Yesterday after the maintenance Frankee's account got unbanned for a few minutes to transfer the clan leadership of Genesiz clan to Flintster. As the most of Hindemith know there was a huge wealth in Genesiz WH - the only Valakas necklase left on Hindemith, Antharas, Zaken (mine), Baium, Frintezza, Ant Queen, IC Set, Drac Bow +6, 1k + BRESS, 600mil - 2bil adena, a lot of other not so expensive things and a clan hall that costs 2 bil adena. Nothing of this is Flintster's. For example the Frintezza necklase and the Zaken Earring was given from me and saw619 when Frankee got scammed. The Valakas necklase was an effort of 170 ppl and it was for the ally, The Baium Ring was a raid for Frankee when he got scammed again an effort of ~100 ppl. The Ant Queen ring was bouth with donations from several clan members for Frankee again after he got scammed, I dont know whos Antharas earring is, the 1000 + bresses are effort of NQ alliance and their sieges, the +6 drac bow and the IC set are Frankee's. the clan hall is bought from the first Genesiz members and Flintster was not even in Genesiz by this time. Actually Flintster has nothing to do with any of these items alone but this is an effort of hundreds of people.
The major problem here comes from that this action with unbanning Frankee's account to transfer leadership for a while was taken too late. The most of Genesiz members left the clan already due to beeing unnable this clan to be leaded or controlled. If it was taken like 4 months ago there was going to be no problems with it. Also unbanning Frankee's account was not only Flintster's effort. I know he hired a lawyer and pushed NCsoft to do this for him, but the thousand of petitions done by NQ members wont be ever forgotten either.
My questions is why when everyone forgot this wealth and the effort put to build it this action is taken. Why one person shuld be oblidged with the effort of hundreds? Why hundreds should be feel scammed by one person (this seems to me as a legal scamming). Why one person should be able to **** a banned account and all this legally?
I know Flintster is a great person and he was a great lider, but one ex leader wouldnt be given such a credit... I know he will never give back to his ex clannies and ally members what they deserve and what is theirs now when we left him to PvP and war the enemies he warred in the past while he stepped back and took a big rest from these wars.
If he got banned then he got banned for a reason. When ever you login you agree to follow the EULA making it legal for them to ban you if you violate the EULA.
Sure it sucks if you where legit in that clan, but if the rest don't give a **** about the EULA and you know it then it's your own fault you lost all those stuff.
You have no idea how long I was looking for a clan until I found one that kicks everyone that violate the EULA in any way.
did he hire a lawyer to harass ncsoft into this? dunno never played hinde, that's just what's on the grapevine.
Besides, if they transfered clan leadership to him they gave him rights to whatever was in cwh, it's not like they could say ok here's clan leadership but give the valakas to joe cause we like joe, give the drac to adam cause he's nice etc etc
My point was that if this action was taken earlier everything would be fine. Now 99 % of the members left to continue having fun and be in clan that could be controlled and he stayed to get the clan back.
Flint promised he will have the clan but after a month of waithing we left cause it was unbelievable. He desided to stay and take "his" clan back from which he gave up long time before. Scamming the clan doesnt happen for the first time. He tryed to steal this Valakas long time ago but he took the right desision and after apologising get back in clan and gave back the Valakas.
Also another point of mine is that I feel like scammed. I never gave my Zaken earring to Flintster but to Frankee. Frankee got banned and it is fine. I took my penalty of giving my earring to a person that have been banned and forgot about it. Now someone who I dont want to own my Earring have it ...
Then all the effort of our ally is in a person we left and I am sure the most of us dont want our effort to be in him. So if it was only cause of the clan I am sure no one has smth against Flint to have the clan hall, but I think we preffer this wealth to dissapear instead of beeing in a person that have nothing to do with it.
If u understand me - I feel scammed and this is in a legal way with the help of NCsoft. Our alliance feels scammed and this is with the help of NCsoft. If all of these items dissapear it will be better for all of us instead of giving them to Flint.
No, when we raided Valakas our clan leader Frankee was playing another account and he transfered all of his stuff on the toon he played. Later we understood that another person knows the info of the account and the same person got kicked from the clan a week earlier.
I d like to correct you. Everyone of us did 5 petitions per day, send rediculous numbers asks to the support team. With his effort he got the stuff back that werent his and were not only his effort.
We gave up cause we tough it wont happend and cause the support team and the GMs were answering us that this is the EULA and nothing can be done. Apperantly the EULA changed, the GMs and the support team changed their minds... I want this explained...
I d like to correct you. Everyone of us did 5 petitions per day, send rediculous numbers asks to the support team. With his effort he got the stuff back that werent his and were not only his effort.
We gave up cause we tough it wont happend and cause the support team and the GMs were answering us that this is the EULA and nothing can be done. Apperantly the EULA changed, the GMs and the support team changed their minds... I want this explained...
Uhm, didnt know about the mass petitions and got ur point
the main problem of that, for example with you, didnt get zaken back because of the fight that bh ppl and flint had( i was in clan by that time)
imo now all that hapenned cant be fixed, if at least frankee was unbanned and then HE decided what to do would be better.
but on the other hand, (i m no one to put my opinion on it ofc) i d rather see flint with it than see it in a wh forever or disappear
Let me explain it again. Flint quit the leadership and gave it to Frankee and Saw. Frankee got banned, after that Saw transfered to Bartz and quit. Flint didnt want the leadership. Me, Zykaths and Trogwar wanted the leadership. Flint desided to take a break from the leading and from the wars he started. Trogwar is now in the enemies, Zykath joined enemies too and now is clanless, I am in BH and continueing the wars Flint started and Frankee kept.
Flint and his small crew of 4-5 ppl were playing against the clan and ally rules and were doing their own things including exping on sieges, doing olympiad for their heroes and giving nothing for the clan. The most of the Genesiz members desided to move to another clan within the ally so we can keep going and to have a clan with a leader. Later after a big dramma BH and imperivm left NQ to build a new alliance without Flint since we were not able to disolve NQ alliance.
Belive me no one in NQ would rather Flint to have our items since he gave up from us and played against us. I personally preffer the WH to be delleted instead of seeing them in a person that quit us, played against us, tryed to scam us once.
my point was that whatever your in clan drama/issues ncsoft doesnt care about it, and neither should they.
If they decided to return clan leadership to toon x that's the end of the story, you can argue about whether it was justified, whether bob that got banned in server x and didnt hire a lawyer would be afforded the same courtesy but end of the day, it's "our decisions are final and we will not discuss the matter further" ncsoft ...
I'm afraid if lawyers were involved this is probably beyond anything you can do in a forum like this. At this point probably be best recourse is to make sure that everyone else gangs up on them. But my guess is he doesn't need you any more and is already tempting some Gustin folks to sign up with him and all those nice clan skills and gear.
This whole thing seems so messy and disappointing on many sides.
sounds like quite the odd problem, but remember they're just pixels (it's easy for me to say that cuz im not affected by it)
That would be a much more powerful statement if this were a free game. However, it's not so I can see why people get upset when things go sour like this. They are paying for a 'service' afterall, right?
Why did NCSOFT unbanned Frankee and gave a chance to take all the ~20 bil worth stuff to a person who is not a leader of the clan? Is it correct working of NC support?!
Give Frankee Leadership and ban him again, take all the stuff from Flintster. ITS JUST [censored] UNFAIR !!!!! NCSOFT WHAT ARE YOU DOING?!!!!
WELL THIS IS WHAT GETS WHEN YOU GET UNLEGIT BOATER CHEATERS IN YOUR CLAN
YOU KNEW IT WAS HAPPENING AND YOU HAD A CHEATER LEADER
YOUR OWN FAULT
NO PITY AT ALL
THX
Why did NCSOFT unbanned Frankee and gave a chance to take all the ~20 bil worth stuff to a person who is not a leader of the clan? Is it correct working of NC support?!
Now where to start...For one don't be blaming flintster for a war EVERYONE in NQ started. A war happen b/c we made it but you blame one person rofl.
As i recall, atleast to 90% of the siege i was at flintster was there on ladycinder most of the time, he did use others but mostly her...only time we had a issue with xping with DS/Airi during a siege which happen once or twice as far as i can remember atleast.
Another thing petitions do nothing in this game. If you want to get something done you have to call them directly, flint did this. He took the extra time out of his day to make this happen, while what u typed / gm ??? That is why he was able to get frankee unban (it seems) for the reason was ******ed in it self.
Maybe if you talked to him for alittle and discussed about it you guys could come to a deal but this probly won't happen b/c we are hinde right? lol
He has the right to keep the items or give some of them back to you guys it his choice now and really as it looks atm its fair in all ways due to him going the extra mile to get frankee unban (for a time??).
Sounds like to me NC broke there own EULA and [censored] on that whole idea "We treat every player fairly" right out the door ... IMO...but thats just my opinion
I'm locking this thread for a few reasons that should be very obvious, but just in case there's any uncertainty, I'll detail why.
One - The forums are not the place to discuss any account-related violations (bannings, hackings, scams, etc.). Period. I've said this many times before. This is no different. Why? The people who deal with those issues aren't here on the forums, and I do not and will not ever have any info on these issues.
Two - No one here at NCsoft will comment on another player's account. An individual's game account and any actions taken on that account are the account owner's business and no one else.
P.S. You're skating on thin ice already, Maya. I lift your forum ban and this is what you choose to post?
Let me clear up all of the misinformation that is floating around in this thread.
Clan leadership has never been transferred by support in the past. We had a gm tool to do this but it was our policy that if the leader quit or was banned the clan was dead. Technically all items in the clan warehouse belong to the clan leader, not the clan. Around the time the clan leader of Genesiz was banned we were going to attempt to change clan leadership for the first time. We understood that membership of Genesiz wanted to stay together (or, I guess just divvy up their loot.) Unfortunately the tool that was supposed to change leadership no longer worked. It was never updated after all the many game updates. (C1 – C5/Interlude) Since so many different database hooks were added, the tool would not only, not work, but could mess up the DB (database) in the process.
So for the last 4 months I had been working on a way to transfer leadership safely. Unfortunately I had run out of time. With the server transfers coming, we (the GM team) were going to have some serious issues. Genesiz owns a clan hall. So now this clan hall is going to mess up the adena reimbursement after the server transfer. We need to get this clan moved or deleted. To do this I had to debug a clan leader account (Frankee.) And attempt to use the old commands to move the clan and clean up the DB issues later. The clan may be broken after the transfer but heck it won’t mess up the adena reimbursement. So after working out the details I looked up the Genesiz roster and found the next highest officer as assigned by Frankee. That was Flintser. So I ungracefully forced the clan leadership change. So ungracefully in fact, that we will not do clan leadership transfers like this again. But we got it to work.
So folks, there ya go. No lawyers. No mass petitions. No Aliens. Just a GM trying to fix things and keep the game running.
On a side note. If you are a clan leader: Do not bot. Do not share your account. Do not access someone else’s account. Ever. Save your clan members the heart ache.