Reds in the rift? I'd be amazed if any non-political reds made it into a catacomb without getting attacked either along the way or by players as they teleport in.
Political reds simply deserve to be able to work off karma in a safe zone ^.^
It's also carebear that we are able to kill mobs in the first place; a true hardocre game would have it so that you'd need a party of 10k people to kill an orc. And a TSR orc at that, tolkien orcs should be unbeatable unless you were level 2k5. And letting people purchase weapons is also carebear.
We should do our killing barehanded and blindfolded.
It's also carebear that we are able to kill mobs in the first place; a true hardocre game would have it so that you'd need a party of 10k people to kill an orc. And a TSR orc at that, tolkien orcs should be unbeatable unless you were level 2k5. And letting people purchase weapons is also carebear.
We should do our killing barehanded and blindfolded.
this guy is old school...and i agree so +1 for him :P
maybe ur a carebear who shouldnt be playing L2. go play RoseOnline.
Carebear where do you get that. You go red you take the risk. Should be no safe zones to work it off. Unless your the one using the rift to work off karma then of course you would have no problem with it. But atleast come up with a better answer than "carebear go play another game"
I see no problem with it. Some are red by mistake..it happens. But red or not, they are players and the deserve the right to hunt. I personally would't care if it was a safe zone or not. It's kind of fun working off karma then having a group of people chasing after you, trying to get you to die and drop gear. It's pretty exciting.
they still need to hunt for the fragments to get in so kill um when they doing that in catas otherwise if they already had them tough luck they killed you and were ready to get rid of the karma...
the op is whining about reds, hence he doesnt like getting pked, hence he enchanted PVE to +30 in ivory tower. seriously go play a pve game.
maybe ur a carebear who shouldnt be playing L2. go play RoseOnline.
Carebear where do you get that. You go red you take the risk. Should be no safe zones to work it off. Unless your the one using the rift to work off karma then of course you would have no problem with it. But atleast come up with a better answer than "carebear go play another game"
they still need to hunt for the fragments to get in so kill um when they doing that in catas otherwise if they already had them tough luck they killed you and were ready to get rid of the karma...
Well u only need to have one fragment to get to the rift.
im not whining about reds im complaining they were chicken sh8ts that hide in a peace zone to work off karma not allowing me to kill them. LoL worried about reds i know
MORON.
Besides your from Hidensmith you dont know what pvp is anyway lol
I question wether or not half the people who play this game even has an idea what true pvp is. Anyways concerning your comment...perhaps they aren't there just to work off karma? Though that may be the main reasoning, but it isn't the only reason? Also like I stated earlier...some people go red by mistake, or by killing bots or other annoyances though with most, atleast on my server, that isn't the case =)
no they went in the for the sole purpose of working off karma. Its what they do all the time now, since they can work off karma and level up sin eaters in total safety and not worry about getting killed.
If they run out for rift stones they send other clannies out to gather more up to work off the rest of their karma.
Its going red with no risks of dropping gear or getting the people you killed to come back for you. Like i said why have a karma system if you can just work off the karma with no risk its kind of defeats the purpose of karma?
And going red 9 times in a row on the same 2 or 3 people isnt by accident lol
Man u're a total waste...... How the **** can u make that guy a carebear?
I'm the CAREBEARS's mom and he's not one of my kids.
Too bad you're not on Gustin... it seems u love getting PK'ed.
Orank, read, slowly, comprehend.
He's not whining about PKs.
What he does is complaining that PKs now get a carebear's helping hand (or stare? Whatever).
And if you are red and SOE clan hall or SOE castle, you should be ported to the closest 9 man exp party :P
Haa hahahaha!
Oh man I sooo love that idea.
Put it in suggestions! :D
If I remember right, the priest of Dawn did talk to red players ;) And sneaking into a town is easier than killing an elpy. You can get to Gludin by many different routes and into Dion by the wall too if I remember right. Not to mention that guards can be easily killed and daggers can silent step.
There should be no place where a red can hide from his sins. When you choose the chaotic path you should be Elf/human/orc/dwarf enough to face the wrath of your peers.
No safe zone for reds in the rifts.
No safe zone for reds in the city.
I dunno - I read it on the internet and assumed it be true.
I've argued in threads here that chaotics should be permitted to sign up for dusk. The presupposition in those threads was that reds couldn't sign up. The gatekeeper zigs are very red-tolerant.
maybe ur a carebear who shouldnt be playing L2. go play RoseOnline.
Well I guess if you are a C-B grader who gets his kicks acting tough against D graders or griefing newbs at starter towns and need to have a place to work off your karma without the fear of someone close to your level kicking the snot out of you for being a punk... then I could understand why you'd attempt to pass off the invalid logic that the OP is carebear.
Otherwise, I can only suppose you are overdue on your medications.
Besides your from Hidensmith you dont know what pvp is anyway lol
actually.. regardless of what you think of Oranj or his statement, I would say that of all the population of Hindemith, he is one of the group that does know of PvP.
I don't know much of the rift... but if you are seeing Reds there can't you just attack them?
Besides your from Hidensmith you dont know what pvp is anyway lol
actually.. regardless of what you think of Oranj or his statement, I would say that of all the population of Hindemith, he is one of the group that does know of PvP.
I don't know much of the rift... but if you are seeing Reds there can't you just attack them?
I haven't been in the rifst either but reading the other posts it appears to be a safe zone, much like when you are inside a town. You can't attack other players and if you try you get a "can't attack in peace zone" message
and I have no problems with reds in the rift. If NCsoft takes them out of the rift, they should dissallow people in clan wars to go to the rift. Guilds should be able to publish kos lists and NCsoft banishes these people from the rift. Or they should just stop it from being a safe zone for anybody, but singling out reds is unfair and dumb.
and I have no problems with reds in the rift. If NCsoft takes them out of the rift, they should dissallow people in clan wars to go to the rift. Guilds should be able to publish kos lists and NCsoft banishes these people from the rift. Or they should just stop it from being a safe zone for anybody, but singling out reds is unfair and dumb.
Well I doubt NCSoft would make it a safe zone for everyone but reds in the first place. If anything where to occur NCSoft would, at most, probably make it where if you are red you cannot enter the rift in the first place. But nothing will come of this, this thread is wasted space if anything
and I have no problems with reds in the rift. If NCsoft takes them out of the rift, they should dissallow people in clan wars to go to the rift. Guilds should be able to publish kos lists and NCsoft banishes these people from the rift. Or they should just stop it from being a safe zone for anybody, but singling out reds is unfair and dumb.
Huh? Reds arent the same as a clanwar so don't even compare the two. Oranj, just wondering how wanting to PVP makes you a carebear? thats funny
Anyways, reds should be able to be killed anywhere.
Anyways, reds should be able to be killed anywhere.
That would be sweet but people are asking for that since day one, so fat chance. They never had a karma wash haven up to now though, which is just ridicoulus.
the op is whining about reds, hence he doesnt like getting pked, hence he enchanted PVE to +30 in ivory tower. seriously go play a pve game.
Your "hence" is about as logical as "He doesn't like the color blue, hence he is a Republican"...appalling reasoning there.
He never whined about reds, where the blazes did you even come up with that?
Working off karma is supposed to involve risk. Some losers are using a cheap tactic to avoid the risk. Seriously, how can saying "defend yourself or die, like the rest of us have to" be carebear? :)
For some reason I'm seeing a red herring, pun intended.
Back to the original topic:
Maybe HGmspam can answer if this was designed to be this way or was something unforseen they didnt think of when implementing it?
...I'll be surprised if they really did intend to create a karma-free zone.
Working off karma is supposed to involve risk. Some losers are using a cheap tactic to avoid the risk. Seriously, how can saying "defend yourself or die, like the rest of us have to" be carebear? :)
That is your OPINION. I don't see ANYWHERE in the rules, tos, game lore, ect that states working off karma must involve some sort of giant risk. Besides, the rift can be difficult, and it does require a party. Someone with a party capable of working off karma in the rift is just as capable of working it off anywhere else and killing anyone who tries to stop them. Your point fails, you receive zero points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
Its nice to have a zone where your whole group doesnt have to keep going red to save your *** anymore. Its not like this is an unlimited access area for exp. If you dont put time in gathering frags prior to PKing people, it isnt going to do you very much good. Later on the price for entry gets extremely high so this isnt a permanent solution for working karma. You'll get a chance to gank them back at least sometime along the way.
and I have no problems with reds in the rift. If NCsoft takes them out of the rift, they should dissallow people in clan wars to go to the rift. Guilds should be able to publish kos lists and NCsoft banishes these people from the rift. Or they should just stop it from being a safe zone for anybody, but singling out reds is unfair and dumb.
Huh? Reds arent the same as a clanwar so don't even compare the two. Oranj, just wondering how wanting to PVP makes you a carebear? thats funny
Anyways, reds should be able to be killed anywhere.
Are they exactly the same? No. However in a clan war you can kill eachother without ingame penalties. You can kill reds without ingame penalties.
My point is that there should be NO place that ANYBODY should be able to lvl without risk being pked/griefed. However if there is such a place I believe it should be open to all.
That is your OPINION. I don't see ANYWHERE in the rules, tos, game lore, ect that states working off karma must involve some sort of giant risk. Besides, the rift can be difficult, and it does require a party. Someone with a party capable of working off karma in the rift is just as capable of working it off anywhere else and killing anyone who tries to stop them. Your point fails, you receive zero points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
Perhaps in your infinite wisdom, you can explain the concept of Karma and going Red, and the game mechanics that allow you to reduce said Karma and those game mechanics that govern pvp when engaging someone who has Karma. If it isn't a game design to be a punishment for picking fights with the unwilling or unknowing, one designed to increase the Risk for those players who choose to take that route (and the factored in elevated risk of item drops), then by all means, please detail your theory.
Reds are using the rift as a staging area, to make attacks into the necros and catas. They can attack without warning, easily killing off whole parties with surprise, then escape to the safety of the rift.
That is your OPINION. I don't see ANYWHERE in the rules, tos, game lore, ect that states working off karma must involve some sort of giant risk.
Partial risk statement, from The Library:
Chaotic character names turn red, and the guards of any village will attack a chaotic character whenever they come in contact with one. Chaotic characters cannot use shop services, and have a high chance of dropping items upon death.
To reduce Karma back to 0, the player must hunt monsters.
Players do not receive penalties for attacking and defeating aggressive characters.
When I have time, I might look for a more thorough explanation in the game lore. I spent less than two minutes looking for this. Don't give me that "it's not written anywhere" crap, you just didn't look for it. It directly states that you can be killed without penalty and that you're at risk to drop items while you are attempting to reduce your karma.
Anything bypassing that risk is going against the stated design of the game. The OP was completely justified in asking if this was an intended shift in the game's design--the shift is there.
Besides, the rift can be difficult, and it does require a party. Someone with a party capable of working off karma in the rift is just as capable of working it off anywhere else and killing anyone who tries to stop them.
Which makes them more chaotic, which completely invalidates your point.
Your point fails, you receive zero points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
:)
I actually like that statement, just wish you'd used it when I was actually wrong.
Reds are using the rift as a staging area, to make attacks into the necros and catas. They can attack without warning, easily killing off whole parties with surprise, then escape to the safety of the rift.
The rift has become just another griefing tool.
Well in honesty I don't care much about dieing and losing exp. If someone wanted to kill me and go red...good for them, all they are doing is helping me save up money for the next grade of gear, as well as saving more SP for those spells I'll need later on. They are just doing me a favor really...and I thank them for a job well done. I think people need to just get over it. So what if there are reds working off karma in a safe zone?
Reds are using the rift as a staging area, to make attacks into the necros and catas. They can attack without warning, easily killing off whole parties with surprise, then escape to the safety of the rift.
The rift has become just another griefing tool.
Well in honesty I don't care much about dieing and losing exp. If someone wanted to kill me and go red...good for them, all they are doing is helping me save up money for the next grade of gear, as well as saving more SP for those spells I'll need later on. They are just doing me a favor really...and I thank them for a job well done. I think people need to just get over it. So what if there are reds working off karma in a safe zone?
I give your attitude 10 levels to change.
Once you're losing a few hours worth grinding per death then it will be a much bigger deal.
Reds are using the rift as a staging area, to make attacks into the necros and catas. They can attack without warning, easily killing off whole parties with surprise, then escape to the safety of the rift.
The rift has become just another griefing tool.
Well in honesty I don't care much about dieing and losing exp. If someone wanted to kill me and go red...good for them, all they are doing is helping me save up money for the next grade of gear, as well as saving more SP for those spells I'll need later on. They are just doing me a favor really...and I thank them for a job well done. I think people need to just get over it. So what if there are reds working off karma in a safe zone?
I give your attitude 10 levels to change.
Once you're losing a few hours worth grinding per death then it will be a much bigger deal.
Nah it wont. After all I understand it's just a game. Dieing is a part of it and no reason to get worked up =P
Anyways, using the rift to work off karma is funny. It will probably be changed soon enough though. I stood in the center of gludio red one day for like 4 hours watching lowbies get killed trying to pull guards to me. I'd log out if they got close enough, it was funny. The rift will change, Oranj will still post without thinking or reading, life will continue.
Reds are using the rift as a staging area, to make attacks into the necros and catas. They can attack without warning, easily killing off whole parties with surprise, then escape to the safety of the rift.
The rift has become just another griefing tool.
Well in honesty I don't care much about dieing and losing exp. If someone wanted to kill me and go red...good for them, all they are doing is helping me save up money for the next grade of gear, as well as saving more SP for those spells I'll need later on. They are just doing me a favor really...and I thank them for a job well done. I think people need to just get over it. So what if there are reds working off karma in a safe zone?
I give your attitude 10 levels to change.
Once you're losing a few hours worth grinding per death then it will be a much bigger deal.
Nah it wont. After all I understand it's just a game. Dieing is a part of it and no reason to get worked up =P
get 60 + then talk about dying. Take a full xp death 4 or 5 times an hour and see how fast your xp is going....... backwards lol
Loss 20% an hour gain 6% -14% an hour you be level 4 in no time lol
Surely I hope that was sarcasm. If someone can get to 60+ but then somehow managed to delvl to 4 unintentionally then somethings up. And I stay firm on what I say. It's a game, get over it. If losing exp when you die really upsets you then maybe you should go outside for awhile, go make friends with real people...hang out places and such instead of making a game what your life is based on.
*edit* also note what I'm saying. It's not like I'm comparing exp loss at 60+ to exp loss of 40+ or 50+. I'm saying exp loss in general is no big deal and part of this game so noone should really get so upset over it.
lol play this game for a few months and tell me how much you enjoy being killed im sure there are plenty of people on Kain that would take nothing but joy in killing u over and over again if you asked lol
get 60+ then talk about griefing and reds and karma till then just shhh quiet and live in your little bubble.
lol play this game for a few months and tell me how much you enjoy being killed im sure there are plenty of people on Kain that would take nothing but joy in killing u over and over again if you asked lol
get 60+ then talk about griefing and reds and karma till then just shhh quiet and live in your little bubble.
I've been playing since Lineage II had just come out where I live, during the beginning of C1. So I'd say I've been playing for quite a long time. And I'm saying if you get upset in a game then you have some serious problems. I'm pro-red, I've had many pking chars myself dating back to C1 and even current. I was hunted on them a lot...but I didn't care if I died on either my whites or my reds, or inbetween =P If I lost gear oh well...it's replaceable. If I died and lost exp, big deal...I CAN get it back. It's not like if I died or lost gear in a game I lose a piece of myself IRL.
So before you open your mouth about someone you know nothing about, I suggest you just keep it shut =)
Wow you're smart. Message board is seperate from the main account. You are looking at when the MESSAGE BOARD ACCOUNT was registered. I haven't used it up till recently because I had a question concerning an issue...and I've been using it ever since.
mhmmm i know lots of people who play since c1 that only register 2 years after they first played.
Your a mute point.
Your not even addressing the issue.
Last i read about this is a pvp game not a pk without consequences game.
They already lowered the penatlies for Karma. Under 5 pks u dont drop anything, Sin eater quest for working off pks, and now a safe haven to work off karma.
mhmmm i know lots of people who play since c1 that only register 2 years after they first played.
Your a mute point.
Your not even addressing the issue.
Last i read about this is a pvp game not a pk without consequences game.
They already lowered the penatlies for Karma. Under 5 pks u dont drop anything, Sin eater quest for working off pks, and now a safe haven to work off karma.
All these things discourage pvp not increase it.
Up till now you haven't been addressing the issue. If you read my former posts I was clearly discussing the topic of reds working off karma in the rift. You, on the other hand, assumed that I was a new player and started talking your nonsense. Anyways I don't know why I should bother responding to someone so ignorant...I think my IQ level decreased in the process.
*edit* Don't know why I'm bothering to do this...but I guess since you are so convinced that you know me, which you don't, perhaps I should tell you a little about my playing history on Lineage II =P
I started back in C1, my very first character on Kain was a female DE fighter named BladeOfDeath. I soon met a guy named IBlade and we became friends...he helped me out a ton when I was a newb. I saw a dwarf in Gludio named DrugDealer, so I made a dwarf myself named DrugAddict and advertised the selling of DSS and cokes up until I made enough for full brig. This was when, on Kain, DSS was commonly sold for 10a each, some even sold for 9a each. After awhile of grinding on my main I decided to make my 3rd character.
The 3rd character was PokedToDeath, who was my PK char at the time. I admit I did wrong and abused the lucky bug...back in C1 before they had changed how Lucky worked (you know level 4 don't lose exp, don't drop items) I had level my pker up enough for some nice bow skills then delvled to 4 and ran around with comp bow and magic set pking people outside DEV.
That wasn't enough. I made another character, a LE named NekoKoneko and leveled her up to 14..then decided to pk around Elven Village with her. I then made an Elf mystic named Allegra and leveled her up to be a EO. Meanwhile my main was made into an SK. C2 was coming soon and lots of people where excited. Me and IBlade had joined D!E and he one day even proposed to me (in game mind you). But after C2 was out IBlade never logged on again...haven't talked with him in ages it seems. But to shorten things a bit, I tried re-rolling many times deleting my old characters, even the ones whom I've gotten up to their 50s and 60s, because I decided I didn't like playing with that class after all. Towards the middle of C3 I finally decided to try an SH, my current main. So far I have had no problems with her and I have all intentions of keeping her for now. I still have my dwarf, DrugAddict, too =P
Keep in mind, not all of us are forum warriors. We lurk but do not post, we post regularly on other forums, we spend more time in game than reading message boards.
get 60 + then talk about dying. Take a full xp death 4 or 5 times an hour and see how fast your xp is going....... backwards lol
Loss 20% an hour gain 6% -14% an hour you be level 4 in no time lol
If I died and lost exp, big deal...I CAN get it back.
did you not read other guys post?
XP goes BACKWARDS, you DONT gain xp when you go BACKWARDS
He is saying if I where to die that much, which I find to be an unlikely thing to happen. If I did die I would be getting an exp rezz and I would get the remainder of what I lost BACK so no I wouldn't be going BACKWARDS I would be going FORWARDS. Is this just the day for some people or what?
It's not like if I died or lost gear in a game I lose a piece of myself IRL.
Actually you did. You lost the amount of time you invested to get that gear/xp in the first place. You won't get it back.
Soo... to put it in terms you may understand. You work for 1 hour to get $20 US Dollars. I walk up to you and take it from you. You have now lost the representation of 1 hour worth of effort. You will have to repeat that effort to get another $20 so I have thus stolen a chunk of your life since you only have a finite amount of time on the planet.
I've been playing since OB. But, because I fear keyloggers and other account-stealing methods (I have a lvl 7x Warsmith, afterall), I rarely ever come out of hiding to post, or even register a forum account, for that matter, whcih explains my reg. date and post count. Particularly on L2-themed boards, where people who want to steal L2 accounts would most likely hide Trojans for that purpose.
*Begins running virus scanner and 3 malware scanners*
I'm pro-red, I've had many pking chars myself dating back to C1 and even current.
And that pretty much explains why you have no qualms with reds in the rift.
Why should anybody be able to xp without fear of being attacked by their enemies? It doesn't matter if they are red or white... everybody has enemies and nobody should be able to xp in safety imo
Being red makes a player a target when they may not otherwise be. The increased chance of dropping items attracts would-be looters. The ability to attack without flagging is an appealing aspect to red-hunting. Ad to that the ability to use status altering spells without needing to elicit flag/attack from the red player changes the strategic dynamic of the encounter.
Of course, for someone who goes red often, you are well aware of these things. There is a purpose behind making a PK go red.
It's not like if I died or lost gear in a game I lose a piece of myself IRL.
Actually you did. You lost the amount of time you invested to get that gear/xp in the first place. You won't get it back.
Soo... to put it in terms you may understand. You work for 1 hour to get $20 US Dollars. I walk up to you and take it from you. You have now lost the representation of 1 hour worth of effort. You will have to repeat that effort to get another $20 so I have thus stolen a chunk of your life since you only have a finite amount of time on the planet.
Wow some people are crazy. I don't see it that way. I enjoy the grind. I enjoy dieing. I enjoy striving for that next grade of gear. I enjoy hunting and waiting and expecting for that drop I want.
And I also enjoy taking breaks from this game and going to spend time with family and friends =P
I agree with you that reds are targets. I understand and accept the reasons even though I don't agree/like them.
However being in a clan war also makes you a big target. People can kill you without fear of turning red. You can use debuffs without them flagging (hold ctrl in clan war and u can still sleep/silence/para)
There should not be a place for anybody to hide if they are a target. And lets face it. Everybody is a target of somebody. The rift should not be a safe zone. (atleast the port in area) so if people want to camp the gathering place to kill reds they can.... but same with killing war tags or anybody else you feel like killing that day.
I agree with you that reds are targets. I understand and accept the reasons even though I don't agree/like them.
However being in a clan war also makes you a big target. People can kill you without fear of turning red. You can use debuffs without them flagging (hold ctrl in clan war and u can still sleep/silence/para)
There should not be a place for anybody to hide if they are a target. And lets face it. Everybody is a target of somebody. The rift should not be a safe zone. (atleast the port in area) so if people want to camp the gathering place to kill reds they can.... but same with killing war tags or anybody else you feel like killing that day.
I agree with this post. Expecially if the target is in a level 3 clan with 10 or more people. If someone wanted to pk that person, no need for them to go red anymore. Declare war and **** away o.o
Funny when people are advocating working off being red in safety.
are u saying that i'm advocating it? cause I'm not...
I think it shouldn't be a safe zone for anybody, but if it is a safezone for everybody, it should be for reds too imo. That's not quite the same as advocating a safe zone for reds. (although i did do that once, but not in this thread :) )
I recognize your point Hi. And in that narrow respect I agree.
That said, I will not excuse or make exceptions for ones actions because they are in a clan war.
Your clan affiliation is a choice. If you choose to be in a that is a warring clan, that's part of the deal. If you choose to stay with people whose actions elicit retaliation, that is your choice.
I've been playing since OB. But, because I fear keyloggers and other account-stealing methods (I have a lvl 7x Warsmith, afterall), I rarely ever come out of hiding to post, or even register a forum account, for that matter, whcih explains my reg. date and post count. Particularly on L2-themed boards, where people who want to steal L2 accounts would most likely hide Trojans for that purpose.
*Begins running virus scanner and 3 malware scanners*
Tell ya what -- I'd be happy to hold your stuff for you while you sweep the Trojans :)
Hey, it's only kinda off topic: can anyone confirm that you can sign-up for dawn/dusk while red?
Hey, it's only kinda off topic: can anyone confirm that you can sign-up for dawn/dusk while red?
Yes just tried it. You can sign up and you can use them to teleport and you can buy things from them just as if you were white. Now isnt that a fun fact for those perma reds out there lol
I think it shouldn't be a safe zone for anybody, but if it is a safezone for everybody, it should be for reds too imo.
It should be a safe zone, ok, yes.
It shouldn't be a place where they can get rid of the red status without having to fear being killed because they are red. I don't mind reds in towns because noone can do anything there. Having a spot where noone can touch them while they work off karma totally defeats the purpose of having karma in the first place.