I have a 63 Dest and a 61 SK and I'm having a hard time choosing wich one to level to 70+ for interlude any suggestions or comments would be appreciated. Thanks.
Destro tears stuff up in PvP and PvE and you can choose a large # of weapons/armor depending on your play style and still do well
SK is ok at PvE and PvP (nothing amazing) and you dont have a real huge option for armors or weapon
the only edge the SK has is it is a very well rounded class... can be a debuffer, a Tank, a DD..ish and do them pretty well
and SK has the coolest skill set and play style ingame imo
also not a huge amount of high lvl SKs around compared to Destros so your kind of unique
i played a little bit of destro on alt but this post is pretty SK bias due to my main class
since neither really get anything different in the 60-78 level range from here to interlude, i would say play your preference. the only diffrence will be 79+
PvE
You are a machine, you can kill and xp faster than most classes in the game, even at high lvls. With a group of destros/titans and propper buffs you can kill almost anything, Raid bosses included.
PvP
The destro can be a force, IF you can catch up to someone. In sieges and other mass PvP it is actually possible to do, although not exactly easy. You wont kill gobs of people until you throw your frenzy/rage and zealot skills, which generally you wil die before you get them off as people tend to focus fire destroyers. It is better to throw the skills before you run in if you can, and get healed. It works well, and with VR as long as you have pots and someone to hit it will take you a while to go down. Even when you go down, most melees in range of you ill have pobably died. In a kiting environment, you wont kill many people, you are easily slowed and can not slow people down(most will have some sort of stun resist).
If you like playing on the edge of death(30% or less hp) then the destroyer will be for you. I dont have much eperience with the SK, but I hear they are fun also.(and a pain to kill, even though they generally have low hp)
Destro tears stuff up in PvP and PvE and you can choose a large # of weapons/armor depending on your play style and still do well
SK is ok at PvE and PvP (nothing amazing) and you dont have a real huge option for armors or weapon
the only edge the SK has is it is a very well rounded class... can be a debuffer, a Tank, a DD..ish and do them pretty well
and SK has the coolest skill set and play style ingame imo
also not a huge amount of high lvl SKs around compared to Destros so your kind of unique
i played a little bit of destro on alt but this post is pretty SK bias due to my main class
Agreed buddy, SK it is. Oh and ty for sticking up for me against that gustin jerk.
O.o lol sup man, yeah im playing the Dest. Well I say playing.... I'm lvling my SO atm when it's high enough ill be playing like a [censored]. Yeah thats right.... I said [censored].
One of the largest differences, in the department of leveling will be, singular slow killing of mobs with a sword (most likely) or pulling 2-3 rooms in catacombs and killing gazillions of mobs!!!!!
Destroyer will level faster, and on top of that kill more people when they touch them.
Imho tanks are hard to play because how this game is set up. People don't really wanna level with you unless you are doing raids or some crazy party, and you have low damage output so you can't really level by yourself very well, although an SK would probably be the easiest tank to level.
If it was my choice, I would go Destroyer hands down. But thats because pole arms are fun and two handed swords are awesomeness.
Wel I have not tried the pts yet .. dont have the time for it..but I hada Destro before and ask and I woudl say ..go with the sk ..it can be real great in pvp and u can lv it with aoe as wel as long u get btb.
but most players forget about the sk ..how to play and so on.
Its easy its a tank first all ok ..its dark elf ...so of al tanks u cna have the highest patk ..easy get dyes +3 str +2 str - con on both ..get nm set geta good dle with health ..k u do dmg now and it wil depend on how many + u got on the dle i suggest about +4+5 at least.
The dmg ur going to do is DoT and its with the cubes use them ALWAYS its alife saver and your enemies in pvp wil hate them and u got hex us it u got life leech does less dmg then drain health but give su more health in pvp do both as much u can and ..now the best destros pdef is very low compared to the sk ... and + u got guard stance + shield sance and of all fighters since ur a dark elf u got the most int and wit and men ..wich means you have more mp then compared to the destro ..and u got the lightning strike..para 30 sec mob or player... in 30 sec u can kill most players with a sk :)
So when u get buffd alwasy ask 4 emp acumen and wildmagic and clarity for your sk.
Wel I have not tried the pts yet .. dont have the time for it..but I hada Destro before and ask and I woudl say ..go with the sk ..it can be real great in pvp and u can lv it with aoe as wel as long u get btb.
Wel I have not tried the pts yet .. dont have the time for it..but I hada Destro before and ask and I woudl say ..go with the sk ..it can be real great in pvp and u can lv it with aoe as wel as long u get btb.
but most players forget about the sk ..how to play and so on.
Its easy its a tank first all ok ..its dark elf ...so of al tanks u cna have the highest patk ..easy get dyes +3 str +2 str - con on both ..get nm set geta good dle with health ..k u do dmg now and it wil depend on how many + u got on the dle i suggest about +4+5 at least.
The dmg ur going to do is DoT and its with the cubes use them ALWAYS its alife saver and your enemies in pvp wil hate them and u got hex us it u got life leech does less dmg then drain health but give su more health in pvp do both as much u can and ..now the best destros pdef is very low compared to the sk ... and + u got guard stance + shield sance and of all fighters since ur a dark elf u got the most int and wit and men ..wich means you have more mp then compared to the destro ..and u got the lightning strike..para 30 sec mob or player... in 30 sec u can kill most players with a sk :)
So when u get buffd alwasy ask 4 emp acumen and wildmagic and clarity for your sk.
Wel I have not tried the pts yet .. dont have the time for it..but I hada Destro before and ask and I woudl say ..go with the sk ..it can be real great in pvp and u can lv it with aoe as wel as long u get btb.
lol yes i have lvld a sk to 70+
and omg yes i can do a whole room with se buffs so i know what i talking about .and threre is a lot of sk that lvld with poles at least on Gustin server
i have sk 70+ really hard to lvl up cause they want you only for raids i played at pts just to wear IC and really were suck with this armor as he were stun target ++str --con defenitely stun shot shot stun shot shot ...die.Go destro
lol not be rude but it seems u cant play your sk the stun shot lands a few times but as long u keep drain him or life leech the archer will have a hard time to kill . .. in the end either he runs away or u get in close and kill it.
And to lvl the sk fast all u need is to party a bd/wc or a sws and go at it in a cata or nec.
Anda word of advice look over your dyes u use and the armor set u use enchant it as much u cna without destroy it it shoudl be enough ..if u use the dc or maj or tal set...sell it and get nm
The problem is tha many classes use stun not only the archers tha is easy to beat them.if a destro stun us then qq evn if we try to kite him.I use NM set +1 con tattoo and +3 int tatoo for make LS lands more often.
I got + 2 +3 stre -2 - 3 con but with the nm set i get the +2 con bonus so only get - 3 con and +5 str ..good deal for dealing dmg (and get the DLE with SA health forget about the other SA it has on a DLE the health is the best)
The int is not bad ..but either u had to lower the casting rate or the mp ...I prefer not to lower any of it..since I use a lot of drains.leech and guard/shield stance I wanta lot of mp..but stil i dont want mu cast speed or matk lowerd so dyes for that is not in use.
I have faced a other sk who was higher then me..he had lower men and I won since i had my guard stance longer then him and had more mp to heal my self with.
And a word of advice try to get btb as much u can it helps out alot my se has it (stick of eternety btb lvl 3) a good advantege in pvp and pve u can tank longer and have the best patk of all tanks.
And always use the cubes they are a life saver and pvp your foes wil hate them a lot and gives ua easy victory as the cubes dont care if u r close or far away.
I got + 2 +3 stre -2 - 3 con but with the nm set i get the +2 con bonus so only get - 3 con and +5 str ..good deal for dealing dmg (and get the DLE with SA health forget about the other SA it has on a DLE the health is the best)
The int is not bad ..but either u had to lower the casting rate or the mp ...I prefer not to lower any of it..since I use a lot of drains.leech and guard/shield stance I wanta lot of mp..but stil i dont want mu cast speed or matk lowerd so dyes for that is not in use.
I have faced a other sk who was higher then me..he had lower men and I won since i had my guard stance longer then him and had more mp to heal my self with.
And a word of advice try to get btb as much u can it helps out alot my se has it (stick of eternety btb lvl 3) a good advantege in pvp and pve u can tank longer and have the best patk of all tanks.
And always use the cubes they are a life saver and pvp your foes wil hate them a lot and gives ua easy victory as the cubes dont care if u r close or far away.
LOL... why are you -5 Con and using a HP set and HP weapon i think all you did for yourself was spend a crap load of extra adena... you could have left you Con alone and got a Tallum Blade, Damascus, or Forgotten if you wanted HP & Dmg
-3 Con you stun resist is low, your max hp/cp is low... gimping you Con and and using a HP weapon is doing nothing but hurting you
25% HP from your weapon does not add your cp back or help w/ stun also your hp/cp regen is gimp
aswell as using a 25% hp sa when youve lowerd your hp to ( about 3k w/ no buffs ?) doesnt add much hp at all
you could have a higher dps and bout the same hp just using a sword w/ a damage sa and not doin -con
the 2 things youve done are really jus counter productive
I wanta lot of mp..but stil i dont want mu cast speed or matk lowerd so dyes for that is not in use.
I have faced a other sk who was higher then me..he had lower men and I won since i had my guard stance longer then him and had more mp to heal my self with.
lemme know what magical tattoo alows fighters to change thier (men)............. ><
i have sk 70+ really hard to lvl up cause they want you only for raids i played at pts just to wear IC and really were suck with this armor as he were stun target ++str --con defenitely stun shot shot stun shot shot ...die.Go destro
It's the worst raid tank you can imagine and even then, it ends up in party with healers rechargers.
:) k it seems u did forget to look at the sk ...its not for using duals or so and I got nm set so only - 3 con but get to keep the str (patk) and the tal set has alot lower pdef as well m8
and dont forget the shield mastery the sk has as all tanks the sk needs a shield to use.
:p so to have about 937 patk and over 1105 (over 1350 with guard stance) pdef with self buffs is not so bad for only a low 70 sk and the shield bonus ad that to it as wel and u will have a hard time to take it out inclose combat.
So ..let us see again +5 str - 3con ,btb ..sa health hmmm got all the hp back and the cool patk as well so now the sk can deal dmg to :) to be able to hit back and make a bit dmg as a tank ..in close combat. is just to godo since we tanks has the best pdef of all classes but now a few can deal dmg as well.
Dont forget teh dark elfs has the highest str compared to al other races yes we are stronger then orcs to :p
but after read your post m8 and if u have a sk its seems to be real gimped :p oh yes by the way my ** with no buffs or so is at 4,2k with btb lvl 3 5k
One of the largest differences, in the department of leveling will be, singular slow killing of mobs with a sword (most likely) or pulling 2-3 rooms in catacombs and killing gazillions of mobs!!!!!
Destroyer will level faster, and on top of that kill more people when they touch them.
Imho tanks are hard to play because how this game is set up. People don't really wanna level with you unless you are doing raids or some crazy party, and you have low damage output so you can't really level by yourself very well, although an SK would probably be the easiest tank to level.
If it was my choice, I would go Destroyer hands down. But thats because pole arms are fun and two handed swords are awesomeness.
The End!
I say stop listening to people who dont play SK's, and Most people who do play SK's dont know jack either, SK's level FINE, infact its EASY for an sk to level, its just SLOWER. SK's are also more expensive. Id like to see more destro's And SK's populate the server, but thats not likely to happen.
--Side note "worst raid tank you can imagine"
All the raid tanks i see in high levels are SK's from the clan i watch kill stuff. that 2-3k less HP isnt that big of a deal, seeing as how many tanks Usually dont even drop that low to make it a big deal. if you lose 4k HP before the heal rounds are let off (just an example) as a human Knight, and your reiflled back to full, And you lose 4k HP as an SK and refilled back to full. Is there a difference in the amount of healing? Um.. NO their isnt.
I don't understand either the issue about lower hp while doing raids. Not like it matters - you get the same amount of healed like any other char it just fills you quicker.
I'd go for SK, because SK is just a cool class to play with. Not many around and they can be pretty **** pain in the *** in pvp also.
Best idea; use dmg setup until you're high lvl, then change to pvp/raid setup? Just a thought.
61-78 tallum heavy (w/ shield), tallum blade w/ haste (or OE'd Damascus w/ focus/haste), perhaps even a Dark legion's edge w/ crit damage (it might be useful after interlude crit nerfs), +5 str, +4 dex, -9 con. Fast as hell killing, SK's drains leave him much room for lowr HP. Tallum heavy let's you carry more shots even with -con. Should be looking at 1k-1.3k patk depending on weapon with very high atk speed. Not great for PvP. Good for PvE; being the main focus of 61-78 :)
Another DD build works with the same principles, but using a 2-handed sword. Less shots used, still great damage (maybe better). Suggestions: Infernal master with focus/haste. Focus is probobly better, but some people are addicted to atk speed :P With this setup, you can probobly DD as well as DD's in your lvl range. Worse than #1 for PvP. But #1 in PvE; being the main focus of 61-78 :)
78+ Majestic heavy set (mad stun resist) / Nightmare heavy set (good PvP armor) / Dark crystal (good tanking setup) / Imperial crusader (the best if you're rich as hell). Dark Legion's Edge w/ health or again...if you're rich as hell Forgotten Blade w/ focus. Add +4 con, -4 Str / +4 dex, -4 Str / +1 Dex, -1 Str. This will ensure mad raid bolss tanking skills and somewhat decent PvP ability.
If you're a glutton for punishment, here's a 61+ tanking setup. Dark crystal heavy, Dark legion's edge w/ health, +4 con, -4 str / +5 dex, -5 Str. You'll hit like a fly and I'll make fun of you; but you'll be able to tank mobs much higher than yourself and raid bosses, plus PvP well.
Change all weapon suggestions to the new interlude weapons if you wish :P But not like anyone who plays an SK could afford them until later on :P
Anyways, just a few suggestions. Hope they help! Good day.
:) k it seems u did forget to look at the sk ...its not for using duals or so and I got nm set so only - 3 con but get to keep the str (patk) and the tal set has alot lower pdef as well m8
and dont forget the shield mastery the sk has as all tanks the sk needs a shield to use.
:p so to have about 937 patk and over 1105 (over 1350 with guard stance) pdef with self buffs is not so bad for only a low 70 sk and the shield bonus ad that to it as wel and u will have a hard time to take it out inclose combat.
So ..let us see again +5 str - 3con ,btb ..sa health hmmm got all the hp back and the cool patk as well so now the sk can deal dmg to :) to be able to hit back and make a bit dmg as a tank ..in close combat. is just to godo since we tanks has the best pdef of all classes but now a few can deal dmg as well.
Dont forget teh dark elfs has the highest str compared to al other races yes we are stronger then orcs to :p
but after read your post m8 and if u have a sk its seems to be real gimped :p oh yes by the way my ** with no buffs or so is at 4,2k with btb lvl 3 5k
who said anything about duals ? i said a sword w/ a dmg SA
-con decreases you HP and your CP and you h/cp regeneration, +str inceases patk, +25% DLE increase HP
so... if you -con +str and use a hp weapon... you get you HP back to wat it was b4 you -con... you have lost no hp (infact you prlly have gained a little) but you lost CP, HP Regen, stun resist etc....
so... what i am saying is.... why didnt you just leave you con at base and use a damascus w/ focus or a tallum blade w/ haste if you wanted to have your hp and still do dmg... that way you would have the same good dps but w/o killing your CP/HP regen, max cp, stun resist, o yeah and weight guage etc.
-con +str and using a hp weapon instead of a dmg SA is not i repeat IS NOT giving you the much better dps that you think it is you have good HP and good Patk but your hitting alot slower than you would be w/ a haste SA and criting less than you would be w/ a Focus SA
i not saying your setup doesnt work... im saying you could be alot better for alot less $ and not take away from abilitys while doing it
Yeah I haven't wanted to jump into this. Because there isn't anything wrong with a -CON setup. Even Damaskinos. But at the same time, each build has its drawbacks, and as H4T3MONG3R pointed out therere are a few. Damskino hasn't really said anything that is totaly unreasonable, but comments like:
I have faced a other sk who was higher then me..he had lower men and I won since i had my guard stance longer then him and had more mp to heal my self with.
kinda make me wonder. And I don't know about other SKs, but I typicaly don't run out of MP fighting any class, and I have a nuke build. Also, Im not a huge fan of the -CON build, but if I was gonna use it, I would probably get Maj. If you don't like the extra -2 CON, just use a tat to cancel it out. But for tanking and for PvP, not getting stunned 99% of the time is gonna be useful. Especially if you are AOEing in high lvl cata/necro, where many of the mobs stun.
You can get away with the -con build against many classes. Certainly all the pesky archers and nukers. So most don't think twice about it. But you are gonna get eaten alive by SKs with other builds, and anything with a stun is gonna present a problem.
i didnt mean -con setup or any other setup is wrong by all means do wat works for ya.... i was jus tryin to point out that he could have got the same dps result and hp for alot cheaper w/ less downfalls... i dont want a new SK to try a ******ed setup like that and quit SK cuase they gimp themselves
personally ima fan of DD type SK w/ a backup tank set or weapon
and there is tons of diff variations of that but gimping 20 different aspects of your toon to add 70 patk jus doesnt make sense
:) k it seems u did forget to look at the sk ...its not for using duals or so and I got nm set so only - 3 con but get to keep the str (patk) and the tal set has alot lower pdef as well m8
and dont forget the shield mastery the sk has as all tanks the sk needs a shield to use.
:p so to have about 937 patk and over 1105 (over 1350 with guard stance) pdef with self buffs is not so bad for only a low 70 sk and the shield bonus ad that to it as wel and u will have a hard time to take it out inclose combat.
So ..let us see again +5 str - 3con ,btb ..sa health hmmm got all the hp back and the cool patk as well so now the sk can deal dmg to :) to be able to hit back and make a bit dmg as a tank ..in close combat. is just to godo since we tanks has the best pdef of all classes but now a few can deal dmg as well.
Dont forget teh dark elfs has the highest str compared to al other races yes we are stronger then orcs to :p
but after read your post m8 and if u have a sk its seems to be real gimped :p oh yes by the way my ** with no buffs or so is at 4,2k with btb lvl 3 5k
who said anything about duals ? i said a sword w/ a dmg SA
-con decreases you HP and your CP and you h/cp regeneration, +str inceases patk, +25% DLE increase HP
so... if you -con +str and use a hp weapon... you get you HP back to wat it was b4 you -con... you have lost no hp (infact you prlly have gained a little) but you lost CP, HP Regen, stun resist etc....
so... what i am saying is.... why didnt you just leave you con at base and use a damascus w/ focus or a tallum blade w/ haste if you wanted to have your hp and still do dmg... that way you would have the same good dps but w/o killing your CP/HP regen, max cp, stun resist, o yeah and weight guage etc.
-con +str and using a hp weapon instead of a dmg SA is not i repeat IS NOT giving you the much better dps that you think it is you have good HP and good Patk but your hitting alot slower than you would be w/ a haste SA and criting less than you would be w/ a Focus SA
i not saying your setup doesnt work... im saying you could be alot better for alot less $ and not take away from abilitys while doing it
I can say from experience that the DPS on a dama or talum blade with base CON, does not compare to what you get with -9 CON, DLE, and maj set. It's insane the damage you do with that setup, for a tank anyway. My DLE doesn't even have health SA on it yet, and I'm doing just fine with gimped HP. With oop SE and PP, I can solo catacomb rooms without healing or even lifeleeching once, VR does all the work for me. I certainly don't expect to pvp with this setup, but it absolutely rules for pve.
Btw I tried poling with a clean tallum glave and did pretty well, except for the fact that pulling is really risky due to my non-existanct HP. But if I had HP on the glave I'd imagine I would do better than my dorf can since I kill trains so much faster, especially with corpse plague ticking on the whole train. (keep in mind i had a bishop healing me, but she never ran out of mana)
Faceless I know I had this conversation with you before, and I don't play SKs but I know a few 70+ SKs and a few 70+ destroyers. There is no such thing as hard grinding in L2, what I meant was long grind, long is hard because it becomes annoying when you start hitting the exp walls in your 70s. Play an SK to 70, I probally know as much as you do about an SK by playing with some at 70+ than you do at actually playing on in your 50s. I am not here to debate experience though, I am here to help a player.
About raids. Who cares! When 2 titans can solo a raid boss including tanking it, who the hell needs a tank. All you need is a bishop and a few buffers. I have seen it! And it does work!
With frenzy, at lvl 40 a Destroyer has roughly the same p.attk as a lvl 75 unbuffed Gladiator.
If we are debating speed of leveling, that is just ******ed. Destroyers WILL and DO level faster than ANY tank! SKs are probally one of the more fun tanks to play, and it is true, like I said before one of the easiest tanks to level because of their skills and high STR rating.
Destroyers get guts which is like a walking UD, granted no shield defenses, but it doesn't matter because you hit like a truck and will basically outlast any other equivalent melee if you know what you are doing.
So you can pull trains if you have a SwS, a WC, or a BD? Yeah, pick some of the hardest classes to find. Not impossible, but as a destroyer you just need an SE and some HP pots. It is a lot easier to get an SE, heck you can even build your own these days.
Which is the better class? Neither really...both have their 'style'. All I am gonna say is a SK will be "slower" to level than a destroyer.
If anything pick what you think looks cooler. Also if you don't want to pole arm, there are ppl who don't like that play style, then don't go destroyer unless you like orcs.
And to the guy that played a lvl 70 something SK and does -CON to +STR, with nightmare and a +HP weapon...wth are you thinking! That armor is one of the worst choices for that tatt setup, you just wasted money because basically you nullify half or your set bonus, or half of your tatts, however u wanna look at it. If your going to go NM go +CON tatts... You would be better going Majestic with the setup you just explained...I mean seriously...
:) k it seems u did forget to look at the sk ...its not for using duals or so and I got nm set so only - 3 con but get to keep the str (patk) and the tal set has alot lower pdef as well m8
and dont forget the shield mastery the sk has as all tanks the sk needs a shield to use.
:p so to have about 937 patk and over 1105 (over 1350 with guard stance) pdef with self buffs is not so bad for only a low 70 sk and the shield bonus ad that to it as wel and u will have a hard time to take it out inclose combat.
So ..let us see again +5 str - 3con ,btb ..sa health hmmm got all the hp back and the cool patk as well so now the sk can deal dmg to :) to be able to hit back and make a bit dmg as a tank ..in close combat. is just to godo since we tanks has the best pdef of all classes but now a few can deal dmg as well.
Dont forget teh dark elfs has the highest str compared to al other races yes we are stronger then orcs to :p
but after read your post m8 and if u have a sk its seems to be real gimped :p oh yes by the way my ** with no buffs or so is at 4,2k with btb lvl 3 5k
who said anything about duals ? i said a sword w/ a dmg SA
-con decreases you HP and your CP and you h/cp regeneration, +str inceases patk, +25% DLE increase HP
so... if you -con +str and use a hp weapon... you get you HP back to wat it was b4 you -con... you have lost no hp (infact you prlly have gained a little) but you lost CP, HP Regen, stun resist etc....
so... what i am saying is.... why didnt you just leave you con at base and use a damascus w/ focus or a tallum blade w/ haste if you wanted to have your hp and still do dmg... that way you would have the same good dps but w/o killing your CP/HP regen, max cp, stun resist, o yeah and weight guage etc.
-con +str and using a hp weapon instead of a dmg SA is not i repeat IS NOT giving you the much better dps that you think it is you have good HP and good Patk but your hitting alot slower than you would be w/ a haste SA and criting less than you would be w/ a Focus SA
i not saying your setup doesnt work... im saying you could be alot better for alot less $ and not take away from abilitys while doing it
I can say from experience that the DPS on a dama or talum blade with base CON, does not compare to what you get with -9 CON, DLE, and maj set. It's insane the damage you do with that setup, for a tank anyway. My DLE doesn't even have health SA on it yet, and I'm doing just fine with gimped HP. With oop SE and PP, I can solo catacomb rooms without healing or even lifeleeching once, VR does all the work for me. I certainly don't expect to pvp with this setup, but it absolutely rules for pve.
Btw I tried poling with a clean tallum glave and did pretty well, except for the fact that pulling is really risky due to my non-existanct HP. But if I had HP on the glave I'd imagine I would do better than my dorf can since I kill trains so much faster, especially with corpse plague ticking on the whole train. (keep in mind i had a bishop healing me, but she never ran out of mana)
LOL... now I'm being quoted and still nobody reads
i didnt say -9 con setup was bad... and i didnt say -9 con + hp weapon < dps than base stats + dama
IF you read his post.... he is using (-5 Con +5 Str)+(NM Heavy)+(DLE /HP) so... his total set up = (-3 Con -2 Dex +5 Str... +25% HP & +4% Patk from NM)
im saying if your gunna gimp your Con for Damage dont use a weapon that doesnt increase dmg and a set thats made for Con/tanking....
im all for -Con +Str or +Dex... but if you want a DD setup conteracting your DD setup w/ HP setup doesnt make any sense and if your doing any tanking pvp or pve -Con isnt gunna help you... making a DD SK is a good idea if your gonna be solo or small group DDing... but then why not jus role BD or some other DD if you want a DD
but like i said... if your goin Dmg go Dmg, if your goin tank go tank if you want both leave the SK how it was made cause thats what they are... dont go Dmg then top it of w/ some tank... atleast not the way this guy was trying to do it... it has more cons than pros and if he wanted high dps and good con a Tallum set and Dama/tallum blade w/ base con would work or other sets
if it works for this guy im happy for him... but anyone who is planning a SK should talk to other SKs because i really think his is a counterproductive and unnecessarly expensive setup
And to the guy that played a lvl 70 something SK and does -CON to +STR, with nightmare and a +HP weapon...wth are you thinking! That armor is one of the worst choices for that tatt setup, you just wasted money because basically you nullify half or your set bonus, or half of your tatts, however u wanna look at it. If your going to go NM go +CON tatts... You would be better going Majestic with the setup you just explained...I mean seriously...
I try to say this many dif ways and he doesnt get it
I don't understand either the issue about lower hp while doing raids. Not like it matters - you get the same amount of healed like any other char it just fills you quicker.
I'd go for SK, because SK is just a cool class to play with. Not many around and they can be pretty **** pain in the *** in pvp also.
Psch Lineage 1 SO DOES HAVE DWARVES BTW (reponse to your comment, EVERYONE BEATS ON THAT STORAGE DWARF I N TOWN FOR HOURS. dwarves just became mean and green o_o!! (also the fact that Elmordians were killed off which is why we dont have orcs either.. ah? ah?) oops changing the subject.. err YEA go with sk. But orc isnt used much either :)
mait- I did say SK was slower merely pointing out wordings. less walls of text please its 3:13 a.m... tired man. and grinding in this game even at 71 is fast to me, i played L1 for gods sakes.. Oh god the nightmares... (shudders violently)
LOL... why are you -5 Con and using a HP set and HP weapon i think all you did for yourself was spend a crap load of extra adena... you could have left you Con alone and got a Tallum Blade, Damascus, or Forgotten if you wanted HP & Dmg
-3 Con you stun resist is low, your max hp/cp is low... gimping you Con and and using a HP weapon is doing nothing but hurting you
25% HP from your weapon does not add your cp back or help w/ stun also your hp/cp regen is gimp
aswell as using a 25% hp sa when youve lowerd your hp to ( about 3k w/ no buffs ?) doesnt add much hp at all
you could have a higher dps and bout the same hp just using a sword w/ a damage sa and not doin -con
the 2 things youve done are really jus counter productive
That's totally wrong; in fact it's exactly the contrary, you gain more HP with this setup and more Patk.
SK are DE so higher gain from Str and lower lost from Con.
-5 CON is rouglhy -15% HP (562hp and 337cp at 78 without buff), so the DLE health give more than you lost even with CP.
And +5 str is roughly +20% Patk.
Add that SK beneficit more from HP than CP (because you cant drain CP). The only lost is the resist to stun but anyway DE without Maj armor or epic jewel is easily stuned.
This set up is a real good hybrid one.
If you prefer a full DD or full Con setup it's your choice, but for a hybrid setup, you gain more like that than with base con and a damage weapon.
Feanorr
PS: I agree that NM isnt the best armor for this tatoo/SA setup though.
LOL... why are you -5 Con and using a HP set and HP weapon i think all you did for yourself was spend a crap load of extra adena... you could have left you Con alone and got a Tallum Blade, Damascus, or Forgotten if you wanted HP & Dmg
-3 Con you stun resist is low, your max hp/cp is low... gimping you Con and and using a HP weapon is doing nothing but hurting you
25% HP from your weapon does not add your cp back or help w/ stun also your hp/cp regen is gimp
aswell as using a 25% hp sa when youve lowerd your hp to ( about 3k w/ no buffs ?) doesnt add much hp at all
you could have a higher dps and bout the same hp just using a sword w/ a damage sa and not doin -con
the 2 things youve done are really jus counter productive
That's totally wrong; in fact it's exactly the contrary, you gain more HP with this setup and more Patk.
SK are DE so higher gain from Str and lower lost from Con.
-5 CON is rouglhy -15% HP (562hp and 337cp at 78 without buff), so the DLE health give more than you lost even with CP.
And +5 str is roughly +20% Patk.
Add that SK beneficit more from HP than CP (because you cant drain CP). The only lost is the resist to stun but anyway DE without Maj armor or epic jewel is easily stuned.
This set up is a real good hybrid one.
If you prefer a full DD or full Con setup it's your choice, but for a hybrid setup, you gain more like that than with base con and a damage weapon.
Feanorr
PS: I agree that NM isnt the best armor for this tatoo/SA setup though.
My main point is that Con does alot more than jus give you more HP while Str only gives more patk... that being said
most people that go w/ a -Con +Str setup on SK plan on being mostly solo or duo... and while max HP isnt that important HP Regen, Weight Gauge, & Resistance are all fairly important for that play style... a Tallum or even Maj set in combination w/ a Focus weapon or Haste weapon and only taking the -2 Con from either set will give you a good amount of dps w/o taking away from your HP modifiers or Resistances
+5 Str adds more patk but a HP sa weapon doesnt increase your dmg and on a Tank (even high Str SK) +4% Patk from nightmare isnt that great due to -dex... you gain 4% patk and lose atk speed, acc, evasion, run speed, shiled rate yadayada
im just trying to make it clear that while the +5 Str and HP sa + NM will give you higher Patk and high HP you gimped 15 other things getting it while you could have gone w/ a dif setup and gained the dps you wanted w/o damaging 1/2 as many other things
I dont solo and rarely duo and I use this kind of setup (not with nightmare though).
My opinion is that a SK is the more hybrid between tank and with that setup you keep that advantage; the +str give you a correct attack and the DLE boost your HP a lot. With that setup I can make a semi good DD in small group (since I still have to level) and still get enough HP if I need to tank bigger thing (with a Doom armor if needed). And in pvp I get enough HP to resist from archer and most melee (of similar level of course), mages is another story though.
Anyway, your setup is your choice, but I couldnt let you say that we get less HP like this when we get more. For the damage it's more tricky to compare since it's +Patk versus +crit; but since the +crit doesnt increase with buff and since I never solo, I prefer the +Patk.
Feanorr
PS: regarding Raid boss, yes SK isnt the best for it on paper but it doesnt really matter, any tank is good enough to do the job, as long as he is high enough compared to the RB (i.e. not more than 10 level less than the RB I would say ^^).
Anyway, your setup is your choice, but I couldnt let you say that we get less HP like this when we get more.
this is what I said
so... if you -con +str and use a hp weapon... you get you HP back to wat it was b4 you -con... you have lost no hp (infact you prlly have gained a little) but you lost CP, HP Regen, stun resist etc....
i didnt say you would have less HP...
but i did say you can do dmg w/o gimping your Con... its always better to keep your Con if you can do the same dmg w/o -Con... 25% HP sa may give you more HP but Con = more than jus HP
if you can modify your damage w/o altering you stats you will be better off... sometimes this isnt possible but in this case it is
Shield defense rate is excellent on a high dex char (over 100% fully buffed with ease) so there is no need for shield defense rate sets. Reflect damage is the dumbest SA for a tank to ever have. Things don't hit us hard...reflecting % of very little is still very little. The weakness of the SK has to be stun, but it isn't limitless, especially after 76 when fortitude comes into play. Majestic is an outstanding damage set, but the % boost to patk will STACK with your added STR.
As always with any class, play to your strengths and accept your weaknesses. The SK can hit very hard, esp with cubics out and makes a very good dd. In most scenario, there is little to no need for higher hp. Most players sacrifice as much hp as possible to hit harder pve. For pvp, the SK is an awkward hybrid. While it has great defense, the lack of hp makes it a poor damage soak other than when using the Ultimate Defense genre of skills. Since these skills generally negate damage, your total hp is irrelevant to the strength of your tanking. The only scenario where the decision becomes difficult is the 1v1 scenario. Here the -con really hurts as many classes gain stun skills. However, a large portion of these are the archers that sk already tear apart. The only critical loss is increasing weakness to destroyer/tyrant classes, but you will probably not find any consistent way to defeat the warrior class group with skill damage increasing and more ignoring our shield defense. As usual, it is probably best to accept that weakness, and strengthen yourself vs the classes you can defeat best. In the mean time, pray that LS lands on the warrior classes... +int - wit may be a viable consideration.
Simply put, there aren't many scenario where you will actually change the tide of battle with more hp, at least not on an SK. Now a human with 7k hp may have to debate such things.
For pvp, the SK is an awkward hybrid. While it has great defense, the lack of hp makes it a poor damage soak other than when using the Ultimate Defense genre of skills.
GreaterCP Potion..... i think any class w/ good amount of hp and defense is a pretty good dmg soak in pvp these days