Well as the title says I'm a new player and I want to learn some things about L2 i don't know.The things that I would like to learn in this thread are methods of making money with dwarfs.The ones that I'm aware of are spolining with a scav for mats and scrolls,the manor system (not directly related to dwarfs) and playing the market (again not directly related to dwarfs).
But the thing that confuses me is how are Warsmiths good money makers if you can craft anything they can with any class in shops in giran for not so much of a higher price.I'm aware that saving money by crafting your own shots is some kind of making money but its not that "good".
Am i missing something?I read the forums a lot and i see most people saying Warsmiths are not good moneymakers nowadays but I'm not sure if thats true or not so I wanted to hear your opinions on are they good moneymakers and if you can explain to me how they make good money that would be a lot of help because I made a scav alt and im loving it so i tought of making a WS too but I got totaly discouraged after reading some posts here.I'm not asking you to convince me to make a WS I just want to learn more about L2 and hear the truth about Warsmiths moneymaking abilities compared to other methods that were already mentioned.
looks like you already done your research and know the answer so i'll just throw in my 2c as a fairly high lvl WS
WS doesn't really make more money than any other class in game
yes you can set up a private shop over night and make a few mil from crafts or spend a few billion on recs so 6 months down the track you start making 10 mil a day but the real money making classes these days are anyone that can hunt at hell bound (lot of classes but dorfs aren't one of them)
even if you do try and justify private craft as an effective adena making tool the fact will always be that a lvl 70 dorf alt will do just as well as a lvl 85 dorf main with the added bonus of faster vitality regen and easier rec farming with an equal lvl nuker/buffer/archer/destro/dagger main and considering i can get a toon to 70 in under 3 weeks like most high lvl players the smart move for me would prolly be to make my 8x WS main a 7x WS alt to make the game easier ><
i have access to 4 high 70's rechargers and without going into any detail even without them i can make a few million SSS a day without breaking a sweat.... and yet i consider it a waste of my time
i quit game for a year not too long ago and when i came back i made 85 mil on the first day hunting fire stones (prices dropped alot since then), sounds ok until you realize right next to me were 9 other classes that could kill 5 mobs before my tiny dorf legs could get me in range of my first one
currently i make pretty awesome xp and average about 40 mil a day which is hard to complain about but there are a fair few classes that can do exactly what i do or better and still be a factor in PVP so you really have to ask yourself why bother playing a dorf?
I'll just tell you how I make money based on my own experience.
Started playing around 3 weeks ago or so, haven't played since shortly after c2 came in.. Made a dwarf and started crafting shots, buying crystals from people in giran and crafting in private craft shots, then deciding on the best place to go and sell the appropriate level shots.
I started out with literally nothing, and worked my way up to 100m so far, I'm saving up for A grade for my main dagger.
My suggestion is don't use a dwarf for your main, but whos to stop you. On its own means, there really aren't many ways to make money on a dwarf, and especially not insane amounts like they used to be able to. Your best bet is probably like mine was, to start crafting shots and selling for other players for profit, but you could also set up craft shops overnight with shots/basic mats in it for players to craft and make a *bit* of money that way.
But in general, the places to make money are in high level hunting grounds. There are a few quests that might be worthwhile, but other than that its just grind grind grind until 70+ish
looks like you already done your research and know the answer so i'll just throw in my 2c as a fairly high lvl WS
WS doesn't really make more money than any other class in game
yes you can set up a private shop over night and make a few mil from crafts or spend a few billion on recs so 6 months down the track you start making 10 mil a day but the real money making classes these days are anyone that can hunt at hell bound (lot of classes but dorfs aren't one of them)
even if you do try and justify private craft as an effective adena making tool the fact will always be that a lvl 70 dorf alt will do just as well as a lvl 85 dorf main with the added bonus of faster vitality regen and easier rec farming with an equal lvl nuker/buffer/archer/destro/dagger main and considering i can get a toon to 70 in under 3 weeks like most high lvl players the smart move for me would prolly be to make my 8x WS main a 7x WS alt to make the game easier ><
i have access to 4 high 70's rechargers and without going into any detail even without them i can make a few million SSS a day without breaking a sweat.... and yet i consider it a waste of my time
i quit game for a year not too long ago and when i came back i made 85 mil on the first day hunting fire stones (prices dropped alot since then), sounds ok until you realize right next to me were 9 other classes that could kill 5 mobs before my tiny dorf legs could get me in range of my first one
currently i make pretty awesome xp and average about 40 mil a day which is hard to complain about but there are a fair few classes that can do exactly what i do or better and still be a factor in PVP so you really have to ask yourself why bother playing a dorf?
Seriously, people! Throwing in a comma or full stop now and there never hurt anyone. How can you call a level 8x 'fairly high'? And to answer your question, before you can hunt in Hellbound and effectively farm said stones, it takes a **CONSIDERABLE** amount of time.
Seriously, people! Throwing in a comma or full stop now and there never hurt anyone. How can you call a level 8x 'fairly high'? And to answer your question, before you can hunt in Hellbound and effectively farm said stones, it takes a **CONSIDERABLE** amount of time.
Fire stones are a pretty common drop on IoP, not hellbound. Right?
Seriously, people! Throwing in a comma or full stop now and there never hurt anyone. How can you call a level 8x 'fairly high'? And to answer your question, before you can hunt in Hellbound and effectively farm said stones, it takes a **CONSIDERABLE** amount of time.
Have you ever seen a WS on HellBound? if you do pleace take a screenshot, print it out and put it up on the wall because you wont see one there again.
To OP:
I'm lvl 77 WS. I make adena by crafting and selling shots, but everyone can do that with the low cost craft shops in Giran.
After playing a WS for 3 years I have started to lose the desire to play one as my main because parties are few and far between unless you have some good friends that takes you with them now and then and I will never see any of the end game content as a WS.
so if you want a dwar class that can make some money on theyre own then go BH and use the cheap craft shops in Giran to craft everything you need.
Seriously, people! Throwing in a comma or full stop now and there never hurt anyone. How can you call a level 8x 'fairly high'? And to answer your question, before you can hunt in Hellbound and effectively farm said stones, it takes a **CONSIDERABLE** amount of time.
commas and full stops are elitism imo
youll notice that i do use them but only to maintain the integrity of a paragraph
and no it takes basically nothing to lvl effectively at HB, once you have a bish and a 8x destro - which is about as common as dirt you just throw in a bd and sws and a few random DDs and you basically have the perfect party
Am i missing something?I read the forums a lot and i see most people saying Warsmiths are not good moneymakers nowadays but I'm not sure if thats true or not so I wanted to hear your opinions on are they good moneymakers and if you can explain to me how they make good money
I am a perma-n00b and I think I got my Artisan to 20 just so that I could craft some low level mats, crystalize junk, and craft DSS. So what can I possibly bring to the table? Just this: there a many different ways to make "phat bank" in L2 and the only one(s) that matter is the one that you actually enjoy enough that you're willing to do it. If a Warsmith sounds like fun then have at it. I liked "playing the market"(buy low, resell high) and I very much enjoyed my Bounty Hunter because it was an instant gratification playstyle that appealed to my village idiot sensibilities. Those activities appealed to me.
I can't tell you how many times well meaning people have shared their solid ideas for generating adena on this forum only to have people come back either on the forum or say to me in-game something to the effect of, "This sucks. I can't believe anyone does this." If you don't like it, you won't give it a serious shot. If you don't give it a serious shot, it was doomed from the get-go. Try finding something that you think you'll actually have fun doing that way you will give it an honest effort and stick with it.
I can't tell you how many times well meaning people have shared their solid ideas for generating adena on this forum only to have people come back either on the forum or say to me in-game something to the effect of, "This sucks. I can't believe anyone does this." If you don't like it, you won't give it a serious shot. If you don't give it a serious shot, it was doomed from the get-go. Try finding something that you think you'll actually have fun doing that way you will give it an honest effort and stick with it.
Have you ever seen a WS on HellBound? if you do pleace take a screenshot, print it out and put it up on the wall because you wont see one there again.
To OP:
I'm lvl 77 WS. I make adena by crafting and selling shots, but everyone can do that with the low cost craft shops in Giran.
After playing a WS for 3 years I have started to lose the desire to play one as my main because parties are few and far between unless you have some good friends that takes you with them now and then and I will never see any of the end game content as a WS.
so if you want a dwar class that can make some money on theyre own then go BH and use the cheap craft shops in Giran to craft everything you need.
I lvl almost entirely in HB (yes on my WS, with pvp), when you get to 78 imo anyone should spend most of their time there. (in partys or OL buffs)
Maybe you just have a pet dwarf thats in NM heavy / elysian with +con tats or something stupid. If you're not set up properly I do immagine it could be difficult I guess.
Anyway, if you want to make adena, WS is not the class to go, if you're going to actually play it. Sitting in town is fine, but you get half vit, so if you want to actually lvl youre going to want to log off = paying for recs, but not getting adena.
If you hate playing dwarf, just wanna get something to make adena while you're sleeping and dont have stuff to sell, it's not a bad toon, but overall you're definately goign to make more adena on a spoiler.
Maybe you just have a pet dwarf thats in NM heavy / elysian with +con tats or something stupid. If you're not set up properly I do immagine it could be difficult I guess.
LOL my dwarf was my main until 2 weeks ago when I gave up playing it after 3 years.
My WS has IC set +3 and HD with focus (more dps than with a blunt).
I have heard others say that a HD was more dps, but I honestly dont believe it at all. It was once, in like C4 or something, but not now. Especially not with the new masterys they've put in for blunts, and blunt only skills. You do use skills right? You should + your hammer crush. +6 at 77, and take armor crush off your bar, only used in emergencys and pvp. It costs you HP and has a 10% lower base land rate. That alone could be your problem.
Here's what worked for me when I started in remnants:
I was +5 str, +4 dex, -tons of con, IC ofc, and bbh 50 [element] and with that setup and my little golem buddy I could solo in remnants with 78 OL buffs np. (no focus, no vr, no btb, no cov) I did use haste pots though, ofc. With a DC or bd buffpet I would have pwned even more, that's ususally what ppl have. And no, not crazy dark resist, infact 0 dark, and tat jewels (sometimes common maj if i'd been on a sub lol, but nm that) Keep cure bleed on your bar, that's really all they do there. Subclass skills help, I'm +crit and +haste, and this is all based on when i was 78.
If I had vr I think i could aoe remnants pretty well. I did like 4 or 5 pulls of 4 mobs, but then tried an 8 mob and killed myself. Probably shouldn't mention that one, sora an idiot for even trying aoe without pots. Ketra/varka is really all you can aoe no vr. It was a fun shot though, so w/e.
Ofc in partys you can do places that're much better, that's just an example of where to start. honestly I see WS as a clan toon, not as a soloing toon. If my clan didnt give me recs I wouldnt have them, if my clan didnt give me partys I wouldnt get them.
If your clan does steel and tullys you'll for sure get groups there, just for your inventory abilitys (unless there's a spoiler or someone with weight augment that they prefer I guess :P)
I have heard others say that a HD was more dps, but I honestly dont believe it at all. It was once, in like C4 or something, but not now. Especially not with the new masterys they've put in for blunts, and blunt only skills. You do use skills right? You should + your hammer crush. +6 at 77, and take armor crush off your bar, only used in emergencys and pvp. It costs you HP and has a 10% lower base land rate. That alone could be your problem.
I have more patk (less atk speed) with my HD than with a Bassalt, but fully buffed with the HD i got almost 300 crit rate and that makes me do alot more dmg over time, not to mention that fatal strike works with the HD and so does armor crush. Only skill I can't use is hammer crush.
I almost never use armor crush because it's slow and does less dmg than fatal strike.
you guys are missing out on using armor crush imo it's the best skill we have and i wouldn't waste the mp on fatal strike once i have COV and songs (all the time)
EDIT:if remnants are what i think they are then it's hardly worth mentioning, if those guys dropped herbs they'd be easier than iop
The party thing is a non-factor, because most classes complain about not getting groups. It depends on whether you can box the correct support classes or you have friends who can box.
I could get groups if I wanted, but why would I want to share exp and spoils.
I have more patk (less atk speed) with my HD than with a Bassalt, but fully buffed with the HD i got almost 300 crit rate and that makes me do alot more dmg over time, not to mention that fatal strike works with the HD and so does armor crush. Only skill I can't use is hammer crush.
I almost never use armor crush because it's slow and does less dmg than fatal strike.
I still dont believe it, even with the crit rate. Call be stubborn, but with all the buffs you had to get 300 you would have near enough with a focus blunt to = your focus hd, but much more pattack. I will give you that the bbh not having focus blows, perhaps a master dha is the only way to go.
Perhaps what you're missing isn't the pattack, but is instead the survivability. Just saying how I set up that works for me. Soloable areas imo are the front mobs, remnants yes ofc, and if you have sm the caravans. I wouldn't reccomend doing scorps or arcanes etc just you + a buffer, but that goes for any class.
Have you ever seen a WS on HellBound? if you do pleace take a screenshot, print it out and put it up on the wall because you wont see one there again.
I'll remember that if I'm ever there, but I'm not sure I see the connection between our posts. :p
and no it takes basically nothing to lvl effectively at HB, once you have a bish and a 8x destro - which is about as common as dirt you just throw in a bd and sws and a few random DDs and you basically have the perfect party
There is a level limit before you can enter some of these zones, correct? The considerable amount of time I am referring to is obtaining that minimum level requirement.
(( Off-Topic: commas and full stops are elitism imo
youll notice that i do use them but only to maintain the integrity of a paragraph That's fine, but certainly wasn't the case in the paragraphs I was talking about - for me, it was really rather irritating to read. ))
minimum lvl for every thing on HB is 78 which basically everyone is these days
it takes forever to do the quests which is why ppl just won't bother doing it unless its in the perfect party (those don't involve dorfs)
I still dont believe it, even with the crit rate. Call be stubborn, but with all the buffs you had to get 300 you would have near enough with a focus blunt to = your focus hd, but much more pattack. I will give you that the bbh not having focus blows, perhaps a master dha is the only way to go.
Perhaps what you're missing isn't the pattack, but is instead the survivability. Just saying how I set up that works for me. Soloable areas imo are the front mobs, remnants yes ofc, and if you have sm the caravans. I wouldn't reccomend doing scorps or arcanes etc just you + a buffer, but that goes for any class.
full buffed dorf with DHA
pattack 1364
crit 120
full buffed dorf with heavens divider
pattack 1235
crit 326
we on the same page yet?
heres the stuff i didnt add because i can't calculate it
augments - those are a fixed amount so getting 20 crit on both will lower then % dps difference between a blunt and a sword
focus on sword - blunt doesn't have focus but what can you do unless you want to use an A grade blunt?
rare items - DHA has crit increase which i think is about 30ish but i also think the HD has crit damage (?) and if i'm right there is no way in hell you can compete with that
dorf buffs - sorry if you are a BH but sharp edge adds crit rate and spike adds stun land rate, the crit rate isn't much (think its static 12) but yes the stun increase from spike seems to be fairly significant
accuracy - blunt will always have more the way accuracy is applied to blunts means the higher your lvl, the more buffs you have the less significant it is
sub skills - again any fixed number increase in crit is gonna lower the gap between blunt and sword DPS but no matter how you look at it the sword will always out damage the blunt
That's fine, but certainly wasn't the case in the paragraphs I was talking about - for me, it was really rather irritating to read. ))
fair enough if it does bother you
i won't go into why i detest the english grammar system so much but if you study a few other languages you'll understand just how inefficient some of the rules are
minimum lvl for every thing on HB is 78 which basically everyone is these days
Sorry, that's just not true. :p
fair enough if it does bother you
i won't go into why i detest the english grammar system so much but if you study a few other languages you'll understand just how inefficient some of the rules are
I'm fluent in three languages and am currently studying a fourth.
minimum lvl for every thing on HB is 78 which basically everyone is these days
it takes forever to do the quests which is why ppl just won't bother doing it unless its in the perfect party (those don't involve dorfs)
full buffed dorf with DHA
pattack 1364
crit 120
full buffed dorf with heavens divider
pattack 1235
crit 326
we on the same page yet?
blablabla
As I said:
... with all the buffs you had to get 300 you would have near enough with a focus blunt to = your focus hd, but much more pattack.
This is in general, yes, S grade does suck, I dont believe everyone is S grade. However, I still use the blunt in S grade and spam skill(s) for, I still believe, more dps. As an added bonus, the higher base stun that doesnt cost HP is very useful for survivability.
Do what you want though, I'm simply showing how my setup works for me hoping to help out a fellow WS. There are many ways to set up a toon depending on what you want to do.
Half the time I wear light armor for example, it's better for what I'm diong in different areas. Many ppl disagree with that, or with tat setups, but my +con sub dwarf in heavy could wack away at a mob for hours and turn my brain to mush, while my light+str+dex dwarf kills in seconds. Just depends what you're doing and what you prefer. example: +dex+str+light for iop where the mobs are easy and I run a lot, vs +con and heavy armor to survive to crest castles'
As far as partying dwarfs in HB:
It's very nice to have a dwarf in your party esp when doing steel. I think so far in like 2/3ish of the partys we've had dwarfs, especially nice for the run that took 11.5 hours, omg that was a long one lol. Not bad at all, we just got ported down as much as up. Hell, even in the 2 hour run the dwarf was atleast good for some mp regen buffs I guess, but not really needed that time. Those ofc are the longest and shortest ones I've been in, but pretty easy to see if you're doing something that could take 11.5 hours you might run out of shots etc.
The other areas no, a dwarf is not required, but still nice for shots holding, etc. Since you cant just /summon ppl - so I guess it depends on room and ppl at that point. You dont strike me as the nicest of ppl, just throwing that out there, so perhaps that's why you dont get partys. Could be wrong, maybe you have a lame clan that doesnt party "non-perfect" classes. I guess if you have supports to box or subbed that is another way to get partys for sure.
This is in general, yes, S grade does suck, I dont believe everyone is S grade. However, I still use the blunt in S grade and spam skill(s) for, I still believe, more dps. As an added bonus, the higher base stun that doesnt cost HP is very useful for survivability.
Even with a focus blunt you will have less crit rate, but I would had used a Barakiel's Axe focus if it wasn't for the elements that they added for S+ grade that adds so mutch more damage per hit.
look man i've said this multiple times before but i'm not the logic police, if you want to run around with a blunt and IC and think thats /win then do it i aint stopping you however if someone does decide to play a dorf despite me constantly advising against it then i'm gonna tell them the best way to do so
i'm not sure if you have a sword as well as a blunt but i do, back when i decided to check the numbers i had a 45 holy blunt (100ish fully buffed) and a 20 fire sword
you'd think the fact i was hunting holy weak blunt weak mobs would give some sort of advantage to the blunt but at the end of the day the sword still outdamaged it
the numbers don't lie man so here they are again
full buffed dorf with DHA
pattack 1364
crit 120
full buffed dorf with heavens divider
pattack 1235
crit 326
full buffed dorf with barakiel's axe
pattack 1030
crit 170
This is in general, yes, S grade does suck, I dont believe everyone is S grade. However, I still use the blunt in S grade and spam skill(s) for, I still believe, more dps. As an added bonus, the higher base stun that doesnt cost HP is very useful for survivability.
it's not like i walk into olympiad with my focus sword of doom and expect to kill ppl. yes if you spam skills you can get more DPS than a sword but there is only so long you can pull that off before you are OOM and i'm sure the SE/EE in your party would be better off charging the bish/dagger/archers
i didn't want to mention this before because it already seemed like i was picking your post apart but afaik noone knows the base land rate of armor crush. my trials indicate that armor crush has the same base land rate as hammer crush but has a mental resitable component to it also (makes sense cause of hex i guess)
**** straight armor crush has a low land rate but the 350 hp cost is nothing to me cosidering i walk around with 11k hp with -7 con and the 35 mp cost means i can spam the crap out of it and never run out of mp
Half the time I wear light armor for example, it's better for what I'm diong in different areas. Many ppl disagree with that, or with tat setups, but my +con sub dwarf in heavy could wack away at a mob for hours and turn my brain to mush, while my light+str+dex dwarf kills in seconds. Just depends what you're doing and what you prefer. example: +dex+str+light for iop where the mobs are easy and I run a lot, vs +con and heavy armor to survive to crest castles'
i kinda agree on that
i really wish i could go +dex but i honestly can't afford to do so with how i xp. back when i hunted IOP i actually wore robes with a sword, ppl laughed at me but being able to 2 hit mobs non stop is worth it :P
The other areas no, a dwarf is not required, but still nice for shots holding, etc. Since you cant just /summon ppl - so I guess it depends on room and ppl at that point. You dont strike me as the nicest of ppl, just throwing that out there, so perhaps that's why you dont get partys. Could be wrong, maybe you have a lame clan that doesnt party "non-perfect" classes. I guess if you have supports to box or subbed that is another way to get partys for sure.
i run my own clan and it consists of me, my buffers and my 12 or so dorf alts
i can go to HB whenever i want since i have friends nice enough to let a leech in party but i fully realize that my slot would be better left to another destro/dagger/EE/W/E so i choose to solo