Before start this final battle against bots, NCSoft should study the real reason why people use bots.
I really don’t think that every people who uses bot is a “bad people” or a “bad customer”.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
That means if you are a new customer, you will be able to PvP against other “end game player” in 4 or 5 years. In my opinion, that’s ridiculous.
In Lineage 2, the best player aren’t made by people that knows the game, has ability with mouse and keyboard or knows his ingame character’s class and skills, but is made by a player that can expend 16 or 18 hours a day playing this game.
I repeat, Lineage 2 valorizes who has more time to play, not who has more skill and more knowledge of the game.
And what does people that don’t have time to play do if want to be competitive in a PvP or join a top clan ? Answer: They BOT, they buy adenas, they ebay characters.
So if NCSoft change the mechanism of the game, people do not need to use BOT!
Make grind easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, should reach max level in 1 year at most.
Make itens and adenas easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day should be able to have a S80 gear in 1 year at most.
If NCSoft do that, people will not need to BOT or ebay to have fun with this game.
So.. who will need to ban BOT ?
this game is made for people who are commited to something, and willing to work hard and put effort into the things they do.
your friends have a job, familly, kids and a wife to take care of? Then they probably shouldn't be playing video games if they find it that hard to gather time to play to begin with. But if they insist on wasting time that is much better spent creating a better life for their 'family', then they can at least realise that lineage is not the game for them. They can take their responsabilities, and their bots, and very kindly go **** themselves.
Everything you have just said is absolutely rediculous.
BTW:: Can we have the names of these friends who are good people and bot? please? =)
Before start this final battle against bots, NCSoft should study the real reason why people use bots.
I really don’t think that every people who uses bot is a “bad people” or a “bad customer”.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
That means if you are a new customer, you will be able to PvP against other “end game player” in 4 or 5 years. In my opinion, that’s ridiculous.
In Lineage 2, the best player aren’t made by people that knows the game, has ability with mouse and keyboard or knows his ingame character’s class and skills, but is made by a player that can expend 16 or 18 hours a day playing this game.
I repeat, Lineage 2 valorizes who has more time to play, not who has more skill and more knowledge of the game.
And what does people that don’t have time to play do if want to be competitive in a PvP or join a top clan ? Answer: They BOT, they buy adenas, they ebay characters.
So if NCSoft change the mechanism of the game, people do not need to use BOT!
Make grind easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, should reach max level in 1 year at most.
Make itens and adenas easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day should be able to have a S80 gear in 1 year at most.
If NCSoft do that, people will not need to BOT or ebay to have fun with this game.
So.. who will need to ban BOT ?
Errr... OMG...
You came to Lineage 2 forums and openly admit that your friends bot/cheat whatsoever and are good people.... WTF.
this game is made for people who are commited to something, and willing to work hard and put effort into the things they do.
your friends have a job, familly, kids and a wife to take care of? Then they probably shouldn't be playing video games if they find it that hard to gather time to play to begin with. But if they insist on wasting time that is much better spent creating a better life for their 'family', then they can at least realise that lineage is not the game for them. They can take their responsabilities, and their bots, and very kindly go **** themselves.
Everything you have just said is absolutely rediculous.
BTW:: Can we have the names of these friends who are good people and bot? please? =)
Before start this final battle against bots, NCSoft should study the real reason why people use bots.
I really don’t think that every people who uses bot is a “bad people” or a “bad customer”.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
That means if you are a new customer, you will be able to PvP against other “end game player” in 4 or 5 years. In my opinion, that’s ridiculous.
In Lineage 2, the best player aren’t made by people that knows the game, has ability with mouse and keyboard or knows his ingame character’s class and skills, but is made by a player that can expend 16 or 18 hours a day playing this game.
I repeat, Lineage 2 valorizes who has more time to play, not who has more skill and more knowledge of the game.
And what does people that don’t have time to play do if want to be competitive in a PvP or join a top clan ? Answer: They BOT, they buy adenas, they ebay characters.
So if NCSoft change the mechanism of the game, people do not need to use BOT!
Make grind easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, should reach max level in 1 year at most.
Make itens and adenas easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day should be able to have a S80 gear in 1 year at most.
If NCSoft do that, people will not need to BOT or ebay to have fun with this game.
So.. who will need to ban BOT ?
I have family, kids, wife and a full time job, i only have 2 hours a day to play for 3 days a week, but I dont bot and ebayer...Other than PVP, I have lot more thing in game I am enjoying, like raid, taking fort from NPC and my friend...please dont make it an excuse to make bot legit...
sorry but one you must not have friends or AoE party
and the word lineage doesnt mean over-night withing a month week or year it's span of time.
if you don't PvP at your level now what makes you think you by botting up a toon you'll be any better at PvPing at level 85 or Ebaying a toon is just the same.
Also if your friend or self I would imagine are too afraid too lose exp now from PvPing at whatever level your trying to get at now 85 the magic number for an acuse to not PvP I guess. Imagine you losing all the botted exp and losing everytime since really you or they don't know how to play.
Either way I ejoy trainging you bots so it dont matter to me what you do and I also love when you guys think you can play and some seasoned player rolls you over....
HF and GF
won't come back this thread enjoy botting cuase you too are my hobbie
Before start this final battle against bots, NCSoft should study the real reason why people use bots.
I really don’t think that every people who uses bot is a “bad people” or a “bad customer”.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
That means if you are a new customer, you will be able to PvP against other “end game player” in 4 or 5 years. In my opinion, that’s ridiculous.
In Lineage 2, the best player aren’t made by people that knows the game, has ability with mouse and keyboard or knows his ingame character’s class and skills, but is made by a player that can expend 16 or 18 hours a day playing this game.
I repeat, Lineage 2 valorizes who has more time to play, not who has more skill and more knowledge of the game.
And what does people that don’t have time to play do if want to be competitive in a PvP or join a top clan ? Answer: They BOT, they buy adenas, they ebay characters.
So if NCSoft change the mechanism of the game, people do not need to use BOT!
Make grind easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, should reach max level in 1 year at most.
Make itens and adenas easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day should be able to have a S80 gear in 1 year at most.
If NCSoft do that, people will not need to BOT or ebay to have fun with this game.
So.. who will need to ban BOT ?
muahahahahaha hahaha thats priceless i bet your age is around 14-16 otherwise u lack some logic
your phrase in 1 sentence ppl should be allowed to bot so they can have social life and join endgame pvp
lineage is meant to play for years gearing up acumuluating wealth and so on it wasnt designed to have such a waste of 80+ and mass enchanted gear even in 2009
bots turn the tide between fair and unfair imagine a lineage2 without bots only some ppl in s grade and even fights that dont last only 2secs
and make it easier ? why ? there r plenty of games out there that fit u desires go there
vitality already was someting introduced to close the gap between cheater and legits and what happened ppl crying all the way buhuhu grind is so hard i wants cream buffs all the day give me full vita on lvlup and so on bet all u whiners had quit back in c3-c4
i log in play my 3% and go into shopmode means 1 lvl each month if i die it will take a bit longer so what 40h/5days gf and pet so in your opinion iam one of those guys they should allow to bot cause i can PWN in endgame *rolleyes*
as someone mentioned before make a cheater server where all this hide radar walker kidz can cheat on eachother and brag about there accomplishments in a video game
guess thats the place where u and ur friends will be happy
last notice who ebays is just really bad at the game sry to say that but thats the truth
Gui, your speech is totally pointless, but I can bet that you're just trolling after all the topics against bots.
So, you are saying that people who spend 30 min every day just loading the client and bot program should have the same rights as people who spend 15 h every day grinding and spend months just to earn a piece of armor? If you can't spend many hours playing Lineage, go play Guild Wars or some 150x server, but the point is that: if you are not nerd, just don't play Lineage.
The only reason to bot on retail is to be able to compete with legitimate players who have a huge disadvantage by not cheating. I guess that winning PvPs against lesser geared and lower levelled enemies makes some people feel better about certain personal shortcomings in real life.
Then when you realise that a considerable amount of players also bot and have similar level/gear, you can always use 3rd party software to help you out in PvP to keep you that 1 step ahead lol.
Never saw a botter thats not selfish,
they think the game belongs to them only,
they think cause they bot till 80+ and became ubber they can do what they want by force,
they only log in to trash talk at hero chat or call people noobs cause they cant reach the same lvl as them fast.
most of them simple dont even know who to play the game without botting.
Excuses. That is all the OP has, excuses to bot, excuses to cheat.
There are no valid excuses to cheat. 'Wanting' to be endgame, having non-game responsibilities, lacking time and willpower to do it legit....these are just excuses.
If you are honorable and honest, you don't cheat and you don't accept excuses you might come up with to excuse your dishonesty.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
If you do not have a lot of time to play L2, then this game is not for you if you expect to be at least somewhat competitive. End of discussion. Play a different game. You can play l2 without spending a lot of time, but then you cannot expect to be competitive. I know a lot of people who do not really care about the super high lvl stuff, they log on for an hour every now and then and are totally happy lvling up the 20th character to lvl 52.
I would like to own a nice sports car, but I do not have the money. Do I resort to illegal means because of that, like robbing a bank, just because I *want* that car? No. I tell myself, tough luck, not enough money, either forget about it or work harder so I get a better job.
But totally disregarding for a moment that L2 is NOT a game for a casual player, the solution to the botter problem is not to allow botting, it is to ban all botter and cheaters without any mercy whatsoever so that the legit players (i.e. those who play without cheating and invest a lot of time) have more chances. Because right now, even if you DO have a lot of time to play, you STILL have no chance against those who have 24/7 botted characters with ebayed adena. And that is just wrong.
I am one of those people who has had his account(s) for 4 years,
My main just got 76 and subclass (currently 59), My story is this...
1. When I started L2, I had nothing, I was given a swordbreaker dagger when i was level 15 or so, I knew so little about the game, I hid my existing sword behind a tree before i picked up this worryingly named weapon -("will it break my sword?"). I picked it up and it gave my light elf more damage output. I didn't have any money in the early days, and i used that dagger right up to level 30+
I levelled hard with a friend, we joined a couple of clans throughout time, and we had fun,
we saw players with stupid names ("jtwjfggwjed") and we ignored them, or if they got in our way we killed them, then spent the next few minutes looking over our shoulders as we worked off the karma.
I have never botted, or ebayed or used any hacks/assistors, but do you know what? We had fun. We still have fun and in my heart I believe I will never reach S80 or S85, but do I care? No, do I look up to those who have? Do I have respect for those who bot their way up to 80+? No. and finally do I care if (and when) I get flamed for this post? No
I play L2 the way I want to, and I believe most players who enjoy the game wont bot it up. Sure it gets to be a drag farming for a NM Helm recipe in Beast farm for hours on end, because a clannie needs the helm for a set, and we know that IF we get the recipe, the craft is likely to fail (60% NCSoft random - yeah right). But we are out there doing our XP whilst we farm for it, and we chat on Vent whilst we do it, we trashtalk on vent, we talk about anything and everything - and we have fun.
The day I log in setup a bot and go do something else "because I don't have time to play" is the day to quit. L2 wasn't made to be easy, It was made just as it is, and as someone said in an earlier post - If you don't like the game mechanics that's not an excuse to cheat, that's a reason to leave and find something you can do quickly.
The only reason to bot on retail is to be able to compete with legitimate players who have a huge disadvantage by not cheating. I guess that winning PvPs against lesser geared and lower levelled enemies makes some people feel better about certain personal shortcomings in real life.
Then when you realise that a considerable amount of players also bot and have similar level/gear, you can always use 3rd party software to help you out in PvP to keep you that 1 step ahead lol.
Actually you hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what the cheaters want...they want to cheat. They don't want a level playing field they would like everyone to play by the rules except them and their friends.
And to correct another poster...cheaters are all ages not just from the 14-18 demographic.
Actually you hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what the cheaters want...they want to cheat. They don't want a level playing field they would like everyone to play by the rules except them and their friends.
Yup. The ideal server from a botter/cheater point of view would be a server full of non-cheaters, with their own clan being the only one using bot/cheat programs. Easy pvp, dominating oly/sieges/pvp over epics due to lvl/gear advantage, lots of "UMADZBRO?", "FAIL MOAR", "are you really THAT bad?" in hero shout, that kind of thing. That's why a server with botting being allowed would not work, it would not be interesting at all for the botters.
Actually you hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what the cheaters want...they want to cheat. They don't want a level playing field they would like everyone to play by the rules except them and their friends.
And to correct another poster...cheaters are all ages not just from the 14-18 demographic.
You actually hit one nail out of many nails.
(1) They bot because they want to pvp
(2) They bot because they want more money to buy stuff
(3) They bot to look fashionable
(4) They bot because they have other important things they need to attend to.
(5) They bot because they realize how bad the grind is
(6) They bot to make stuff because they realize how much you need to gather in order to make a item (especially when there's a fail rate).
(7) They bot because "everyone" else does it.
(8) They bot because GMs aren't doing there jobs properly since April of 04.
(9) They bot because there's a third party software there and its convient to them.
(10) They bot because NcSoft doesn't really care about the community
(11) They bot because no one sued the third party software
(12) They bot because they have a hard time competing with other bots.
(13) They bot to get that gratification and feeling of success at the end "Nirvana"
(14) They bot because there friends do it and not get caught (tied in with everything else.)
I think I hit all the nails, forgive me if I missed some extra nails.
With this many reasons, you'd think an Associate producer would say "Hmmm I think we need to check our majority and ask them what we need to do to make your day in L2 more enjoyable and actually do it."
But no they're wasting all there efforts on banning players legit or not and not focusing resources on more productive means that will serve the greater good of L2 Community
And probably the most common response you'll get from some players, "BAN THE BOTTERS that's how it'll make my day enjoyable." Others will keep telling you the same reduce reduce reduce. Then you'll get THIS GAME REQUIRES COMMITMENT AND DEDICATION. None of these responses in no way will help the general L2 community.
this game is made for people who are commited to something, and willing to work hard and put effort into the things they do.
your friends have a job, familly, kids and a wife to take care of? Then they probably shouldn't be playing video games if they find it that hard to gather time to play to begin with. But if they insist on wasting time that is much better spent creating a better life for their 'family', then they can at least realise that lineage is not the game for them. They can take their responsabilities, and their bots, and very kindly go **** themselves.
Everything you have just said is absolutely rediculous.
BTW:: Can we have the names of these friends who are good people and bot? please? =)
It sounds like you would LOVE free korean mmo's they are huge huge grind fest killing same mobs all day for 12+ hours, could spare yourself some $$$$
I see what he means people cheat because you have to be unemployed or work a part time job to get ahead on lineage
That really dosent apply to most western customers and as long as the game is just big grind fest weeks and weeks for 1 level there will always be cheating
Thats why even banning bots will do no good people odnt leave or not play because of the bots there are bots on every game out now
It sounds like you would LOVE free korean mmo's they are huge huge grind fest killing same mobs all day for 12+ hours, could spare yourself some $$$$
I see what he means people cheat because you have to be unemployed or work a part time job to get ahead on lineage
That really dosent apply to most western customers and as long as the game is just big grind fest weeks and weeks for 1 level there will always be cheating
Thats why even banning bots will do no good people odnt leave or not play because of the bots there are bots on every game out now
I have played lineage 1 for 9+ years.
There is no max lvl there.. there is only endless 'grind', and I didn't accept cheaters there any more than I do here.
I don't even know what this has to do with me, or what your point even is.
This game requires you to devote large amounts of time to it. If you cannot do that, then its just too **** bad.. This is not equal opportunity gaming, if you do not fall into the category of the eligable, then its not my or anyone elses problem. It does not justify breaking the rules for your own profit
this game is made for people who are commited to something, and willing to work hard and put effort into the things they do.
your friends have a job, familly, kids and a wife to take care of? Then they probably shouldn't be playing video games if they find it that hard to gather time to play to begin with. But if they insist on wasting time that is much better spent creating a better life for their 'family', then they can at least realise that lineage is not the game for them. They can take their responsabilities, and their bots, and very kindly go **** themselves.
Everything you have just said is absolutely rediculous.
BTW:: Can we have the names of these friends who are good people and bot? please? =)
This response is just plane stupid. Just because someone has a real life doesn't mean they shouldn't play this game. However this game doesn't need to turn into another wow either with everything handed to them to easily. It also doesn't excuse botting no matter how little time somone has to devote to a video game.
Everyone has to admit there is nothing chalanging about spending hours upon hours day after day grinding on mobs for little to no xp or even rewards from it.
I agree I dont want it to easy but the drop rate in this game has been rediculas. In all honesty every change in the drop rate and the drops(common items) since I started playing this game has benefited only one thing RMT. I imagine NcSoft has been trying to combat the RMT by lowering drop rate so 24/7 trains didn't collect to much. It seems though it has had the opposite effect and even more players have resorted to botting and farming to get what they need.
This game is very game/lvl dependent for pvp. The people who have the lvls and gear own everything on each server. It becomes very clear what the design problems of an open pvp game is when you get into the higher lvls.
NcSoft could if they wanted to, make a few changes that would really kill the profits of rmt's. The problem however is that alot of the players base plays L2 because of how hard it is to obtain items in game. It's a real give and take.
Sadly I think it is to late in L2 to really do anything to stop what is going on. With any kind of major changes L2 as we know it would probably die.
Anyway L2 is a great game with a few flaws that have been discussed on these forums for years. NcSoft did listen unfortuntly thier answers were week at best (common items). Maybe the Issues that have boiled over latley will finaly be the boiling point that really gets some changes done. All we can really do is wait and see.
Most people want lineage 2 to change so there is actually a flow of new people coming in I mean yea the game is hard I like that it feels rewarding but at 77+ it becomes like OMG WTF 0_0
Just because someone has a real life doesn't mean they shouldn't play this game.
Thats not what I said. Read it again, and read my and many other peoples post which pretty much say everything that needs to be said.
Being high lvl and participating in endgame pvp is NOT equal opportunity. If thats all you want out of the game, and you don't have the time to devote to it then its too bad, but without cheating or botting you will never reach that level.
And ontop of that, its just easy fact that no matter what kind of responsililities you have, playing video games online is a neglect of those responsibilities, no matter if they directly impact your ability to perform said responsibilities or not. There is ALWAYS something productive you could be doing instead of sitting infront of a computer monitor playing video games, sorry..
You actually hit one nail out of many nails.
(1) They bot because they want to pvp
(2) They bot because they want more money to buy stuff
(3) They bot to look fashionable
(4) They bot because they have other important things they need to attend to.
(5) They bot because they realize how bad the grind is
(6) They bot to make stuff because they realize how much you need to gather in order to make a item (especially when there's a fail rate).
(7) They bot because "everyone" else does it.
(8) They bot because GMs aren't doing there jobs properly since April of 04.
(9) They bot because there's a third party software there and its convient to them.
(10) They bot because NcSoft doesn't really care about the community
(11) They bot because no one sued the third party software
(12) They bot because they have a hard time competing with other bots.
(13) They bot to get that gratification and feeling of success at the end "Nirvana"
(14) They bot because there friends do it and not get caught (tied in with everything else.)
I think I hit all the nails, forgive me if I missed some extra nails.
With this many reasons, you'd think an Associate producer would say "Hmmm I think we need to check our majority and ask them what we need to do to make your day in L2 more enjoyable and actually do it."
But no they're wasting all there efforts on banning players legit or not and not focusing resources on more productive means that will serve the greater good of L2 Community
And probably the most common response you'll get from some players, "BAN THE BOTTERS that's how it'll make my day enjoyable." Others will keep telling you the same reduce reduce reduce. Then you'll get THIS GAME REQUIRES COMMITMENT AND DEDICATION. None of these responses in no way will help the general L2 community.
Those are all excuses. Lame excuses, not a single valid reason there...it is all 'I want, gimmie gimmie, i deserve it easy because I am me' type whining.
If you are good enough to do it legit, you don't cheat. If you cheat, it proves you don't have what it takes to do it legit.
Those are all excuses. Lame excuses, not a single valid reason there...it is all 'I want, gimmie gimmie, i deserve it easy because I am me' type whining.
If you are good enough to do it legit, you don't cheat. If you cheat, it proves you don't have what it takes to do it legit.
Those are all excuses. Lame excuses, not a single valid reason there...it is all 'I want, gimmie gimmie, i deserve it easy because I am me' type whining.
If you are good enough to do it legit, you don't cheat. If you cheat, it proves you don't have what it takes to do it legit.
Before start this final battle against bots, NCSoft should study the real reason why people use bots.
I really don’t think that every people who uses bot is a “bad people” or a “bad customer”.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
That means if you are a new customer, you will be able to PvP against other “end game player” in 4 or 5 years. In my opinion, that’s ridiculous.
In Lineage 2, the best player aren’t made by people that knows the game, has ability with mouse and keyboard or knows his ingame character’s class and skills, but is made by a player that can expend 16 or 18 hours a day playing this game.
I repeat, Lineage 2 valorizes who has more time to play, not who has more skill and more knowledge of the game.
And what does people that don’t have time to play do if want to be competitive in a PvP or join a top clan ? Answer: They BOT, they buy adenas, they ebay characters.
So if NCSoft change the mechanism of the game, people do not need to use BOT!
Make grind easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, should reach max level in 1 year at most.
Make itens and adenas easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day should be able to have a S80 gear in 1 year at most.
If NCSoft do that, people will not need to BOT or ebay to have fun with this game.
So.. who will need to ban BOT ?
I can see where you were going with this, but I have to tell you that you're 100% incorrect. People didn't start botting, buying adena, or ebaying because the grind was hard and they didn't have time to play. They started all these negative behaviors because they wanted castles before everyone else, they wanted to be top level so they could easily pvp lower levels, and most of all (believe it or not) they wanted to catch up with other cheaters.
If the GM's would have stepped in way back when people first started account sharing (the very first exploit on all the L2 servers) most of these bad behaviors could have been curtailed. I'm not sure how the logs work, but I would hope there is some way you can tell how long a person has been logged in and engaged in combat. There is no way one living soul (unless you're independently wealthy and have no need to do any business of any kind) can actively level an account more than 10 hours a day, every day. If account sharing would have been stopped dead in it's tracks, this problem wouldn't have ballooned out of control. If ANY regulation was instigated right now against people that are logged in in combat mode for an ungodly amount of time, you would see the bot population dry up almost immediately.
Cheaters + Lack of Punishment = MORE CHEATERS!!!
This is the only reason why people use bots. Because they can do it and get away with it.
Before start this final battle against bots, NCSoft should study the real reason why people use bots.
I really don’t think that every people who uses bot is a “bad people” or a “bad customer”.
I have friends that use bot and are not a “bad person”. They have a job, family, kids and a wife to care.
They simple don’t have too much time to expend in a videogame.
AND people that don’t have time to expend playing Lineage 2, DON’T HAVE chance to be competitive in a PvP.
If you play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, you will reach at level 85 in 4 or 5 years.
That means if you are a new customer, you will be able to PvP against other “end game player” in 4 or 5 years. In my opinion, that’s ridiculous.
In Lineage 2, the best player aren’t made by people that knows the game, has ability with mouse and keyboard or knows his ingame character’s class and skills, but is made by a player that can expend 16 or 18 hours a day playing this game.
I repeat, Lineage 2 valorizes who has more time to play, not who has more skill and more knowledge of the game.
And what does people that don’t have time to play do if want to be competitive in a PvP or join a top clan ? Answer: They BOT, they buy adenas, they ebay characters.
So if NCSoft change the mechanism of the game, people do not need to use BOT!
Make grind easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day, should reach max level in 1 year at most.
Make itens and adenas easier: People that play this game for 3 or 4 hours a day should be able to have a S80 gear in 1 year at most.
If NCSoft do that, people will not need to BOT or ebay to have fun with this game.
So.. who will need to ban BOT ?
You're insane
If you play for only 2-4 hours a day and still can't make it to "end game" in less than 4 years you are either deficient, or just plain suck at this game.
I have multiple toons around the subclass level (75)... I play for only 45 minutes to an hour a day (exactly enough time for me to go from full VIT to lvl 3 VIT). Which means that I always log in will Full VIT, and always stop when it falls to lvl 3... and I cane get 5-7% a day at lvl 75.
explain to me how that takes 4-5 years to reach end game?
I have multiple toons around the subclass level (75)... I play for only 45 minutes to an hour a day (exactly enough time for me to go from full VIT to lvl 3 VIT). Which means that I always log in will Full VIT, and always stop when it falls to lvl 3... and I cane get 5-7% a day at lvl 75.
explain to me how that takes 4-5 years to reach end game?
Hmmm. Depends how you define end game I suppose. I'd probably agree with you that once you are subclass level/third class change (75+), that is end game. And that's how the game is engineered I think. The devs intended anyone 75+ to be end-game characters, and 80+s to be quite rare, I think.
What changes the definition is the clans full of botters who are 80+. Because they so dominate PvP, it basically shifts the 'end game' bracket up to the 80s, because otherwise you have no hope of competing with these cheaters.
75 is doable for a casual player. 80 on the other hand is a whole different ball game. Once you hit 76, your VIT consumption is immediately doubled. And it's increased again as you progress through the next few levels. My main is 78 and VIT4 lasts precisely 7 whole minutes. Vit3 maybe another 10 mins. So basically in less than a buff round, I've consumed more vit than will regenerate in a day (vit3 and 4 regen in about 24 hours). What that means is that once you are into your high 70s, even a CASUAL player will be grinding at vit0-2 most of the time (provided they play more than 20 minutes a day). At those kind of rates, yes, it will literally take years for a casual player to reach end game, if you define that as lv 80+. Lv 79 alone is 2.1 billion xp, which is equal to every other level before it combined (1-78).
Anyway to get back on topic, bots are a huge problem in this game. They throw the economy out of whack and make high end PvP almost impossible to enjoy for legit players. How can you honestly compete with people who have an unhumanly high level compared to you (I say 'unhumanly' because if you do the math, there are some toons out there that are 84/80/80/80 and with highly OE'ed skills ... which literally could not have been done by a human with normal eating and sleeping needs, in the time the character has existed).
I am one of those people who has had his account(s) for 4 years,
My main just got 76 and subclass (currently 59), My story is this...
1. When I started L2, I had nothing, I was given a swordbreaker dagger when i was level 15 or so, I knew so little about the game, I hid my existing sword behind a tree before i picked up this worryingly named weapon -("will it break my sword?"). I picked it up and it gave my light elf more damage output. I didn't have any money in the early days, and i used that dagger right up to level 30+
I levelled hard with a friend, we joined a couple of clans throughout time, and we had fun,
we saw players with stupid names ("jtwjfggwjed") and we ignored them, or if they got in our way we killed them, then spent the next few minutes looking over our shoulders as we worked off the karma.
I have never botted, or ebayed or used any hacks/assistors, but do you know what? We had fun. We still have fun and in my heart I believe I will never reach S80 or S85, but do I care? No, do I look up to those who have? Do I have respect for those who bot their way up to 80+? No. and finally do I care if (and when) I get flamed for this post? No
I play L2 the way I want to, and I believe most players who enjoy the game wont bot it up. Sure it gets to be a drag farming for a NM Helm recipe in Beast farm for hours on end, because a clannie needs the helm for a set, and we know that IF we get the recipe, the craft is likely to fail (60% NCSoft random - yeah right). But we are out there doing our XP whilst we farm for it, and we chat on Vent whilst we do it, we trashtalk on vent, we talk about anything and everything - and we have fun.
The day I log in setup a bot and go do something else "because I don't have time to play" is the day to quit. L2 wasn't made to be easy, It was made just as it is, and as someone said in an earlier post - If you don't like the game mechanics that's not an excuse to cheat, that's a reason to leave and find something you can do quickly.
Hmmm. Depends how you define end game I suppose. I'd probably agree with you that once you are subclass level/third class change (75+), that is end game. And that's how the game is engineered I think. The devs intended anyone 75+ to be end-game characters, and 80+s to be quite rare, I think.
What changes the definition is the clans full of botters who are 80+. Because they so dominate PvP, it basically shifts the 'end game' bracket up to the 80s, because otherwise you have no hope of competing with these cheaters.
75 is doable for a casual player. 80 on the other hand is a whole different ball game. Once you hit 76, your VIT consumption is immediately doubled. And it's increased again as you progress through the next few levels. My main is 78 and VIT4 lasts precisely 7 whole minutes. Vit3 maybe another 10 mins. So basically in less than a buff round, I've consumed more vit than will regenerate in a day (vit3 and 4 regen in about 24 hours). What that means is that once you are into your high 70s, even a CASUAL player will be grinding at vit0-2 most of the time (provided they play more than 20 minutes a day). At those kind of rates, yes, it will literally take years for a casual player to reach end game, if you define that as lv 80+. Lv 79 alone is 2.1 billion xp, which is equal to every other level before it combined (1-78).
Anyway to get back on topic, bots are a huge problem in this game. They throw the economy out of whack and make high end PvP almost impossible to enjoy for legit players. How can you honestly compete with people who have an unhumanly high level compared to you (I say 'unhumanly' because if you do the math, there are some toons out there that are 84/80/80/80 and with highly OE'ed skills ... which literally could not have been done by a human with normal eating and sleeping needs, in the time the character has existed).
Referring to those that are 84/80/80/80 and every knows there are and how they got there levels and I'm also pretty sure NC knows who they are as that is how they decide to raise the level cap (right) but yet they are still around ... ? Why do you think that is so ...
Its pretty simple the real life excuse is just that a excuse.
Why are their bots in WoW, GuildWars, CoH, etc where leveling is not a issue? No one wants to work for anything.
Euros and NA people are a majority of lazy people who want instant grafication. It is why FPS are so popular in the NA/Euro market more then in Asian countries. Fighting games are more popular here also. WoW was the only game that made it big ever in the NA/Euro market because its just that friggen easy but people still bot, because THEY ARE LAZY AND WANT INSTANT GRATIFICATION.
MMORPG = RMT it don't matter what mmorpg you play they all have bots and RMT etc.
Thats not what I said. Read it again, and read my and many other peoples post which pretty much say everything that needs to be said.
Being high lvl and participating in endgame pvp is NOT equal opportunity. If thats all you want out of the game, and you don't have the time to devote to it then its too bad, but without cheating or botting you will never reach that level.
And ontop of that, its just easy fact that no matter what kind of responsililities you have, playing video games online is a neglect of those responsibilities, no matter if they directly impact your ability to perform said responsibilities or not. There is ALWAYS something productive you could be doing instead of sitting infront of a computer monitor playing video games, sorry..
There is ALWAYS something productive you could be doing instead of sitting infront of a computer monitor playing video games, sorry.
This above statement applies to every single human being on earth except for the one's that earn a living playing this game. By the way most high lvl players wouldn't have what they have except maybe the lvl's if it wasn't for the farmers/botters so don't try and use the "Being high lvl and participating in endgame pvp is NOT equal opportunity" this statement is such bull crap because most of us would be on the same equal footing if it wasn't for RMT where most of the advantages come from.
I have been playing L2 on and off since C2 I know how frustrating it is and I also know how the game has changed. I have a high enough toon that could compete if I resorted to it, and payed for the items I needed to compete. However I refuse to cheat so I don't try to compete. I actually enjoy the grind and the chance of a decent drop, why else would I spend all my time out on IOP. It definatly isn't for the xp. There are things NcSoft could do to minimize the rmt in L2 but it would probably run most people off. They couldn't afford that since the RMT (a major portion of accounts) would leave too.
I think the bots are due to the fact that western auditory did not "get" this game.
It was made for koreans who are more social than westerners.
Koreans socialize easier so even people who are completely unknown to each other can form clans in this game. Or even party with some random people in high profile locations like hb. In west, such clans and antag people are considered noobs, and are denied any xp spots that can get most of them to anything over 79 without bot in time less than a few years.
Besides, westerners are much more sadistic so they like to grief on unknown people alot, hence they close up all the locations they can so that other people would not be able to xp. Just look at HB on most servers - its empty, not because people don't want to xp there, but because anyone not permitted to exp there is being pk'd even when pker's clans don't xp there at the moment.
Only way the "top" clans are formed in EU/US is by people who know each other or by recommendations, because acc sharing is used alot and completely stranger has to submit his own acc completely if he wants to enter some factorable clan (so called "const parties" where acc sharing between all members is a must are the core of any top clan) .. Because of such requirements which is even against EULA, most people have to solo or be part of less able clans..
Hence most people have to xp in places other than hb which of course means it'll take a few years of legit play to get to 84. But it's not how it was intended to be played.
So yeah, the WoW which was made for western auditory is probably the only good choice for most people which means that lineage 2 will soon be dependent on the mercy of NC West when all ppl not in top alliances will quit or be banned and those top alliances will soon quit too because there is no pvp and no noobs to grief over which those people only play this game for.
There is ALWAYS something productive you could be doing instead of sitting infront of a computer monitor playing video games, sorry.
This above statement applies to every single human being on earth except for the one's that earn a living playing this game. By the way most high lvl players wouldn't have what they have except maybe the lvl's if it wasn't for the farmers/botters so don't try and use the "Being high lvl and participating in endgame pvp is NOT equal opportunity" this statement is such bull crap because most of us would be on the same equal footing if it wasn't for RMT where most of the advantages come from.
I have been playing L2 on and off since C2 I know how frustrating it is and I also know how the game has changed. I have a high enough toon that could compete if I resorted to it, and payed for the items I needed to compete. However I refuse to cheat so I don't try to compete. I actually enjoy the grind and the chance of a decent drop, why else would I spend all my time out on IOP. It definatly isn't for the xp. There are things NcSoft could do to minimize the rmt in L2 but it would probably run most people off. They couldn't afford that since the RMT (a major portion of accounts) would leave too.
You obviously have a hard time understanding the things I say...
Right after I say l2 is not equal opportunity, I say that if you don't have time to play then no one will make time for you, or allow you to bend the rules to suit your needs. This has nothing to do with actually being high lvl in pvp.. You read it all out of context, and its about GETTING high lvl, I'm sorry but if you don't have the time to get high lvl, no video game fairy is going to come by and wipe the tears of your face and say "its okay, my child. Just dry those tears and I will make you level 80". Everything in this game is earned and if you don't have the time to earn it its your problem, not anyone elses.
Like varaya said, if I want to buy a ferrari, but I make $25k a year, no one is going to let me rob a bank to buy one, so why should botters have any excuse to do what they do?
Like varaya said, if I want to buy a ferrari, but I make $25k a year, no one is going to let me rob a bank to buy one, so why should botters have any excuse to do what they do?
I don't see why not? Here in the US if you make $25k a year, banks were REQUIRED to loan you the money for a $400,000.00 house which you never made a payment on for the past 2 years, now can't be taken away from you, and the bank is now required to leave you in the house and use forgiveness money to pay off your debt--which is mysteriously adjusted down--AND NOW, you can buy a car you can't afford from GM, loose your job at McDonalds and your neighbors will pay for that TOO!
Who said the American dream is dead? Maybe that Ferrari is closer than you think Jayy!
I find it curious that a majority of posters pressing the 'banning bots is useless' meme, have accounts that joined within the last few months. Did you perhaps have had your lvl 80+ account banned?
The sale of game currency for RL cash is a $2 billion a year business. All games have the problem, and no one has satisfactorily solved the issue.
Additionally, I hear people say that NC gets cash from all the bot accounts, so it is not in their interest to ban. This may hold true for the non adena seller aligned bots, but the reality for adena sellers is that they use a lot of stolen credit information to purchase accounts, and keep their RL costs down. NC is responsible for credit returns in cases of fraud, and actually loses money on the account.
But it seems that a few approaches have a fairly good chance of mitigating it.
1) make it harder for the sellers to get the in game currency to the buyers.
Place restrictions on sales, where only a compatible amount of currency can be given for an article of similar value. Do not allow people to sell their user manuals or a stem for 300 Mil. Trades will be trickier to monitor, but methods may be implemented to monitor trades over a set value.
2) have active GM's in game and banning on the spot 24/7.
This is more of a PR move than an effective strategy, and the mass bans are more useful, but the perception of in game people is also extremely important, and needs to be addressed.
3) Do not allow a character to drop anything on the ground while in party.
This may inconvenience me when I'm trying to get some pots to my boxed buffer, but a trade works just as well. If a person is dumb enough to trade their weapon to a stranger, well, that's their own fault.
The other side is the upper level players who bot to get back XP lost in battles, or make cash to resupply pots and supplies, or simply cuz they're too lazy to level. These "players" (and I use the term loosely) are more damaging to the reputation of the game than the adena sellers.
I have seen good players get up to a high level without cheating, but once they get involved with the end game PvP, are encouraged to bot. Buff bots are supplied to them for levelling, knowing that sooner or later, the person will allow his main to also be botted. I have no facts to support this opinion, but I would not be surprised to learn that some of the top clans (or at least the leaders) in the game are also associated with adena sellers.
Keep up the mass bannings. Keep the GM's in game and banning publicly. Have them travel to the areas reported in multiple threads, have a look, and forcelog the account(s) at the least.