Every thing I have seen about C4 says that WLs are going to be the worse class in the game soon, (yes worse at pvp than Dwaves)
I guess it is time to go back to my DA, at lest then I can beat a Dwarf in pvp.
please someone tell I am wrong and that WLs will not be as bad as I think.
Worse than Dwarves?! Look at Shock Blast skills. RANGED AoE attack that can put enemies in a state of shock AND reduce defense AND makes them lose targets. That sounds like an awesome skill, much better than dwarves.
A warlord/polearm user line, backed by archers and nukers above/behind, is probably one of the most powerful defensive tactics in a siege you can have. Warlords are definately not meant for 1v1's or small group pvp, they're meant to slow and soften up zergs. If your alliance isn't taking advantage of you, then find one that will. ;)
I think Warlords (and other polearm users like dwarf and destroyer) are the most effecient melee hunter.
PvP wise i cant comment for warlords but their aoe stun is very effective.
Depends on how you are calculationg efficiency. They are far more efficient with soulshots then single target classes. They take more damage over time though when they're hitting multiple mobs so have to sit more often and are thus less efficient actually hunting unless they have a healer standing behind them. They're great for duos or getting multiple warlords/pole destroyers/pole dwarves together for parties but they're not very efficient soloing. Getting all of the mobs to position correctly still takes some skills and effort as well which can end up wasting time from actually killing the mobs.
Another one of the NCSoft's 'Cool in Theory, Lame in Application' ideas.
Everyone is blowing the whole AOE Nerf thing wayyy out of proportion.
All it does is limit you to 20 mobs per pull. For Polearm users, this is really minor, since we don't usually pull bigger groups than 20 at a time anyhow.
So yeah.. WL is pretty much unaffected by the supposed nerf.
IT's pretty much the same across the board. All AOE skills are limited to affecting 20 mobs at once. Big deal. Pull 19.
No...the skill/spell nerf is different from the polearm nerf. Polearms are hugely less effective to anyone under level 20 or without the Polearm Mastery skill, and far less effective to everyone under level 40 whether they have the skill or not. NG/DG polearms are on their way out, I'd wager, due to this change.
I don't think this was very visible on the PTS due to everyone being 40+ and the increased rates, but try it out.
But well, noone plays a class because of it's pre-40 content. If you wanna be a Warlord, and you know you get your "real power" after 2nd class change, it should not be a big problem.
I would not see this as nerf for Warlords, I see these changes as "upgrade". Now the only polearm-groups will come from chars with these masteries to be effective, you will be much more in demand now.
But well, noone plays a class because of it's pre-40 content. If you wanna be a Warlord, and you know you get your "real power" after 2nd class change, it should not be a big problem.
Pre-40 content and trying if you like aoe, is precisely what makes your mind - not everyone is a reroll PLed to 4x by friendly summoner and trainer in 6 hours.
I'll be surprised if any info about aoe nerf will be in official patch notes. Info about post-C3 updates info (between korean and our release) wasn't (people still think brig>half plate, for instance). If not for l2center, we wouldn't know jack about it (that's another of your screwups NC).
My alliance does not siege, therefore the one type of fighting a WL is good at is a moot point.
The real problem I thinking about is not so much the nerfs to AOE, but that C4 is going to have more open pvp. With C4 focusing on clan wars a WL is not good at that.
And with Nukers and Bows still ruling the world in C4, a WL is just an easy kill. WLs have very low Mdef, and can not use a shield to stop arrows.
With +3 BO set and at lvl 62 Mdef is only in the 500s which means about 3 shots for most nukers of the same lvl range.
With Thrill Fight on a WL is the slowest class in the game with a whooping speed of 125 with ww 2 on. which means you never even get to the fight. Without Thrill Fight our attacks speeds are bad and damge out put about like a Hate Tank.
With the Nerf to Bezerk (lowers mdef) it means one less thing a WL can use.
And yes 1 v 1 a Bisphop could more than likely take a WL.
Think little bit about what you wanna complain.
- Pole nerf - didn't catch you - coz WL is one of those classes which have pole masteries ;)
- AOE nerf, well with pole you still hit all of this mobs - just your skills like AOE stun can affect 'only' 20 of them. So it's almost doesn't change anything in pole party.
If you trying to complain about PvP... well WL it's not a PvP class type but PvE. If you are great in killing massive amouts of mobs you must be weak in other way. So WL never was the top of PvP hierarchy :P
IMO because of pole nerf for non-pole users we became not nerfed but powed uped.
Pre-40 content and trying if you like aoe, is precisely what makes your mind - not everyone is a reroll PLed to 4x by friendly summoner and trainer in 6 hours.
So your only fear is that less ppl. will choose WL as a class? Hmm, I always thought it's cool to play a class not everyone has, so I would not worry about that for one second :D
AOE nerf, well with pole you still hit all of this mobs
You don't. I'll doublecheck though.
So your only fear is that less ppl. will choose WL as a class? Hmm, I always thought it's cool to play a class not everyone has, so I would not worry about that for one second
That's very naive. Look at amount of nukers and archers, be it rerolls or subclasses. And look at amount of WLs. And few other severely underplayed classes.
Polearm nerf (30/60/100 one) could be done in a much better way (and achieving the same), if some designer in Korea used more than 1 brain cell.
IMO because of pole nerf for non-pole users we became not nerfed but powed uped.
Again: unability to make AoE groups with the people I usually do them, is not a powerup. It's a stupid nerf.
Let's make it so:
anyone without bow passives have accuracy halved
anyone without blunt passives have speed halved
anyone without sword passives have patt halved
etc.
"If you trying to complain about PvP... well WL it's not a PvP class type but PvE. If you are great in killing massive amouts of mobs you must be weak in other way. So WL never was the top of PvP hierarchy :P"
They might not be top, but they had be better able to do something. Because anyone can make a WL go purple by hitting someone while a WL is using it's skills. So don't tell us not to pvp when a WL can be forced in to pvp without every touching the "Ctrl" key.
Every class in this game has a role in pvp there is no such thing as a PvE only class.
Healers heal and debuff
Buffers bufff and root and debuff
Even BH's have a place in PvP they can stun, hard to kill by other melees, and can drop trains on groups.
WCs are buffers but also one of the best 1v1 pvpers in the game if not the best.
anyone without bow passives have accuracy halved
anyone without blunt passives have speed halved
anyone without sword passives have patt halved
etc.
Great ideas, really ! :mad:
Sounds good to me, no more orchers or dwarchers, or BD's using bows in sieges. wewt!
/reality on
They will likely never nerf every weapon to this degree, but I seriously have no problem with it. As I see it, your class is supposed to be tailored to specific weapon types, so why not change the system to either require the masteries for proper use of the weapon, or add a penalty for non-mastery weapons for your class. *shrugs*
anyone without bow passives have accuracy halved
anyone without blunt passives have speed halved
anyone without sword passives have patt halved
etc.
Great ideas, really ! :mad:
Sounds good to me, no more orchers or dwarchers, or BD's using bows in sieges. wewt!
/reality on
They will likely never nerf every weapon to this degree, but I seriously have no problem with it. As I see it, your class is supposed to be tailored to specific weapon types, so why not change the system to either require the masteries for proper use of the weapon, or add a penalty for non-mastery weapons for your class. *shrugs*
Even though classes like Orcs and BDs can be quite powerful with bows their damage over time is still always better with their intended weapon. Use a bow to get fleeing enemies, use a bow to start off with. But they are much better off pulling out their sword(s) and going at it. Its risky for Destroyers to use a bow as they miss OFTEN. As I see it bows are fine. And the people that do not specialize in bows yet use them the most are fools who are only fooling themselves. They DO NOT do more damage over time with bows typically.
Yup yup, first off they have less range. They got no masteries, so their accuracy and dmg is lower. And they're generally geared towards using their own class weapons. Granted, Destroyer with bow can have the most patk in this game, but it's for a short duration, and they still are hindered by the lack of range and accuracy. Bow for melee classes is a weapon that they start with, use when rooted or when the enemy flees/tries to kite.
Warlords are a bit gimp in pvp, but in mass pvp, like sieges, a WL that gets to flags for example can keep numerous people stunned if it manages to spam that aoe stun. Warlords rushing into the gauntlet after gates are broken(defending and attacking warlords) can cause serious damage with their aoe attacks.
In 1vs1 WLs are gimp, but they're not meant for 1vs1 fights, otherwise they would not be pole specialists.
Warlords are a bit gimp in pvp, but in mass pvp, like sieges, a WL that gets to flags for example can keep numerous people stunned if it manages to spam
that aoe stun. Warlords rushing into the gauntlet after gates are broken(defending and attacking warlords) can cause serious damage with their aoe attacks.
Any melee class rushing into broken gate, WL including, will be dropped down before it can ****.
anyone without bow passives have accuracy halved
anyone without blunt passives have speed halved
anyone without sword passives have patt halved
etc.
Great ideas, really ! :mad:
Well, without bow-mastery you already have much less range, bad accuracy.
Blunts and Swords do not offer a special benefit like a Pole does, they get their strenghts from the masteries or skills you have for them.
The problem with pole was, that nearly everyone could use it, so there never was a real "need" for Pole-classes like WL or Dwarves.
Now that only chars with Pole masteries can use them, that will change and will BOOST those classes, not nerf them...
And to the "general" AOE nerf:
I think a limit of 20 mobs for a pole party is no problem at all, should be more than enough. This really only hits nuker-AOEs...