no. too low dmg from regular shots, and hard to get 500 crit rate. also arb = low con and low men. mage that knows what he is doing will overcome. 1600 cast speed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 900 atk speed.
Arbalesters are, unfortunately, just too slow. They might get a lucky interrupt once, but I bet the next shot from the mage will really singe that bird's wing.
Also, and I haven't done the research on this, don't mages and archers have greater range than the arbalester? That alone would mean one nuke before the arbalester can even get in range for a shot.
I don't have the 'proof' screenshots anymore either (buried somewhere on blah), but he's correct.
That said, I'm not sure an arablester will have the damage output neccessary to spike a mage down. :<
As for low MEN - I don't get what everyone is on about with that. Not only do Kamael have MDef passives, they have the joint highest MEN (with dwarves and orcs) of any fighter class.
As for their skills, remember a Arb isnt like a regular Archer. They just cant stand there and fire. They use MP like a Glad (thus why cheap shot = clarity on a crossbow...).
From Dark Seed (which is Para, gg), to real target (hex for bolts and arrows, ..wee), to Ultimate Escape (250+ speed, beat that..), to Decoy (spammable hate, which combined with root trap = fun), to *magic resistance* just like a tank (forgot that?)...
The last thing a Arb is worried about is a freaking mage. Even slowed by a SPS, they still have more speed then any mage, even if the mage has Wind up. (due to hard march + ww2 + ultimate escape) So even if they get ganked, they can simply truck on out, lay a trap down as they run (slow, stun, root, take your pick).
I just wanted to see the logic. I believed your initial post, as I didn't have much chance to PVP on my arbalester on PTS, but having the logic there helps with your argument.
Well, I had hoped to give screenshots, but all mine are gone (wweeeee).
Arb's are tricky beasts, and require far more brain cells to use correctly then your typical Archer. With that said, I doubt you'll find very many "good" ones.
well, ashane, being slightly LESS range than nukers an arb would have to NOT face a SH/necro to win. the old argument of greatest nuker now applies to arb's. their skills are MAGIC which means silence is golden. since its hard to resist a SH silence i am SURE a kamael would loose vs sh/necro, and only slightly worried a kamael MIGHT win vs sorc/sps with higher cast speed to interrupt those nice magic skills.
btw if you see an arb kiting you, youre doing something wrong.
and dont start with the dark resist natural of Kamael. 20% dmg reduction makes 1000 damage into 800 damage but its still enough to kill a kamael.
If I am not mistaking, after 40 arbs get the same 900 range as other archers, which is the same as long ranges nukes. Where are we getting this less range thing.
On the other hand, they can warp in ... well, I don't know how far it is.
In either case, I believe silence to be a 600 range skill, and that, in turn, means the nuker spending a rather long time running up to a kamael just to get it off if they wanted to use it.
well, actual firing range of the crossbow is 600 range when last i played an arb on pts. i didnt test it all though, and i didnt pvp much either. i do remember having to be rather close to land real target however.
check your skills again rohirrim. try auto-using some bsps and see which ones fire faster and land more, hit harder with bsps. real target is one of them.
edit: alright, IF most skills are physical Curse of Doom would be the Kamael Bane.
Well I don't know, my Warder is both a nuker and an archer. Its nukes use BSPS and its Arbalest skills takes SS of course. (Warder's nukes are pretty good, with less matk they are as efficient as a nuker's nuke; of course they take a soul to use)
And it seems to crit a lot without any crit buff.
@Ashane : don't worry, it'll take only one good Arbalester to make Sagis/Necros flood the boards with tears.
And yeah if you really have a problem, even only WW2 + Hard March and nobody follows you. You don't need a BSOE :p
Sure that was Warp and not the other version of it? ;P Warp was given at the very last update FYI.
So much other misinformation too, jeez....
Majority of Arb skills are NOT magic. The majority are skill based soulshot usage. Your thinking of Soul Breaker, but even for them the majority of their high powered skills are not magic either (checkmate, etc).
The Arb range *is* greater then 600. Its about 800ish under sharpshooter, 700 under normal. (Give or take, the best we could test with adena drops..)
Furthermore, as someone already pointed out, and as did I, Kamael have the _greatest_ magic resistance, not the least. Arb's have m.def passives that are about equal to knights, plus naturally high men.
Compared to speculation, I've seen S grade Arb's fight S grade Mages, and its not even a contest. The Mages are flat out done.
The only mage I could see having a valid shot at winning would be a Sorc due to Fire Vortex [censored] attack speed.
Sure that was Warp and not the other version of it? ;P Warp was given at the very last update FYI.
Warp was introduced with the opening of the CT1 PTS before CT1 went live.
What update are you talking about?
Actually Warp wasnt in when CT1 went live first on PTS. It was put in about 3/4 days before PTS shut down.
Blink is the skill you are talking about and was live the second PTS was up.
Dont you remember the 3 (or was it 4?) skills that were added in the small update to PTS? And people paying 10M for the books when they were sold in the magic shop :X
The same update that allowed you to gather souls from critical hits, which was not in the original CT1 release on PTS.
Sure that was Warp and not the other version of it? ;P Warp was given at the very last update FYI.
Warp was introduced with the opening of the CT1 PTS before CT1 went live.
What update are you talking about?
Actually Warp wasnt in when CT1 went live first on PTS. It was put in about 3/4 days before PTS shut down.
Blink is the skill you are talking about and was live the second PTS was up.
Dont you remember the 3 (or was it 4?) skills that were added in the small update to PTS? And people paying 10M for the books when they were sold in the magic shop :X
The same update that allowed you to gather souls from critical hits, which was not in the original CT1 release on PTS.
I might have confused them and that it indeed was added in the late patch on the PTS, but I know that Female Kamaels don't get Blink as it is a Male Kamael skill and that they get Warp as Abralaster.
I might have confused them and that it indeed was added in the late patch on the PTS, but I know that Female Kamaels don't get Blink as it is a Male Kamael skill and that they get Warp as Abralaster.
I might have confused them and that it indeed was added in the late patch on the PTS, but I know that Female Kamaels don't get Blink as it is a Male Kamael skill and that they get Warp as Abralaster.
Your still confused ;) (heh)
Blink isnt a male kamael skill.
For some reason I was 100% sure that my brother had Blink on his male Kamael.
I might have confused them and that it indeed was added in the late patch on the PTS, but I know that Female Kamaels don't get Blink as it is a Male Kamael skill and that they get Warp as Abralaster.
Your still confused ;) (heh)
Blink isnt a male kamael skill.
For some reason I was 100% sure that my brother had Blink on his male Kamael.
Which states that only kamael men have a m def problem which they fix with m def passives that only Mages and Tanks get and Female kamael Has the highest M def for a fighter the only ones with higher m def are those in the mystic classes
they even get this as an trickster- 78 Prahnah;Temporarily but significantly increases party members' magic resistance . Consumes 7 soul.
Arbelestors do infact have greater than 600 range DUH what archer doesn't?
40 Increase Range "LEVEL" "2"Increases crossbow range.
Skills useful agains't mages for Arbelestors
Binding Trap-root,
Real Target-surrender to bows, Bleeding Shot- bleed from a distance,
warp-teleport to where you are facing(useful for getting in range for traps),
Slow Trap- slows movement speed
Flash Trap- stuns
Sharpshooting-Temporarily increases Accuracy, P. Atk., range of attack, and critical attack rate when a crossbow is equipped. Immobilized while in effect.
Imbue Dark Seed-Sow a dark seed into the body of an enemy. The seed will grow within body, eating up health and eventually paralyzing the enemy when it is fully grown. Consumes 1 Dark Seed.
Only wrong skill is p something shot in the arbelestor thing and if there are missing skills is that relevant to the skills I posted? also your not seeing the point of the post
hmm..looks like I didn't...you are telling everyone to read lists that are incorrect and then you start telling us allot of stuff that you are only guessing will work. They might work in theory,but a nuker will put you down before you get the traps deployed.
PS: Bring IT ON ya 1 winged freaks and I'll knock the other wing off ye!
Pfft wait till I grow up and I'd like to see you try!
The Cursed Man will just stun you (Low CON, GF) and then the Necro will Silence, Fear/Anchor, and kill you.
That's why I'm currently stuck in Maj LA :( Necro's are *censored* anyways, I can know. Still even at this lvl I was able to win a few duels with casters some lvls above me, high resist and OE jewels helps ;)
I really have my doubts about the 'secret' subclass though, too much troubles to even be able to sub it, and from what I heard it's barely worth it. 10 second buffs every 10 mins? pfft...
I have dueled some, they are trivial. Necros live alot longer than other nukers and drains are very useful in that fight. Kamael Dark resist is non factor since a Necro even at C Grade can have Dark Attribute on his weapon from Blessing of Darkness. Debuff land rate went up in CT1, so everything else lands better. Kamael M.Def is absolutely no problem, seeing as how I can debuff a 79 Doom Cryer after Gloom lands (and it will land) without too much trouble.
Too many debuffs to [censored] Kamael up.
You think a Kamael will win against a Necro after it gets feared? Especially seeing as how Stratics lists so many of their skills at 5-700 range. The only skill I see on stratics that is 900 range for them is Surrender to the Unholy, and Soultaker at 78+ has a passive that ups their Dark Resist anyways (and attribute potion gives 30 which cannot be surrendered off), + Divine Protection.
Soulbreaker would get ***** by an competent Necro/Soultaker. There is no comparison IMO, severe gear/leevl advantage would have to come into play for a Soulbreaker to consistently win a Necro.
There are a few 6x/7x Kamael already and I have run some trials in the Arena, even letting them start in melee range sometimes. Even if I get disarmed, it's easy to kill the even near my level.
CT1 was a HUGE Necro boost. Resist buff nerf put them back in there dmg-wise with the other nukers (and above them when u factor in Gloom > Surrender and Dark Vortex gives more -Attribute than the elemental Surrenders) pre-79. CT1 upped Debuff land-rate also.
Competent Necro > Competent Kamael, if there are no severe gear advantages on either side.
PS: Bring IT ON ya 1 winged freaks and I'll knock the other wing off ye!
Pfft wait till I grow up and I'd like to see you try!
The Cursed Man will just stun you (Low CON, GF) and then the Necro will Silence, Fear/Anchor, and kill you.
That's why I'm currently stuck in Maj LA :( Necro's are *censored* anyways, I can know. Still even at this lvl I was able to win a few duels with casters some lvls above me, high resist and OE jewels helps ;)
I really have my doubts about the 'secret' subclass though, too much troubles to even be able to sub it, and from what I heard it's barely worth it. 10 second buffs every 10 mins? pfft...
High Resist advantage changes in S Grade when nukers come with Attributes on their Arcana Maces. The benefit from those on a nuker is quite astounding.
One thing that will be nice, at the very least in mass pvp, is steal divinity/curse divinity. Depends on land-rate though, I don't have either yet. It sucks for a lvl 60 book to drop from a 54 (?) mob and when I found out about that I was already 61 >.<
I have dueled some, they are trivial. Necros live alot longer than other nukers and drains are very useful in that fight. Kamael Dark resist is non factor since a Necro even at C Grade can have Dark Attribute on his weapon from Blessing of Darkness. Debuff land rate went up in CT1, so everything else lands better. Kamael M.Def is absolutely no problem, seeing as how I can debuff a 79 Doom Cryer after Gloom lands (and it will land) without too much trouble.
Well, in the Olympiad on PTS, the Necro's didnt stand a chance. They got rolled unless they landed a lucky Anchor.
Not to mention which, everytime they walked in the first thing a SB did was Steal Divinity.
Granted if you setup your buffs *just right*, but your still losing 7 and in a self buffed fight.. thats every buff you have. In a full on fight, they woudnt even steal, they'd nuke you for over 200% increase in damage due to all the buffs you'd have on.
I've also fought some of those soul breakers on bartz and frankly they are doing it all wrong. Its almost a joke how they are playing that class :/
Competent Necro > Competent Kamael, if there are no severe gear advantages on either side.
Eh, completely disagree. Competent Kamael > Competent Necro in every way shape and form. You just havent fought one yet... although I know a few on Franz and Teon that are getting it right. (Havent met any on Bartz... all running around with Rapiers.. LOL)
Hmm feel free to indulge me in PM on your view on what weapon to use ;)
On a purely lvling-wise basis tho I'm using a rapier right now. For PvP I imagine something with more m.atk? :o I'm a newb with my SB, I never tried the class on ptr, and I'm still learning currently. If only the books weren't hard/bloody expensive to get by.
Hmm feel free to indulge me in PM on your view on what weapon to use ;)
On a purely lvling-wise basis tho I'm using a rapier right now. For PvP I imagine something with more m.atk? :o I'm a newb with my SB, I never tried the class on ptr, and I'm still learning currently. If only the books weren't hard/bloody expensive to get by.
You've already gotten it ;P
Play it more like a mage and you'll have far more success then praying to land death mark and spamming checkmate.
What's the reuse rate on curse of divinity at any rate?
Most Kamael spells seem to be on the incredibly slow end of things as far as reuse goes.
That's what I'm curious about as well, I heard both steal divinity and curse of divinity have a really fast reuse timer, if it's something like Soul of pain that wouldn't be bad at all.
Granted if you setup your buffs *just right*, but your still losing 7 and in a self buffed fight.. thats every buff you have. In a full on fight, they woudnt even steal, they'd nuke you for over 200% increase in damage due to all the buffs you'd have on.
erm? not counting the Nobless buff or two, what self buffs are you talking about? Shield 1, Might 1, Concetration 2?
Interesting so I should try to exchange my OE-ed DLE for a Som? :p
Well as I said I'm still lvling, but for pvp, definetly gonna keep that in mind...can't wait to give curse divinity a test drive either ;)
Sure, you can exchange your DLE for SoM, but you won't be able to convert your SoM into Rapier or whatever that's called, hence all your skills will be useless. Hope your DLE is at least +10 as then you'll have the M.atk about equal to +3 SoM.
Interesting so I should try to exchange my OE-ed DLE for a Som? :p
Well as I said I'm still lvling, but for pvp, definetly gonna keep that in mind...can't wait to give curse divinity a test drive either ;)
Sure, you can exchange your DLE for SoM, but you won't be able to convert your SoM into Rapier or whatever that's called, hence all your skills will be useless. Hope your DLE is at least +10 as then you'll have the M.atk about equal to +3 SoM.
Thats incorrect as well. The only skills you woudnt be able to use are rapier specific skills, like Checkmate, Shining Edge, etc.
You can still use your magic spells... which are better then all of the above anyway.
I got to see how a soulbreaker works with a mage wep cause so far they're at a disadvantage with the slow cast speed weaker nukers and unable to fix that with tats also they can't wear robes so they're only hope is HIGHLY OE'd mage weapon with SA acumen + a cast speed augment lol also they need to wear bluewolf light
I got to see how a soulbreaker works with a mage wep cause so far they're at a disadvantage with the slow cast speed weaker nukers and unable to fix that with tats also they can't wear robes so they're only hope is HIGHLY OE'd mage weapon with SA acumen + a cast speed augment lol also they need to wear bluewolf light
Oh yeah, speaking of OE'd Kamael weapons, I love just how much P.atk/M.atk you loose when you convert a weapon.
So a +10 DLE would feel more like what, a +3 DLE when couting the damage modifyiers on those converts?
Don't really care about Olympiad, which is never balanced in this buff-based game.
Even regular PvP isnt much different.
Unless you count ganking, which is mostly what a Necro is good at. Obviously.. a ganker should always win.
Sorry, never had much love for the Necro :P Didnt think it was hot before and still dont. Great straight up ganking class tho, but that was never my style :)
Sorry, never had much love for the Necro :P Didnt think it was hot before and still dont. Great straight up ganking class tho, but that was never my style
Haha, however, you play a class that is equally as hated as the Necro's :p
soulbreakers probably cannot count on just the nuke to pvp, but there are a number of ways a soulbreaker can amplify the damage they do with the nuke. the mellee skills are good finishers for after the target finnally gets into attack range or sooner if u use rush or warp. oh btw last i checked m.atk is uneffected when coverting.
Don't really care about Olympiad, which is never balanced in this buff-based game.
Even regular PvP isnt much different.
Unless you count ganking, which is mostly what a Necro is good at. Obviously.. a ganker should always win.
Sorry, never had much love for the Necro :P Didnt think it was hot before and still dont. Great straight up ganking class tho, but that was never my style :)
I seen 4-5 Necros from one clan in a seige last night, and that's not counting how many were in the opposing force (I would think 3+ some of the others who subbed Necro and hardly play their main).
I seen 4-5 Necros from one clan in a seige last night, and that's not counting how many were in the opposing force (I would think 3+ some of the others who subbed Necro and hardly play their main).
So yea, there are alot of Necros in mass PvP.
You are 100% correct :)
4-5 vs... 30+ Archers? :X
Deluded man :P
You know why you picked Necro, because you can gank with it.. thats what you did/do. In mass PvP, a plethora of other classes are far better.
4-5 Necros on each side is alot of Necros at one seige.
Archer is an Archetype with 3 Classes in it (SR/HE/PR). Nuker is an Archetype with 3 Classes in it (SPS/SORC/SH). Necro is just one class.
Would you say 4-5 Bishops vs... 30+ Archers was a non-factor number? SE's? EE's? Prophets? Blade Dancers or Sword Singers?
For the record, Necros are better than over half of the classes in the game in Mass PvP. This includes some Kamael classes.
No one (not me at least) cares about non-stacked PTS Olympiad, though. Lol. Horrible base for a comparison, IMO. The Necros that do Open Olympiad on Bartz are all level 78-80 with +9/12 skills/servitors and stacked with Epics.
I know why you rolled that Necro, you told me why you rolled it in game.
If you think 4-5 Necro's is alot on a siege field, thats just dumb. Factor in just HE's if you want, since the majority are HE or PR. Hell factor in just SR's... more SR's on the field then Necro's.
More SPS's on the field then Necro's, but whatever ;P Continue to think that class rocks because you gank scrubs in hot springs with it..
As for the Oly, your joking if you think we werent stacked too. (+12 summons, GG Bartz?) Epic's dont mean anything because they completely cancel each other out now. (Look ma, I got stun resist... oh wait, hes got stun chance..sh*t!) Newb-a-refic.