Effect of Clarity - I would like some numbers

Hi

I read somewhre that Clarity was supposed to decrease the MP usage of skills by 4%, 8% and 12% on the levels 1, 2 and 3 respectively. I have the level 3 so that should give me 12% MP reduction. My recharge costs 137MP to cast so that would mean that I should save 12% which is 16 MP. But I have tested it and I only save 10 MP. That is only 7.2% reduction. Can that really be true?

Also I have noticed that a Major heal that costs 80 MP to cast cost 73 MP to cast with clarity. That is 8.75% reduction.

So my questions are. Can it be true that clarity doesn't give more reduction in the MP usage? And is the reduction different from skill to skill?

Maybe Clarity hits only the second part of MP consumption of skills? That would be smaller.

lol if it only hits the first though...

at lvl 74 clearity has a 15% reduce(effects taken from hellrose X lated notes)

your suffering from MP regen, cause you can't sit and buff you have to stand...while standing your mp regen is about half. (or 8 mp per tick)

apply clearity to a EE/SE thats 76+ with a ++ cost to recharge.. and that mp useage will fall to the point that you can self recharge your mp.

The skill is 4%, 7%, 10% and no where more then this.

Secondly you haw a lot more then 8 MP regen standing, running on otherh and drops your MP regen way to the bottom.

I pull out the numbers of what the difference is in regen if needed but between siting and standing it's not that big difference.

I use the recharge on myself between 2 ticks of MP regen so it has nothing to do with me getting less MP from standing instead of stitting. I plain get only 10 MP per recharge of my self regardless of the regen.

7.2% from a recharge thats all I get with clarity. To me it sounds weird.

Anyone else has something to say?

Could you give the Initial and Final consumptions for Recharge? I don't know where to check them, and I honestly think this is where you will find the answer.

I was grouped with an EE friend of mine. He was describing to me that Clarity seems to reduce the spellcasting by a set number as apposed to a %.

He was able to recharge himself with a gain, and that was at level 1.

I know some elders that swear by this, recharging themselves with clarity. They claim that they get like 70+ mp from recharging themselves w/ clarity 3 (and no POW). I often find that they aren't starting their count at the right place. They start after the pre-cast mp is spent, therefore not taking that into account. The best way to count is to cast right after a tick, starting at what you were at that tick and then seeing what you end up after you cast the spell. You have to be quick though because you will tick again right after you cast. Doing this, I find that with Clarity 3 I get about 10-11 mp per recharge.

The thing I wonder (and I just haven't tested it yet) is how much difference is there between mp regen standing and sitting? Sitting is better than standing so I wonder if it's really worth it to stand there recharging yourself over and over, like I've seen some people do. If you get, say, 5 mp more sitting than standing, then you're really only recharging yourself at 5 mp faster than you would get sitting. Even at the full 10 mp you get over just standing, you have to cast 10 times just to give yourself 100 mp.

I just have this feeling that a bunch of EEs are standing there looking like fools recharging themselves 20 times in a row for nothing, LOL. Now get POW, Renewal and Clarity 3 and THEN you can recharge yourself! :cool:

Yea, Clarity 1 is between 8-10 mp back. Sitting and recharging yourself long enough to figure that out is the most boring thing I've ever done in my life.

At least if I'm sitting to regen mana I can go take a break

That's why you jam a penny in your recharge hotkey.

so at what lvl EE can you start recharging yourself for more mp/time than sitting would have produced ?

That depends on your cast speed, and of course on external buffs. It seems unlikely pre-75.

You would proberbly have to wait till you recieve Clarity 3, even then it would only put a max of 2 mins ahead of resting while sitting, not worth using it on yourself unless you spam MoH soloing i guess.

That's why you jam a penny in your recharge hotkey.

OMG! 3rd party haxxx!!!!

Yup, its exactly the same mistake alot of SH's do, they count the amount of mana they get from BtM wrong and then goes on about how great it is...its great because while you're casting it, you stand still and with Clear Mind, you'll regenerate mana while casting, making it seem like you recieve alot more than you actually do.

Too bad we've been using this since before we had clear mind.... and that necromancers take advantage of b2m just the same... even though they DONT have clear mind. So yeah... if anyone is making a mistake here... it's not us.

Doesn't change what I said one iota, its the same deal without clear mind, B2M takes a while to cast and that time standing still you regenerate mana as well.

Well, you get a message now of how much it restores (I think, I don't think I got any screens of the log of Amoni using BtM unfortunately).

BtM is definitely overrated though in people saying "I have no downtime" when they keep standing around BtMing.

I don't know any other class that can fill their MP as fast as a summoner, and that's good business. ;)

Ugh.. my b2m casts very fast. Fast enough that I can cast it between the first and second nuke... killing a mob before it reaches me.

If you think it's overrated Maline... play a nuker that doesn't have it and tell me the +55 mana per casting comes close to standing idle. I never counted how many times I cast it within a given buff round... but +3000 mana per buff round does make the diffrence.

I'm not saying it's not good, or that it doesn't mean a significant elevation over SpS or Sorcs in the PvE department.

I'm saying it doesn't compare to popping a summon and having it charge up your MP to full in a few casts - if I actually had higher mana gain like I should (I have not got a single clue why, pre-C5, now it makes sense, it was given to nukers over summoners, and now still not why summoners don't have it also), I think I could use a conversion weapon and still get filled up by one servitor.

Why are you even comparing a nuker to a summoner....

...

Nevermind. I think we should get back on topic ( before the mods delete more of my posts ).

Because that's what I was talking about in the context of saying "BtM is overrated as a 'no downtime tool'."

Evne I have downtime, and I'm saying that it makes me snorfle every time BtM nukers claim that they don't have any, because the time they spend BtMing is most definitely greater than the time I spend getting recharged.

Maybe... but I'm positive we get a better exp ratio from the time it takes to B2M then summoners do with their recharge. Not to mention that nifty +25% exp bonus from overhit~

I would stop whining if I could actually exp faster. :D

With level 2 Clarity, and level 28 recharge (I think), I gain 7mp from recharging myself (I can cast between ticks, so it's easy to see). This turns out to be about 6.1%, I haven't really tested whether it's faster to recharge myself, or to sit and regen, but it does seem faster if I am buffed.

Unbuffed it certainly doesn't seem worth it. The only time I believe it's worth doing (when unbuffed)is if your group is out in the field running quite a distance between mobs. You don't really get much time to sit in those cases.

I'll have to check how much mp I save on other spells, just to see if the percentage varies.

What are the initial and final costs on your recharge?

Of course its useful, duh, I have more than one SH myself.

Alot of people just overrate how much it gives and also from another perspective think B2M+Greater Heal is a better use of SE MP than Recharge.

I'm actually not sure what's more MP efficient. Having the numbers would be interesting.

Although for time purposes, recharges seem vastly superior.

Ok I've done some tests and here are the results and a summary.

Greater Heal

Normal Cost: 104mp (21 Initial, 83 End)
Cost with Clarity: 98mp (21 Initial, 77 End)
% Saved: 5.77%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 7.22%

With one more mp saved:

% Saved: 6.73%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 8.43%

Battle Heal

Normal Cost: 78mp (16 Initial, 61 End)
Cost with Clarity: 74mp (16 Initial, 57 End)
% Saved: 5.13%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 6.56%

With one more mp saved:

% Saved: 6.41%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 8.20%

Might

Normal Cost: 35mp (7 Initial, 28 End)
Cost with Clarity: 33mp (7 Initial, 26 End)
% Saved: 5.71%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 7.11%

With one more mp saved:

% Saved: 8.57%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 10.71%

Recharge

Normal Cost: 130 (26 Initial, 104 End)
Cost With Clarity: 122 (26 Initial, 96 End)
% Saved: 6.2%
% Of Final Portion Saved: 7.69%

With one more mp saved:

% Saved: 6.92%
% On Final Portion Saved: 8.65%


Summary

So yes, it seems there is only an mp saving on the final cost of the spell, not in the initial one.

The variation in % saved is because saving one more mp would take the % saved over the limit. This limit is applied to the 2nd half of the spell cost, not the full cost of the spell.

For Clarity level 2, it seems to save 8% at max, and every spell will save as close to 8% mp (on the 2nd half only!) as it can before going over this limit.

Uh I hope that makes sense, if anyone sees any mistakes feel free to point them out :).

Edit:

Oh and when I say half, I don't really mean half. The initial casting cost of each spell is around 20% of the total.

So yes, it seems there is only an mp saving on the final cost of the spell, not in the initial one.

I feel smart now. <ego swells> :D

Thanks for the tests. It would be cool if clarity worked on the whole spell. :/

I'm actually not sure what's more MP efficient. Having the numbers would be interesting.

Although for time purposes, recharges seem vastly superior.

This is an age old question that's been answered many times. Trust me... b2m + heal is much more efficient.

If it wasn't for empower... I would have been using an EE instead of an SE... because I love EE's defensive buffs, heal, Rez ability, and cast speed. Those things > empower.... but I can't hunt without empower so SE it was =(

Efficient...because it take 4 times as long to get back the same mp. You have to factor in that your SE can plop back down and hunting resumes.

Well, the question is also if MP dips at all - there's no reason to hunt on heals/B2M if it keeps the recharge's MP full - just like SpS like to burn through all their MP ASAP to have downtime instead of spending their dipped time actually looking for the perfect target.

Efficient...because it take 4 times as long to get back the same mp. You have to factor in that your SE can plop back down and hunting resumes.

That's not a problem. Wasting a healer/ buffer's mp when you can be saving it... that's a problem. The only time recharging would be a better choice is for duoing. Otherwise... conservation it is.

For duoing is recharge better. Do not count only mana given and MP gained from recharge or B2m, you have to also take a look at healer's MP. We used some calculations with my boyfriend, he is SH, and he found out that when I recharge him it is more mana effective, not to mention time effective.
I do not remember correct numbers now, I remember my heal was eating 98 MP then (now 100), restoring less than 700 HP. He was receiving 190 MP per my recharge, my recharge eats 119 MP. I do not remember B2M values - any hint from somebody with B2M 4? My calculations may be obsolete now, because of the HoT part of the spell, and I do not use bsps while healing b2m-ed mages.

Its not really saving the healers MP at all.

Well Im level 78 with +5 Recharge now. When I have acumen, zerk and POW i have 1207 casting speed. I get 17 MP per recharge on top of the regen so it is worth doing for sure.

I am also 78 Eva Saint with PoW clarity and using arcana Wisdom I get +70mp recharge So I recharge fast.