I'm playing TK myself as main char since C1 now.
To agree to the previous posters, i think the TK has the best abilities to tank ( = PvE)
Best shield block, best mp regeneration&mdef(SK has same MEN, pala one less) and can support party with heals without getting low on mp(as pala). Even if you have no buffer, he can selfbuff pretty good for e.g. small quest parties.
The downside is the Str and the lack of active skills. Thats why he isnt very good in PvPing compared to other tank classes.
(you could always push str/dex and make him a good PvP char, but you wont be a good tank then)
Even that i like TK most, all tank classes can do their job pretty well. There's none of them, that really suck in tanking. So, get what you like. As PvP seem to be an important point for many people, there's no other choice then SK/DA.
PS:The myth TK has best defence isnt true. Human tank has more thanks to majestic selfbuff.
While TK shines for casual PvE (as much as a tank can shine [save being a hero.---then |FlaheS|)) human tanks have the highest natural CON (HP and Stun resist) getting stunned in raid = everyone dead.
Paladin is also the best AoE tank (due to highest HP all-around block, and again stun resistance).
Paladins are usually not targeted in PvP so they can sacrifice, spamming healing pots.
SK is not good for raid/AoE due to extremly low CON and being stun-prone.
On the other hand SK has highest mana pool and uber Hex - for regular PvE parties virtually the best *tank*, i.e not absolutely the best tanking abilities but semi DD adds more and 'hate' is still 'hate'. Usually hex is pretty much enough in a melee group to hold aggro enough till the mob eradication.
Back on TK - life cubic triggers based on the entire party avg. HP, so it's not so good in larger parties where just a few members get hit.
I would probably say for PvP = Dark Avenger, if you know how to use it. Debuffing can be tricky and is one of the hardest things to master in Lineage. Necros dont have it as easy as you would think. I think the most dangerous person in this game would be the person that knows when to debuff, when to attack, and when to break off an attack to let someone else finish them off. Its not all about 1v1 people, a great assist could be better then offing someone yourself.
PvE, I have to agree with the other posters here and go with the Temple Knight. I remember grouping with Penthesia(sp) back in the bad ole days of Korristain's Valor Clan. She was THE best tank I have ever partied with, and Ive partied with some fine tanks (Leo, Luke, Valder, to name a few) and she was a TK.
But as they said, go with what you know. Hell, i might even give DA a worl, but im not coming back to game without 2-boxing StThomas...couldnt stomach starting yet ANOTHER character naked from level 1 >.<
Just wondering whats the way to go for the best tank.
The best tank in PvE in my opinion is a Dark Avenger using Tallum heavy and a health Dragon Slayer with +4 str, +4 dex, and -8 con.
Honestly, since VR was introduced, high HP tanks are utterly ****ed useless outside of PvP or raid bosses. Quit packing the doom w/ health blunts please hindemith tanks, you only quest to make yourselves more useless in grinding parties (which are 95+% of the game).
VR is really helpfull, but its not the skill that makes high HP becoming totally useless. When you end up in fighting against multiple mobs, VR cant help much.
Combined with lowest pdef(tallum) and less stun resistance(even less then a SK) this is lowering your tank abilities in my opinion, where tanking is not just targeting.
The best tank in PvE in my opinion is a Dark Avenger using Tallum heavy and a health Dragon Slayer with +4 str, +4 dex, and -8 con.
I still say: a tank without a shield isn't a real tank.
They get those skills for a reason you know?
If you're talking of A then a Dark Legion's Edge with criticle damage SA and a heavy armour set with a shield bonus is still better.
Yes VR is great, doesn't help the tank (or his healer) if he get's two critical shots form an archer on the way to it because he can't use deflect arrow, as an example.
I wouldn't call a shield that's blocking about 75% of all incoming attacks useless...
Yeah, whoever thinks tanks are not needed, well good luck when you need one. Especially once you hit the 65+ range.
Even back in C3 when I was tanking Toi on my Sws (btw not recommended) I noticed a significant diffrence whenever we got an actual tank in the party. Plain and simple a tank saves a healers mp, usually a decent tank can keep aggro marginally off the DD's so that the healers are not spamming heals left and right. To be honest the best partying experiences I have had are with tanks in large parties.
I still say though that a Temple Knight would make the best Raid boss tank in the game.
Yeah, whoever thinks tanks are not needed, well good luck when you need one. Especially once you hit the 65+ range.
Even back in C3 when I was tanking Toi on my Sws (btw not recommended) I noticed a significant diffrence whenever we got an actual tank in the party. Plain and simple a tank saves a healers mp, usually a decent tank can keep aggro marginally off the DD's so that the healers are not spamming heals left and right. To be honest the best partying experiences I have had are with tanks in large parties.
I still say though that a Temple Knight would make the best Raid boss tank in the game.
im afraid i couldnt disagree more. i tank in 95% of the parties im in. without a "real" tank, everyone gets random aggro, and i get the majority. with a sws in party i have something like 1150pdef and dont even need a heal while tanking toi 9th. without a "real" tank, mobs aggro randoms from time to time, and that makes for everyone to be able to take their share of the hits, so the others can gain hp back off VR. the only time i would pt a tank now would be for nuker party, or if i felt like being lazy. sucks for tanks, but thats the way it seems to be.
random target = a running mob = wasting time you could spend on next mob already
I dont say, SWS shouldnt ever tank. I just disagree to that random target is an advantage.
Just wondering whats the way to go for the best tank.
The best tank in PvE in my opinion is a Dark Avenger using Tallum heavy and a health Dragon Slayer with +4 str, +4 dex, and -8 con.
Honestly, since VR was introduced, high HP tanks are utterly ****ed useless outside of PvP or raid bosses. Quit packing the doom w/ health blunts please hindemith tanks, you only quest to make yourselves more useless in grinding parties (which are 95+% of the game).
Lol have u ever tryed play a tank in the high lvl spots ? rofl sry this to funny
sry to say as iam a lvl 74 paladin on gustin in pvp clan+++++ i must say paladin is absolutly best Pve Tank u ever get, High pdeff lots off udneads mosb everywhere where Nm set+DLE/health, for pvp get a Spul Bow or just a BoP and yes u can carry lots off arrows and ***/bss, not a problem i even steal pvp scores from our mages/archers++++ anyways it depends on how u wanan paly u char.
Pvp go SK whit Nm set+DLE/Health+Sould Bow/BoP
Pve go Paladin/Dark avanenger Dark crystal DLE/healt
ofc TK is there to bvut just not a good tank in my opinion.
Yeah, whoever thinks tanks are not needed, well good luck when you need one. Especially once you hit the 65+ range.
Even back in C3 when I was tanking Toi on my Sws (btw not recommended) I noticed a significant diffrence whenever we got an actual tank in the party. Plain and simple a tank saves a healers mp, usually a decent tank can keep aggro marginally off the DD's so that the healers are not spamming heals left and right. To be honest the best partying experiences I have had are with tanks in large parties.
I still say though that a Temple Knight would make the best Raid boss tank in the game.
im afraid i couldnt disagree more. i tank in 95% of the parties im in. without a "real" tank, everyone gets random aggro, and i get the majority. with a sws in party i have something like 1150pdef and dont even need a heal while tanking toi 9th. without a "real" tank, mobs aggro randoms from time to time, and that makes for everyone to be able to take their share of the hits, so the others can gain hp back off VR. the only time i would pt a tank now would be for nuker party, or if i felt like being lazy. sucks for tanks, but thats the way it seems to be.
well in Nm set+zerk i still got like 11xx Pdeff and iallways ask for zerk pve/pvp i just love zerk but well tahts my way off playing my tank.
Why does everyone think a tank is there to kill people? Do all of you misunderstand what kind of class you play? If your out there dying you realize it gives your DD more time to overwhelm the enemy right, you should value there tanks, your melee groups should be fully balanced, 5 tanks, 1 sws, 1 bd, 1 wc/proph, 1 SE or EE. SwS should sing hunter, warding, and wind (with prophet buffs + hunter you can even crit alot with a health sword, wind gives you the speed to keep on a mages ***, they hate that [censored], and warding is a must for a tank, they already got insanely high p def they dont need earth for pvp). BD Should dance Fire and the attack speed dance. Prophet buffs should include, haste, focus, deathwhisper, all defensive buffs possible, including bless the body and soul, please dont give your tanks these buffs : Zerk, Guidance, Shield, Might, etc. they take up too many buff slots and dont help as much as the more defensive buffs you could replace them with, especially with the new c4 buffs.
Paladins and TKs = hardcore tanks lots of P.def, lots of HP, lots of party helping skills and heals
DA = lots of P.def, lots of HP, almost none party helping skills no heals and relatively powerfull summon
SK = good P.def, low HP, but being able to greatly debuff enemyes comensates for lack of damage sustaining
well u dont know how much a tank can give in dmgm, whit a bow ? hmm pretty hardcore at my lvl actualy
or u can just go for robe and mage weapon and +5 int and just start spaming drains ftw. As soon as u realize that being a good tank = being able to sustain as many hits as posibble, not being able to inflict as many damage as posible you will beg NCsoft to make u able to cary 2 shields and no weapon at all.
What's a matter with u peaople there is a reason for calling them TANKS not DAMAGE DELAERS, think about that.
If I can do a 70-75 level duo with TH in heavy armor for 15-20% a day w/ my SE giving VR to us, I would have to say HP tanks are worthless in PvE. Sorrus is correct about the Bladedancer tanking to, My sub BD (with Tsu*sls, BW heavy, +4 str, +4 dex, -9 Con) tanks better than a 60+ SK in HP setup. GG.
I see only tanks disagree with me, I used to disagree when paladin was my main.
HP tanks are only good for raid bosses when it comes to PvE in my opinion.
The ability to hold aggro better and make use of the most overpowered buff in the game far outweighs high HP in grinding parties. I wouldn't even invite a HP tank to a grind party I am leader of, but perhaps would make an exception for a VR-tank. Badger had a good idea for the Dark legion edge though. Perhaps DLE w/ health, tallum/NM/Maj heavy with shield and a DD symbol or two would be the king*****.
Oh, and to anyone who brings up PvP, perhaps use DD build till you are 78, then go PvP build, because then you would be at the top of your PvP prowess. Thanks.
Your right Paladin, but who wants to wait till they are 78/787/78 to pvp? And btw, A good tank will never be outdone by a blade dancer or sws or any other dual wield class when it comes to tanking, hp build or not.
At lvl 54 I can tank better and more efficiently than any bd or sws 10 levels higher than me
Then again I'm running around with a Sov w/ Acu and a + CON build. I don't get stunned nearly as easily that way.
Would be nice to have my robes on tho with this SoV. Then I could pretend I'm a nuker.
Your right Paladin, but who wants to wait till they are 78/787/78 to pvp? And btw, A good tank will never be outdone by a blade dancer or sws or any other dual wield class when it comes to tanking, hp build or not.
Well, if tank is your main class, don't need 78/78/78 :) Just 78. No matter how much HP a tank has, a nuker will roll them, so why bother PvP'ing at low lvls at all? :P
At lvl 54 I can tank better and more efficiently than any bd or sws 10 levels higher than me
Then again I'm running around with a Sov w/ Acu and a + CON build. I don't get stunned nearly as easily that way.
Would be nice to have my robes on tho with this SoV. Then I could pretend I'm a nuker.
I never said SwS was a good tank. SoV and CON build? No damage = no aggro = lots of hate / VR useless = more heals/recharges = no healer mp = bad tank. Sorry :/ Any hardcore melee grinding party will take a BD tank (or glad maybe, sometimes heavy armor daggers) over anything else, to be honest, I was only trying to help tanks by giving my personal opinion and ideas to be more useful and maybe get more good melee groups. :/
You should party with me sometime Paladin. It's actually a pretty decent tank build I have. And I only have to use Aggression on a mob once. Even with a 65 BD in party using +4 sls*sls. He can't pull aggro from me. :)
Actually your one of those people who love to grind and think they have mastered l2, I dont group to grind, I group because its more fun than soloing, my bad that grinding is a job to you, in fact Im just trying to help you by telling you my opinion about your responses to people on this forum. Seriously, though as an SwS I would have to say that with a Health Weapon nukers have one hell of a hard time for me, and again you said "in pvp nukers will roll tanks" yea.. umm.. tanks are supposed to get rolled, you realize this right? Why do you think they are called tanks... its not cause they have a big cannon man... its the armor and the amount of punishment they absorb, IF your pvping and you dont see your tanks hp drop....hes not being a tank and he might as well reroll...everyone always thinks its so cool to have a high pvp count lol. Thing is, when all the tanks are gone...pvp is gonna get super boring. I plan on staying true to my gaming roots, I always play a tank, and I always find a way to tear up any nuker, archer, or other class that thinks they pwn everybody, Ill figure this one out too...just gotta get 61...Im feeling tallum heavy set and a DLE w/health will = dead nukers...especially self buff vs self buff. Btw when I tested my hp dual build against nukers in c3, no matter which type of nuker it was...they always had to sleep, amd spam self heal, to have enough hp left to even drop me. Before you comment on pvp builds you should learn how to do it right.
Actually your one of those people who love to grind and think they have mastered l2, I dont group to grind, I group because its more fun than soloing, my bad that grinding is a job to you, in fact Im just trying to help you by telling you my opinion about your responses to people on this forum. Seriously, though as an SwS I would have to say that with a Health Weapon nukers have one hell of a hard time for me, and again you said "in pvp nukers will roll tanks" yea.. umm.. tanks are supposed to get rolled, you realize this right? Why do you think they are called tanks... its not cause they have a big cannon man... its the armor and the amount of punishment they absorb, IF your pvping and you dont see your tanks hp drop....hes not being a tank and he might as well reroll...everyone always thinks its so cool to have a high pvp count lol. Thing is, when all the tanks are gone...pvp is gonna get super boring. I plan on staying true to my gaming roots, I always play a tank, and I always find a way to tear up any nuker, archer, or other class that thinks they pwn everybody, Ill figure this one out too...just gotta get 61...Im feeling tallum heavy set and a DLE w/health will = dead nukers...especially self buff vs self buff. Btw when I tested my hp dual build against nukers in c3, no matter which type of nuker it was...they always had to sleep, amd spam self heal, to have enough hp left to even drop me. Before you comment on pvp builds you should learn how to do it right.
But I don't PvP :)
I grind :P
And as a person who grinds all the time instead of pvping, maybe I'm just giving grind tips :P Lvl 7x PvP is much more interesting than low lvl pvp anyway. But you gotta make it there first ;)
You are all immensely confused. You talk about tanking locations that are low level. ToI 9? You don't need a [censored] tank to attack white mobs. You can find SE/SHs duoing on ToI 10. They are great areas to exp, but tanks are not needed for these parties.
Tanks belong on the tough stuff. The places where healers are actually using their mana and sitting to keep mp up. Back in the day, when ToI was red to players, tanks were needed there. Now, obviously, it is better to take a dd class in its place.
Paladinx is a moron who could never learn to play his class. Duo? Tanks don't duo unless there is nowhere else to go. Tanks handle raid bosses and dark bloody red mobs. Head up to Forge of Gods without a REAL tank. We got caught in an aoe explosion from a mob in there. I took 2227 damage. Let that hit a BD and he will be lying on the floor one hit.
You want to know why so few parties go into Forge of Gods? Because most of the tanks on this server don't have a clue. They are used to climbing an empty ToI and trying to dd to hold aggro. Most have no idea what it was like trying to regulate a party climbing ToI for the first times. The difficulty level is dramatically different now due to changes and the level of players. But don't come talking about BD's and tanking...ROFL You can duo without a tank just fine, you just don't pick bloody red mobs to do it on. And brining a party of 9 to kill 4x hp mobs that are white isn't all that different.
Real tanks can take you into tough places. Places a dd group can't get to. But then again, why would you want to go there? Everyone just wants to grind up as fast as possible. GOGOGO Hurry up so you can beat lineage 2!! You win! LOL
Why does a TK suck? Guardstance BLOWS. I can hold 1300+ pdef and spam hate. A TK has to pick one or the other, can't guard stance 24/7 like majesty. Heals? A tank shouldn't be healing except in emergencies when something crazy gets outta control. In which case it needs to be fast and massive...hello sacrifice. Faster than battle heal and 1200+ hp.
You are all immensely confused. You talk about tanking locations that are low level. ToI 9? You don't need a [censored] tank to attack white mobs. You can find SE/SHs duoing on ToI 10. They are great areas to exp, but tanks are not needed for these parties.
Tanks belong on the tough stuff. The places where healers are actually using their mana and sitting to keep mp up. Back in the day, when ToI was red to players, tanks were needed there. Now, obviously, it is better to take a dd class in its place.
Paladinx is a moron who could never learn to play his class. Duo? Tanks don't duo unless there is nowhere else to go. Tanks handle raid bosses and dark bloody red mobs. Head up to Forge of Gods without a REAL tank. We got caught in an aoe explosion from a mob in there. I took 2227 damage. Let that hit a BD and he will be lying on the floor one hit.
You want to know why so few parties go into Forge of Gods? Because most of the tanks on this server don't have a clue. They are used to climbing an empty ToI and trying to dd to hold aggro. Most have no idea what it was like trying to regulate a party climbing ToI for the first times. The difficulty level is dramatically different now due to changes and the level of players. But don't come talking about BD's and tanking...ROFL You can duo without a tank just fine, you just don't pick bloody red mobs to do it on. And brining a party of 9 to kill 4x hp mobs that are white isn't all that different.
Real tanks can take you into tough places. Places a dd group can't get to. But then again, why would you want to go there? Everyone just wants to grind up as fast as possible. GOGOGO Hurry up so you can beat lineage 2!! You win! LOL
Why does a TK suck? Guardstance BLOWS. I can hold 1300+ pdef and spam hate. A TK has to pick one or the other, can't guard stance 24/7 like majesty. Heals? A tank shouldn't be healing except in emergencies when something crazy gets outta control. In which case it needs to be fast and massive...hello sacrifice. Faster than battle heal and 1200+ hp.
No need for name-calling Luke, also, I knew **** well how to play my class, too bad it was boring as all hell (prophet is 100x more exciting, and most call them buffpets). Like I said, only tanks will disagree with me; I'm right. I said grind parties, read my posts before calling me a moron, you lose credibility in your self worship.
No need for name-calling Luke, also, I knew **** well how to play my class, too bad it was boring as all hell (prophet is 100x more exciting, and most call them buffpets). Like I said, only tanks will disagree with me; I'm right. I said grind parties, read my posts before calling me a moron, you lose credibility in your self worship.
You were awful and I 2box a prophet better than you play one...you only lvl because you play excessively but this does not make you intelligent. Soo many no party lists rofl :p
No need for name-calling Luke, also, I knew **** well how to play my class, too bad it was boring as all hell (prophet is 100x more exciting, and most call them buffpets). Like I said, only tanks will disagree with me; I'm right. I said grind parties, read my posts before calling me a moron, you lose credibility in your self worship.
You were awful and I 2box a prophet better than you play one...
I will strive to be worthy of your awesome AF and buff skills. Too bad my prophet has more patk then your paladin.
TK owns all when it comes to sheer tanking. With normal high pdef, and the high dex for more hsield block, we take less damage then any other tank class. I win.
I dont belive "the best tank" label belongs to a class..
Every tank class has a single use...
All tanks are like the plants we have at our home.We have them cause they just look cool...
NC proves that Balance is not their good spot.As i said many times melee people will become more and more useless while game revolutions making NNukers Archers stronger and srtonger untill a REAL balace move from NC occurs,
and untill NC realises that having:
*Durability(hp and/or pdef) IS kinda worthless comparing to
*Range A N D Dmg/time (Nukers,Archers)
Loving your class is not bad, But not being able to REALISE your class exists at this game for Style reasons and to make
other classes feel better cause they are better from you
is not wise at all...
For history now im Playing my last reroll at this game as a Tank (SK).
Paladin is definately the best tank for parties that require actual tanks. SK is a substitute for another DD in areas where a DD can not quite handle the tank job. Every tank has their roles - TK are especially good at raids that require kiting a single raid boss, since they are especially fast (with berserk not lowering pdef much and the +8 speed it is quite useful for a TK in raids now (kiting that is). Sadly, TK has few other uses where a Paladin (the other PvM tank) is not superior.
Also any Paladin is better than SK or TK in raids - because every raid has bishops and % heal is much more mana effective on them than on TK or especially SK. DA is better than SK or TK if no kiting or all around shield (no minions) is required. Guard Stance pretty much sucks. Majesty is better any day. Also, whenever buffing a paladin never forget Acumen ;)
Since this post was ressurected, I have a question about tanks... what role do they play in PVP?
Mass pvp and small pvp? I got into a debate over this with my clanny in Vent, and I was explaining that all classes have a role.. but I couldn't figure out what the role of a tank was in terms of PVP, when they are fully buffed, do they play a major role or are they purely PVE characters.
Since this post was ressurected, I have a question about tanks... what role do they play in PVP?
Mass pvp and small pvp? I got into a debate over this with my clanny in Vent, and I was explaining that all classes have a role.. but I couldn't figure out what the role of a tank was in terms of PVP, when they are fully buffed, do they play a major role or are they purely PVE characters.
Outside of SK and DA ability to deal good dmg pvp, tanks are just cannon fodder in pvp. Specially when considering that they use melee better than ranged attacks. cant do much without a bow if u hit ud :(
Since this post was ressurected, I have a question about tanks... what role do they play in PVP?
Mass pvp and small pvp? I got into a debate over this with my clanny in Vent, and I was explaining that all classes have a role.. but I couldn't figure out what the role of a tank was in terms of PVP, when they are fully buffed, do they play a major role or are they purely PVE characters.
In modern pvp the best role for a tank to play is to soak. For human tanks this also involves stunning any melee that close the gap. A tank should be paired with a healer. Group heal for the party, greater battle heal for the tank. The average player does not have the hp/mdef/pdef to withstand a party assisted barrage of nuking/arrows, but a tank does. The draw people in, prevent disrupters from closing in on dds, and soak.
Alternatively, in small party pvp, tanks EXCEL. 5v5, a tank is a better pick than one of the dds. Able to soak an immense number of volleys AND stun, the tank can break apart the party from the healer. They become even more powerful when you augment their strength with an intelligent debuff, slow. Slow a player and have the tank pursue. With an immobile enemy, the tank will maul the hell out of any class, with room to spare stunning anyone that draws close to help.
Agreed, any melee should always be the forefront of your attacking forces in a mass pvp like a siege or really any place but the arena.
In most mass pvp issues aside from clan leaders and alliance leaders being targeted during sieges the first thing most people click to start shooting is the first thing they see. Tanks make excellent front runners in battle.
Hate may not be something usable on players during pvp but it's simple numbers. If you see a group of 20 melee charging you, you target what you see first. Human tanks especially can get in past your ranks and start stunning mages and archers.
Not only that, kitty with soulshots hurt now, so DA's make the best siege ground tanks, long after the DA goes down kitty fights on.
I dunno about DA making the best siege ground tanks.
Warsmith golems do tremendous damage, both melee and magic with shots. And I would venture to say, not only does our stun land a bit more often, but how many pure tank classes have 11k hp and cp? Takes 12-15 hits easy to kill me and I have no UD to rely on. And thats from high level nukers. Add a polearm for close quarters mass pvp, and a Warsmith makes a **** good siege tank. (2 stuns, 3 polearm attacks, masteries for both weapons, and an over-powered golem...)
I never really viewed Warsmiths or Bounty Hunters as tanks, I always considered them as just being a melee class like daggers and gladiators and destroyers and well I could go on?
Sure I have seen a Bounty hunter and warsmith able to marginally hold aggro when pve'ing, but I think the topic discussion was Best Tank Class. I don't think Warsmith/Bounteyhunter's class description is Tank.
I was simply saying in terms of siege and pvp, as WS/BH are not tanks, but dd's. Only in sieges/pvp can they be good tanks since hate doesn't work pvp. And even then, BH isnt as good as WS in pvp.
I Takes 12-15 hits easy to kill me and I have no UD to rely on. And thats from high level nukers.
Really o.O I run around 9.5k hp, 3k cp. Stats at around 1200 mdef and a skill to resist dark attack it took exactly 11 nukes. You have some mystical magical jewelry there.
Strong as summons may be, they have relatively low hp/defense. They fall under the annoyance category.
I Takes 12-15 hits easy to kill me and I have no UD to rely on. And thats from high level nukers.
Really o.O I run around 9.5k hp, 3k cp. Stats at around 1200 mdef and a skill to resist dark attack it took exactly 11 nukes. You have some mystical magical jewelry there.
Strong as summons may be, they have relatively low hp/defense. They fall under the annoyance category.
Mew the cat > Luke
don't underestimate summons or you may find yourself saying that from the floor
I Takes 12-15 hits easy to kill me and I have no UD to rely on. And thats from high level nukers.
Really o.O I run around 9.5k hp, 3k cp. Stats at around 1200 mdef and a skill to resist dark attack it took exactly 11 nukes. You have some mystical magical jewelry there.
Strong as summons may be, they have relatively low hp/defense. They fall under the annoyance category.
Mew the cat > Luke
don't underestimate summons or you may find yourself saying that from the floor
He's only saying that cause summoners can easily beat any tank in a 1vs1, and in mass pvp too. :) I think his ego is hurting alittle. ;D
People forget about my golem a lot of the time. But with a bishop in party, or btb from a prophet of around my lvl, my golem has 5k hp.
While he doesn't have the best pdef, fully buffed he has 1200patk and 1k matk. Combine that with beast shots and blessed beast spiritshots, the golem is more effective in taking people out in mass pvp than any single dd outside of a nuker. Add warsmith stun or debuffs from a good summoner, and pets rule the day.
Especially when two or three summoners work together. I saw four pets take out a group of 7 melee in about 30 seconds in a siege. And three of those melee were in a grade, including an sk.
Like I said tho, in terms of pvp, warsmith is one of the better summoners, not only because of the golem, but also stun attacks and tremendous amounts of cp and hp.
Everything Luke has said in this post is correct, He knows the tank class, He knows there abilities, the potential, and how to play them. People keep trying to make tanks killers in pvp, well they are stupid, because tanks arent killers, they are protectors, the more dmg that gets done to you, the less damage that gets done to your DD. So having a bishop and a WC or Prophet in a Tank group is amazingly important, because it will take forever to kill a tank that is being healed, I remember back in the day me and zalvador (he was on his old TK) were pvping at Dion castle, I was protecting ReBorN flags with my clan. I was an SK at the time and it was SK vs TK, cubics out, we must have attacked each other for 5 minutes..it was ridiculous.. finally lullabycurse nuked his *** and he dropped. Which completely explains the purpose of tanks, you hold an enemy and keep him busy till your DD has time to clean him up. Stop worrying about your pvp count, if people keep rerolling... your gonna see Tanks become a huge commodity in sieges, especially 1 or 2 tank parties if they are set up right.
Everything Luke has said in this post is correct, He knows the tank class, He knows there abilities, the potential, and how to play them. People keep trying to make tanks killers in pvp, well they are stupid, because tanks arent killers, they are protectors, the more dmg that gets done to you, the less damage that gets done to your DD. So having a bishop and a WC or Prophet in a Tank group is amazingly important, because it will take forever to kill a tank that is being healed, I remember back in the day me and zalvador (he was on his old TK) were pvping at Dion castle, I was protecting ReBorN flags with my clan. I was an SK at the time and it was SK vs TK, cubics out, we must have attacked each other for 5 minutes..it was ridiculous.. finally lullabycurse nuked his *** and he dropped. Which completely explains the purpose of tanks, you hold an enemy and keep him busy till your DD has time to clean him up. Stop worrying about your pvp count, if people keep rerolling... your gonna see Tanks become a huge commodity in sieges, especially 1 or 2 tank parties if they are set up right.
Well its really a numbers game. 9v9 tanks really rock things. They arent easy to take down with just 3 or 4 heavy dd's and they make archers obsolete. But in a siege pvp (like on Hindemith) where the numbers have to be over 100 each, closing the range gap is hard. Too many heavy dd's dropping targets before they get close. Tanks rock in the small fight. Ask Elishka, after wiping his party at argos, the only ones left standing were the tanks (with mobs chasing us). Sieges is a different ballgame. Inside the castle Aden where small fights break out...GOGO TANK. Outside in a wide open field...well...tank is lucky if he even gets into the 600 range to shoot a bow.
Wind, Warding, windwalk2 = gap closed and tank protected.
Ill fix that for you since those are the only 3 that provide for taking damage when you can't do damage back because you're out of range.
And no, they don't. In UD2 with 4k+ mdef a nuker still hits for 150 damage. At 1300 mdef you're looking at 8-900 damage. That's 10 nukes aka two volleys. And when you get there if you do...most are dead and many are weakened. Then there is the sleep/para/slow/root factor. Then life taps from the SH and necro... The best you can hope is to distract for your own dd's to close in.
The best you can hope is to distract for your own dd's to close in.
Which would be the job at the inital part of a siege for you, anyway. As a tank, I wouldn't phrase it as 'the best you can hope' for, rather, that should be your target, no?
Tank Class = damage absorber Luke, those 10 nukes that killed you.. could have dropped 3-4 DD's in that time...and if they waste time killing the DD's then tanks will have the time to close in and wipe [censored] out.. only unbalanced thing I see is a Necro, I watched Tido2 drop Deena, Sultan, and 1 other person today with corrupted man out.. those are high level people and good pvpers.
Tank Class = damage absorber Luke, those 10 nukes that killed you.. could have dropped 3-4 DD's in that time...and if they waste time killing the DD's then tanks will have the time to close in and wipe [censored] out.. only unbalanced thing I see is a Necro, I watched Tido2 drop Deena, Sultan, and 1 other person today with corrupted man out.. those are high level people and good pvpers.
Deena is a SE or a WC, it wont take much to drop him. Sultan is an archer, and sometime archer stand no chance against Necro. But i do agree with you about tank being a toll for absord damage not dealing damage.
i didnt really wanna read all this, but I say SK. SK have very nice blocking skills, cubics to debuff and add some damage / health to the SK, not to mention 2 other lifedrains to add health as well, can pop some bsps. Or some SK even get a magic sword instead of a p.atk sword. You're play style can affect a lot of stuff man, play what ya want, play whats fun. I play SK because I <3 it. I love lightning strike on trainers, I love when I get slept to see my cubics still poison and tap people, I like to hit ultimate defense and be able to use life drains to get all my hp back. And From what I hear SK now get shield stun at 76, sexeh. So I'll always be a SK, and I'll probably still screw around with gear / tattoo combinations and p.atk / m. atk swords till I find what I like =D
And From what I hear SK now get shield stun at 76, sexeh.
It's gonna be great when all the non human tanks get shield stun and think it's cool. All us humans are gonna love never letting you use it in a fight >.>
lightning strike, bleh, the reason a lot of SK lose is they depend on that =P so many other things you can do, swap to a m.atk weapon and hit the drains and Ls, back to the p.atk one, sting and run, tap if they try to cure =D so many things rely on the players skill and intelligence. Lots of people panic like ZOMG IM GETTIN HITS! I've been beatin by humans, but they were very good :)
Tank Class = damage absorber Luke, those 10 nukes that killed you.. could have dropped 3-4 DD's in that time...and if they waste time killing the DD's then tanks will have the time to close in and wipe [censored] out.. only unbalanced thing I see is a Necro, I watched Tido2 drop Deena, Sultan, and 1 other person today with corrupted man out.. those are high level people and good pvpers.
Deena is a SE or a WC, it wont take much to drop him. Sultan is an archer, and sometime archer stand no chance against Necro. But i do agree with you about tank being a toll for absord damage not dealing damage.
i killed him like 5 times that day fyi, he dropped me once only.it is not an accomplishment to kill as a necro, but it is one to kill a necro.someone named silentfire was spamming heal on him and not flaggin (i dont know why, he was not getting purple....), thats the only time he killed me and deena. just wanted to get facts straight^^
edit: deena was on his lvl 5x subclass there, not his lvl 75 WC.