Well I'm in the UK and as I left for work this morning there was an ad on TV for an online game - WOW.
It was quite interesting, sort of got my attention but the thing that I thought about most was this - WOW are using what I am guessing are clips from their online videos showing aspects of the game. It is brief and shows a couple of characters and a bit of fighting.
If NC used the same principle using clips from their videos - Frintezza, Antharas, Baium etc along with clips from character action, seiges etc they would totally walk all over WOW.
NC's videos are by far much much more impressive. Being as WOW are doing this (or so it appears) to advertise the fact that they are offering free trials (it's almost Christmas) surely NC should be doing the same thing. I have never to this day seen any advertising for L2 in the UK and wouldn't know anything about it apart from one person happening to play it where my BF works.
It's a shame that this isn't done. I know that TV advertising is expensive, however a lot of the work is already done, it just needs adpating. L2 is a really great game, it's about time NC shouted out the fact.
It's okay, we have 8 "NA" servers and I have never seen a commercial or ad for Lineage in the US. It's a shame really, the game is still beautiful after all these years. And while there are some problems, they can be fixed.
I always see WOW ad in PC Games magazines, and webs but I never see a L2 ad.
I'm totally agree, L2 is a really great game and a nice marketing campaign would be the indicated in this season.
I've seen a bunch of L2 ads - but not too much. My brother came up to me playing once and wouldn't believe that it's an old game. It does look good, and more people for more tension and PvP might actually make it a lot of a better game, too. :p
WoW owes alot of its success to a massive marketting effort. Something that other MMORPG companies really don't want to commit to.
I can think of several reasons why NCSoft would chose to only market Lineage 2 in a very light manner. But its sad they do so, Lineage 2 could be so many times larger.
Hitting 100,000 subscribers isn't really a success considering what Lineage 2 offers :(
Of course it wouldn't have those numbers, but it could easily be 10 times bigger than it is now.
Casual players could play L2 as well, there's just rarely anything to do and too few players to do it with at the lower levels...all people see are the weird named people running around in circles and then they just walk around bored with little to do.
Casual players can play this game only if they give up on being competitive with the "movers and shakers" and just "have fun".
But many people play games so that they can be part of the "action" so to speak. It really is hard to do that in this game where so many people are 60+ or more.
L2 won't work with casual players for the most part. First and foremost reason is that it requires a lot more patience than any other game out there, and patience is something gamers lack these days. And open PvP, while being the thing that draws players into the game is also the thing that drives many off. I myself am one of those casual players who enjoy themselves just playing the game, having the occasional skirmish and a bit of verbal acrobacy afterwards, but generally the weight of the opinions of the general populace is oppressive to say the least. It seems to be unconceiveable to most that someone wouldn't have any practical reason to aim for the top position, since there's fun to have at almost every stage of the game. Oh no, it has to be that hero glow, by any means possible.
The problem with advertising L2 as a player versus player game is that it draws the wrong crowd (in my opinion) of immature ADHD children who want everything this very instant and don't mind spending their (parents') money to be teh bestest evar. This is already evident on any given server, with the majority of population being of the mentality that merely wants to "pwn" everything, with little regard to anything else. Cheaters thrive, and anyone trying to do a fresh legit start now would soon become exasperated beyond belief with the automated pals that seem to be the only thing living in the newbie areas.
Now, if they advertised the game as MMORPG instead of the MMOG it is now, and drew in the RP crowd in sufficient numbers things might change.. Roleplayers don't necessarily abhor PvP, and they're much more fun to be around than the usual ROFLOL!-people. Not that this'd ever happen.. *sigh*
I don't entirely agree that TV advertising wouldn't work. As with most things in life getting someone's attention is the first step.
Take for example a really well put together film clip - if it's done well you want to watch the rest of it.
Although I agree that the game style is very different, without first getting the audience there is no chance of them trying a new way to play. My post was mainly suggesting that NC should have some form of marketing campaign and that I feel TV is an excellent medium. If the offer of a trial is there then there is at least a chance that the new players will get used to the game style and stay - without any advertising word of mouth is the only option and I sadly don't know a few 100,000 people to help get the numbers up :(
Casual players can play this game only if they give up on being competitive with the "movers and shakers" and just "have fun".
But many people play games so that they can be part of the "action" so to speak. It really is hard to do that in this game where so many people are 60+ or more.
Which they only do because
1. There's too few people = it becomes a boring grind.
2. Lack of low end content.
You got to remember that its actually pretty fun and easy to play in Lineage 2, its just really complicated by the fact that people log in and very few are on, very few to play with, everyone is doing high end content.
I don't entirely agree that TV advertising wouldn't work. As with most things in life getting someone's attention is the first step.
Take for example a really well put together film clip - if it's done well you want to watch the rest of it.
Although I agree that the game style is very different, without first getting the audience there is no chance of them trying a new way to play. My post was mainly suggesting that NC should have some form of marketing campaign and that I feel TV is an excellent medium. If the offer of a trial is there then there is at least a chance that the new players will get used to the game style and stay - without any advertising word of mouth is the only option and I sadly don't know a few 100,000 people to help get the numbers up :(
Ok, well, yes you are 100% correct that TV advertising will get people's attention. The art design to this game is so superior to a lot that is out there of the same genre. No argument there.
And they will try the game out. But I don't think many will stay.
When I show my few gamers friends what I do in L2 they roll their eyes. Then I tell them (and explain to them) that it is open pvp and they say "forget it.
And these aren't pansies in real life by any stretch of the imagination. Definitely not metrosexuals such as myself (to a certain extent :) )
You underestimate people. Many don't really care about it or actually think the high end PvP is fun, especially now that you don't drop gear. Just need to lay it out differently, there's alot to this game outside of PvP, in fact its possible to play for years without PvP'ing and heck even possible to go through the entire game without a single war.
You underestimate people. Many don't really care about it or actually think the high end PvP is fun, especially now that you don't drop gear. Just need to lay it out differently, there's alot to this game outside of PvP, in fact its possible to play for years without PvP'ing and heck even possible to go through the entire game without a single war.
I don't think I'm underestimating them at all.
After trying a variety of online games that more casual or "regular people" would be playing, I have to say that L2 just isn't there.
Yes, it is possible to play this game without a single war or pvp but I venture to say "why"? Grinding just for the sake of grinding and then chatting to people while you do it might be fun for some. I can see that. But I just don't see many people signing on to what then becomes an online chatroom with great graphics.
Yes, it's true that I hate/despise/loathe L2 quests. But even if I was to be a bit neutral on the whole affair, other games do quests better.
So then again, without any interest in pvp it goes back to the question of "why".
Of course, you can make your own fun. If you just love the market and buying, selling, crafting (not to maline) then yeah, this game could scratch that itch.
But what else is there? Fishing? That's pretty repetitive. Grinding is relaxing but most people don't play these games to relax "per se". They want to be part of a dynamic online world where they quest and vanquish foes, etc.
I just don't see the L2 world offering any grand adventures outside of the politics, clan wars, sieges.
I really do think that other games cover that stuff better.
And what player who is not interested in pvp is going to be a good sport when they and their party gets wiped out by a stronger alliance who wants that spot? Most casual players find that annoying.
PvP is only a flex of PvE muscle, as I keep saying - in the end, you compete even if you "only" grind - to get to top level is a good motivation for many people, getting 'this and that armour', beating XY boss, exploring this or that dungeon... there are many goals.
I've tried other games for roleplaying too - poor lore, and poorer RP environments, all over - except in Korean grind-o-matics, for some obscure reason.
What's the point of the PvP? No really - there isn't one any more than for the PvE.
You underestimate people. Many don't really care about it or actually think the high end PvP is fun, especially now that you don't drop gear. Just need to lay it out differently, there's alot to this game outside of PvP, in fact its possible to play for years without PvP'ing and heck even possible to go through the entire game without a single war.
I don't think I'm underestimating them at all.
After trying a variety of online games that more casual or "regular people" would be playing, I have to say that L2 just isn't there.
Yes, it is possible to play this game without a single war or pvp but I venture to say "why"? Grinding just for the sake of grinding and then chatting to people while you do it might be fun for some. I can see that. But I just don't see many people signing on to what then becomes an online chatroom with great graphics.
Yes, it's true that I hate/despise/loathe L2 quests. But even if I was to be a bit neutral on the whole affair, other games do quests better.
So then again, without any interest in pvp it goes back to the question of "why".
Of course, you can make your own fun. If you just love the market and buying, selling, crafting (not to maline) then yeah, this game could scratch that itch.
But what else is there? Fishing? That's pretty repetitive. Grinding is relaxing but most people don't play these games to relax "per se". They want to be part of a dynamic online world where they quest and vanquish foes, etc.
I just don't see the L2 world offering any grand adventures outside of the politics, clan wars, sieges.
I really do think that other games cover that stuff better.
I see both of your points.
What I would say is that to make it more interesting to new players takes time and money. Some content could be changed or added to keep the potential initial new players (that discussion is for another thread), but it all still comes back to advertising in the first place.
Without the new players there is no money coming into the game to aid the work required to keep the old and attract the new - people need to know this game exists somehow.
And I do agree that it is surprising just how many people would give this game a go if they knew about it. There are areas that need work and there are lots that don't. It is a varied game and I do believe has a huge potential to be massive, NC needs to let people know they are here.
Enough of debate. Lets get some real life examples.
I show some friends of mine a Antharas raid video. They are like "oo aww" then they ask how long would it take to get to do that. I tell them honestly around 4-5 months hardcore and about 6months to a year casual. That shuts the door right there. NCSoft doesn't rush you through the lower levels, theres just nothing to do there so you just exp to 6x. Theres almost nothing significant you can do or add to the high end economy until you are level 6x+.
After trying a variety of online games that more casual or "regular people" would be playing, I have to say that L2 just isn't there.
I've had lots of casual players play Lineage 2 and they love it...why do they quit? Because there's noone to play with. Sure they can tag along level 75+ characters or drag existing players along on alts, but there's nothing else for them really.
This is why every feels they just have to mad dash for the top, not because thats all there is, but because thats where the players are.
Yes, it's true that I hate/despise/loathe L2 quests. But even if I was to be a bit neutral on the whole affair, other games do quests better.
They aren't all that bad, but they start reminding you of a single player game and people who start out become lost and all they have for company is "iri4ewjij" and "kork4oijfk".
I just don't see the L2 world offering any grand adventures outside of the politics, clan wars, sieges.
There's lots of adventure and exploring in the game, so many awesome jawdropping areas. But again, Cruma Tower just doesn't hold much if you're just going there on your own and there's little to no life there.
Enough of debate. Lets get some real life examples.
I show some friends of mine a Antharas raid video. They are like "oo aww" then they ask how long would it take to get to do that. I tell them honestly around 4-5 months hardcore and about 6months to a year casual. That shuts the door right there. NCSoft doesn't rush you through the lower levels, theres just nothing to do there so you just exp to 6x. Theres almost nothing significant you can do or add to the high end economy until you are level 6x+.
And thats your mistake right there, show them the videos of the content at all levels, not just the endgame.
There's lots to do at lower levels, many areas to explore, monsters that a new player has never seen to see. We just push it all up to the top like thats all that matters.
Heck, its the other way around, you could literally destroy every character at the very top and it would have less impact on the game overall than a steady new player flow.
Enough of debate. Lets get some real life examples.
I show some friends of mine a Antharas raid video. They are like "oo aww" then they ask how long would it take to get to do that. I tell them honestly around 4-5 months hardcore and about 6months to a year casual. That shuts the door right there. NCSoft doesn't rush you through the lower levels, theres just nothing to do there so you just exp to 6x. Theres almost nothing significant you can do or add to the high end economy until you are level 6x+.
Ahhh... too much to respond to.
well first off, I do think Vent has it. And yeah, there isn't much to do at lower lvls because there just aren't the players. More lower lvl players would mean more of what all of us went through when we first started. edit: One of my greatest L2 memories is being invited to one of my first groups so we could take down one of the Trees in the Dark Elf Swamp. Back then they were killable and would give xp. We got wiped but it was one of the single most thrilling experiences I've had in this game. So yeah, we need more players coming in who like this type of game.
Also, I had made a mistype. I meant to say "Nod to Maline" regarding Market as Maline is actually one of those players who enjoys L2 for other reasons.
And sure Lord O' Chaos, I think you make a very valid point with the feeling that the lower lvls get that solo feel gameplay.
Sadly, I've helped out a lot of new players but I don't think they are around anymore. They kind of got tired of "no one around".
I really don't think that L2 quests work well. You never know what your reward is. you don't gain xp for each leg of the quest. Too much running of course. And in some cases a bit too much gambling for my taste.
I'm tempted to make a poll (of sorts) and fine out what quests people absolutely loved and why.
But I still don't see players who are used to games such as Everquest 2 or WoW really liking L2's gamplay unless they are looking for something quite different. I could be "beyond the pale" wrong but having tried these games, I see why they are popular with people.
Of course there are some other factors such as built in playerbase because of WoW being a Blizzard game or players of Everquest seeing what II was about.
And unless they've added tons of new quests that I don't know about in the new player areas, what else is there to do and grind solo.
As Lord of Chaos says, people don't want to do that alone when they first join a game.
But I still don't see players who are used to games such as Everquest 2 or WoW really liking L2's gamplay unless they are looking for something quite different. I could be "beyond the pale" wrong but having tried these games, I see why they are popular with people.
I think people who play on WoW's PVP servers would enjoy the game more. I know that's how it is for me. The only turn-off for me with L2 is walking into the DE village and the 40 - 50 49fkgr4i's in the city running around like chickens with their heads cut off.
But I still don't see players who are used to games such as Everquest 2 or WoW really liking L2's gamplay unless they are looking for something quite different. I could be "beyond the pale" wrong but having tried these games, I see why they are popular with people.
I think people who play on WoW's PVP servers would enjoy the game more. I know that's how it is for me. The only turn-off for me with L2 is walking into the DE village and the 40 - 50 49fkgr4i's in the city running around like chickens with their heads cut off.
Seriously, I saw a horde of those dwarves on Saturday. Had I the time (was leaving to go out in the light) I was going to take a lvl 24 archer of mine and just pk them as they left the village. Hate those **** things.
But I still don't see players who are used to games such as Everquest 2 or WoW really liking L2's gamplay
Actually those are exactly the people whom I've been able to get over, people see the movies and go [censored] this looks awesome...but again, no players and lack of trials is a huge deterrent for people.
And its amplified by the difficoulties of people even getting to eachother and playing with eachother, when there's not so many people you'll outlevel eachother, move to different areas, porting costs drains you trying to get together with friends, etc.
You never know what your reward is.
Actually almost every quest from 1-60 is well documented on Stratics with up to date rewards, heh.
Its just us old timers thats used to "quests sucks", because they truly did once suck...heck, before C2 there wasn't even any quests above level 40. And those below were crappy for the most part.
Other than that, I can see where you're coming from.
Yeah, your right, the graphics are pretty much top notch. And that's ****ing with faint praise. The sieges themselves are so cool that I had people over to actually watch while we defended (was one of those huge sieges that got down to the last 5 minutes). They were "feeding" me beers while I played all the while marveling on the light show.
The monsters in this game blow every other game out of the water.
But the killing monsters over and over again without many quests involved gets old for players.
Though maybe you have a good point with the trials think. though that is a tough one because free trials are an invitation for the "mindless" to roam free.
And sure, the quests are on stratics (and thank god for that!) But many casual players are not going to even know stratics. Heck, many don't even know about this site. The idea that a player has to check a completely different site for the quest reward seems a bit ridiculous. Especially when the NPC can just offer that info to the player.
Seriously, how many of us do a job and not know what the reward is going to be afterward. "ok.. I'm going to cut all that wood and haul it up the river to pile it. I really hope I get paid 'something'" :p
But the killing monsters over and over again without many quests involved gets old for players.
Thats what you do in most games, the difference is that in most other games you have other people around to play with you and not just "jkfijjwik" and his buddies.
Abandoned Camp, Forgotten Temple, Soda, etc. All of these places are super cool to a newbie thats never been here before.
Though maybe you have a good point with the trials think. though that is a tough one because free trials are an invitation for the "mindless" to roam free.
And thats why I keep telling them to spend their energy on doing what other games do right, namely make limited trial accounts. People just want to try it out and they want life around them.
But many casual players are not going to even know stratics.
Heh, you would be surprised. But, that would rather easily be remidied by again emulating what some other good games do, promote the info on the site and the major fansites inside the game itself.
Seriously, how many of us do a job and not know what the reward is going to be afterward.
Of course, I agree. Information is the key...heck many newbies don't even know how to go about with the quests beyond the starting one and end up standing dumbfounded in a newbie village wonder what all those male dwarves are doing, heh.
But the killing monsters over and over again without many quests involved gets old for players.
Thats what you do in most games, the difference is that in most other games you have other people around to play with you and not just "jkfijjwik" and his buddies.
But I think the context of the quests are different. Why is it that I had no problem to WoW quests, and took every one of them I could get but every L2 quest I take I usually drop?
Now, I'm not saying WoW is a better game but I do think they do their quests "the right way".
Everything is clear, there isn't a huge amount of running, you can actually get a quest from a drop (a note, something that leads you to another quest, EQ 2 does this as well) and they are generally fun. But not ground breaking in any way.
But L2 quests always seem to dry for me, excess running, I have to check stratics to see if it is worth it and I usually just end up dropping the quest.
There really is a difference. But again, maybe I'm wrong. It is possible that WoW and EQ II players that come to this game don't mind the L2 quests. I would love to hear from some of them and see if this is true.
Maybe that's the answer. Throughout the whole of this thread there has been the underlying agreement that L2 needs more new players and NC needs to work at keeping them.
Newbies do use this forum and there are many regulars also. I've no doubt that many of them have used or come from other similar games. Maybe a list of questions should be asked as mentioned by Sovrath and Lord Chaos. A poll of likes and dislikes and why might be acted upon - probably not - but you never know.
Of course that comes back to the original post which is that NC needs to do more advertising and maybe TV advertising which will bring in new players.
So maybe that is it. Maybe, despite all my misgivings about TV advertising drawing in players who won't like this game, more players will equal better gameplay experience and any of the games shortcomings won't really matter.
Ok fine. I concede. NC, you may now go ahead and do some TV advertising. :p
Try and imagine one of the gameplay movies in the cinema *drools*
Oh, I love the gameplay movies. Heck, I know a guy who was a big EQ/EQ II fan and I made a cd of all the gameplay movies so he could see the game "I" played.
I read through this thread at work, but couldn't reply because I couldn't remember my password for the life of me >.<;
I've played FFXI for about 3 years, 2 of which have been spent at end-game. I also played WoW long enough to be in a guild that started up and got MC, BWL, ZG, and Ony on farm before AQ came out. I've played L2 sporatically for the past couple months (hardcore for about a month, now about 5-10 hours a week if that.)
I agree 100% with Sovrath's comparison of L2 quests to WoW's. To add FFXI into it, there are hundreds and hundreds of quests in that game. They often don't tell you what the reward will be ahead of time, and the descriptions are often vague. The strong point to that game's quest system vs. L2's is that virtually every quest has intro and outro cutscenes and possibly cutscenes in the middle too.
There are also a great deal of missions (new set for each expansion and 3 sets for the original game) and those are typically very involved, have elaborate cutscenes and often very difficult fights. The rewards for those are access to new areas (often the top end-game time sinks) and some fantastic gear. Of the three games I think that L2 loses out in the quest/mission department due to poor rewards (although C5 did a decent job of added more low and mid-level quests) and lack of anything to make them interesting. I often skip L2 quests because they slow down the grind, and the quests are typically just excuses to grind anyway.
On the issue of PvP, L2 wins big time. WoW's world PvP is virtually non-existant, and Battle Grounds PvP is often little more than a battle to see who can afk longer for points. FFXI's PvP came out a couple years after the game was released. It's pointless, horribly unbalanced, and is generally viewed as a total waste of time for anything other than figuring out exact effects of things like what how much the spell Slow affects a mob.
From playing FFXI for so long I am in love with PvE. That game has some truly epic battles, and has been very clever in finding new ways to have people work together. There are a number of things in the game that are on set timers so that you can only do them so often, and they often have a great progression (finish area x to access area y kind of stuff).
WoW's PvE is interesting, and was my favorite part of the game. It was fairly straight forward and often felt empty by how often items dropped however. There wasn't much reason to stick around for AQ to be out after a few months of having everyone's main and alt capped on BWL gear.
L2's PvE is what drew me personally to the game. I watched a lot of videos of Antharas and Valakas. I was excited to see the Frintezza teaser videos pre-C5. I'm really disappointed to see how much the end-game PvE is looked down upon by a large portion of the L2 community. I understand this is a PvP game, and seiges are cool, but I'm more impressed by things like Frintezza getting killed pre-nerf than "my clan has had Aden forever." I think my biggest gripe with this is the dispartiy between how the game is marketed (shots of epic bosses and new areas) vs. how the community sees the game (PvP rules noob).
Sorry for the longwinded post, but I figured I'd give the perspective almost from the outside looking in since I'm still only BD 48 as my highest.
Lets not forget that NCSoft NA has around a dozen games that it oversees, each of which deserve advertising. Would it be fair to have this game promoted and not the others?
As much as I like the idea of having more people I hate what happens when it starts to cause lag. Also there is the problem of getting more casual boaters which will soon be followed by more professional boaters. Thereafter we get those with yachts that just buy it all. On the other hand the problem in all starter villages will pretty much run off many new comers. A twink can blaze through starter areas but a true noobie will take time.
would love to see the cinematics/trailers for L2 in a place other than the official website. originaly, when i was looking for a game to play, i only knew that i wanted to find one where i could bop someone on the head if they were stealing my mobs. i was actually suprised how rare that is in an MMO. i guess different people have different selling points but artwork is a very common one, and L2 definately has it.
Try and imagine one of the gameplay movies in the cinema *drools*
Funnily enough I said the same thing last night, my BF was watching the LE/DE fight - that would be awesome in the cinema and I think would definately draw the interest.
I know what it means, heh. Was just leading in to the question, because it implies you're female (which I didn't think you were), but you could be a man and gay. (and nothing wrong with that at all).
lol off topic somewhat but come to think about it i never seen a l2 game being sold on a shelf other than at a game store EB games etc but i c other games liek city of heros/villians guild warz and others at wal-mart but no l2
I bought mine from best buy 3 years ago. I went to the same best buy a couple days ago and seen nothing but time cards for sale. But no game. Yet for WoW they have time cards and the game sitting next to each other, same with guild wars, city of heroes/villians,...just not l2...why is that.
I bought mine from best buy 3 years ago. I went to the same best buy a couple days ago and seen nothing but time cards for sale. But no game. Yet for WoW they have time cards and the game sitting next to each other, same with guild wars, city of heroes/villians,...just not l2...why is that.
That's a good question. It seems that though they used to have L2 cards in the stores, they are now hard to find. Part of that could be the stores themselves.
If people are not buying L2 then the stores might not see the reason to supply the cards. Luckily, you can use any NC Soft game card to play L2.
We want lineage 2 to advertise more so more ppl will play and appreciate the greatness that l2 is, however companies like best buy don't want to carry the game or time cards because not enough ppl play, and not enogh ppl play because l2 doesn't advertise very much. Is that right? What a vicious circle.
I see GW is very well advertised and available in almost every good supplied game store. As it is a NC soft game, why are they not advertising L2 as same as GW. Or are they saving the money for lineage3, i doubt that. The last Gameplay video of the new update is very poor also, we are all Computer Graphics addicted, what we want is a nice normal lenght Computer Generated Movie and not a simple gameplay. Was nice though. Well we never know they might are working on it and release it at the same time when interlude comes to live servers.
and BTW here in Estonia we got Ncsoft game trial code cards to buy. I wonder how comes bigger countries ain't got them. Might Sold out!
How i found lineage2 was trough mmorpg.com i had no idea a good game like that existed before.
And as far as the cinematic and trailers for l2 goes. you want them available from other websites than lineage2.com and might even some that will never be on lineage2.co, as they are made from a single person. Seems the fan base of l2 has no good CG artist to make this happen.
And if the gamers really are looking for a game like this then they will come across lineage2.com some day.
Lets not forget that NCSoft NA has around a dozen games that it oversees, each of which deserve advertising. Would it be fair to have this game promoted and not the others?
Actually, Auto-Assault had a lot of advertising in PC Gamer magazine...and that game went over like a **** in church. :confused:
Lets not forget that NCSoft NA has around a dozen games that it oversees, each of which deserve advertising. Would it be fair to have this game promoted and not the others?
Actually, Auto-Assault had a lot of advertising in PC Gamer magazine...and that game went over like a **** in church. :confused:
Now I'm not saying it isn't promoted well. Just in comparison to other games and NC titles, it wasn't as successful as it was hyped up to be. *grumbles* I still want advertising.
Yeah :( And please NCSoft, when you're making the very rare ad about Lineage 2, could you at least use a proper looking DE Female and not one that looks like she's STD city :(
Ok my post was worth it, seems everyone is mostly in agreement - NC need far more advertising, could easily better what ads are on offer from other games and that we NEED MORE PEEPS :D
Only problem is nothing will happen but at least everyone on this forum tries to get over what they want, no matter what the request - it's a good thing :)
This is the down fall of NCsoft NA. I live in Taiwan and here On the buses they run adds for Lin 2 all the time. You see adds for lin 2 in EVERY 7-11, Family Mart, and other convent stores. In short NC NA is just coasting off of NC Asia.
You can get Lin 2 toys here.
I teach here and every student knows Lin 2 (albeit the Chinese Name)
Thats just so sad. I really get the feeling sometimes that NCSoft NA just use Lineage 2 as a funder for their own projects and therefore want as few maintainance expenses as possible (which would mean next to no marketting expenses).
Its really sad to see such a great game just shelfed as an irrelevant game in the west.
Is any one else now just a little upset? I feel that NCsoft has abandon North America. why isn't there more marketing here? Lineage 2 is an awesome game...truly. I do NOT see what ncsoft has to lose except our satisfation. I really really really want to see my friends start playin L2, but they think because of the lack of marketing--ie. not on the shelves next to wow or guild wars or in the local walmart--that automatically makes it a poor game. Am I wrong for feeling this way? grrr...ncsoft, if any of you see this thread, which I hope you do, could you respond logically?
Maybe upset wasn't the right word...but I mean I quite literally am addicted to l2. I play so much for months straight, that when something bad happens ...like scammers or the bots...I take it personally and have to take a break for a couple weeks. But I always come back. I just want everyone to experience what I am. I love it to death. I dunno, maybe I am wrong. But I don't see what l2 has to lose. You say marketing is expensive, but you'd figure the players gained by that marketing would more than pay the bills. Thats why I want Ncsoft to explain thier logic behind NOT pushing the game in NA.
so you're saying more and more ppl are playing every day? If so thats fine, but I was thinking more and more ppl are leaving every day. Maybe I just am not seeing the increase in players on the sieghardt server, are the other servers actually growing? Is there a server population site that actually lists how many ppl play on each server?
I watch how many new registered users we gain on the messageboard, and while thats not a valid method. It still shows we have gained a member of the community.
I've been playing for a little over 3 weeks, and registered on the forum the same day I started. A lesson I learned playing another NCSoft funded MMO. :)
I don't think they give a breakdown by server in the published subscription numbers, unfortunately. However, Franz and Teon seem to have consistantly high numbers of players on them.
There is a total of around 100K active accounts (at least we hit that barrier, no way to know if thats a consistant number), which IMO is very very low.
Sadly like I said, I think they see this as a steady cash flow, minimum investment for maximum output. And of course because there's no NA development on L2 there's probably not any major push for it either out of professional desire.
well that kinda ****** me off. So... is any of this [censored] true? : the following was taken from lineage 2's homepage under latest news:
"NCsoft today announced Lineage® II, with more than 14 million customers worldwide, has reached 100,000 active players in North America and Europe. The title started as a cult favorite of many massively multiplayer online (MMO) gamers in North America and Europe and continues its success as the premiere player-versus-player (PvP) online role playing game for the elite PvP player.
Lineage II was launched in North America in 2004 as a modest success. The game has since built itself into one of the top MMOs in the western markets, with a 25 percent growth rate in 2006. NCsoft credits the growth of the game to regular updates and free expansions to the product, and delivering features requested by players. Additionally, NCsoft has implemented aggressive policies to eliminate activities like "botting" and "farming" which give some players unfair advantages over legitimate players."
In North America and Europe, yes. We don't know how many subscribers they have in Asia. We also don't know if they are counting total subscribers since release or not.
I just am having problems believing 14mil. WoW is estimated to have something like 8 mil world wide. I just don't see it on the servers, of course I don't play on the european servers though. I thought...and wish...if 14 million ppl were playing ...well I'd see more toons...I just can't believe 14 mil.
Its called marketting. There isn't 14 million people playing, what they're counting is the total number of accounts ever created since the beginning.
The true worldwide number is somewhere between 1-2 million active accounts (all territories) and 100,000 active accounts in the NA version (including Teon and Franz)
pfft, I would just like to say that I think NcSoft should respond to this thread. Of course we all know they wont..and I wont say anything else. Just upsetting is all the way NcSoft seems to abandon us NA players.
Now calm down. We are not abandoned. Most great things are kept underground. Its when they start to target the mainstream that the rest of us are screwed.
actually, we are not losing subscribers, we have gained subscribers. You got to look at the quarterly reports.
In NA we have yes. Worldwide, no.
Sorry, yes, that is what I'm addressing, NA.
As far as what splatter just said, it doesn't matter if all those 110k players are "players" or the "mindless". NC bases changes/plans for the game on the subscription numbers. They aren't going to say "hey, 'x' amount of thousands of players aren't real so we need to discount those dollars".
If they are receiving the dollars they are receiving those dollars. It is my hope that they also know that some of those accounts aren't "real" and therefore they need to be realistic on any plans for the game with regards to new servers, etc.
And it's why NC went back at banning them massively these last weeks.
Since RGIs buy new accounts each time they're banned they inflate the accounts count nicely.
And since it's end of year they'll end up the Q4 with a nice touch of growth. And I'm sure KR won't bother if it's artificial, too pleased of the progression.
Its 100K active accounts, which in all likelyhood means around 40K active players (and thats assuming all accounts are non-mindless)
the extra "1" was a mistype. Of course I meant "100k" .
And even if there are only 5 real players, NC is going to look at the numbers and say "hey, we have 100,000 players."
To the company, 100,000 subscriptions means 100,000 subscriptions. To the players, the reality is a bit different.
I'm also going to add, this thread is starting to turn into a bot discussion. Unless we want it locked perhaps it should be steered back toward advertising.
We all know the bot/farmer discussion, we've seen it and participated in it for 3 years. In the end there as to be more than that discussion.