This is not intended to be a suggestion in the first place, nor a open discussion for players. If this is the wrong subforum, please move this thread where it belongs.
Well. The question I have is pretty simple: Why does the gamedesign doesnt allow players to restart while fighting epic raidbosses?
Well. For people that organize these epic raids, its a rather terrible gaming-experience to see thier perfectly plan raid-force crumble to something that gets beaten up badly.
To take Valakas as an example, you can expect that between 5-10% of the people you start the raid with disconnect per hour due to critical errors, ISP-problems and similar issues . Depending on the class that disconnect, the effect to the raid can be significant and lead to retreating. Just imagine Groups facing the damageoutput of a dragon after the main healer disconnected.
Unfortunatly, the ingame customer support can't react on this problems properly. I guess it is obvious that its a little to late when you get the "answer to your problem" per email a day or two later.
So. Are there any changes planed? Will the customersupport be adviced to assist the raidleader to keep thier force intact? What is NCSoft's point of view here?
This is not intended to be a suggestion in the first place, nor a open discussion for players. If this is the wrong subforum, please move this thread where it belongs.
It belongs in a PM to someone at NCSoft then. This forum is for players. Since you do not want this, it does not belong on the forums at all.
well. Thats basically an assumption. As far as i know, there is no official statment form NCSoft concerning this matter. Maybe this can turn into a discussion how to solve this problems for the raid-organizers in a matter that avoids
unwanted player-behavior but leaves the option for disconnected people to rejoin the raid.
An option my alliance could accept, would be to allow reconnecting in the raid-area as dead body including a 4% XP lost.
Disconnects, lag and the like are part and parcel of life in an MMO.
Let me turn the situation around for you, and show you why things are the way they are.
You, a non-Recalling class, and 500 of your closest friends decide that it's time to "kill the dragon". You mount up, go in, do the deed, and are picking through the loot when disaster strikes. You Disconnect! Horror! At the same time, a car runs into the utility pole outside your house and you lose electricity for 12 hours.
Finally, power is restored, you log into the game again. Now, as it is right now, you reappear in the closest city to the area in which you disconnected. If this wasn't the case, you reappear in the lair of the creature... but you forgot to bring SOEs with you! Doh! You're alone, in the lair, perhaps with the respawned boss (perhaps not) and absolutely no way to get home without dying and taking an XP hit and a potential death penalty (in the old days, an XP hit and a chance to drop half the gear on your person).
Thank the gods they respawn you in town...
Now, I would agree that there should be a time limit before the server sends you back to town, say 30 minutes. If you reconnect to the server within that time frame, you reappear exactly where you were.
The way I see it, the proposed rule allows a clan or ally to camp toons in the area of a particular Boss who are min/maxed to offer the best possible chance for a successful kill and best loots from the Boss in question, they simply log a toon in to check the spawn and, if it's up, log in the Raid toons and take the kill, avoiding the necessary fight through whatever lair precedes the Boss (ie, you camp an entire raid outside Baium's door and 1 toon right in front of him, and check in now and then to see if he's up).
To me, the proposition seems to favor raid-farming more than anything else, or can easily be exploited to do so.
If this wasn't the case, you reappear in the lair of the creature... but you forgot to bring SOEs with you! Doh! You're alone, in the lair, perhaps with the respawned boss (perhaps not) and absolutely no way to get home without dying and taking an XP hit and a potential death penalty
If this wasn't the case, you reappear in the lair of the creature... but you forgot to bring SOEs with you! Doh! You're alone, in the lair, perhaps with the respawned boss (perhaps not) and absolutely no way to get home without dying and taking an XP hit and a potential death penalty
/unstuck ;)
Who gets to use /unstuck in a hostile area without taking aggro and getting interrupted?
Well first of all, the 30min - relog rule is already applied to:
- Antharas
- Baium
But NCSoft decided for some reason to make Valakas Lair a-non-30min-rule zone. Basicly, if you disconnect or whatever. You are back in town. This entire utter noncense, if you apply 30min relog rule for Anthy and Baium, then why not for Valakas aswell ????
I petitioned few times about this, but never got a real answer back other then: "We cannot give info out bla blabla, game designs been made like this bla bla"
Obviously the designer of Valakas lair just was drunk and forgot the 30min variable possibly.
And thats not the only problem for Valakas. You can only raid it with 200 people. 200 only ! While for Antharas you can bring like 1000 people.
We tried it on Teon Valakas before the patch came out where I did as a poor mage only 50 damage. And we started with raid force of 184, and after hour only 150 were left. and after 2 hours of battle and Valakas at 50% HP We had raid force of 110 or so. It was impossible to even deal damage because all the crashed people could not get back into the fight.
The rule already excists my dear thread starter, but it doesn't counts for Valakas ( don't know frintezza yet, prolly same as Valakas )
Man. I dont know. I think you are just making up stuff and actually you are terrible at it.
See. Like your "a car hit my powersupply"-example. What can I say. Every Raidboss has a 10 (frintezza) to 30 minute timer to make the raidboss appear or in case of Baium a trigger (talk to the statue) to wake it. So yeah. If you would log in 12 hour past your disconnect, you are save.
As for raidfarmers:Antharas Valakas and Frintezza? No way farmers can do that. Baium. As if disconnecting would make a difference.
You dear Sir have maybe hear about epic raid, you havent been in one tho.
What did you expect by posting on a community forum and declaring "no one respond, please." How's being stupid working out for you?
I would have avoided you official board beasts if I could. I would have choosen the way of a direct PM if I wasnt aware that Mystrl, Spam or whoever would reply to me would forward me to the customer servic. The customer servic would answer me that they cant comment on the ingame design and the thoughts of the developers.
I am actually not interested what players assume NCSofts intention might be when they designed the Epics like they did. I am hope in respectiv to the guildline of the suggestion-forum that this topic might draw the attention of an official and might give the community a readout on NCSofts point of view.
Well first of all, the 30min - relog rule is already applied to:
- Antharas
- Baium
But NCSoft decided for some reason to make Valakas Lair a-non-30min-rule zone. Basicly, if you disconnect or whatever. You are back in town. This entire utter noncense, if you apply 30min relog rule for Anthy and Baium, then why not for Valakas aswell ????
I petitioned few times about this, but never got a real answer back other then: "We cannot give info out bla blabla, game designs been made like this bla bla"
Obviously the designer of Valakas lair just was drunk and forgot the 30min variable possibly.
And thats not the only problem for Valakas. You can only raid it with 200 people. 200 only ! While for Antharas you can bring like 1000 people.
We tried it on Teon Valakas before the patch came out where I did as a poor mage only 50 damage. And we started with raid force of 184, and after hour only 150 were left. and after 2 hours of battle and Valakas at 50% HP We had raid force of 110 or so. It was impossible to even deal damage because all the crashed people could not get back into the fight.
The rule already excists my dear thread starter, but it doesn't counts for Valakas ( don't know frintezza yet, prolly same as Valakas )
Pretty much the same situation here.
We /gm:ed to get our members ported back to the raid and got told that such service would not be provided.
As far has I know, valakas has been only taken down twice and antharas (since the new relog-rule applies) not at all.
I doubt the reason is that allainces are actually not strong enough to make attempts that lead to success. It more that a raidforces get crippled to 2/3s and raidleaders have to call it off.
I would have choosen the way of a direct PM if I wasnt aware that Mystrl, Spam or whoever would reply to me would forward me to the customer servic. The customer servic would answer me that they cant comment on the ingame design and the thoughts of the developers.
Did you actually try this or just make useless assumptions? I don't know about you but I've always gotten responses from them and have never been told to just go to customer service.
I am actually not interested what players assume NCSofts intention might be when they designed the Epics like they did. I am hope in respectiv to the guildline of the suggestion-forum that this topic might draw the attention of an official and might give the community a readout on NCSofts point of view.
Too bad. Perhaps a lively discussion of it might have given some things that you might not have thought of; right or wrong. I don't know why you find this unwanted.
You cant help me.
I tried to on my first post. You ignored it. Your loss.
I would have choosen the way of a direct PM if I wasnt aware that Mystrl, Spam or whoever would reply to me would forward me to the customer servic. The customer servic would answer me that they cant comment on the ingame design and the thoughts of the developers.
Did you actually try this or just make useless assumptions? I don't know about you but I've always gotten responses from them and have never been told to just go to customer service.
Mails with the supportcenter and ingame petiton.
I am actually not interested what players assume NCSofts intention might be when they designed the Epics like they did. I am hope in respectiv to the guildline of the suggestion-forum that this topic might draw the attention of an official and might give the community a readout on NCSofts point of view.
Too bad. Perhaps a lively discussion of it might have given some things that you might not have thought of; right or wrong. I don't know why you find this unwanted.
Well. See what happens, I dont see the "How NCSoft protects my character from XP-lost in case a car hits my powersupply" actually is gonna help. I dont know what enlightening informations players can provide on what NCSoft intents with the no-relog rule.
You cant help me.
I tried to on my first post. You ignored it. Your loss.
whatever.
Edit. Im bad with quoteing and to lazy to fix it :(
Being moved back to town if you re-log during an "epic" boss fight is currently by design:
If a player is disconnected or restarts while in battle with Antharas, Zaken, Baium, Anakim, Lilith, Valakas, or Frintezza their character will be transported to the nearest town. If the player disconnection is caused by a server crash, the player will not be returned to town upon login if they reconnect within 30 minutes.
This note not originally included in the Chronicle 5 feature notes due to an accidental oversight, but it is in there now to let everyone know that this is how it is intended. The GM team is typically unable to intervene if this occurs during a raid.
I don't have any information about if this will be changed in the future. We understand that it can be rough losing your raid force in the middle of a raid due to accidental disconnections, and we are definitely open to feedback (constructive feedback :p) about this mechanic.
what about the 4 sepulchers? we were doing it last night and upon entering the final room for the raid boss everyone in the party critical error'd (ncsofts fault). why are these rooms no restart areas?
Being moved back to town if you re-log during an "epic" boss fight is currently by design:
If a player is disconnected or restarts while in battle with Antharas, Zaken, Baium, Anakim, Lilith, Valakas, or Frintezza their character will be transported to the nearest town. If the player disconnection is caused by a server crash, the player will not be returned to town upon login if they reconnect within 30 minutes.
This note not originally included in the Chronicle 5 feature notes due to an accidental oversight, but it is in there now to let everyone know that this is how it is intended. The GM team is typically unable to intervene if this occurs during a raid.
I don't have any information about if this will be changed in the future. We understand that it can be rough losing your raid force in the middle of a raid due to accidental disconnections, and we are definitely open to feedback (constructive feedback :p) about this mechanic.
Thanks for the clearification.
Can you elaborate what unwanted behavior the new relog-rule is intended to prevent? For a constructiv discussion that would help.
Also, NCSoft-US is polly bound to the parameters giving from the korean mothercompany,is there any way to approach the costomer-support to get players back to the raid? The ingame support so far wasnt of any use, sadly.
Being moved back to town if you re-log during an "epic" boss fight is currently by design:
If a player is disconnected or restarts while in battle with Antharas, Zaken, Baium, Anakim, Lilith, Valakas, or Frintezza their character will be transported to the nearest town. If the player disconnection is caused by a server crash, the player will not be returned to town upon login if they reconnect within 30 minutes.
This note not originally included in the Chronicle 5 feature notes due to an accidental oversight, but it is in there now to let everyone know that this is how it is intended. The GM team is typically unable to intervene if this occurs during a raid.
I don't have any information about if this will be changed in the future. We understand that it can be rough losing your raid force in the middle of a raid due to accidental disconnections, and we are definitely open to feedback (constructive feedback :p) about this mechanic.
Rough? You make it sound like people can get back there and keep fighting. It was rough when people dc and came back 10 min later. Now it is a total waste of time if the wrong class disconnect...
I know this wasn't very constructive but I really don't care.. The old 30 min rule was perfect and should apply to every epic boss out there. And if healing the bosses was such a big issue make it a bannable offense instead of making stupid game designs.
Wasn't it one time that whoever wanted to do epic raid, petitioned it to have GM support at that raid in such cases? I remember GM appeared "in person" on Antharas or Valakas raid. And they HAD massive crits - same as when you are ported out of castle during siege.
What the big ****** with baium is the random lag where everyone's FPS is pushed to 1-5. Relogging used to fix this, but now if you relog you're forced to town... that, or you can continue to raid baium at 2 frames per second. Until the critical errors are fixed, and there isn't random perfornace lag in the middle of a raid, valakas, antharas, and baium are pretty much not worth it.
Frintezza works pretty well, though. Not as many crashes at that boss.
Being moved back to town if you re-log during an "epic" boss fight is currently by design:
If a player is disconnected or restarts while in battle with Antharas, Zaken, Baium, Anakim, Lilith, Valakas, or Frintezza their character will be transported to the nearest town. If the player disconnection is caused by a server crash, the player will not be returned to town upon login if they reconnect within 30 minutes.
This note not originally included in the Chronicle 5 feature notes due to an accidental oversight, but it is in there now to let everyone know that this is how it is intended. The GM team is typically unable to intervene if this occurs during a raid.
I don't have any information about if this will be changed in the future. We understand that it can be rough losing your raid force in the middle of a raid due to accidental disconnections, and we are definitely open to feedback (constructive feedback :p) about this mechanic.
Pretty sure my constructive feedback would be: We should definitely have the 30 minute rule, and if we don't, an explanation on the logic behind it would be nice. If L2 was a game where people DIDN'T crash or d/c almost every single high end raid boss, it would be one thing. But that's not the case.
Cant you trie and use the summon thing we got in C5; so you can teleport back to the raid?
Taken from the official patchnotes. Ill highlight the important part on this matter.
New Skills
Skills that summon party members have been added.
The “Summon Friend” skill, which enables a Summoner to summon party members, has been added. Elemental Summoners, Phantom Summoners, and Warlocks can acquire this skill at level 56. Spellbooks can be acquired as drops from monsters and at the Magic Stores of Rune Township and the Town of Goddard. These items are sold at a certain time at a certain rate.
The character summoned must have the Summoning Crystal. Summoning Crystals can be purchased at a town grocer.
You cannot summon party members to battle grounds, certain raid boss regions , and the Olympiad Stadium. You cannot summon party members who are engaged in combat or dead.
More party summoning classes will be added in a later update.
I assume that Antharas Baium etc are ment with "certain Raidbosses". So this is not the solution here.
On the other hand, the no-relog rule gets around a griefer (or griefers) who cast the percentage-heal spell on the boss and then camp out to allow the spell to cool and reload...
... so it has its uses.
Can you elaborate what unwanted behavior the new relog-rule is intended to prevent? For a constructiv discussion that would help.
to prevent farmer from farming epic boss
for example @ Lilith raid
1 month ago woworedfiretruck(raid farmer clan) used to do it with 2 party, log in, spam all MP on Lilith, log out while tank UD . and die. Log in, regen MP, rest tank, rinse and repeat. They have to do this quite a few times but in the end they got the boss.