Well as i see it bots go in catacmobs..lets say branded...and u see them in D gear not even top. How do they do this? Altho its not legit they work as a team, real players could learn alot from bots, its sad but true. I mean think of the adena u would save not having to buy top gear and soulshots to SOLO, just hav not so good gear and GROUP. Me and some clannies did this the other day, buffer, and 3 daggers not even in top with +++ sets, we didnt use shots, just lvled, (this in heretics btw) i made about 200k in like 4 or 5 buff rounds, got quite alot of seals for that lvl catacomb and i think we all dinged at least once, and it cost us nothing, oh yes thats right..nothing. People are too caught up in soloing cos its "faster", but if u grouped in D grade to 52 like bots seem to able to, then u can hav top B with all the adena u save.
I dunno just a thought, lets see more REAL players, "playing" like bots do, team effort.
The question isn't about saving adena - it's about level speed. Since that's the top priority for most players, they don't want to hunt without soulshots even though they probably could.
It would be much more reasonable to level with soulshots on and spend the time you save on levelling in selling/buying/manoring/fishing etc. Will net you better profits for sure.
Well i mean in the catacomb the exp is great and we kill so fast 1 big room w/o shots u need another or wait for respawns, if we all used shots we'd still hav to wait or find another room.
And also ppl get so caught up in lvling, i must get top stuff, i must use shots to lvl, i must make a boxed buffer, they end up ebaying for their next grade lol.
Me and some clannies did this the other day, buffer, and 3 daggers not even in top with +++ sets, we didnt use shots, just lvled, (this in heretics btw) i made about 200k in like 4 or 5 buff rounds, got quite alot of seals for that lvl catacomb and i think we all dinged at least once, and it cost us nothing, oh yes thats right..nothing.
I played L2 a few years back. When I left I handed my account over to a friend. When I came back I started a new account. I got a lot of gear and Adena from friends and old clannies, but I'm hardly rolling in dough. It sucks to try to keep up with the Jones' when shots alone cost an arm and a leg. Hell, I feel like a jerk because I want to run from place to place. Ports cost money, you know?
I commend you for playing without shots. As astonishing as it sounds that's possible and it takes a lot of pressure off those of us who aren't interested in playing the market or swiping the Visa.
Oh, and I do have a dwarf. The spoils go to the clan. That's my choice, and something I am not willing to change. It's just about the only way I can contribute to the clan while still being a lowbie.
I've read that back in the early days of the game, when more people were lowbies, there was more grouping and less dependence on shots and gear. But I started in C4, and that's just not the way it is at lower levels now, for the most part.
At the other end of the game, the developers seem to favor adding in tough places which do demand grouping. But I get the impression they are sufficiently demanding that even in groups, players will want to use shots. On top of that, the ever-increasing slope of the XP curve at higher levels provides a lot of incentive to use shots.
You're right. At the beginning few people used shots, everyone ran from town to town (made doing those class changes a pain), and it was really easy to start or join a pickup group. Leveling was slower back then, because few people had good gear, and hardly anybody had gear waiting for them when they hit their next grade.
When we do lowbie raids (20-40) and the RB is a solo one (no minions) most of us don't use shots (except the healer). This saves around 1 - 5K depending on class/grade.
Someone thought we were bots once till we turned our SS on and PKed them for attacking our RB.
I do use shots all the time. I even buy top-grade equipment and use OE'd weapons but that's only because i am able to play the market while i hunted with shots and therefore have enough time to spend making money.
If you are able to earn enough money to grind with shots and afford your next grade, why don't do so?
Well i mean in the catacomb the exp is great and we kill so fast 1 big room w/o shots u need another or wait for respawns, if we all used shots we'd still hav to wait or find another room.
And also ppl get so caught up in lvling, i must get top stuff, i must use shots to lvl, i must make a boxed buffer, they end up ebaying for their next grade lol.
Correction of that last statement:
SOME will end up ebaying...
But you have a very good point that if people would team up more as they did back in C1 and C2 they would need less shots (maybe none even) and still own a catacomb room. Problem is most of the player sthese days want to FLY through their levels to recah the top base and be the Best of the best to own everyone else...There is where the biggest problem came from.
ok im getting the impression that everyone is going to blame the WS again for the cost of shots etc well.... it aint our fault we try to keep the prices down but you guys are forgetting a few things about crafting the first one being its our time we are wasting pressing that **** button and gets very monotonouse its almost like xping but you dont get much reward for it click click click wait for mp regen .... click click click wait for mp regen ... you get the picture :( and the biggest culprits as to the price of shots dan dan dannnnnn the castle lords who always seem to like shoving taxes through the roof remember the price of mats goes up and then in turn so does the shots so wanna blame someone for the prices blame the DD's who own the castles because its pretty **** rare a dorf will be in charge of a castle :(
Rampantliones
A GOOD WARMSITH IS AN HONOURABLE ONE :)
Yes, the true culprit is GREED. No one plays in groups anymore, even though it may be more economically sound and in many occasions, more fun. Everyone boxes (1 to 3 boxes) and "solos" and has no care to party because they only want everything for themselves.
Now that we are in the waning years of this game, the game has filtered out all the players that enjoyed the early playstyles and has left us with the core and essence of what makes up most lineage players. There are a few that stick it out and continue to try and play more socially, but very few, on my server at least.
You are absolutely correct about the bot parties. Players continue to make excuses for their actions and say you can't level in a party. LIES. but oh well, the bots seem to be doing just fine with that model.
But you have a very good point that if people would team up more as they did back in C1 and C2 they would need less shots (maybe none even) and still own a catacomb room. Problem is most of the player sthese days want to FLY through their levels to recah the top base and be the Best of the best to own everyone else...There is where the biggest problem came from.
That is just not true. Solo as an SR I can 2-3 shot mobs for anywhere from 5k-13K xp. teamed with a bunch of people I fight higher level or x4 mobs go thru a ton of arrows and ss and earn less xp. Been there done that.
Maybe it is true for melee classes but certainly not a nuker or archer.
I honestly wish they would make teaming more viable, 2 or 3 people and you hit the limit.
I find it interesting how people can talk about 1-2 shotting mobs... When i engage them it's an all out 30 second fight for my life :)
Splatter you really should try poling. My destro can pole Martys with 4-5 people at lvl 71. The whole fight for your life thing is very true there as you watch you hp bar drop and drop then start back up.
I wish you didnt have to use shots to pole but alas entire group would die if you didnt. VR simply works so much better if your damage output is higher.
I remember C2 and the pickup groups in Cruma. I also remember someone having to explain shots to me and why I should use them. That was around level 25 lmao. Now shots are a necessity at the higher levels. Easiest thing to do is to craft your own shots. There are always a couple of dwarfs who want your business and are not part of the dwarven union. Sometimes scabs are a good thing! :D
Yes, the true culprit is GREED. No one plays in groups anymore, even though it may be more economically sound and in many occasions, more fun. Everyone boxes (1 to 3 boxes) and "solos" and has no care to party because they only want everything for themselves.
Kinda-sorta agree...it's the botting/ebaying side of greed that did this though.
Why? Because Spamming shots solo = slight to good income, while spamming shots in party as a melee often ends in a loss. Usually at a time when you need adena the most.
Thus as soon as the level of 'unearned adena' reached the point that spamming SS in a party became *required* most groups started to splinter and fade, as people couldn't afford to party up without cheating. Which drove a lot of people to quit or change to a archer/nuker who soloes faster, easier and with more income than a poor melee. (To say nothing of tanks or other low damage classes.)
And since a nuker/archer does all the work (easily) in a duo, (And thats all you need...) no live buffer/healer enjoys that. hence they came boxed. And with fewer melee around (they became archer/nuker) the demand for buffers went down as well...which made it into a self-fullfilling cycle of fewer live buffers and more boxes.
That's all I can say to what you wrote PainAmplifier.
As a semi-live heal/buffer I have a better income playing a DD of sorts and even more when I triplebox my SE/PP with a DD or mage relatively speaking.
Best part of the DD I play "solo" with is that it can defend itself in 1v1 PvP or PK attacks.
I have done cata gridning wothout shots. was in a duo, and we only had 1 room (bots had all the others) so instead of killing everything fast and wait for respawn, we turned off shots and cleaned the room anyway, and made some adena :)
ok im getting the impression that everyone is going to blame the WS again for the cost of shots etc well.... it aint our fault we try to keep the prices down but you guys are forgetting a few things about crafting the first one being its our time we are wasting pressing that **** button and gets very monotonouse its almost like xping but you dont get much reward for it click click click wait for mp regen .... click click click wait for mp regen ... you get the picture :( and the biggest culprits as to the price of shots dan dan dannnnnn the castle lords who always seem to like shoving taxes through the roof remember the price of mats goes up and then in turn so does the shots so wanna blame someone for the prices blame the DD's who own the castles because its pretty **** rare a dorf will be in charge of a castle :(
Rampantliones
A GOOD WARMSITH IS AN HONOURABLE ONE :)
My remark was not aimed at Dwarves at all :p
I have one myself so I know how the flow on crafting goes ^^ and I have all due respect for most (some dwarves on my server DO overprice beyond what is really needed due to all the factors you mentioned ).
Greed is the biggest culprit that groups are less and less apparant, be it greed of money, drops or even XP.
But you have a very good point that if people would team up more as they did back in C1 and C2 they would need less shots (maybe none even) and still own a catacomb room. Problem is most of the player sthese days want to FLY through their levels to recah the top base and be the Best of the best to own everyone else...There is where the biggest problem came from.
That is just not true. Solo as an SR I can 2-3 shot mobs for anywhere from 5k-13K xp. teamed with a bunch of people I fight higher level or x4 mobs go thru a ton of arrows and ss and earn less xp. Been there done that.
Maybe it is true for melee classes but certainly not a nuker or archer.
I honestly wish they would make teaming more viable, 2 or 3 people and you hit the limit.
Hence why I say people want it all and now ;)
Sorry more then half the time I'm teamed up with my alliance and although XP less compared to what I'd be making if I'd soloed (or duoed) it, I do grow decently in an evening (it's a question of choosing your locations well). But that ain't the point. You CAN party regardless of class if you do not want to, it's probably just because to you XP > then party and teaming fun.
I do give you the point that NCSoft should improve the XP gain in a team beyond 5 players. That however has been an issue raised and raised again by many players in the suggestion area.
I find it interesting how people can talk about 1-2 shotting mobs... When i engage them it's an all out 30 second fight for my life :)
Splatter you really should try poling. My destro can pole Martys with 4-5 people at lvl 71. The whole fight for your life thing is very true there as you watch you hp bar drop and drop then start back up.
I wish you didnt have to use shots to pole but alas entire group would die if you didnt. VR simply works so much better if your damage output is higher.
I remember C2 and the pickup groups in Cruma. I also remember someone having to explain shots to me and why I should use them. That was around level 25 lmao. Now shots are a necessity at the higher levels. Easiest thing to do is to craft your own shots. There are always a couple of dwarfs who want your business and are not part of the dwarven union. Sometimes scabs are a good thing! :D
So so true ^^ VR does great with higher output...
And Cruma....Oh Man!!! Where are the times you couldn't get one of the rooms there because they were all taken by pick up teams :D I loved it when you entered the tower and always someone would be shouting: Group LF DD's/Healers :D Heeh and the first time I heard about shots I was like: "Euhm...What are shots? :confused:" HA HAAAAA...Ah sweet memories