So, do you guys think that with the introduction of the fortress battles in Kamael, regular sieging, and all of the special dungeon zones that go in (controlled by fortresses etc), that there will be enough in end-game to warrant increasing xp and drop rates?
Really, up until fortresses you couldn't say there would be enough in the game and so that is why they cheated and just increased the xp times, to hide that.
Now though, since there WILL be something to do, is there any reason to have such low xp/drop rates?
Seriously, after Kamael, why wouldn't you want to increase xp/drop rates, especially if you get a whole lot of new players that want to try it? I can already tell that this will introduce a TON of pvp into the game so I am very much looking forward to it.
Shouldn't the focus of the game be able sieging, pvp, and raiding huge freaking bosses, instead of who is the biggest loser with no life?
ok my thoughts on the grind...
the time to grind from lvl 1 to 70 is ok.
So its just basiclly 70 to 80 that might need a litle notch down. especially when you get closer to 80.
drop rate is in my mind also ok, only thing you might wanna increase is the spoil rate for scavengers.
Personaly I like the hard grind... I think that not everyone should be the best or even the highest level.
I dunno, when you say turn up the xp rate do you mean in all levels? even from 1 to 61 ?
when you say incease the drop rate do you mean materials or more full item drops?
ok my thoughts on the grind...
the time to grind from lvl 1 to 70 is ok.
So its just basiclly 70 to 80 that might need a litle notch down. especially when you get closer to 80.
drop rate is in my mind also ok, only thing you might wanna increase is the spoil rate for scavengers.
Personaly I like the hard grind... I think that not everyone should be the best or even the highest level.
I dunno, when you say turn up the xp rate do you mean in all levels? even from 1 to 61 ?
when you say incease the drop rate do you mean materials or more full item drops?
I like that hard grind as well. And "no" I don't think they should raise xp rates. I don't see why they would, even in view of the upcoming update.
The next update does not invalidate the "theory" behind this game.
I for one am glad that there are only a handful of lvl 80 players.
Actually, the grind from level 1 to level 70 is hideous. The only ones who feel that it isn't are people that have characters between level 70 and 80 who are in the midst of the INSANELY hideous grind. I think that drop rates and XP rates should be boosted so that players can have a little more sense of accomplishment in their gameplay. I also think that every skill increasing level after level 61 should include a brand new skill and not just upgrades to existing ones.
I don't know how someone can say the drop rates are fine and keep a straight face. I played over the weekend leveling an alt character from level 55 to 58, based on the amount of XP needed for each level and the amount of XP I was getting from the mobs, I must have killed over 5000 MOBs in this three day period, but didn't get one drop. As a matter of fact, I haven't gotten a drop for any of the past 8 levels. I haven't even gotten a decent recipe (silver arrow recs aren't decent) or a even a reasonable number of mats. As a matter of fact, I've been playing this alt and picked up every item that a monster dropped and I haven't even gotten enough mats to craft 1 c-grade armor piece. Oh, but I do have enough firework pieces to blow Aden castle off the freakin' map.
I'm all for an increase across the board come CT-1
Actually, the grind from level 1 to level 70 is hideous. The only ones who feel that it isn't are people that have characters between level 70 and 80 who are in the midst of the INSANELY hideous grind. I think that drop rates and XP rates should be boosted so that players can have a little more sense of accomplishment in their gameplay. I also think that every skill increasing level after level 61 should include a brand new skill and not just upgrades to existing ones.
I don't know how someone can say the drop rates are fine and keep a straight face. I played over the weekend leveling an alt character from level 55 to 58, based on the amount of XP needed for each level and the amount of XP I was getting from the mobs, I must have killed over 5000 MOBs in this three day period, but didn't get one drop. As a matter of fact, I haven't gotten a drop for any of the past 8 levels. I haven't even gotten a decent recipe (silver arrow recs aren't decent) or a even a reasonable number of mats. As a matter of fact, I've been playing this alt and picked up every item that a monster dropped and I haven't even gotten enough mats to craft 1 c-grade armor piece. Oh, but I do have enough firework pieces to blow Aden castle off the freakin' map.
I'm all for an increase across the board come CT-1
DS....
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
This game seems to be about the long hard journey. Please keep in mind that I hate what is needed to make money and would love to be able to make my money simply by grinding.
But again, that seems to go against the game's design philosophy.
And yes, going from 77-78 is hard but finally attaining it will make me feel like I truly earned it.
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
Pretty much agree with that, as that point view i also have.
Pretty much in most games there one can fend for them self and get what they whant with a realative ease, here in L2 one has to get help from your clan if you dont whant to spend days trading, crafting, fishing, manoring whatever.
I like to do all that but some dont, I understand that, and that is were the clan comes in with gear ( gathered drops from the entire clan ).
I like the system the way it is now and just increasing the xp and drop will not fix it imo but take away alitle of the felling of L2.
that you have to play alot to get somewere and have fun at the same time.
The problem in this game is that the things that you need a group for - castles, major bosses, fortresses, certain quests, are a small part of the game. The overwhelming part of the game is simply the grind. Something that a computer program can easily do for you because its so mindlessly repetitive. Levelling up takes no skill, only time. The things that do take skill, PvP and the like take huge investments of mindless grind to pay for.
I'd like to see a 10x server or relax server or something here introduced with CT 1, but changing the current servers probably would annoy a fair number of people.
So, do you guys think that with the introduction of the fortress battles in Kamael, regular sieging, and all of the special dungeon zones that go in (controlled by fortresses etc), that there will be enough in end-game to warrant increasing xp and drop rates?
Really, up until fortresses you couldn't say there would be enough in the game and so that is why they cheated and just increased the xp times, to hide that.
Now though, since there WILL be something to do, is there any reason to have such low xp/drop rates?
Seriously, after Kamael, why wouldn't you want to increase xp/drop rates, especially if you get a whole lot of new players that want to try it? I can already tell that this will introduce a TON of pvp into the game so I am very much looking forward to it.
Shouldn't the focus of the game be able sieging, pvp, and raiding huge freaking bosses, instead of who is the biggest loser with no life?
pvp should NOT be restricted to end game.
people should NOT be forced to thinking the only pvp fun is 8x.
fortresses provide ALL levels the ability to siege and pvp. while this is true it is moreso true that those with high end gear/everything else will dominate the lower end.
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
Honestly, I don't think it's become easier to grind. We've just become much better at it. Back in the old days, we had no clue where to go to get maximum XP for our levels, what the best quests were, what's the most efficient armor, or where exactly the NPC's were for the class change quests. Now we're old hands at this so leveling up alts is simplicity in itself....UNTIL you reach level 61 or so and slam into your first really difficult level wall.
I'd freely admit that recently I've become a bit more acquainted with the Korean style of play. With that being said, I've come to accept the L2 philosophy and how it should be played out from a purists point of view. The problem with this is, there are very few Korean-style purists on the NA servers. So NCSoft finds itself in much of the same pickle that Chevrolet was in when it introduced the Nova to spanish speaking markets. It wasn't that the car wasn't good or workable it just had a negative stygma attached to it that prevented it from being popular. It became apparent that a change was in order to make it more appealing in the new market. That's exactly what's needed here.
I guess I've been trying to say, if given an opportunity to get a bunch of new players due to awesome content changes (i.e. Kamael), wouldn't you want to adjust xp rates, and keep those new players interested?
Can you honestly expect some newb to put in 1-2 years in a game this old? Due to other MMO releases, I think you can say the Korean MMO model is flawed, as is anything prior-WoW. Looking at all the other games released before then, which ones are still active? Which ones keep getting new players?
I would also beg to differ and say that the game has gotten HARDER to level, past 40, with all the nerfs to AoE/poling, etc. For those who think it has gotten easier, about how long ago did you get a 2 box??? Buying extra accounts != easier.
The game IS good, it is just pretty sad when a few minor tweaks would get a ton of new players but some of you are so used to eating garbage you don't even think about asking for a steak.
The xp/drop rate should be increased until level 52, then you should be on your own, because you'll be high enough to take some damage if not necesarilly dish it out, unless you fight a high level noob(like that'll happen) and you have high def and attack and can manage to kill a high level, but hey what are the chances? OO-->1.
Although new people can just do the hard level grind from 52-61 then get smacked by the hand of grinding.
I'm not saying you should it 52 in a week or so. But atleast 5x to 20, 4xto 40, 2x to 52, your on your own!
I guess I've been trying to say, if given an opportunity to get a bunch of new players due to awesome content changes (i.e. Kamael), wouldn't you want to adjust xp rates, and keep those new players interested?
Can you honestly expect some newb to put in 1-2 years in a game this old? Due to other MMO releases, I think you can say the Korean MMO model is flawed, as is anything prior-WoW. Looking at all the other games released before then, which ones are still active? Which ones keep getting new players?
I would also beg to differ and say that the game has gotten HARDER to level, past 40, with all the nerfs to AoE/poling, etc. For those who think it has gotten easier, about how long ago did you get a 2 box??? Buying extra accounts != easier.
The game IS good, it is just pretty sad when a few minor tweaks would get a ton of new players but some of you are so used to eating garbage you don't even think about asking for a steak.
nobody puts time into anything recently - look at the "new" games and tell me someone didnt devise a bot for the simple lvl 20 grind in Guild wars. WOW advertises end game in 7days and 5 hrs. i get more wow ads on my clan's forum than L2 ads. theres a difference in the ads too, L2's ads are for invincibility, wow's are for quick end game and cheap gold.
that should tell you what kind of players get drawn into this game as it is currently. invincibility because 1/2 of the players in the end game would rather see a noob perish at the end of an arrow rather than stick close and give lvling suggestions.
in the short span i was in wow i received more lvling tips and help than i ever did in my experience here. i was given 100g free by some troll i never met and we only ever hear of stories like this in l2 when someone quits or decides his clan needs recruits.
its too bad the end game hipocrisy is so rampant, it would be a far better game sans the"lawl bot/bsoe/pr more" types in hero chat.
The xp/drop rate should be increased until level 52, then you should be on your own, because you'll be high enough to take some damage if not necesarilly dish it out, unless you fight a high level noob(like that'll happen) and you have high def and attack and can manage to kill a high level, but hey what are the chances? OO-->1.
Although new people can just do the hard level grind from 52-61 then get smacked by the hand of grinding.
I'm not saying you should it 52 in a week or so. But atleast 5x to 20, 4xto 40, 2x to 52, your on your own!
You know, I would even agree with that, I think that would help. B graders aren't useless.
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
Honestly, I don't think it's become easier to grind. We've just become much better at it. Back in the old days, we had no clue where to go to get maximum XP for our levels, what the best quests were, what's the most efficient armor, or where exactly the NPC's were for the class change quests. Now we're old hands at this so leveling up alts is simplicity in itself....UNTIL you reach level 61 or so and slam into your first really difficult level wall.
I'd freely admit that recently I've become a bit more acquainted with the Korean style of play. With that being said, I've come to accept the L2 philosophy and how it should be played out from a purists point of view. The problem with this is, there are very few Korean-style purists on the NA servers. So NCSoft finds itself in much of the same pickle that Chevrolet was in when it introduced the Nova to spanish speaking markets. It wasn't that the car wasn't good or workable it just had a negative stygma attached to it that prevented it from being popular. It became apparent that a change was in order to make it more appealing in the new market. That's exactly what's needed here.
Though we've gotten better at it, it also has become easier.
New players get free shots and buffs (now buffs all the way to lvl 39), There are the adventure and newbie guides, There is B grade armor (when we started there was none of that so players had to still where C grade in the 50's).
I also think the lvl walls are a bit different as well. And we also have the herbs! As well as weapon SA's and tats.
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
Honestly, I don't think it's become easier to grind. We've just become much better at it. Back in the old days, we had no clue where to go to get maximum XP for our levels, what the best quests were, what's the most efficient armor, or where exactly the NPC's were for the class change quests. Now we're old hands at this so leveling up alts is simplicity in itself....UNTIL you reach level 61 or so and slam into your first really difficult level wall.
I'd freely admit that recently I've become a bit more acquainted with the Korean style of play. With that being said, I've come to accept the L2 philosophy and how it should be played out from a purists point of view. The problem with this is, there are very few Korean-style purists on the NA servers. So NCSoft finds itself in much of the same pickle that Chevrolet was in when it introduced the Nova to spanish speaking markets. It wasn't that the car wasn't good or workable it just had a negative stygma attached to it that prevented it from being popular. It became apparent that a change was in order to make it more appealing in the new market. That's exactly what's needed here.
Though we've gotten better at it it also has become easier.
New players get free shots and buffs (now buffs all the way to lvl 39), There is B grade armor (when we started there was none of that so players had to still where C grade in the 50's).
I also think the lvl walls are a bit different as well. And we also have the herbs!
It's easier.
It's faster, not necessairly easier, well I guess It is a litle easier, but survival wise. But then survival wasn't really an issue, but the buff herbs make it easier, but then people boxed buffers, but then not everyone can box, hmmm. I guess it is easier
people should NOT be forced to thinking the only pvp fun is 8x.
fortresses provide ALL levels the ability to siege and pvp. while this is true it is moreso true that those with high end gear/everything else will dominate the lower end.
which also is wrong.
I completely agree with everyone of these statements. Unfortunately, all these problems have been caused by idiot players moreso than NCSoft. The simple fact that you have the top three or four clans on each server owning all the castles lets you know that these players have all the drive and determination in the world, but absolutely no long-term vision whatsoever. What kind of sense does it make for a group of level 7x players to own Gludio, Dion, or Oren, Innadril, or Schuttgart Castles with either their clan or their alt clans? It makes no sense whatsoever, because all it does is send a message to other players that you have to either:
A) Continue to grind until level 78 to compete for a castle with your clan or...
B) Continue to grind until level 78 so you can join one of top clans on the server.
Either way, it makes for a dead and lackluster game at lower levels. Don't get me wrong, I can understand high levels fighting for Giran, Aden, Rune, or Goddard because of the teleport locations and the money they bring in. However, if most of your crew is subclassing and you own one of the lower castles, you're a very large part of the reason why this game can't attract more people for PvP when it's mainly a PvP game.
Why should my clan start a war with some other low level clan? What are we fighting for? What trangression could they do to me that would make me want to forego leveling to level 78 to be able to PvP? This is the benchmark that has been set by all the higher ups. If I start a war or participate in a war, it potentially stops me from reaching end-game on a game where end-game has become all important.
Power is a large part of this game, but knowing how to use that power is the difference between being a thug and being a hero. The higher level players are consistently drowning the game out and I fear that it's going to carry over to the Fortresses in CT-1. So far, no addition that NCSoft has created has escaped the constant exploitation of the server elite. Why should this release be any different?
Smookie, I'm gonna throw in one little side comment. You and I both play on Seigehart. I don't know about you, but it seems to me like the low drop rate just gets even lower on the weekends on Seighart. And my clan leader tells me that she has seen the drop rates in the game decline overall. At the same time, I occasionally pick up that other players on this forum seem to get much better drop rates. I have in particular noticed this with the European servers. I guess I'm saying, the drop and spoil rates might be low in this game overall. But I also think maybe the drop rates are not uniform across the server, and this might account for part of what you experience.
on lionna and devianne both ive noticed 3 things about the drop rates as you level up:
1 - full drops are still pretty much count-on-able every 2-3 levels.
2 - discounting keymats, the normal mat drops taper off.
3 - keymat wise you can count on being able to craft mid grade gear by the time you catch up to top grade gear; this may sound difficult to explain so i will use B grade as an example...
following the Drop rates you can see that people were not supposed to be in top B by 52. in fact much the opposite drops wise you can expect a top C drop at 53. this means low B by 56ish and top B by 63.
while yes it is possible to be in top b at 52, the game wasnt designed for it (hence speed levelling, easier grind) but it happens anyway. so people complain that drops are horrible, and the argument snowballs into who ebays the least.
the drops arent low, your adena is too high.
nowadays i not only hear about people in A gear pre 61, ive both seen it and done it. i say nerf the drop rate if anything, not boost.
there i said it. thats my opinion as much as it counts.
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
I disagree with that part. Remove the bots and you will cry for mats. Particularily on underpopulated servers.
Maybe I've got my low A-Grade set a bit soon according to the theory of the philosophy of the game (at level 64), but that's the theory. Also Tallum Robe parts drops well. From what I heard about C-Grade warrior stuff, it's problematic. Even if you want to go from D to C-Grade at level 50+.
Edit: I bought the recipes. The BH of the clan is too high for Beast Farm now, and he didn't get so many A-Grade Helmet recipes. Just enough for clannies.
Yeah, but remember Smookie, the leveling rate is so much easier now than when we first started.
The drop rate is fine given the whole "philosophy" of the game.
True, in other games equipment drops so regularly that it is possible to equip a character by grinding. However, that isn't really part of what this game is about.
I disagree with that part. Remove the bots and you will cry for mats. Particularily on underpopulated servers.
Maybe I've got my low A-Grade set a bit soon according to the theory of the philosophy of the game (at level 64), but that's the theory. Also Tallum Robe parts drops well. From what I heard about C-Grade warrior stuff, it's problematic. Even if you want to go from D to C-Grade at level 50+.
Edit: I bought the recipes. The BH of the clan is too high for Beast Farm now, and he didn't get so many A-Grade Helmet recipes. Just enough for clannies.
But that's exactly it "you'll cry for mats".
That's what I mean that they are fine for the "philosophy" (for lack of a better word) of the game.
Everything in L2 is long. Leveling, getting a pet and leveling him, finding a recipe as a drop.
When compared to other games the drop rates in L2 are Machiavellian. But when seen in the context of the game they make sense and are "right".
Unlike a game such as WoW (and no, I am not bringing up WoW to say "L2 love it or leave it, etc) where you can pretty much level and get equipment as drops or as pretty easy buys in the store, L2 was never meant to be the type of game where you could just hunt and occasionally get enough to completely outfit you.
It's a game about "long story arcs" of a sort.
Within the context of this game is makes sense.
Also, without bots you would have more players out there actually using scavs and making quite a bit of money selling mats. The one thing about this game (and life I suppose) is that if there is a void, someone is going to move to fill it.
Heck, in the early days of the game, players would buy ng shots and run them from Dev or Lev in order to sell in Gludio for 1, 2, or 3 adena more just to make money.
Eventually the mats would be there. But I feel the demographics of the playerbase would also be different.
people should NOT be forced to thinking the only pvp fun is 8x.
On Lionna, however, it is. I was a 70 SwS in a-grade at the last siege I went to, every LP that hit me did enough damage to kill me in 4 hits (about 2500 damage each time) with me fully buffed and songs up. You cannot siege anywhere on Lionna without having LP coming and crushing it. They go to all the sieges. At least until this last weekend, maybe things are changing. But mostly, if you aren't S-grade with 76+ buffs you're going to be flattened by people with 77+ buffs, boss jewels, OE'd gear, hero's, and super augments like wild magic.
Oh, and while they were doing 2500 to me, I was hitting them for about 40 with my DLE.
And as for non-siege PvP, well, usually someone shows up with their s-grade toon if they get annoyed and kill you. Or they have a friend that does. No, this game is all for the PvPers at the very highest level.
people should NOT be forced to thinking the only pvp fun is 8x.
On Lionna, however, it is. I was a 70 SwS in a-grade at the last siege I went to, every LP that hit me did enough damage to kill me in 4 hits (about 2500 damage each time) with me fully buffed and songs up. You cannot siege anywhere on Lionna without having LP coming and crushing it. They go to all the sieges. At least until this last weekend, maybe things are changing. But mostly, if you aren't S-grade with 76+ buffs you're going to be flattened by people with 77+ buffs, boss jewels, OE'd gear, hero's, and super augments like wild magic.
Oh, and while they were doing 2500 to me, I was hitting them for about 40 with my DLE.
And as for non-siege PvP, well, usually someone shows up with their s-grade toon if they get annoyed and kill you. Or they have a friend that does. No, this game is all for the PvPers at the very highest level.
no offence Valdis, but youre not exactly competing with LP when you bring a 70 sws. i would expect to compete with LP you would have needed those last 8 levels. LP owns sieges because they dont compete without anything less than the best. gear, buffs, levels, skills - all those things are what you also will need to compete with LP.
what i am trying to delicately put is LP cannot be bothered with under76 pvp. those who either choose not to get 76 or are not rich enough to loose a job to grind to 76 can compete for sieges etc using fortresses. after all, there are max limits to levels for fortress competition.
They don't need to increase exp, they just need to make it easier. Every update they make it harder on new players to grind.
Bring back true AoE parties, remove AoE limit for PvE. Let non pole classes hit more then 5 mobs per swing. Drop Pdef/Mdef/Evasion of mobs across the board with exception of bosses. Don't be so stingy on overhit skills. Make exping more interesting and quicker then sitting in cata/pagans/MoS/IT room for 3 months straight.
We have a half a dozen grind spots no one goes to(even bots) because they're too hard, too expensive, too annoying to grind in. Or because they take perfect parties to get decent exp rate out of(Dances, song, summoner, prophecy) which 90% of players don't have immediate access to.
I'm not saying make it like WoW with everyone 80 in a month. But speed it up alittle so the 3rd class/Sub/Noble/80/gear grinds don't burn people out before they even finish 1 of them. Higher level people means more interesting politics means better subscription base.
They don't need to increase exp, they just need to make it easier. Every update they make it harder on new players to grind.
First there came group xp bonus, then there came open field xp bonus, and then there came newbie buffs, then there came Pots, then now there is coming buffs all the way to 40.
You might say I gets harder to grind but comon, It has gotten ALOT easier to lvl in Lineage on every update since Chronicle 3 - 4.
They don't need to increase exp, they just need to make it easier. Every update they make it harder on new players to grind.
Bring back true AoE parties, remove AoE limit for PvE. Let non pole classes hit more then 5 mobs per swing. Drop Pdef/Mdef/Evasion of mobs across the board with exception of bosses. Don't be so stingy on overhit skills. Make exping more interesting and quicker then sitting in cata/pagans/MoS/IT room for 3 months straight.
We have a half a dozen grind spots no one goes to(even bots) because they're too hard, too expensive, too annoying to grind in. Or because they take perfect parties to get decent exp rate out of(Dances, song, summoner, prophecy) which 90% of players don't have immediate access to.
I'm not saying make it like WoW with everyone 80 in a month. But speed it up alittle so the 3rd class/Sub/Noble/80/gear grinds don't burn people out before they even finish 1 of them. Higher level people means more interesting politics means better subscription base.
Yet another brilliant suggestion. There is true intelligence lurking on these forums yet we are still stuck in the mud.
They don't need to increase exp, they just need to make it easier. Every update they make it harder on new players to grind.
First there came group xp bonus, then there came open field xp bonus, and then there came newbie buffs, then there came Pots, then now there is coming buffs all the way to 40.
You might say I gets harder to grind but comon, It has gotten ALOT easier to lvl in Lineage on every update since Chronicle 3 - 4.
Group xp bonus still isn't enough, people refuse to party my prophet because he'll take 500 exp per kill from them. He will be 62 forever at this rate. Pots help certain classes alot.
Btw when I mean new players I mean 50-75. May seem a bit high, but thats when they start coming into server issues/politics. You simply aren't going to have any impact on the game until those levels.
I agree, they increased exp slighty. But they've made it harder to grind itself. Look at last update. Reduced crit dmg, raised mob pdef/evasion, outdoor poling made harder. Theres one thing I can't stand even if I pulling in low exp. Is if the exp rate is slow/hard.
They don't need to increase exp, they just need to make it easier. Every update they make it harder on new players to grind.
First there came group xp bonus, then there came open field xp bonus, and then there came newbie buffs, then there came Pots, then now there is coming buffs all the way to 40.
You might say I gets harder to grind but comon, It has gotten ALOT easier to lvl in Lineage on every update since Chronicle 3 - 4.
Group xp bonus still isn't enough, people refuse to party my prophet because he'll take 500 exp per kill from them. He will be 62 forever at this rate. Pots help certain classes alot.
Btw when I mean new players I mean 50-75. May seem a bit high, but thats when they start coming into server issues/politics. You simply aren't going to have any impact on the game until those levels.
I agree, they increased exp slighty. But they've made it harder to grind itself. Look at last update. Reduced crit dmg, raised mob pdef/evasion, outdoor poling made harder. Theres one thing I can't stand even if I pulling in low exp. Is if the exp rate is slow/hard.
ok your 62 when I played my gladdi lvl 61 I wasent perticulay fast in grinding or even maximise my input of xp.
And I am not a hard core gamer.
But I could sit and play for a 2-3 hours one day and i got 15%.
Now if someone was a real hardcore gamer he would have gotten the level in that day or even more. ( not in 2 - 3 hours but he would have played longer .)
And that is fair in my book.
Talked to a clan member at the same time and he was about lvl 70 but a mage and he got about the same xp as me at the same time frame, basiclly becuse i suck and he is better...
ok...
... I have lost my point completly but I fell bad just deleting my entire post so I post it anyway.
Happy hunting!
Heck, in the early days of the game, players would buy ng shots and run them from Dev or Lev in order to sell in Gludio for 1, 2, or 3 adena more just to make money.
Back in the days just after OB I used to run to Gludin, by loads of normal healing pots and then run back to SODA and set up shop. Still didn't earn me enough for my apprentice staff though :(
They don't need to increase exp, they just need to make it easier. Every update they make it harder on new players to grind.
First there came group xp bonus, then there came open field xp bonus, and then there came newbie buffs, then there came Pots, then now there is coming buffs all the way to 40.
You might say I gets harder to grind but comon, It has gotten ALOT easier to lvl in Lineage on every update since Chronicle 3 - 4.
Group xp bonus still isn't enough, people refuse to party my prophet because he'll take 500 exp per kill from them. He will be 62 forever at this rate. Pots help certain classes alot.
Btw when I mean new players I mean 50-75. May seem a bit high, but thats when they start coming into server issues/politics. You simply aren't going to have any impact on the game until those levels.
I agree, they increased exp slighty. But they've made it harder to grind itself. Look at last update. Reduced crit dmg, raised mob pdef/evasion, outdoor poling made harder. Theres one thing I can't stand even if I pulling in low exp. Is if the exp rate is slow/hard.
ok your 62 when I played my gladdi lvl 61 I wasent perticulay fast in grinding or even maximise my input of xp.
And I am not a hard core gamer.
But I could sit and play for a 2-3 hours one day and i got 15%.
Now if someone was a real hardcore gamer he would have gotten the level in that day or even more. ( not in 2 - 3 hours but he would have played longer .)
And that is fair in my book.
Talked to a clan member at the same time and he was about lvl 70 but a mage and he got about the same xp as me at the same time frame, basiclly becuse i suck and he is better...
ok...
... I have lost my point completly but I fell bad just deleting my entire post so I post it anyway.
Happy hunting!
4% a buffround at level 70 in VoS (more if mage can level in FoTD - I'm Necro) * 3 (per hour) * 3 (hours) is 36% of level 70 I can do in 3 hours. I can probably do 40 if I CDL and maybe up to 45 if I AE the mobs there and pull groups from 2 fields (rare but possible if you play LATE). Mage is rather overpowered in leveling.
Get a pole and go pole with a WL/Destroyer/Dwarf IMO. That should get you more than 5% an hour.
But I had an SPS tell me he got 4% an hour at level 65 and my jaw dropped - so don't feel too bad (he was obviously ebayed as he didn't know crap about his toon, at all...).
no offence Valdis, but youre not exactly competing with LP when you bring a 70 sws. i would expect to compete with LP you would have needed those last 8 levels. LP owns sieges because they dont compete without anything less than the best. gear, buffs, levels, skills - all those things are what you also will need to compete with LP.
what i am trying to delicately put is LP cannot be bothered with under76 pvp. those who either choose not to get 76 or are not rich enough to loose a job to grind to 76 can compete for sieges etc using fortresses. after all, there are max limits to levels for fortress competition.
My point was, I have to compete with LP. There's no other option. They are everywhere. They control every quest boss, as demonstrated yesterday when they wrecked a Prophecy raid by buffing Barakiel and a few weeks ago when they did the same at one of the ToI bosses for Tenebrae. They go to every siege. They even threaten to war our clan because one nuker wants to play in the olympiad.
My point is, I am forced to play on their terms, as is anyone else on Lionna. NCSoft might as well give us a chance.
If this post is truly about "how to "incent" newer players"....by lessening the grind, I would suggest it misses the point.
The new player (truly new) needs to actually play 1-40 to learn how to do the most simple of things.
It doesn't take that long currently with all the game additions from the past 3 chronicles anyway.
What new players need is a PAY RAISE. What has not really changed since C1 is the ADENA drop rate--even though prices have at the very least doubled or tripled.
In C2 if you leveled frugally and straight to 20, you had somewhere between 200-500k. If you manored and somehow beat the bots to the sale AND sold your stuff--you had another few hundred k maybe.
At that time, it was about 1.8 million to buy a top d-weapon from another player on my server. Even after all the changes on my server that 'price' is still 3.0 million (and almost the same to do a Mammon exchange).
The guy that bought his ELS in January 06 didn't spend 2 million. The guy today spends 3 million.
They both get the SAME adena per mob hunting in NOS or AC or OB.
You want to assist new players--give them a 'minimum wage increase' to adjust for inflation! How bout doubling a few of the adena payouts on the lowbie quests?
Yeah, yeah, I know--now the lowbie gets clan oath armor (basically for free--771 d-crystals) and shadow weapon coupons for free....but those aren't top gear the player can take pride in and resell for c-grade or b-grade.
Putting a bit more ADENA into the hands of newbies (ONLY newbies) makes some sense if you want them incented.
They don't need faster xp--it's already REALLY easy and fast to get to c-grade.
So much so that the player arrives at 40 ABSOLUTELY BROKE and is faced with begging, cheating, quitting, or more rarely with finding ways to finally earn some adena....which slows their level progression.
That's why players quit--because coming up with 12 million for a c-weapon at 40-ish after grinding straight through to 40 seems insurmountable.
You want the newbies--then Pay the newbies! :) (and ONLY them for a change)
~D~
I'm sort of replying to a few posts here, and can't be bothered with quoting all of them lol.
Any melee in a good cat party can get as much xp as quickly as a mage :) I don't remember the xp rates at 70, but at 75, I got between 0.5 - 1.0% per buff round in FoTD, that's also with my 75 se in party. FoTD is a little low on xp now, I think it's time for me to head to BS. Anyway, in a good cat group any melee of the same lvl can get as much xp as I can, if not more. There are very few places for mages to solo (we're virtually useless in a cat) and there are many places for melees to solo or group. The last cat party I was in we had a des with a pole, that was just as fast as a mage, without the down time for mp, of course I was on my se only.
About your problem with this LP...it doesn't matter which server you're on. We have darkside vs lightsie on Kain. They're all 76+, most noble, some 80/80. Below 76 is just an average person, because so many have played this game for so long or been pwer lvled, you won't be able to really do much until you spend a lot more time behind the keyboard. I mean seriously, because I've chosen to stay fairly neutral, I'm not bothered by these people and the odd time I do engage in PvP with them, they don't even call for back up..even if I kill them, because I'm only 76 and I'm not a war tag which makes me a nobody. My advice to everyone below 75, is lvl up!! Competing in Olympiad ensures wars, every nble competing wants to be a hero...therefore, they will compete in and out of the stadium, not to mention, whoever you're directly competing against can get a good idea of what you're all about by PvPing onsite freely via war invite.
Not all of us who are 76+ botted or have no life either, some of us anyway have been playing since c1 or c2. I just hit 76 not too long ago, and I've been playing since c1...of course it took me longer than most because I lvled other chars, my sps was not my original main, I have a clan and I lvled alts for rep points etc...
On Kain, I was at the mercy of the "LP" type clans. I was lucky enough to have two different clans do TOI bosses and when it came time for Baium I was even luckier...I happened to know someone in one of the clans from way back in the beginning. The other people up there waiting...not so lucky. They were pked on site and charged for a res. Some are pked inside and then charged for a res...and if you have only 1 bloody fabric, that means you had better pay up for that res, or do that part of the quest all over again...
I guess my point is (I've been kinda rambling), it's like this on every server. Noone is anyone until you are at LEAST 76, even then, nowadays 76 really isn't that great. It sucks, but nothing we can do about it until we lvl up and either A war them with your clan or B join a clan that does war them or C Join them :)
I lvl each one of my noobie chars with clan oath armour...I still have the top d sets, I should probably sell them :) But for the noobs, the clan oath is great, mix it with some noobie buffs and you're set! I do agree that the amount of adena you receive from quests and whatnot definately do not afford you c grade. I usually hunt in NoS from 20-30something, and I get enough D grade drops down there to pay for my shots. Sometimes it's littered with bots, other times it's not. Plus, some clans, will pay you to put a toon through their academy.
Just a couple ideas for true noobs..join an academy, use the clan oath, hunt in cats and necros when you can (for the seal stones and blank scrolls, gives you some extra cash). Most clans will provide the oath armour for you, because really, the cost of it is low (if it's a true noob, I always prove the crystals and a bunch of DSS). I have a set of duals in my cwh for weaponless noobs to borrow until c grade, I used to have three sets but of course people decided to scam me for D duals LOL. Most people who play this game know how difficult it is, and since I don't see NC changing the drop rate of anything, you'll have to utlize all the in game help you can get. I have a lvl 62 WS who can craft a ton of stuff, starting at C grade, I also offer his services free. Whatever is in cwh is free for all in clan, the only thing we ask in return is that people dep their mats and stuff in cwh. There are a few clans like us, you just have to ask around :)