Ok, ill give you guys a quick run down of my problem here.
I need 1'548 Crafted Leather. I have two options, manor or spoil.
For the last 4 days i have been in NoS seeding mobs constantly. I use roughly 100 seeds in 30 mins seeding 2 rooms on a constant basis. This is my result:
Fruit ratio = 4.5 fruit per mob on average ( sometimes 6 or 7 fruit, but average out at 4.5 per mob )
4'050 x 4.5 = 18'225 fruit.
18'225 fruit = 336 Crafted Leather.
At this rate its going to take me 23 days to accumlate my 1'548 crafted leather.
My other option is to spoil the Animal Skin which works out to be 37'152 animal skin, then at the rate my wifes lvl 59 SE regens her mana will take me another 5-6 hours to turn that Animal Skin into Leather, i then have to turn that Leather into Crafted Leather. :eek:, yes as you can see, crazy.....
My question is this, would spoiling be any faster, i really havent gone about spoiling it because the Ascetics Necropolis is seriously over run with bots on Kain and if you try to train a room clean, they train you back or just go red and kill you.
Can i manor Animal Skin? No, no manor on the entire Kain server rewards Animal Skin or i wouldnt be here having this conversation with you.
Can i go and spoil the 37'152 Animal Skin? Sure, lol, but it will then take me 2 months to get 1'548 Crafted Leather. Not to mention all the other components i still need for my A grade gear.
Surely there has to be a easier way to get Crafted Leather, this is just madness and i really dont think i can do 23 days seeding lvl 25 mobs...... :(
Well, although it may seem madness, the game is designed to have you depend on others in your clan. So the reason it's so difficult to gain this many mats is because you are not supposed to do it alone.
Well, although it may seem madness, the game is designed to have you depend on others in your clan. So the reason it's so difficult to gain this many mats is because you are not supposed to do it alone.
While i understand what you are saying here, i should of put some more Numbers up there for you.
Blue Coda = Crafted Leather
Gludio - Buys back 4500 at 100. Seed price 20 adena each.
Dion - Buys back 4666 at 110. Seed price 15 adena each.
These are the only 2 towns on Kain that buy back Blue Coda for Crafted Leather, the next time i can manor Crafted Leather is around 63:
Blue Coba = Crafted Leather
Aden - Buys back 598 at 1250. Seed price 400 adena each.
Goddard - Buys back 800 at 1250. Seed price 400 adena each.
As you can see, its more efficient to roll a new toon, lvl him to 20, stick a high lvl main or a few high lvl alts in the group with him to absorb most of the xp so he doesnt level like a freak, and do the lvl 20 seeds rather then get reamed doing the Aden and Goddard seeds, seeing the buy back prices are much much higher then Gludio and Dion, meaning id have to buy more seeds and sell back more fruit, making it more beneficial for the people who own the higher castles seeing the Blacksmiths require ALOT more fruit turn over to purchase those items.
Hope that clears a bit up, but my point here being, it doesnt matter in this particualr case if i had clannies were helping me or not, because i alone sell out 2 castle towns, Gludio and DIon in one days worth of seeding, so the only real way clannie could help me would be from spoiling it, which on a 6 hour based spoil day, constant basis, would probaly generate, maybe what? 20 - 40 Crafted Leather? If your lucky and dont get trained, PK'ed or War tags find you?
Maybe my answer is kind a "off-topic" but I would say drop the manor and spoil idea and go play the marked.
YES I know you have proberly heard this before but it's by far the quickest way to get adena... which you then can buy CL for.
I don't know about the marked on Kain, but I can easily get a nice profit in a week or so.
I think you need like 20.000.000a to buy that amount of CL, if you buy it for 13.000a each.
If you have 50-60.000.000a and you play the marked wisely, then you should easily get a profit of 20.000.000a within 1-2 weeks.
What ever you decide to do, good luck on collecting the CL :)
so... whatcha need all that cl for?
at higher lvls you can get seeds that sell for like 2k (on gustin at least) those guys require somewhat less fruit to get what you need :P
70+ seeds i think. cant remeber exactly but i remember doing em once
Wow, thats ALOT of crafted leather..... the most Ive even used in 1 shot is 480 >< and no I did not buy it.
The way I have aquired the CL is pretty much exactly what you have been doing. However, to speed things up a bit when two people are there, a low level toon does all the seeding and I bring along my lvl 60+ toon to do the buffing and to speed up the killing. Works like a charm, the poor guy barely has time to seed/harvest at the rate Im killing.
You mentioned at the rate your going its going to take you 23 days.... have you ever considered the amout of CL your looking for is insane???? Your not supposed to be able to get that much in a short period of time.....
As for crafting it its not just Animal skin you need.... you also need lots of other mats and that can be expensive too.
Crafted leather (1)
I have sometimes resorted to crafting CL from scratch.... however, the only reason I have done so is because I was sitting on a stash of 10k+ of animal skin, coal and cord that was ammased during hours and hours of seeding and pooled together by the members of my clan. However, if your not in the same sittuation, I would not recommend crafting it if you want to save money.
IMO you should stick with what your doing. Seed in NOS with a low level toon. If you want to speed up the process get help from a high level and get him to plow through the mobs.
Do keep in mind that although it seems long you are asking for alot of CL.
Yeah i fully understand i am asking for alot of Crafted Leather here and here is my reason why im asking so much.
I need to basically make 3 sets of A grade armor, 1 Maj Robe, 1 DC Light and 1 NM Heavy.
Now considering that all these recipes will be 60% chances, im farming enough mats to take a shot at each peice 2 times in the event the first attempt fails. If both fail, well im up [censored] creek and ill have to farm those mats all over again, but if both succed both times, then ill be able to sell the 2nd peices i succesfully make to just simply buy back any mats ill lose during the first two attempts.
I suppose i shouldnt be complaining just about the Crafted Leather sell back prices, i should also be complaining that no manor on Kain server rewards Animal Skin, and i sometimes feel this is the reason why, because Animal Skin is Reward 1, realistically you wouldnt need to buy 19'000 seeds to get a return of 1'548 Crafted Leather because lets say for example, 2'000 fruit IF it rewarded Animal Skin might yeild 3500 Animal Skin.
Now as you already know yourself, seeding and harvesting in Cats / Necros is probaly the most effcient and economical way to use your seeds for money spent vs reward gained, but then they would lose all that fruit that they stock pile from people like us harvesting Crafted Leather.
Now granted, yes, when you look at it all like this, im realistically getting 1 Crafted Leather for roughly 150 adena, yes very nice turn over, i know, but very time consuming.
One last thing that eats me up about all this is, like i suggested earlier, there is no reason for so many Manors to be rewarding the same type for every city ie: Red Codran on Kain ALWAYS rewards Asofe, Blue Coda ALWAYS rewards Crafted Leather. Now on Kain, every single day i watch that Manor tick over, Gludio and Dion have at least 20'000 to 25'000+ wor6th of seed that never gets brought for the simple fact, its is spoiled in mass at higher levels or drops like crazy.
Take Gludio for example on Kain, every day, this is no exageration ethier, every day, Dark Coda sells 9'000 and buys back 9'000, never have i seen anyone buy them, total waste of seeds when they could just as easily set up Blue Coda to reward Animal Skin and Alternative Blue Coda to reward Crafted Leather, by doing so your still going to have to purchase alot of seeds to generate alot of fruit and in turn, the manor is still benefiting from it while giving players another option.
Simple fix if they dont want to populate the server to much to force the price of Crafted Leather down is simple, dont buy back so much Blue Coda to reward Animal Skin, simple, OR lower the amount ot rewards from lets say for example 4 per fruit down to 2 per fruit.
At the end of the day yeah i know, this is what i want to cover my *** when i hit the big COMBINE button, but hey, im still enjoying myself non the less, would be better if we had intelligent castle lords though.... :(
Manor cord and possibly coal (ideally manor cord where coal spoils), buy the rest. Get excess cord, coal or both to sell if you can not afford buying the skin.
If you want a specific suggestion, please list the level of the manor capable toons (basically all melee types) available to you.
animal skin is cheappppp. It is around 100-120a each on bartz. Six of these equal one leather and you can figure out the rest. I bought about 35k of animal skin one day because I was sick of running out of leather. That is going to take you a lonngg time to craft lol. Anyway, it is only one million per 10,000 a skin which is probably going to be reasonable.
Now as you already know yourself, seeding and harvesting in Cats / Necros is probaly the most effcient and economical way to use your seeds for money spent vs reward gained, but then they would lose all that fruit that they stock pile from people like us harvesting Crafted Leather.
Yeah from my experience, it is the way to go. When you can get 7-10 crops back for 1 seed it deffinatly better than getting 2:1 youd get on 1X hp mobs.
Thoug Im still confused about that last part... whos "they" and who will loose all the seeds theyve stockpiled ? Cause the manor doesnt stockpile them, they can sell whatever amount they want to sell everyday (up to a set max). the only person that can stockpile seeds is people like you and me.... and if I stockpile them its to be seeded/havested in the near future.
Now granted, yes, when you look at it all like this, im realistically getting 1 Crafted Leather for roughly 150 adena,
1 CL = 150 adena + time.
The game is time consuming (look at the grind 70+ ><)
Your gettign CL for dirt cheap. If your also doing what im doing and not using SS and using a dorf to spoil while your at it your making lots of profit just farming.
The question you have to ask yourself is: could you amass 20 mil (or amount youd have to pay to buy CL form a sell shop) in the amount of time you will spend seeding? Could you lets say play the market and gain 20 mil in less time?.
At the end of the day yeah i know, this is what i want to cover my *** when i hit the big COMBINE button, but hey, im still enjoying myself non the less, would be better if we had intelligent castle lords though....
So so soooooooo true.
/signed
But however, there might be a reason why the manors always set it to the same reward.... i wont try to understand it but someone mentioned to me it had to do with what the castle lord gets out of teh crops you give him.... I think >< Maby they are just dumb ><
I wonder if sending a pm to the castle lord and telling him "Hey, of powerfull ruler of Dion... No one is buying back XX seeds at Type 1/2! Change the type and give me a decent price and I have xxx crops to pass!"
Thoug Im still confused about that last part... whos "they" and who will loose all the seeds theyve stockpiled ? Cause the manor doesnt stockpile them, they can sell whatever amount they want to sell everyday (up to a set max). the only person that can stockpile seeds is people like you and me.... and if I stockpile them its to be seeded/havested in the near future.
Sorry what i meant here was, you will buy less seeds IF the reward was Animal Skin because you will generate 35'000 animal skin faster and with less fruit then what it would take to generate 1'500 Crafted Leather, see you hand in 1 Fruit for reward 1 and get anywhere upto 5 base mats for reward, i think its 5 max, i cant remeber now, but reward 2 is different, its like 10 - 50 fruit for reward 2 and get 1 final sub component in return, so obviously its going to take more seeds to get you Crafted Leather which in turn equals more fruit which equals good for castle manor.
Now granted, yes, when you look at it all like this, im realistically getting 1 Crafted Leather for roughly 150 adena,
1 CL = 150 adena + time.
The game is time consuming (look at the grind 70+ ><)
Your gettign CL for dirt cheap. If your also doing what im doing and not using SS and using a dorf to spoil while your at it your making lots of profit just farming.
The question you have to ask yourself is: could you amass 20 mil (or amount youd have to pay to buy CL form a sell shop) in the amount of time you will spend seeding? Could you lets say play the market and gain 20 mil in less time?.
Yes thats exactaly what i do, hehehe, you read me like a book.
At the end of the day yeah i know, this is what i want to cover my *** when i hit the big COMBINE button, but hey, im still enjoying myself non the less, would be better if we had intelligent castle lords though....
So so soooooooo true.
/signed
But however, there might be a reason why the manors always set it to the same reward.... i wont try to understand it but someone mentioned to me it had to do with what the castle lord gets out of teh crops you give him.... I think >< Maby they are just dumb ><
I wonder if sending a pm to the castle lord and telling him "Hey, of powerfull ruler of Dion... No one is buying back XX seeds at Type 1/2! Change the type and give me a decent price and I have xxx crops to pass!"
Yeah i think most are just dumb or too lazy to see what crops are selling and what arent. I know alot of castles that havent changed their Seed selection for months.......they set it and forget it.
One more thing really quick Shrimpstoo, it wouldnt really matter what reward they reward you with, cause the fruit is all the same, Blue coda is Blue coda regurdless of what it rewards.
One more thing really quick Shrimpstoo, it wouldnt really matter what reward they reward you with, cause the fruit is all the same, Blue coda is Blue coda regurdless of what it rewards.
Thanks,
Guess Ill try pming the castle lords and requesting they change it to another type....
I have thousands of crops to turn in but I want to other type... and since they are not buying back any crops at the type/price they have set... maby it will work :)
I declare it the official "Harass the castle Lords till they change the buy back type" week! Whos withe me!?
Ah -_-, on second though.... Id have to pm people I really dont like >< great........ The current castle lords apparently dont give a **** if their clan members "accidently pk/train" people from other clans... But thats another storry worthy of the Hind server forums !!!!
I suggest buying the base mats and crafting CL at your leisure. Animal skin was selling for less than 200a on Devianne.
What I don't understand is how is it possible to have the steadfast determination to craft 6 complete A grade sets and yet not factor in the amount of time and patience that you'll need to accomplish that goal. Give yourself a break.
What I don't understand is how is it possible to have the steadfast determination to craft 6 complete A grade sets and yet not factor in the amount of time and patience that you'll need to accomplish that goal. Give yourself a break.
I want to craft 3 sets, not six, gotta remeber, just because i am technically gathering enough mats to craft 6 sets, being 60% recipes and having to craft so many peices, my chances to fail are going to be quite high.
It sounds like everyone here has some good ideas that will help you out. I read through most of them fast and see that they are very helpfull for you.
But let me take a min of your time and go through how I do my lil crafting projects. Like you I usually craft 3+ of the same item so it takes a while to get everything together.
Before I even start I make a list of everything that I will need and spend some time looking over the market and the manor system. Will take the A grade armor as an example.
Last time I did 3 sets of Tallim robes and DC light:
To get the rec for the main part you have to spend some time in GC working the first quest. At the same time I was using Aden seed for CL. By the time I got the rec. I had more than enough CL.
Another way to look at the manor is say you need A. Bone for example. On my server everyone and there mother does thoes seed and trys to turn them in. So the odds of getting your fruit turned in are slim. I look for another seed that has a good time vs. money turn around. I will look for a seed that I know on most every night I can turn in around 75% of my fruit. Sell the mats and then setup a buy shop for a lil less than what ppl are selling the mat I need for.
Doing all this does take time and alot of effort on your part. But if your like me, you get a good feeling after you get everything together and craft the stuff you need. It's like a small high (kind of like hitting that lvl 52 or lvl 61 on your first toon. :D
This is just my 2 cents....good luck on your crafts :)
Gludio - Buys back 4500 at 100. Seed price 20 adena each.
Dion - Buys back 4666 at 110. Seed price 15 adena each.
These are the only 2 towns on Kain that buy back Blue Coda for Crafted Leather, the next time i can manor Crafted Leather is around 63:
Blue Coba = Crafted Leather
Aden - Buys back 598 at 1250. Seed price 400 adena each.
Goddard - Buys back 800 at 1250. Seed price 400 adena each.
As you can see, its more efficient to roll a new toon, lvl him to 20, stick a high lvl main or a few high lvl alts in the group with him to absorb most of the xp so he doesnt level like a freak, and do the lvl 20 seeds rather then get reamed doing the Aden and Goddard seeds, seeing the buy back prices are much much higher then Gludio and Dion, meaning id have to buy more seeds and sell back more fruit, making it more beneficial for the people who own the higher castles seeing the Blacksmiths require ALOT more fruit turn over to purchase those items.
higher buyback price actually means that you need to buy less fruit to get:
[buyback price/material base price]=# of mats per seed
seeds needed to produce 1 CL at the above rates:
gludio: 57 seeds 1148a/CL
dion: 51.8 seeds 777a/CL (must turn in 259 seeds at once to get this price)
aden/goddard:4.56 seeds 1824a/CL (must turn in 114 seeds at once to get this price)
If a fration results from the number of seeds turned in, the material reward is rounded off. To minimize wasted seeds, try to turn in enough at once to result in a reward that is a whole number.
higher buyback price actually means that you need to buy less fruit to get:
[buyback price/material base price]=# of mats per seed
seeds needed to produce 1 CL at the above rates:
gludio: 57 seeds 1148a/CL
dion: 51.8 seeds 777a/CL (must turn in 259 seeds at once to get this price)
aden/goddard:4.56 seeds 1824a/CL (must turn in 114 seeds at once to get this price)
If a fration results from the number of seeds turned in, the material reward is rounded off. To minimize wasted seeds, try to turn in enough at once to result in a reward that is a whole number.
Where do you get Materials Base price? Because if you are refering to the materials base price on the Manor Manager in the Basic Seed information section, then the Base price for Crafted Leather produced from Blue Coda is 100, and the base price for Crafted Leather produced by Blue Coba is 1250.
So using your calculation:
Blue Coda
[100/100] = 1 mat per fruit.
Blue Coba
[1250/1250] = 1 mat per fruit.
Now obviously, this isnt how it works, and im often wondering, as i have been told about the formulation that works when calculating how many mats you will get from how many fruit you hand in is based of base material prices, but where exactaly do you see these base material prices?
You have confused me on one part though, where you say 57 seeds 1148/CL, i think you mean Fruit, because yes you are correct, i had worked it out to be roughly 55 fruit per CL.
One last thing, cant the Castle Lord change the amount that is rewarded from the fruit that is handed in? So it doesnt really matter about maths in this case because they can change it when ever they want, but what we are seeing here is the ratio the Castle Lord has set at the current time, subject to change at will when he choses of course.
try to sell item to then npc, then double their offer, that's the item's base price. castle reward*number of crops / base price is what you get. and i have no idea on how they round it up.
try to sell item to then npc, then double their offer, that's the item's base price. castle reward*number of crops / base price is what you get. and i have no idea on how they round it up.
try to sell item to then npc, then double their offer, that's the item's base price. castle reward*number of crops / base price is what you get. and i have no idea on how they round it up.
my (limited) experience is that they round it to the nearest full material (yes, even in players favor sometimes)
My test sample was fairly limited, but i handed in like 90 seeds and got 30 back of something, then i handed in 89 and got 30 again, 91 also gave me 30
I don't think they ever round up. I have noticed that the manor manager just gives you as many mats as you fully paid for and keeps the change (bastard should give me those few extra fruit back).
If this wasn't the case you could always hand in just under the amount needed for one mat and get mats for a fruit or two less, ripping off the castle lord.
In your example 89 fruit was enough to get 30 mats but 91 was not enough to get 31 (between ~2.936 and 2.967 fruit per mat).