Which of the two is better, I'm going to be 2 boxing one with my shaman main. I thought maybe spoils would be good, but I don't know the game well enough to decide.
If you want to make them for money I would say Bounty Hunter is easier. You won't get much money in the beginning. But in the higher levels you will be able to spoil some nice stuff.
At least that is the impression I get from the Bounty Hunters in my clan. They seem to a far easier life than the warsmiths.
Which of the two is better, I'm going to be 2 boxing one with my shaman main. I thought maybe spoils would be good, but I don't know the game well enough to decide.
You don't need a Warsmith...enough of those in Giran to craft the almost everything worth crafting, but if you want enough key mats and recipes for B grade and above then a Bounty Hunter is better. Although I must warn you, most spoils are still really crappy and the least crappy are usually in the spots that require an entire party to grind in. (TOI, Giants Cave, Devil's Isle, etc.)
...pretty much everything under B grade is a wasteland for either dwarf though. :/
Depends on what seems fun to you. I have both, and they are SO different they might as well be seperate races.
A Bounty Hunter makes their adena by fighting / farming mobs for spoils. They are like more likely of the 2 to get in parties, but they are best soloing, unless you are trying to level one up to a certian level, as they make the most taking as long as possible to level. A BH you want to level slow, to alot of people that is exactly opposite of what you want to do with a toon.
For a Warsmith, the faster you level the better. Always great to do massive AOE parties in the cats/necros. The down side, you make your adena in town. Most of your gametime involves wondering through town looking for sales, then crushing for crystals and selling or making shots to sell. Making shots involves a LOT of clicking the mouse button. Can't use an F key to craft anything, all has to be mouse driven :(. So if your concerned about carpal tunnel, stay away from a Warsmith.
1 good thing about a Warsmith, once you level enough, you can make a crafting shop, and leave your computer on 24/7 and your char will constantly be making adena for you. Sometimes its nice to open your game and see a pile of adena that you have no recollection of making.
I play a warsmith, but aoe with a spoiler. (and have a lowbie 5X spoiler) Whichever class you chose try to make friends of the other class, that way you can share the loot and the crafting. ^.^
Warsmith is also better for your clan if you guys dont have one, and Golem makes soloing easier. You get seige golems too if you're going to seriously play the toon and lvl enough.
However, if you're in it purely for the money spoiler probably makes more, especially once you hit 60 and can go to beast farm. (A grade rec spoils) But that's only if you like playing the dwarf. If you hate lvling on it go WS so you can do afk shops, or craft tons of shots.
Even with a spoiler I would reccomend getting to atleast lvl 64 before you stop lvling fast with aoe. The spoils are lots of black ore except for beast farm, but soloing there with a spoiler can make a ton of money.
I play a warsmith, but aoe with a spoiler. (and have a lowbie 5X spoiler) Whichever class you chose try to make friends of the other class, that way you can share the loot and the crafting. ^.^
thats good advice
but firstly since you are a new player i have to warn you that dwarves in L2 are very different then the ones in other mmorgs
the whole dwarven L2 race is made for making money and nother else
depending on who you ask we really dont make enough money to make up for our obvious downsides which are poor pvp and pve abilities
if you are playing a dwarf for its melee capabilities i would instead recommend an orc destroyer, they basically have every skill a dwarf has plus some others which are twice as good
if you are playing one for its money making abilities i can suggest a few other ways to make some cash
OMG, nameless1 just reroll already since you think dwarfs are so aweful, I'm sick of hearing you complain.
I rerolled in order to be a dwarf.
I love playing the dwarf, more than any other class.
Dwarfs are great because they can aoe, solo decently, or join regular groups. Granted they dont have have as many fighting skills as destroyers, but destroyers also dont get golems or money making skills.
I will agree that dwarfs are not for everyone, as you can see. There are some dwarfs who hate it. There are also some nukers who hate it, or daggers, or any other class.
Personally I think the dwarfs are the best class in the game, and really really cute to boot ^.^
this isnt the place for a debate
dude wants to play a dorf
if he wants it for the cash there are alternatives
if he wants it for its pvp or pve abilities its a bad move
and really really cute to boot ^.^
cant argue with that
but just so i understand you, you mean the female dorfs right?
<3 my little dwarven warehouse... I'll be levelling her up to 24 or what it is for the next level of weight limit and then she can be packmulebox to my summoner. XD
1 good thing about a Warsmith, once you level enough, you can make a crafting shop, and leave your computer on 24/7 and your char will constantly be making adena for you. Sometimes its nice to open your game and see a pile of adena that you have no recollection of making.
Not 100% true...you still need the recipes to setup a craft shop and those recipes aren't free (even if you get them as drop)...you can make more adena by just selling the recipe than reging it into your craft book.
Yesterday I crafted 3 crystal daggers... my personal investment for all three was about 12 million for all three, if I'd sold the mats overnight instead of using them I might have gotten somewhere in the vicinity of 20 mil something. I paid 75kx3 = 225k for the clicks.
Then I exchanged them at mammon and sat down to sell them. My profit? Depending on how you want to count somewhere between 20 and 40 million.
The warsmith who actually crafted them? Doesn't seem to feel cheated. ;)
I enjoy the bounty hunter more. I two box, and I level just fine. I love spoiling. At higher levels among some mobs, the excitement of whether or not you are going to get something awesome is fun. like rubbing off lottery tickets. oh yeah, and fake deathing mobs onto bots is a riot.
When I play the warsmith. I get irratated that I can't spoil. but I also LOVE making shots. and during sieges making golems is fun.
carry and sell lots and lots of shots. get a pole and a blunt. carry 2000 cp pots in case people get squirlly. have fun being a dwarf if thats what you want. you will do like half the damage of others. with a pole and vr, you can keep up with most others, leveling wise. seed while you are playing, and you should make plenty of money. and if you have to PvP, practice running away with your finger on a cp pot hot key.
The game is far evolved already
and if u want a chance on being one of the high classes
some day or just make it over 75 to be able to make a sub class
don't go dwarf,
on dwarf u can kiss u'r chances to catch up goodbye
u can always sub a spoiler if u really want to
or take a second toon as dwarf to play from time to time
if u think they are so cute
but in this stade of game
goign dwarf is going to make u quit real soon
be a shame
I really like playing dwarves, almost as much as my main class.
Since key mats tend to spoil from mobs slightly higher than the level of the player who would find them white (for example, low C mats spoil from mobs which a high D player would find hard to solo), I have found the following dwarf duo very helpful.
I have a bounty hunter (spoiler) who is about 6-8 levels higher than the warsmith (crafter). That way the BH is well positioned to spoil the items that the BH is best able to craft. In other words, my advice is to make not one dwarf but two, a spoiler and a crafter, and level the spoiler ahead of the crafter. Of course, if you find you love dwarving then this is for you. If you don't, then don't do it....but the money made from a team like this can be impressive.
I dont think so. Yes Dwarves are slow to lvl, but that doesnt stop me from grinding away. I moved to Hinde just before christmas and Mela is 41 there. Yeah yeah..before you start, I have 8 or 9 alts I play at any given time depending on which toon I feel in the mood to play.
Just try out a dwarf. Some of us actually ENJOY being short and cute!
And as for your damage, I play with a warloard (human aoe class) who is 2 lvls higher, and I outdamage him on my dwarf with the same weapon. Tats (change base stats) do a lot here, you can customize your toon a bit.
Doing aoe I lvl faster than one of my friends who plays a BD (in his clan it's the fastest lvling toon) and I can't hardly log in without group invites sent to me.
I may be one extreeme, and nameless1 may be the other, but youll probably fall somewhere in the middle.
I also prefer pvp on the dwarf. I can't catch archers who are smart enough to kite starting from far away, but if I do catch them and chain stun they dont have a chance. I also have enough CP and HP that I hardly ever die in pvp. It's a little similar to playing a tank who does more damamge though, if you want a pure pvp class go archer or ol or something.
I agree that dwarfs aren't for everyone. There are some who love them and some who hate them. There are some idiots who wont group with dwarfs, but there are people who wont take other things too.
There are other ways to make money, but I prefer leaving crafty shop up and going afk for the night. So easy, and some of my recs have been given to me, so they were free. (<3 my clan and friends)
Crafty shop doenst make near what a spoiler makes but since I have a spoiler friend I get half of that too. (spoils are shared with the group)
I'd go scavvy for $$$ at 45+ you can get some 500k spoils (EWC) ..or make both..spoil some designs and then make them on your arti...btw I would re-roll shaman asap speciall if its only 20-39 if your planning to dual-box..their heals arn't the greatest..and if your aoeing ww is a must :-) And from what I hear from my friends he dies alot in aoe.. if you plan to aoe which im assuming because your planning to be a dorf..and if you have aoe capabilities...your wasting your time going for any other weapon. 20-30 = One day of raiding.
30-40 One day of aoeing (included dieing every 8 minutes as I do myself - except at my level it makes me kind of angry)
And as for your damage, I play with a warloard (human aoe class) who is 2 lvls higher, and I outdamage him on my dwarf with the same weapon. Tats (change base stats) do a lot here, you can customize your toon a bit.
Doing aoe I lvl faster than one of my friends who plays a BD (in his clan it's the fastest lvling toon) and I can't hardly log in without group invites sent to me.
I may be one extreeme, and nameless1 may be the other, but youll probably fall somewhere in the middle.
I also prefer pvp on the dwarf. I can't catch archers who are smart enough to kite starting from far away, but if I do catch them and chain stun they dont have a chance. I also have enough CP and HP that I hardly ever die in pvp. It's a little similar to playing a tank who does more damamge though, if you want a pure pvp class go archer or ol or something.
I agree that dwarfs aren't for everyone. There are some who love them and some who hate them. There are some idiots who wont group with dwarfs, but there are people who wont take other things too.
There are other ways to make money, but I prefer leaving crafty shop up and going afk for the night. So easy, and some of my recs have been given to me, so they were free. (<3 my clan and friends)
Crafty shop doenst make near what a spoiler makes but since I have a spoiler friend I get half of that too. (spoils are shared with the group)
no dwarf will ever outdmg a warlord or a destroyer that gota remotly similar tatto setup while aoeing most likely the dorf wotn even get close to the dmg
also pvping archers and you think you got a chance what lvl your fighting at? 40
cuz once theres A grade archers will ahve something nice called majestic set which give quite a bit stun resist and makes stun worthless
not to speak about endgame when its possible that some ppl have stacked up stun resists
so if your talking about dwarfs being good in pvp or can hold their own vs archers then i suggest you to go out and pvp and see (note MDT is not pvp)
I have 3 dwarfs. A BH, WS on one account and another BH on my buffer account. Spoil after work. and craft shots and sell all night on two dwarfs, and in the morning again. I make a decent coin. and i level just as fast as people who just play after work with the use of AOE.
The real trick is that you have to LOVE spoiling or crafting. Everything everyone else says is true. you do less damage than every other class. you have almost no skills. if you don't have your own buffer/healer 2nd account, you will have a long difficult time leveling. you cant even fight mobs the same level as you without buffs because you do so little damage.
Dwarves don't neccasarily mean your going to make money..mine did nothing but spend it..it easy enough to make money in this game, because everyone has dwarves (needless to say we don't need more) and they craft meaning they sell it cheaper (sometimes) then you buy and sell at normal price. Just finding occasional deals gives me enough to fund all my chars
For those who say you don't make any money as a dorf.
When I find market deals or good bargains, ANY character I use makes plenty of money... buy for 50 mil, sell for 60 mil, repeat, etc.
When I can't find a good deal, or don
't ahve anything to sell my normal characters make ZERO profit per night... with my Warsmith, I can guarantee a certain level of profit average per night period by simply crystal and shot crafts...
Even if you decide another class is better, keeping a little Artisan/Warsmith around for crystals or shots is always in your best interest.
The negativity here? Its because your learning the pricing and crafting workings lowers their profit margins.
Gigls has it right dwarfs can fight and lvl just fine in PVE and not bad in PVP. I've been with her in groups of 3 dwarfys and the exp is not bad at all, polearm flw. Only thing we can't do is hold agro well if theres a dumb caster in group or archer but we(dwarfy) and aoe just as good as a WL or Destro.
no dwarf will ever outdmg a warlord or a destroyer that gota remotly similar tatto setup while aoeing most likely the dorf wotn even get close to the dmg
I just said I do noob, pay attention. That was the point of my post.
also pvping archers and you think you got a chance what lvl your fighting at? 40
cuz once theres A grade archers will ahve something nice called majestic set which give quite a bit stun resist and makes stun worthless
not to speak about endgame when its possible that some ppl have stacked up stun resists
so if your talking about dwarfs being good in pvp or can hold their own vs archers then i suggest you to go out and pvp and see (note MDT is not pvp)
K, first off, I'm not lvl 40 noob, do you not see the 7x? Learn to read kid. I killed an archer in maj la with a +10 soul bow by chain stunning her. (when I was only 65) BOY was she ******. That was fun.
Yesterday another dwarf and I killed an archer when 2 archers tried to gank us. The other archer ran away. lol.
Dwarfs weren't really made to beat archers. We're not supposed to be able to, we're supposed to kill tanks in the great lineage circle of pvp, but it does happen.
The archers I've killed did not have raid boss jewels for stun resist. There are definately limits, I wont be solo killing lvl 78 archers with boss jewels any time soon... but then again I didnt think I was going to win against the archer with the +10 soul bow and maj either...
I'm just saying that we're not as bad in pvp as people tend to think, which leads to some ****** off dead archers ^.^
I do agree, MDT sucks, and that's definately not where I go for pvp. lol. Only thing I use it for is showing off that my dwarf can nuke, SO CUTE! If I'm gunna pvp it better be for pvp points and xp losses :)
Yea common makes a good point..but IMO you'd be wasting time lvling the dorf to make your grade of shots (if your not someone just starting out) or you could make dss..and on gustin, it costs about 10.8984blahblah per dss to make..they sell for 11 each..unless you sit inshop for a week to sell an hours worth of shots..and plus..your wasting time making them for little profit when you can be killing mobs... I make about 700 adena per kill (subtracting gsap, shots ect) and I can kill a mob in..3 hits ( 1x mob) so about 5 seconds a mob, and I get 700..which is equal to making about 600 dss..which is almost two full mana bars for a D grade dwarf (dss) and that creates more time..plus wasting a recharger time (it's hard to dualbox recharger aswell). Wouldn't it be better to just get a high level? And yes dorfs can pvp nicely from what i've seen..untill Maj wearers come and screw your only hope of winning - stun.
The real trick is that you have to LOVE spoiling or crafting. Everything everyone else says is true. you do less damage than every other class. you have almost no skills. if you don't have your own buffer/healer 2nd account, you will have a long difficult time leveling. you cant even fight mobs the same level as you without buffs because you do so little damage.
I can solo yellows without buffs, but I do have a golem, which bh's dont get. I also have dd tats instead of tanking tats, and use GSAP (dwarf buffs)
I wont die if I get 4/5 mobs on me, but I do try to stay at 1/2, why take extra damage if you dont have to? And learn to read silly, no buffs, no heals.
In regards to a much previous post that said a dwarf would never hit 75 and get to sub if they started today, I started my dwarf only 5 months ago. I lvl faster with aoe than most classes like archers/nukers.
Lol...I would find that very hard to acomplish..unless your pulling 2 mobs at max? No buffs and no heals?
She's almost 76 and why would you pull more than two mobs unless you're doing AOE? As she stated she uses dwarf buffs, that is potions you make from common craft or buy from the store.
Umm... I do use a blunt... an elysian. I dont understand what you're getting at. Am I not allowed to play with blunts? I have blunt mastery. Do you even know what skills dwarfs have? I was saying that dwarfs do fine soloing... lets look at my previous quote again, shall we? Maybe I said something about soloing with a pole or bow or heck, why not a chrono weapon?
I can solo yellows without buffs, but I do have a golem, which bh's dont get. I also have dd tats instead of tanking tats, and use GSAP (dwarf buffs)
Yeah, looks like my statement confirms, you ARE an idiot who can't read. I said that dwarfs can solo, nothing about having to fight with chronos or whatever fool thing you try to do.
I can solo yellows without buffs, but I do have a golem, which bh's dont get. I also have dd tats instead of tanking tats, and use GSAP (dwarf buffs)
Yeah, looks like my statement confirms, you ARE an idiot who can't read. I said that dwarfs can solo, nothing about having to fight with chronos or whatever fool thing you try to do.
I can perfectly solo too
and my favorit spots are actually the same as the once's
necros's use on Exception of FOD, gods i hate root
And yes i do it unbuffed on pots only, not even buffscrolls
can't afford those, only have them when i did event...
Andrasa i am sorry mate but there is no way u can do more damage than a warlord in poleing. I have warcry which increase my p.attack- i have final frenzy increase my p.taack when hp falls and i have more dexterity than u so i do more hits than u do(and if not pulling thrill fight for extra attack speed). I believe u did more damage than your warlord friend(if u had increased your str) but the warlord was hiting more times.
Now dwarfs are fine toon and they can xp with pole much faster than any wizzard or glady so hit 70+ faster than average. In pvp they can stand their position better than most people think but it's very expensive- the point is spamming cp and greater cp potion the same time( u have enough weight limit to carry 1000 when an archer can carry the most 50) thus at worst u make the archer run away.
If u go for pole and i am pole addict i would suggest warsmith, why? because there is no mass sweeper till ncsoft put this essential skill to BH they have to use blunt or they are loosing money. WS has the golem which is a must in pvp(can do more dmg than the dwarf himself) and another golem for aoe(bigboom) and he can aoe without any regrets for loosing money. But if you are going to bot him BH is better if you are going to be live and poleing then WS
p.s. can somebody tell me if big boom can be used in pvp effectively and how much dmg can do
If u go for pole and i am pole addict i would suggest warsmith, why? because there is no mass sweeper till ncsoft put this essential skill to BH they have to use blunt or they are loosing money.
p.s. can somebody tell me if big boom can be used in pvp effectively and how much dmg can do
unless your keyboard is missing both Shift keys then you should have no problem using a pole on BH... just hold shift+click the dead mob+ (let go of Shift) Sweep... and repeat
Big Boom is usable in pvp (its really funny) it does a good amount of dmg but not enuff to kill anyone... its only good in a castle gate or large cluster of ppl and in most cases it will die b4 its attack can go off
If u go for pole and i am pole addict i would suggest warsmith, why? because there is no mass sweeper till ncsoft put this essential skill to BH they have to use blunt or they are loosing money.
p.s. can somebody tell me if big boom can be used in pvp effectively and how much dmg can do
unless your keyboard is missing both Shift keys then you should have no problem using a pole on BH... just hold shift+click the dead mob+ (let go of Shift) Sweep... and repeat
Big Boom is usable in pvp (its really funny) it does a good amount of dmg but not enuff to kill anyone... its only good in a castle gate or large cluster of ppl and in most cases it will die b4 its attack can go off
shift+ click works when there are like 4 mobs max, any more than that and GL at finding the mob that is blinking, targeting them in the horde of 10+ mobs, sweeping them and not dying while u are sweeping.
You might get the last 1-2 mobs sweptbut getting the whole pack is impossible
You might get the last 1-2 mobs sweptbut getting the whole pack is impossible
This is only true if you're doing aoe where the only dd is the BH. If you have more dwarfs they can help sweep, or if you have a warloard or something the spoiler can sweep while the warloard does damage. With 2 dwarfs and a wl we hardly ever dont get things swept.
i am sorry mate but there is no way u can do more damage than a warlord in poleing. I have warcry which increase my p.attack- i have final frenzy increase my p.taack when hp falls and i have more dexterity than u so i do more hits than u do(and if not pulling thrill fight for extra attack speed). I believe u did more damage than your warlord friend(if u had increased your str) but the warlord was hiting more times.
Well, I consistantly took agro from my wl friend who's 2 lvls higher, after he had done his hate. You take that to mean whatever you want I guess. Even if it's the difference in 1 skill he doenst have the MP for, I still take it to mean I do atleast a close amount of damage...
Quote:
i am sorry mate but there is no way u can do more damage than a warlord in poleing. I have warcry which increase my p.attack- i have final frenzy increase my p.taack when hp falls and i have more dexterity than u so i do more hits than u do(and if not pulling thrill fight for extra attack speed). I believe u did more damage than your warlord friend(if u had increased your str) but the warlord was hiting more times.
Well, I consistantly took agro from my wl friend who's 2 lvls higher, after he had done his hate. You take that to mean whatever you want I guess. Even if it's the difference in 1 skill he doenst have the MP for, I still take it to mean I do atleast a close amount of damage...
im +7 str
a wl 1 lvl lower with -str pulls hate from me
and afaik there is only 1 skill capable of pulling agro off a poleing wl and i dont think you have it
WL's provoke is not hate that's for sure it's just to move the non aggro mobs. That's why it is good to train people.
There are two reason that a dwarf can pull aggro. One is spoil i have saved a lot of people by using spoil the same way a tank use aggresion or spoil festival as aura of hate(it does work, i have done when playin a BH).
As you are not BH i suppose you got lucky and give more critical to the poor mob. I hope though that the warlord hasn't decrease his str or dex to incrase con because that would be a dumb move
And about sweeping mobs bh is such a rare class(apart to bot trains) that you will rarely find two to pack together. Although i heard that BH gets group sweeping at last in interlude. If it does then go for BH. Duo with SE and u realy get good money without have to split it with others.
I used to hit whamp rats with my T-16 back home, and they arent much bigger than 2 meters.
I pick up blue mobs all the time. doesnt matter how big the pull is. ask my clannies. they will tell you I can sweep a blue mob outta a mega-pack. practice practice practice. a true insane bounty hunter will have a nervous breakdown if you don't get all the bluey blueys. Practice. target mobs that will fall first. if you have an archer, bd in party, ask them to target your mob for max spoilage.
To the left To the left, spoil festival musta landed on the dead mob to the left.
guess you don't know bout me, guess you don't know bout me. I'll sweep another mob in a second. ill be sweeping that mob in a second
Fact: WL and Destroyer do more damage than dwarfs with a pole. under any/all circumstances.
If i was a WL, I'd be 80 by now. i would even venture to say that WL's have the greatest potential for the quickest leveling.
If i was a WL, I'd be 80 by now. i would even venture to say that WL's have the greatest potential for the quickest leveling.
debatable
i still think destro is the best pole class in game
they suck at pulling and dont have the cool stuff like howl and thunderstorm, but do you really need it when you have the choice at B grade of 2k pdef or 3k pattack?
I love playing a dwarf, when I am on my SH subclass.
As a 77 WS I have spent months working on the quest to obtain S armor recipes for my book. I hunt the Ketra orcs. Nobody likes to hunt Ketras, so I usually "solo". Even with my golem and SE buffs, the killing is slow. But now my SH subclass is level 70. With the SH I can kill the higher level Ketras much faster than my WS can kill the lowest level orcs.
Finally I have some hope to finish this quest in the next few months. I need all the recipes for my book, plus recipes to make the heavy armor and robe armor for myself. That is 13 in the book and 9 for crafting for a total 22 recipes. Asuming a 60% success on craft I will probably need about 28 recipes. Did I mention the recipe you get is random, so double that number (56, at least I can sell/craft the extra).
About 1:4 recipes will be main armor requiring 2500 orc molars. The other recipes require 750 molars. I estimate I need 66,500 molars to get my book filled and my armor made. If I kill only orcs, I seem to at best get a 50% drop (maybe not that good), which means I need to kill 133,000 Ketras.
This is the life of a high level WS, do you really want to go there?
K, first off, I'm not lvl 40 noob, do you not see the 7x? Learn to read kid. I killed an archer in maj la with a +10 soul bow by chain stunning her. (when I was only 65) BOY was she ******. That was fun.
Anecdotal evidence proves nothing. I was in a PvP were my party of 8 went up against a necro and an archer. I finally got a stun to land on the necro (in DC) with the 5th or 6th try. Too bad everyone else in my party was dead by then. One of those dead was an orc with 12k+ health!! I wisely bsoed before the necro could attack me.
It was nice that you could chain stun the archer, but my stuns rarely land. I have that level 77 armor crush, and that rarely lands also. When I PvP now, I get out a Soul bow, I have become much more efective.