Ok I've been in game like 2 seconds and already picked up several greater pot of life or whatever it's called, restored nearly 700 hp. Greater mana pot, 117 mp.
... at this drop rate too, **** who needs healers even in a duo ><
No, these herbs didn't drop before the patch, I'm hunting in the same area I was before the patch too. I'm getting haste pots, speed pots, crit pots, acumen pots, up to 4 per mob
Make that herbs not pots, the icon just looks like a pot sometimes.
ummm yea they put herbs in places u didnt get them before but they are same ones for HP and MP u got before the patch they added the other herbs though.
Instant pots are craft or buy only they dont drop from mobs your confusing the two things hun.
ummm yea they put herbs in places u didnt get them before but they are same ones for HP and MP u got before the patch they added the other herbs though.
Instant pots are craft or buy only they dont drop from mobs your confusing the two things hun.
LOL they added a TON OF MORE.
Let me sumerise what they added:
-Empower 3
-Haste 2
Acumen lv.3
-Wind Walk 2
-Focus 3
-Mana Herb- 11%MP rocovery
-Strong Mana Herb 18%MP recovery
-Strongest Mana Herb Recovers all MP
-Life Herb 15%HP recovery
-Strong Life Herb 25%HP recovery
-Strongest Life Herb recovers full HP
Herb of Power & magic still excist does not stack with Might and empower thoght.
I got one of those that restores all of your mp. I thought it was a bug, and it was supposed to be one of the normal ones, but then I got a normal one.... This is pretty sweet, from a purely selfish point of view. But I can understand why SEs and EEs would be concerned.
Well I am pretty concerned, I have no buffs of note, you can already buy a better rez that mine at max level, and these herbs heal more than I can, again at max level. I know they aren't on demand but W T H.
Here is L2 (to me):
1) Social--requiring cooperation and interaction
2) Dedicated grinding/play
3) Complicated play interface
4) Player controlled economy
5) Open PvP with consequences.
6) Different classes/races that, BY DESIGN, can't all accomplish the same things.
Okay. The herbs that restore your mana to full are pretty rare. I got one since server came back up and no more, and I am currently resting for mana (which is why I am here).
I'm not sure whether to be happy about this or growl - but the mana pots seriously make me wonder if I should just chase the prophet after the BH, maybe she'll get enough MP for spoiling off them. :/
That's fantastic, I always have a place in one specific area in the game. At level 70 plus.
Well let's put it this way, pre patch I was duoing with my SE out of party, because she's 10 levels above my BH. She had to heal and recharge. Post patch, I didn't have to heal or recharge once not in 5+ buff rounds.
I solo anyway, these herbs dropping just make it so i don't need CH buffs to level. It's great in a way since now its possible to level fast without the need of a boxed buffer or a CH. Leveling is not so much a chore now as WoW. I keep hunting as fast as possible so i don't run out of the emp herb which allows me to 2shot the mobs.
But it's still better exp and still needed to hunt in dungeons for exp and especially for AA. These are solo areas they drop and it was a good addition I think since these are solo areas and shouldn't require support classes to make decent exp.
Ok I've been in game like 2 seconds and already picked up several greater pot of life or whatever it's called, restored nearly 700 hp. Greater mana pot, 117 mp.
... at this drop rate too, **** who needs healers even in a duo ><
Very nice that melees can solo now without a healer/buffer. About time, right?!
Now there is no reason to even play a healer. Low lvl would-be healers/buffers will have so much more incentive to try to continue playing now that no one needs them...
It was bad enough that greedy exp melee classes started buffbots, mildly negating the need for a live healer/buffer. Now, NC soft places the final nail in the coffin. A new player has no reason at all to start playing a healer/buffer class, not with these instant pots. It's sad when I meet a new player that has chosen to play a healer/buffer and asks me to help them level because they can't get a group because of an OOP buffer. I'm an SE, shouldn't a melee/DD class be helping them level??? Why can't a lvl 31 healer/buffer find a group?
So now, there is even less of a reason to start one, unless an experienced player just happens to want to play a healer. But that doesn't equal a new player, now does it.
Balance, that's what this game is about. Healers/Buffers can lvl easily and solo... and PVP, right... "Find a party!" "Level on mobs your own lvl!" Hmmm, healer/buffer can do both... oh darn, it's C5.5! No, they can't anymore!!! In many ways, they haven't been able to in awhile.
I was about to say - anything you can do without a box, you can do without a live. All this patch means is that I'll be duoing with myself into A Grade when dungeons become inevitable and I can actually offer some of these buff herbs buff on a permanent basis.
I don't mind.
But it blows for social people, it blows for healers who don't want to melee their way up - and making a class superfluous is certainly not the way to fix its low population.
Yes, like people said in this thread - the herbs are perfect for people who want to solo, it basically eliminates the need for a 2box. But by consequence it also eliminates the need for duoing with a healer/buffer. And since healers/buffers cannot really solo themselves that much, you have to wonder where NCSoft expects to suddenly get all the live healers/buffers from when the super-soloing nukers/daggers/archers/... hit high levels and need to go to some party place where the herbs do not drop. On the one hand they please the DDs who don't have to 2box and can exp whenever they want, but on the other hand the devs shoot themselves in the foot because they make whole classes unneeded in many areas of the game world. I do not really have problems because I am high level enough, but I'd guess that many lower level healers will only get pity groups or groups just for the social factor until they somehow get to high levels. And I don't think it's really fun if you feel that you are not really needed and that the DD you play with could play just as well without you and get more exp that way, too.
Ok I admit I've not read every post in this thread, I'm just throwing in my two penneth.
I'm not sure if I like all these herb pots or not. Out on my PK last night, more drops than I can count and most of them are timed so they don't overwrite each other, one starts, pick up another type of pot and that one waits until the first is gone before starting to be used.
I really can't decide if all this addtion has made L2 far to easy to play. I quite liked either taking out my buffer with me or going back to town periodically for buffs. Now you can run around forever without needing to do either. I think it's made the game too soft now but as I said ......
Oh I did read the post above me though ..... gogogo ProdaznayaShkura :)
No, these herbs didn't drop before the patch, I'm hunting in the same area I was before the patch too. I'm getting haste pots, speed pots, crit pots, acumen pots, up to 4 per mob
Make that herbs not pots, the icon just looks like a pot sometimes.
I'm getting the atack speed, critical and speed pots a lot too. Only problem is I'm a SH... And acumen/empower herbs aren't dropping that much, on VoS...
Where are these Herbs dropping btw? I noticed that all the herbs, mp and hp pots dont drop now at all in the area of WoA where we were xping. Any spot they are dropping where I can level my 61 WS good?
Where are these Herbs dropping btw? I noticed that all the herbs, mp and hp pots dont drop now at all in the area of WoA where we were xping. Any spot they are dropping where I can level my 61 WS good?
lol didnt know you were lvling a ws lickn, i take back what i said about you going the easy route
the herbs are meant to be for solo play so im not sure if they would drop in woa
best place for a ws that lvl is fod if you can avoid pvp
should note that the herbs overwrite their resprective buffs so if you have a se and a pro following you around you wont have any use for much except mp and hp herbs
whole thing is rediculous if you ask me, you guys have no idea what a necro or sh can do with those pots
It's supposed to be solo areas, like around IT they drop, Frozen lab they drop. I just can't believe the sheer amount of them that drop and the POWER.. it's unreal.
Healers can solo! All the way to S grade if you just think about what skills you have and the options you have for gearing. No, I won't give you all the answers but it can be done...and actully they can solo for longer the most classes. You have full buffs, powerful heals, and hold skills...use them.
Have you actually soloed a healer to 76? Even in my mid-high 60s it was long and boring soloing my EE(no downtime but so tedious), and expensive, I lost a lot of adena when doing so. Of course if you have +16 duals or something maybe it's better.
I do wish they'd do away with all except the most basic potions/scrolls etc including the herbs. Healers/buffers are quite limited in what they can really do (well), and I don't feel it's a good idea to add things to the game that can do their job just as well.
The herbs weren't so bad when they just slightly extended the uptime of classes. However from what I've read about the new herbs, they don't reduce downtime, they eliminate it.
Of course there will still be groups, but less duos for healers I guess.
Have you actually soloed a healer to 76? Even in my mid-high 60s it was long and boring soloing my EE(no downtime but so tedious), and expensive, I lost a lot of adena when doing so. Of course if you have +16 duals or something maybe it's better.
Tedious and boring is a matter of opinion...expenceive I will agree on but you did prove my point. You just stated that you were soloing in you mid-60's. Healers "can't solo" is BS...they can't solo as well as some other classes but they CAN solo. No I don't have +16 duels....and infact I think healers suck with duels. Get a dagger. if your an EE in light you have decent evasion and high base DEX for decent crits and attck speed, if your a Prop or a SE you have DW and Focus.
Edit additon : My EE has +4 DEX -4 CON and +5 WIT -5 MEN. The +4 Dex makes quite the differance. Oh and I forgot to add holy weapon buff to the list for EEs and Prophs
Yesterday I spent three buff rounds on my ~70ish~ caster. Pots dropped like mad. I hunted without a moment's rest for an hour and ended at full mana. Often the mana pots were wasted because I was already full.
I believe that there are too many mana pots. Why even have a mana bar if it won't be a constraint?
Too many mana pots, too easy a game --- L2 will lose its 'specialness' if it keeps getting easier and softer. We have our dedicated base of players because we are different.
True tedious and boring is an opinion. I don't know many people who would enjoy hitting the same mob 25-30 times and then healing once ;).
I soloed with BW Light and Keshanberk with focus, which did ok, but it was a lot slower than almost every other class would be. I've not tried a dagger, but I'd be worried about missing a little too much when using one (plus the extra cost of SS).
I'll agree that healers can solo. However, worse than most other classes, and these herbs help those other classes a lot more than they'd help most soloing healers.
I want Hurricane herbs, 2 minutes of being able to cast Hurricane ;). Then healers can DD like DDs can heal and buff themselves with the herbs.
and btw, get a decent clan and party together if you're healer class. LOT OF CLAN are lacking support class and always welcome and LF support class tbh. (at least mine is O,o)
lol didnt know you were lvling a ws lickn, i take back what i said about you going the easy route
I started my little WS like a year ago, lvl her a little here and there with +4 tsu*sls duals, BW Heavey, +5str and +4dex tatoos. She is not involved with Synergy so PvP issue shouldn't be a problem. I like to play her when I am at work. The internet connection is wireless here and really sucks but if I stack her with tons of HP and haste pots to kill green mobs. If I can find a nice spot where alot of these pots drop that would be nice. FoD? Forest of the Dead?
I think its way over the top these pots. I have to go kill other mobs for 15 secs for them to dissapear cause I don't want the hp/buff pots and mana pots rarely.
Hmm, I think this is pretty good overall, everyone can solo in open areas now, regardless of whether they have 2 buff slaves on autofollow, MP herbs is especially for the poor sleep-nerfed nukers.
Regarding healers getting groups, I dont think it will be a problem either in fact it may even help. Duoing with a buffer becomes easier due to Life-herbs, duoing with a healer becomes easier due to Buff-herb, etc.....
Great, maybe they boosted MoH to 900 range and it'll do more than like 1500 dmg to a dark blue mob.
MoH is short range, but you will find it does a LOT of damage.
So much that a 40 Elven elder can two-hit pink mobs...
A 6x Bishop can VERY easily solo in the FotD...
You might try using a weapon that isn't two or more grades too low for you.
Drop rate on the really good pots is not that high.
Having buffs when you NEED them instead of once in a while is a big deal.
Spellsingers are still completely dependant on SE or EE or they have 80%+ downtime. That's counting the new pots.
That being said... I'd love to see all priests (except the orcs)
get some serious buffs in the combat department.
I have always wondered why EE, SE, Bishop, and especially prophet did not have more melee-related skills.
(and c5's weaponry nerfs completely confuse me)
True tedious and boring is an opinion. I don't know many people who would enjoy hitting the same mob 25-30 times and then healing once ;).
I soloed with BW Light and Keshanberk with focus, which did ok, but it was a lot slower than almost every other class would be. I've not tried a dagger, but I'd be worried about missing a little too much when using one (plus the extra cost of SS).
I'll agree that healers can solo. However, worse than most other classes, and these herbs help those other classes a lot more than they'd help most soloing healers.
I want Hurricane herbs, 2 minutes of being able to cast Hurricane ;). Then healers can DD like DDs can heal and buff themselves with the herbs.
Try FotD.
You will find fields of 6x mobs which are all undead.
Yes,you will have to look around.
Behind Devastated castle is an area of all undead as well.
EE or Bishop solos better than a spellsinger on undead. by a decent margin. Your undead nukes are ALL bane damage and cast VERY quickly.
Yes, they are shorter range.. but you also have perma-windwalk2, and a bishop also has perma acumen2 and berz1.
Someone needs to sell their duals and get a mystic weapon.
(That isn't 2 grades below your level...)
I tried MoH leveling (ok with a +6 Ghoul Staff) around Dev Castle a quite a while back, and even with an SE I ran out of mp really fast. Might of Heaven does less damage per mp than an equal level nukers main nuke.
At 74, MoH for an EE costs 69mp (~64mp with Clarity3 I think) and has 87 power. Compared to Hyrdo Blast which is 69mp and has 108 power. Considering most SpS say they run out of mp too fast, imagine what it'd be like for an EE :). Most SpS will also have more INT than an EE, since we can't change it with tattoos.
Holy damage gives an extra 10% damage no? So I'm not sure that compensates. That's of course if we exclude SpS using Solar Flare. Include SpS having Mana Regen (as limited as this seems to be), and Clear Mind, they regen a better than an EE as well.
Everyone with any money has perma ww2 and at least Acu2, I don't know anyone that tries to solo without at least using NPC potions.
I've not seen a field of only undead in Forest of the Dead at my level. I know there are those just up the hill behind the necromancer, but they're blue to me now I think. Otherwise there are always either the Bone Magi, or Vampires or the spiders and bats. If you let me know where they are, I'll go and have a look :).
I guess it's possible that things would be better now, with the herbs since MP might not be such an issue. I might also pickup Empower as well. I'd have to try it again with the new herbs, but I'd rather keep my melee weapon for those small groups I join that don't hunt undead. I'd never use duals though, I love my shield too much ;).
I won't say it definatly doesn't work, because I've not tried it recently (and I don't always think I'm right ;)). But previously the exp was better meleeing than it was nuking, because of the downtime.
Yes, at level 72 I gain about 7mp each time I cast recharge on myself. I've not tested it, but if I'm not buffed with Acu3, Zerk2 then sitting might regen faster than recharging myself.
It looks like I started my Human Wizard re-roll at the right time. Even though I have a buffbot on standby, I rarely need her. Thanks to the combination of herbs and skills (body 2 mind, corpse life drain), my mage can now go nonstop without rest, just like a fighter with VR and heal pots in the good old days.
My only complaint...and it's a complaint that every slow-running and/or lazy mage has...is that I wished that you didn't have to pick up the pots in order for the effects to take place. But that is a minor complaint at this point.
I tried MoH leveling (ok with a +6 Ghoul Staff) around Dev Castle a quite a while back, and even with an SE I ran out of mp really fast. Might of Heaven does less damage per mp than an equal level nukers main nuke.
At 74, MoH for an EE costs 69mp (~64mp with Clarity3 I think) and has 87 power. Compared to Hyrdo Blast which is 69mp and has 108 power. Considering most SpS say they run out of mp too fast, imagine what it'd be like for an EE :). Most SpS will also have more INT than an EE, since we can't change it with tattoos.
Holy damage gives an extra 10% damage no? So I'm not sure that compensates.
Until C5 Might of Heaven was *not* considered holy damage. That is, it did not give the % boost (what % the boost is actually is determined by the monster). The only Holy nuke prior to C5 was Solar Spark/Solar Flare.
With C5, you do get the bonus damage applied as you should.
Regarding the self-recharge, it does not become worthwhile until you're either buffed by a swordmuse or have the level 78 toggle yourself or you could OE recharge for cost. :p
I started my little WS like a year ago, lvl her a little here and there with +4 tsu*sls duals, BW Heavey, +5str and +4dex tatoos. She is not involved with Synergy so PvP issue shouldn't be a problem. I like to play her when I am at work. The internet connection is wireless here and really sucks but if I stack her with tons of HP and haste pots to kill green mobs. If I can find a nice spot where alot of these pots drop that would be nice. FoD? Forest of the Dead?
for starters your build is perfect
wish i could have had that set up but pvp meant i had to use a blunt and not gimp my dex that bad
fod = forest of the dead, also known as fotd but im makeing a push to change the name :P
i'd really advise against makeing a crafter since the only purpose they serve is to make adena and im sure your sh already gets tons of that
if you are lvling it so you can have S grade crafts and you dont already know a S grade crafter (could always give me the recs to register ;) ) fair enough
if you are lvling it for siegeing forget about it
And the fact that people are even considering nukers as the best solo options make the class that is supposed to be the dedicated soloer cry ... since they can't take advantage of this once again. :p
If you have a +5 SoM, and half a brain with a bishop, you should be able to solo as an undead nuker with very little trouble.
And its NUKES... Someone should check the recast on MoH.
You can spam MoH... undead die in a hurry.
Yes, you are going to have to think about your hunting grounds... but that really isn't different for any class.
Undead nukes are 87 power vs 108 power of a real nuker, for the same mp cost.
This basically means a 74 bishop has the same power nuke as a lvl 60-62 Nuker, but with the same MP cost as the 74 nuke, along with less matk due to -4/5 int ......and with less then half the range....no clear mind, no BTM, no Greater mana gain,and no MP regeration buff , and a total inability to hunt any mob that is not undead or that happens to even live near a non-undead mob (which is probably 95% of the game area)
FOTD is not viable , there are simply too many non-undead aggros , even at night.......except for the very low lvl river border area which is grey to 70+ and still is night time only to avoid non-undeads.
Shrine of the Loyal is marginally viable , but the mobs are mixed with aggro non-undead scavenger scarab/ants.
So in fact , I actually cannot think of even 1 fully viable spot in the entire game with x1 undead mobs that a bishop could solo on at 70+ ..... do you actually know of any?
Ps:
I think you may have incorrect assumptions of MoH , based on the Paladins Holy strike....which only costs half the MP , for the same power , (and may actually have a higher dmg output if it is treated as a physical skill , not sure about this)
A physical skill with that damage rating would do no noteworthy damage, as physical skill damage is added, not multiplied. ;)
But apart from that, I don't think most people even bother learning MoH... it's good as an opener (maybe), that's about it.
To those having trouble juggling the numbers: Imagine a sorc without clear mind or even BtM level 1, and no INT tats trying to level with auraflare. Would that be soloing perfectly fine?
+20% holy weakness makes the effective power of MoH almost as high as a real nuke... on a non-fire-weak target. Still, no +Int, no Clear Mind, no HMG... and lots of extra moves because of the short range of the nuke.
If you insist on saying on I have nukes, please tell me what nuke I have besides might of heaven. Just because I can cast it quickly doesn't make it a separate spell some how.
See also what waster and Maline already said. sigh. Seriously I'm going to run out to those undead areas and post some stats.
Alright I took a level 77 stormscreamer out with a level 77 cardinal with the same gear, major arcana robes, +5 SOM, no tats on either. Empower 3 on both, using bsps, hitting Shrine Guards (undead, weak to sacred)
Stormscreamer:
2 hurricanes, 2113 damage each, 138 MP total.
1 hurricane, 2113 dmg, 1 shadow flare, 2642 dmg, 154 mp. Extra exp due to overhit.
Can kill about 18 mobs before running out of mp. Can't adjust INT with tats, no surrender skills, no clear mind, no body to mind, no mana regen, no overhit skills, and can't nuke anything but the undead, and in this location there are aggro living that a SS can kill and a cardinal will struggle with, wasting mp on heals in the process.
So we're nuking for a good 376 LESS per hit for 69 mp MORE than a stormscreamer to kill the same exact mob. Or if you compare moh to shadow flare we're nuking for 905 less. And unless you have a similar level EE/SE on your tail you'll be sitting to regen all that mp, making the exp over time really bad.
So yeah, sure it's doable if you have an area with only undeads but weaker, slower, with massive downtime.
If that's fun to you, well you're a better person that I am.
Well how can you even compare a DD to a support class? Your not ment to be a DD and never shoud be one. Your class is a party class but the fact remains that you CAN solo with your class just not as well as a DD which really makes sence. I know of a level 69 Bishop in Majestic Robes with a Hell Knife (not sure if it has an SA or not) that can solo FOtD for an entire buff round and end up with full mana at the end due to the herbs that drop in that area. I don't want to hear "I can't solo" because you can...if your not having fun doing it the problem is you not the game. (don't mean to sound offencive but it IS a matter of opinion)
Why exactly does it make sense that a DD should solo easier than a healer? Other than that's the way it is in this game. If healers aren't supposed to solo, and are supposed to support other characters, then why introduce things that negate the need for healers in this role?
I know I can solo, it's just expensive and inefficient (either slow kills or long downtime). My issue is that the herbs allow DDs to get the benefit of a healer (or recharger/buffer), without having to group one, and now without even having to spend adena on potions. However there's no way for a healer to get the benefits of a DD class without grouping with one.
The main purpose of a DD is DAMAGE...the main purpose of a support class is SUPPORT. A Mage cannot heal like a Bishop so why should a Bishop be able to nuke like a Mage? You can't...and shouldn't have it all. The herbs do NOT remove the need for a Bishop or other buffer. I cannot pick up an HP herb mid fight if the mobs not dead when a Bishop could heal me mid-fight and save my life. Buffers are still very useful...there is no VR herb, there is no Zerk Herb, There is No resist shock or evasion herb, there is no Proh of Wind, Water, Fire, herb either.
So yeah, sure it's doable if you have an area with only undeads but weaker, slower, with massive downtime.
Well thats what I thought .
But the question is , does there even exist any areas with only undeads at 70+ , I dont think any bishops would consider soloing mobs at 50% or less efficiency of a real nuker to be worthwhile , particularly if they are going to be constantly aggroed by non-undeads also.
Entrance to the Forge of the Gods I belive are all undead and 70+. Correct me if I am mistaken.
I think you mean entrance to IT.
But those are x2 x3mobs, and took a surrender+6-8 nukes to kill.
So 7-9 nukes worth of MP for 1.5 - 2 times the exp of a 2-shot shrine mob = 3.5 times less efficient for a real nuker = 6.25 times less efficient for a bishop , then the shrine mobs.....
Allthough , it may in fact be the single only safe non-aggro undead-only hunt spot in the game for a bishop 70+ , but this means safe bishop soloing is more then 6 times slower then a real nuker, before you even consider downtime and mp recovery skills (or lack therof)
I'm not saying I should be able to nuke like a nuker, in fact I don't want to (I made my healer to heal). Sure the herbs don't drop while in the middle of killing a mob, so if you've done something stupid you'll die. I somehow doubt that anyone would take an EE into a duo just in case they have to heal once every twenty minutes (or they could use GHP).
However from what I've been reading (here, and from people in my alliance), people have been soloing with no downtime. The herbs giving enough mp/hp to not need to rest at all, and so not needing heals, or recharges. Maybe it's just me when I think that is slightly over the top? To me it does seem that this removes the need for healers/recharges in duos (maybe small groups also).
The herbs increase the exp over time for almost all classes when soloing, excepting healers/summoners (or two boxers, maybe some others) I guess. While decreasing the chance of a healer to actually find a duo, since those that would have duoed before can solo without downtime anyway. EE buffs aren't really that helpful at increasing kill speed, so I doubt that would be a reason for anyone to duo with one.
There will of course always be groups for healers, but you can't always find one. I'm just happy I've got a good clan and alliance, so I can get groups quite regularly.
I think you mean the first room of Imperial Tomb for Undead. One room and one corridor for the entire 70+ population of healers to solo on ;). I do want to try hunting there solo with Turn Undead when I hit 74 though, maybe that'll be ok.
I'll survive, as always. I'm just tired of things being introduced into the game that might not totally remove but certainly reduce the need for my class.
I cannot pick up an HP herb mid fight if the mobs not dead when a Bishop could heal me mid-fight and save my life.
this might be true for a robe class but consider the bigger picture.
I have been lvling an alt a destroyer in varka silenos outpost solo since this patch came out easily.
I go the where we are supposed to group get my boxed buffs (what can I say?) and kill stuff. Before this patch I would pick up a healer, now when I get over my head all I got to do is spot a health pot on the ground and pick it up (since im already killing the mobs) and wham over 2,000 HP more than anyone but a bishop could heal me for.
yes there are no vr pots but I could easily solo and I mean solo w/o buffs the area's the pots drop w/o vr as long as I spammed pickup.
I think these pots are just over the top. You must realize that for the most part support classes are supposed to group.. but where do they find a group since solo/duo xp is so much better and easier now?
the only groups I ever see running are duo/trio's w/o healers with a dual box to the catas, pagan's group with an outside buffer and IT groups.
Well , getting back to the topic, I still dont think the new buffs will hurt healers at all.
As mentioned earlier , heal herbs cant be used untill mob is dead , whilst buff herbs will be useful for the next 2 mins, there is a focus herb which if anything will make it easier for your EE to find a duo since your lack of such a critical (no pun intended) buff will now be less important, whilst your heals will still be in demand.
I will agree thet they are a bit over the top but I'd also like to point out that the herbs only drop in fields and only certin fields. If you want to go anywhere else to hunt you will need a duo at least.
P.S. Yes I did mean Imperial Tomb. Thank you for the correction. I know it's not much but it is something and healers choices for hunting grounds have always been limited
i'd really advise against makeing a crafter since the only purpose they serve is to make adena and im sure your sh already gets tons of that
if you are lvling it so you can have S grade crafts and you dont already know a S grade crafter (could always give me the recs to register ;) ) fair enough
Basically, she is for making ss and sps. I just need to get her to 62 to make S grade shots. It seems the dwarfs lately haven't been keeping up to demand as well as they would like so its nice to be able to craft the ss and sps when I need them. She has quite a bit of rare recs on her and I like to craft the odd thing when I am bored. I don't use her at all for making money, just more for convience or when someone else needs something.
I think my main issue is that they seem to be introducing more and more ways to melee/archer/nuker classes to solo but doing nothing for support classes.
From my point of view since I started a healer they've introduced store sold potions for WW1, haste 1, then SA's for acumen, bless the body, focus, minor haste, then dawn/dusk priest WW2, better haste, better acumen, then scrolls for high versions and longer lasting buffs of WW, focus, empower, shield, might, agility, etc. Then herbs for minor healing and mana regen. Oh and of course, BSOE's that steal a EE'/PPs unique skill and give it to ALL, and BREZ's that return full exp, something on a scroll that even a level 80 bishop cannot do.
And now of course, herbs that in certain areas drop like crazy (from what I've seen) for focus, ww, might, whatever else, PLUS pots that heal from 400-3000 and mp restoration from 100-700 or more.
I think my main issue is that they seem to be introducing more and more ways to melee/archer/nuker classes to solo but doing nothing for support classes.
OK lets get this ball rolling then... What would be a way that we could help a healer solo? MoH and Holy weapon working on Demonic mobs is a start...any other ideas?
She doesn't want to solo. She wants to be needed as a healer.
And that is definitely the line of thought to persue - higher risk exp simply needs to be more worthwhile. PvP also needs to be paced slower for healers to show their true power there.
I also still think that anything you can buff yourself should have a stronger effect on you - i.e. a prophet should get haste level 3 when they buff themselves with haste 2.
Alright I took a level 77 stormscreamer out with a level 77 cardinal with the same gear, major arcana robes, +5 SOM, no tats on either.
Before I start, I'd like to make sure you know that I appreciate the fact you actually tried it. It is a credit to you that you went and tested that which someone else claimed.
Thanks for that at least... If you are going to disagree with me, at LEAST have the nuts to go out and TRY it.
That being said...
Dark elf has more Int than a human.
A human sorceror would have been a better test overall, but I appreciate the fact you brought a real nuker. You just happened to bring the absolute best nuker in the game period... and you are comparing damage output with 3 more INT... thus the actual disparity between nukers is actually pretty close to what would be happening even if a human sorc had the typcial +4int tat and you compared it to a Bishop with his inability to change the INT score. (you tested 44 int vs 41int... human sorc would have 45 int with tat.) To be fair, the bishop would have +5wit, and the sorc +4wit.
Empower 3 on both, using bsps, hitting Shrine Guards (undead, weak to sacred)
If you had an SE, then mana is considerably less of an issue.
I said SOLO.
(Why is it people still think "solo" is whatever+SE?)
Solo bishops have ww2, berz1 and acumen2 that nukers will not have and cannot get without spending adena for pots or scrolls.
Stormscreamer:
2 hurricanes, 2113 damage each, 138 MP total.
1 hurricane, 2113 dmg, 1 shadow flare, 2642 dmg, 154 mp. Extra exp due to overhit.
Let's try some math. 1737/2113 = 82%. You had 3 less INT.
Note please, you didn't find the "right" mobs which take more damage overall. (They vary... some mobs take more damage from holy than others... and being undead does not necessarily indicate they are the weakest.
You also should be looking for mobs which are two hits. (2 hits per HP bracket, a 2x mob you kill in 4 hits is the same.)
Can kill about 18 mobs before running out of mp.
Spellsingers do about 22-23 before having to stand/sit around.
The difference is that you actually kill FASTER if you pick 2-hits.
If yer actually solo, you are even better as you have ww2, berz, and acumen2 free!
Can't adjust INT with tats
Correct, but your own test already give us an idea of the difference down to 1 INT.
no surrender skills
Hint... it takes mobs that require 5 or more hits to break EVEN in casting a surrender.
Nukers do not use surrender on standard mobs. Why waste mana? For those of us with overhits, we would require TWO surrendered elements. (or count on vortex being up every mob.)
no clear mind
I can drop every single ounce of my mana in 2 minutes. In those 2 minutes, I gain 160 mana more than I would if I was running with clear mind. Grats me one extra kill every 2 minutes. Does it help? Yes... but note I am WALKING with either a ww1 pot compared to your bishop running with free perma-ww2. Bishops run slow, but a lot faster than me walking.
no body to mind
Only Spellhowlers and necros have appreciable B2M. Sorcs get rank 1, which refills mana slower than a lower level EE with clarity casting recharge on themselves. B2M is powerful stuff... but only one true nuker has it.
no mana regen
I suppose you mean the spell which gives 80 mana/minute at its max rank.
Grats me on ONE extra kill every 2 minutes uptime period.
Highly overrated... they could DOUBLE its effect and it would still suck compared to B2M1.
, no overhit skills
Overhit is also highly overrated. I won't say its not nice... but I would trade it for B2M rank 1 any day.
and can't nuke anything but the undead, and in this location there are aggro living that a SS can kill and a cardinal will struggle with, wasting mp on heals in the process.
Yes, you actually have to demonstrate some skill in picking your levelling grounds.
Grats learning how to nuke.
Now try it without any useful control...
So we're nuking for a good 376 LESS per hit for 69 mp MORE than a stormscreamer to kill the same exact mob.
This is completely misleading. You stated yourself:
44 int base, SoM+5, MA robes stormscreamer = 2113 damage for 69 mana
41 int base, SoM+5, MA robes cardinal = 1737 damage for 69 mana
Cardinals do 376 less on a mob that isn't that weak to holy.
You even picked the wrong mob... there are mobs weaker than those to holy in which case you would have done more damage.
You need to find mobs which are two-hits... every nuker knows that... time to step up to the plate and find the right XP spot.
Eva forbid that a class that can mod its INT and pretty much cannot do anything except nuke is slightly better than a bishop at nuking...
Or if you compare moh to shadow flare we're nuking for 905 less. And unless you have a similar level EE/SE on your tail you'll be sitting to regen all that mp, making the exp over time really bad.
Welcome to my world.
2 minutes of nuking for 10 minutes of downtime.
You get no pity.
The new pots help you just as much as me.
So yeah, sure it's doable if you have an area with only undeads but weaker, slower, with massive downtime. If that's fun to you, well you're a better person that I am.
No, its not fun.
Have you been paying attention to the spellsinger/sorc posts since C5?
You are in the same boat as non SH/SS nukers when it comes to solo... but bishops can actually offer something to a group...
Bishops CAN solo undead with a little care... yes, nukers are better at it... but barely.
Bishops are so much more beneficial to a group that it isn't even funny.
Bishops go out and solo for a bit waiting for a group.
Spellsingers go out to solo for hours on end of 2 minutes nuking 10 minutes standing around because they know that only a group willing to do them a favor and accept their complete pointlessness compared to alternative classes is going to take them.
You proved that solo for a bishop is possible... you even proved that you do it 80ish% as well as a spellsinger. (vs undead)
I WISH I healed or resurrected 80ish% as well as a bishop.
I wish I could SLEEP/control 80ish% as well as a bishop.
Agreed, its harder for a healer to get exp. But these places are intended for SOLOING. Please get that through your heads. These places give a bonus to soloing, not duoing not trioing but solo. Groups are needed in any place without these herbs. IE GROUP mobs. These mobs need support to help kill them. So these herbs are right on the money. If you are financing an OOP buffer in solo areas it might seem over the top though, but if you try to do it without OOP buffs you may understand why its balanced.
I find it fun now just hunting nonstop waiting for that 100% mana pot to jump up and replenish me for another 5 minutes of straight nuking. Before there was only predictable change to my MP bar. I've had to bsoe 3 times from mobs since the patch because I've tried to handle too many mobs with too little MP.
As well with this patch it makes it too rewarding to solo like this. To compensate for this, the rewards in group exp locations needs to be boosted. That may happen sometime soon in the future. But until then I'm going to keep spamming Death Spike on my Necromancer :P
I think my main issue is that they seem to be introducing more and more ways to melee/archer/nuker classes to solo but doing nothing for support classes.
You just proved you can solo too...
The mana/buff pots help you almost as well as the nuker/archer/melee classes.
That being said I have not one iota of opposition to making buffs less powerful overall, and making priest/buffers more substance in combat.
Keep in mind, the number one reason PvP is so short is buff stacking...
Mages with 1500+ cast speed (Matk is actually a horrendously weak stat due to the sqrt calculation) and archers with 50% crit rate doing 7k damage in PvP are the primary problems.
Mages wth 700 or less cast speed and archers toinking for 900 on robes with a 30% chance for 2200 is not nearly as bad.
I think my main issue is that they seem to be introducing more and more ways to melee/archer/nuker classes to solo but doing nothing for support classes.
OK lets get this ball rolling then... What would be a way that we could help a healer solo? MoH and Holy weapon working on Demonic mobs is a start...any other ideas?
/signed on the undead-only being changed to undead/demon instead. Frankly, I think SEs should get an unholy nuke which only affects anything weak to dark.
The mana/buff pots help you almost as well as the nuker/archer/melee classes.
There is no fully MoH-able spot where pots drop though, I believe - not exactly solo capable if that's the case.
I still laugh that a summoner has to pay at least 10% experience and a noticable chunk of money over time to get the "right" to EXP without sitting but everyone else is getting it stuffed up their back.
And I've been saying the stacking buffs thing for a while - I mean, 1k attack speed on an archer? What was NCSoft smoking, exactly?
Another game comes to mind but the bishop class was actually two separate things. A cleric could "keep" a body so it didn't decay before they could safely rez it. They could also put holy weapon on magic blades (think anything but nub weapons) and did very well soloing.
An empath was the healer and got exp from healing others. Don't ask how they kept people from exploiting that I don't remember.
Here's another fix though, make it so a healer can have a DD out of party but the healer gets 100% exp, problem solved. Notice most people say they exp with a OOP buffer and/or healer but it doesn't go the other way around now does it? At the very least a healer has to split their exp with a DD, but a DD doesn't HAVE to share with the healer/buffer.
She doesn't want to solo. She wants to be needed as a healer.
But we have already determined through the course of this thread that a healer/buffer is still very needed and so I moved on to fix the only real issue that is present. The fact that everyone else has gotten a hand up on soloing but the healer not so much (which is still debateable to some extent).
I think my main issue is that they seem to be introducing more and more ways to melee/archer/nuker classes to solo but doing nothing for support classes.
You just proved you can solo too...
The mana/buff pots help you almost as well as the nuker/archer/melee classes.
That being said I have not one iota of opposition to making buffs less powerful overall, and making priest/buffers more substance in combat.
Keep in mind, the number one reason PvP is so short is buff stacking...
Mages with 1500+ cast speed (Matk is actually a horrendously weak stat due to the sqrt calculation) and archers with 50% crit rate doing 7k damage in PvP are the primary problems.
Mages wth 700 or less cast speed and archers toinking for 900 on robes with a 30% chance for 2200 is not nearly as bad.
These problems are why I wish the Prophecy of Water buff defensive all increasing evasion by about 10, p.def doubled, m.def doubled etc got through the testing process. There are so many offensive buffs out there, there usually is no reason to have defensive buffs if your going to be killed in 3-4 shots anyways.
A live buffer/healer is nice, but rarely 'needed'. Less so now. That is the problem with the herbs.
An empath was the healer and got exp from healing others. Don't ask how they kept people from exploiting that I don't remember
I remember that in RFO levelling buffs was painful because you could not overwrite a buff that was not about to ding out - of course people went on to buff masses of AFK people, but it wasn't as easy as putting a rock on your buff hotkey and going AFK, you had to go around finding unbuffed targets - might do something similar for healing, and then making sure the damage is to HP, not CP, or something to that effect.
But then, that wouldn't work in L2 - just as well, too, the game can be fixed within its own design.
There is no fully MoH-able spot where pots drop though, I believe - not exactly solo capable if that's the case.
Forest Of The Dead.
EDIT: On the subject of Healers in PvP...hows about a "Make Unholy" debuff which would make a target player esentally an undead so they can use MoH for PvP?
I can do this with a level 77 of SPS or Sorc too. This may be a whole separate thread really :P
However fair enough, I picked the wrong mobs I guess. If anyone can tell me where I can find undead mobs around level 77 where pots drop that are two shot-able I'll move my butt and try that. Oh and I really need there to be no aggro living things because they would kick my ***.
I still disagree. A healer/buffer is very much needed anywhere that herbs do not drop in fields or anywhere that is not a field....AoE groups, PvP, and even in a field that drops herbs. They are not as dependable as a live buffer/healer and again cannot be used unless that mob is dead also there are many buffs that the herbs cannot provide and the duration of these herbs are short.
She doesn't want to solo. She wants to be needed as a healer.
Bishops aren't having trouble getting groups.
Archer insta-kill groups deep in non-solo areas are still the best XP by far. Bishops and EE compete for the "healer" slot.
EE are better by a nose, but I don't know anyone who won't take a bishop.. especially if that group took a warcrier instead of a prophet.
And that is definitely the line of thought to persue - higher risk exp simply needs to be more worthwhile.
Finally something we can agree on.
The solution is simple... group places should have noticeable XP and loot bonuses. When you spend 4+ hours in a group, you should have real loot to show for it. We aren't talking a guaranteed top-a grade weapon or armor, but we are talking enough adena/loot to cover your expenses PLUS some sort of definite profit margin overall.
I have gone almost a year and a half without a full drop of any kind for my main. That's stingy. I have gone 6 months without seeing a B or A grade drop in group AT ALL. I generally go out with clan groups (7-9-man) and camp for hours in at a time.
You would think I would have seen at least one B or A grade full drop...
PvP also needs to be paced slower for healers to show their true power there.
Also /signed... nerf buff stacking overall.
I also still think that anything you can buff yourself should have a stronger effect on you - i.e. a prophet should get haste level 3 when they buff themselves with haste 2.
I won't agree with this ever.
Specialist classes need to be superior at their job than buffing classes can do when all buffs are applied.
Given the power of buffs in this game, this is a really bad idea.
I am for melee upgrades for priest classes to bring them more in line with the orc mages. Unnerf the stupid bow/polearm nerfs, and put in some real melee skills for priests so they have some teeth on their own accord.
In PvP a healer is only needed if it does not involve multiple assisting fully buffed archers, and a pure buffer is only needed in town to give out level 5x buffs (ok, NCSoft has been starting to amend the latter). :p
Soloing people still irk me - on behalf not only of the healers, but moreover of their mutant cousins the summoners.
ETA cos Thal was posting at the same time as me:
Buffers already have a passive skill that gives them ca. 30% free PAtk, it hasn't made their PAtk higher than that of real classes. You'll still lack the power in melee PvP to outdamage a real archer or dagger, and in PvE, if the "rise-above" levels of skills like haste, deathwhisper etc. were made decently small enough, this would hold true also.
It might also fix something with elven self-buffs: What worth does a self-buff have at 7x that a level 20 cleric can replace?
In PvP a healer is only needed if it does not involve multiple assisting fully buffed archers, and a pure buffer is only needed in town to give out level 5x buffs (ok, NCSoft has been starting to amend the latter). :p
Soloing people still irk me - on behalf not only of the healers, but moreover of their mutant cousins the summoners.
<-- lvl 78 DC.. came across PvP in a full group vs aprox 2 groups.
When we came within range and my CP started droping the bishop hit his battle heal with over 1400 cast speed, in the recharge time of battle heal I was dead.
When we came within range and my CP started droping the bishop hit his battle heal with over 1400 cast speed, in the recharge time of battle heal I was dead.
And people call me silly when I say the PvP in this game sucks...
1 group vs 2 groups...what did you expect to happen? How were they geared? What was the party set up? How were you buffed? how were they buffed? This argument dosen't seem to hold much water and is only one small example.
1 group vs 2 groups...what did you expect to happen? How were they geared? What was the party set up? How were you buffed? how were they buffed? This argument dosen't seem to hold much water and is only one small example.
we had full buffs Sws, CoV, BD, BoA
they had the standard 56+ prophet buffs with 1 bd and 1 sws no CoV and no prophecy
Note that it totally doesn't matter that he was outnumbered, because he was dead faster than the fastest heal in the game could provide - even if he had been with a second group, that would have been of no relevance.
Knowing Tok, he was at least self-buffed (that's a lot for a 78 WC), and knowing CORE's reputation (if he's still with 'em?) he should have been SwS and BD buffed also.
Ever use CP potions? QHPs? GHPs? Also I'd like to point out that the new potions should alviate some of this problem. But still if 2 groups of GOOD players focus fire on one MYSTIC class...you should die that fast.
Edit: Is it just me or are we getting totally off topic here? >.<
Discussed and established as untrue if I remember correctly?
Just because someone cannot find it, does not mean it doesn't exist. The same people also claimed they couldn't solo at all and now that has been debunked completely.
There are FIELDS of undead-only mobs at day and night in the FotD. The first set starts turning light blue at 68 if I remember correctly and the second set turns light blue at 73.
The earlier level one definitely drop the new pots and I woudl hazard a guess the higher level one does too as it is in the same area, just higher level mobs.
Better yet their only special attacks are STUNS which they never get to use. (you get bonus XP for the stun ability, and it has no effect on you.)
After 73-74, it is best to leave FotD as the undead only fields are too low, or at least the mob density and profit margins are.
Use your head.
-Do you know what level range turns light blue?
-Do you know where to look up mobs by level and type?
Please maline... go out and actually try this stuff before posting. You are arguing with someone who HAS a Bishop and a Spellsinger. (to be fair the bishop is only 66) I can log both on and do it. I have been there and soloed them... and yes I truly SOLO. I don't usually have a buffbot unless a clannie takes pity on me.
Bishops solo undead 80% as well as a nuker.
When do nukers get to heal, res, or sleep 80% as well as a healer?
Two topics one thread, and no I'm not going to say stay on topic :P
The other issue a soloing healer runs into is pvp. Chances are at 77 you have more than a handful of wars. A sps out soloing can take that same nuke and aim it at another player, a bishop can trance and... run? BSOE? Little you can do in defense.
Surrender to dead and heals turned to harms would be hysterically cool though ;)
Actually you can definently heal yourself, mana burn your opponent, run around try to lead him to die by mobs and ask for backup. You can carry 100+ CP pots, + the cp pot that gives you 1200+ cp, and the hp pot that gives 2k+ hp. And root is effective too.
On my Necromancer I've tried to duel against same level healers. My nukes do.... 500 dmg. Healers heal that and spam cp pots while they drain my MP to 0. Sure it's easy to BSOE cause they cant kill fast but healers can stand their own in PvP and the rps system works if you include cp pots cause a necro can rarely anchor through a healers M.Def and anchor and silence are the Necro's only way to beat the healer.
I'm pretty sure 100+ CP pots, heal pots, the big cp heal pot, spirit ore for my various skills, and bsps would have be pinned to the ground at like 100% weight XD
And running around in aggro mobs is most likely going to get me killed as well, repose isn't that fool proof. Anyway **** don't tell me I need to try dueling a necro now while soloing in FotD! :P
Well don't come here saying healers aren't good in pvp since recently in PvP my Necromancer has had loads of trouble with them. I've been rooted, mana drained and beaten to a pulp by swords of a prophet because my dps couldn't beat his CP pot spamming. Sure I can spam cp pots too but I don't have melee capability which is required when you have 0 mana to outlast. I think the latest CP pot changes hurt nukers hard who rely most on their MP bar. It's possible if you have the right resists, to be able to tank a nukers mp bar dry with CP pots. My nukes do 600-700 dmg to a properly geared same level healer with dark resist. Him spamming heal on self while spamming 100+ cp pots, it's almost virtually impossible to kill without an anchor/silence.A big boost for archers who are virtually unkillable with this. Especially Hawkeyes with their new weight skill can carry hundreds of cp pots.
Let me just say the new patch made soloing much more enjoyable and easier to do while making open pvp much much more lame. :(
the herbs are great but to try and hunt with just herbs makes a mage play ... Magic Herb Bingo and pray he gets em all the time or spend time 2 shotting some times or smokin mana tryin to get another herb drop ... sure the heath and mp herbs drop good . and alot of atk spd and atk power drops but honestly I would rather have the gauranteed power then the lottery drop power . but they are nice bonuses when using buffer/healers like the gimped EE
Prophets can also wear robes, light armor or heavy, have a ton of buffs, root (bishops stop at 9) and aren't likely to minus or STR to increase survivability either. But me trying to take on other classes in fights for real is a whole entire other thread XD
After 73-74, it is best to leave FotD as the undead only fields are too low, or at least the mob density and profit margins are.
But then go where ?
I dont think there is actually any where in the game she could go apart from the x2/x3 mobs at IT entrance (which real nukers dont even consider worth hunting)
The shrine mobs had non-undead aggros which made it un-feasible.
So saying she can solo undead 80% as effectively , that sounds nice, but it isnt very helpful if there is no where to do it at dont you think ?
Has anyone tried melee soloing with a healer (Bishop /EE)?
Shouldnt the buff herbs actually help this since those classes suffer from lack of buffs ?
And as seems the case 74+ healer undead soloing has to be done in areas with accompanying non-undeads, thus a melee-capable setup would be needed in any case.
Has anyone tried melee soloing with a healer (Bishop /EE)?
Shouldnt the buff herbs actually help this since those classes suffer from lack of buffs ?
The problem is that you have to gimp yourself up for PvP (and some would argue group PvE, but I dont' see as much of a problem there if you're careful) by swapping your tattoos around from -STR/+CON/+DEX to at least -CON/+one of the others, dropping 8 to 12 CON.
A standard bishop set up is +4 CON -STR at the least, most of us go +4 DEX -4 STR because we're so slow. That's -8 str right there, and since our buffs stop around 35 most favor the party build anyway. Self buffed we only have might 2, shield 2, zerk 1, focus 1, herbs help that a little but I personally would rather put on demon and try to painfully nuke than ever try melee.
A standard bishop set up is +4 CON -STR at the least, most of us go +4 DEX -4 STR because we're so slow. That's -8 str right there, and since our buffs stop around 35 most favor the party build anyway. Self buffed we only have might 2, shield 2, zerk 1, focus 1, herbs help that a little but I personally would rather put on demon and try to painfully nuke than ever try melee.
my bishop is set up now mostly for looks.
the red mask and horns with dual crimson sword and ELVEN set. yes i have some. who wants to touch me ...
when im feelin lookin really "good" tho, dual sor sahayas white mask (yes, i got it - custom order from eb games in canada. paid a TON extra.) and white robes/dark stockings.
Sorry for the unclarity Ellie - that's what I meant: You can't expect any class except maybe dwarves to change their tattoo setup every time they want to solo while waiting around for a group.
I don't think healers/buffers can solo still, not counting the orc mages or course, maybe a Prophet in extreme cases...but other than that I don't really see it.
The pots do not replace active healers imo. Maybe people that dual boxed healers decided to cancel that second account, but I am sure the active healer isn't going to care.
Considering everyone including their grandma almost has their own personal buffer, or two, or even 3, I am sure the 8 active healers on each server aren't really gonna see that they get less parties. And this is why:
Active healers are needed for PvP.
Active healers are (preferred) needed for ToI and DVC type parties. (Both which are A grade quest areas)
Catacombs (where 80% of ppl hunt) don't drop herbs.
Well anyway I think you get my point. Any dungeon area that is especially used for A grade quests, or any pvp, or any other thing isn't "soloable" and doesn't have herbs. Not to mention, herbs are not constant like a buffer. For example, you can solo and Pick up those MP pots (that drop randomly) or you can duo with a SE and get recharged and pick up MP pots so you will never have to rest, except maybe every 2 hours or so depending on where you are hunting.
I think NCsoft thought about "herbs replacing healer concept" and realized that if you want to exp better, get Seal Stones, use the Mammons, complete A grade Quest items, PvP, Socialize, explore the dangerous perils of L2, then you need a healer.
The herbs are meant to let those who want to log out at a "solo spot", log in (maybe on a lunch break) grind for an hour and log out, without not logging in at all or just sitting in town chatting with ppl.
The herbs are meant to let those who want to log out at a "solo spot", log in (maybe on a lunch break) grind for an hour and log out, without not logging in at all or just sitting in town chatting with ppl.
Although I think you are perfectly fine with this point. As a tank, with these herbs I can solo non stop, with out my panther on white mobs with x1 HP, while having full MP and HP all the time.
The only time I need to rest now is when my hand starts to hurt from too much clicking.
The drop rates of these herbs is just too high imo. Its true you don´t get greater or superior herbs very often...but the lesser ones just drop fastly enough to get a constant flow of HP or MP....more on HP though.
Well I always heard how slow tanks leveled so this should be some way to balance out the leveling speed then. Yes HP herbs drop TONS more than MP pots. It makes me wish I was a SH. If I was an SH I could solo forever!
I really don't think the pots drop rate is too high. Lots of pots drop, but not all of them are useful for every class, or even for soloing in general. They only last 2 minutes so you aren't always buffed. Basically it makes it possible for people to solo for an hour or so without having loads of down time, because when you wanna play, you wanna PLAY, you don't wanna sit on your butt for half the time.
The crappiest thing about L2 is it's LONG grind! It is easy, because the mobs are dumb as dirt without micro organisms living in it! But it is just time consuming, and not everyone can be unemployed.
A subscription based game that caters to the unemployed is the most ludicrous idea I have ever heard of!
WHen you need to kill something, you need a weapon, right?
And what's summoner's weapon?
A DRAGON SLAYER and full buffs! lol
I agree a summoner's weapon is his summon, but it isn't his WEAPON. If your statement was 100% summoners would not have weapons, the ones u hold in ur hand. When I see an EE pick up his horse by it's horn and attempt to beat you with it, then the summon = weapon! Until then it is a pet/servitor...
Plus the only thing that can make a LE more fruity is a freakin unicorn! :mad:
Actually a true summoner can sit while his summon does the dirty work. Then stand up and heal the summon and sit down again. Its like a 2 box where the summon is the main and the summoner is 2 box.
If some summoners like to get some action along with its summon its their choice...but its not really necessary.
If I could only pick up herbs with my panther it would be great...
That would require servitor inventories, and then they could also use ... potions. Like everyone else. Did anyone else remember that ponies don't have CP when the CP pots change rolled around?
When I say solo, I mean, solo! No pets, no people, no buffer.
I have played a phantom summoner for 67 levels and they are very fun to play, when soloing you cna use your shadow although ti takes 30% exp wich can be frustrating ti has more p atack then msot classes ahve HP but ina aprty nightsahde can heal as much a a lvl 70 bishop can I have never been able to level without a summon out though Maybe lgiht armor and a draogn slayer with prophet and se buffs MAYBE