I think everyone knows that Necromancers are overpowered at the moment. Even more so than the other mages. Reason for this IMO is Transfer Pain. This skill allows a Necromancer to have a enormous amount of hit points. Combined with a high-powered nuke they are very hard to kill (almost impossible for melee).
My suggestion therefore is to change Transfer Pain. I want to suggest that Transfer Pain works 2-ways in PvP (It works perfectly for PvE, so no need to change that). Make it so that a Necromancer receives dmg when people hit the summon when Transfer Pain is activated. For balancing issues they would have to figure out how much dmg is transfered.
well if you do that, the summon would always be targetted first for anything as it has low mdef and pdef if i remember correctly, not to bright on the necro summons :P
anyway, dont forget real summors get the skill aswell and they dont really need a nerf yet, unless the summon pvpers, few as there may be become true dominant
Just cut their nukes by 2 and reduce their transfert pain by 2.. or just deleted the Necro from the game... but leave us, the real summoners, alone. ;)
I know that people would attack the summon first. But no one is forcing the Necro to use TP. And if he wants to use it, he would just have to make sure that the summon stays away from the fight. The result would be that he can still use it, but it would be a lot harder. IMO a skill with such high benefits should be hard to use.
As for summoners: Yea, they would get nerfed a bit. However, they now have the possibility to attack people without any risk to themselves. They can stay back and send in the summon. If they do that, they won't use TP anyway. And if they both attack, people target the summon before the summoner anyway, as dieing to the summon results in 4% loss, even in war, and the summon can deal a lot more dmg (especially with SS now). So not turning on TP would solve that problem.
Problem with modifying the Transfer Pain skill is if it gets nerfed it will do more damage to Summoner classes. Alright hard enough to pvp when summoner always targetted and summon AI is crap.
Only simple solution would be remove TP from Necromancier. I too am in agreement that Necros have way to much ablilites compared to any class.
Here is a simplesuggestion that would nerf transfer pain a bit but not kill it all together. Make transfer pain not work when the necor has CP to go through. say a necro has 1500 CP and 2500 HP transfer pain would not take affect untill all the cp is worn through. Then all the damage that reduces the HPS would be halved with the summons. This would have no effect in PVE where CP doesn't play a role and in pvp it would lower the amount of life a necro has to a bit more reasonable number.
Otherwise unsigned I have had to put up with necros so far why can't I have the same bonuses when I sub one.
Death Spike and Dark Vortex ARE top nukes. Death spike has low mp cost, fast reuse timer and does some serious dmg. They also can summon at will if they got clannies/allies with them. Just let a fellow nuker summon their lvl 35(or whatever pre 2nd cc) summon, kill it and summon from the dead summon.
If the majority of the playerbase agrees that Necros are way overpowered, and most people picking subclass choose Necro then there is clearly some merit behind the case about them being FOTM and overpowered.
My suggestion therefore is to change Transfer Pain. I want to suggest that Transfer Pain works 2-ways in PvP (It works perfectly for PvE, so no need to change that). Make it so that a Necromancer receives dmg when people hit the summon when Transfer Pain is activated. For balancing issues they would have to figure out how much dmg is transfered.
Screws over three pure classes to fix one factor of one problem with a hybrid class. Sorry, just not a good idea.
As for summoners: Yea, they would get nerfed a bit. However, they now have the possibility to attack people without any risk to themselves. They can stay back and send in the summon. If they do that, they won't use TP anyway.
Your assumptions are wrong, the conclusions you drew from them are also wrong. Please do not make statements about pure summoner PvP strategies. You do not know what you are talking about, and I don't think it's that you're dumb, just that you don't know anything about summoners.
As for summoners: Yea, they would get nerfed a bit. However, they now have the possibility to attack people without any risk to themselves. They can stay back and send in the summon. If they do that, they won't use TP anyway. And if they both attack, people target the summon before the summoner anyway, as dieing to the summon results in 4% loss, even in war, and the summon can deal a lot more dmg (especially with SS now). So not turning on TP would solve that problem.
That's for NC to fix. Tell u the truth ONLY time can use that stradegy is when in a group pvp with melees in it, otherwise summoner is targetted and runs around like a helpless healer. Some summoners try combine LA + TP so summoner himself can stand his ground and try get their cubics to trigger.
The way to make a fix to necros only could be giving them only lower lvl transfer pain (there are different lvls of it, right?)
5 lvls in total. 10% of damage shifted to the summon per lvl. So at lvl 5, 50% damage is shifted to the summon.
The way to make a fix to necros only could be giving them only lower lvl transfer pain (there are different lvls of it, right?)
Up to 5 levels of it by level 70, each level being 10%. The first level or two are very minor, but because it's a constant amount taken from a dwindling total, each level of TP is more important than the last...<ul type="square"> Lv1: 10%, 11.11% difference from base. Lv2: 20%, 12.5% difference from Lv1. Lv3: 30%, 14.3% difference from Lv2. Lv4: 40%, 16.7% difference from Lv3. Lv5: 50%, 20% difference from Lv4. How does that happen? Imagine a 100hp attack against TP4 (60 damage), then against TP5 (50 damage)...even though it's a +10% effect level, it's 20% more effective in actual damage mitigation.
Giving necromancers half the normal progression: TP1 at the same time, TP2 when a summoner gets TP3, TP3 when a summoner gets TP5...it would work pretty well, actually, as necromancers would lose 40% of the effectiveness while maintaining enough of a transfer (-30% damage) to suit the class's hybrid-summoner status.
Might be too subtle of a change for the message board to go for it, though.
Sounds relatively good bekkar, subtle changes and tweaks are the key to mmog balancing.
Major removal and "nerfing" of attributes and abilities are not.
The idea of making TP work in reverse is workable, although a heavy change.
It could well increase player tactics in defeating classes with TP, and also increase the skill of said classes in defence.
You wont know if the character has TP on, therefore which do you shoot? Do you go for the corrupted man because you know it can die fast and the Necro is much tougher because of it? Or do you go for the Necro himself?
Wasting a test shot on either pet or summoner gives the summoner the upper hand, and remember the summoner can always toggle this skill on at any time inbetween shots. This could really confuse enemies and a good summoner would easily learn the best way to utilise it.
I don't see the reversal of TP being unfair for these reasons. Anything which gives players more ability to control the outcome and more ability to fool their enemies is generally a good thing.
I've been playing Necro since C2, I know his good & weak points. The class itself is good as it is now.
It's not affected significantly by C4. All his "overpower" was here since prelude, why there were no whinnings 2 years before?
Let's review what C4 added to Necro:
1. New summon - Cursed Man. Just LOL. No group buffs, takes 15% of exp (instead of 5 of real summoner), weakest pdef/mdef, required a corpse to summon, no PvP use, 2 C-Cry for 20 mins. Why do I need it at all?
2. SS for summons. Just LOL. For PvP summon it makes no sense because of his low patk/matk/attack speed/casting speed. Just a waste of adena. As for PvM summon - no Necro uses it anyway. 15% of exp is more or less ok, but summon is so weak, it dies from few hits, you spend more sps healing it.
3. What's new for summoner in C4? New uber-skills on 76 lvl? Just LOL. I'm sure, 90% of all necro rerollers will never ever reach 76. Necro can solo/duo, can be a tanking mage in nukers party, but without real AOE skills, it's very expensive, very slow, very difficult and boring to reach even 75... My wife is WarCryer and she is always welcomed and having party. And she is already 72. And will subclass half-year before I even reach 75. Necro has to dual-box SE. Play the game on the new level? Buy second account? Buy second computer? That's only how it works. Why do I need MMORPG then? To play alone?
In this game level and gear decide. SH/SPS is 5 times easier/faster to lvl. So they will actually play the olympiad, rather than Necro. Because most of rerollers will abandon their Necro anyway... And if level decides, SH/SPS 78 lvl vs Necro 70- will be the real statistics.
Transfer Pain is the only thing why people playing a Necro.
Anchor/Silence/Gloom are not really reliable skills. They fail most of the time on ppl, spending the same time playing this game as me. And those ppl are somehow tens levels higher than me.
Necro of lvl X invested at least x2 more time in his level, than any other class of lvl X. If he has earned adena himself.
I've been playing Necro since C2, I know his good & weak points. The class itself is good as it is now.
It's not affected significantly by C4. All his "overpower" was here since prelude, why there was no whinnings 2 years before?
Let's review what C4 added to Necro:
1. New summon - Cursed Man. Just LOL. No group buffs, takes 15% of exp (instead of 5 of real summoner), weakest pdef/mdef, required a corpse to summon, no PvP use, 2 C-Cry for 20 mins. Why do I need it at all?
2. SS for summons. Just LOL. For PvP summon it makes no sense because of his low patk/matk/attack speed/casting speed. Just a waste of adena. As for PvM summon - no Necro uses it anyway. 15% of exp is more or less ok, but summon is so weak, it dies from few hits, you spend more sps healing it.
Flag, Gloom + Anchor. Either collect mobs and train on paralyzed player or kill him with summon spamming SS to receive full 4% death.
Summon allows necro same training ablilites as a summoner and tanking ablilites "TP".
I agree with ur second statement, TP main reason for huge reroll train. Even a semi nuker that can shift 50% damage to his servitor gives them an edge.
Hehe even thou everyone, including myself, calling nerf. I have to admit Necromancier is a completely developed class. Be nice if other classes got little more detail and have some new skills. Well just ignore this, not enough coffee to finish this suggestion.
I think its funny that soon as everyone got done complaining about SPS and Sorcs with aura flare they turned around to necros to cry nerf stick on TP. They were the same all the way till now so whats the difference? Obviously didnt bother people back then dont see the huge problem now. Necors pets are easy to drop if you havea archer or another nuker in the area. And if you bring up the point of in a one on one you kil lthe pet then the necro will kill you ...of course but then again this game isnt about 1v1 now is it? its about mass pvp. From pvping* beside a necro for an entire chronicle that pet can get rocked easily by a nuker or archer any people who arent smart enough to drop the **** thing in the begining of mass pvp deserve to get rocked.
I still think OL's are being underrated by everyone cry to hard about straight nuker mages tho :)
I think its funny that soon as everyone got done complaining about SPS and Sorcs with aura flare they turned around to necros to cry nerf stick on TP. They were the same all the way till now so whats the difference? Obviously didnt bother people back then dont see the huge problem now. Necors pets are easy to drop if you havea archer or another nuker in the area. And if you bring up the point of in a one on one you kil lthe pet then the necro will kill you ...of course but then again this game isnt about 1v1 now is it? its about mass pvp. From pvp beside a necro for an entire chronicle that pet can get rocked easily by a nuker or archer any people who arent smart enough to drop the **** thing in the begining of mass pvp deserve to get rocked.
I still think OL's are being underrated by everyone cry to hard about straight nuker mages tho :)
i absolutely agree... ol > all
oh... and riptose stance > necro
people who cry about necros being overpowered got owned by one in the arena... not in the open field and not in mass pvp.
Necro's level just as fast as a SH, hell they both use the same nuke to level.
And I don't see everyone rerolling to a OL. OL's are strong, but necro's... well strength and the ability to level as quickly as your pockets are deep.
No turning around necessary. Summoners have been -_-ing about necromancers since day 1 - there are just more of them now, so their voice has gotten louder.
If you don't use your summons as a necro (or can't figure out how to bypass its weak defense in PvE) that's your own fault. Do you know how many SHs would kill for your ability to safely C:DL?