I got scammed a +3 emi and 5m and the petition said
"Thank you for contacting us. Unfortunately, we would not be able to help you as Game Masters do not interfere in such issues. This is to maintain a balance stability in the game and to respect our player's freedom. Being a player-versus-player server, players use different kind of tactics in the game to benefit themselves. Therefore, we always suggest our players to be active with their gameplay or while dealing with other players and also to develop a habit of double checking each and every transaction. Feel free to contact us for any other issue. We shall be glad to assist you. Have a nice time playing Lineage II.
This ends the GM petition."
WHAT THE....?!! Do they even spare a thought for the players? I know i was a noob to get scammed, but i mean shouldnt there be at least a little help from the gms rather then an answer like
"Unfortunately, we would not be able to help you as Game Masters do not interfere in such issues. This is to maintain a balance stability in the game and to respect our player's freedom. Being a player-versus-player server, players use different kind of tactics in the game to benefit themselves."
Talk about player's freedom...sheesh,what crappy customer service.
well +1 before lock
not only do they not care, they CANT do anything about it. as far as the game goes, you decided just to be nice and give your items to someone else :(
sorry man, it sux i know
They try to make it resemble RL in that issue.. if you let somenoe trick something off from you thats valuable the laws wont help you for jack unless you can prove it was a theft. Its different with company frauds and stuff and tax cash, lol, they'll hound you down for scamming with taxes :P but person-person exchanges/purchases laws dont do jack. Basically you're free to do whatever you want aslong as you dont screw governments or companies of their profit, lol. Same with l2 and GM's i guess, unless you can prove its a downright theft with means that break the EULA, you're outta luck son :/
sucks but such is life
Scamming is part of the game, and while it's not promoted it's not prohibited in any way shape or form either, as long as all things that are scammed involve only in game things.
If you only didn't scam because you thought it wasn't allowed, you're no better than whoever scammed you, by the way.
I can't even count how many chars tried to namescam me or my friends, how many times I saw shops selling NGSS for ***, Stems for Soul Bow staves, open and closing trade windows to confuse...
Never got scammed out of even a blood mark though.
I once bought 3 4sepulchers entrance passes instead of 3 Sgems, it didnt hurt me much. But i am usualy very careeful with trades etc. And I even created characters with names which could be used to namescam with my name.
Isnt this promoting scams, then? If so i'd start scamming right away.
I don't think you realize but scamming is "allowed" in this game. It is not against the rules. At all. It is part of the nature of this world which is to say it is supposed to be a brutal, unforgiving world where you find allies that help you through it.
This game is not like other games. Your enemies are usually your enemies (not people you just "dislike") and your friends are actually there for you (not just people in chat).
You might want to read a few reviews to get a better idea of what this game's game play is about.
Neverhave been scammed in my entire LII carreer. It's as been stated by some players here above...The KEY is vigilence, attention to what you do and most of double checking when in transaction.
If someone wants to see the stats on your weapon, they can find that out by visiting this site or using a stats calculator. Never give it to them to even try it.
To the Game you indeed were just kind enough to hook up a player with your weapon...You agreed to the trade so there isn't much they can do about a willing 'gift'. Sorry you got scammed mate :/
The purpose of GMs is to hunt rulebreakers and help players with technical problems.
The purpose of GMs is not to babysit players, who are playing with their eyes wide shut.
Scamming cannot be forced on a player. The victim is required to act like a fool, so the best defense against scams is to not be a fool.
Foolish Kitten
I need to be b!itch slapped for being such a Rtard. well once bitten twice shy. still, gms of a game should help players with scams even though it isnt against the EULA. I guess WoW's still #1 in customer service as far as i've seen =/
I need to be b!itch slapped for being such a Rtard. well once bitten twice shy. still, gms of a game should help players with scams even though it isnt against the EULA. I guess WoW's still #1 in customer service as far as i've seen =/
Has nothing to do with customer service levels. You are trying to compare a hardcore PvP based game, to a generic MMO (WoW). Lineage2 is all about player conflict. If you get scammed/PKed/ganked/whatevered you are empowered in this game to hunt down those responsible and punish them yourself.
I need to be b!itch slapped for being such a Rtard. well once bitten twice shy. still, gms of a game should help players with scams even though it isnt against the EULA. I guess WoW's still #1 in customer service as far as i've seen =/
The customer service in this game really is not all that great (most of the time you just get canned answers), but in this case your problem does not have anything to do with quality of the customer service. The problem is that you do not understand that the GMs in L2 do not act against scams because they are lazy, they do not act because in this game, scamming is not against the rules. Complaining about a lack of customer service because the GMs do not give your items back to you like they would in WoW (do not know, I do not play WoW) is like participating in a wrestling match and then complaining "he threw me to the floor! You are not allowed to do that in basket ball!"
WoW and L2 are different games with different philosophies. In L2, you are allowed to be "bad" to other players as long as everything stays inside the game. It is one of the strengths and also one of the things which need getting used to.
If someone takes your stuff, kill him. Repeatedly. As soon as he goes outside town, so that he never can grind in peace again. Have your clan war his clan until they kick him or compensate you for your loss. Tell other clans about him so that he never finds a new clan and has to reroll.
I need to be b!itch slapped for being such a Rtard. well once bitten twice shy. still, gms of a game should help players with scams even though it isnt against the EULA. I guess WoW's still #1 in customer service as far as i've seen =/
How can the GM actually know you are the one that got scammed, and that you aren't just tryign to use the GMs to grab the other guys gear. It really just comes down to your word against his, and if he comes up with a semiplausible reason on why you would turn over all you stuff to him there really is no way of telling whos lieing. So what it boils down to is don't trust anyone with anything you can't afford to lose.
Oh and btw CCP(developers of EVE) have a much better and more responsive customer service than WOW IMO.
The handling of scamming, as Varaya explained beautifully, has nothing to do with the level of customer service.
If you want to see this game's bad customer service, try to pry an answer to a technical problem out of a GM.
("My quest marker is pointing me to Elmore, where I know this quest mob isn't, because it is for sure in Aden."
"I can't tell you where the mob is."
"Can you tell me how to fix my quest marker then?"
"You have to kill a lot of them before you get the item."
"I'd kill them ALL if I could get my quest marker fixed so I can find them..."
"I can't tell you where the mob is.")
You loose 4% of xp (and delevel) on death, equipment costs more than drops give you on regular hunting, PvP is free (with consequences) outside towns, the xp curve puts any monster bashing game to shame, and you cry because someone sells ng shots for a grade, a bone helmet for a doom one, or ask you to lend him your weapon and run away with it?
GMs are not there to make pass an IQ test to understand why you lend your worthy possession to a complete stranger or whatever...
You can't compare L2 and WoW on that. In WoW players are like babies in candyland with waiters to show them the way, so of course they don't want to let scam happen. In L2 it's "you're on your own... survive!".
Mum! There are naughty people who block the hunting spot and don't want meh to play there wawawaaaah :(
scams are allowed and yeah it kinda sucks and yeah for the most part we all hate scammers
if the only thing preventing you from scamming is the fact the gms might punish you, then grats you prolly arnt a very nice person
you know what it feels like to be scammed so if you can go ahead and scam someone else then i worry about your moral code
i got scammed out of about 20k buying gemstone D's labled as SOPs
back when i was 40 got name scammed and basically went to trade my whole inventory to my clan leader, i forgot to take off my weapon and when i did and went to trade it all to the clan leader i realized the huge mistake i nearly made (lost nothing from that but gained the knowledge of what this game is like)
lol i passed him the emi bow which was given from a guildie and he said he would give it a cheapshot enchant but logged off instead and he made me buy some crystals for 5m saying those are mats and return those to him, im a silly goose
Got scammed by the 1AA:1A scam when they sell 1AA for 350.545 something adena...
I allways think that what morons go for this scam...
I laughed so hard I almost fell from the chair when I noticed it.
lol i passed him the emi bow which was given from a guildie and he said he would give it a cheapshot enchant but logged off instead and he made me buy some crystals for 5m saying those are mats and return those to him, im a silly goose
a perfect example of greed gone wrong
dont expect to get anything from anyone in L2 for free
you learned your lesson and aint being a cry baby about it so i bet you will bounce right back ^^
Players don't add SAs to weapons... that's done by a Blacksmith NPC.
Since you have an Emi bow, I imagine that you've been playing long enough to know that. Did he tell you he had a SA Scroll? That he knew "a trick"? An SA "exploit"?
Seriously... sounds like you were trying to get one over on the system, and got one done over on you.
Welcome to the scamm world. i can see you saw only the head of the iceberg. Imagine people faking your clan leader with the tag your clan use with only 1 letter (usually the one you will not notice) different. Yeah, they do some work on plans to steal stuffs from people. Pay more attention, is all the advice i can give. And yeah gm's don't give a damm to this, they could see the server logs to find it out, but they don't care.
I have a buddy that got scammed in WOW where someone keylogged his loggin, stole all his stuff (2 years of playnig) and left him with 42 copper pieces. He said that the GMs go back into the database and gave him all his gear back - why can't they do it in L2??
because you should be smart enough not to get scammed...and for WOW they shouldnt do stupid [censored] like that. Thats what a 12 year old gets for playing too much ><
if they did things like that people could take all their gear off one account, put it on the other and claim someone scammed them.
imho people who hand over their gear to have someone "dupe it" "sa it" "+16 it" "[insert potential scam] it" for them deserve what they get ~> a whole lot of nothing in return.
I have a buddy that got scammed in WOW where someone keylogged his loggin, stole all his stuff (2 years of playnig) and left him with 42 copper pieces. He said that the GMs go back into the database and gave him all his gear back - why can't they do it in L2??
Because that involved the use of a keylogger and other illegal software. I think even NCSoft might refund items lost in this way (but I doubt it).
The only reason why I think NCsoft doesn't enforce scamming is such.
Your buddy buys and L2 account, you set up a scam to scam the GM. Basically it works like this.
Friend A buys L2. Friend A is poor. Friend A tells friend B (or even A himself) to create an account so he can scam himself. He reports to the GM. GM now gives friend A stuff, and in a sense duplicated the item for A.
If they took the thing back from friend B this could be easily exploited to scamming B.
The help GMs will tell you is the daily tips and loading tips that say not to trade anything unless willing to depart with it forever.
Scamming sucks, but it happens a lot. It is part of the ruthless free economy of L2. Hopefully now that you had it happen to you, you will never become scammed again.
I am not saying anything, but it is easy to avoid scams. For the two years that I have played L2 I have never been scammed once!
I have a buddy that got scammed in WOW where someone keylogged his loggin, stole all his stuff (2 years of playnig) and left him with 42 copper pieces. He said that the GMs go back into the database and gave him all his gear back - why can't they do it in L2??
Thats not scamming, that is getting your account hacked and handled completely different. Scamming is done completely in game, does not involve a key logger. Like setting up shop with no grade crystals and selling them for 1k under market value for a grade with a title that reads CHEAP A CRYSTALS.
This game is an expiriment in darwinism. The strong and smart will survive, the weak will get scammed, killed and give the rest of their stuff to me before they leave.
It's the difference between scamming a player and a character.
A roleplayer would understand this. ;)
PS: Kyrael, the bow was given to him by a clannie. This is why I always say it's best to earn your own things. It does make me wonder though: What business do you have fiddling with/"upgrading" an item that doesn't belong to you?
Well whiling scamming isn't breaking any rules. You still think that L2 would take an active interest in stopping people from scamming especially repeat offender. As you can tell from the post that this person is pretty unhappy and good chance they will now quit the game. So the person doing the scamming is actually cutting in to L2 profits. So its actually in the best interest of L2 to deal with these people.
What do you think how many people quit the game due to the open PvP?
It's not in a game's best interest to try to keep all of its customers happy, because the result would be a horrible game enjoyable by none, with no profile, and no point.
What do you think how many people quit the game due to the open PvP?
It's not in a game's best interest to try to keep all of its customers happy, because the result would be a horrible game enjoyable by none, with no profile, and no point.
True. L2, at least for us "western" gamers, is pretty much a niche game. As such, it attracts those who think that the generic "for the masses" games like WoW are not interesting/"hardcore" enough, but of course it also makes people quit who bought the game expecting to get WoW with different graphics. Making L2 into another WoW clone would not help, since WoW is already established and Blizzard spends far more money on advertising, so not many more people would join - and of course existing customers would leave by the thousands, since they joined L2 because it is not like WoW.
I guess the best advice really would be "if you do not like it, leave". Not every game is for everybody, if you want WoW, why not play WoW? There is such a variety of mmorpgs out there, everybody should be able to find a game he enjoys, instead of joining some random game and suggesting to the devs to change it into what he wants it to be like.
i though i was for all not just scams i haven't seen a GM in my hole life and they stop making their names appear along time ago with the /gmlist command with a post of Mistryl saying they supposedly the can turn that off.
Never been scammed yet, there alot about just walk round giran and ull find good 5-10 shops selling soul ore for A Crys. Must work or they wouldnt do it, be nice if items were unique so many chances to scam. Cats earing for one of the boss jewels made me lol
Just my opinion as a comparison to security in real life, the more you give to people to protect them, the more they will fall for a similar but yet uncovered problem.
Nowadays they forbid to use ladders at work, oblige you to wear an helmet for this or for that, but instead of protecting people it makes them unaware of simple daily dangers. It's less important in a video game, but if players are taken care of for every problem they encounter, they won't be able to resolve them by themselves and take precautions to avoid them. If you take slaps, you understand why, you learn and you're stronger. As slaps in a video games are not dangerous, I think it's ok to let the player learn the hard way.
You get scammed once with crystals, you'll learn and you'll pay attention and not only for crystal. If a GM helps you when you fall for a scam, you'll fall for every scam. Maybe you'll even seek them for more drama and GM hugs.
There are things we players can't fight against (third party programs, keyloggers, hacks...) and we can call GMs for that. There are things we are intelligent enough toknow how avoid them. Not allowing trade scams won't prevent trade scams to happen, even in WoW.
So your argument is that people play L2 to be miserable and that what makes it different then WoW ? Interesting theory
Nice spin. While scammers are scum, and it sucks to be scammed, I like that GMs aren't here to hold our hands. Sometimes, a bit more cooporation from GMs could be desired, but in this case you are the one who's responsible for your own things. You just gotta pay attention.
The only reason why I think NCsoft doesn't enforce scamming is such.
Your buddy buys and L2 account, you set up a scam to scam the GM. Basically it works like this.
Friend A buys L2. Friend A is poor. Friend A tells friend B (or even A himself) to create an account so he can scam himself. He reports to the GM. GM now gives friend A stuff, and in a sense duplicated the item for A.
If they took the thing back from friend B this could be easily exploited to scamming B.
The help GMs will tell you is the daily tips and loading tips that say not to trade anything unless willing to depart with it forever.
Scamming sucks, but it happens a lot. It is part of the ruthless free economy of L2. Hopefully now that you had it happen to you, you will never become scammed again.
I am not saying anything, but it is easy to avoid scams. For the two years that I have played L2 I have never been scammed once!
There are always ways for GMs to find out what really happened, trade logs, chat logs etc. What can i say? their the game masters. and Lineage2 and all other ncsoft games cant be rolled back (return to a previous state of your account*ETC before the **** took place*) i think thats just dumb.