I'm a PW and i want to hear from all you PWs out there.
I'm enjoying every minute of pw.
Will return with some comments later on.
Feel free to talk about pw in the mean time :). Booya!
Nice :confused:.
I went +4 dex -4 con after 40, should I add +4 str -4 con ? Or with 28 con will I a laughing stock of anyone? :confused:
I'm 61 PW with +4 str +4 dex - 8 con, and dc set (bartz).
I had + str sense I was like lvl 46 or something like that, with PL I had 44 str, and -5 con (31). I was able to lvl like this till 61. I didn't add my +4 dex till I hit 61. but my run speed shot up big! I'm at 192 run speed self buffed (sprint).
working on buying a naga storm.
I'm conflicted on SA's tho, I'm thinking CD cause of the passive increase in CT1...but talking to one of the PW Heroes, I might do what he said and get: Focus.
By the time I was 56 I could get 452 crt rate (almost max).
I had SwS, focus, +3 kris with focus, and augment that added 7.8 crt rate. Last bonus was 49 for crt rate passive.
The lvl 4 crt rate pasive is at 60. And if I understand it right it's a bonus of +50 more crt rate. But the translation says +50%...which would be insane, so I rule out the translation as moronic, and think they meant +50 more, not +50% more.
There was something else about a possible detect trap, disarm trap skill (Kamael Arbalaster gets to set traps). The translation is a bit loose, so I don't trust it very well, but seamily it's a AW skill. But I think PW + AW should get it imo....screw TH's they are already over powered (again loosly translated, not very good to say no PW don't get it).
Deffently learn Summon keys (if you plan to lvl where there are chest, I lvl in dvc alot, chest there, so I learned it to get extra money drops...keys work good, unlock blows!). Don't learn unlock, don't learn elemental heal. save your SP for 76+ skills, and up coming passive.
Entangle, switch, bleed, are great skills to learn for pvp. Really really important to learn how to use switch, it will save your life!!!! It will annoy the hell out of your enemy's, and it's great for training people (bots). Because FD (fake death) doesn't always lose all of your mobs, so switch them to get them off you.
I enjoyed the video where the hero PW did nothing but crits to naga at blazing swamps for 3 mins till it died.
I just did naga this week end.
I swear sat there and crted literally 8 times in a row till it broke with 1 normal hit then back to crts again.mind you naga is like lvl 72 (or close), and I'm 61 atking it.
But i do like the PW best off the 3 daggers.
Yeah I do to. I just wish they where as strong as the TH are. DMG and atk speed wise. the whole PW has more evasion means nothing, cause in pvp it's skill, skill, skill, etc...
Ya, Crit Rate is completley useless for pvp, especially for daggers that go -9 str (all of them?), and in the case of PW his crit power is almost irelevant....
They give us crit rate 4 at 60something but that's only relevant in pve...
I don't really ask for crit power much, just lvl 1 or 2...
Considering TH already has (currently) our crit rate (only a little bit under due to dex); same skill lvl we should get a hell of a lot more crit rate, that's what they thought maybe with the 4th level of crit rate (50%+ more?).
We have other skills such as insane self buffed run speed magic defense way aobve anything th or aw can hope for, however we're still irelevantly low on mdef against mages anyway...
For me personally, I absolutely despise trying to get entangle off in pvp; I'd much rather throw switch up multiple times. Like any other pvp situation, it's always about the skill with witch you play your class. I have AW, and TH friends, some lower, some higher, but I don't think I've lost more than a duel or two to any of them.
To the poster who asked about tatts, nerf nerf nerf the con. I can't tell you how important that is (imo). I'm in doom currently, +4 str -4 con, +5 dex -5 con; Even with the dooms -1 con -1 strength it's really not that bad. However, with that said, if you do nerf that much, don't go focus. I had a focus dagger for c grade, and a crt. dmg dagger for b grade, I found that with the focus I'd pull aggro way too much, and didn't have the HP to back it up. With the crt. dmg though, I can consistently pull out the high numbers when they are needed, but not to a point where I'm stressin out my healer or havin to pop pots all the time.
What do you mean you agrro too much with focus ? :confused:
I really don't get it, you hit the mob... and you agrro what (except the mob itself and the social monsters nearby that you agrro no matter what SA you have on your weapon)? In comparison to not having focus.
I might be too tired at this hour to actually read correctly what you said. :eek:
According to L2 calc. Demon Dagger w/ crit damage out damages Kris w/ focus slightly. (I didn't check Dark Screamer and Crystal Dagger, or Soul Separator and Bloody Orchid)
@GabrielK
He/she means that with a focus dagger, he/she pulls aggro off a tank more often than with a crit damage dagger.
Oh :o. Thanks.
I wonder if i should go with doom dagger with crit dmg :confused:.
Still ways to go until then, not to speak about actually getting a B dagger.
Will Spiritshot help with our skill attack? And also for pve is +4Str +5Dex -8Con still recommended, or is another combination better off till im ready for PvP
and in the case of PW his crit power is almost irelevant....
They give us crit rate 4 at 60something but that's only relevant in pve...
I don't really ask for crit power much, just lvl 1 or 2...
I totally disagree with any one that claims this. I think it's totally off base of what a dagger is.
Our stabs are based off our crt rate.then by P df, followed by skills that boost land rates. back in C2 daggers ignored P df. The having sense C3 they don't.
With Focus death, that increase crt dmg, yet lowers crt rate. A boost to ctr rate for PW puts them a steep above the others. I've already proven that PW can max ctr rate before they even hit 60 for the new passive lvl.
So if you got a dagger party with a WK in it giving cat buff, your going to boost up that crt rate to 500 easily, their fast run, and Blinding blow they can catch any one, FD just means they should win. However (specially after the changes to heavy/light armor) PW will have a harder time come throne 1; do to their low P atk from having the lowest str of the 3 daggers.
Again you don't want to go all out -9 STR...specially if your got to still lvl up to 78/79/80. PW P atk is too low for such a set up to work in pvp, that set up is best for AW > TH. PW would be best off in -2 STR, - 2 CON, +4 DEX, however don't forget that drac has that - 2 CON so you go from 36 con to 34. This imo is most ballenced pvp set up for PW with out nerfing them into the Deck 1 way or the other!
I don't want to get into the what I think they need to do to ballence PW.
Our stabs are based off our crt rate.then by P df, followed by skills that boost land rates. back in C2 daggers ignored P df. The having sense C3 they don't.
I thought crit rate no longer affected the land rate of skills. I am almost positive they removed this and now we all have the same chance pre might mortal, etc. Thought his also started in c3.
Our stabs are based off our crt rate.then by P df, followed by skills that boost land rates. back in C2 daggers ignored P df. The having sense C3 they don't.
I thought crit rate no longer affected the land rate of skills. I am almost positive they removed this and now we all have the same chance pre might mortal, etc. Thought his also started in c3.
That's exactly what i knew too :(. That's what I said what I said.
Was I wrong? :confused:
I even saw the patch notes stating exactly this. One sec. I look it up.
The success rates of Mortal Blow, Deadly Blow, and Backstab skills were adjusted so as not to be affected by the skills that increase critical rates. MP costs of such skills were reduced.
This is what the patch note says. However I don't fully understand this, but does it mean that all the crit rate gained from crit rate increasing buffs is no longer influencing land rate right?
But does that mean that the crit rate itself from our passives/weapontype influence it? :eek:
Does the SA focus on the dagger influence it?
I'm confused :confused: . What's the deal exactly?
Ya, crit rate no longer effects the land rate of dagger skills. The only "stat" that does is pure "Dex". Nothing else raises it, except for a couple skills.
Might Mortal (SA) also gives you a much greater chance to land skills, however this was removed from the game. But when they removed it from the game, they didn't take it off the daggers that already had it. So there are still some daggers floating around with that SA.
The adjustment does not say exactly that, it just says that land rate is no longer influenced by SKILLS that affect crit rate. It does not say crit rate no longer affects land rate....
Or perhaps those skills affected land rate almost like a bug and crit rate NEVER had anything to do with it, it was just those buffs that increased it besides increasing crit rate. That would seem the most reasonable assumption imo :confused: .
Daggers skills and how often they land are only affected by DEX. That is why a lot of TH (I know for sure) go +4 CON +5 DEX -9 STR so that their DEX gives them more ability to land their skills while their CON gives them more endurance in battle. STR on a dagger is only good for PvE because STR doesn't not affect the damage out put of skills.
This I knew already, but if someone could actually explain what the heck that patch note actually means (like i explained) it would be great.
If not, nevermind.
Yup.
The patch note does not say that crit ever actually affected land rate, and it probably never did :). We simply associated the fact that when we had all crit rate buffs we'd land the hits almost every time. And they removed that effect from the buffs so now we automatically considered that it used to be related to crit rate when it was actually related to the buffs that gave crit rate having that additional effect completley separate.
Yup.
The patch note does not say that crit ever actually affected land rate, and it probably never did :). We simply associated the fact that when we had all crit rate buffs we'd land the hits almost every time. And they removed that effect from the buffs so now we automatically considered that it used to be related to crit rate when it was actually related to the buffs that gave crit rate having that additional effect completley separate.
Interesting. :cool: (if not entirely wrong :p)
There is only 4 things that can affect land rate and actually 5 if you really think in depth about it.
1) Your base stats (DEX)
2) Your tattoos (DEX)
3) Your armor (DEX)
4) Your weapon (if your lucky Might Mortal)
And our 5th one is based on skill landing skills on opponents from their back side.
So wrong lol. Focus Death gives a major boost in landrate, 78 passive skill "Assasination" also increases land rate. Mortal Strike according to most people only increases lethal strike chance.
I see, I was wondering about that skill at 55, well, good nevertheless as lethal landing is independant to the blow landing :p and i have it land alot without the blow landing.
Really? Only bakcstab crits from what i saw. Never ever got a deadly blow crit.
I'm more incliend to think abou that lethal bit.
What's the truth really? (besides guesses....)
All the melee skills can crit(dont know about lethal blow at higher lvls, but I have seen crits with DB, BS and BB). The skill description even says raises skill crit rate. I notice more crits when I have it active, don't really notice an increase in lethals though.
Lethal Blow? Dang, so that skill is completley useless until you get to 76?? Backstabs are rarely if ever used.... at least pre bluff, sure it's something.... but more useless to me than i thought.. for now.
**** it :confused:.
Nothing. Since Blows are not ordinary skill attacks, dur to their damage being able to get greatly boosted with critical damage buffs, and they can miss, it awlays says "critical hit" when they land. If they crit there's no message, just the damage is two times higher.
If a lethal landed and it crit, wouldn't it still only take half of the mobs hp? I was screwing around with my 51 PW a little while back, just one hitting the breka orcs with back stabs. One of them I back stabed only last 1/2 of his hp. Checked my combat log and it said "Lethal strike".
So, is it different when it crits and lethal strikes or something?
The thing is when you crit you simply do double dmg...
Lethal is completely independent to actually successfully landing the blow. So, if you lethal and not land the blow you only take half his hp.
If you lethal and successfully land the blow you do 1/2 hp + blow dmg, damage to the mob. And if you CRIT above all this... :) well, 1/2 hp + (blow dmg * 2). Poof.
Ah, so I must have landed a lethal without the blow landing. That restores my faith in NCSoft. When it happened I thought "This is the most ******ED thing I've ever seen"
Only pay attention to Lethal strikes in PVP; Any other time it's useless. When it says "Lethal Strike" in your combat log, in pvp situations, it means that that particular hit bypassed CP, and went straight for HP.
I know that a lethal strike will bypass CP. I know that a backstab will also bypass CP. But if you get a lethal strike with say, a deadly blow, does the deadly blow damage bypass CP when you get a lethal strike as well?
Question about chameleon rest: When does it become usable? At 46 it is useless as it consume 1-2 mana every tick, so you can't rest for squat. I would assume at later levels 58+ ? you will recover mana faster then the skill consumes it correct? Such a dissapointment this skill when you get it... useless. Later on i hope it will be usefull, if i get 1-2 mana per tick back (due to the consumption of the skill) i would be satisfied. Afk rest forever, in the middle of agro mobs :o.
Question about chameleon rest: When does it become usable? At 46 it is useless as it consume 1-2 mana every tick, so you can't rest for squat. I would assume at later levels 58+ ? you will recover mana faster then the skill consumes it correct? Such a dissapointment this skill when you get it... useless. Later on i hope it will be usefull, if i get 1-2 mana per tick back (due to the consumption of the skill) i would be satisfied. Afk rest forever, in the middle of agro mobs :o.
It never really becomes efficient, but if you have to go afk for a few or something in the middle of an aggro field it comes in handy. You still regen while sitting in chameleon..just slowly.
You don't regen mana, not at 46, you loose mana. Later you at least regen mana very slowly? Please answer in the offpost, maybe more ppl are interested :p.
Yes, I can sit in chameleon and regen mp while see through. I use it in the clan hall, when I am waiting for raids, basically whenever I sit and am not trying to regen fast. Occasionally I use it in the middle of a field when I know I have to go afk for 10 minutes or so.
Why use it in clan hall? O_o;;; Does it work against guards when you're red? :P
I use it in ch, just because...no real reason, but since I am usually only sitting in CH when I go afk I might as well be wireframed. Still havent checked to see if Silent Step still works against guards when red. If it does than Chameleon probably does as well...(sucks that you can no longer silent step to avoid curses)
The ONLY skill that bypass CP is Backstab. It can both leathal and critical (does double damage).
A leathal strike has two possibilities.
PVP:
1. Takes all CP
2. Takes all CP _and_ HP, leaving you with 1 hp. As you can see, it doesn't bypass CP..
PvE
1. Takes 50% of mobs HP
2. Takes 70% of mobs HP
well let me see for the last 24 lvls that I've done(40-64). I'd say that your mostly wrong (yes I know thats the discription, it's the way it works that is in question). And sense I've field tested my class (PW) in both PvP and PvE...I feel I have a strong case to back me up (don't pull this SS it, or it didn't happen crap on me ether).
firstly: if you lethal a mob it takes HP to 50%; sometimes you can lethal, and normal blow at the same time. so deadly blow hits lethal then mob ='s 50% HP, skill dmg hits mob take skill dmg = to skill. IE: 1400 dmg (what I normally do as a PW with my 62 skill lvl DB on mobs).
I've might of seen 70% lethals on 1X hp mobs, but thats debatable.
Again, deadly blow can hit to CP before hiting to a player. Doing dmg to CP, then Lethaling (kind of a lag, as if it don't know which to function first). When it does that the Lethal takes all CP, then the player takes (about) 10-15% dmg.
Deadly Blow does lethal (not only does back stab). Also so does blinding blow, and lethal blow 76 skill.
yes BS is the only skill that by passes CP, how ever it can (will, and does) lethal strike. When it Lethals it has 2 choices. hp/CP to 1. Or CP to 1/ HP skill dmg, Depending on the skill dmg.
IE: I can BS crt a player, lethal in 1 hit.. that player will suffer Lethal hit, BS dmg in form of double dmg.. Say: BS crt's for 3500 dmg. that player will take 3500 dmg, and get a Lethal hit to their CP (dropping CP to 1, then CP regen takes effect). If I did a skill crt for 3500 dmg then normal BS dmg is half that: 1750 dmg.
I have seen Lethals lag..I've seen DB hit and only land dmg, and DB hit, and only land Lethal. I've seen BS hit from the front or side and hit Lethals. I've seen and done BS's to players front, after they just turned around and still hit to their HP by passing CP (mobs to).
Only pay attention to Lethal strikes in PVP; Any other time it's useless. When it says "Lethal Strike" in your combat log, in pvp situations, it means that that particular hit bypassed CP, and went straight for HP.
I disagree with this. It's not useless.
Reason, cause when you Lethal a mob it's nice to know when to hit "next target" and get ready to kill that next mob. it's also nice to know if you did a Lethal, or a skill crt. Sometimes its effective to knwo whats going on. you can usually tell when a Dagger hits a Lethal on a mob, even harder to know if you landed one in pvp.
sure you get the message. Personally I play with the system box open, and have it only show dmg in the chat box. pretty effective way to check dmg dooring combat.
well let me see for the last 24 lvls that I've done(40-64). I'd say that your mostly wrong (yes I know thats the discription, it's the way it works that is in question). And sense I've field tested my class (PW) in both PvP and PvE...I feel I have a strong case to back me up (don't pull this SS it, or it didn't happen crap on me ether).
firstly: if you lethal a mob it takes HP to 50%; sometimes you can lethal, and normal blow at the same time. so deadly blow hits lethal then mob ='s 50% HP, skill dmg hits mob take skill dmg = to skill. IE: 1400 dmg (what I normally do as a PW with my 62 skill lvl DB on mobs).
Can't say I'm mostly wrong when you CONFIRM everything I just said!.. I just want to comment on this part, which is the part we disagree on.
Regarding the PvE thing with a dagger, you're more experienced than me, but I've mostly hunted 2-4x hp mobs, and in my experience, it's how I said it is.
First of all because the release notes SAYS so from NC Soft. Second, because it's blatantly obvious that's how it works when hunting multiple HP mobs, can't test it on 1x hp mobs, since my AW (lvl 55) at least, cut through them like butter and it's almost not worth using stabs.
Only thing I'm not certain about, is what happens if your normal stab would do more damage than a 50% or 70% leathal blow would.. only happens on 1x H mobs anyways. My guess is it calculates the case that would do the most damage, think I remember something about that in C5 or Interlude notes.
I can confirm that a lethal strike (with the skill NOT landing) can take 70% of a mobs health away, had it happen twice last night. This was using DB, since I mostly solo and am tanking the mobs(solo as in no buff pet either).
The problem with 1X hp mobs is that they have low P df. and low HP. So when you hit for 1700 dmg to that mob it's going to look like you did 70% dmg (even when you get the message lethal).
If you hit the mob and lethaled but got no dmg from the blow its self, then I'd agree with you. (this milch is where I was disagreeing with you about).
The problem with Lethal hits in pvp, is sometimes the Lethal strike delays. Those making your normal hits hit to CP till it actually lands like it should, Lethal prior to dmg.
The problem with 1X hp mobs is that they have low P df. and low HP. So when you hit for 1700 dmg to that mob it's going to look like you did 70% dmg (even when you get the message lethal).
If you hit the mob and lethaled but got no dmg from the blow its self, then I'd agree with you. (this milch is where I was disagreeing with you about).
The problem with Lethal hits in pvp, is sometimes the Lethal strike delays. Those making your normal hits hit to CP till it actually lands like it should, Lethal prior to dmg.
Did have lethal land...no skill damage just the lethal..first hit on mob. 70% hp gone. Has since happened a few times. On 1x, 2x and even 4x mobs.
I stand firm that 70% lethal is so rare its not even worth mentioning. It may happen, but I don't think I've gotten them.
Now 66 is the real turning point. Blinding blow is just out of this world awesome. I've managed to get it to land (facing the front) on people 76+ in drac sets.
One of the best things about it is that it has a strong chance to make your opponent turn their back to you. It can skill crt, and can lethal, And will increase run speed by 40 (at 66) for about 12 sec., the bad thing is that its power rating is low, compared to your other 2 atks. I'm unsure if run speed goes up by skill lvl, however power rating does.
a common way to play your PW in mass pvp is to do this: BS, BB, BS, DB, BS. If you can chase someone just keep doing BS...I got a few pvp wins cause people try to run, or kite, YOU CAN NOT kite a dagger.
Max run speed I've gotten is 260, with BB active. a 76 TH can get about 263 with dash.
Can't wait to get BB after hearing that ^^ Nice land rate too :)
My experience with 70% leathals is that it's more like 50/50 of the two possibilities. However I notice a huge difference in fighting mobs high or lower level than me, lands alot more the lower level they are.
You say BB can skill crit ? wow, deadly blow never ever crits.
I only get skill crits on back stabs for now.
Very nice then :).
I can't wait for BB too, but i've still got a long way to go :).
You say BB can skill crit ? wow, deadly blow never ever crits.
I only get skill crits on back stabs for now.
Very nice then :).
I can't wait for BB too, but i've still got a long way to go :).
BB does skill crt.
As I said PW is kind of low in skill dmg, its not till 56 that you will see a noticeable change in skill dmg.
The thing I posted about 260 is best case scenario: wind, ww, zerk, + dex, BB active (run speed). TH at 76 is ww, zerk, dash, I'm not sure if I tested that with wind also. BB's active skill time is something like 12-15 seconds. Not very long, but long enough to catch a dashed HE, and many other classes.
Do you have an SS of using Deadly Blow the same mob with the same buffs with different damage then?
If I remember correctly, whenever a blow lands "Critical hit!" will be shown in the system messages. It doesn't mean that you've had a skill crit though, you can only see that by the damage difference.
Yes, you are wrong, that is not a _skill_ crit. I see what you mean, but I'll explain how it works.
All dagger stabs are regarded as a critical hit when it lands, that's why you see "Critical hit!" each time one of your stabs land (pay attention next time, try on an NPC). So in reality, all their skill do a critical hit when they land.
However, there is a difference between a critical hit and a skill critical. A skill critical doubles the damage, obviously. The only way to know if you have done a skill crit is to see that you've actually done double damage on the skill.
So.. for a skill to do a skill crit, it would first have to land the stab critical hit, then do a skill critical!
Just for fun, leathal strikes can land without the stab actually landing.. whaaaat?! :P
Obviously not, mr. level 66. Lets analyze your so called "proof":
1 .You use Deadly Blow.
2. Critical hit!
3. You hit for 2395 damage.
4. Critical hit!
5. You hit for 1433 damage.
Translation:
1. Hey, I'm using my SKILL called Deadly Blow, and I'm gonna hit the mob real hard, yay!! God I love this Deadly blow skill that can't do a SKILL CRITICAL.
2. OMG a critical hit, yes!! That means my Deadly blow skill landed and it did some nice damage!
3. You hit for 2395 damage.
4. Ok, I'm gonna randomly swing my dagger that I'm holding with my arm against that mob. OH MAMA! I hit his face, critical hit again! Not for so much though, since it was only a normal swing and _NOT_ a skill called Deadly Blow that I really like because it hits so hard and can't SKILL CRITICAL.
5. You hit for 1433 damage.
I know what my SS says. I know what my **** skill does.
I'm done arguing with you cause your starting to piss me off.
the skill does crt so just back off already, if you don't think it does then you don't think it does. I'll keep thinking it does, your not going to get me to change my mind just cause your analyzing my SS.
I know what my SS says. I know what my **** skill does.
I'm done arguing with you cause your starting to piss me off.
the skill does crt so just back off already, if you don't think it does then you don't think it does. I'll keep thinking it does, your not going to get me to change my mind just cause your analyzing my SS.
If I'm ******* you off, something must be fundamentally wrong with you, with emphasis on MENTAL!!
Learn to read, learn to comprehend definitions, facts and explanations. Obviously there is nothing common sense can do to help you.. are you a politician by any chance?
Stabs crit when they do damage. They can proc a leathal strike and some of them can also proc a skill critical, but not deadly blow!
Actually you love to be obnoxious, ur one of those people that hides behind the internet. It's not 'cause it's the net that you have to forget about manners...
lol.. I'd say it the exact same way to his face, he's being an idiot for even trying to discuss the inner workings of this skill. How much proof does one need?! His so called "proof" doesn't even prove his point, it actually proves that he doesn't understand how the system window displays messages.
I only talk like this when confronted with idiocy, regardless of topic.
Have a nice day! :)
BTW, and you love to judge people from a few lines of text without actually knowing the person behind the keyboard ^^
BTW, and you love to judge people from a few lines of text without actually knowing the person behind the keyboard ^^
Yes, that's how I judge people on forums. If they don't bring anything positive, and they mock people then I don't have any positive image of them. You can say someone is wrong/ assert a different opinion without mocking/saying bad things of them.
If someone doesn't understand something, then I try to make them understand. If they still don't, then I let them be. I don't mock them. Mocking them would just make me look like an idiot.
Matsumoto... IF you have the same buffs as in the SS, attack the same mob with DB 5 times and the DAMAGE is always the same as in the SS then you either:
A. Have gotten _6_ skill crits in a row.
B. Have thought that the normal DB damage is a skill crit.
Only way to prove that DB actually can skill crit, is to use it multiple times with same buffs on same target and have atleast 1 time when it does double the damage of other landing DBs.
Lionna has loudmouths, so excuse most of those obnoxious posts.
MB has been changed many times since C2. So unless you can actually take a look at the code ncsoft is using for interlude L2, you are only speculating. You can make a education guess by using statistics, but then again you are beyond obsessive if you actually care whether MB simply crits or skill crits.
My suggestion for this problem at hand is to take both your hands, place them on your ears and proceed to "skill crit" by slamming your head into your keyboard. Have a nice day.
This changed from discussing DB mechanics to trying to figure out methods on how to educate people, many posts ago! Certain people just don't want to learn ^^
Yes, that's how I judge people on forums. If they don't bring anything positive, and they mock people then I don't have any positive image of them. You can say someone is wrong/ assert a different opinion without mocking/saying bad things of them.
I did try several times to educate about the skill, but when people are so ignorant.. One must change tactics.
Actually you love to be obnoxious, ur one of those people that hides behind the internet. It's not 'cause it's the net that you have to forget about manners...
Actually you love to be obnoxious, ur one of those people that hides behind the internet. It's not 'cause it's the net that you have to forget about manners...
Hello pot, meet kettle.
Busted :P
So, crit or no crit? Anyone up for some testing? Come on, show us how leet your dagger skillz are.
So, crit or no crit? Anyone up for some testing? Come on, show us how leet your dagger skillz are.
Since the only way to find out if your skill crits is to actually watch the damage, I was too lazy to try to notice on my old Plains Walker. So I can't comment on that based on my own experience. However, I can comment about what has been said in the topic, and other information I have access to.
It seems there is no proof that it can crit. And it's not like the people saying that it can't crit can supply anything other than "There's no proof it can" as evidence. Also, the tool tip for back stab says it can crit. However, the tool tip for deadly blow says nothing of the sort.
So, going from all the info in this topic, I'm going to take the side of "Deadly Blow can NOT crit."
I decided to do a little testing on the Giran manor manger with my PW on Erica. His brother on Lionna refused to reserve some purchases from me, so I had to hit him where it hurt.
Anyways, I took 5 chat boxes worth of deadly blows (not all hit, of course) and not one crit.
To further prove that Deadly blow never skill crits, I've leveled from 40 to 62 on my AW during Interlude and I can guarantee it has never ever skill critted.
Btw, I always thought backstab couldn't miss as long as you were behind the target. But when I was stabbing the manor NPC, I never moved, and I only hit 2 out of 4 times. Was I mistaken?
I noticed the same thing, against both mobs and players. Could be explained by lag why it would miss against mobs and players, or just a lost packet that tell you the target turned around maybe.. or the most logical explanation, it doesn't have a 100% land rate.
On the other hand, if I'm really fast I can use trick and click behind the target and almost at the same time hit backstab, and it will land even though it looks like I'm in front of the target. Guess that's lag though.
On the other hand, if I'm really fast I can use trick and click behind the target and almost at the same time hit backstab, and it will land even though it looks like I'm in front of the target. Guess that's lag though.
hey guys so since this is a PW thread i thought i could get advice here. So anyways im planin on going PW. and its really new to me. i've never played a LE or a dagger class but i like the balance of the LE more than DE. So yeah if anyone wants to give me advice or what i should look out for i would really apreciate it. Thnaks!
hey guys so since this is a PW thread i thought i could get advice here. So anyways im planin on going PW. and its really new to me. i've never played a LE or a dagger class but i like the balance of the LE more than DE. So yeah if anyone wants to give me advice or what i should look out for i would really apreciate it. Thnaks!
PL set, +4 str.
don't lvl up charm. waste of SP, also you don't need mortal blow.
I'm considering a dagger for my first sub, and I'm having a hard time figuring out exactly what advantages the PW has over the other two daggers.
I'm completely green with daggers, my experience is limited to rogue academy alts and getting 3-hit while xp'ing. All I know is "turn back to them=bad" and that they stun rather well if they're not in maj.
I'm going to focus on my WL for endgame pvp (whole other discussion), so it's not too relevant for me just how it compares in that regard. What's making me write this post is that just by looking at the list of skills between the different daggers, I can't see much - if any - reason to go PW. While I wouldn't be *completely* surprised if that was the case considering some of the lols ncsoft has previously pulled off, I'd just like some input on what makes a PW a PW. Except elemental heal and self mbarrier.
TH gets FD, crit power passives, crit rate passives, attack speed passives, and Dash 2.
Just not really seeing where PW > TH.
\
Focus death alone make PW > TH.
if you don't want to train ever then AW is better suited for PvE cause PW lacks crt dmg, while they have a hole hell of alot of Crt rate.
PW gets bluff, blinding blow, fast run speed, pretty good evasion, can self buff M df (will be handy in the olym). has more HP/CP then AW, can resist stun more vs their AW counter part.
I'm seeing in the PTS notes that PW and AW had their crit passives buffed as well where the TH ones remain unaffected, which makes sense (in a "why didn't they do that to begin with?.." kinda way).
*
Effect 1: At a low probability, it lowers monsters’ HP by 50% and players’ CP to 1.
*
Effect 2: At an extremely low probability, it lowers monsters’ HP to 1 and players’ CP and HP to 1.
21. Lethal Strike’s effect has been added to Deadly Blow and Blinding Blow.
22. The Lethal Strike and skill critical effects (skill damage x2) have been added to Backstab, and the damage of Soulshots has been increased due to a change in the damage formula.
44. Back stab will now hit to a players HP, no matter how much CP they have.
I admit defet.
Apparently no where in C4/5/interlude notes does it mention that deadly blow does skill crt, only that BackStab does.
Also blindingblow doesn't skill crt it only lethals.
And apparently CT1 has a increased chance to lethal.
so I was wrong as you clearly pointed out...my bad I was looking at things in the wrong way.
Its all about playstyle. Personally, I love my PW when I play him. I have maxed out dex and my evasion and crit rate are crazy. I cant see running that slow and having to use a skill to keep up with the other daggers(th). I guess an AW is ok, their advantage in PvE comes from Hex and Powerbreak I guess, but I still would take my PW(I hardly see hex and PB cast in PvP as most groups are focus firing and the skills basically waste mp on a target that dies in 10 seconds anyway).
AW = hardest crits, hardest hitting. Thats where the advantage lies. Just like PR for archers ^^
Crit rate becomes rather obsolete since it can be maxed with buffs, thus PW loses one advantage. Evasion will matter more in CT1, but unless you're using UE, it wont save you from skills.
I guess if would work if you don't have a buffer but I have a OOP SE so I only use a bow in a Raid. I hate RB AOE skills so I stay back with a bow.
I agree is its mobs like hestia that do AoE sleep, or MP drain, hell a dagger can hit a boss go afk come back 10 minutes later, and move on to the next boss.
same could be said if your using a bow.
I use a bow often, but as a PW I'd suggest having a boxed PP, and a boxed BD. you can do it with out, but its kind of painful, the best thing about using a bow as a PW...your crt rate pwns archers crt rate!!
my friends 77 PR has about 177 (ish), when me at 70+ has 257 (ish), and thats with focus (buff).
if I'm doing bow, I prefer field mobs like FoTD, and I tend to stay away from heart groups. I've done them, you can get good dmg out put, but I don't have CS on my bow so MP gets burned quickly.
Well, it actually works well with just potion of alcarity and a BoP (borrowed gear ftw). I dont kill quite as fast as archers, but I dont get hit near as much so I can solo harder areas than I can just using a dagger. Now I just need to get an A grade bow.
Well, it actually works well with just potion of alcarity and a BoP (borrowed gear ftw). I dont kill quite as fast as archers, but I dont get hit near as much so I can solo harder areas than I can just using a dagger. Now I just need to get an A grade bow.
alacrt is too slow: haste 1.
as a PW, if you don't have 58+ pp then your killing will be slow. what your talking about is worthless. your kill speed wouldn't be a benefit for you to be doing it in that manner. What would be the point of using a bow?
Bow on a PW is for field mobs.
if you can't supply a buffer for your self, then you need to make a party, and head to a dungeon. I do a pp on field mobs.
Well, not all of us feel that we shold have to create a buffer to be able to "solo". I still refuse to create a buffer. If I have a live buffer, it ceases to be soloing doesnt it. The bow isb't actually that bad with Tallum Heavy's attack speed boost, although it isnt that much faster.
I will always refuse to use something outside the expertise of the class.
Sure you can, but why? It should be sufficient just to use the deigned weapon for that class.
Some classes can use 2 or 3 types of weapons, daggers can only use dagger. So when I play PW i always stick to dagger no matter what kind of wep i could borrow. (tried various shadow weapons like a bow or a pole in a pole party i was leeching off... dropped the act soon)
I will always refuse to use something outside the expertise of the class.
Sure you can, but why? It should be sufficient just to use the deigned weapon for that class.
Some classes can use 2 or 3 types of weapons, daggers can only use dagger. So when I play PW i always stick to dagger no matter what kind of wep i could borrow. (tried various shadow weapons like a bow or a pole in a pole party i was leeching off... dropped the act soon)
Franz
----- PW 5x
giving your comments, and your sig. I would assume that you don't want to be 70+.
Lvling in FoD or VoS with a bow is good, those quest are great for mat's. Vamp quest gives 250k, while the other quest (mina) gives 25k for completing it.
Soloing cata's with support is good XP, how ever its a bit slow. I prefer a duo trio, I don't like anything above a 5 man cause the kill speed + respawn isn't worth the small XP gain.
If you insist on being a slow grinder thats you. but if I solo XP (w/ oop support in party, duo) I gain more XP per hour then with 6 people in party. how do you think I did 70-71 in 4 days? soloed martyr's front rooms, with boxed PP 62+ in party, and grinded about 6-10 hours a day. Sleeped about 8-10 hours (ruffly).
Its all about what kind of commitment you have to that chr. Maybe I'm on the more extreme of the grind spectrum.
while in FoD I can make 10% in 2 hours with 3 people in party, and boxing a oop BD.
while Poling is Good XP, it takes alot of support to pull it off, and PW isn't the best Poler after 60.
I just pulled out of Fotd near the bridge last lvl, collectors turned green. mos pagans etc.. I would LOVE to go but cant solo there.
If you found a better mouse trap for a lvl 73 solo with pp buffs pm me the places :cool: besides vamp spot .. unless I feel frisky I tend to stay away from that area.
as a PW, if you don't have 58+ pp then your killing will be slow. what your talking about is worthless. your kill speed wouldn't be a benefit for you to be doing it in that manner. What would be the point of using a bow?
Bow on a PW is for field mobs.
if you can't supply a buffer for your self, then you need to make a party, and head to a dungeon. I do a pp on field mobs.
I'm a PW amost 60 and i played till about a month before The Kamael and just recently came back I was using my level 57 PP (has 58 skills) and I was begining to wonder wether or not it was worth gettign rid of him for a SE.
I was thinkign about this for VR, it seems to me if you hunt in the outdoors you can pretty much keep haste 2 on you via herbs whilst using a alca pot for haste 1 for the short time you may not have herb of atk speed on. Or if hunting soemwhere without herbs use haste 2 pots to fill up that gap.
I was consideirng this due to lack of VR and it was seeming to me that a PW would benefit more with SE with haste 1/2 pots, maybe someone can elt me know how it is 60+ with PP and not having VR but it seems to me as if VR would make leveling up alot easier.
I'm a 77+ WR and I have 62 PP and 62 SE. The 62 PP is only used when I'm in a Open field with a Bow other then that It's SE all the way. :p
I've often do things differently.
Log'd in and out the pp/se combo, keeping the PP in game longer for the use of getting her to 66 for GM 2. After toying around on the PTS my friend and I think we should grind her up to 70 for the combined buffs.
I prefer the SE only cause most of the time I'm grinding in cata's.
I think that a WC is far better tho. however with a WC you don't get btb/bts, ww, or resist buffs. and when you want to grind at higher lvls its best to have good resist buffs.
Also the cool down on COV is 2 long When COV goes away I have wait a while before I can cast it again, and for some one soloing it use way to much sprint ores. With the SE POW is ready to be cast again way before it runs out on you. SE is just a better OOP buffer then WC. WC is better for groups (real groups). :p
Even when I solo RB I use the WC buffs and The SE Buffs. The WC buffs was Better but COV took to long to cool down and I end up taking forever to take out the RB or end up dead. With the SE I can Take out the RB faster and I don't have 2 die.
What are everyone's thoughts on the new chance skill "Dagger Mastery" that reduces WHOLE LOT the skill mana consumption and land rate?
I like the mana consumption reduction a great deal, my mana lasts a LOT longer now even if i don't get mana herbs or i'm in a non-herb zone.
I can't say I noticed the increase in land rate thou, it is there probably. (even an increase with a few percent wouldn't be all that visible, probably only if you run a statistic on a few hundred blows)
I Love it I only use skills now when it shows up saves a ton on my mp. As far as land rate they might as well just not tell us about that part...it's not much of a boost at all but every bit helps. ;)
They made a lot of good changes on Daggers this last few Update. I can solo a 4 mob Room at DO with Mellee resist mobs with just self buffs, NM Light and haste 2 Attack pot, and a few heal pots just fine. Could not do that back in C5. Give me a Buffer and I will take on a 8 mob room but not with melle resist :p
I will always refuse to use something outside the expertise of the class.
Sure you can, but why? It should be sufficient just to use the deigned weapon for that class.
Some classes can use 2 or 3 types of weapons, daggers can only use dagger. So when I play PW i always stick to dagger no matter what kind of wep i could borrow. (tried various shadow weapons like a bow or a pole in a pole party i was leeching off... dropped the act soon)
obviously generic pve setup/buffs, would nt call that bad.
Also the cool down on COV is 2 long When COV goes away I have wait a while before I can cast it again, and for some one soloing it use way to much sprint ores. With the SE POW is ready to be cast again way before it runs out on you. SE is just a better OOP buffer then WC. WC is better for groups (real groups). :p
Even when I solo RB I use the WC buffs and The SE Buffs. The WC buffs was Better but COV took to long to cool down and I end up taking forever to take out the RB or end up dead. With the SE I can Take out the RB faster and I don't have 2 die.
CoV is fine when you o/e it for time. At +3 with standard cast speed set up, it will reset by the time its worn off, about 20-30 second remain before it cooled off. Other wise you still need the BD's cast speed buff to make it cool off faster.
I'd say a +5 CoV will cool off before the skill is actually warn off.
and IDK, I think PoF is better for small room PvE. while PoWind (or cov) is better for a dagger in PvP.
Also; as far as the "dagger mastery," it's no good for PvP, because it probably wont ever fire off. However for PvE its going to single handly make dagger the fastest XPing melee class in the game (or tieing with a zelot tyrant).
the amont of MP you can save from D.M. is alot, you can litterally spam deadly blow on mobs for lethal. not only will it make a dagger level faster, it will help lower our cost in shots.
just the chance to land a lethal with more chances cause of more mp to waste on deadly blow + the increased chance to land skills. Pretty good!
but you have to be melee'ng to get it to fire off, it doesn't fire off skills (not that I've seen). and it doesn't last long enough to be effective tool in pvp.
You've censored PW's second name on main forum page, please, please don't do that.
Alyra please can you remove this censorship? :(
It's not in the best interest of this forum to censor one of the classes' NAMES no matter what that word is related too, the class relation takes precedence, no??
Same goes for AW I guess.
Us pws and aws are censored, shh, we're the underworld.
Seriously now, it's an illegal 3rd party software that contains that word, I wouldn't advise looking for it even or talking about it here. It will get this thread closed, so let's stop it here :p.
But on the other hand, Alyra, can you please remove this word from censorship? The name of my main class is Plains W...er, two separate words, like for AW and in game and in the library it's spelled the same :(.
If you can help us, thank you, if not... :confused:.
In my opinion PW is a character with very good abilities.I wont say PW is better from AW and TH because i thing all dagger classes are very funny to play with.So... The thing i love in PW and play with him for 3 years is that he is elf (peaceful race) but an assassin..kinda dark for an elf! And i love the fact that he does lethals most of the time (aw doesnt do so often and dont mention th :P)Even he lucks on crit dmg in blows he does lethal strikes in blows.Well i think this is awesome thats why i love him so much xD have fun x)
Ok. I'm a plainswalker lvl55 and I still keep that lvl39 Mortal Blow in my hotkey bar. I wanted to know if it is worth keeping there (both for PvE and PvP situations) or I just can forget completely about it (assuming it gets useless as I lvl up) and free that slot for something more useful. Thanks in advance, Kayley.
Don't take mortal blow off your hotkeys.. You have more than enough room for all the skills you need + more, and its still a useful skill.. Easy dmg when you get a dagger mastery and deadly blow is already on cd, and when used with vicious stance, it still does some incredible dmg
Mortal Blow is worthless as you stop getting any more masteries in it past LV 40. I do more damage with a critical from a normal melee attack then with Mortal Blow. I can see somebody maybe using to to B Grade but at her level of 55 I am sure the damage of mortal blow has become very minimal.
I'm an abyss walker, not a pw, but at 64 I still keep mb on my hotkey. I don't know what you need the room for anyway.
The main thing is when dagger mastery goes off, and I just used deadly blow because my mp was full anyway, its nice to still have mortal blow to use, its like a free crit.
Put vicious stance on and try another mortal blow, it should add about 350+ dmg to it. Its a good skill in pvp cuz of that and its good for pve when dagger mastery goes off.
Ok, I did some testing and I was wrong. I went to Garden Of Beast outside of Goddard and I crit for about 770. Mortal Blow did about 800. Using Vicious Stance I crit for about 950 and Mortal Blow did about 1100. So I see Mortal Blow is still effective. This was full buffed btw.