So I've got a lvl 30 Knight with brig gear and so far I've only been in one successfull raid boss party. It's getting lonely soloing in Aden and some of that raid boss xp wouldn't hurt either. I've read Glav's tanking guide which was great but I have a couple questions still....
Many posts state that when tanking ALL you do is stand there and spam Hate? So does this mean you literally stand there without swinging your sword or should you be getting some hits in while you spam hate? I would think that getting in some hits would help secure aggro but what do I know.
Also, is there any raid boss guides out there? Like something that lists the raid bosses locations and what lvl your party should be in order to defeat it? I have a feeling stratics has something but the site appears to be down now. I just want to be prepared so if I do end up organizing my own party in Dion I dont' look like a total ******* which i'm sure I will anyways ;)
Many posts state that when tanking ALL you do is stand there and spam Hate? So does this mean you literally stand there without swinging your sword or should you be getting some hits in while you spam hate? I would think that getting in some hits would help secure aggro but what do I know.
There is nothing stopping you from hitting the raid boss, in fact I would encourage it. Depending on your raid group size your extra damage (although it may be small) is still extra damage to take down the raid boss faster. On top of that, like you mentioned, more hate.
I wouldnt say that casting hate is all that tank CAN do , but its all that he MUST do. The rest is extra gravy.
tanks damge vs a boss = 0 or not enough to do anything.
so it does not matter if you attack or not.
Many high lvl groups like to use a dagger as a tank, because they take less damge and can pull one mob at a time with "lure". That is for Exp parties. Nukers still need a Tank to keep the Bosses from eatting them though, but not for Exp.
To be honest there is not much room for melees in high lvl parties if they are setup right.
Most melee players right now play melees because they like self abuse.
tanks damge vs a boss = 0 or not enough to do anything.
so it does not matter if you attack or not.
Many high lvl groups like to use a dagger as a tank, because they take less damge and can pull one mob at a time with "lure". That is for Exp parties. Nukers still need a Tank to keep the Bosses from eatting them though, but not for Exp.
To be honest there is not much room for melees in high lvl parties if they are setup right.
Most melee players right now play melees because they like self abuse.
Re-read the question.
To the op, tanking a raid boss at lvl 30 has a few factors you must accept.
1. The RB level must be close to your own
2. You are gonna lose hate, it happens. I recommend casting hate every 3 seconds, while swinging on the boss inbetween. Also, when the nukers/melees grab hate in a low level raid, have them stop attacking until the boss is off them.
3. Buy health pots
4. Do damage
At your level, there is a lot more leniency with the dmg output of the RB, and the amount of hp's they have. You can really enjoy these raids if they are successful.
Hey thanks for the replys guys. Just the info I was looking for. Now I just need to get out there and do it. Oh and one more thing - raid boss minions. Should you hate one of them first and then hate the boss right after OR should you just hate the boss first? I know you should generally take out the minions first but once you attack a minion the boss is gonna attack anyways right? My thinking is that if I hate the boss right away i'll get hate from the minions by default and then I don't have to worry about the boss going after a nuker or healer right off the bat. Any thoughts?
To OP--having tanked about 60 of the types of RB's you're describing from lvl 26-40 recently, I can tell you that your damage is negligible.
Generally even with a +5 ELS I hit bosses for 25 points--sometimes a crit for 50 or 60. Nukers around me were hitting at some levels (even lower levels) for 1250.
Aggro and hate (when u get it)---aggro and hate--swing as much as you can.
Keep control of the group. It's better to type instructions than to swing a sword hitting for 25 hit points. Make sure the group stays together and focused. Type encouragement, progress once in awhile.
As long as you're picking bosses close to you and your group has at least a good healer and 3 nukers--and is full at 9 I don't think you should generally fail on a raid at those levels.
That being said--I've seen just about everything in 'pickup' groups at those levels........players running, healers buffing dd's during the raid instead of healing tanks, outside pkers interrupting group, nukers deciding to quit casting!!! LMAO--when they go south they generally go south in a hurry.
At those levels by the way--even if you do everything right to maintain aggro the Boss will leave you from time to time. Particularly around those lvl 30 bosses. The disparity of how hard the nukers hit relative to everyone else at those levels just draws the bosses to them.
Hang in there and keep practicing. If you can establish a solid core of a group to raid and level together you will find it more fun and less risky too!
GL!
Drakkos also has a good way to go about it. My groups are spoiled, as I have oop buffers. I raid lower level raids with my clannies on alts. We can do 30 under with about 5 people, 40 under with about 9, depending on the boss. Takes a lot of coordination.
What I meant by the nukers to stop when they have aggro, is kinda like a ping pong style. If I see the RB coming after me, I stop while the other nuker gans aggro, then he stops while I nuke. This works pretty decently on the 30 and under until the RB settles back on the tank. Those times of chaos are when the pick up groups usually fall apart. What the melees need to remember, is when the nukers are kiting or ping=ponging, that they also have ranged attacks of some sort. Use them with blessed sps.
If you are nuker-heavy in your party (5 or more nukers), you may just want to have the nukers kill the boss, and not even worry about the minions. Hate the boss and then run around in little circles. You won't take much damage because you're not standing in place. Once the boss is down, all the minions will disappear. Bosses with minions have less HP, and the level 30'ish bosses can be taken down with 5 nukers in about 1 minute.
yeah their is little to be gained by whacking the RB. A few tanks put debuffs on their weaps and whack the raid when they can to get their SA to go off.. which will still fail 99% of the time but still draw major agro. But at lvl 30 there are no SA's sooooo.
in a minon RB its best to do single hate in the boss then aura hate minons, switch back and forth as minons will not always follow the boss's agro
sometimes RB's don't follow a pattern tho.
We had a lvl 57 ES pull agro off a 76 hero paladin on liluth using an emi bow (mind u there are almost 18 other nuker's archers there 70+), and in the tank group (he didn't have a BD just an SWS). The paladin couldn't regain hate the entire time even with spaming of hates. That ES pratcially tanked lilth (thank god he was in the tank pt and had a summon out for TP)
To OP--having tanked about 60 of the types of RB's you're describing from lvl 26-40 recently, I can tell you that your damage is negligible.
Ive done lvl 25-30 raid bosses with 4 people (no nuker) with an out of party prophet.
2 Dorfs, 1 Paulus Knight, 1 Monk...
and if a lvl 30 "tank" does sweet ***** all damage as you guys say, then we had 3 toons that did no damage and sill manged to take raid boses down with minions and all. Yes we had an out of party buffer but who doesnt these days?
Great advice here and I have really no corrections to make. I have a lil 3x palus that I tank RB with when Im tired of grinding my mains.
The main mistake RB groups make are #1 tanks dont use hate until they lose aggro (which is too late and often guarantees the death of a partymember) and #2 nukers failing to stop nuking (ie generating hate) after they pull aggro. The two together are a set up for party wipe.
I do hit the mob, because my palus has an 11+ ELS and nifty things like sting. I figure any crits I get, any stings I land will help me generate more hate and reduce the chance of losing aggro, but I regularly use hate as we kill minions and the boss.
Decided to bring the post back to share my RB tanking experiences and maybe help some other new players. Also wanted to say thanks for all the great comments. So anyways, I've actually participated in quite a few RB's lately and even joined a clan ^^ Currently lvl 32...
The Social/Friend making aspects have been great but the success rate has not been so good. Mostly due to people wanting to take raid bosses above our level and not having enough healers and nukers (too melee heavy). Keeping the hate really hasn't been a problem for me - staying healed and killing the boss before the minions respawn has. So I've drawn the following conclusions:
1.) Make sure the Raid boss is lower in level than your party's average level or else you're gonna die.
2.) Be prepared to spend adena. Yes if you win you'll get a ton of XP even for lower lvl RB's but you will lose money.
3.) I'd rather hit necropolis or catacombs with a party than do RB's all the time.