it. A smart player crafts his own equipment and doesnt buy from a sell shop >.>
Nighthawk plays on Teon and is on a holy crusade against dwarves, he was told numerous times in ally chat to shut up cos he makes no sense and seems to me that he still is as derailed as back then.
Nighthawk, if Enshin at some point kicks you out of clan, and you're untagged, be prepared for the wrath of dwarves(and other people who also thought you were a flamethrowing rambler), lots of people in Celestial were offended by your remarks and stupid whining about dwarves being the source of all evil.
Dwarves in pve = mediocre DDs at best. Sure they can do pole trains but Destroyers and Warlords are much more efficient in it thanks to much higher damage output. Sure they can swing their blunt in normal parties, but again their damage is much lower than that of any other melee DD. Only reason people take dwarves into parties = Spoil for Bounty Hunters. And getting the clan/ally/friend warsmith some lvls so he craft better/crystallize higher grade equipment or summon siege golems/big boom. Dwarfs = weakest melee DD out there.
EDIT: Adding in the market fluctuations on Teon. SoM, old price 100mil+, new price 80mil+. Soulbow, 100mil+, new price 80mil+.(Thats for A-grade comparision)
Great Sword, old price 24mil, new price 17-18mil. Bop, old price 35mil, new price 28mil(need I go on? B-grade done)
Any top C(thanks to ol' BS of mammon), old price 11-12mil unenchanted/without SA, 16mil with +3 and SA. New price 8-9mil unenchanted, 12mil with +3 and SA.(C-grade done >.>)
Any top D(mammooooon), old price 3-3,5mil. New price 2,4mil.
NOW WHY IS THIS SO? Because there is more crafters out there making these items. The dwarves aint pushing the prices up, they're making them drop. More items of the same type on market= more competition= PRICES DROP. Only thing that causes some prices raise from time to time are fluctuations on material prices. Manor affects thons, oriharukon ore and enria prices, so Nighthawk, GO KILL IMMORTAL ALLIANCE -ally FOR CAUSING ORIHARUKON ORE PRICES TO RAISE(Ori ore is vital for most crafts, thus the making expenses get higher)
Oriharukon prices recently, from 9k to 20k max. Thons prices from 7k to 15k but on the other hand, varnish and iron prices dropped. Coal and Charcoal prices dropped. Abone dropped...
Teon economy is just fine, it is working like a real economy, where supply and demand cause price fluctuations. Stop crying and learn to play the market. :p
Hello, Timecop.
Currently you are rank #4521431 on my personal list of people, whom I would miss on these boards.
Even though your whole suggestion is made up of repertition without any new suggestion, I will reply anyway.
You complain, that only Dwarves make money...
... and you say, that Dwarves are made to make money.
Well, Sorry, I apologize for all members of the Dwarven race, that we are actually doing the only thing that we are good at.
You say, you want to play your lvl 34 Wizard. Well, fine. I guess you like to play that kind of char, cause you do not need ages to kill a mob and cause you have a class, which is currently the top dog in PvP.
Well, I apologize again, on behalf of all non-nukers this time, but the other classes got other skills. That is why the other classes are played. Wizards are not supposed to have better fighting skills, better leveling skills, better PvP skills AND better money making skills than everyone else.
You said, that a Dwarf can make 4 Million per day, while you cannot. Well, since you are talking about a lvl 34 Dwarf here, that Dwarf would need to sell at least 1 Million Soulshots D-Grade on that day, with the insane profit of 4a per shot (which you do not get) and with being able to even hold 1 Million Soulshots, which you cannot.
A Scavenger however would have to spoil 1000 materials worth 4000a each. Well, while spoiling 1000 items per day might be possible, if you talking of a full day of active playing, those materials do not sell for 4k. If you spoil items around 700-1000a (which is possible), you would need to spoil 4000-5714 items of that kind and I dunno, if the spoils were significantly raised since I was 34, but I really doubt, that is possible.
So I wouldn't know, how a Dwarf can make 4 Million per day. Especially not without help.
Then you are talking about Dwarves selling overenchanted items...
Well, I did not know so far, that Dwarves were the only players who were allowed to double click an enchant scroll and then click on an item. Guess I was cheating then, when I enchanted a Dagger for my DE today on my DE char, with the money, she earned on her own.
Funny too, that from the Enchant WEapon D, that are currently sold in Dion (Gustin), the most expensives are sold by non-dwarves, while the dwarf chars are selling cheaper.
You say, that you do not want to spend 8h to get from 34 to 38, that is why you do need to use BSpS.
Well, if you think, 8 hours for 4 levels is much, you might want to stop playing right away. It would safe you lots of trouble as in the higher levels, you take closer to 8 days, than to 8 hours for ONE level. And that is with BSpS.
The fact remains, that you CAN level without spamming BSpS, they are not necessary or mandatory, and they do indeed cost a lot of money.... which btw is hardly influenced by greedy dwarves, as all ingredients are bought in a shop (at least for D and C shots).
You claim that 50% of all Newbies buy adena.
Well, I guess you did ask every Newbie then. Or are you just pulling up numbers from your [you know where] to make a weak point ?
I will give you some suggestions that will benefit you and me:
#1 - Play more, complain less
#2 - Play the game, level slow, gain money
#3 - Stop playing
All my suggestions are perfectly within the rules, my 4521431th best friend.
Oh, and once more:
As long as the Elves can cast even ONE spell, I want to keep my (already severely nerved) money making skill. (note, that skill is singular with intention).
Edit: one add on... You (timecop) are talking all the time about some Dwarf selling items for 10 Millions a day... But did you ever think about how these Dwarves got those items ? You know, they do not just mysteriously appear in our inventory when we log on. We need to hunt mobs to gather them or we need to buy lots of ressources to craft it... after buying the recipe first.
Oks im gonna go check if these guys are REALLY immortal <.<(j/k)Heh ive made a new char so i can make some ori ore since its price go out the roof!But yeah castle lords have very big impact on the market in general.BTW since SoP isnt manor made you cant find sop anywhere T.T And i need 160 :( Any tips on making some ?
Make a buyshop for sop overnight at Giran, preferrably next to Taurin or another highly used NPC WH keeper.
And as kitten said, the items dont just pop up from thin air, they need mats to craft. Making a top B-grade weapon costs from 20 to 25mil(all mats, 1x recipe, all blades bought, using a dwarf with recipe in book already), sells for 30mil, perhaps a bit more(this is a generalization) so in order to have those items in shop for sale, the dwarf needs to have a load of adena first. Also, they dont sell in seconds, the dwarf might actually be selling the same item for weeks. Imagine sitting in town 24/7 for 2 weeks with your sorceror, fun eh?
One of the facts is that a level 50 Fighter, or mystic will make over 40% less adena than a level 50 Dwarf will, and to me that sounds very unfair, and unbalnced, thats why something needs to be done about the ecnomic system...
Let me clue you in to a couple of things.
1) As a Bounty Hunter's (Spoiler) level rises, his ability to make tons of money LOWERS. See, as you go up in levels it becomes progressively harder to solo, and grouping with others will drain 50% to 90% of any spoils. Spoil a full item in a group? Too bad, everyone else in the group has the same chance to get it as you. Also, in a group you go where the group goes...not where the 'good spoils' are.
2)Crystalizing is the one of two things Crafters get that you can't do with craft shops and buy/sell shops with almost the same efficency. (Shot crafting is the other.) Otherwise, you have the same ability to buy/sell make stuff they do. Just be prepared to sit in town for huge stretches of time to do it. (Just like the dwarves!)
Finally, I am going to let you in on the biggest open secret of Lineage 2.
*******************************************
****** BIG SECRET OF LINEAGE 2 SPOILER ******
*******************************************
Lineage 2 is an ECONOMIC grind game.
It is NOT a level grind game!!!!!!!!!!
*******************************************
There you go. Lineage 2's dirtiest secret laid bare to you. There are only a few levels (do a Search for 'Level Walls', on the forum for more info) that really live up to the label of 'Grind' for XP but each and every level is a huge Grind for adena and materials.
The problem with the NA players of Lineage 2 is that the vast majority of them fail to understand this simple fact. Thus they try to level as fast as possible and whine because they can't afford stuff or make gobs of money. All their attention and effort is focused on getting the most XP solo or in a party....very few truly make an effort to make money as a 'clan'. For NA players, clans seem to exist more for PVP, or 'giving me stuff' rather than as a group that works together to aquire the adena and materials/items in the game needed to equip everyone. Hence the 'big money' people are often dwarves and soloers who understand these facts and play the market or work to maximise their income from the start. It's true that once you reach A grade / Raids and other 'high level' content that you ability to gather more money becomes greater due to 'having bought it all' syndrome, or other high level drops.
So if you want to be 'successful' at Lineage 2, you have several choices.
1) Just play the game like you have been. You'll be broke, but you probably won't be alone in that manner. Eventually however, you will make aquire enough money to buy everything your little character needs. (Like sometime around L70)
2) Ebay/bot/scam like the rest of the idiots. And whine when you get banned/owned/bored. (The sooner the better this last happens the better for the rest of us who actually 'play' the game!)
3) Be resigned to grind out the adena with alts/deleving by yourself.
4) Join a clan that can put up with you and help you with equipment. And/or works together to make adena in game.
OOOO the wrath of dwarven race i am afraid :p what they going to do close thier afk shops when i come into town<maybe then i might be able to use the staris in garain> try to cheat and scam me more or maybe thier bots will target me :p<WTS EBAY PIRCED OVER INFLATED STUF>
The saying goes if you think you got a good deal from a dwarf count your fingers then count your limbs then count your relitives ;)
BTW for price info on teon when i started to looking for a c weapon crystal staff started at 2 went to 4 is now ~5.5 mil
Hom swords stared at 4-5 mil when they became popular because of complaints the dwarves push thier price to 8mil now i seen them toping 24mil that is in a period of 4 weeks.
This is the type of dwarf/ebay inflation i am talking about just a few examples.
Sure you can find a few things going down abit becuse the market for them colapsed due to dwarf over production....although it nowhere drops to the price they started at.
Dwarves are like oil companys they say we arn't gougeing 3months ago 6 months ago $1.2/ltr of gas was outrages! now now $1.10 /ltr looks like a bargain.
We just keep paying and they just keep makeing obsene profits...untill paying 10mil for a sword that was 5 mil a few weeks ago looks like a good deal <cont your fingers :)>
Excuse me, Mr Bird, but every player can produce a Homunkulus Sword nowadays.
I seriously doubt, that anyone takes the time to craft these ones. Normally they buy a C-grade weapon, upgrade it once at the Mammon guy using AA and then exchange it at the mammon guy for a Homunkulus Sword.
If you see any point in that project, that only a dwarf can do, I would be most interested in it as I personally utilized it with my wizard char.
So now that we can agree, that the production of Homunkulus Swords is possible for every race, how is the selling of these swords restricted to dwarves ? ... Yep, easy answer... it is not.
And now that we did find out, that every race can produce and sell a Homunkulus Sword the same way, I would be most interested to hear a reason, why DWARVES are driving up the prices on those swords and not PLAYERS.
Any serious reasoning will be most apreciated, Mr. Bird
This game is meant to be tough and it's meant to reward commitment. However, it is also very much a team game.
A lot of the things you mentioned become far easier with friends, clanmates or even an alliance. If you play as a team things are easier to accomplish in L2.
One of the things I like about L2 is it promotes teamplay to the point where it's almost a really bad idea to go it alone.
If this is a team game, whats up with this, I joined a clan about 3 weeks ago, and I had to leave the clan, because no one was ever on. What is up with people saying clans will help? I waited over 2 weeks, and I got to level 34, without any help or support from them at all, I finally left their clan, and now I already got 5 Invites to different clans, so in 5 days I am going to join a new one...
If is is truely a team game, I cant find that many parties at my level on it, I have shouted asking for them, but cant hardly find them, and also no one uses the party function...
Excuse me, Mr Bird, but every player can produce a Homunkulus Sword nowadays.
I seriously doubt, that anyone takes the time to craft these ones. Normally they buy a C-grade weapon, upgrade it once at the Mammon guy using AA and then exchange it at the mammon guy for a Homunkulus Sword.
If you see any point in that project, that only a dwarf can do, I would be most interested in it as I personally utilized it with my wizard char.
So now that we can agree, that the production of Homunkulus Swords is possible for every race, how is the selling of these swords restricted to dwarves ? ... Yep, easy answer... it is not.
And now that we did find out, that every race can produce and sell a Homunkulus Sword the same way, I would be most interested to hear a reason, why DWARVES are driving up the prices on those swords and not PLAYERS.
Any serious reasoning will be most apreciated, Mr. Bird
Here is your answer, Dwafs control the whole ecnomic system in this game, not the players...
I do not mean to sound like a racist, but why is it that a lot of german websites sell adena? Are they the ones who develop the softawre for it?
You were quick to edit this out, but not quick enough
LOL. Well, the top seller of Adena is a .com website my dear friend.
And I am not arrogant or stupid enough to claim, that there are no german adena selling sites, but I am 100% sure, that www.lineageII.de (http://www.lineageII.de) does not offer such sales nor do we in any way encourage them.
Looks like you are out of arguments, if you need to resort to such silly accusations.
Here is your answer, Dwafs control the whole ecnomic system in this game, not the players...
What the heck ? In the text you quoted, I explained, why EVERYONE can sell Homunkulus the same way as dwarves can. How is that an argument for dwarves controlling the market ??
My oh my, and women are accused of being illogical.
Are you talking about Ebay.com, well first of all Ebay is a world wide website, this means that germans, anywhere on the world can post one there, and if you go there, they tell you not to buy it from ebay, they say buy it from their website... Ebay.com, you can buy games,adena,gil,electronics everything there...
If it wasnt illegal I could give you plenty of examples right here...
Ebay.com, is a place where people go to sell lots of items, I know about it already everyone does, but since then I have came across 5 German websites that sell adena, GIL, Ect...
Yep took it out, I didn't wanna sound like a racist ;)
No, I am not talking about Ebay, I am talking about a site with 3 letters, starting with "I".
Since there are "so many" german sites, please PM me a list (that is not against the rules).
Oh and btw... Americans, Europeans and everyone else can go to ebay too. I suggest you stop bringing nationalities into this matter, as NCsoft does indeed not like OOC racism very much.
Want me to end this topic?
Once again for anyone who may be a newbie, or is wodnering, NC,NA could do something about the prices, but they choose not to get into an arguemnt with other players...
NC soft reserves the right to delete anyones character because it belongs to NC soft correct, it says that in the agreement, so why not reset all the adena, and restrict the selling to npc's of the items you had before the reset, so that they could not inflate prices again.
Something could be done, but they seriously choose not to do anything about it, They Might even have some GM's paid off, by some company's you know corrupt GM's, maybe even NC soft its self...
Or maybe all this game is just about ecnomics, and not (Fun)(PVP)(Roleplay)???
Which leaves me to the following Idea's...
A. Players are greedy players.
B. It is NC softs fault, in a little bit of a way
C. People dont like helping others
D. Dwarfs Control the whole ecnomic system about.
E.Clans Cannot always help
F.You cant rely on anyone really because when I first joined the game I got no help at all, However you can meet nice people too that will help, but I havent...
G. No one uses the party function in the game...
H. NC soft could do something about inflation but choose not to.
I am not going to list that NC soft Is responsible, and getting paid off by gaming company's, because I do not know if its a true fact, just a rumor I have heard, and that has happened in other mmo's, however it has not been proven here yet, but above is the facts that have been proven, either some people are like this, and some arent...
Once again, Ban every bot, bot users have more than one account, and often run off of routers, what can NC do, is it they dont want to ban them, so they can continue to make more money, or is it they actually try to do something, Truth is I dont know...
I am not being racist, I know about I** online, and nothing is done about it...
NC soft reserves the right to delete anyones character because it belongs to NC soft correct, it says that in the agreement, so why not reset all the adena,
Because such a measure would likely lead to much more canceled accounts, than just keeping the system that is.
If I were to be punished for other players breaking the rules, then I would be seriously ******. And quite frankly, if NCsoft would decide to take away all the money, that I earned legally, then I would decide to take away my RL-money from them too.
Yes, technically they could just delete my whole account, but they need to use measures, that the community in a whole will agree to or at least be indifferent about. I see a huge opposition against your adena wipe idea and a very small support group... actually I did not see anyone supporting that wipe idea.
About your list:
A. Players are greedy players. Yes, I am greedy and will happily admit to it
B. It is NC softs fault, in a little bit of a way Kinda agreed, altough I see the majority of the fault with the people buying and selling adena
C. People dont like helping others I help people every day. Helping does not necessarily mean, that I will donate huge amounts of MY money to them
D. Dwarfs Control the whole ecnomic system about. Absolute nonsense as stated numerous times and explained in detail.
E.Clans Cannot always help True
F.You cant rely on anyone really because when I first joined the game I got no help at all, However you can meet nice people too that will help, but I havent...Actually I guess you would make a lot more friends, if you had not such drastic and illogical ideas. And once again, "helping" and "giving adena" is not the same.
G. No one uses the party function in the game...Absolutely not true. I would say less than 10% of all people above 40 are leveling ungrouped.
H. NC soft could do something about inflation but choose not to. Because they choose not to mess with the majority of the playerbase as it seems, just to follow the ideas of a handful of players
well Nighthawk, I personally will pk you on sight if you're untagged, be sure of that. If you got no idea about the economy, please stop talking about it. Only reason I'm not killing already is that I'm friends with Enshin.
Crystal Staff is Low Luxury shop item, and it costs 3mil to make it with buying crystals. That has been it's price about always and still is. 3,6mil for a plain crystal staff, why? Cos the maker wants some profit too and some people, like you, are too dim witted to use the luxury shop yourselves. The prices you mentioned are for Enchanted and SA'd staffs. Wonder why they cost more, hmmm... COS SA costs to add, cos enchant scrolls cost?
Homunkulus Sword = Dark Screamer = Sage Staff = Sword of Delusion in crystal count(and a few others) Make a Dark Screamer from Luxury Shop, costs 6mil. Go to Blacksmith of Mammon, even change = Get HOMUNKULUS SWORD. Add in +3 and Acumen SA and it is 9mil, which you normally see. Or 6,5-7mil for plain cos the maker again wants profit for the job he made. 24mil is for a highly Over Enchanted homunkulus, or someone trying to just scam a player who got no idea about the prices.
Now then, you can make both of those weapons for _free_. Train bots, get drops and crystallize. Or craft items that have plenty of cheap parts around(elven jewels some say, craft and crush, craft and crush).
The price of crystall staffs and homunkulus swords havent changed much in 6 months. They've been pretty much the same. Ofcourse you always find someone trying to make more profit, or trying to sell it real fast hence the really low price, but fact is, they're price aint changing cos they will always cost as much to make(unlike crafted items that are affected by material prices)
I've crafted: 2x Great Sword, 3x Bow of Peril, 1x Full Doom heavy set, 3x Black Ore jewelry set, 1x Demons Sword, 1x Full Blue wolf heavy set, 1x Staff of Evil Spirits, 1x Failed Sword of Miracles craft(30mil into thin air.), 1x Failed Dasparions staff craft(20mil into thin air.) and some more, and I'm currently crafting majestic jewelry set and such. I'm not a Dwarf. I'm not buying Adena with rl money. What I'm doing then? I'm PLAYING THE GAME INSTEAD OF CRYING. Now I'm gonna watch super bowl.
A. Players are greedy players.
B. It is NC softs fault, in a little bit of a way
C. People dont like helping others
D. Dwarfs Control the whole ecnomic system about.
E.Clans Cannot always help
F.You cant rely on anyone really because when I first joined the game I got no help at all, However you can meet nice people too that will help, but I havent...
G. No one uses the party function in the game...
H. NC soft could do something about inflation but choose not to.
A. yes players are greedy ********, so is more or less every living person in the world. its in the human nature.
B. yes NCS has made the world greedy
C. Well talk to other people, i have always found alot of friendly and helpful people in this game, many many more then in the ~25 other mmo i have played.
D. do you even read what people write in your threads? it has been explained several times in all of them!
E. no of course they cant always help but if you are in a clan that never helps you in any way, change clan , dont complain on the game if you are unable to find nice players.
F. just the same as E. its not L2 nor NCS fault if you cant find good players in the game
G. what? im in a party most of the time and sp is more or less everyone i know in this game.
H. why should they? this game has a PLAYERS BASED economy, and guess what.. that meens that we control it, not NCS nor the bots. of course bots influense it but they do not controll it.
Why do you even play this game if you cant find anything good about it? and stop with your racist remarks all the time. and start reading peoples answers instead of just write the same thing over and over again. The game wont change to what you want, just get over it.
I haven't read the whole thread, but I would like to say something about dwarves and the economy:
Everyone is a warsmith, except the warsmiths pay more than the average joe to be one.
Everyone is a bounty hunter, except the bounty hunters have less PvP and grind skills than the average player leeching off their spoils.
PS: WTB Party with BH on cruma 2! <3
ETA: Might he be talking about the party matching mechanism, not actual parties? I would like to say to this that plainly, most people bother to meet likeminded, friendly players (of which there are more than you care to believe) and party with people they know and like.
A. Players are greedy players.
B. It is NC softs fault, in a little bit of a way
C. People dont like helping others
D. Dwarfs Control the whole ecnomic system about.
E.Clans Cannot always help
F.You cant rely on anyone really because when I first joined the game I got no help at all, However you can meet nice people too that will help, but I havent...
G. No one uses the party function in the game...
H. NC soft could do something about inflation but choose not to.
Yes I have read your threads about where it says that dwarf control the ecnomic system, and how hard they have to work. But Dwarf need to realize that once they learn a recipie its theirs to keep forever unless they delete character, their account gets hacked, they quit, or they junk it. I know it is hard playing a Dwarf crafter, and stuff, but in 5-6 months I couldnt even make half of what you would as a Dwarf with a Fighter/Mystic, To me thats very unbalanced...
What do you think Bots do? They are Spoiler Bots, they Sell you Legal Dwarf's high crafts that cost 100mil, and as a result you increase the prices a lot, and it ruins it for all of us newbies, ect, and thats why over 20% newbies buy adena, Thats what bots want, they want you to increase prices, becasue they make more money, thats how their system works...
Now stop thinking about yourself if you got 50Billion adena, and be willing to give it up, so that it may help all of us on a reset...
I have met lots of nice people in this game, I do love This game, but I hate how the ecnomic system is going. I have met lots of people on this game, but most of them are about my same level, and are new too, so they cant really help...
The clan I was in I had to leave, because the clan members were all the same level and were never on really, now I have to wait 5 days for a new clan.
Yeah some people are kind, help, and some are greedy pigs, I have met a lot of nice people, and mean people...
Yes there are nice people who love to help people, but there are also those who dont help people.
NC Soft doesnt control the ecnomic system, but it is their server, that means its them who can do something about it, I have came up with a better solution anyways to fix the probelm with bots...
#1 Reset the whole servers ecnomic system, and take everyones adena, one time thing, but warn us all like 1 month or more before its done, and make all items that you currently own, so they cant be sold to the NPC's in shops, or traded...
#2 Fix it so you can no longer drop adena, or trade adena, except to buy from private shops, then there would be no way to bot this game to sell adena, this would be the most likely way to keep it from happening again...
Yes I know the effect this reset would have, but Think about how many newbies, and future players you would be helping by doing this... I know you couldnt afford a fast teleport, so what? walk it for once, and that way everyone could make adena, and it would be like a new game, except we all keep levels and items, ect, but the items that we had before cant be sold, or traded, just junked...
Why do I hate playing single player games? Its because In single player games they are Boring, They system is always the same, in command and conquer if you save often, and you attack, and your base is getting destroyed, you can simply reload, and stop it from happening, thats why I like online games...
The same thing happened in another mmorpg called Final Fantasy XI, I had to quit that game too, thats why I came here, and the same thing is happening here...
I think that this games could be really good, It is really good already, but the ecnomic system is really scrwed up, the Graphics are good, everything to me except the ecnomic system, thats why I am complaing about it, have you seen me complain about anything other than ecnomics yet?
Once again, I Love Dwarf's in this game, I think they look cute, and that people like them, I also have friends that are dwarfs, but not high level dwarfs, I do not hate dwarf, as in racist, I just dont like playing them myself, so before you go calling my a racist again, I am not...
All of you probabily fill the same about a certain race, or cass too in this game, am I wrong?
Some people say humans smell like fish lol, some people hate playing mages, because they say mp takes too long to change, Kinda true about mp taking too long, but Its okay to me, and It may not be okay to you, so what would you do If I forced you to play something you didn't like just to make some good adena, or better than a fighter/mystic
well Nighthawk, I personally will pk you on sight if you're untagged, be sure of that. If you got no idea about the economy, please stop talking about it. Only reason I'm not killing already is that I'm friends with Enshin.
Crystal Staff is Low Luxury shop item, and it costs 3mil to make it with buying crystals. That has been it's price about always and still is. 3,6mil for a plain crystal staff, why? Cos the maker wants some profit too and some people, like you, are too dim witted to use the luxury shop yourselves. The prices you mentioned are for Enchanted and SA'd staffs. Wonder why they cost more, hmmm... COS SA costs to add, cos enchant scrolls cost?
Homunkulus Sword = Dark Screamer = Sage Staff = Sword of Delusion in crystal count(and a few others) Make a Dark Screamer from Luxury Shop, costs 6mil. Go to Blacksmith of Mammon, even change = Get HOMUNKULUS SWORD. Add in +3 and Acumen SA and it is 9mil, which you normally see. Or 6,5-7mil for plain cos the maker again wants profit for the job he made. 24mil is for a highly Over Enchanted homunkulus, or someone trying to just scam a player who got no idea about the prices.
Now then, you can make both of those weapons for _free_. Train bots, get drops and crystallize. Or craft items that have plenty of cheap parts around(elven jewels some say, craft and crush, craft and crush).
The price of crystall staffs and homunkulus swords havent changed much in 6 months. They've been pretty much the same. Ofcourse you always find someone trying to make more profit, or trying to sell it real fast hence the really low price, but fact is, they're price aint changing cos they will always cost as much to make(unlike crafted items that are affected by material prices)
I've crafted: 2x Great Sword, 3x Bow of Peril, 1x Full Doom heavy set, 3x Black Ore jewelry set, 1x Demons Sword, 1x Full Blue wolf heavy set, 1x Staff of Evil Spirits, 1x Failed Sword of Miracles craft(30mil into thin air.), 1x Failed Dasparions staff craft(20mil into thin air.) and some more, and I'm currently crafting majestic jewelry set and such. I'm not a Dwarf. I'm not buying Adena with rl money. What I'm doing then? I'm PLAYING THE GAME INSTEAD OF CRYING. Now I'm gonna watch super bowl.
Hmm
Well no need to get personal I don't call you names or threaten you<not that I can :p>
I am just stating <along with many others> that the economy is out of wack.
And who benfits most from this Dwarves !
Every time somthing increase in price it's pure profit for crafters <eg dwarves>
The price of mats are as low as they can go only because the npc shops will buy them for set price.
Who benifits most from this people who craft <Dwarves>
You say there is other ways to get weapons and armour i agree but unless i want to search cats & necs and get a team of people to go with me I have to pay Dwarf prices for the stuff i want.
You have found a way to craft stuff for cheaper then buying it but not all of us are high lvl clan people who do/can have thier dwarf freinds make stuff for them at cost and even provide mats.
I like most people have to deal with ebay inflated prices and deflated farmer prices on mats if the dwarves don't buy them all first!
So if I want to get stuff crafted I have to hunt which I do 3-5hrs that i am online /day find a dwarf that will craft the thing i want at a reasonable price :eek:
The best solution is have NPC shop sell anything at reasonable price... like i said 2x the npc mat price +10% +tax
This will give crafters 13-25% profit it will curb and but not stop ebayers hence reduce farmers and increase mat prices.
Benifiting all players rather then the status quo of hyper inflations increase ebaying and mats going for cheaper then dirt.
Training bots is a superb way to make money. I train with my 6x warlord, made 10 mil in drops in 30 minutes of training. Sure this isn't "real playing," but as long as there are bots, I will be training them for drops.
Another note: asking NC to mess with the economics of the game (with price celings and floors etc) is asking for market inefficiency and instability. Take some economics courses, because I dont know how to draw a graph on these boards.
Think of it this way, NC is like the "government," and when governments get involved in economics, it introduces deadweight loss. The most stable and efficient form for an economy is human-driven (with few exceptions).
sure a reset would help the realy low level but it wont happen, they would loose a large part of their players becouse of it. yes this game is hard, that why alot of us love it, i had a tough time when i started, hey i still have a tough time, my main is lvl 54 and is still in c grade and i dont make alot of money at all, but its much more rewarding when you finaly are able to get that shiny new piece of eq you have been looking at for the past months.
and that we have a player based economy is probobly one of the best things aboput this game, hardly any games other then this have that. and if you have a hard time earning adena there is a huge amount of tips how to on this forum, its just a search away.
Yeah I want games to be hard too, I just want to be able to afford decent stuff for each grade, untill I have enough adena to buy the really good stuff, If NC doesnt want to do anything, lets just let the cheaters bot then, and sell adena, and see what happens in the future, you will have no new players willing to play...
I am not just posting this stuff here, I am sending it To G4 and all the other people who rate games, so they can rate it them selves, and keep people from buying it :) ! I would love to see this game loose its customers due to the fact that they didnt want to help fix the ecnomic system...
Hm maybe I should keep that 2m Bow my other character has? If I keep it and wait like 1 year, maybe it will be worth 4 million ???
Yeah loosing customers looks like it is going to be the only way to get NC to listen to us...
The best solution is have NPC shop sell anything at reasonable price... like i said 2x the npc mat price +10% +tax
This will give crafters 13-25% profit it will curb and but not stop ebayers hence reduce farmers and increase mat prices.
Benifiting all players rather then the status quo of hyper inflations increase ebaying and mats going for cheaper then dirt.
This sounds like a good suggestion at first.
But:
Currently, there are 2 classes in game, which solely exist, cause you cannot buy everything in stores. Those classes are Bounty Hunter and Warsmith.
Granted, it might be still reasonable to have a Warsmith, if you can craft cheaper than that shop price, but what would be any reason for a Bounty Hunter to still exist ?
Currently a Bounty Hunter provides materials for crafting. They can do nothing else. Providing materials and recipes is the absolute only thing a Bounty Hunter can do. The poor fighting skills are easily better on any other combat char (including Prophets).
Let's assume, that adena buying would still be there, people could just buy everything from an NPC-shop without having to bother about finding a Warsmith.
Logically the number of real Warsmiths would drop even more than it already did with the invention of the Recipe Book.
With the number of Warsmiths dropping, the reason for Bounty Hunters to exist will drop too.
And in the end a suggestion, which sounds good on first glance would eliminate the reason of existance for a whole playable race.
Maybe you got another idea, why Warsmiths and Bounty Hunters would still be worth the tremendous trouble of leveling them ?
I would love to see this game loose its customers due to the fact that they didnt want to help fix the ecnomic system...
You are lucky, that I am not a moderator of this boards, as for such an intention, I would insta-ban you.
Don't you think that it is at least a BIT arrogant of you, to claim, that you with your lvl 34 char know everything about the economy, when every thread you suggested has proof in, that you do not get your facts straight ? (like Homunculus swords being only available to dwarves in your world)
How can YOU dare to ask game rating companies to write bad about Lineage2, just because Rust is not obeying to your silly suggestions ?
Did I say Give Line Age 2 A Bad Raiting? No I didnt say bad, But if I got G4, or something to come sign up, and paid for their subscript + a CD for them to get on, they would probabily do it, and they would see how hard it is as a newbie, then they would rate it bad, Im not asking them to rate it bad, but they would... Im saying something needs to be done, or this game is seriously going to loose customer's, and we dont want that, Im trying to make a point...
If a GM wants to tell me not to post this stuff here, fine when they tell me I wont, but they cant stop me from posting on websites that NC soft does not own...
I told you I Love Line Age2, and I would hate to have to start writeing on public forums for everyone to read that lineage2 sucks...
It is my belief, that fulfilling any of your economic suggestions, would drive more players off this game, than just keeping the status quo.
I agree, that the economic system is far from perfect, but I do not see any hope in punishing the legal players for the things, the adena sellers and buyers did.
Yeah I know, I dont expect it to be 100% perfect, it will never be, but I expect it to be a good game, in which it never is, I emailed NC soft and asked them if they are going to change anything, and I bet they will say no... My next step will be to start going public instead of posting here next time...
The game is very good, I like everything really except the ecnomic system...
And that is where the term "arrogance" comes in again.
You can only speak for yourself. You do not speak for "the community". You do not even speak for more than a very smal fraction of the game.
I happen to be the administrator of the only german official fansite, and I would never dare to speak on their behalf, simply cause I do not know all their opinions.
Only a fraction of all Lineage2 players ever reads these forums. Only a fraction of the readers are voicing their opinion as well.
So why do you believe, that you got any right to "go public" with what seems to me like only your opinion as you seem to believe, that you got the problem identified and know the only solution ?
Your posts about how Dwarves are overpowered and how they are the only ones to control the whole market show to everyone, who is playing this game for a while longer, that you are not setting your claims on firm ground, but rather on very weak assumptions and accusations.
Currently I believe, that you are more hurting the game in total, that you are benefitting it.
and what good would that do? you are at lvl 34(?) you have hardly even experienced the economy in its full state yet. yes it has flaws but thats the price we have to pay for having a player based economy wich you seem to have a big problem with.
"I expect it to be a good game, in which it never is"
then u honestly dont understand why you are still playing. find a game that fit your needs better instead of playing a game that is never good.
Yea i would like to know what you meen by going public to ? i dont think that any serious magazine/site (or what you had on your mind) would take it seriously. Hi i have played this game for a few low levels and it sucks cus its not like i want it to be.
my sugestion for you is just give it up, as you said in your previous post its never a good game for you, then find one that is instead of trying to "know it all" about it. hey i consider myself a newbee in this game but i dont try to know how to fix the end game material in it cus i havnt experienced it.
So why do you believe, that you got any right to "go public" with what seems to me like only your opinion as you seem to believe, that you got the problem identified and know the only solution ?
Your posts about how Dwarves are overpowered and how they are the only ones to control the whole market show to everyone, who is playing this game for a while longer, that you are not setting your claims on firm ground, but rather on very weak assumptions and accusations.
You guys dont really see the big picture, The big picture is I have a lot of newbie friends agreeing with me that something needs to be done about the ecnomic system, Yes I have seen items myself on the server sell for up to 150mil already, and higher, I do understand the point...
This isnt my first mmorpg that I have played, I used to play Final Fantasy XI online, and the same thing happened there, I got over 500 people to leave their service already...
I hate the problem with the ecnomic system, and so do all newbies, high levels dont really hate it that much, because they arent the ones effected, try junking all your adena, and leveling with a level 1 newbie again, and see how good you do...
Yes I know that I am the only one wrtieing this stuff, but If I get others to agree too, I will not be the only one, my friends that play the game dont really want to come here and start an arguement, because they think it will ruin their game reputation, well the fact is it wont, because no one knows who I am, and no one will, last time people saw me was hmm, bartz server? that was like months ago...
Yeah I will not be the only one complaining about it I will get others to send their complaints to NC too, so that maybe something will be done, otherwise I will go public all over the internet, and see what results I get from people who are newbies...
Please click the blue links and look at all the articals...
After all these that have been posted in 2005, What else should I add to them?
Here is an example of what how adena sellers screw up games, its not just this game thats screwed up, they are trying to take over all the mmos,and us players, and NC soft is letting them get by with it... here have a look...
I want this [censored] to stop, Why the hell does NC allow the ecnomic system to be so screwed up like it is? They are the ones who have the power to stop this [censored] right now, but they wont do it, because they are making money from cheaters probabily...
Basically I dont care how it is stopped in LineAge2, I just want the stuff to be reset, or the prices put on a max limit so that dwarfs cant over price items, or something, if you have something better please post it here...
What are you gonna do? Call a press conference?? Seriously, you've already been proven terribly wrong. Now you want to embarrass yourself "publicly"?
No wrong, What I am going to do is find all the top gaming websites, and give this game a bad raiting as far as the ecnomic system, and I will get friends to do the same who hate how its going, and thats what I will do, we will all go and write our storys on the internet... If nothing is going to be done about this...
Us Newbies just want the prices to be fixed, we do not want to go public, in other words go on forum's, and write about the game, there will be those who say its fine, there will be those who dont agree,and those who agree with us, thats how the internet works, and it will go on, untill one of us wins it...
How long would it take to send emails to people across the world ? like 5mins less than that...
Well I can go and write game reports just like I am doing right here right now, I can go in the other 5 mmorpg's I play, and make sure that people dont come to this one, there are lots of things I can do 100% legal... :)
Well the thing is NC soft should just take care of the ecnomic system, and then it would be a great game, and we could all agree...
Most companys that sell adena just drop adena, and other player picks it up, that way the people that buy adena, and screw up the ecnomic system, it is too hard for a gm to find on logs, because there are lots of drops that player will pick up after they pick up adena...
They need to make this game so you cant drop or trade adena, this isnt a bad idea, and then they need to reset the ecnomic system with adena, and fix it so items before the reset cannot be sold at npc's, or traded, or, NC soft could just fix it so you cant drop, or trade adena, and we can lower the prices our selves if we are willing...
Wow. I didn't realize you were so powerful. Should I cancel my account now to avoid the rush?
Its up to you, im not going to say yes, or no, if you liek the way it is stay, if you dont, and want to argue about it here, do it, if you want to quit, quit, but I am not quiting the arguemnt, If I have to take this off of NC's server I will
The big picture is I have a lot of newbie friends agreeing with me that something needs to be done about the ecnomic system
I happen to know a lot of old players and a fair bunch of newbie players.
And the old players agree with me, that the economy that you are imagining would be worse than the current system.
And I seriously doubt, that you can find anyone with 6 month or more playtime, who will agree with your "wipe the adena" idea.
The big picture is made up by the big fishes and the big fishes are not the ones, who started playing this year.
Actually NCsoft IS doing stuff to help new players. When I started the game, there were no Newbie Helpers giving me free SS or SpS. They were not buffing me till lvl 25. I was not allowed to simply exchange my equipment in the stores.
You just want everything served to you on a silver platter and that is naturally causing some animosity from players, who did actually earn their way with their own effort.
You dear sir, are plainly wrong... on my example (currently 58th PS)
before 20 - top NG
before 30 - Knowledge Set + Demon Fangs (Knowledge Gloves were reasonably priced back then though)
before 48 - Drake Armor + Kat*Kat
before 55 - Full Doom Light + Full BO + Doom Shield + top B weapon (AoBA right now... I change them too often :P)
No dwarf alt... actually my alt (SR) sucks money from my main. I equipped few friends with C weapons... I'm *not* a dwarf, and NC soft can check logs that I have never sold 1 stem for some weird amount of money (ranging in million).
Need to explain? here:
Quest + Manor + Play Market + Clan's Help (less than 10% of what I have though)
(oh, manor sucks for me because of 5am restock time so might as well cross that out... I use it when I'm desperate). Most money I made so far was on people being lazy.
ETA: I'm on a pretty good way to own A weapon before 61, maybe even few pieces of armor.
You know what ?
Since the Superbowl is currently on TV, I come to a funny analogy:
You are behaving like a football player, who is plaing in the World Bowl, instead of the NFL. The World Bowl is generally made up by players, who want to play in the NFL, but are not good enough or have not had a chance to proove themselves worthy yet.
And now, the World Bowl player TimeCop sees the NFL players getting paid much more money and then he looks at his own money and sees, how little he got.
And so he goes to the press and rambles about how unfair it is, that the NFL players are paid more than the World Bowl players.
And since all the NFL players are laughing at him and tell him, to play better to get paid payment, he is writing to the chief of the NFL a letter like this:
"I want you to pay the NFL players no more than the World Bowl plays their players.
If you do not agree, I will stop playing football and tell all my friends to stop playing football too and also I will tell the news and Jerry Springer, that you are a very very very bad man, cause you do not give me what I want."
And the chief will laugh his *** off, and maybe answer:
"Hey, Rookie. Learn to play football and come back after you got a few games on your back and then try to get into an NFL team. If you manage that, you get paid like an NFL player, otherwise go away and stop wasting my time."
and you think that if you and your amy of friends threatens to leave this game, NCS will change it to what you want? i can promise you that it wont do anything at all. if you seriously want to change this game this is not the way to go. i hardly think NCS will bother listening to someone that threatens to leave the game and take your friends with you or to "go public".
this isnt leading anywhere cus you obviusly dont listen to what everyone is trying to tell you over and over and over again. i actualy think that people that have been playing this game for a long time have a much better view of the matter then you (for exempel the german kitten).
Thank you for contacting Lineage II e-mail support.
We highly appreciate your observations as well as your valuable suggestions and escalating the ticket to Senior Customer Support Representative for consideration. We would also encourage you to post your suggestion on our official message boards at http://boards.lineage2.com/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=suggestions where your voice can be heard. This will give other players a chance to comment and offer their thoughts on your topic. Every message is read by our Community teams who report hot topic. We also look forward to your feedback/suggestion in the future!
Thank you,
This is what I get from NC soft, I told you guys they dont care, all they care about is your money...
oh the horror! they send me an automated answer so i know that they recived my email. and i was ncs i wouldnt care about it either, as several people have said, you are one person who only played for a short while but tries to teach them how the game should be. i would probobly just put it in my spam folder tbh.
okay lets get off the topic about going all over the internet, and telling people why the shouldnt Join Line Age 2.
WHO HERE THINKS THAT THE ECNOMIC SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE CHANGED?
Something needs to be done, because new people are having a hard time, Us fighters, and Mystics need to be able to make at least 50% of what a dwarf can crafting in one week...
#3 Mages/Fighters to be able to make at least 2mil a week, unlike dwarfs that make like 5mil or over a week...
I would actually be happy, if I could make 2 Million a week on a reliable basis. Yes, there are weeks, that I can make 2 Million or close to it, but I am 24 levels ahead of you. At lvl 34 I was counting for my first Million, not talking of Millions per week.
By now I think, that you are calling dwarves greedy, while in truth, YOU are the most greedy person around.
Once again:
You do not need Soul or Spiritshots to level. You do need to utilize quests. And you do not need to have top grade equipment at the start of a grade. If you do not make enough money, you need to level slower. This game is not meant for players, who want to reach the max level in one spring break.
#3 Mages/Fighters to be able to make at least 2mil a week, unlike dwarfs that make like 5mil or over a week...
I would actually be happy, if I could make 2 Million a week on a reliable basis. Yes, there are weeks, that I can make 2 Million or close to it, but I am 24 levels ahead of you. At lvl 34 I was counting for my first Million, not talking of Millions per week.
By now I think, that you are calling dwarves greedy, while in truth, YOU are the most greedy person around.
Once again:
You do not need Soul or Spiritshots to level. You do need to utilize quests. And you do not need to have top grade equipment at the start of a grade. If you do not make enough money, you need to level slower. This game is not meant for players, who want to reach the max level in one spring break.
Spring Kitten
2mil a week for everyone not just for me, that way we could all afford things better, becuase Dwarfs are the ones that make the most adena more than any fighter/mystic can in this game, Dwarfs need to have Price limits set, or something.
Fighter/Mages should be able to make at least 50% or a little less tahn what a dwarf can killing things, this doesnt just go for me, it goes for every dwarf/mystic...
Us fighters, and Mystics need to be able to make at least 50% of what a dwarf can crafting in one week...
That system is already in action. There are dozens of craft shops around, which enable EVERY player to craft items to then sell them for profit very close to the profit the crafter can make herself.
Let us assume, that you craft an item for 5 Million material cost and sell it for 10 Million (such rates you seem to think are absolutely normal). Now such an item would have a crafting cost of roughly 100k, so instead of 5 Million profit you would make 4.9 Million with a craft shop dwarf you found.
And again, you are complaining about a small fraction of the game, without really having understood the game mechanics.
"Well I can go and write game reports just like I am doing right here right now, I can go in the other 5 mmorpg's I play, and make sure that people dont come to this one, there are lots of things I can do 100% legal"
in my eyes thats threatening ncs to change the game as you se fit.
i think its futile to try to continue your crusade if you dont change your attitude. as said several times before, its been explained to you in several threads before. you can start with actualy read them instead of acting this ignorant towards them.
I'll be nice person and give you two direct tips. (of course you need some starting funds, about 700k for first tip, and about 2.2m for second one)
1. Buy Green Seal Stones at 6a each, or less (it happens). Turn them in for Ancient Adena. For that Ancient Adena buy High Grade SP Scrolls (should be about 600-700k for one). Sell in Dion for 900k-1m. (Made few million in 3 days this way)
2. Buy top weapon from Giran weapon store (any will do). Buy 480k ancient adena (same way as above. green seal stones and exchange), go to blacksmith of mammon, exchange your weapon for top D and change that into Mithril Dagger/LxBow/Staff of Life (these seemed to sell best). This should cost you about 2.1-2.2m. Easily sold for as much as 2.7m
Why am I telling you this? because I found even more profitable business. risky, but extremely worth it (something about 2:1 return)
2mil a week for everyone not just for me, that way we could all afford things better, becuase Dwarfs are the ones that make the most adena more than any fighter/mystic can in this game, Dwarfs need to have Price limits set, or something.
Fighter/Mages should be able to make at least 50% or a little less tahn what a dwarf can killing things, this doesnt just go for me, it goes for every dwarf/mystic...
And here we are again at your run against dwarves.
If I kill a mob at my level, and spoil it, then I get roughly 1000a in drop and another 100-500a from the spoil. Rare drops are available for me as for any other class. My only surpluss in money comes from spoiling.
Case 1:
Grouped: The BH will be forced to share spoil and every member of the group gets exactly the same share as the BH. Due to the nature of spoil sharing this can mean, that the other group members are getting a net total of materials, that are worth MORE than what the BH gets.
Case 2:
Solo: The dwarf can only fight green mobs and has no access to the real expensive spoils, as the million adena spoils are unable to kill solo. Normally the extra money generated by spoil is less than 50% of the normal drops of the mob (in adena worth). So the BH is getting 150%, where everyone else gets 100%. That means, that every other player is already getting 66% of what a BH can get while solo or 100% of what the BH gets while grouped.
Sounds to me, as if your 50% rule is already in place.
Do you pick your numbers from thin air, or are they somewhat based on experience ? Since you never played a Scavenger, I am wondering, how you know, how the class earns money.
"2mil a week for everyone not just for me, that way we could all afford things better, becuase Dwarfs are the ones that make the most adena more than any fighter/mystic can in this game, Dwarfs need to have Price limits set, or something."
ok im goin to say this once again, ITS A PLAYER BASED ECONOMY, is that so hard to understand?
my dwarf isnt more then lvl 33 and i made much more money at that level with my mystic becouse i had good fighting skills, and guess what.. the dwarf doesnt.
I rolled scavenger recently... she's just level 21 so it might be not too correct but so far the extra money she got from spoils was rather in the "meh" range. Fun doing something extra but not that profitable (I don't plan on de-leveling her since I find this counter productive in RP view. Best I'll do is use Sin Eater while hunting for elven robes since I really want a set of those)
As most of you know this is an Eastern created game with an eastern monetary system. We North americans and Europeans (who are becoming more and more like NA's), do not and do not see money the same way they do. (This post is not in any way rascist, just simple demographic economics) What they see as 120yen (it being the most publicly traded RL dollar value) We see as one US dollar. So items really aren't as expensive as we percieve them to be. when we get a drop of 150 adena think of it being more like a dollar twenty-five.
Furthermore they don't play the same as we do. Some of the most popular classes they play are tank classes. They understand and use teamwork to level quickly and efficiently. Trading off hate from one tank to another to keep downtime to a minimum if ever. They rarely use ss, because what is the need with 8 tanks beating on the same mob. Its going to go down in 2 seconds anyway.
There is very little that needs to be fixed in this game if we played it the way it was meant to be played. Yet we NA's are very well known for the Jones' symdrome. We want it quickly with little effort invloved and we don't really like to share. the Jones' syndrome falling under the....The Jones down the street got their Kitchen redone, so we have to do it too to keep up. and it better be better.
Funniest thing is that people have given em ways to make lots of adena, and they still complain it is hard. There's tons of articles, guides and threads about making adena, and how the economy works and still people blame the dwarves...
For all those who dont have a WS or know one, USE THE CRAFT SHOPS. They're there for a reason. And if you've never even clicked on those orange titled shops, you should really look into the mirror and blame the person looking back for your poorness.
Btw, timecop, aint you being greedy when you want to have top stuff and want others to hand adena out to you? Sounds greed to me.
L2 economy is balanced, the market fluctuates according to supply and demand, there's nothing wrong with it. Just like in real life, if something is rare it will be expensive. If something on the other hand is really common, it will be cheap. If something costs alot to make, even if it's a common item, it will be expensive so that the makers/sellers can cover the making price and make some profit. Same happens in L2, items get crafted and sold for a profit... would there be any other reason to craft other than profit? Would someone actually craft stuff just to sell em for the same price he put into it? No, unless he got all that he will ever need already.
Not everyone is rich in real life either, why not try to fix that?
Why suggest fixing something when its clearly not broken? There's lots of other things that need fixing, economy is not one since it is player run, like a real free market would.
No I am not a Greedy Person, whenever I have either maxed out my character with good gear, or before then, when I have enough adena, I give newbies items, and donate Items to clans, no I am not a PIG...
No I am not a Greedy Person, whenever I have either maxed out my character with good gear, or before then, when I have enough adena, I give newbies items, and donate Items to clans, no I am not a PIG...
Your problem is that someone could give you 10's of millions of adena and it wouldn't be enough for you. You just don't have the skill to handle the money.
Lack of money is not your problem. Lack of imagination is. Changing the game mechanics won't help you.
hehe, sorry tried to read through the first few posts, and the last few...but got bored, this is the same thing again.
I consistently make at least 14m+ a week, someweeks I double my money, I do not farm, I gave up using the manor system except for mats I need to craft something. I spent 4 weeks researching the market here, trying buying/selling different items to see what would be most profitable. I found a way, I won't tell you though or anyone else it is somewhat of a niche market and I do better without competition. I do it with a dwarf, but no crafting is required I only use a dwarf because of 4 sell slots but that will change in c4. Just think a little bit. I know I have seen players export things such as regular healing pots to starter towns because none are sold there, and of course they raise the prices ;)
heres something for ya. You want to spam bsps to level but don't want to waste adena. Find mobs that 1 to 2 spell hits to kill. Trust me after awhile you will not only make alot of money but level like crazy. Case in point. Vegetta and Inudaw two different nukers. Vegetta is a spellhowler he spends 600 for a-bsps and two shots mobs. THe mobs that he two shots drop an average of 1500 adena. Thats 900 adena proffit plus drops and mats. Inudaw is the same way except he is a spellsinger. He also hunts quest specific mobs which drop items which he then sells to other players. In the end he makes a crap ton of adena. Im a sword singer. I spam ss and I require buffs but when I do solo, I do infernium ore quest and therefor make ALOT of adena doing it. Your more than likely at the level to do a hunters quest or the coin quests. In which case you hunt the specific mobs, you don't spend alot of adena in bsps and you can sell the coins, or earn adena from the quests. There are dozens of ways around it. You just gotta find what works for you. My biggest issue with the economy is a grade stuff. Its way overpriced compared to crafting price. Case in point tallum helm goes for 50m. It only costs 4m to craft it. I can understand trippling the price.
No dont be a smart *** lol, if an item costs 500m+ it probabily took him(DWARF) weeks to farm these items, maybe even a month, but what is the chance, that a fighter/mystic will even make 100mil within that time? See how unbalanced it is?
WRONG.
Dwarfs are horrible fighters, and you agreed to it, cause you said they have very little to no fighting skills. I have a lvl 49 Bounty Hunter, I agree with that 100%.
If you wanna craft an ITEM that costs 500m as you said, the DWARF is the least likely class to collect the amount of resources needed for a craft. Instead of a Dwarf, ANY MELEE character can and will get all the mats much much faster than a Dwarf because all other classes have LOTS of other skills, so they kill quickly.
My dwarf is spoiling 70-80% Crap, and 20-30% of things that are useful and valuable.
So get off the Dwarfs here. They are the most Gimped class. 2nd to Temple Knights.
The description for Bounty Hunters on the website, and the actual game play is FALSE.
No where in that description does it mention things like:
*Horrible killing speed
*Can't solo effectively and after a point can't solo at all
*Must share spoils with Party members in order to continue leveling
*Most of spoils are utter crap.
None of these things are mentioned in:
Bounty Hunter
It is said that the Bounty Hunter is a veteran who has the greatest known collecting abilities. He is even said to have gathered a dragon's scales. The Bounty Hunter is adept at using the Whirlwind in battle. He also possesses many skills related to commercial activities.
The last line, "He also possesses many skills related to commercial activities" , what does that mean?? I sure have no idea what these skills are, except if they mean lvl 1 crafting skills. Whoopty doo.
Another thing, since you are SUCH an expert on this game after only playing till lvl 34.
Crafter Dwarfss who you say can easily hunt and gather enough mats to craft an item worth 500m, that is utter bull.
As a Bounty Hunter, people will want to group with you, because the spoils are being shared. If the Bounty Hunter is greedy and is not sharing spoils, he gets kicked from group.
Problem with Crafter dwarf, no one wants to group with them. How often do you see: Artisan LFG or WS LFG?
I've been playing this game for about 8 months non stop, and I can honestly tell you, I've seen that message only 1 time. That is it.
So if no one wants to group with them, how in the world are they gonna get the mats themselfs by hunting if they can barely kill and after a while, can't solo at all unless with clan/ally members???
What actually happens, is usually other classes farm or manor the materials, go to dwarfs to craft the items, or sell those mats to dwarfs. Some mats can take months to farm for some of the items.
Moral of my post, Play the game a little more before trying to suggest the things that you do.
Another thing, this game is meant to be Hard Core.
That's not a cup of soup everyone likes.
If we do not like it I guess we should all just quit......
Speak for yourself, I love this game and I tryed oh so many other MMO's before I found L2 as my 1 and only game. Thank you very much.
......because NC probabily wont do anything about it...
BINGO!!!
I really, seriously doubt NC will do anything about it, because that's just the way they want it.
I have a question for you now.
You keep on suggesting that Adena should get regular wipes.
If you can barely scrape enough Adena right now, how in the world would regular adena wipes help YOU?
Say you just spent a month, finaly got 3m adena, and now it's gone(hey, it's Your suggestion) so now you, yourself is back to square 1.
Will you then come back to the boards and start complaing about these adena wipes?
amazing that not one high lvl ws has replyed to this post
i blame it on the fact that there are so few of us (and your post is barely worth replying to)
i have a very high lvl ws and a very very high lvl spellsinger so let me tell you a little story
my first toon was an elf mage (yet to decide spellsinger or summoner)
it never spammed sps but by lvl 25 it was fairly poorly equipt
i heard that dwarfs made mad bank so i rolled one to try and get money for my main
i choose a crafter (big mistake) by the time i was 25 i had borrowed 2 million adena from my mage to equip the dwarf, due to its poor hunting skills even top d grade (given to me by a friend) was insufficient meanwhile the mage was effectively soloing yellow and red mobs with mid d grade without spirit shots
haveing read a guide to making money on dwarfs (the infamous c1 million adena ss guide) i decided to go into the ss and sps bussiness
well spending hours a day searching for bargains on stuff to crush i was well capable of making 40-60k an hour... amazing huh thats nearly 20% of what you could make on your mage and all i have to do is sit in town and click a button every 30 seconds (mp regen is about 2mp per tick)
now by lvl 40 guess what? i had top d grade (from a friend) and about 700k, any money i actually earned from crafting i had to put back into hunting since a mob that drops 200a will cost me 250a to kill, it took about 30 seconds to kill the mob and i would have to rest every 4 mobs
now c grade wasnt fun for my spellsinger or my ws but my spellsinger managed to afford a karmian set and low c staff meanwhile my ws was wearing brig (with helm that i farmed and crafted myself) with a tarber
at this point i rerolled a scav to 40 to try and get some c grade for the ws
now here comes the fun part of the story
thx to the wonder of shared spoil, by lvl 40 i had made about 3 million even though the scav was fully twinked
my initial idea was to use the scav to farm mats so i could craft a SOR (second top d) now anyone doing some quick maths will tell you that a sor can be crafted for about 1.6 million it can then maybe be sold for 1.6-1.65 (if taxes are high and an ebayer wants it)
so you ask me how did i afford c grade?
the answer is manor system. i spent 1 week farmer oren manor and by the end of that time i had made enough to get top c weapon and armor and put some +'s on it
whats interesting about that is that any other class can actually use the manor system better than a dwarf
sorry that this post is so long but ill tell you how my sps got equipt
low c weapon and karmian set by doing nothing but hunting.
at about 44 my first l2 event hit (l2 letter event) now even though i spent equal time on the sps as i did the ws by the end of the event my mage had made 10x as much adena as the dwarf did
but guess what? with 30+ mil in the bank i choose not to upgrade my staff, dwarfs will laugh at this but a mage can actually solo all the way to 52 useing a low c weapon
at b grade is where things get really interesting for mages
every clan on the server wanted a b grade spellsinger and i was lucky enough to get into one that actively raided and aoed
now most ppl will tell you that raiding is one of the best ways to make adena and get equiptment so tell me how many times did the clan say "want to bring your ws to the raid?" answer none
a dwarf is useless at raids and hence never gets to go
ok so im gonna cut this post short here because odds are your hatred for these imaginary uber dorfs wont allow you to understand this post
let me add i spent 3 weeks crafting bss 8 hours a day to get my ws b grade armor and i crafted my aoba (on another dwarf because registering the recipie would cost too much)
at 68 my sps was in full a grade armor with a +7 homu (thx to drops raids, manor system and crafting weapons on other ws's)
my ws still has b grade armor the same aoba and a low a grade pole
BTW if you read my post "i made my first million" you will see that i can make about 3 million a day this requires me to have a recharger (since it quadriples my mp recovery) and to sit in town crafting for 6+ hours it also means i have to invest about 20 mil in soul ore and crystals
im sure at your low lvl that seems amazing but give some of the elfs on this board that money and ill bet they make 5x that
Oh and about those 500 million adena weapons there is no such thing
a top a grade weapon sells for about 250 on my server it would cost about 200 to make, anything selling for close to 500 is heavily enchanted
i personally dont have the cash to craft something like that so i leave it to the elves
in summary... any class can make as much adena if not more than a dwarf we get about 10% more money making capacity and in return we have 2x less fighting capacity
next time you see a dwarf with 1 billion+ adena (you obviously think there are alot of them) check what armor and weapon he has my guess is its crafting gear or ng armor
now ask him how much % he has got the past month O.O
you think you cant make as much adena and more xp than a dwarf i say you can but you are lazy
BTW if you read my post "i made my first million" you will see that i can make about 3 million a day this requires me to have a recharger (since it quadriples my mp recovery) and to sit in town crafting for 6+ hours it also means i have to invest about 20 mil in soul ore and crystals
im sure at your low lvl that seems amazing but give some of the elfs on this board that money and ill bet they make 5x that.
How about Dark Elves? :p
My spell howler makes far more money than my Bounty hunter is..........just by Hunting mobs. But hey, that's just what you said there didn't ya? :p
OP is clueless and unwilling to learn how and what to do and just wants an Easy way out. eg: NC Fix economy, or Ebay.
by TimeCop
Once again, Ban every bot, bot users have more than one account, and often run off of routers......
Care to tell me what do ROUTERS do for Botters?
Oh and by the way, there are many more American websites selling Adena NOT counting Ebay which is a US based company. So this goes hand in hand with your German comment.
All I can say is that a new player with a good head between his shoulders who knows how to show courtesy towards his 'in game seniors' can get by easily in terms of making money.
ETA: I switched to an artisan on my farming (which was at its peak worth about 10 million a day). Not because she could craft for profit, but so I could save myself time looking for DSS - she simply killed well enough that not having to leave my dingy little dungeon place was enough incentive to choose her over an elf. Doesn't it say something about the profit of crafting when a level 28 artisan can make more money by hunting solo smartly than a high level - what, 60+ by now? - warsmith can make all day with a recharger's help?
much more than 60+
my lvl will become pretty obvious come c4 (new skill hint hint)
the fact remains a lvl 40 anything can make as much as i do a day
maybe that means i cant play my toon which is prolly true but i have alot of ws buddies and im one of the richest of them
it comes down to one simple fact the money i earned came from sacrificing xp one thing that the op and the other dwarf haters refuse to do
BTW for price info on teon when i started to looking for a c weapon crystal staff started at 2 went to 4 is now ~5.5 mil
Hom swords stared at 4-5 mil when they became popular because of complaints the dwarves push thier price to 8mil now i seen them toping 24mil that is in a period of 4 weeks.
This is the type of dwarf/ebay inflation i am talking about just a few examples.
Holy cow......... I have no words for that comment, really.
I must ask you a question Darkbird about that comment.
Did you BUY your Account from Ebay, or did you play your character(s) from lvl 1 and up?
Dark Screamers(Aka: Homunk sword/Sword of Whispering Death/Akat Bow, etc) is obtainable from NPC in GIRAN.
Do you even know how to get Crystals, especially D and C and what affects their prices?
Did I say Give Line Age 2 A Bad Raiting? No I didnt say bad, But if I got G4, or something to come sign up, and paid for their subscript + a CD for them to get on, they would probabily do it, and they would see how hard it is as a newbie, then they would rate it bad, Im not asking them to rate it bad, but they would... Im saying something needs to be done, or this game is seriously going to loose customer's, and we dont want that, Im trying to make a point...
He prolly doesnt, as I pointed out the prices didnt change like that. Only high OEd homus sell for 24mil or more. Normal price for clean homu is from lux shop 6mil, or from the market at 6,5-7mil. +3 with Acumen is 9-10mil.
D-cry sells 600-640 on market and C-cry is usually 2900-2950 but you can get em cheaper with buyshop or hunting cheap items and crushing. Or training bots ^^
Warsmith = LOTS of work and still not that much of an advantage in making money. Props to all A-grade smiths.
New gamers have it easy, they can always ask for advice or check different forums. Lots of info on making cash to be found. But if they're too lazy or cant understand the mechanics, well then they can blame only their own lack of skills and vigor for it. Also, all those newbie SS/buffs and all make it a lot easier to start a new account ^^
Learn from the veterans is my advice to all of em. If they refuse to do so, then they might aswell go somewhere else.
No I am not a Greedy Person, whenever I have either maxed out my character with good gear, or before then, when I have enough adena, I give newbies items, and donate Items to clans, no I am not a PIG...
Yes, yes you are. You want to be given more money without needing to do the work that everyone else did to get where they are. That's greed. A greedy philanthropist is still greedy.
At least this thread has given me a new .sig :cool:
Yes, yes you are. You want to be given more money without needing to do the work that everyone else did to get where they are. That's greed. A greedy philanthropist is still greedy.
No I did not say I am not willing to work for it, where did I ever say that, I just need to know a few ways, because hunting monsters at my level, I dont really get any adena.
Didn't you listen to TimeCop ? Only Dwarves can earn money. All other races do not even get adena as drops from mobs they kill. Everytime a mob drops adena, there is a dwarf materializing with their leet teleport skill and robbing the adena away. Same with material, which the dwarves then use to craft 100 items per day, using only 10 basic mats per item and spending no money on the recipe, so that they can sell the item for 99.9% profit.
Seriously, you got to listen closer to what the Cop is saying.
No I did not say I am not willing to work for it, where did I ever say that
Ahem. Allow me to remind you of your own statements and the obvious conclusions. Bear in mind that, while all of these are from your own statements in this thread, I could form a similar list out of any of the several redundant threads you have created.
You are more interested in gaining levels and "having fun" than with making profit.
Who plays Line Age 2 for fun, and not 100% ecnomics? I play Line Age 2 for fun
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If i buy D grade spirit shots, I will waste all my adena, and wont make any adena at all, so what do I do? The answer is dont buy them, and spend over 8 hours a day trying to get from 34 to 37 ?
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because nothing is being done about the prices, no one is able to have fun, everyone is worried about ecnomics
Also of note in those is the fact that you completely fail to recognize that the economy is fun for some people...but that's a side issue.
You are not interested in the "money-making" class, in fact you have a pronounced hatred for them:
I would be forced to play a dwarf
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What about us who hate playing certain jobs? Doesnt that ruin the (Fun) of the game? For Example, I hate Playing a Dwarf
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For all you dwarfs who dont know what your doing...
#1 Dwarf Farmers or (Spoilers) increase prices and sell items to creafters...
#2 Dwarf (Crafters) Increase the production price a lot more...
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not every one of us like playing dwarf, just because you like to doesnt mean I do
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they are money makers, thats why I dont like playting them
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dwafs control the whole ecnomic system in this game, not the players.
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Dwarfs Control the whole ecnomic system about.
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What do you think Bots do? They are Spoiler Bots, they Sell you Legal Dwarf's high crafts that cost 100mil, and as a result you increase the prices a lot, and it ruins it for all of us newbies
You regularly say that you don’t want to play the money-making class, you want money to be handed to you on a silver platter for playing a class that doesn’t make money. You also equate Dwarves with bots on a regular basis, which frankly I consider defamation and think you should have your forum account suspended for, but that’s probably just me.
You're also a fan of heavy-handed "solutions" that don't solve the problem and screw over players who are better off than you:
I think the whole game needs to be reset
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this game should be reset when the prices go really high, reset as in reset only everyones adena, and not allowing the resell of items they currently ownd before after the resell
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Now stop thinking about yourself if you got 50Billion adena, and be willing to give it up, so that it may help all of us on a reset. …
Fix it so you can no longer drop adena, or trade adena, except to buy from private shops, then there would be no way to bot this game to sell adena
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They need to make this game so you cant drop or trade adena
None of these “solutions” would fix the economy, and every one of them is designed to screw over the established players to give yourself an artificial advantage.
And, not involving being a lazy and greedy, but just for fun—quotables I found that are either ridiculously ignorant or just plain out-in-left-field:
One of the facts is that a level 50 Fighter, or mystic will make over 40% less adena than a level 50 Dwarf will
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Fighter/Mages should be able to make at least 50% or a little less tahn what a dwarf can killing things
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I am not a Greedy Person, whenever I have either maxed out my character with good gear
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I dont expect it to be 100% perfect, it will never be, but I expect it to be a good game, in which it never is
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I would expect to at least make 3mil a week at 50+, which I bet I still wont be able to do
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Yes this is true, but Dwarfs can sell items worth over 4mil a day, while we only make 100k-200k at my level, or less?
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It is kind of hard to solo, because you have to hit mobs a lot
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Dwarf need to realize that once they learn a recipie its theirs to keep forever unless they delete character
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You guys dont really see the big picture, The big picture is I have a lot of newbie friends agreeing with me
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Please stop trying to deny the fact that the games ecnomic system is way out of control
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more of our sugguestions should be added to the game, they should have a voting system going on in the game, where you can press alt+B and vote, and 1 month after the vote, they calculate the percenatege, and or people from all servers, to see if it wins, and if it wins they fix the problem people dont like
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No I am not mental
"It is kind of hard to solo, because you have to hit mobs a lot"
that is probobly one of the best things ive heard in a long time and i seriusly (as i said before) cant understand why you bother to play this game when its so horrible and run by an army of evil dwarfs. i wouldnt pay 15$/month for a game that i dont have fun playing, but hey maybe thats just me.
its no wonder that you dont have alot of money if you spam shots and havnt even tried the manor system (another thread). you could start by actualy reading the info on this site and what everyone have been trying to tell you.
Sorry, but Goethe was a german and as TimeCop stated, he suspects the germans to be responsible for the bots and farmers, as the germans have so many adena-selling sites.
In his logic, Goethe is probably the founder of the adena-selling companies and with you agreeing with Goethe, you are agreeing with the adena-selling then. Oh and of course Goethe was a Dwarf and was controling the german economy with his lyrics.
BAAaaad Musician!! promoting such a cheater !
No I did not say I am not willing to work for it, where did I ever say that
Ahem. Allow me to remind you of your own statements and the obvious conclusions. Bear in mind that, while all of these are from your own statements in this thread, I could form a similar list out of any of the several redundant threads you have created.
You are more interested in gaining levels and "having fun" than with making profit.
Who plays Line Age 2 for fun, and not 100% ecnomics? I play Line Age 2 for fun
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If i buy D grade spirit shots, I will waste all my adena, and wont make any adena at all, so what do I do? The answer is dont buy them, and spend over 8 hours a day trying to get from 34 to 37 ?
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because nothing is being done about the prices, no one is able to have fun, everyone is worried about ecnomics
Also of note in those is the fact that you completely fail to recognize that the economy is fun for some people...but that's a side issue.
You are not interested in the "money-making" class, in fact you have a pronounced hatred for them:
I would be forced to play a dwarf
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What about us who hate playing certain jobs? Doesnt that ruin the (Fun) of the game? For Example, I hate Playing a Dwarf
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For all you dwarfs who dont know what your doing...
#1 Dwarf Farmers or (Spoilers) increase prices and sell items to creafters...
#2 Dwarf (Crafters) Increase the production price a lot more...
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not every one of us like playing dwarf, just because you like to doesnt mean I do
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they are money makers, thats why I dont like playting them
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dwafs control the whole ecnomic system in this game, not the players.
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Dwarfs Control the whole ecnomic system about.
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What do you think Bots do? They are Spoiler Bots, they Sell you Legal Dwarf's high crafts that cost 100mil, and as a result you increase the prices a lot, and it ruins it for all of us newbies
You regularly say that you don’t want to play the money-making class, you want money to be handed to you on a silver platter for playing a class that doesn’t make money. You also equate Dwarves with bots on a regular basis, which frankly I consider defamation and think you should have your forum account suspended for, but that’s probably just me.
You're also a fan of heavy-handed "solutions" that don't solve the problem and screw over players who are better off than you:
I think the whole game needs to be reset
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this game should be reset when the prices go really high, reset as in reset only everyones adena, and not allowing the resell of items they currently ownd before after the resell
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Now stop thinking about yourself if you got 50Billion adena, and be willing to give it up, so that it may help all of us on a reset. …
Fix it so you can no longer drop adena, or trade adena, except to buy from private shops, then there would be no way to bot this game to sell adena
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They need to make this game so you cant drop or trade adena
None of these “solutions” would fix the economy, and every one of them is designed to screw over the established players to give yourself an artificial advantage.
And, not involving being a lazy and greedy, but just for fun—quotables I found that are either ridiculously ignorant or just plain out-in-left-field:
One of the facts is that a level 50 Fighter, or mystic will make over 40% less adena than a level 50 Dwarf will
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Fighter/Mages should be able to make at least 50% or a little less tahn what a dwarf can killing things
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I am not a Greedy Person, whenever I have either maxed out my character with good gear
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I dont expect it to be 100% perfect, it will never be, but I expect it to be a good game, in which it never is
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I would expect to at least make 3mil a week at 50+, which I bet I still wont be able to do
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Yes this is true, but Dwarfs can sell items worth over 4mil a day, while we only make 100k-200k at my level, or less?
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It is kind of hard to solo, because you have to hit mobs a lot
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Dwarf need to realize that once they learn a recipie its theirs to keep forever unless they delete character
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You guys dont really see the big picture, The big picture is I have a lot of newbie friends agreeing with me
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Please stop trying to deny the fact that the games ecnomic system is way out of control
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more of our sugguestions should be added to the game, they should have a voting system going on in the game, where you can press alt+B and vote, and 1 month after the vote, they calculate the percenatege, and or people from all servers, to see if it wins, and if it wins they fix the problem people dont like
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No I am not mental
I need a bigger .sig :cool:
Here we go again...
I am intrestered, in Meeting New people, Fun, Roleplay, and Making a profit, what fun is it, if you walk around 24/7 trying to make adena from a repeatable quest, Boring...
Why do I hate money making classes? Because they have no good fighting skills, cant PVP people, ect, but this is what I think, doesnt mean that other people feel the same way...
You regularly say that you don’t want to play the money-making class, you want money to be handed to you on a silver platter for playing a class that doesn’t make money. You also equate Dwarves with bots on a regular basis, which frankly I consider defamation and think you should have your forum account suspended for, but that’s probably just me.
You're also a fan of heavy-handed "solutions" that don't solve the problem and screw over players who are better off than you:
NO I did not say I wanted It handed to me on a silver platter, but every class should be able to afford things in this game, I mean we shouldnt have to play like 8 hours a day, and waste 1 year, just so we can get like 200mil,or more, so we can get an item we want at level 75 +
None of these “solutions” would fix the economy, and every one of them is designed to screw over the established players to give yourself an artificial advantage.
And, not involving being a lazy and greedy, but just for fun—quotables I found that are either ridiculously ignorant or just plain out-in-left-field:
This is bull, it would not screw over everyone, Right now us newbies are the ones getting screwed over, and thats why over 20% newbies buy adena...
The reason is, if the ecnomic system was reset, and everyones adena was 0, it would be fair, and the items that we currently have, inc newbies, are fixed so they cannot be traded, or sold to npcs, they can only be junked, that way people can sell them back to npc and make 50k or more.
Then everyones prices would go back down, to like when the game first started, except something will be done about the bots, and we will all feel happy... I mean, how is this giving me an advantage, Isnt it giving everyone an Advantage, to those who are not rich...
Any class in this game should be able to make at least 3mil a week at a a higher level without having to play a crafter/dwarf, Dwarfs should make more cash due to the fact that they work hard to craft, but fighter/mystics should all be able to at least get 3mil, without having to quest 24/7, I dont see what is wrong with earning it, but 24/7 non stop quests, that would bore anyone, dont believe me go try it...
It is kind of hard to solo, because you have to hit mobs a lot This one, I must of been tired when I typed this one, from staying up all night, prob wasnt thinking straight for this one sentence I put here...
No I am not Mental either, but this is startig to really suck, I know some people like playing dwarfs, but for those who dont, they should also be able to afford good gear, without questing 24/7 just for good gear, and stuff...
I am not saying we shouldn't work for it, because Dwarf work hard too, but we should be able to get good adena, what if all Mobs dropped adena, including dark blue monsters, then we would have a way to make some adena...
I am also not saying that German's are the only reason for Adena selling, but they arent the only ones, and I am not racist...
"Any class in this game should be able to make at least 3mil a week at a a higher level without having to play a crafter/dwarf, Dwarfs should make more cash due to the fact that they work hard to craft, but fighter/mystics should all be able to at least get 3mil, without having to quest 24/7, I dont see what is wrong with earning it, but 24/7 non stop quests, that would bore anyone, dont believe me go try it... "
one question for you, how is it you know that you cant make 3+mil per week at higher levels? have you played this game at a high level?.. no you havnt, hell with my main i can make 3mil in a week without a problem and you know what, shes not even a dwarf
"NO I did not say I wanted It handed to me on a silver platter, but every class should be able to afford things in this game, I mean we shouldnt have to play like 8 hours a day, and waste 1 year, just so we can get like 200mil,or more, so we can get an item we want at level 75 + "
well if you dont like to grind this is so the wrong game for you, just stop playing this game and most of the asian ones and stick with the ones made here in the west, this is a grind game, get used to it.
and just forgett the idea about a reset, i wouldnt do any good, it would ruin the economy. and you honestly think that it wouldnt leed to even more people buying adena? suddenly the bots would truly control the market.
if you think that its boring to actualy do the things that give you money, its your own fault if you are broke in the game. just go play wow or something like that instead, it would probobly suit you much better.
"Any class in this game should be able to make at least 3mil a week at a a higher level without having to play a crafter/dwarf, Dwarfs should make more cash due to the fact that they work hard to craft, but fighter/mystics should all be able to at least get 3mil, without having to quest 24/7, I dont see what is wrong with earning it, but 24/7 non stop quests, that would bore anyone, dont believe me go try it... "
one question for you, how is it you know that you cant make 3+mil per week at higher levels? have you played this game at a high level?.. no you havnt, hell with my main i can make 3mil in a week without a problem and you know what, shes not even a dwarf
"NO I did not say I wanted It handed to me on a silver platter, but every class should be able to afford things in this game, I mean we shouldnt have to play like 8 hours a day, and waste 1 year, just so we can get like 200mil,or more, so we can get an item we want at level 75 + "
well if you dont like to grind this is so the wrong game for you, just stop playing this game and most of the asian ones and stick with the ones made here in the west, this is a grind game, get used to it.
and just forgett the idea about a reset, i wouldnt do any good, it would ruin the economy. and you honestly think that it wouldnt leed to even more people buying adena? suddenly the bots would truly control the market.
if you think that its boring to actualy do the things that give you money, its your own fault if you are broke in the game. just go play wow or something like that instead, it would probobly suit you much better.
No I do not mind grinding this game, I just dont like to have to do a repeatable quest 24/7 to make any adena at all, now thats what mental people do, other than that I would do the quest for adena, and do rain bosses with clans, ect, but to grind 24/7, never meet new people, they should just make this game a single player game then... I dont mind grinding this game, because thats part that makes it fun, but when It is 24/7 too much, like 5-8 hours a day, and when you have a Real Life job, that is kinda hard...
again, I know that resetting the ecnomic system, you all think would ruin it, but it wouldnt, because newbies wouldnt be able to buy adena, if everyones was wiped out, because they wouldn't have anything to sell, and if GM's watched bots more, or found a way to stop them, then did the reset, it would be really great for all of us, this is what I think, not sure about everyone tho...
No I have not played higher levels, but, I will be over 40 soon...
No I do not mind grinding this game, I just dont like to have to do a repeatable quest 24/7 to make any adena at all, now thats what mental people do, other than that I would do the quest for adena, and do rain bosses with clans, ect, but to grind 24/7, never meet new people, they should just make this game a single player game then... I dont mind grinding this game, because thats part that makes it fun, but when It is 24/7 too much, like 5-8 hours a day, and when you have a Real Life job, that is kinda hard...
its during the grinding most of us actualy meets people, there is hardly any reason to do it solo, you are soposed to be in a party as its intended in this game. as i said before, this is how the game is, get used to it cus it wont change.
again, I know that resetting the ecnomic system, you all think would ruin it, but it wouldnt, because newbies wouldnt be able to buy adena, if everyones was wiped out, because they wouldn't have anything to sell, and if GM's watched bots more, or found a way to stop them, then did the reset, it would be really great for all of us, this is what I think, not sure about everyone tho...
and you continue to be as ignorant as ever, of course it wouldnt, how could i ever have doubted your word cus aparently you hold all the absolut answers for this game.
and how many days do you think it would take before the botters had money to sell again? sure the price would go up and we would probobly se even more botters trying to get a cut of the adena inc biz.
Yes of course I know about bots, but If there were more GM'S, or if NC would find a way to put an end to bot users, then reset it, it would actually work...
Yes I know this is a party game, at like level 40 + you really have to party, but one thing is, no one uses the search function, so on my server, when I am on, it is kind of hard to find party members at my level, because I am on in the morning hours a lot, and no one is looking for party, over 50% of the time I shout for one, and no one is inviting, and no one is looking for a party...
Maybe it is just because I am a not level 40 + yet, well I will have to wait and see, I am not asking for that to be changed, But what about when no one is looking for a party, since no one uses the search function, it is kind of hard to move to 1 area to another, without wasteing adena for a teleport...
#1 no one uses the party function, they all shout, what do I do when I shout, and cant find anyone within my rage, or cant get invited to one?
#2 What about clan members, what If they arent in my ranger or are not on?
Then it is really kinda hard to grind, Maybe its just because of my level...
Yesterday I did get a party of 7 tho, first time ive ever found a party like this, but XP was slower than what I was soloing...
When I was talking about not likeing to grind, I was talking about grinding Solo quests all day, the ones that can be solo, why waste time doing a quest like 5-8 hours per day, and not meet anyone?
This is bull, it would not screw over everyone, Right now us newbies are the ones getting screwed over, and thats why over 20% newbies buy adena...
The reason is, if the ecnomic system was reset, and everyones adena was 0, it would be fair, and the items that we currently have, inc newbies, are fixed so they cannot be traded, or sold to npcs, they can only be junked, that way people can sell them back to npc and make 50k or more.
Please tell me, how it would be fair to me to loose my currently 11 Million adena Cash ?
I do have full B-grade right now, so I do not need to buy any items, and I cannot afford A-grade yet, that is why I can only keep the cash as cash.
Your suggestion to give ahead warning, so I could buy items (which are then non-tradeable) wouldn't work, as for my 11 Million I cannot buy anything, that I need.
Now please explain to me, how it would be fair to me to loose all my money, just cause you want it and got the idea, that it would solve any problem.
This is another sugguestion I just thought about...
#1 Fix guards, so that people cant attack them to DeLevel, that way bots can no longer Delevel that way, and it would take them longer, unless they pked each other...
#2 Bots use the map coords, or something like that is a way point system, so if GM's, or Nc finds a way to stop this from happening in the game, it would stop bots, for example, you find a bot, pk the bot, it comes back, and starts killing again, so If NC, Or GM's could put an end to this, it would stop bots, then a reset would work...
Also here Ill give you an example of how bots work...
Person runs a program in the back ground, example Bot2.0
Then the program enables commands in the game of lineage 2 like any other command, except the people that use bots c an now type an in game command, like /record path 1, so that they can record waypoints, and automatically load them later, so they dont gotta do it again, or they use a box in the back ground...
NC/GM's, could fix it so that the game runs a scan through all of the files, as they start the game, to detect any modified files, like a quick scan, kind of like sony, before you enter Line Age2, that way any modifed file could be detected, and they would also need a way to fix it so people cannot run it after they start the game, or run it outside of L2 Directory...
An even simpler way, they could go around like normal players as GM's ,and search for bots, then ask if they are a bot, if no answer, and they keep doing the same thing Ban them, but GM's would use a name like a regular person with GM tag, that way people wouldn't know, Its simple, watch waht they do, if they keep repeating same actions, and dont respond to the GM Ban them...
If something could be done about bots, then the adena reset would work, and all the items that people had before reset, would have to be made so that they could not be sold to shop, or traded, but items after reset could...
BOT users have their own AI system just like the game, Its just a program, all programs can be detected some how, my advice find a way, make an anti bot patch, and as soon as they try to use it and log in, they recieve a ban notice... That would be cool...
The only thing is their AI system only controls their character, and other bot users in party...
This is bull, it would not screw over everyone, Right now us newbies are the ones getting screwed over, and thats why over 20% newbies buy adena...
The reason is, if the ecnomic system was reset, and everyones adena was 0, it would be fair, and the items that we currently have, inc newbies, are fixed so they cannot be traded, or sold to npcs, they can only be junked, that way people can sell them back to npc and make 50k or more.
Please tell me, how it would be fair to me to loose my currently 11 Million adena Cash ?
I do have full B-grade right now, so I do not need to buy any items, and I cannot afford A-grade yet, that is why I can only keep the cash as cash.
Your suggestion to give ahead warning, so I could buy items (which are then non-tradeable) wouldn't work, as for my 11 Million I cannot buy anything, that I need.
Now please explain to me, how it would be fair to me to loose all my money, just cause you want it and got the idea, that it would solve any problem.
Fair Kitten
Well Its not just about you, what if I had 100 mil, I would loose it all so that newbies could benifit from it them selves, and by the way, the B grade armor would cost a lot less if the adena was reset, because everyone would start off at 0, so why would it automatically cost 11 mil or more for B grade armor, if no one can afford it, then you would have a chance to buy it...
If I had to loose 100mil or more, If everyone would benifit from it, and it wouldn't happen again with bots, I would do it knowing that I helped everyone, and I would also be able to afford gear again, because the gear would cost less than it did before the reset was done, so please tell me, why wouldnt you want to loose the 11mil, and be able to buy maybe a whole B grade set for a lot less?
We cant let these bots win and take over this game, The bots are the people who want to stay like it is, because they get paid good cash selling adena, and what would you do if you had $300 extra per month? Wouldn't you like it, wouldn't you want it to stay the same so you could continue, what if NC/GM's found a way to put an end to it, and everyone could get what they wanted for less, but still had to work for it?
NC/GM's, could fix it so that the game runs a scan through all of the files, as they start the game, to detect any modified files, like a quick scan, kind of like sony, before you enter Line Age2, that way any modifed file could be detected, and they would also need a way to fix it so people cannot run it after they start the game, or run it outside of L2 Directory...
Really cool idea. Sounds like a Guard for the Game, very cool.
Hmm. We could call that Gameguard and have it block all programs from interfering with the Lineage2 Client, that would be totally fantastic.
Yes, we definitely need such a program.
Oh wait. I fear, if botters would just use a bot program instead of the client, they would bypass this Gameguard. To bad.
Kudos to your intense knowledge on how bots work, TimeCop.
im sorry but i dont se what fair with it either, why should the people who have worked their buts of for something have it taken away. you dont seem to realise that even if you can make more cash when at higher levels the price for those things are much more expensive becouse they need a [censored] load of mats to be crafted, it wont become cheap just becouse everything is taken away, they will just become more expensive.
Well Its not just about you, what if I had 100 mil, I would loose it all so that newbies could benifit from it them selves, and by the way, the B grade armor would cost a lot less if the adena was reset, because everyone would start off at 0, so why would it automatically cost 11 mil or more for B grade armor, if no one can afford it, then you would have a chance to buy it...
If I had to loose 100mil or more, If everyone would benifit from it, and it wouldn't happen again with bots, I would do it knowing that I helped everyone, and I would also be able to afford gear again, because the gear would cost less than it did before the reset was done, so please tell me, why wouldnt you want to loose the 11mil, and be able to buy maybe a whole B grade set for a lot less?
I do have B-Grade, I need A-Grade.
And why exactly do you believe, that just beacuse suddenly noone has any money, anyone would sell A-Grade for 10.000a ?
I do not see, how removing money will lower the prices for extremely expensive stuff, which is MEANT to be expensive.
Also, lets say, we clone my own account and have another player in my same situation, with the same char and the same equipment. Only the cash is different. They got 50 Million, not 11 Million like I do. And another clone, that got only 1 Million.
And now after your suggested wipe, I do loose 11 Million, the other guys loose 50 Million or just 1 Million.
And how would that be fair ?
Yes, I know in the holy bible, there is this story of that guy giving 20 silver to everyone working on his vineyard. He gave the guy who worked all day 20 silver and the guy, who came late and worked only 1h was given 20 silver too.
Nice story, but Lineage2 is not the bible. I do not want to loose, what I earned with my own hands. I take pride in the fact, that I made my way and I am proud of my cash that I gathered and the materials stuffed in my warehouse. If I want to loose all that, I would just start out on another server.
So the new question:
Why would anyone sell an item, that is currently worth 50 Million for 50.000a, just because noone got any money ? They could just keep the item and slay a couple mobs and have 50.000a without having to sell the item.
You sell an item to make more cash with the sale than you could get in the same time with hunting mobs.
How would I be able to buy anything ? Especially since with your idea, all the items, that players only bought for their excess money are no-sale, so there isn't even anything to be sold.
Do you really believe, that anyone will take the time to kill Antharas to then sell the A-grade weapons for 5 Million each ?
We cant let these bots win and take over this game, The bots are the people who want to stay like it is, because they get paid good cash selling adena, and what would you do if you had $300 extra per month? Wouldn't you like it, wouldn't you want it to stay the same so you could continue, what if NC/GM's found a way to put an end to it, and everyone could get what they wanted for less, but still had to work for it?
This again sounds to me, as if everyone, who does not agree with your suggestion is a botter in your eyes.
Yes, I would like 300$ extra per month, but I am not getting it, at least not from breaking any L2-rules.
Still I do not like your idea just one bit. If the GMs find a way to remove the botters and adena sellers, I am all for it, but if they need to take away all my money for it, I wonder, why ?
We cant let these bots win and take over this game, The bots are the people who want to stay like it is, because they get paid good cash selling adena, and what would you do if you had $300 extra per month? Wouldn't you like it, wouldn't you want it to stay the same so you could continue, what if NC/GM's found a way to put an end to it, and everyone could get what they wanted for less, but still had to work for it?
This again sounds to me, as if everyone, who does not agree with your suggestion is a botter in your eyes.
Yes, I would like 300$ extra per month, but I am not getting it, at least not from breaking any L2-rules.
Still I do not like your idea just one bit. If the GMs find a way to remove the botters and adena sellers, I am all for it, but if they need to take away all my money for it, I wonder, why ?
Who ? Kitten !
I know that not everyone is a bot, and that people dont feel like loosing what they have earned, neither would I... As a newbie, dont you think my 200k or more weapon means a lot to me? Yeah it does, just like what you have means a lot to you, just because it is expensive, doesnt mean that what we have as newbies means that its not expensive to us...
Yes I know you all hate this sugguestion, but if you can think of another way to get the ecnomic system under control, so everyone can get something please let me know, because I would like to hear it, besides taking care of bots, the damage has already been done by them, and If it is not reset, its going to be players Greed taking over the ecnomic system, because since the bots have really damaged it, It will just continue to stay the same, and go higher, wait untill items are so high not even a newbie can afford D grade equipment at level 30-40, what will that look like? I had a friend that is level 30 and couldnt even afford a good D grade weapon, not to say he still has non grade armor...
Dont just think about yourselves, because you are high levels, think about the newbies that join the game, After the bots are taken care of, normal players are going to be part of the problem too, not part of the solution, if the ecnomic system is not reset, so if you all got any better sugguestions, after the bots have been taken care of, other than leaving it like it is, and Increaseing drop rates, Please tell me here, so that other people may decide if its any good...
Another Thing, By the prices staying the same, and going up, instead of coming down, Bots just love that, because it helps them make more real life cash, because more future newbies will buy adena, so if you all want to continue to jack up the prices, it wont just effect me, it will effect lots of newbies, and they will most likely buy adena once they hear about it, and over 50% of the time adena buyers dont get caught...
Geez,
Do you realize that for making adena dwarf (artisan) have to SIT ALMOST 24/7 IN TOWN AND BUY/SELL ?? He doesn't get any exp from this. If you would have half the profit of a dwarf without sacrificing any XP then you won't see me crafting anymore.
I got two words for you, Second Account, I would make a 2nd account, and run the games twice on my pc here, yes it is possible, or wait untill you go to bed, or while you are out shopping, or afk, thats what I would do, doesnt really cost anything if you do it this way...
You can even do it with one account, while you are afk, sleeping, or out shopping ect, or you can use 2 accounts, and play with one, while your other sells items in game, no it is not cheating, because your paying for both accounts, Yes lots of botters doing it, but as long as you do not use (TPP) Third Party Programs, it is not cheating, altho lots of (BOTS) do this, you dont have to be a bot to do it...
i know very well that its hard for a newbee, im one myself but its not as hard as you claim it to be. you constantly refuse to do the things people sugest that you do to get money cus you think that they are boring. well if the shoe doesnt fit, change the **** shoe dont shop of your foot..
just bescous people are at a high level doesnt meen that they can get their gear easier then you, i worket my but of to be able to get a homu sword for my main, i got it when i was like 52 mainly cus i didnt start using the manor untill i was over 40.
its you who should stop thinking about your self, cus your ideas wouldnt help most of the players.
yes increasing the droprates for mats is one way that i actualy think would help the economy
Yes same goes I could do the same, but I do not like playing crafters, and spoilers, because to me they are boring, hard, ect. But this is just my opinion, I would rather make good adena with my mage, or a huamn fighter, I am not saying people dont like playing dwarf...
Once again I love every race, and respect what people like, and dont like in their opinions, if someone wants to tell me I am a smelly human, they can, I dont care, I have already been told it lots of times, that I smell like fish, thats what they think, thats their opinions becuase they dont like humans, so be it, It doesnt mean I have to play a Dwarf, just because Others choose to, and I like it, That doesnt mean everyones likes it, but we should all still be able to make good cash, and the ecnomic system shouldn't be so **** hard for newbies...
Not replied to the right post - I'm still not reading all of this because I know I would get very screechy at time cop if I did.
TimeCop, it is very possible for a level 30 character (that is very lowbie) to make 3 million in one day of concentrated playing on the right server (Gustin seems to offer this possibility at the moment).
The highest 'earning in one day' I've had was 5 million before counting any adena and seal stone drops received, in pure manor rewards. I was, afterwards, very close to tears and realised that I was playing a bit more intently than I should have been. That was 10 hours of farming in a circle - on a dwarf, mind you, but a dwarf that was hitting things, which dwarves are spectacularly bad at. If I had done the same thing on a different toon, it would simply have involved more travel (and time lost in a catacomb) and less slow killing, but taken the same time.
I did not have fun in the last hours of farming, but I was very, very happy when I handed in. And that's what this game is all about to me: Toiling, toiling, toiling, and then sweet rewards.
It is possible for any toon, regardless of race, class, or level, to make 3 million easily in one day provided they have enough resources to begin with. Money makes money.
If you don't want to learn making money, you have to learn to saving money. I will point you to two very beautiful pictures and ask you to learn from looking at them:
ETA: re: money reset helping
A money reset would simply widen the gap between the honest but clueless, the ebayers, and those who make it a game to rob the ebayers (both capable market players and farmers) again.
You would still be at the bottom rung until you put effort into it, just like I will be getting omgbbqPWNED in PvP until I put in the effort to learn it.
and once again.. just becous you have a dwarf doesnt make you rich, i have hardly made any money with mine, i made lots more with my mystic at the same level.
the problem is that you dont listen to what we are telling you, you constantly ignore our advice and contunue to go on about how unfair it is for you. its getting very tiredsome to tell you the same thing over and over again when you dont seem to actualy want to try our advices. the game is like it is, if you dont like the fundations of the game play some other instead of trying to impose changes that would upset a very large part of the player base, use some comon sense for christ sake
bout time a newb stepped in and told you its not impossible
ok heres a story
when a man was 25 years old he went for a walk down the street
he passed a shop selling cars, in the shop he seen a beautiful car. it was bright red and shiny, nice wheels, good sound system with a super powerful engine and comfy seats ^^
some would say the best car in the world but he couldnt afford it
the next day he went to look at the car but it was sold :(
later that day he seen the car parked outside a shop and he said to the owner "wow that is a beautiful car, the car of my dreams i would love to own a car like that. how do i get one?"
the man replyed
"you are right it is a beutiful car and indeed it is the car of my dreams too"
this is how i got it
at a young age i studied hard learning everything my tutors would teach me
i then went to college and while studying hard i also worked 2 jobs to afford the best books and teachers
after colledge i got myself a low lvl entry job and spent the next few years working hard so that one day i would be promoted.
every week i put a little money aside and after only 5 years i had saved enough money to own the car
not everyone gets the CAR
just because you arnt prepared to work for it doesnt mean they should take ours away
Yes, but in the world of TimeCop, that guy would have worked his *** off, only to have all the money taken away from him before he could afford the Car, just because the lazy one could not afford it either.
Oh and that is a system, that would be FAIR in TimeCops world.
So glad, that Time is not working as a german or EU politician. I might have to emigrate otherwise.
Kitten, I am surprised that you can not understand that the man who had the car was at an unfair disadvantage because he chose to work rather than poke things with sticks all day long.
My bad, I apologize. I can see, how the man was controlling the ecenomy, cause he was able to afford a car.
Guess it was silly for me to study Computer Science, if I could have instead just played games and have had fun and been just given a house and a car and 5000$ per month.
Where do I go to donate my car to the TimeCop-fund for lazy L2-players with silly suggestions ?
Hm...
You do realize Lineage II is a game, right ? :eek:
Isnt a GAME just supposed to be FUN ? To PLAY ?
And isnt it supposed to be different from real life, that is not so fun all the time, like you perfectly said in your exemple ?
I'm not taking TimeCop's side because he's really... well, i said i'll watch my language so :p, but i guess there could be a middle point between you guys...
Of course we newbies (i've played the game for less than two months) shouldnt get everything right away, but maybe we should be able to get a little something that could make the game fun to play without having to grind for years before it actually becomes interesting...
Oh well, this has been debated over and over again, when is RFOnline gonna be released again ? ;)
rofl that was a great story but im sad to say, i dont think it will do any good cus he wont understand what you meen, it must be nice in the land of timecop.
its very much possible for newbes to get gear, i havnt played for much longer then you, but the problem is that some people just doesnt take in the advice people here are giving them. and if its not a fun game, then that person should change game becouse as you said, it should be fun to play ;)
On teon it's more like the guy works hard day and night earning money for the car.
Some millionare who inhereted the money and pays 10x as much as the car is worth.
Then the guy finaly saveing enugh money comes back to the shop to find the car dealer jacked up the price of all cars 10x becase sombody payed that much and the person who make the cars also sell the cars at new jacked up price.
So the guy goes back to work find his wages are reduced to minimum.
He works like 2/7 and saves finaly he has enugh goes back to the shop and find a billoionare bough the car and 2x the price and all cars are jacked up again.
This continues untill all the billionare bought all the cars.
Then they start on airplanes ect .
well that more or less (in a very simpel way) how real world economy works. and i dont think that the prices on teon is that bad, i like the market there actualy.
In Lineage II, unlike in real life, you are able to easily produce expensive goods that that millionaire wants and rip their not-won money from their pockets.
And yes, Lineage II is a game - a game that makes you buckle down and suffer a bit before you get to the fun, rewarding part. That is how the live servers work, that is their charm for many. There are many fun things you can do at any given time, but if you wish to progress, you'll be 'working'.
I've suggested a few ideas to return it to its game state - but th is would have to be done on a different server.
A server with half EXP, for example, would be a nub's paradise.
Since timecop aint really even trying to understand what people are saying I think it is pointless to continue this discussion. The economy is fine, every player has the same chance to make adena. Every player can craft items, even without owning a dwarf character(private craft shops). Every player can do manor. Every player can get full drops. Every player can operate buy and sell shops. EVERY **** PLAYER CAN MAKE 3mil a DAY at low lvls, if they want to work for their money. It's up to the people, not the game or community. If you cant make the money, you're either lazy, ignorant or dumb as hell. Or all of em combined.
I'm a Destroyer, a big orc that swings a big sword. I'm richer than most dwarfs, I make more money than most dwarfs, you gonna start picking on orcs next?
And yes, Lineage II is a game - a game that makes you buckle down and suffer a bit before you get to the fun, rewarding part.
Yes, and thats exactly what i dont have time to do (**** real life :p), and no real interest in doing neither, so maybe L2 is just not the game for me after all... Well, noone will miss me anyway... :eek:
I've suggested a few ideas to return it to its game state - but th is would have to be done on a different server.
A server with half EXP, for example, would be a nub's paradise.
Yes, there is another thread discussing this kind of idea right now, but i dont know if NCSoft would be ready for this unfortunately...
Not everyone got a car, that is true. But that is RL.
Not everyone has a strider, that is true. And that is Lineage2.
Yes, Lineage2 should not be the same as the real world. I guess noone of us would play it, if it were just like the real world.
But that does not mean either, that everyone should be able to buy a Strider for 100.000a in an NPC shop.
Everyone can make a Strider. Not at lvl 34, but a friend of mine who is lvl 71 did make two striders for himself (main and twink). He did not buy them and he spent a lot less money than what a strider is commonly sold for.
If you cannot afford a car, you can try and find a cheaper car, or try to assemble a car of your own or try and gather all the materials needed for a car and go to someone, who will assemble it for a small fee.
Just cause you cannot personally afford a car, is absolutely no valid reason to demand, that you be given a car or that noone else may have a car either. Up to level 52 you can use requipment, that can be gathered without a dwarf involved, safe for having just one friendly dwarf, who will crush items for you.
You can buy almost all D-grade from shops. At lvl 34 you cannot even use anything but D-grade, so you are not even forced to buy anything from dwarves, safe for your precious Soulshots or Spiritshots, which are are convenience, but not necessary for leveling.
At lvl 40 you will be allowed to use C-grade equipment, and guess what, that can be bought at the luxury shop for a fixed price. No dwarf can influence that price in any way. You pay with crystals there and the crystal price is unable to skyrocket, cause everyone who knows a warsmith can produce their own crystals again at a set rate. You just buy a few D-grade weapons and let the dwarf crush them. You then got D-crystals. You combine 2 D-swords and get C-duals. Have your dwarf friend crush them and you got C-Crystals. Use the D and C crystals to buy a weapon from luxury store.
The most wanted Mage weapon (Homunkulus Sword) cannot be directly bought, but a Dark Screamer can be bought, which then can be exchanged at the Blacksmith of Mammon at NO COST (safe for the 50.000a you need to pay, if you are lvl 40 and not in a castle owning clan to join the 7S Event).
The Homunkulus sword is used by many Mages well into the B-grade range, as it allows the Acumen SA, which the B-grade weapons do not allow yet.
As for armor, I personally equipped my necromancer with a full Demon Set, without having to buy anything from a dwarf. The gloves and boots I got from the coin quest and the robe and stockings can be bought from the luxury store again. That demon set can very well bring me deep into B-grade range again.
So what is your problem at lvl 34 or lower ? You are not even close to the level range, where you need a dwarf crafted item. That is B-grade and A-grade and you already demand lower prices for that, altough you will likely never reach that level cause you are lacking the patience for the grind.
In Lineage II, unlike in real life, you are able to easily produce expensive goods that that millionaire wants and rip their not-won money from their pockets.
And yes, Lineage II is a game - a game that makes you buckle down and suffer a bit before you get to the fun, rewarding part. That is how the live servers work, that is their charm for many. There are many fun things you can do at any given time, but if you wish to progress, you'll be 'working'.
I've suggested a few ideas to return it to its game state - but th is would have to be done on a different server.
A server with half EXP, for example, would be a nub's paradise.
I think the grind in that case would be unbearable. They would have more adena per level but the levels would take far too long to complete. The game would lack any sense of accomplishment because even the most minor tasks would take far too long. It already takes far too long to see any progress.. at half xp it woulld be unplayable to all but the most hardcore.
It's a matter of mindset, but it would be much easier, and more accessible to people who don't want to work markets.
It wouldn't be that much easier because you're not factoring in the costs of hunting. People that have trouble hunting and making money now would still suffer under your suggestion. The adena dropped per mob would still barely (if at all) cover the cost of any shots/potions used to kill the mob.
That is another major factor in what makes the accelerated servers easier. Its far more affordable to solo and the cost of hunting supplies take a significantly lower portion of the rewards from hunting.
no the reason that we are rough towards him are becouse we have all told him several times how to make some adena and he find the ways in this game to boring and continue to complain about the same things over and over again and doesnt listen to what has been said in every thread so far.
I think you guys are a little rough on people that post radical ideas.
I personally am rough to Mr. TimeCop, cause:
1. He accuses Dwarves of being cheaters
2. He accuses Dwarves of controlling the market
3. He makes false and illogical assumptions about level ranges that he never experienced.
4. He is consequently ignoring all hints and tips, that were presented to him.
5. He wants his own char to be best at everything, without caring one bit about the other chars.
6. The movie Timecop sucks royally.
I think you guys are a little rough on people that post radical ideas.
I personally am rough to Mr. TimeCop, cause:
1. He accuses Dwarves of being cheaters
2. He accuses Dwarves of controlling the market
3. He makes false and illogical assumptions about level ranges that he never experienced.
4. He is consequently ignoring all hints and tips, that were presented to him.
5. He wants his own char to be best at everything, without caring one bit about the other chars.
6. The movie Timecop sucks royally.
Jean Claude Van Kitten
Answers...
#1 I accuse some dwarfs for being cheaters, that doesnt mean that every single person is a cheater that plays a dwarf, otherwise I would Pk them all the time in the game if I thought they were...
#2 Yes as far as I have seen dwarfs do really control the market more than any other class in this game, because Us newbies cannot buy any good items for grade D, because prices are way too high, yes you have given me tips on how to make adena, And I will do them, and try to make as much as I can, But dwarfs still make over 50% more than any Fighter/Mystic in this game, not counting recipies they buy...
The main reason I say that dwafs control the market, is because everywhere you go you see Dwarfs, Selling items, and the reason is Dwarfs crafters, which are legal players buy from Spoilers, which are Bots, and farm items, and these bots Increase the prices on the recipies, so that the legal plays that do play fair, will buy it for their price, then when the legal players produce the item, they sell it for a high price, and that is what these bots want, because they will continue to raise the price on different items that dwarf crafters need, so that the dwarf crafters that spend a lot of time working hard will increase the price, and by increasing the prices it really hurts newbies...
Here, you dwarfs told me in earlier posts that Dwarfs buy scrolls for 100mil right, well here let me tell you all something...
Every Recipies that these illegal bots sell to the legal people who play fair for over 100mil, these adena sellers earn $255 Real Life cash, or more,and the longer the ecnomic system goes like this, and because legal crafters will be increaseing prices, the worse it will get, and the more Adena sellers will make of Real Life Cash, because you all are helping them wheever you know it or not, Im not saying you are meaning to, but you are helping them every time you up the prices on items, I know you need to make a profit too, but its screwing up this game...
#3 I have played in simular mmo's, and I left the other mmo Final Fantasy XI, because the same thing happened there, there gil is harder to make, than it is to make adena here, but the thing is I saved up 4mil for a scorpion harness when the armor was first being sold on the server, and by the time I saved up to 4mil, the price on the auction house went up to 6mil, and it stayed for like 1month, by the time I reached close to 6mil, the price went way up to 9 mil, now it is 11 mil, but it was selling for 16mil on Valefor , but no one bought it so it went to 11-12 mil...
Yes I have experienced all the same things that are happening in this mmorpg, it doesnt mean, just because I havent got a level 75 in this game, that I do not know about mmorpg's, because If I didn't know I wouldn't know anything about how to play a mage, a fighter ect, But I do know how to play them, because I have played all of them in other mmos...
The same thing is gonna happen here, In Final Fantasy over 500 people have already left, because of the huge inflations...
#4 I have not been Ignoreing the tips, I have already started hunting in the Cats for the seven signs, and I have been talking to some people In private messages, and been trying to learn how to use the manor system, and so on...
#5 Bull, If I wanted that, I would go buy a [censored] load of adena right now, but I am a legit player, so I dont, and this statement, Idk where you heard it from, incase you didnt know, I have given all my newbies equipment to a clan, to support newbies... I dont know where you came up with this Idea, because if the whole ecnomic system was reset, and bots were elminated, and items we currently own cant be traded, nor sold to npcs, either keep em or junk em, the items before reset of adena, and a 30 day or more warning before it is done, then we would all benifit from it, because it would be fair, all prices would be reset to like when the game first started, without bots, All newbies would be able to afford good gear, and so would those high levels who couldn't afford A grade gear, because if it was reset, you think a dwarf will sell An A grade weapon for 50mil adena, when no one will buy it because they all cant afford it? No they wont price will be reset too, so everyone will have a chance to buy what they want...
You bad boy.
You release your anger upon dwarves, you know nothing about dwarves because you haven't played one, and you refuse to play a dwarf to check the other side of coin.
For me this is total ignorance.
I pitty all my dwarven brothers and sisters (or brother and children ?) because of people like you :(
The main reason I say that dwafs control the market, is because everywhere you go you see Dwarfs, Selling items
that becouse they have an extra sell slot, nothing more then that. if they gave Elfs more slots then the dwarfs they would be sitting and selling things everywhere.
The main reason I say that dwafs control the market, is because everywhere you go you see Dwarfs, Selling items
that becouse they have an extra sell slot, nothing more then that. if they gave Elfs more slots then the dwarfs they would be sitting and selling things everywhere.
Yeah I knew you would most likely say this...
You bad boy.
You release your anger upon dwarves, you know nothing about dwarves because you haven't played one, and you refuse to play a dwarf to check the other side of coin.
For me this is total ignorance.
I pitty all my dwarven brothers and sisters (or brother and children ?) because of people like you
I am not Angry at all the Dwarfs in the game, I have lots of Dwarf friends as I have said a lot of times, and I am nice to Dwarfs that play legal, I do not take it out on every single dwarf in Line Age 2...
I do not like Playing dwarf, how many times do I have to say it, I do not like playing them, because they do not have any good skills Imo, they cant pvp any other job, and to me it is a waste of time...
I do not hate them tho, I just do not like playing dwarf in this game... The only way I would be a crafter in Line Age 2 is if mages at level 75 could learn crafting skills like a dwarf, because I do not like Dwarfs, Just like I do not like playing a Healer, or Prophey anyways...
Yes Healers, and prophets are very good, they got good spells for assist magic in LineAge2, but I do not like playing them, because I like Classes that do really good damage, like Dark Elf, SH,Sorc,Sps,Gladiator,Warlord,ect.
I used to play a healer in another mmorpg, just like this one, and it is very boring, but tihs is my opinion, just like I dont like to play dwarfs, this is my opinion about them, it doesnt mean that no one else is going to like them at all...
Healers are boring, because they do not get any good attack magic, and all you do is bff, Dwarf are boring because you cannot pvp, and you always have to be in a party to farm good, and then half of your items go to other players, and also they dont do any good damage, but again this is my opinion about them...
The only time that I really loved playing a healer class, was in a old game called The 4th Coming online, because there you could be both a healer, and do good damage, because you got to choose your own stats, you could even solo all the way to level 200, but I quit that game, because hackers were hacking the game, and GM's did nothing, now the game is basically all dead...
#1 Healers are a must need for parties, and are very good with buffs, It is not my play style...
#2 Dwarfs are good money makers in this game, but it isnt something that I like to play, so I dont, and since I dont I should be able to make good enough adena to buy some decent stuff, just like every newbie fighter should do...
#3 If we all liked dwarfs in this game, why doesnt NC soft just make us all play a dwarf? Because NC soft knows that that not everyone likes that one class in this game...
You release your anger upon dwarves, you know nothing about dwarves because you haven't played one, and you refuse to play a dwarf to check the other side of coin
Maybe I do not know everything about dwarfs, but I do know that Dwarfs make a lot more than fighters/mages, and that they also buy their recipies from other dwarfs, and when they buy the recipies, they are really probabily buying from a bot, because bots love to increase the prices on recipies so that (Legal Dwarf Players) will (Increase) (Prices) on in game items, so that (Dwarf) (Bots) will make more (Real Life Cash)
I am not angry at all the dwarfs, just those who are screwing this game up, however it effects everyone still...
Sugguestions
<ul type="square">
Every mob drops adena Including Dark Blue mobs, so that fighters/mages can make good adena...
Reset Of ecnomic system, and Items/equipment before reset, cannot be sold/traded only junked, but NC soft needs to take care of the (Bot Probelm)
Force Lower all the prices in the game, and put a max limit
Increase Drop Rates
Fix it so that fighters/mages can get good adena without spending 24/7 Repeating a quest like 5000 times a day... I mean I do not mind grining for leveling up, but grinding an easy quest, for 5-8 hours a day to make good adena, and since everyone does not use the party function, it is kind of hard to hunt in the Cat's, because Most of the time when I am on everyone is too high for me, I shout for party cant find one, and I cant find anyone looking for an invite in range, or if so not enough to make a good enough party , for example 1 sorc and 1 sh, cant both go to the Cat's without a healer, and a tank, unless you got very good equipment, and maybe not even then...
Then what do you do?
I played a game Final Fantasy XI, and sometimes I couldn't even get an invite for 6 hours or more, and in that game you cant solo anything at all, so basically you always have to be in a party of 6 or more, so it was boring waiting there 6 hours doing nothing for a party... Since no one uses the pary command, it is also kinda hard to go town to town shouting, because mages walk so slow, and teleports would eat up adena, and I am trying to save...
I understand where you're coming from to a certain extent but I think you're blaming the wrong facets of the game and your suggestions are entirely off based (because you're coming to incorrect conclusions about the cause of the problem).
The problem with the game isn't the farmers or greedy dwarves or any of that. The problem is that the game economy is designed around farmers and botters as a necessity due to the insanely low drop rates. If there were no botters then material prices would be even higher then they are now.
A wipe is out of the question so you shouldn't even bother asking for it. Some of the people in the game have spent years amassing their fortunes and levelling. If anything, ask for a clean slate server instead if that's what you really think you need to be able to compete.
Mages have it easier then Dwarves. Period. Mages can actually make a profit after shots are factored in and can gather far more drops in the same period of time due to their much faster kill speed.
I agree that dark blue mobs should retain their drop rates once you've outlevelled them. It'd solve alot of problems and making farming materials easier for legitimate players and help correct the problem of grossly overpriced low grade gear.
I agree that drop rates for materials should really be improved. They should also be increased for spoils in the same fashion so that if you're seeing 5 iron ore drop from a mob that spoiling should get even more.
The rest of your theories are really the issue here, Timecop.
You need to stop pinning problems on particular races/classes in the game. You aren't going to sway public opinion on the game. NCSoft marketing would love to hire you if you actually could do this but seeing as how they have a budget and can't do it I doubt you can.
There's no point in making threats here because its been established that NCSoft doesn't care. The best you can hope for is to make a coherent point and then cancel your account if you are really unhappy. For those of you that will now point out that I should do the same, I only came back to check out C4. My account was originally deactivated a few weeks after C2 came out. I resubscribe for a month everytime there is a new chronicle to see if they've fixed anything. But I stick to my belief that if you're unhappy quit (don't give away your gear) and you can always come back and check on it later.
#1 I accuse some dwarfs for being cheaters, that doesnt mean that every single person is a cheater that plays a dwarf, otherwise I would Pk them all the time in the game if I thought they were...
Then why do you keep saying "dwarves"? Are you even remotely aware of how many "dwarves" you see sitting in town are attached on the other end to an elf, a dark elf, a human or an orc?
#2 Yes as far as I have seen dwarfs do really control the market more than any other class in this game, because Us newbies cannot buy any good items for grade D, because prices are way too high, yes you have given me tips on how to make adena, And I will do them, and try to make as much as I can, But dwarfs still make over 50% more than any Fighter/Mystic in this game, not counting recipies they buy...
Prove, please? You say this pretty baselessly. Dwarves are one of the most the slow killing classes. They have no self heals, very little in terms of useful attack skills, and they are tough as nails to find a group outside of clan with. This means, they earn less money than others. That, in turn, means that their only advantage lies in their spoiling and crafting skills.
Now let's have a look at this.
Making Money with Spoiling
Spoils, in C3, are poor. It is difficult for bounty hunters to find parties, and if they do find parties, they have to evenly split all of their extra loot - meaning everyone in the same party as a BH receives the exact same benefit as them from their special dwarf money making skill.
Crafting and Money
If a warsmith wants to craft something, he needs to buy the recipe and the materials (and he must buy them, because manoring for them is not an option as he can not solo well*). He has to spend extra money on the recipe, while any other toon just has to spend a small, almost negligible, craft fee.
Example numbers: I recently crafted myself an avadon circlet. I could sell it for a profit anywhere between 1 and 2 million adena if I tried (I'm going to wear it though, so I won't). The dwarf who crafted me that thing had to pay for the recipe to be put in her book - and only got a craft fee of, what, 50k from me.
That's right - everyone can craft, except they can do it more cheaply than dwarves.
Dwarfs crafters, which are legal players buy from Spoilers, which are Bots,
I hate to break it to you, but bounty hunters have become rare because people were too greedy to party them - not because they chose to. Ask Schmusekatze, I'm sure she can tell you a tale of the relaxed and beautiful life as a bounty hunter surrounded by grateful fellow players.
Not all spoilers are bots, that is just nonsense. It is no more true than the insinuation that all healers, or dagger users, which are also always part of bot field groups, must be bots.
they will continue to raise the price on different items that dwarf crafters need, so that the dwarf crafters that spend a lot of time working hard will increase the price, and by increasing the prices it really hurts newbies...
Increased prices are good for newbies. You can acquire your own materials and sell them at overinflated prices, taking money away from everyone who doesn't deserve it.
every time you up the prices on items, I know you need to make a profit too, but its screwing up this game...
You will be surprised to hear that farmers actually usually set the top end of the market scale, not real players. Farmers sell items at a ridiculous price which nobody would pay, and the real players then generally tick in under them.
You lack of and confidence in your knowledge of the way the market works is frightening.
#3 I have played in simular mmo's, and I left the other mmo Final Fantasy XI, because the same thing happened there,
Isn't it obvious that it's a sign of a healthy market when items change in value depending on demand and supply? When I first started making money with plated leather boot crafts, the prices for the linings went up from 35k to 300k in the matter of a few days. After they got too expensive to make crafting the boots for profit worthwhile - they dropped again.
The same thing is gonna happen here, In Final Fantasy over 500 people have already left, because of the huge inflations...
500 is very, very little to an MMORPG. Nobody would care, really. o.O
#4 I have not been Ignoreing the tips, I have already started hunting in the Cats for the seven signs, and I have been talking to some people In private messages, and been trying to learn how to use the manor system, and so on...
To learn the manor system, all you would have needed to do was go through the trouble of talking to all the NPCs around your home town, or first thing when you got to Gludin if you were an orc. All the information is right there in the game.
#5 I dont know where you came up with this Idea, because if the whole ecnomic system was reset, and bots were elminated, and items we currently own cant be traded, nor sold to npcs, either keep em or junk em, the items before reset of adena, and a 30 day or more warning before it is done, then we would all benifit from it, because it would be fair,
Taking everything someone has worked hard for for two years away is fair ... how? People are meant to have an advantage over you if they've been around longer. Besides, there are too many ifs in there.
All newbies would be able to afford good gear,
Those with a clue already can. Do I need to dig up my 'ding to 20' picture again?
and so would those high levels who couldn't afford A grade gear, because if it was reset, you think a dwarf will sell An A grade weapon for 50mil adena,
Do you think all the materials for these weapons would magically appear out of nowhere? They would be utterly unaccessible to anyone except ebayers and very, very organised clans.
Did you look at the images I posted? Do you understand their meaning?
* True once again in C4.
PS: Do you realise that people in D and C Grade actually receive only 100% profit from inflation if they do not get greedy about their gear?
I would never have been able to afford brig and sword of revolution by level 20 if prices weren't so inflated. :D
I understand where you're coming from to a certain extent but I think you're blaming the wrong facets of the game and your suggestions are entirely off based (because you're coming to incorrect conclusions about the cause of the problem).
The problem with the game isn't the farmers or greedy dwarves or any of that. The problem is that the game economy is designed around farmers and botters as a necessity due to the insanely low drop rates. If there were no botters then material prices would be even higher then they are now.
A wipe is out of the question so you shouldn't even bother asking for it. Some of the people in the game have spent years amassing their fortunes and levelling. If anything, ask for a clean slate server instead if that's what you really think you need to be able to compete.
Mages have it easier then Dwarves. Period. Mages can actually make a profit after shots are factored in and can gather far more drops in the same period of time due to their much faster kill speed.
I agree that dark blue mobs should retain their drop rates once you've outlevelled them. It'd solve alot of problems and making farming materials easier for legitimate players and help correct the problem of grossly overpriced low grade gear.
I agree that drop rates for materials should really be improved. They should also be increased for spoils in the same fashion so that if you're seeing 5 iron ore drop from a mob that spoiling should get even more.
The rest of your theories are really the issue here, Timecop.
You need to stop pinning problems on particular races/classes in the game. You aren't going to sway public opinion on the game. NCSoft marketing would love to hire you if you actually could do this but seeing as how they have a budget and can't do it I doubt you can.
There's no point in making threats here because its been established that NCSoft doesn't care. The best you can hope for is to make a coherent point and then cancel your account if you are really unhappy. For those of you that will now point out that I should do the same, I only came back to check out C4. My account was originally deactivated a few weeks after C2 came out. I resubscribe for a month everytime there is a new chronicle to see if they've fixed anything. But I stick to my belief that if you're unhappy quit (don't give away your gear) and you can always come back and check on it later.
#1 Yeah I hate the fact of a server wipe too, but the thing seems to be this, If NC soft made a new server, the same thing would happen there, so its no use, sure I might be able to leave,and get the best A grade gear in the game, becaue its a new server, but what about new players that come after me?
#2Yes Dark Blue Monsters should retain their items like you say, but the thing is we cant make any adena, so since dwarf have all the money making skills either they should have a max limit placed on their crafts, so that the prices will come down, or dark blue monsters need to drop like regular green or grey monsters...
#3 Hm am I really pinning it on a race? No not really, one of the things is... If there was no such thing as a Dwarf in this game at all, Bots would still be here, but they would not be all using dwarfs... Every bot that I have seen is a dwarf, and since dwarfs are the ones who control all the majory crafts, and ingredient farming, thats why I put it on them, However
I do not blame the ones that are legit players...
#4 People should use the party function more in the game, or something so that parties are easier to get, because the way I see it at my level, it is hard even getting a party
#5 NC soft does not care about players really, I know the ecnomic part is really the major part of the game, but NC soft should not of let it get out of hand in the first place, even tho it is the Bots faults... NC soft just cares about the money, but wait and see when future games come out that are better than LineAge2, Guild Wars, ect. NC soft will begin to loose customers, because maybe those games will not have bots, then they will be wishing they would of done something, This happened to all the old mmorpg's that I played way back, and they are still wasteing money trying to upgrade their service, when the facts show that even if The 4th coming upgrades their service they arent going to get that many players, because the graphics suck compared to any of these mmo's
#6 Most of your post is 100% correct,
Monsters should retain items if Dark Blue, But since Fighters/Mages do not really have a way to make adena, they these two classes should be able to obtain items from them no matter what, unless The drop rate is increased enough so that newbies can afford some good D grade gear and low level gear...
#7 I do not really blame any race/class in this game, because everyone likes something different, but I would be blaming humans,elfs,dark elfs, dwarfs, orcs too, if they could all craft like a dwarf, but because they cant, thats why it looks like I am really saying dwarf are the only reason, which isnt 100% true...
Dwarfs are the only reace in this game right, they are the ones who spoil items, so by Dwarfs being able to spoil items in the game, that makes them the money makers, so since they can spoil, every Adena selling company has Bots, maybe with healers ect out botting up places with a dwarf, then these dwarfs that are bots sell the items for a very high price the the legal dwarfs that havent done anything wrong at all which make the items, like a 100mil recipie, so naturaly the legal dwarfs are going to increase prices, which ruins it for newbies, which makes newbies buy adena, and as long as newbies keep buying adena, it will not stop, if every newbies stopped buying adena for 3 years or more, it would stop for sure...
Most of this post you posted is correct, except that some of the following needs to take place...
#1 Drop rates incread
#2 Limit Dwarfs Prices
#3 Make Dark Blue monsters drop like any monster would no matter if that person is level 75 killing a level 60 monster, that way fighters/mages would not have to argue for not having any good adena...
#4 I know this game takes grinding, but when you spend 5-8 hours a day trying to quest for adena, it gets really really really boring, and thats probabily not what NC soft intended when the game first came out, now for grinding levels thats a complete different story...
Oh by the way all the mmorpg's are being botted, why dont they write in the user agreement anyone caught selling adena, can have legal actions taken on them...
The most two options I would Sugguest are
#1 Items Drop rate Increase
#2 Limit Dwrafs Prices for selling stuff in private shops...
#3 maybe...
#4 Fighters/Mages other than dwarfs need a way to make adena faster, I have not really profitted off killing mobs, and I am trying to find parties so I can do the seven signs, like people sugguested, but its kinda hard, when no one uses search function, and no one is looking at your same level and area, and doing a quest repeatable for 5-8 hours a day is just too **** boring, I mean at first its not but later on yes it is Mental who do it, If I had to do that every single day of the month, I would give it to a little brother or something to do...
Otherwise this post is 100% good, except the dwarfs are still the main problem, because they are the ones with spoil, and they are the ones that Bots use, however I still will not blame the Legal dwarfs that play fair...
The only gear I think In my opinion that should cost a lot is A grade gear, because it is the final gear in the game, untill S grade gear comes out in C4, then S grade gear should be the only most expensive...
Any tips on getting a party for Seven Signs ect?
When I try to find a party so I can do what some people have sugguested, no one is looking around the same level/area, and since no one uses the party search function, it is kind of hard to find people, and half the time clan members arent on when I am, what do you do then, and I cant teleport to other areas takes too much adena...
you still fail to understand that dwarfs arnt some magic money making race! mages kills alot more mobs / hour then a dwarf and that meens much more mats and adena drops. its simpel math, even i understand it.
#1 I accuse some dwarfs for being cheaters, that doesnt mean that every single person is a cheater that plays a dwarf, otherwise I would Pk them all the time in the game if I thought they were...
Then why do you keep saying "dwarves"? Are you even remotely aware of how many "dwarves" you see sitting in town are attached on the other end to an elf, a dark elf, a human or an orc?
#2 Yes as far as I have seen dwarfs do really control the market more than any other class in this game, because Us newbies cannot buy any good items for grade D, because prices are way too high, yes you have given me tips on how to make adena, And I will do them, and try to make as much as I can, But dwarfs still make over 50% more than any Fighter/Mystic in this game, not counting recipies they buy...
Prove, please? You say this pretty baselessly. Dwarves are one of the most the slow killing classes. They have no self heals, very little in terms of useful attack skills, and they are tough as nails to find a group outside of clan with. This means, they earn less money than others. That, in turn, means that their only advantage lies in their spoiling and crafting skills.
Now let's have a look at this.
Making Money with Spoiling
Spoils, in C3, are poor. It is difficult for bounty hunters to find parties, and if they do find parties, they have to evenly split all of their extra loot - meaning everyone in the same party as a BH receives the exact same benefit as them from their special dwarf money making skill.
Crafting and Money
If a warsmith wants to craft something, he needs to buy the recipe and the materials (and he must buy them, because manoring for them is not an option as he can not solo well*). He has to spend extra money on the recipe, while any other toon just has to spend a small, almost negligible, craft fee.
Example numbers: I recently crafted myself an avadon circlet. I could sell it for a profit anywhere between 1 and 2 million adena if I tried (I'm going to wear it though, so I won't). The dwarf who crafted me that thing had to pay for the recipe to be put in her book - and only got a craft fee of, what, 50k from me.
That's right - everyone can craft, except they can do it more cheaply than dwarves.
Dwarfs crafters, which are legal players buy from Spoilers, which are Bots,
I hate to break it to you, but bounty hunters have become rare because people were too greedy to party them - not because they chose to. Ask Schmusekatze, I'm sure she can tell you a tale of the relaxed and beautiful life as a bounty hunter surrounded by grateful fellow players.
Not all spoilers are bots, that is just nonsense. It is no more true than the insinuation that all healers, or dagger users, which are also always part of bot field groups, must be bots.
they will continue to raise the price on different items that dwarf crafters need, so that the dwarf crafters that spend a lot of time working hard will increase the price, and by increasing the prices it really hurts newbies...
Increased prices are good for newbies. You can acquire your own materials and sell them at overinflated prices, taking money away from everyone who doesn't deserve it.
every time you up the prices on items, I know you need to make a profit too, but its screwing up this game...
You will be surprised to hear that farmers actually usually set the top end of the market scale, not real players. Farmers sell items at a ridiculous price which nobody would pay, and the real players then generally tick in under them.
You lack of and confidence in your knowledge of the way the market works is frightening.
#3 I have played in simular mmo's, and I left the other mmo Final Fantasy XI, because the same thing happened there,
Isn't it obvious that it's a sign of a healthy market when items change in value depending on demand and supply? When I first started making money with plated leather boot crafts, the prices for the linings went up from 35k to 300k in the matter of a few days. After they got too expensive to make crafting the boots for profit worthwhile - they dropped again.
The same thing is gonna happen here, In Final Fantasy over 500 people have already left, because of the huge inflations...
500 is very, very little to an MMORPG. Nobody would care, really. o.O
#4 I have not been Ignoreing the tips, I have already started hunting in the Cats for the seven signs, and I have been talking to some people In private messages, and been trying to learn how to use the manor system, and so on...
To learn the manor system, all you would have needed to do was go through the trouble of talking to all the NPCs around your home town, or first thing when you got to Gludin if you were an orc. All the information is right there in the game.
#5 I dont know where you came up with this Idea, because if the whole ecnomic system was reset, and bots were elminated, and items we currently own cant be traded, nor sold to npcs, either keep em or junk em, the items before reset of adena, and a 30 day or more warning before it is done, then we would all benifit from it, because it would be fair,
Taking everything someone has worked hard for for two years away is fair ... how? People are meant to have an advantage over you if they've been around longer. Besides, there are too many ifs in there.
All newbies would be able to afford good gear,
Those with a clue already can. Do I need to dig up my 'ding to 20' picture again?
and so would those high levels who couldn't afford A grade gear, because if it was reset, you think a dwarf will sell An A grade weapon for 50mil adena,
Do you think all the materials for these weapons would magically appear out of nowhere? They would be utterly unaccessible to anyone except ebayers and very, very organised clans.
Did you look at the images I posted? Do you understand their meaning?
* True once again in C4.
PS: Do you realise that people in D and C Grade actually receive only 100% profit from inflation if they do not get greedy about their gear?
I would never have been able to afford brig and sword of revolution by level 20 if prices weren't so inflated. :D
#1 Increased prices are good for newbies. You can acquire your own materials and sell them at overinflated prices, taking money away from everyone who doesn't deserve it.
I do not like doing this, because I am only helping people ruin it for future newbies to get items, becuase people will increase the price on equipment then, and I am not like that..
#2 Bounty Hunters, can hunt with a clan, and they can make their own parties, so they dont have to share thier spoils, that simple...
#3 Not all dwarfs are Bots I know this, but some still are Bots, and something needs to be done about those that are Bots, and then we wouldn't have any problem with dwarfs at all...
#4 yes 500 players is a lot hmm i wonder what I would do with $6,475 per month extrea, how many pizzas could I buy? How many cars could I buy? Not including that players on this mmo actually pay for extra characters + aditional services, 12.95 X 500 or more.. wow I wouldnt wanna loose that much money if it was my server, Maybe its not a lot to make the game close down, because they make millions, but it is a start... ;)
Do you think all the materials for these weapons would magically appear out of nowhere? They would be utterly unaccessible to anyone except ebayers and very, very organised clans.
Did you look at the images I posted? Do you understand their meaning?
* True once again in C4.
PS: Do you realise that people in D and C Grade actually receive only 100% profit from inflation if they do not get greedy about their gear?
I would never have been able to afford brig and sword of revolution by level 20 if prices weren't so inflated.
No I did not see it, please post a link to it, and Inflating prices does not help the ecnomic system, so I will not do it, even if it means loosing some adena...
#2 Bounty Hunters, can hunt with a clan, and they can make their own parties, so they dont have to share thier spoils, that simple...
#3 Not all dwarfs are Bots I know this, but some still are Bots, and something needs to be done about those that are Bots, and then we wouldn't have any problem with dwarfs at all...
yes a bh can make its own party.. and it would be a party of ONE if he doesnt want to share his spoils.
Yes some bots are dwarfs, some bots are Elfs should we try and kill them as a race to? a bot train uses ONE dwarf for a 9 people party most of the time. how doest that make them the evil bot race you think they are?
Which part of every class can spoil, every class can craft, NCSoft feels no love for dwarves do you find yourself uncapable of handling?
No the answer is I do not care what skills they have, I was saying, if every race had the same skills as a dwarf, I wouldnt just be talking about Dwarf bots like I am right now, but since they are the only race who have the skills, which I do not really care if they do, they are the only ones that I talk about, because thats what Bots use...
you still fail to understand that dwarfs arnt some magic money making race! mages kills alot more mobs / hour then a dwarf and that meens much more mats and adena drops. its simpel math, even i understand it.
--------------------
”To think is easy. To act is hard. But the hardest thing in the world is to act in accordance with your thinking.” - Goethe
Yes I know Dwarfs work for them, and it isnt very ubber easy, I know they arent magic money making classes, no class is, but something still has to be done because of Bots...
#1 Increase Drop Rates, to make prices go down...
#2 Set Price Limit to what dwarfs sell...
#3 Make all Dark Blue monsters drop adena/items
#3 Doesnt really need to be done, but it would help, the only two sugguestions I see fit are #1, and #2
Yes I know Dwarfs work hard, but something needs to be done about bots, I know dwarfs arent magic making classes, but something still needs to be done, I can only say ths abotu dwarfs, because not every race can use the same skills a dwarf can, and I am not sugguesting they should, just saying, before you all start calling me a racist...
Please Remember, Not Everyone likes a class, just because others do, otherwise everyone would be doing the same class, I respect Dwarfs that play fair, even tho I do not like playing them...
What I meant by Dwarf Crafters buying from bots was from private stores in town, when Dwarf Bots sell the High level recipies that are over charged, thats where the crafters buy them, then the crafters increase prices, because they spent a lot of adena on a recipie, then the newbies have a hard time getting it...
#2Yes Dark Blue Monsters should retain their items like you say, but the thing is we cant make any adena, so since dwarf have all the money making skills either they should have a max limit placed on their crafts, so that the prices will come down, or dark blue monsters need to drop like regular green or grey monsters...
Excuse me, you dare to claim, that you are not out on a witchhunt against dwarves, after writing such a nonsense ?
Moneymaking skills:
1: Kill mobs (last I checked, it was available to all races)
2: Sell an item (last I checked, it was available to all races)
3: Craft an item to sell it (somewhat limited to Warsmiths, but available to every class by craft shops for a relative small fee)
4: Spoil (skill use limited to Bounty Hunters, but skill reward spread evenly in group)
5: Overenchanting a weapon and sell for profit (last I checked, it was still available for all classes)
6: Raid Bosses (Last I checked, no dwarves were in the raid groups, that constantly kill Antharas and the other big bosses on gustin. Seems this is not available to Dwarves, but only to nukers)
7: Manor System (Last I checked, it was available to all races)
Summary: There are plenty of ways to make money and the dwarves are doing slightly better on it, that the rest. But saying, that all the money making is with dwarves is a blatant LIE.
#3 Hm am I really pinning it on a race? No not really, one of the things is... If there was no such thing as a Dwarf in this game at all, Bots would still be here, but they would not be all using dwarfs... Every bot that I have seen is a dwarf, and since dwarfs are the ones who control all the majory crafts, and ingredient farming, thats why I put it on them, However I do not blame the ones that are legit players...
This only shows your lack of knowledge of what is going on in the game. Every bot train I see consists of 1 Dwarf, 2 Healers (non dwarves) and 1 Damage Dealer (non dwarf). That is 3 non-dwarf bots for every dwarf bot. You are obviously seeing only what you want to see.
Monsters should retain items if Dark Blue, But since Fighters/Mages do not really have a way to make adena, they these two classes should be able to obtain items from them no matter what, unless The drop rate is increased enough so that newbies can afford some good D grade gear and low level gear...
Fighers and mages is the basis of ALL classes. Even Dwarves are fighters. And also you might want to know, that currently (with C3) the AOE caster groups (made up from NUKERS) are easily making lots of money in adena drops and lots more money from quest items like stolen infernium ore. There is no dwarf necessary in such a group and if there is one, they are there to spoil and share the outcome with the whole party.
Dwarfs are the only reace in this game right, they are the ones who spoil items, so by Dwarfs being able to spoil items in the game, that makes them the money makers, so since they can spoil, every Adena selling company has Bots, maybe with healers ect out botting up places with a dwarf, then these dwarfs that are bots sell the items for a very high price the the legal dwarfs that havent done anything wrong at all which make the items, like a 100mil recipie, so naturaly the legal dwarfs are going to increase prices, which ruins it for newbies, which makes newbies buy adena, and as long as newbies keep buying adena, it will not stop, if every newbies stopped buying adena for 3 years or more, it would stop for sure...
Just so you know, if there would be a loud plop and there would be no more farmers, I would RAISE my prices, not lower them. Supply would shorten, and demand would be the same, thus I would charge even more money, until there is noone left, who can pay that price.
#2 Limit Dwarfs Prices
Why limit dwarf prices ? Why not limit "player shop" prices ? An elf can sell a sword for the same inflated ammount as a dwarf can. In fact I know elves, who buy items off a dwarf and then instantly resell them for a higher price.
Oh by the way all the mmorpg's are being botted, why dont they write in the user agreement anyone caught selling adena, can have legal actions taken on them...
What kind of legal actions ? Have you any suggestion, what kind of LAW is broken by adena selling ? Yes, it is against the rules, but I do not see any law being broken.
#2 Limit Dwrafs Prices for selling stuff in private shops...
Why Dwarves, why not Player shop prices ?
Any tips on getting a party for Seven Signs ect?
For you, I suggest you do not tell anyone your in game name after all the nonsense you suggest here, as every dwarf with a spark of honor would rather drop dead on the spot than group with you.
I cant teleport to other areas takes too much adena...
Last I checked, every place a teleport leads to, can also be reached by walking.
#1 Think about your logic for a second there. The inflation helps you as a newbie - so you don't want to further it because it would, like, help other newbies more? Prices have been steady/dropping most of C3. They are now rising on some items in anticipation of C4 - and dropping on others.
#2 The only bounty hunter that does not share his spoils is a bounty hunter in a group of close friends - and if they're letting him keep his spoils, you can bet that he'll be offering them spoil support when they need it - i.e. : they can spoil through him. Your point was?
#3 It's not the dwarf part of the bot that's the problem. People would take you more seriously if you understood this.
#4 If they're 500 people for which it wasn't the right game, good riddance. Trying to please all people will lead a game to its certain doom, just like trying to be **** for one guy with a thin fetish and one who likes the ladies a bit more full will make you very ugly very fast.
#5 Non-continuous inflation can be good for a game.
Scroll back a few pages, I didn't post that often (yet). There are two links to very interesting weapons.
Why do you ppl even TRY to explain something to THIS guy?Everything that had to be said was said a LONG time ago-everything written from that point on is totally useless.I also think a moderator should check the thread(or better yet-lock it!) since he says he will take a course of action AGAINST Ncsoft(and i know this isnt alowed on these boards).
Yes there are lots of ways to make money, but you cant even make as much as a dwarf? while a dwarf is afk selling items for 10mil adena, you at this level 30 cant even make 3mil a day, thats why I said they were over powered in other posts...
I want the Dwarf skill that drops 10 million adena items in my lap every day... Where do I get that one, where? The OP seems to think that Dwarves are by their existence rich. This is the silliest thing I've heard in my lifetime. While he is out spamming BSPS/SPS on mobs and not only collecting adena and items, but also XP, I'm sitting in town 24/7 my little craft shop up, and taking care of helping others like him craft their C, B, A grade items. Yeah if someone walks up and crafts a Sword of Valhalla then I make 50k adena in one shot. But if one were to pay for that recipe to put it in their book, it's currently running somewhere around 6-8 mill on Gustin. That means that I have to have 120 - 140 people craft a Sword of Valhalla even before I begin to make a profit on the recipe. The reasons Dwarves make money, is because people who main Dwarves are resourceful. Otherwise, it's as previously stated, someone who mains something other than a Dwarf using the Dwarf to buy/sell the items they desire or have already obtained using some other race. Dwarves don't control the economy, they contribute to it by providing beneficial services. Bounty Hunters provide materials obtained by Spoil, Warsmiths provide crafting services for which they charge a small portion of the recipe cost. Are all Dwarves rich? No. Do you HAVE to play a Dwarf to make money in this game? NO! Lots of people have suggested ways to make money in this game, and I've heard that wizzy classes that can 1 and 2 hit mobs make far more cash adena than any Dwarf.
TimeCop, you don't like Dwarves, DON'T play a Dwarf, but stop blaming us for your economic issues. There are botters who use Dwarves to sell the items they OE and otherwise questionably acquire. Players who buy adena pay for those items, this causes prices to rise. I can't help that botters/ebayers use Dwarves to buy/sell their items. That's the way the game was designed with more buy/sell slots for Dwarves.
Yes BountyHunters can make extra cash spoiling basic mats. Oh WAIT so can you, if you use seeds and use them smartly. Go seed 1k worth of Red Coda somewhere, and turn in between 2.5-3k worth of fruit. Wow, you probably paid 50k for those seeds, and now you have 3000 varnish worth anywhere from 600-1000a each depending on the server. You just made money. You just turned 50k into 1.8 - 3 mill. Congrats, all for 3-4 hours of doing 1000 seeds. Do you need to have a Dwarf to sell that varnish? NO! Sit down overnight and sell them yourself.
But please, we're begging you stop making posts about the economy. If you think Raid Bosses are the only way to get good gear, then you're not working hard enough to craft your own. Find out what you want, figure out what drops the parts you need and hunt them. Or make some money on seeds, quests, or a billion other ways of doing it, and stop complaining. Please.
*hugs SchmuseKatze and all the other abused Bounty Hunters and Warsmiths of the Game*
Dwarves !
The problem with dwarfs is that they athe main cog in ebay machine... {snip} ...What does this mean to use legit players is unless we are lucky we have to wait for events<which the dwarves complain about> to get our top armour/weapon.... {snip}
Wow. That's almost as good as when Time Cop said that Dwarves were over powered. I know I'm reading this thread a little late, and I'm sure that this poster has already been fried for this, but please, please do not call me an non-legit player simply because I play a Dwarf. This sentiment is raceist and it says that simply because I like being a Dwarf means that I love botters/ebayers and support them exclusively. There is nothing more offensive than that comment. I am every bit as legit as you are, and work hard to make every single adena I get. Work smarter, and do some research please... And stop banging Dwarves, because we're not the cause of your economic woes. Bang botters/ebayers all you want, but not the Dwarf race. It's unfair, unjust and cowardly to blame Dwarves for your lack of effort in the game.
Excuse me, Mr Bird, but every player can produce a Homunkulus Sword nowadays.
I seriously doubt, that anyone takes the time to craft these ones.
Luv ya Schmuse. :) But yeah the only real players who are crafting Homu's are Dwarves. I have enough blades for four of them, and as soon as I have the rest of the materials, for which I am seeding (TimeCop, seeds again see), as they take 1700 varnish each, then I will have spent more time than any other player on a Homu and will have 4 to sell in C4 when they're no longer as valued because you can add SAs to Swords of Valhalla now. So where went that big money grubbing Dwarf? (Darkbird?) Well she spent her time collecting the materials and crafting the Homu to be sold out to the public. Could anybody else do that? YEAH! Play more, post less, and stop picking on the rest of us, who have time to post, because we're in town crafting 24/7.
Yes I have read your threads about where it says that dwarf control the ecnomic system, and how hard they have to work. But Dwarf need to realize that once they learn a recipie its theirs to keep forever unless they delete character, their account gets hacked, they quit, or they junk it. I know it is hard playing a Dwarf crafter, and stuff, but in 5-6 months I couldnt even make half of what you would as a Dwarf with a Fighter/Mystic, To me thats very unbalanced...
Wow! Another one of those types of comments. I wish my recipe book had unlimited slots that I could use. It did in C1, I could keep a recipe in my inventory and use it again and again, and then put it back in my warehouse when I didn't need it. But those days are long gone. Now I have a limit, at least until C4, of 50 recipes in my book, and my book is FULL! Are there other recipes that I would like to have? Yeah, but no room. Another comment from someone who needs to play a Dwarf before any of their comments will even apply.
I'm sorry Mr. TimeCop, but like Schmuse I just can't listen to your Dwarf comments anymore. You have no idea what you're talking about. Spend a few years in a Dwarf crafters shoes and then come back and tell us that we control the economy, then come back and tell us that we make all the money. After you have a Dwarf up to 52, then I'd like to hear your comments on our race, same for Darkbird...
I think you guys are a little rough on people that post radical ideas.
He is not "posting radical ideas". Instead, he is...<ul type="square"> ...a RL racist. He has repeatedly made anti-German statements that frankly should have gotten him banned. I'm a little disappointed. ...an in-game racist. He has made sweeping and ignorant statements like "dwarves are cheaters", "real players don't make dwarves". ...extremely selfish. He wants everyone to be reset to newbie amounts of money so that his newbie will have as much money as the people who worked hard for more than a year. ...a liar. He makes up "facts" and posts them as real, when even the most oblivious of players who had actually gotten play experience would know better. For example, he thinks most bots are dwarves, when everyone over 40 knows there are more bot healer/buffers than dwarves. ...too arrogant to listen to people who have far more experience than him. Ever heard the phrase "don't bother me with the facts, I've already made up my mind"? That's him. ...too ignorant to even realize that Lineage2 is drastically different from every other game he's played, and thus he applies useless experience and worthless anecdotes that, even when they're not lies, are still utterly pointless in this game. ...too lazy to make money the way we all did. He says "but I'm not lazy, I'm doing XYZ" but if he actually took the suggestions he's been given, he wouldn't be poor anymore, so it's obvious he's lying again. ...too oblivious to realize that, when established and respected posters come up with more than a dozen mistakes in a single one of his posts, it's time for him to stop and rethink his suggestions. Instead, he defends them as if he actually had a good idea. ...threatening to defame NCSoft and their property. I think the only reason this didn't get him in trouble is that the moderators stopped listening to him a long time ago. If I sound like I'm being "a little rough", it might be because I play two dwarves and have a German last name, and thus have been personally insulted by almost every post he's made. You don't even want to know what would happen if comments like those were made to my face... :D
Yeah I know, I dont expect it to be 100% perfect, it will never be, but I expect it to be a good game, in which it never is, I emailed NC soft and asked them if they are going to change anything, and I bet they will say no... My next step will be to start going public instead of posting here next time...
The game is very good, I like everything really except the ecnomic system...
Please do and save us all the trouble of being offended and having to defend our positions from insane and as previously stated illogical suggestions. You are level 34, you want to help newbies... Gee whiz. We've all been there, and we appreciate your opinion. In fact we understand how hard it is for you, we'be been there. So go public, make as much noise as you need to. As a law student I recognize that as an idle threat from someone who doesn't really understand why their complaints aren't receiving a better airing. But, here are the facts. The economy is what it is, NCSoft has stayed pretty hands off, and other than banning bots (see that thread) and punishing violaters of the EULA, the economy will stay as it is. If you don't like it, I suggest you learn how to live with it, make money off it, or follow one of SchmuseKatze's other suggestions.
In the end it seems like the L2 forum board community is begging you to stop posting these complaints here. We've hashed them time and time again, do what you need to do to find validation.
You guys dont really see the big picture, The big picture is I have a lot of newbie friends agreeing with me (can we say overclaim?) that something needs to be done about the ecnomic system, Yes I have seen items myself on the server sell for up to 150mil already, and higher, I do understand the point...
This isnt my first mmorpg that I have played, I used to play Final Fantasy XI online, and the same thing happened there, I got over 500 people to leave their service already... (over claim again)
I hate the problem with the ecnomic system, and so do all newbies (OVERCLAIM!), high levels dont really hate it that much, because they arent the ones effected, try junking all your adena, and leveling with a level 1 newbie again, and see how good you do... (We all did! I think you forget that.)
Yes I know that I am the only one wrtieing this stuff, but If I get others to agree too, I will not be the only one, my friends that play the game dont really want to come here and start an arguement, because they think it will ruin their game reputation, well the fact is it wont, because no one knows who I am, and no one will, last time people saw me was hmm, bartz server? that was like months ago... (Months Ago? So you don't even play?)
Yeah I will not be the only one complaining about it I will get others to send their complaints to NC too, so that maybe something will be done, otherwise I will go public all over the internet, and see what results I get from people who are newbies... (over claim!)
Please take your exaggerations to the public, and then post a link here with TimeCop as the author of the e-zine or magazine article, in a reputable magazine that says L2 sucks. The rest of us here are aruging with you, because we disagree. There are things we don't like, but you and a couple others are singling yourselves out as the dissidents in this game. If you don't like the game, please don't play. But please don't say, I love L2, but this sucks and I'm going to tell the world it does. That shows how much love for the game you have. Now please stop trashing our game, because we, the real players, actually do enjoy playing or we wouldn't do it.
amazing that not one high lvl ws has replyed to this post
i blame it on the fact that there are so few of us (and your post is barely worth replying to)
*hugs Nameless* Yeah I'll bet I could count on two hands the number of high level Warsmiths that actually main a Warsmith. No one wants us in party, unless it's at a siege, and everyone wants us back in town when we're out leveling. It's the bane of Warsmiths, and with A grade being only quest available it's the bane of Bounty Hunters as well *hugs Kitten*
I'm a little slow on the thread because I skipped reading the forums yesterday because I got to get out of town and level. Gee whiz TimeCop you should try it. :)
If anyone thinks Dwarves are over powered then they haven't played one. SS/SPS is not a super money making deal. I tried it for one year in C1/C2. I sold DSS for 10-11a each, was the regular price back then, and made 1a per shot. Woohoo I was rolling in the dough. When craft shops came out and I could setup over night I began to make 10-20k a night doing level 1-4 mats. Now that I can do the higher level stuff I make significantly more, but nothing to shout about. Most of the high level WS I know are alts. Even if they started out as mains they were out leveled by an alt that now acts as the main. Just the way it goes.
Why do I hate money making classes? Because they have no good fighting skills, cant PVP people, ect, but this is what I think, doesnt mean that other people feel the same way... {snip}
Please learn to use SNIP in quotes... That way someone is more likely to actually read what you're saying. But as for PVP, please let me know where you are and I'll bring one of my 2 Warsmiths to PVP with you. I'll take my dwarf and golem against your 34 wizzy anytime you want.
I play my class because I like to play it, and will not take the abuse and ridicule that my class constantly receives from your threads. Please stop blaming Dwarves, or bring it to the Arena and we'll settle it the medival way. Just hope you can run faster than my stun, and watch out for golem's flame, it hurts! :)
Please stop blaming Dwarves, or bring it to the Arena and we'll settle it the medival way. Just hope you can run faster than my stun, and watch out for golem's flame, it hurts! :)
This is bull, it would not screw over everyone, Right now us newbies are the ones getting screwed over, and thats why over 20% newbies buy adena...
Remember when I said OVERCLAIM! Now you're changing your numbers. I'm sure someone has already called you on this, but wasn't it 50% a couple hours ago?
Also, let's buy your idea of a reset. Just take everyone's equipment, adena, warehouse stores etc... Take it all away. You and your "newbie" friends, which again I say is an overclaim, will start complaining as soon as everything comes back up, because you'll still be level 34, and there will be others who are many levels higher than you, which means that they will still kill higher mobs, still collect better drops, and the major setback will be getting their gear back. This doesn't fix your problem. You can make as much as any other level 34 Dwarf, DE, LE, Human or Orc. What it seems like you want is to be able to make more, if you want top C gear at level 34, then I think you have some work to do. If you don't have top D by 34, then others have suggested how you can accomplish that pretty quickly.
For everyone else, I'm sorry you have to read post after post of mine, I just find TimeCop highly offensive. I've been playing a crafter since prelude and I just really struggle with his anti-Dwarfisms... My apologies...
Of course we newbies (i've played the game for less than two months) shouldnt get everything right away, but maybe we should be able to get a little something that could make the game fun to play without having to grind for years before it actually becomes interesting...
Welcome to the game Grazzt. One thing you will learn is that you as newbies since C3 have had it much easier than those of us who started in Prelude. The SS/SPS that you receive when you start the game, did not exist when we started playing. We got only the gear that you start with.
The buffs that the nice Newbie Guide gives you, including a Life Cubic (guardian healing angel) did not exist when we started playing. The only empower we hoped to get at 10-20 was from someone who leveled quicker and had a 30+ SE...
When we started in Prelude/C1 there was no manor system. In C2 there were no catas/necros (Meaning far fewer X2-X4 hp mobs. Heck we didn't even know what was a 1/2 - 4 hp mob, at least not immediately in game.)
So please forgive us if we seem a little harsh at times, we like real players, including newbies who are coming to a game we love. If we don't help out right away it's because we've been begged, scammed and terrorized by players who want a free hand for a long long time. We like to meet the people who want to play, and want to work, but it seems more often than not that the original poster (TimeCop) wants things not to be boring, and doesn't want to do what is necessary to get what he wants. If he choses not to work, then he will reep the rewards of not doing it. I'll be that my grind from 1-20 took twice as long as it does today, if not more. Make some friends, TimeCop says he has plenty of them, but then complains that he can't find a party, but make friends in game and then work together to get the things you need. Make friends with some higher levels and they'll help you out, but please don't beg/scam for adena/items.
We all love and want to help real newbies, but like the saying goes, we only want to help the ones who want to help themselves.
For everyone else, I'm sorry you have to read post after post of mine, I just find TimeCop highly offensive. I've been playing a crafter since prelude and I just really struggle with his anti-Dwarfisms... My apologies...
i just read the last few sentences of your posts... then i quote them... so people think i'm paying attention to this conversation...
I still think aden communism is the way to go!
Seriously though... I'm going to chime in and tell timecop what everybody else has....
Dwarfs don't control the economy. Bots don't control the economy. It is the players. The players who are willing to pay 3m for top d-grade for their rerolls. Because to them it is cheaper to pay 3.2m than it is to wait until sign effect period, wait around for mammon, and make their own. THe thing that drives up d-grade prices (the ones u are concerned with) is the rerolls.
C-grade prices are stable.
B-grade prices are quite reasonable. Besides BoP, but even that is droping in price as people are saying screw it and getting a DeLB for pvp.
A-Grade is VERY REASONABLE! Considering it is 60% craft, recipies don't drop, weapon blades don't drop, the price of a-grade is quite reasonable considering the demand. In C4 the demand will go down. The economy in aden is purely capitalist. it works perfectly. Somebody should write a book on it. God knows when L3 comes out I'm playing from beta and tracking the economy over time... (assuming they don't screw it up with an auction house)
anyway... that's it.
/edit that isn't it....
I do think the dwarven class is poorly designed. I do not like the concept of a purely money makeing class (exception being ws needed in siege). I would much rather all races specialize in certain types of crafting and dwarves be given crafting skills. But I would NEVER support this change in L2. L3 i will beg for it once there is an appropriate website to do so.