This game is sincerely confusing compared to the other MMORPGs I've played. I'm thinking of rolling knight, but I'm not sure. In other MMO's I've played I like DD jobs that have the ability to use some magic to support their survivability. This leans me towards knight > paladin > PK, however in most games this class is almost incapable of any DD endgame and isn't to great in PvP due to lack of burst damage, and ultimately just ends up tanking and healing. Dark Avenger > HK seems fun to me. Is this class a tank? Does it use a 2hd sword like most "Dark/Shadow Knight" classes from other games? What would I be doing endgame as this class? Another thing I'm considering is going Warrior > Glad > Duelist. However, I'm curious of Duelist's soloability and usefulness in PvP later on. It doesn't seem to have many healing/buff skills to minimize damage and downtime. I realize I'm thinking waaaaaaaaaay down the line, but I wanna think ahead so I don't bone myself and end up with a class I hate. I've read the Library's Race/Class/Skill guide over and over and I still can't decide. So if anyone wouldn't mind describing what it's like to level those 3 paths and play them at higher levels, I would really appreciate it. Also, once I pick a path, am I stuck in it forever? Thanks for your help! Seems there is much to learn inside the world of Lineage 2.
Paladin is as you said a tank class. The damage output isn't great and although theyr heals are strong, they are slow and consume alot of mp to be casted (not sure about sacrifice that uses hp). Can use 2h sword in Vanguard stance (a skill you get at lvl 43), you can use it without the vanguard stance to but in vanguard you get masteries and skills for that type of weapon.
Dark Avenger is also a tank class. It got no heals, but has a summon that helps with the damage dealing. Can use duals in Vanguard stance (a skill you get at lvl 43). Just as the Paladin it can use 2h sword, but doesn't get any masteries or skills for them.
Gladiator is a good damage dealer with huge burst damage.
With newbie buffs you can solo most classes to lvl 63, but L2 is made so that almost every class needs a support class to buff/heal them.
Be friend with a SE or WC and your gladiator can go almost everywhere.
If you take one path and don't like it then you have 2 choices:
1. make a new char and start all over
or
2. lvl it to 75 and add a subclass (subclass lets you change your char into almost any other class in the game. when you add a subclass you become lvl 40, but you can switch back to your lvl 75+ char anytime you want and back to the subclass by talking to NPC's)
I have only played Paladin/Dark Avenger to lvl 52 and Gladiator to 64 so others that plays them as main may help you better, but if you want a class that does good burst damage and that is ok in PvP I would had gone for the gladiator.
Well an SK is decently durable with magic skills..but damage output isn't incredibly high as they are a tank. Their cubes can be beastly in the right situation though as can their debuffs and whatnot. They have the highest base damage out of the three tanks (minus the DA's Dark Panther) since they are a Dark Elf...from what I've experienced between the three tank races anyway.
Damage (melee, anyway) plus magic makes me think of a Bladedancer, although I know you didn't mention one. They have quick, stackable party buffs, debuffs, aoe skills, and high melee damage if you combine the right duals with the right gear for your playstyle. They're a lot like paper tigers in the way a nuker is a glass cannon, though...a lot of damage, but little pdef.
Gladiators are fun and can solo amazingly well without a buffer/healer. If you can learn to operate a gladiator without becoming too dependant on your skills (as they have times where they run out of mp) then you are good to go. They are really an awesome class with high (and fast) damage output and they're tough little ****s if played right.
Good luck with your decision. ^_^
PS--once you 'pick a path', as I'm assuming you're referring to picking a class as you class-change, yes you are stuck with that. So if you're a human knight and you choose Paladin instead of Dark Avenger, doing the 2nd class quests and turning them in to the NPC's as completed, you will be changed to that profession and you can't go back and undo it without rerolling.
In my opinion go Gladiator -> Duelist. The tanks in this game are just as you described, they really do lack real damage output and most of the time you're hating daggers off people and stunning/annoying. It's fun if you like that playstyle, but if you want to kill a tank is not going to even come close to a traditional DD.
Duelists are still relatively weak at the moment in open/large-scale pvp, CP pots are just too broken, but next update they're going to get a huge boost with elemental attacks. The elemental attacks should make them pretty beastly.
Both the tyrant and destroyer are good DD classes that shouldn't be overlooked. I would suggest you give them a look if you haven't already.
Aw, yes. :) They are nice classes. I personally prefer the Destroyer over the Tyrant just because that is what I played, but the 'baby' Tyrant I goofed around with had promising attributes and abilities. Their totems are a BLAST to toy around with, and would be awesome if you utilize them correctly for the right situations.
Their drawbacks...Destroyers take some know-how to play right if you don't have 'uber' gear just the right tat setup because they're slow. I took a break on mine from 2006 to the summer of 2008, and the difference in playstyle with the changes they made to their dynamics was noticeable. You have to become quite familiar with frenzy, zealot, rage, guts, battle roar, what they do and when to use them. Destroyers are also slow in run speed and attack speed. So tatting them or gearing them to swing a balance to favor your playstyle might take some experimentation...but if operated correctly Destroyers are BEASTS, and as I like to call them...runaway trains. If you can dodge their attacks or outrun them you're safe...but if they catch up with you, you're screwed.
Tyrants...their totems and ranged attacks are awesome. Their attack speed is incredible. They are flexible in what they can go against and are fun to play (in the short time I played with one) but they do have some tricky pdef issues from what I've seen. Of course, if they fit someone's playstyle and are geared right and put in appropriate situations for their strengths, they can really rock.
You won't love many classes without buffs, the game is heavily dependent on buffs to feel like you kill fast and that you're strong.
Zerker is an incredibly fun class true, but it can be sluggish without buffs, like most/all classes.
the trouble with Lineage2's archetypes is they DONT have the same things as other games. i.e. tanks really have no skills for damage spiking, warriors really have no heal, etc.
what youre looking for you just won't find. the Phoenix knight has some healing skill, but lacks offensively, severely. the Hell Knight has a summonable panther that hits like a truck but again the HK lacks - no heal worth the time to cast. the Shilen knight skill tree MIGHT have something suited to your taste... but it is chancey.
the Vampiric cubic, Drain health, and Lightning strike (among other magic attacks of the SK) will likely suit your style. being a Dark archetype however, your altenate weapon (dropping the shield) is a Dualsword.
why is people mentioning other stuffs than what the OP asked for?
he asked about paladin, dark avenger and gladiator since he has a human fighter.
Okay then. The important thing here is does he want to do damage himself and lots of it? Then he needs to go with the Gladiator. If he doesn't mind duo'ing with a supplementary critter to do the high damage for him, then he can go Dark Avenger.
If he wants to FEEL strong by taking on a butt-load of mobs and letting his party take the mobs down while he controls aggro with hates and stuns, then he should pick one of the two tanks. As mentioned, the DA has a panther with beastly damage. The DA is an offensive tank. The paladin on the other hand is defensive and can play the role of lead or backup tank with their healing capabilities. I will reiterate though that tanks are not meant to do high damage of any sort themselves. Thinking otherwise is a mistake.
Gladiators are my favorite DD's hands down. My hubby plays one amazingly well, I've played one almost to agrade, and we both played them at 82 on the CT1.5 pts. It is an AWESOME class for fast and strong hits, range, and pure destruction. Not everyone can play them well. They take some practice to get used to charges, when to and not to use your skills, and how to get used to running without mp.
They can solo incredibly well...which is one reason why I love them so much. They can also lead parties, if being played by the right kind of person.
What about bladedancer? How well does it solo/pvp? Is it a versatile class? And SK... solo/pvp/versatility?
God I'm so confused now. Glad sounds alot of fun but pretty one dimensional.
Bladedancer is a buffer. You dance (buff) every 2 minutes, buffs apply to party for that duration. Offensive buffs, well liked in both melee and mage parties. But its not a DD, its a not a tank in parties. Its a buffer which can solo effectively in PvW till 7x with a SE/WC and can find PvE parties with relative ease at ~ 6x, but its neither a DD not a tank. There can be cases in which a BD has played an off-tank in a party, but its not one as a class. It's 100% support in PvP, no DD at all.
If I had to go a melee I would go either a Gladiator or a Tyrant if I wanted to play melee DPS with range attacks in the mix, for a melee class which is excellent in both PvP and PvE. Dark Avenger is a good offensive tank, but relies too much on the Panther pet for damage for my own comfort to play the class. Tyrant is more of a soloer with the totems: as a Tyrant get a WC/BD and go to town in a cata with Bison: Tyrant after 68 screams through levels comparatively. Gladiator is a bit more of a grouping class, to get great xp you'll need a fuller party at comparative levels (this will likely be contested). Both Gladiator and Tyrant are excellent in PvP. In PvP any melee class which doesn't have a movement speed boost will be horrid against nukers and archers which are always FOTM in L2. Gladi and Tyrant have the DPS, movement boosts and hit like a truck when they get in range.
SK is decent, its considered slightly lower down the PvP tier than Gladiator (in before SK owns Glad post), but its decent. I'm not sure what changes are coming to the SK with Gracia Final, but its apparently improved over the last few updates.
Edit: Every melee class is a decent soloer, as long as you have support, either a box buffer or a live buffer friend. Once the newbie buffs go away at 6x you will cry without support, no matter if you play a Glad, SK, Paladin, Tyrant or DA. Its true for some classes more than most, for example summoners can level ok without a buffer, but melee cry without one and so do nukers. And melee especially choke if they are playing a tank class without a buffer.
I had sent you a PM earlier, but I think you will find your way regardless. The best way to find out what you will enjoy is to play the class you're interested in. You can get information and get a good approximation of what you may or may not like to play through forums, but the best way to find out would be to go 5x or 6x with a class you like the sound of from reading posts and see how you like it shaping up. Most L2 players play several classes to 5/6x before they settle down on something they want to play to 75, so don't hesitate to pick something and then change your mind later. Even if it sounds like a waste of time to most: you won't really know till you play a class yourself.
Bladedancer is a buffer. You dance (buff) every 2 minutes, buffs apply to party for that duration. Offensive buffs, well liked in both melee and mage parties. But its not a DD, its a not a tank in parties. Its a buffer which can solo effectively till 7x with a SE/WC and can find parties with relative ease at ~ 6x, but its neither a DD not a tank. There can be cases in which a BD has played an off-tank in a party, but its not one as a class.
If I had to go a melee I would go either a Gladiator or a Tyrant if I wanted to play melee DPS with range attacks in the mix. Dark Avenger is a good offensive tank, but relies too much on the Panther pet for damage for my own comfort to play the class. Tyrant is more of a soloer with the totems: as a Tyrant get a WC/BD and go to town in a cata with Bison: Tyrant after 68 screams through levels comparatively. Gladiator is a bit more of a grouping class, to get great xp you'll need a fuller party at comparative levels (this will likely be contested).
SK is decent, its considered slightly lower down the PvP tier than Gladiator (in before SK owns Glad post), but its decent. I'm not sure what changes are coming to the SK with Gracia Final, but its apparently improved over the last few updates.
Don't forget that the Bison will get nerfed in the next patch so no more Bison lvling for the Tyrant.
As for going tank, I suggest you try to lvl up a wolf as you lvl. They become strong damage dealers at lvl 55+ (insanely good in PvE) and if you go as tank you can hold the agro away from your pet. But keep in mind that equiping a Great Wolf (what the wolf becomes and lvl 55+) costs alot.
At the moment I'm lvling a BD (lvl 65) as main and I love it. I get parties all the time and I can deal some desent damage (BD dances increses normal hits by alot) although they got very little offencive skills.
Don't forget that the Bison will get nerfed in the next patch so no more Bison lvling for the Tyrant.
As for going tank, I suggest you try to lvl up a wolf as you lvl. They become strong damage dealers at lvl 55+ (insanely good in PvE) and if you go as tank you can hold the agro away from your pet. But keep in mind that equiping a Great Wolf (what the wolf becomes and lvl 55+) costs alot.
At the moment I'm lvling a BD (lvl 65) as main and I love it. I get parties all the time and I can deal some desent damage (BD dances increses normal hits by alot) although they got very little offencive skills.
Tyrant after Bison nerf in Final will stay a viable DPS class. XPing all the way at ~ 30% HP cannot be any game's intended design (as much as everyone doubts he sanity of L2's devs). Bison got touched by the nerfbat, Hawk got a bit of a boost, Ogre looks super its a more well rounded class IMO than Bison-Bison all the time in XPing, as great fun as Bison sounds. Tyrant is NOT nerfed next update, its actually getting a good polish. Anyone who looks at Ogre and Hawk next update and still thinks Tyrant is nerfed just because Bison got adjusted needs to take another look at Ogre and Hawk. The sad part is that Ogre and Hawk were always pretty ok, never bad, but Tyrant equalled Bison, which should have been fixed and will be.
BD are damage assists at most in 6x parties with their regular swing hits. In 7x parties BDs stand in a corner and dance every 2 minutes. They have *no* damage skills worth note (sting doesn't count) and the only decent ranged offensive skill they have on paper (hex) almost never lands in PvP. BDs plink away with a drac/soul/carnage bow from a distance, but that doesn't make them DD. Its a great class, don't get me wrong, but because of its awesome buffs. Its not DD in any way outside of 2/3 person or solo XPing. =)
Another Edit: He's a new player, had no gear waiting in bank for him and likely will be without support. From that perspective a BD or a SWS would be the least expensive classes to play (comparatively) if he is happy with being a buffer in PvE/PvP parties. The cost of A/S grade SS would make Tyrant a good recommendation, for any other melee tank/DD class you can't do without SS. There are pleanty of variables, some he ouldn't even be aware of when he's making the class choice: affording to level should be one of them. I'm not a Tyrant fangirl, I prefer Gladi or DA myself, but I would recommend either of them only if I knew he had access to a buffer and enough money to afford spamming shots at high levels.
BD are damage assists at most in 6x parties with their regular swing hits. In 7x parties BDs stand in a corner and dance every 2 minutes. They have *no* damage skills worth note (sting doesn't count) and the only decent ranged offensive skill they have on paper (hex) almost never lands in PvP. BDs plink away with a drac/soul/carnage bow from a distance, but that doesn't make them DD. Its a great class, don't get me wrong, but because of its awesome buffs. Its not DD in any way outside of 2/3 person or solo XPing. =)
It's not as good as the true DD's, but at lvl 65 I regulary make over 1k dmg on crits on white/yellow mobs so I would say it's pretty good concidering they get the same dual masteries as the gladi gets.
Maybe it's just me that thinks that BD are ok DD's since I have been playing a WS for the last 3 years.
It's not as good as the true DD's, but at lvl 65 I regulary make over 1k dmg on crits on white/yellow mobs so I would say it's pretty good concidering they get the same dual masteries as the gladi gets.
Same dual masteries, but the masteries only hold for regular non-skill hits. DPS in organized PvE/PvP parties is all about skills, not swings. Between a Gladiator and BD there is *no* comparison. At 65 BD may feel just fine against mobs soloing, but 7x PvP and organized PvE is a completely different world. You can't even compare battle roar/triple sonic slash/double sonic slash/sonic blaster/sonic move with any BD skills of note - all of which are buff dances.
Maybe it's just me that thinks that BD are ok DD's since I have been playing a WS for the last 3 years.
Touche. =) WS have to be the most longest-neglected class in the game.
BDs are an excellent class (and hence my sub). However they lack the burst damage. All the crits in the world don't mean much when you're getting TSSed in the face x_x .
However, for long term PVE, BDs are far imo better than gladis - they have their dances as well as a very high mana regen allowing them to hex almost every mob and still have full mp. Gladis basically **** and slash and try to save MP for when they need it.
Ok. This thread is proving to be very helpful to me. My questions now are about SK. Can anyone give me a good explanation as to what it's like to level/pvp/solo/party/endgame as one? What type weapon will I be using as I level? Still sword/board?
I play Phoneix Knight lvl 77 and i love it SK is a class with pet that eats up your exp but its better for PVP (if you want to pvp make archer) Phoneix Kinght is the best TANK class and its undefeted at lvl 80 it has self rez 100% at lvl 79very cool skill I should also mention that SK/PK is hardest class to lvl cus your not a DD or Buffer just a TANK.
well, you dont get shield masteries for NOTHING you know.
but
your damage will be lower with a sword. with duals, youll be a BETTER DD, but not great.
pve youre a FAST (running) tank with high STR. look for buff help and try to use Patk oriented armor. in pvp your Hates, cubics, drains, hexes, and such are your bread and butter. pass pvp won't come until youre REALLY high up there but by then you'll know your role without having the need to have anyone essplain it to you.
people look for SK's as in general any tank in pvp has an enormous task, to keep attention on you via Hatelock, and rooting. you may find yourself using a bow more than once in your sieges too. freezing strike good for slowing the opposition as you kite. its better than such skills as "cripple" from a tyrant cause Freezing stike has some range to it.
levelling will alwyas depend on your support. depending what support you have, youll be able to AOE or be forced to single-target. Mana is a hard thing to keep at any rate.
theres no great difference between your level 56 SK and your level 80 SK apart from gear choices. touch of death takes a while to refresh, shield bash has limited usefulness, etc etc. your skillset climaxes around 56 with the addition of your rooting skills. i'm not sure when you get the hate cubic (if at all, i cannot remember anymore).
but definitely, for a tank archetype, youre the tank with the most robust skillset and the best cubics. keep stocked up in D crystals and befriend some rechargers.