Because their damage is nowhere near what someone spamming pots can counter. If an archer with drac bow crits on you, most players are dead, see the point?
They have better survivability then robe weaarers but it's only a matter of time before someone runs you out of pots or gets in a lucky crit.
for a tank, you absorb more damage than you can put out again. reflect damage doesnt reflect the arrow back onto the archer, nor the spell upon the caster. only melee swings upon the ...swinger.
the tank also has NO damage dealing skills that are a) easily spammable, or b) highly powerful. the paladin has NO damage skills at all. the DA has what, drain? that it.
an archer can stack up his damage up to (9x?) the damage of a regular hit on crit, and they can crit 1 in 2 shots at full range. add to that they can carry MORE potions than a dwarf can and spam like crazy IF they get hit. they use a weapon that is inherently more powerful in Patk than any other weapon in the game.
a mage can stack his magic crits to nearly (what is perceptably) 100%. meaning you Mcrit AT NEARLY EVERY CAST! tried Mcritting when AoE'ing? its severe damage. sure the pve is fast, but its even faster pvp 1v1 or even 1caster vs probly 5-6 of [insert any non-mage class here]
by comparison, the tank is at best a 3 second temporary shield for the rest of the party to SOE or BSOE.
Before you say tanks suck, please take a look around you, OPEN YOUR EYES, and ask advice from people who play tanks like it was their 6th sense. FYI: in typical threads like these, 80% of the people replying don't even play lv78+ tanks themself. Go figure.
Their are tanks in NA L2 who could **** well solo a raid boss (take a look at the second screenshot). You could be one of them, if you started playing the game like a champion from the dark abyss, and definitely stopped asking questions like this on a forum where the general public still has to do their 3rd class change.
Before you say tanks suck, please take a look around you, OPEN YOUR EYES, and ask advice from people who play tanks like it was their 6th sense. FYI: in typical threads like these, 80% of the people replying don't even play lv78+ tanks themself. Go figure.
Their are tanks in NA L2 who could **** well solo a raid boss (take a look at the second screenshot). You could be one of them, if you started playing the game like a champion from the dark abyss, and definitely stopped asking questions like this on a forum where the general public still has to do their 3rd class change.
Good luck.
guess what EACH ONE of those people you posted shots of (with the exception of the ST) uses a bow and a distraction squad to pvp.
yeah, a bow on a tank. go figure. they DONT pvp with SWORDS AND SHIELD!! xLance included. it tends not to work. people in end game walk around with Draconic bows, seldom do you see a "basalt battlehammer" or angel slayer. because bows own. classic Sword and shield tanks dont. end of discussion. Xlance's pdef is a 4shot for an accomplished Hawkeye. but this assumes Xlance doesnt have his resist stun and jewellery on. it assumes he is being ganked by other people outnumbering him at least 3 to 1. he is easily trance+root+para+crit from death with his shield on.. with a bow, he can EASILY defend himself. because he cannot withstand a gank squad. nobody can. its not the only way people can beat him, but its the way its done in end game. either you get ganked, or you gank, or you siege. there is no middle ground. no fair fights.
anyone who says otherwise surely has not gotten there yet.
In the single play RPGs the spellcasters start as very weal and almost useless chars and they must level a lot before their spells become powerfull enough to do some real damage. In this game the spells at any lvl are doing several times more damage then the corresponding lvl melee weapons.
Who cares what weapons a tank uses? Stop roleplaying and start working on your 3000 pvp score, please. If tanks could win 1v3 fights with fists or duals, hell, they'd be using those too. Tanks could use their *** bare teeth to win fights for all I care. It's called strategy and maximizing your potential. The people who achieve least in this game are the people who roleplay. I hope you can acknowledge that fact (When is the last time you saw roleplayers with 3000 pvps or killing Valakas, or winning the L2 battle tournament?).
Any Saggitarius, even completely stacked to the fingernails, does not crit 4,6k pdef for 3000 damage (~12k total HP, so 4shot as you suggest). Don't forget a damage reduction of over 60% from shield toggles and Deflect Arrow, compared to other classes. Trance/root/para? This guy has every boss jewel on earth, on top of 4 80% resistances from his armor set, good luck.
I've seen enough HK/PK movie clips to believe a 1v3 attack could not harm such a character.
Sure, a full gank squad could [kil him]. But so will every class in L2 when confronted by a proper gank team. I don't think the thread starter here is trying to say "Help! My DA can't kill a full gank squad!" either, is he? He's talking about everyday small encounters one may face, and the general idea that tanks suck at handling those...
Which they totally don't. It's just that alot of people try to roleplay, eat out of their nose, complain etc., and only bout 10 people in NA L2 have actually stepped up, and in the end created amazing celebrity icons of their characters in the process.
In the single play RPGs the spellcasters start as very weal and almost useless chars and they must level a lot before their spells become powerfull enough to do some real damage. In this game the spells at any lvl are doing several times more damage then the corresponding lvl melee weapons.
Hey bro, I heard their are these awesome things called MAGIC RESISTS, you should try them out. They reduce damage by up to, like, 80% did you know? Give it a shot!
the say i see a roleplayer giove a rat's behind about a pvp score is the day roleplay dies in lineage2.
it doesnt matter what you use to kill someone. that i will acknowledge. what you fail to acknowledge is that once you step into the "fire a bow and +pvp score" is the day you stop being a proper tank, and become a half-***** DD with decent Pdef. the fact is you kill faster with a bow. the fact is you still wont survive a moment longer with a shield+sword vs an archer than any other class does. the fact is he may have as you suggest every piece of uber gear in the game, which i believe to be true. this makes him pretty well one of a kind. it makes him a minority. one that is easily dismissed as an overacheiver if he is legit. congrats, he wins the game, move on please.
celebrity icons? the most celebrity anyone in the game ever has become is DVC. but nobody outside of the game knows it. this makes him only a celebrity if you think he is famous. next question.
what got up your butt about roleplay? please tell me why it is you find roleplay so distasteful in a game whith an open ended story. yes, story. the thing around which the game was designed. yeah that. there is one, you know. and its very open to interpretation, interpolation, extrapolation, and extensions. the characters themselves are blank pages upon which one can create anything from an angel to a demon. this game was desigend for roleplay just as much as pvp, and pk. did you know valakas has a story? hoho, if not, you suck at playing video games, try mario. i hear the story is easy to follow.
so lets hear it, whats your greatest claim to fame in this game, mister. so far youre just an angry nameless noob. angry at Roleplayers for some odd reason. hell, Xlance likely has his own "persona" in game. i venture to call that Roleplay just as much as a lvl 1 elf pretending to be Eva.
anyone who says otherwise surely has not gotten there yet.
Hows that B grade tyrant going spud?
The people who achieve least in this game are the people who roleplay.
Really? My RP clan has a Clan Hall in Rune, Will be level 7 probably Saturday, Already has the skill item for clan luck, got CoM for our ally, held Gludio Castle for 4 months, and held the most poweful clan on our server with 12 heroes, several cov archer parties, and a mage with enough mag crit gear to one shot all of us from taking our castle for an hour.
Finally to the topic at hand. I have yet to find a non hero archer that I can not beat. With Sword and Shield, Most archers with more buffs in their favor can not beat a properly geared and played tank. A tank with a bow can do very well, however the power of the tanks come in their stuns and roots(which land often). An enchanted shield stun tank can chain stun archers in maj allllll day long.
Well, been reading most of this. Umm, most if not all PvP encounters in L2 are not fair so yeah.
If you play a tank like you are supposed to... which really doesn't exist anymore because there isn't a need for tanks... except maybe raid bosses /grumble VR >.>
But anyway... another thing. Tanks rely on their root/stuns... hmmm i guess you mean DA is technically the only real tank because:
A. TK doesn't get a stun until 77. Arrest is our only real root... we're mostly geared toward killing undead.... holy aura (semi-ineffective aoe undead root), holy armor (why do sws get holy blade >.>) and tribunal (lowers crit rate... what and does Holy damage). I don't know of many undead PCs...
B. SK gets lightning strike but it's unreliable and they don't get a shield stun till 77 and again, only root is arrest which is pretty lvl specific but helps with empower
C. Paladin.... who the heck plays one and if they do... do they even get a non-undead root?
I play a 64 (soon to be 65) TK. Taken me a while to lvl up by choice... more important life issues and it's not really hard to lvl at all, especially now with these herb things. Drac bows from unbuffed SRs crit for a whopping 320 dmg on me with +3/4 NM and deflect arrow. 851 mdef is the best I can get till I can find some reasonable EAAs and even then... most of the people who pvp are high end crazy buffed players. Epic jewlery is crazy to get when they are all farmed by the top allys... it's pretty annoying.
In normal scenarios with normal players, tanks are good at pvp but when you add a rediculous amount of buffs... then it's a problem. I encountered someone at a siege, lv 80 DE archer w/ drac bow.... probably overbuffed as crap. hit me 6 times in a row, 4 crits (imho) and 2x 1dmg blocks. 1.2k dmg hits (pmed him and he said they weren't crits... yeah, ok). How do you compete with that, eh?
If youre a tank and you get owned by an archer, you should reroll.
I think the only thing thats really lacking for tanks is magic defense. Sure we have more than non-tank/non-mage classes, but it still doesnt cut it. Nukes do too much damage, too fast. Resist buffs are easily squashed by Surrenders and Vortex's or Cancel, etc. BSPS is overpowered. Debuffs land nearly every time. Magic crits do ******ed damage.
Hopefully in CT1 nukers wont be so hard hitting with the changes to mdef and resists.
If youre a tank and you get owned by an archer, you should reroll.
+1
I do quite well vs archers and daggers in most situations without having to pick up a bow at all. Currently these are the only 2 classes we are designed to kill very easily. Seeing as how half of the entire population is an archer or a dagger, tanks have it pretty good right now.
Just don't try tanking a destro/glad/tyrant and expect to kill them as easily, because they are setup to kill tanks. And yes, while DA has that mdef self buff, the other 3 tanks need something similar to up our mdef, because I get destroyed by nukers, even with specific resist buffs and magic barrier. But I hear they are adding stuff to do just that in the following updates.
If youre a tank and you get owned by an archer, you should reroll.
There is an exception.... 64 TK being smacked by a lv 80 Ghost sentinel buffed out the [censored]. Even with shield blocking and deflect arrow, self buffs can only do so much when they are still somehow hitting for 1.2k each time... that's a little rediculous imo especially since I've never seen that happen before
So, 16 lvl difference, gear difference and difference in buffs... Yeah, no wonder. Being a tank does not mean that you can survive everything thrown at you.
If youre a tank and you get owned by an archer, you should reroll.
There is an exception.... 64 TK being smacked by a lv 80 Ghost sentinel buffed out the [censored]. Even with shield blocking and deflect arrow, self buffs can only do so much when they are still somehow hitting for 1.2k each time... that's a little rediculous imo especially since I've never seen that happen before
"Mom, Dad! I started this game 2 weeks ago and this guy who's been playing for 3 years just 1shot me!! This is not right! Make me stronger!"