Do Sorcerers and SpS ever party together?
The Surrender to Water/Fire spells don't seem to compliment each other in a group situation.
Since they oppose each other how does group managment occur when facing mobs or Raids?
Or do sorcerers and spell singers just not mix?
You shouldn't be surrendering in a group, in a raid the effect lessens slightly but you don't want SpS/Sorcs as raid DDs anyway as their mana issues prevent them from being effective.
Sorcs and Sps are not a group-friendly nor raid-friendly class.
As it stands this moment they are only for soloing as they are horrid in comparison to daggers and archers for sustained group damage dealing by a LONG shot. (no pun intended)
Truthfully, surrender can and should be used on raids, as its the only time its even remotely useful in PvE.
Surrender should be used in cycles... provided mages had reasonable mana management to actually be halfway useful to cast with on bigger targets, you would cast surrender to water and have all your spellsingers open up. then surrender to air and have all your spellhowlers open up, then surrender to fire and have all your sorcerors open up... the others would be regenning mana for optimal use of their mana when it was time.
(even if they fix mana management to some degree it will still be in limited quantities and you will run out...)
Unfortunately mage mana management is so bad that rechargers are actually WASTING mana by recharging mages. An archer will do 5-6 times what the mage can do with the same recharge (even though the mage will get more mana out fo the deal, they do NOT get more damage.)
Yes, these things need to be fixed... no you shouldn't expect it anytime soon.
Sorcerors and Spellsingers who want to actually help their clan should be levelling up newbies for clan points or soloing to 75 to reclass to a useful class.
the thing is casting surrender to water then surrender to fire brings the mob or raid back to its original resistance, does it not?
My SH seems one of the three true mystics that can cast surrenders without it effecting other mystics damage. Why is that?
lol i guess I like the whole elemental connection but Dark Elf mystics seem partially removed from the elemental relationship. :p
Zerk increases run speed, and attack speed/power for archers. Since nothing should be hitting them anyway it's all bonus for them. Just like it is for mages.
- Greater Might
- Resists/MBarrier (a prophet buffed character will always have more effective MDef than an SE buffed one)
- Holy Weapon
Prophets afford additional attack, which, for an archer party, is additional protection. You want a prophet there anyway - so if you're going to fill the second slot, you might as well get an EE.
We're talking about practical facts of the game, are we not?
And practically speaking, among 6-7 archers, it is unlikely that not even one will have a boxed prophet.
If we're *not* talking about practicality of the game, none of you are getting any experience, as all the support classes are off levelling with warlords and dwarves that have magically become plentiful.
Problem with Sorc/SpS is not only that the surrender to element skills cannot be used without hindering the other nuker, also the vortex skills (fire vortex/ice vortex) cannot be used since they have an included surrender effect. Only light vortex can be used effectively when you have both types of nuker in one group. It is really better to have only nukers of the same type, since then the surrenders work very well, especially during raids. One fire vortex, one surrender to fire, then prominence with +++damage.
Why do you say that Sorc are not good for raids? Becuase of mana management issues?
I think I am a little lost on this. I played my sorc to 64 doing lots of raids. I dont need acumen or zerk. As long as I cast at the same rate the archer is shooting i do fine. Does any ever tell an archer they are not shooting fast enough?
the thing is casting surrender to water then surrender to fire brings the mob or raid back to its original resistance, does it not?
My SH seems one of the three true mystics that can cast surrenders without it effecting other mystics damage. Why is that?
lol i guess I like the whole elemental connection but Dark Elf mystics seem partially removed from the elemental relationship.
surrenders dont stack
you can only have 1 on a target at one time
the thing is casting surrender to water then surrender to fire brings the mob or raid back to its original resistance, does it not?
My SH seems one of the three true mystics that can cast surrenders without it effecting other mystics damage. Why is that?
lol i guess I like the whole elemental connection but Dark Elf mystics seem partially removed from the elemental relationship.
surrenders dont stack
you can only have 1 on a target at one time
they dont stack but you can have multipule restiance at a time = what logic?
also the vortex skills (fire vortex/ice vortex) cannot be used since they have an included surrender effect.
Ive tested this with a arch mage.... I (as an mystic muse) dont loose any damage when a mob is debuffed with fire vortex. Its not in the description. Just says that it decreases resistance to fire/water attacks. Surrenders actually specifically say that they increase the resistance of the opposite element.
I really think they should get rid of that downside to surrenders. It only effects SpS/Sorc (which are the two nukers who least need a nerf), and leave SH completely unaffected (unless you have a really wierd sorc in your group that does nothing but cast decay......, or a sps who hates you, and keeps casting surrender to earth :p ).
surrenders dont stack
you can only have 1 on a target at one time
Side note - the "surrender to <element>" skills don't stack (i.e. you cannot have more than one in effect at the same time), but the surrender effect of a vortex and the surrender skill for the same element do stack. And of course gloom stacks with everything.
also the vortex skills (fire vortex/ice vortex) cannot be used since they have an included surrender effect.
Ive tested this with a arch mage.... I (as an mystic muse) dont loose any damage when a mob is debuffed with fire vortex. Its not in the description. Just says that it decreases resistance to fire/water attacks. Surrenders actually specifically say that they increase the resistance of the opposite element.
Interesting, I was pretty sure my damage decreased when a clannie mystic muse used ice vortex. Well, good if it doesn't :) (maybe the vortex only removed my surrender to fire, have to test it a bit in the arena). Then really only the "surrender to <element>" skills have that effect.