hmm surely it will stimulated the economics a LOT with at least 1 full item drop eatch week for a normaal guy that plays around 2 hours a day=14 hours a week
i just have a feeling this game is going downhill fast if NCsoft not take actions SOON
a other way to stimulated market is they make all weapons do the damage with SS,blessed and add SS,Blessed for 4x the damage so it cost a LOT less to kill or no adena's at all to kill
Some low-B and low-A full drops to wear and then crystallize; enough mats to craft your first top weapon and/or armor set of B-grade in late 50s; A-grade in mid-60s. Spoilable recipes.
Full items should never be dropped by any mob, including all bosses.
Full items should spoil once a month.
Materials should drop at roughly 1/50th of the spoil rates.
All key materials, all recipes and all spellbooks should be spoil only.
Dwarven Chain Shield and Full Plate Shield dropped at a week distance from each other..
I m pleased, dont get me wrong, but I m starting to wonder if between this and the herbs the game is starting to be a bit too.. relaxed..
If we can't have a weekend event EVERY QUARTER whereupon the drop rates would increase a thousand times for everyone, then I propose the following:
In addition to XP and SP, players should accumulate "Drop Points" (hereafter DP) as they hunt. The amount of DP depends on your level, but otherwise remains constant for each mob within your level (Green, White and Yellow). Once you've reached certain thresholds -- for example, say 1 million DP -- the players can cash in the DP through Mammon or some other periodically spawning NPC for a Drop Point Certificate (hereafter DPC) which dramatically increases your odds of either a bulk basic material or a complete item drop. As long as you are hunting with a DPC, you are assured of getting a drop, provided it is an item or mat that the mob typically drops.
However, you cannot determine what that drop will be, or when the drop will occur. The DPC disappears after you get either a bulk material drop (e.g., 200 animal bones for one kill) or a complete item drop.
There could be other limitations as well. Like...
You can only use the DPC that corresponds to your current grade level. You can only farm with one DPC in your inventory at a time, similar to leveling a soul crystal. DPC's do not stack and are not transferable from player to player. DPC's do not enhance the possibilities of a spoil. DPC's cannot be used in conjunction with seeding and manor. DPC's can be used in parties, however, there is a possibility that a bulk basic mat drop will be equally distributed to all persons carrying an activated DPC at the time of drop. Raid Bosses do not give DP and are not themselves effected by DPC's. Chaotic players cannot use DPC's. Finally, recipes, spell books, scrolls (Escape, Rez, L2Day , etc.) are considered a "complete item drop" and not a "bulk item drop," and count towards redemption of the DPC.
I like Sin's idea for Drop Points. Though, mostly, this game needs an Auction House. I recently got a Claymore Blade off a mob. According to a website that lists in-game items worth, it sells for about 200k. Unfortunately, I'll end up selling it to an NPC for about 20k. Why? Because I'm not willing to add on to my already expensive electricity bill by leaving my computer on 24/7 just to sell an item in a game. Not to mention, if there were an Auction House, it would solve the lag issue in Giran.
Firstly, claymore blades are worth nothing - and secondly, if you're not willing to leave the game running, deal with it and pay more. That's just how it runs.
Why is it so easy to understand that being lower level is a consequence of less time spent in game, but when the turn comes to poverty people reel?
An 'auction house' would be like remvoing PvE and making you click a button in an NPC dialogue every 20 seconds to receive EXP, SP and drops. Not much different than actual grinding, but somehow crippled - eh?
As for full drops... I haven't had any, and I can't honestly say I feel I'm missing out.
I have more lag in Gludio than Giran. No one is selling there.
I wish I could grind offline as well. Suck it up. Auction house is a stupid idea for L2.
Selling an item in a game and grinding are two completely different things. I can't grind while afk, but I can sell while afk. It takes no interaction from me other than setting up the store. Really, there's no reason to have to be online to sell my items. I'm curious though, why is an auction house a 'stupid' idea for L2?
Because nothing comes easy in L2..Having to search around town(s) for what your looking for at a reasonable price is part of the challenge. Also picking a selling location can be key in making the sale.
Selling an item in a game and grinding are two completely different things.
No, they are not. You have the option to sell everything to an NPC or you can take the extra time to setup a shop. There are some people that spend more time selling than grinding. The are the same.
I can't grind while afk, but I can sell while afk. It takes no interaction from me other than setting up the store.
You'll always be broke. The people that make good money actively buy and sell.
Really, there's no reason to have to be online to sell my items.
With this I'll agree but not the way you're suggesting.
I'm curious though, why is an auction house a 'stupid' idea for L2?
Nameless, no discrespect, but you should quit posting such threads. If you have luck with drops, that's great for you. Others are not quite so lucky.
For example, for the past week I have been leveling in VoS like crazy. What do I have to show for it? 100 Blood medusa coins, 100+ Silver coins and a bunch of crap avadon/zubei mats. Not even enough mats to create 1 full item.
yeah, it would be nice if B weapon recipes had a drop rate of something beter than 1/10000, or a spoil rate better than 1/1000.
it would be nice if key mats actually dropped/spoiled from the same grade mobs as the item (d grade mats from 40+ mobs is just stupid IMHO).
what needs to happen, and I don't see it happening, is NCSoft needs to go through their entire drop/spoil list and reoptimize it. every time a new Chronicle thingy comes out, they change things or add or remove things and don't pay attention how it impacts the rest of the game. anyone remember when Brig helm/full plate helms used to not cost 10 million adena+? or the rest of the d armor set completers, for that matter.
The D-grade set completers have always been pretty high, as well as C grade ones... just not quite as high as now.
Sellers take advantage of twinking. High level players have lots of money and start an alt, they want the best gear so they can level as fast as possible. It would take longer for them to farm the stuff that it would to XP with shop gear.
This is actually a good money making opprotunity for lower levels, they can farm the mobs that drop those items, although for slightly less xp, and make loads of money off high levels by crafting and reselling (on seig there is quite often a dwarf in giran with all c/d set item recs). When I was level 35-45, I made a killing off of Elven Mithril Gloves, made 2 or 3 pairs for good friends of mine and sold a good handful at high profit.
I would suggest having the NPCS force you to craft every item ingame, then the economy wouldnt be soo re twawd ded. Dwarfs have such a overshadowed role in this game w/ mammon and the npcs that just "sell" full gear.
Gear imo, should drop only off raidbosses. Mobs should drop all the mats u need for crafting, and remove recipes.. that is such a archaic and broken system. Just Use Mats only to craft from a NPC or dwarf(that is adequate lvl) then ppl would enjoy playing crafter dwarfs.
Id like to get more full drops, or maybe a price limit on items (ie. i will end up spending more on my B-grade weapon/armor for my sub, than I paid for my a-grade for my main) The economy on my server (lionna) is rediculas, a-grade helms just went to 100m+ again, and some items are selling for 800m+ and they are selling so fast the stores cant keep up with it. for me a lvl 75 gladiator, who still cant afford full a-grade jewels, and support a sub class, I think higher drop rates would help to make up for that.
Isn't that a bit skewed though, since you usually level with Ple and he usually manors?
I know I was getting a lot more full drops on Faelir at almost level 50 than I was on Amathal at 24 - but then, Amathal was manoring at 25 (though he still got three full drops in all... huhu failed seeds).
If there's a Trick you guys know that yeild more full drops, please share it. Or at least share you drops.
I killed maybe 2k+ mobs yesterday in the span of 2.5 hours, not even a single **** recipe fell. I'm not even talking about the "good" recipes, I'm talking about the crappy ones.
However, if you don't want to share your 'trick' to getting mobs drop full items, or not going to give you drops to other people, quit whyning to NCsoft to Neft drops even more.
thats why the drop rate is screwed Admiral
i spend 4 days on a spingle spot to get 1 **** rec
i like a chalange but this is just to insane if you ask me
i like to work for my items but it must not be "inposable"
about full drops i hardly see a probleem about more full drops even if it drops 50% more people will still get full drops rarely but it will insanely boost the economics in this game becose it's now realy screwed if you ask me
Nameless, no discrespect, but you should quit posting such threads. If you have luck with drops, that's great for you. Others are not quite so lucky.
For example, for the past week I have been leveling in VoS like crazy. What do I have to show for it? 100 Blood medusa coins, 100+ Silver coins and a bunch of crap avadon/zubei mats. Not even enough mats to create 1 full item.
calm down man
this isnt a post about how leet lucky kick *** my necro is compared to my ws (since my ws got 2 full drops from 0-70+)
just stateing that a full drop every week is fine for a single player rpg but for a mmorg its essentially saying that half of your clan doesnt have to worry about equiping themselves
my original post might have been overboard saying that the drop rate is too high but its pretty far from unreasonable
for all those ppl that say "i havent got a full drop in X amount of months" i gotta ask
are you hunting mobs that actually drop something?
and what exactly does X amount of months mean? if you ask someone like splatter thats equivilent to like 500 mobs
checking an unmentionable site i see that the actually raised the drop rate this chronicle so back to the original question, what is a decent drop rate?
nameless1 i have been killing Frost Yeti's Lost Yeti's,Ursus cub's my last 4 levels do you wanna know what they droped ??
some doom mats now what the **** am i doing with that yesterday i was lucky they droped a W.tear Rec and i got 1 dam edge from it you call that good drop rates?????
i leveled from 56 to 60 their i think around 15,000 mosters is needed to kill for that level range
again... i spend about 5 hours a day grinding, hunting, questing, and i haven't gotten a full drop since i was nongrade, i don't really care (although would be nice to get a full drop) because i craft 99% of my stuff, and i hunted in hot springs for lvl 73-75...now that's a lot of mobs (not sure the exact amount) but all i got was aobut 14 bloody orchid heads and 10 blody tornado heads...
i'm sure eventually i'll get a drop at some point, but like i siad, peopl ave luck in this game, it just depens on what that luck is: mine is OEing weapons, one of my clannies is crafting B-S grade items, another clannies is getting spoils(good spoils) another is getting some drops, another is magic critting,
just because you have no luck with drops, don't mean you don't have luck
edit: please don't judge my spelling, i'm using a laptop and i find it hard to type on these things
Okay, simple solution other than Drops for your Economic Stimulation... Remove all Adena from Lineage 2. All characters, all warehouses, every single piece. Let people start over from 0 Adena. From there lower the Adena that Mobs drop, and actually take action against Bots.
So far that strategy has righted the economic structure of Everquest, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, and Final Fantasy XI.
You get alot of irritated players for a bit, but to be honest, items should -not- cost Millions of Adena. No offense to those involved, but the only way to obtain the insane prices that you have to have to even make a 'living' in Lineage 2 is to get it from those who Bot, or those who bought it from those who Bot, or atleast somewhere down the road. I have no problem with bots, but the botting structure of Lineage 2 has screwed its economy... eh.
Well, to be honest, having played for several years, I have had 1 full drop of my own (plate shield) which was nice, don't get me wrong, but not all that exciting...
I've had a few good drops in parties, which we have usually crystalized or sold and split the profit, (included b-grade light armor, a decent b-grade blunt, and something else I can't realy remember)...
that all sounds nice but split the profit 2-6 ways and its almost more work than its worth...
I think that NCSoft should implement a system whereby the drops you get are proportional to the number of kills you have (duh, sound like what we have... but it's not). As things stand now, an item may have a 1:1 billion chance of dropping from a mob... but that doesn't mean that it will.... you could kill 10 billion mobs and never get a ****ed thing... that's luck, terrible as it is... and some people have it, some people don't...
Now I am not counting no-grade drops... mostly becouse none of they are typically just junk...maybe 5-6k for a standard no-grade drop, and that's about the same as a c-grade key mat, so not realy worth note... so not counting no-grade... I do feel a bit cheated with a single full drop in almost 3 years, and 3 full drops aplit amongst 2-6 people...
that being said, if everyone got a full drop every two days, then it wouldn't be exciting, and the economy would fall apart...
I guess what I am saying is, it sucks to have crappy luck and not get drops, but don't get your hopes up for change... it won't happen... for many good reasons...
I have had a couple of full drops in my time on Lineage 2, however that honestly has been since open Beta, so now that I think about it... strange. Perhaps a simple shift in the rarity of the drops, perhaps an average of once a month or so...
Isn't that a bit skewed though, since you usually level with Ple and he usually manors?
Yeah, but in C4 we didn't have seeds because Rune didn't have a castle then, and our animatronic friends had the manor pretty well locked down, so we had six months without doing the manor at all.
Ah - I wasn't seeding too much on Mielle due to nuking (I wish the pony could seed on its own :p ) throughout C Grade... but didn't get any full drops either.
I think at that time it was still heavily influenced by time of the day though - if the medal event was any indication, that's fixed now - right?
There are really two big problems which are ruining the economy, in terms of drops and drop rates, (well really 4, but explaining how ss use a chance to fail crafting create inflation is not pertinent to the topic).
Before actually beginning, let me clearify by explaining that I treat the low end of an equipment grade and the high end of an equipment grade as two seperate grades, so low b and high b are not simply b.
The first problem is that the level of mobs a player hunts, drop parts, recipes and full item drops at least 1 and a half grade levels lower than the player can use. This prevents any person from trying to go out and farm either for the recipes and parts to craft the item, or simply trying to farm for the full item drop. Therefore whenever a player does get one of these drops, and because the drops have a probability of dropping such that the player is likely to only ever be able to construct one full item using nothing but drops between traveling from one equipment grade to the next, this player is motivated or required to sell this item closer to the price of the item they really want to buy is. Such to say that if a player farms level 59 mobs until they are level 61, when they will just be able to use a grade equipment, they are only getting low b grade drops. If they happen to construct one lwo b grade item from all that farming, they are not going to want to sell that item cheaply, but rather they are going to want to sell it as the highest possible price which will allow them to buy low A grade. Whereas if a player who was in high grade were getting low B grade drops, they would be selling the items cheaply because they would correlate precisely to the grade of items they would be buying to replace their current set, and so being able to make a doom glove is synonymous to being able to make a blue wolf glove, and the player would price the item according to its equivalent item grade price because they are looking to exchange the doom glove for a blue wolf glove, and not looking to exchange an avadon glove for a dark crystal glove. So long as players are not getting or able to make the items of the same grade they have just entered or are going to enter, there will always be upwards pressure on the price of items above a fair ecxhange price because they items will be priced at the level where they closely equate what the item grade the seller is trying to buy with the item earned from selling the lower grade item. And as the difference between item drops and equipment grade of the player increases, the magnitude of the problem increases.
Thus a player who is trying to equip themselves in high A grade armor, is simply not going to be able to afford several if not all of the parts because the mobs which drop the items are between levels 76 and 80, and the players who are of a level where hunthing those mobs is efficient, are both scarce and number and trying to buy S grade equipment, whcih only drops from raid bosses and boss mobs. Therefore any item or part drop they get, is priced according to what will allow them to most easily afford their S grade. Hence we now a sufficient explanation as to why making A grade helm recipes both droppable and spoilable actually resulted in the helms becoming more expensive rather than less expensive. I have to admit, when I first logged back in a few weeks after the patch had gone live, I was baffled to see A grade helms going for at least 20 million more than they had gone for previously.
And essentially, this is no different from saying that disallowing players to hunt for the parts and recipes of the equipment they are going to want to use essentiually creates an oligopoly in the markets for these items.
Even if drops became more frequent, without fixing the above problem, it would be impossible to actually fix the market without setting the probability so high that the market essentially bottoms out and the items become worthless. This threshold point is much lower than once a week, but possibly higher than once a month. Now I will say that with the current low probability, the game could be made more fun by increasing the rate of some item falling, but this need not be a full item drop. Rather, it would be far easier to simply raise the rate at which recipes and parts drop, allowing a player to craft an item maybe once every month using just the parts and recipes they have acquired from normal grinding. Or if we do find that getting items more frequently makes the game that much more fun, one could always add another equippable item type or modify an existing type so that it gives bonuses when it wouldn't have regurlary done so before. By keeping the bonuses small, and by having a lot of items with different bonuses covering everything from increased sleep or stun resistance to increased mp regeneration rates or very small increase in one stat (somehwere between 1/4 and 1/2). These items would allow a player to get an item drop once a week, but be varied and ineffective enough to prevent the game from becoming too imbalanced.
I dunno, I get so frustrated reading these threads.
L2 has so many problems, the games difficulty and hardcoreness is both the reason why people like it and the reason bots, Ebayers, farmers, etc run rampant.
The harder you make a game, the harder it is to get ahead in the game, the more inclined people will be to cheat. And the further the gap between casual, or less intense players, and the extreme players.
Make the game too layed back and easy and it loses one of the only things it has going for it..Oddly. L2 doesn't have a lot of fun content (fun quests, games, etc) most of L2s excitement comes from improving your character, getting stronger, and fighting over politics and real estate. (which is good in theory, till Ebayers, botters, etc get into the mix). Plus if the game was made easier we would have to endure the onslaught of WoW phobic posters crying.
I don't think we need full drops weekly, monthly, or hardly ever. But I don't think it would hurt to see more parts and recipes dropping. Maybe even more mats too.
I also think that the top grade parts and recipes (especially for the lower grades) should be farmable closer to the lvl at which they would be needed. There just isn't the large playerbase at these lvls which is needed to soften the prices.
This message board has the same group of people who go to bat for the company every time I come here to read. I guarantee you that some of you guys like the message board better than playing this game.
"As for full drops... I haven't had any, and I can't honestly say I feel I'm missing out."
*****, is all I can say to that. . . . . I don't need drops, I'm just rolling in adena soloing with boxer on my ES.
"You'll always be broke. The people that make good money actively buy and sell."
And all the adena they make buying and selling is legit. Hell yeah, none of it comes from adenainc. Right, let them shut down all the illegal activity in the game and your *** will be out farming where you belong.
"so ppl think you should get a full item of your grade every week? seems abit extreme and WOWish doesnt it?"
That is the sound that a Cessna makes when a Boeing 747 passes it. 10% market share vrs 52.9%
"For example, for the past week I have been leveling in VoS like crazy. What do I have to show for it? 100 Blood medusa coins, 100+ Silver coins and a bunch of crap avadon/zubei mats. Not even enough mats to create 1 full item."
Now look in the next room. What do you see there? Look real hard and you will see a bounty hunter leading about 5 treasure hunters, all bristling with daggers and flowing like a ribbon. Then in the back of the pack, why there is an SE, PP and a bishop; all buffing in harmony. Now that dude (and I can't emphasize enough that there is not an "S" on dude) that dude has got the bases covered. That Dude knows who to make money in this game. Why he doesn't even get tired.
All weapon and armor mats need to be spoil only. The game needs higher spoil rates. At the current rates; the game can't operate without the Dude mentioned above.
Now that's good stuff. :cool: Must add "Dude" to my all time favorite names for those "automated for profit" types.
However I have to disagree that weapon and armor mats should be spoil only. But just in case someone in NCSoftland takes that to heart, I guess my next re-roll will be a BH.
*****, is all I can say to that. . . . . I don't need drops, I'm just rolling in adena soloing with boxer on my ES.
Actually, I'm playing as an EE/PP now.
I'm not exactly 'rolling in it' either (I'm far from affording my B Grade - I think after I sell off my D Grade I'll have around 20 mil and 5 mil in crystals - but then, I'm not there yet), but I know I'll have the money when I get there.
It's part of the charm of the game that things don't fall in your lap. This isn't guildwars, there isn't a 'get me to level 75' button, and as someone who enjoys the market and all its little nasties, I don't understand why people are so very desperate to try to ruin it.
And all the adena they make buying and selling is legit. Hell yeah, none of it comes from adenainc. Right, let them shut down all the illegal activity in the game and your *** will be out farming where you belong.
That's right - the market adapts and creates more earning possibilities when third party adena enters it. A self-fixing system that actually can survive a mechanic like that, isn't it just plain out horrible?
Just because a game is more popular (market share) it isn't necessarily better. I would have thought the box office success of holywood movies would have taught us that much.
All materials need not be spoil-only, but spoiling needs to be the fastest way to get materials - and all materials and recipes need to be spoilable.
I'm sure expanding the manor system further wouldn't hurt either, right now with the caps not enough people can really take advantage of it.