Not too sure which forum this should be in, this or the elf mage forum so i apologise just incase.
I have a 54 Bishop, which i love to pieces, however i am finding it very hard to find groups due to the fact that i cannot buff well. So many times have people taken an EE over me, as they can buff aswell as heal.
I have a few questions, which should help me decide wether i will stick to my bishop, or reroll to an ee. Keeping into consideration, i am fully aware bishops have major group heal/balance life and ee's do not have greater group heal at all.
At 61+, what type of casting speed is typical for a bishop with self buffs, and +4wit dyes? I know this is a hard question, but if anyone can rememeber? Or have a simular bishop level? The reason i ask is in small pvp healing one target, an EE seems to be able to cast major heal faster than i can cast greater battle heal which sucks mp.
Also, if anyone has a 61(level range) what type of casting speed do you have?
The way i look at it, is in my personal play style, i play small groups, and love to heal. I do not do much PVP, mainly due to being in smaller clans. So, an EE with buffs for groups, and recahrge for nuker duos be better for me than a bishop?
Not sure how many people have play both characters, who could give an idea on these?
Depends on what weapon you have too, hopefully it is one with acumen on it. But, if i remember correctly, my casting speed was 803 -- maybe 860 -- or something like that with self buffs... in majestic robes and homunculus/acumen +7, +4 WIT tat.
EEs are nice (I've been playing one on PTS and it's a lot of fun and versatile), yes, but the parties that I got in with them, what their job was to do specific buffs (i.e. clarity), recharge MP, and to back up heal. It's a nice combination. No one, except someone "desperate", would party a Bishop to buff them. That's like depending on the prophet to heal you as well... it's just not good practice.
Regarding EE casting speed... that is just one of their intrinsic advantages... like their running speed.
I don't have the stats on the EE I played for a siege, but same tats same gear same buffs same level (77) I didn't notice that much of a big casting speed difference.
No one will take just an EE to buff in any group either, unless you have empower scrolls.
Anyway a level 77 cardinal's casting speed, with an acumen weapon and no buffs is the following
DC robes: 649
Maj Robes: 591
BW robes: 593
Avadon robes: 591
I have a 54 Bishop, which i love to pieces, however i am finding it very hard to find groups due to the fact that i cannot buff well. So many times have people taken an EE over me, as they can buff aswell as heal.
EEs cannot "buff well". People may prefer EEs because they need recharges, or because EEs are highlevel enough to have Major Heal.
Some of EEs' buffs are handy, but nukers still want Empower, and everyone else still wants Death Whisper.
The kind of people who won't take you into a party because of your weaker buffs are NOT the kind of people who you want to party with anyhow. Find yourself some good people, who like you as you are as a person (not just as one type of character or another) and start hanging out with them.
I admire clans who go out hunting with all kinds of oddly put together parties because they go out with clannies....whoever is on, whatever their class, that is who they hunt with. Now those are people worth partying with, not the ones who reject one person because they want a specific buff from another class.
You forget that the nukers usualy wants clarity and PoWater if it is available from the EE.
My casting speed on a 68 EE without buffs or acument pots is 716 this is with majestic robe, +5wit and acumen weapon. With Acumen3 and dance of concentration (or was it mystic...I always confuse those two) I have 1316 in cast speed.
Going -5men doesn't affect me as an EE because I can buff myself with clarity.
You can add up what ever stats you want to about cast speed, and a Bishop is still better. There is NO OTHER HEAL IN THE GAME that casts as fast, and heals as much as Greater Battle Heal, which ONLY Bishops get. Player cast speed is completely irrelevant, if they are worried about how fast you can heal.
Also, as has been said, if your group is that superficial, find a new group. However, the best for them would be to group you both. With your heals, the EE recharging, buffing and backing you up, not to mention Trance for crowd control, (which you do better because of matk....) a Bishop and an EE are an awesome combo. My ally does Rifts, and that's how we roll into the Boss, and it works extremely well.
Or, if your group is that screwed up, take the EE, and go to a Cata in your level range, and duo. If you get some good team work going, Turn Undead is an awesome way for that duo to level. A 71 EE I know got 6% xp in an hour with she and I doing that in FP Cata. I was 75 Bishop at the time, and we had a 59 SE OOP. If both of you leave, the group can pound sand, and maybe they'll be less of jerks about it next time. :D
Just some suggestions. I'll never bad mouth EE's. I think they are an awesome class, and had I done that instead of Bishop, I'd prolly be an EE. But, as far as all out healing, nobody is even close to us. Nobody.
Ohhhh...If members of that group die, make them take the rez from the EE, which is AT LEAST 20% less than yours...... Maybe they'll think again.
At the OP's level, EE's rez is actually higher than Bishop's one. Because of Wit bonus. Then, EE gets +75% rez bonus quite early in just their regular levelling gear, and I doubt you ever get a "20% more rez" that isn't a buff.
For crowd control with Trance (which, by the way, the OP doesn't have yet), EE is better too, because of both castspeed and runspeed. You don't need high MAtk to land Trance, unless you are hunting dark red sleep resist mobs.
EE lacks Purify, MGH, Mass Rez and (later) Balance Life. Also, EE's Serenade of Eva has been nerfed into oblivion, while Bishop still has working Peace.
You can add up what ever stats you want to about cast speed, and a Bishop is still better. There is NO OTHER HEAL IN THE GAME that casts as fast, and heals as much as Greater Battle Heal, which ONLY Bishops get. Player cast speed is completely irrelevant, if they are worried about how fast you can heal.
I hope you meant Major Battle Heal and not Greater Battle Heal.
Greater Heal, Greater Group Heal and Greater Battle Heal isn't good to use if your party members are fully buffed and you risk to overbuff them.
I use Major Heal as my main heal. It uses little MP and heals for alot (not as much as a Bishops Major Heal because of the INT)
Ohhhh...If members of that group die, make them take the rez from the EE, which is AT LEAST 20% less than yours...... Maybe they'll think again.
Later!
EE's rez is 10% less than the Bishop not 20%, but I would still had choisen the Bishop rez over the EE rez if I had both available.
As for Trance/Sleep yours might land more often, but you lack the casting speed to sleep multiple mobs fast. At lvl 58 I had no problems doing crowd controll at TOI10 (my Trance landed 99% of the time).
I can also do a Serenade of Eva (makes the mobs loose agro) if the party gets to many mobs on them so they can get away from the danger, but it requires that everyone stops hitting the mobs or else they will get the agro again.
But all in all the best healer and rezer in the game is the Bishop there is no doubt about that.
And as you say Boundless a EE/Bishop can duo in the rift or cata very well.
No...I meant Greater Battle Heal. That one never got nerfed, and heals for the full effect, all at once. It is mp expensive, though. But, mp regens faster than xp, on high level toons. Also, we have restore life, which heals a flat 30%. On a dwarf I know (76 fortune seeker, with tatts and gear to max hp), it heals for almost 4k. I use Major Heal 99% of the time. But, if needed, I can drain my mp to save someone. Spamming GBH and normal battle heal (the sub-40 one) I dropped over 10k hps on a titan in about 7 seconds. -Killed- my mp, but he survived. As for not being able to control large crowds effectively.....Not sure what Bishops you normally roll with, but I control crowds as well as anyone I know. The difference in cast speed on Trance is nominal, because the spell is very fast casting. And, for the ~second longer I take, I -know- mine will land, 99% of the time. In the time it takes to recast, I'm Trancing the next target. Bishops can use Peace effectively to kill aggro as well. I saved one of the dou's in FP cata like that. The EE got frisky, and aggro'd all of the mobs in the room. Using trance and peace, I was able to save us. The EE, wasn't prepared, and wasn't much help, unfortunately.
Again, I'm not insulting EE's in any manner. I love the EE class, and would be one if I wasn't caught up in how much I heal for. :D But, like anyone who plays a support class, I take a great deal of pride in what my class does. And, I can only read "EE's are better healers" so many times before I have to respond. We all have our place in the game. It just seems that some people forget that.
Ok, my bad. I wasn't aware that Greater Battle Heal is still the same as it used to be.
...but where did I say that EE are better healers/rezers than the Bishop?
If I aren't mistaken. Peace is single target skill to remove agro from mobs, right?
Serenade of Eva is AoE version of Peace, the only downside is the last nerf they did to it...they made the cooldown time to be 15-20min :( If it get's interupted I have PR to save everyone, but it isn't good to use if you are in an area that takes long time to get to :(
You didn't say that at all. The OP was saying he might reroll from Bishop to EE because of this, that and the other. That's what generated my first post in this thread. Peace is single target. However, it doesn't disturb Trance, so it can still be effective for more than 1 target, assuming you stay calm, and take care of them all. Bishops also get requiem, which is an aoe version, but only affects undead. Sorry it looked like I was shooting at you.
Thank you all for your replies, i've decided to stick with the bishop, i've actually found a clan which is very active, and has active clan parties. It really makes a difference, and being able to heal much more than everyone is makes me that little bit special in there eyes ^_^