I've never had problems getting a party, even at low level. It all depends on what you want to do and how you want to play. If you're good at playing tank, you'll be easily in-demand for parties, they are very useful.
tanks arn't to popular, because nothing really hits hard, short of raid bosses, and the diferance between the defense of a tank class and a DD class that wears heavy armor isn't that much, for a hunting party tanks aren't really needed, only need tank for raid bosses really.
that said, you shouldn't have to hard of a time finding partys, long as you find a decent clan...
then again you'll proably have a easier time as a SWS, songs are great, and not alotta ppl play sws, since they do fairly low dmg, thus lvling slower.
43
Guard Stance
Increases P. Def. and Shield Defense
success rate.
MP will be consumed continuously.
Ok, as i can see i didnt get that much melee skills anyway.
But i should avoid using Elemental Heal when GStance is activated...>.>
The most interesting skill for me is "Vanguard".
Is Vanguard appropriate for farming?
I even like 2HandSwords.
Level 43
Vangaurd
Display your valor by charging headlong into battle.
Your two-handed sword attacks strike with increased ferocity.
P. Def and Shield Defense are decreased in this form.
How i have to imagine that?
Death after 5 hits from a mob
that is 3 level higher than me? ^^
Some experience reports with
Vangaurd would help me very much, because i
want use it for solo farming if i cant find party.
Sorry for all these newB question, but i
just want to know what i have to expect ^^
(sry about my grammar, its not the best >.>)
EDIT:
Hm....its not realy my intention to create a char only for RBs.
So it would be better to contemplate SwS.
...there should be something like the destroyer class for elves :rolleyes:
Vanguard is really useful for a TK. You can hit really hard and your levelling will go so much faster and cheaper. I used it to solo a good chunk of the way to 70 (or DD when not main tank). Your pdef is reduced to about what a Gladiator would have, so it's no that bad. In most cases, your life cubic can still keep up. You can't use most skills while in Vanguard though.
Although I've played neither actively, I would strongly suggest going SWS. All I have ever heard from tanks is how hard it is to xp. Yes, a tank who starts parties will always have one, so if you go that route, you'd better be an extrovert.
SWS can duo with ANY melee class, and is instrumental in making an aoe party twice as efficient. Besides being able to pull mobs, their songs increase criticals (hunter), magic defence (warding and elemental songs), and physical defense (earth), and health (vitality). Duo with a BD and you will be set.
Once you get to high level, renewal and champion permit you to make 1 party raids possible.
I have a clannie who leveled his sub as an SWS, and he was able to aoe by himself all the way to lvl 75 (where he has since stopped). He did this without any high level buffs, as well, but he did have a boxed SE for heals (i.e. not great heals).
In pvp, I have rarely beaten a SWS on my Storm Screamer (78). After Warding and Storm Guard, I typically hit for 300 damage, and with Wind, they outrun me to pop CP pots or draw me into their friends. Archer parties love SWS for Hunter (crit fest), making them essential for seiges.
I would suggest you think seriously before choosing your class, although you can easily reroll if you change your mind at this level. While a tank could be fun to play, an SWS has a lot more versatility for solo, party, raids, and seiges.
If i decide for SwS, can i play as TK later then as sub-class?
Ive heard the max level for sub-class is Lv80,
does it make a big different to 85?
If yes, i will create a new character for TK,
i want the full potential of this class.
Does ist make much sense to use a Shield as SwS?
I get even no shield mastery :/
Only Sword/Blunt...
That means i get only skills for usin 1
weapon and the other hand is idle...
The passive skills of a SwS are realy...decent...
And its quite unfair, because BladeDancers get somethin like
DualWeaponMastery, both hands are in use....
Its like u said, SwS has no chance against a BD.
I realy bother about the cheap passive skills of a SwS,
if the L2J-Servers would run properly i would test the
class there to see SwS skills in practice...
If you LOVE tanks (and the skills they get) and don't mind doing bad damage or being the last pick for a party, TK is ok. But I really stress that you gotta LOVE it, because tanks in this game are a difficult sell.
It's much easier to find a party with sws because there aren't many, but singing every 2 mins can be annoyin for some and all sws do is sing. You get very few active skills and the ones you get you can't use until 70s+because you need to keep your mp for songs. Clanmates usually love partying with you cause there aren't many sws around.
Either way: Play what you think you'll have fun with. Also, I suggest you level with a wolf. Both classes benefit tremendously from a wolf (and more importantly Greater Wolf later on).
I faced the same dillemma when I subclassed.
I spent about a week playing both classes up to about 44.
It was enough to get a feel for both and in the end I settled on SwS.
I've been very happy with my choice.
My clan has a TK though, and she also loves her class and is darn good at her job. With a collection of friends and clan you should have the ability to get a party frequently on both classes, I feel.
How are you with keeping track of things like buffs?
Songs only last two minutes and remembering to keep them up is important. Also, managing your Singing with any BladeDancer you party with will also be very important.
I'm with Aquaspark too - I highly recommend leveling a wolf.
Their added damage capability will make it easier for you to solo if you need to.
I dont know if that helps any, but its what I had to offer.
I hope whatever you're happy with whichever path you take!
M
You learn it at level 43 and it costs 99,000 SP. You do not need to spend anymore SP on this skill since it levels as you do. To use, activate vanguard stance (3 second cast) and open your skill window. Drag the new skills to your bar and have fun. Note that you need to use a 2H Sword to use vanguard effectively. I have seperate bars for normal and vanguard stance on. While you can use your cubics, you cannot use toggles or your Cure Poison/Bleed skills.
A TK only begins to discover its strength at level 43. It's true power isn't felt until you're in your 60s. I did level with a friend's great wolf before and it did really help. But it was very expensive in addition to all the expenses a TK already has to put up with. Since Vanguard, I felt it was unnecessary as I was already killing very fast.
I have enjoyed my Vangaurd skill, it's an auto learn skill costs nothing in SP or EXP to level it and every level it gets better.
I would say get a wolf, since this is what i've done and 2hnd sword focus or haste. Just use your pet shots and use no Soul Shots yourself and then your good to go till 62. If you decide of Soul Shots then go for it, but a wolf your level will deal just about as much damage.
I can honestly say that if you like the idea of not waiting for parties to exp and solo and don't wanna worry about buffers past 62, then a TK is soloable as far as I can tell past that with no problem.
I just don't like to wait for a special support to come along so I can exp and I don't like having to use out of party buffers.
Now take in consideration of some of the thing people said about the SWS as well, some people had some usefull posts about those as well and experience with them that I don't have.
I just love my TK and the fact it's easier for me to grind him without nothing more then my wolf. In fact he's my money saver and his shots will always be cheaper then mine.
I setup my macro's to use for Vangaurd. Just set yours up to use soul shots on Vangaurd skills and try to get away from auto spamming shots, this will greating maximize your soul shot usage and save money, also knowing which cubes to use will help save D-crystals. Also knowing the suituation helps with this too, so practice makes perfect. Another helpful Idea get a ghouls staff with btb4 then SoES, if you can get the money worked up. Also stay away from DC HVY that just my opinion, NM HVY is a good choice for all around solo/tanking you can do both 3/4 @ssed.
Sum it all up, explore and take time in making a choice .
Yea, i play this game for fun, so i should choose a class that brings
the most fun for me.
Fun means for me:
-Moderate or fast WalkSpeed
-2h/DualWeapons
-HeavyArmor and stability
-Can hunt in party or solo (if necessary)
-Vicious magic skills that do additional to the melee
-Useful for others (i guess this depends on player skills too
and not only even of the class...)
-A class that requires more than assist ^^
-To stay on the front
-H4rd_t0_k1LL
Ok looks like i go for TK, i found a good clan already they
told me they will help me to level my char.
No mater for which class i decide.
The only question i have is:
Which weapon is recommended for a TK in Vanguard form?
2Hand-Sword/Blunt, or DualSwords?
Im level 35 with my Elven Knight Jenica, and im not so confident
anymore if i realy should go for TK (Temple Knight) as i intended :/
Im realy insecure about my decision....:confused:
Any suggestions with reasons could help me.
Many people told me that its pretty hard
to find party as TK >.>
But why?
Are tanks realy so useless in this game?
/regards
Jenica
First of all always go with the class you intended.
Second
in my opinion... you should ask yourself what you want.
Do I wanna give or do I wanna receive... sounds a bit disturbing huh
SWS: you are a giver, you'll love all the attention you get from people, everyone will say you look great, you taste good and wanna have you near them... and you love it... and give it to them long time.
TK: you are a receiver, you're well aware that you need to put effort into convincing people of your ability. And down that bumpy road you'll get a few punches to the head. But on the other hand, you dont give a **** what other people think. People dont always need/want your hand, but that doesnt bother you much. You know you can do fine on your own, and that hand never let you down... You'll like animals better then people anyway, your dog is your faithful companion and the two of you go wild all the time.
People eventually see that you can take them to places they couldnt go on their own. And will love you just for that change of pace. And if you are really lucky they might invite you over to their place, just because they feel sorry for you. You know what they're thinking.. but hey.. it looks like love, so you take it in the crapper anyway.
I've had no problem using my Great Sword /w Focus. Tho if you like the fast animation of a haste version, the haste Sa might be for you. I believe the best weapon to tell this right off is the berserker blade, either haste or focus for the Sa. Now I reccomend that you get a ghouls staff with BTB4 Sa on it or save for a Staff of Evil Spirits with BTB5 for when you get past level 62. Pets also work really good with these guys as well, so help and healer out and get a couger ex. baby pet. They are very nice when doing later kama's and extra heals from those don't even drain their MP. I am yet to see my imp. baby pet run out of MP. Oh and some blunts are ok if they can make up in focus: accuracy ratio, I just prefer swords.
tank if u're a quiet/solitude kinda of player, very strong Olympiad enforcer with top gears.
sws if u like to group, or raid/pvp in top clan. We can still kill the boss if 3-4 out of the 5 bd disconnected, but 2 out of the 5 sws dc --> big trouble for the raid force :(
dont worry about the subclass thang focus on your main class, sws are kinda rare (most choose bladedancer because of damage) but are very good and have had stuff added (like windstorm song) lately which make em even better.
wait until you have a few of the good songs (pdef, crit rate, wind) you'll love it, they stack with normal buffs and dont just add a little bit they add alot.
....wait until you have a few of the good songs (pdef, crit rate, wind) you'll love it, they stack with normal buffs and dont just add a little bit they add alot.
yeah my lvl 76 SR friend says his crit rate (w/ full buffs) goes from 280->320 w/ song of hunter. it really does add a whole lot. my own m.def w/ song of warding goes from 900-> almost 1.2k
Is TK better as main and SwS as sub, or backwards?
Becuz the Lv81 skills for TK....max level for sub is 80 right?
That means i dont get the Lv81 skills when i sub TK...?
I would say yes TK is better as main.
SWS might seem fun, but you are a support class.
Which means your main skills are buffs which make you stronger AND make your party members stronger.
Because your main skills are buffs, you're left out on the skills that only benefit yourself.
(its like this since the beginning of the game and NC doesnt show any intention to change this in the near future (if this is a good or bad policy is another discussion).
My main is a support class and I used to find it fun to play. However in end game, stuff like pvp and sieges and stuff, its no fun at all. Why is it no fun? Well, in good organised pvp everyone on the battlefield has like equal buffs. Which means all buffer classes (SWS/BD included) will just be mediocre characters on the battlefield since they lack personal skills that DD classes get. And believe me you're gonna feel mediocre after a while. I mean why do you think most of the support classes are boxed...
So for a sub SWS seems fine, but personally I wouldnt recommened it as a main.
This is just my opinion offcourse, but I regret choosing a support class as main.
I been reading some info on the Temple Knight and I have decided thats what I am going to sub. Seems like a very cool Tank class to play thats built to kill undead mobs. I also like SWS too even more than BDs so good choice either way.
So that means i have to create a new char....OMG
Thats so un:cool:
Another point that NC-Soft should change....
I dont get the sense of this rule....for what is that good, it makes no
sense to do a sub if u cant get the "full" potencial of the respective
class....
SubClass = Useless in my eyes (only good for healer classes or such things...)
I will not sub TK then....unfortunately
....at least no fighter class :rolleyes:
Maybe i have luck and NCSoft wil set the max
level for subclasses on 81 :)
I should start a poll about that ^^
@Ext
In this case you're right, TK is realy better as main.
Looks like i have to delete 1 char to create Jenica a 2nd time...
My account is already full >.>
@OrcishEspada
Yea its an impressive class, but useless without level 81 skills, i do not
level all that long way to get a trimmed version of a powefull class, sorry :/
Its better than to create a new char and do it as main.
You have to remember it's a Sub not your main. your focus is 2 make the best of your main not your sub. All the Sub bonus go to your main not your sub. Keep that in mind and you will understand why a Sub is limited and as it should be.
In fact I don't even like the change your class thing. What ever you pick as your main is what you PICK so stick with your choice. :D
subbing is there (besides all the helping main/noblesse etc etc) to give you a chance to play another class w/o having to get on/start a new char, and gives you the time to take a break from the manotiny (however its spelt) of one class. plus good luck getting all your subs to lvl 80/80/80, let me know when that happens :D
im not too bothered that they stop at lvl 80... your main is called a main for a reason ;)
you can still sub TK... theres nothing in the game right now that requires higher level than 80, and you will most likly not get that high on your main, let alone your sub... by the time you are required to get over lvl80 for anything, the lvl cap will be raised on main and sub... you will see this more clearly when you have played a while longer, and levels start getting harder and harder to make... everything in game you will be able to do at lv78~80 (except maybe olympiad), and while higher levels help, they aren't really needed, and definatly are not needed as much as higher end gear, which will be as hard or harder to get than making lv79/80, or above.
... and while higher levels help, they aren't really needed, and definatly are not needed as much as higher end gear, which will be as hard or harder to get than making lv79/80, or above.
i agree i hardly ever exp, took me 3+ years to finally get lvl 70 on my main, and i still think i have a way better chance getting lvl 80 then getting boss jewels... they are so **** hard to get :(
Hi!im an sws and to tell you the truth it wont be easy to level nor the tk nor a sws. the lack of a physical attack doesnt help us at all, so the best way is to use our superior crit rate with a weapon sa crit. I like be an sws a lot. we can do everything and if something rong, just sing wind, and get out of there...:D
get a archer friend or a tank or even an damage dealer (i recommend a glad or a tyrant/destroyer) and they will be yours forever friend. still, till you reach lvl 49 (at this lvl you will get hunter song) you will sweat a lot, but your friends and clan will support your effort when you get those bombastic songs.
Just remember, do it for fun and all bad moments would be past.
Im level 50 and finaly got SoH,
this song is GREAT :)
Much more crits, but its even
not a good idea to hunt alone ^^
I dont regret my decision,
SwS is realy impressive!:cool:
Im realy satisfied with my Main.
Great to hear..! It really is an awesome class. Just because songs apply to whole party, doesnt mean its not as good as other classes / support only. They are great solo or in party, party thing can even be seen as more of a bonus. That said, you'll always be popular to join parties if you want to.
PVP you get some fun (and good) skills - like aoe fear which recently got changed so effects in PVP too not just PVE. You also get an aoe slow atk / slow cast / slow run speed. Quite a strong effect its nasty. Good for PVP and PVE. At the very high end when you are 79, you get an aoe magic and physical silence.
As far as hunting alone, you have UD which is handy for tight spots - but you'll fair alot better once you are LV58 and get the pdef song, so look forward to that one :) And a focus sword and +4 STR tat will help u do alot more damage.
I would say yes TK is better as main.
SWS might seem fun, but you are a support class.
Which means your main skills are buffs which make you stronger AND make your party members stronger.
Because your main skills are buffs, you're left out on the skills that only benefit yourself.
(its like this since the beginning of the game and NC doesnt show any intention to change this in the near future (if this is a good or bad policy is another discussion).
My main is a support class and I used to find it fun to play. However in end game, stuff like pvp and sieges and stuff, its no fun at all. Why is it no fun? Well, in good organised pvp everyone on the battlefield has like equal buffs. Which means all buffer classes (SWS/BD included) will just be mediocre characters on the battlefield since they lack personal skills that DD classes get. And believe me you're gonna feel mediocre after a while. I mean why do you think most of the support classes are boxed...
So for a sub SWS seems fine, but personally I wouldnt recommened it as a main.
This is just my opinion offcourse, but I regret choosing a support class as main.
You get some great skills for party pvp and such, hit and run type of class. Plus you know everyone appreciates your *** being there singing your funk. I know you saying if you were another class you'd get songs anyway - but a boxed sws has got nothing on one played live. You can keep yourself alive and kite in and our sooo much better.
yeah my lvl 76 SR friend says his crit rate (w/ full buffs) goes from 280->320 w/ song of hunter. it really does add a whole lot. my own m.def w/ song of warding goes from 900-> almost 1.2k
Adds more than that, should add about 100 to crit rate on average :)
PVP you get some fun (and good) skills - like aoe fear which recently got changed so effects in PVP too not just PVE. You also get an aoe slow atk / slow cast / slow run speed. Quite a strong effect its nasty. Good for PVP and PVE. At the very high end when you are 79, you get an aoe magic and physical silence.
As far as hunting alone, you have UD which is handy for tight spots - but you'll fair alot better once you are LV58 and get the pdef song, so look forward to that one :) And a focus sword and +4 STR tat will help u do alot more damage.
Mass AoE slow is undependable due to its 74 skill level, which means that it has a low chance of landing on a lot of high level players. AoE fear is nice.... Song of Silence has a tiny AoE at around 200, so you aren't going to be hitting a lot of things with it.
Song of Earth is a level 55 skill. Water is the 58 one.
The SwS overall is a fun class as long as you enjoy playing a support class. It has one of the lowest DPS while fully buffed and no active damage skill. In a 1 vs 1 situation, it's very rare that it'll beat any person with equal gear that knows what he or she is doing. What I'm getting at is... don't expect to kill anyone... ever.
yeah my lvl 76 SR friend says his crit rate (w/ full buffs) goes from 280->320 w/ song of hunter. it really does add a whole lot. my own m.def w/ song of warding goes from 900-> almost 1.2k
Your base crit rate should be around 160 or so, tack 88 on from the bow, focus... you should be hitting pretty close to 300 with just those buffs. Adding hunter should allow you to easily exceed those numbers.
Song of Hunter adds 100% base crit rate (no passives or SAs) BTW.