I post here on the official boards and not some other area. I do it for a number of reasons. I've heard a lot of people accusing those of us who post here with a high post count as not knowing anything about the game.
People make assumptions based on superficial things. If you are a store clerk in a very high class exclusive store and someone walks in wearing clothes from Walmart you are probably going to assume they can't afford what you have to sell. That assumption is probably correct, but not always. They could still have a load of cash in their wallet, because appearances can be deceiving.
Many people who post here on the official forums are extremely knowlegable about the game. Many do have high level characters and many others know more about the mid/lower level than anyone who has a high level one. The game isn't just the end game, though that is where all of us hope to eventually end up.
All people posting on the official forums are not stupid any more than all people who post on l2blah are cheaters.
One thing we have in common is the game and a love for it. There are some larger problems that people are trying to address and perpetuating an 'us v. them' attitude on the boards is not going to get things solved.
Don't make potential allies enemies by name calling and elitism.
That and flaming back against someone just makes them want to act even more abrasive. Everyone who has played L2 for more than 2 months knows that for a fact, and will probably carry that knowledge till the day they die lol
Well said, one more thing though. Post count <> quality knowledge. By hanging here low these many moons, I can almost tell just by the names, the quality of the post. I include flames, ignorance, and rudeness in there too. While I many not always be as nice in type form as I wish to be, some of the rude comments that have been posted to these boards list last month are awful. Granted, sometimes you want to say RTM, but I now I read, search, google, and ask in game a lot and still need someone here to help with my research. The answers are not always where you expect them to be and at times, some of the posted content has errors.
Bottom line, 90% of the time, there is no reason in the world to 'dis someone here. We are all part of making this game fun.
Post count, level and knowledge of the game have absolutely nothing to do with each other.
I've witnessed people that are in their mid 60's and don't have a **** clue about the game. There are plenty of peeps who post here with post counts in excess of 3k who don't know anything about what the game is like in the mid to high levels. (Tip: The game changes, it evolves, the difference between lvl 1 and lvl 40 is similiar to the difference between lvl 40 and 70...)
I've also know a couple people who don't post here at all, and don't have any characters above 60, who know a TON about the game, including all the quests, and have a toon of nearly every class.
Postcount and Level are completely independant of game knowledge. The same as PvP count is no indicator of someone's actual ability to PvP. LOL
I can't imagine anything less useful than 'forum politics'...(lol).
That being said--this entire forum has helped me all along the way thus far.
Sometimes a wrong answer gets to me...but if I recheck someone else has corrected it.
Generally as someone who probably posts most of the incorrect answers (though I don't try to)....I think the forum would not lose any value if folks were a bit more tolerant of other opinions.
The times i've been most offended--seem to be the times when i post the stuff i'm not proud of.
Jute makes a good point (as usual). There are players and posters--and more than a few folks who do both. There's room at the table, so to speak, for everyone.
my 2 adena :)
Since earlier posts had examples...i can't resist. L2 isn't like a transmission guide for car repair where every piece must fit in one place in order. It's not even a jigsaw puzzle. The architecture is open enough that there are a lot of potentially right answers....i think that causes some of the criticisms too.
I like the official forums just for the fact that I can give an honest opinion on any subject I like. Without seeing 4 pages of RL flames and insults. I don't see endless we pwnd you threads or endless your clan/alliance cheats/ebays/walker/hacks threads.
90% of the people on here give constructive criticism. If not the flames are held to a minimum and held to in game discussion.
I have been playing for a years and a half. I dont know everything about this game. Actually I know little about this game that doesn't involved what I have learned playing the toons I have. I will take advice from someone on these forums. But would never take advice from anyone on those other servers I just dont trust any of them after seeing what kind of inteligence is being spewed over there.
Well said, one more thing though. Post count <> quality knowledge. By hanging here low these many moons, I can almost tell just by the names, the quality of the post. I include flames, ignorance, and rudeness in there too. While I many not always be as nice in type form as I wish to be, some of the rude comments that have been posted to these boards list last month are awful. Granted, sometimes you want to say RTFM, but I now I read, search, google, and ask in game a lot and still need someone here to help with my research. The answers are not always where you expect them to be and at times, some of the posted content has errors.
Bottom line, 90% of the time, there is no reason in the world to 'dis someone here. We are all part of making this game fun.
There is one problem in this. When you constantly have your accounts banned, topics locked, deleted, and ignored, you tend to get really upset and harsh words get said.
I for one come to the Offical L2 boards maybe once every few months, most people complain about the poor layout, but I find it easy to use. I just prefer using another forum (l2blah) because their you do not have to suck up to moderators, you do not have to worry about your post getting deleted if you have a problem with the site or one of the moderators or even the game itself. True you get alot of flames, but you would get information off that site faster than you would here.
I for one come to the Offical L2 boards maybe once every few months, most people complain about the poor layout, but I find it easy to use. I just prefer using another forum (l2blah) because their you do not have to suck up to moderators, you do not have to worry about your post getting deleted if you have a problem with the site or one of the moderators or even the game itself. True you get alot of flames, but you would get information off that site faster than you would here.
You don't have to suck up to moderator here either. I hate them like mosquitos, they are just annoying.
This is the "adults" table at the party. Blah is the kids table.
Exactly what DM said... See DM even you can be serious ;)
The real problem is this :
There is one problem in this. When you constantly have your accounts banned, topics locked, deleted, and ignored, you tend to get really upset and harsh words get said.
It takes someone with a real attitude problem to get all his topics locked and accounts banned...
It's kinda stupid to fall for that.
Well said, one more thing though. Post count <> quality knowledge. By hanging here low these many moons, I can almost tell just by the names, the quality of the post. I include flames, ignorance, and rudeness in there too. While I many not always be as nice in type form as I wish to be, some of the rude comments that have been posted to these boards list last month are awful. Granted, sometimes you want to say RTFM, but I now I read, search, google, and ask in game a lot and still need someone here to help with my research. The answers are not always where you expect them to be and at times, some of the posted content has errors.
Bottom line, 90% of the time, there is no reason in the world to 'dis someone here. We are all part of making this game fun.
There is one problem in this. When you constantly have your accounts banned, topics locked, deleted, and ignored, you tend to get really upset and harsh words get said.
I for one come to the Offical L2 boards maybe once every few months, most people complain about the poor layout, but I find it easy to use. I just prefer using another forum (l2blah) because their you do not have to suck up to moderators, you do not have to worry about your post getting deleted if you have a problem with the site or one of the moderators or even the game itself. True you get alot of flames, but you would get information off that site faster than you would here.
i agree with tika :)
Hey guys i have 6k posts on official forums!!!! All i do is talk to myself and report threads to the moderators!!!!
I concur.
This blah vs official forum business is ridiculous. Not to mention the idea of someone being more knowledgable because they have a 78/78/78 toon.
Hey guys i have 6k posts on official forums!!!! All i do is talk to myself and report threads to the moderators!!!!
Your complaints about threads getting deleted is akin to that of the level 20 who keeps complaining about getting PKed when he levels in windmill hill: No, getting your threads deleted and locked is not cool, and neither is getting PKed. But there are some basic steps you should take yourself, such as not repeatedly posting the same thing (in effect, only a single thread was deleted), and maybe not posting something that is so blatantly unconstructive in the first place.
Of course, I do have to agree that getting ignore sucks - but the best you can do about that is pack up and take your money elsewhere. I don't know why they're not acting, but I will assume that there is a reason for it that is not the personal all-consuming malvolence of some staffer, so they don't deserve being flamed and insulted.
I had my second lock ever in that context, and seeing the route people were trying to take that thread, I would assume it semi-justified - and I'm fairly certain it would have remained open if it was not posted in the middle of Savage's wave.
I like - and frequent - blah. I won't have the opportunity to flame a farmer in person over here, and I won't get to meet people from my server in the same way. I also won't get up to date information on Korean news (which is another topic, NCSoft...!)
I spend a lot of time at computers where I can not play Lineage 2, and so forums have become a natural extension of the game (they first started becoming important to me while I was sellshopping things despite being there). I read a lot, I talk to people a lot, and of course I experiment a lot myself. I believe to have myself solid knowledge of the lower end of the game (60 and below) as well as the market and the problems with it, as well as a fair clue about the high end (although that doesn't stem from personal experience).
In short: The forums are a game of their own. High post counts mean nothing (and I've not written a single post only to +1, although I will gladly admit that I'm abusing the forums to keep myself writing), neither does a high level. Yes, I've tought someone well above me in levels how to manor, and someone way below too (although I've stopped that now, too much competition xD), and yes I often get tips from newbs that I wasn't aware of.
It's not the ppl who post here, because they are players just like anyone else. The main reason why a lot of ppl do not post here is that ppl can not address the real problems in the game on these forums because it is easier to delete those posts than to solve the problems.
As stated by several moderators your in-game account can be banned because of what you do on this forum. Ultimately that is the last resort against any criticism ppl might have on the in-game policies.
People generally only get in trouble here for personal insults, for explaining exploits in detail and so on and so forth. It's a matter of how you say thing. People who think that "free speech" is an excuse to be an *** and then snap up when they are faced with the consequences of their own actions irritate me.
You are allowed to say pretty much anything within reasonable bounds (and yes, this includes discussion of the farmer and botter problems, which were often held away from the official thread before someone decided to have a hissyfit and force the mods put their foot down), you're just not allowed to say it HOWever you want.
Let me point again to LC666. If you were not allowed to say bad things about NCSoft, I'm sure he would not be here any longer. xD
I have been a moderator on another community site (http://www.l2rpa.org) for a while now, and it is not an easy job. Pruning some threads, letting others go, and knowing where to draw the line.
Here, it has been stated plenty of times what you can and cannot talk about. Politics, religion, sex... all of these are taboo. And coming in and ranting about problems is more than likely going to push a moderator (or, heaven forbid, an administrator) to just lock it up.
I commend the admins and mods here. It is not an easy job, theirs. I cannot say I envy them.
The point I'm trying to make is that the moderators, just like the posters, are human. They have rules to play by, and they make mistakes. Don't break the rules, you won't be disciplined. < 600 post count, < 60 levels on my main.
Community is community. You get from it what you put into it.
(I apologize for rambling. This has been a long time coming, I think)
A) a quick burst of critical debate only to be banished to the never regions of the board abyss.
B) or will it somehow mysteriously manage lurk in the spot light gaining prolonged and undeserved attention until it smells.
If it's B) I am sure we will all be able to quietly farm good amounts of post counts from it if we wish. Board farmers 4tw
People have the ability easily to get threads locked if they like.
My point was basically that if we fight each other off the Lineage II battlefield in the forums, we are much less likely to accomplish the common goal of improving the game.
I agree no link between level, knoledge or post count at all.
I sift through here semi daily and enjoy the change of pace every now and then. But to be honest annoying spams with useless info are just as bad as rl insults to me (its still crap I don't care about that im forced to sift through to get to decent posts).