Wanted to post a few thoughts on the official boards; I have meant to do so for several months but as is always RL is after all RL.
As a player from the beginning I can say that Botting and NC's lack of EULA enforcing has turned this beautiful gem of a game into a very frustrating experience. Is an old story of course, but a legit player like myself, no longer feels the "need" to login as often as i once did. No QQ here, just reality, I sit down at my PC and hesitate before the login screen and think, "Hmmm...maybe I should just watch the tube tonight or read a new book". At 79, after so long playing L2, the "rewards for efforts" of a legit player simply are not there. Furthermore, logging in to see current Sayha "Heroes" that a few months earlier were bots in IOP or Varkas leaves me with a bitter taste.
Saddest part though. perhaps L2 just isn't for me any longer; 4 + years to 79/78 sub with several breaks in between, there is no way that I can possibly think of levels past 80. The next patch looks beautiful, as did the first day I logged into L2, but the beauty is for who? Botted up toons? Toons bought and sold on GOGYGO? I simply do not have the time to be able to play and attempt to compete against others that sit in "trains" 24/7. Again, no QQ, just reality....L2 is of course meant to be hard, to need group play, but until the Botting can be stopped it is going to lose more and more of it's longtime legit players.
At some point I began to believe that maybe NCSOFT should start to simply allow botting on retail; I know others will flame this, but if Legit players are to compete how can we possibly do so when we are out leveled, outgeared, and in many instances need to grind just to make enough Adena to cover Shot Usage for the next week? Yes there are ways to earn Adena, I know this, been here a while, sold and bought market items often when I logged in several times a day , but now I find i have little to no motivation to do this. People in Clan were quite amazed when i subbed a BH, best thing I ever did IMO, as I made the best usage of Beast Farm when the L2 economy for A Grade was insane.
An hour ago I read the patch notes for Final; I got excited about the armor and weapons, about flying and new zones, skills, territories....5 minutes later I thought "It will literally take me more than a year to even begin thinking of the new gear, let alone attempt to craft or actually own any. As noted in last paragraph "rewards for efforts" just simply are not there any longer. How many people actually believe they can legitimately acquire these new items when so many I know still don't even have full S Grade now?
I will hope to comment a great deal more later on this week; I am fairly certain a great deal of people are going to ask for my "gear" in this post but I do not plan on leaving l2, at least until Aion release in NA.
We hear you, I amn't going to last much longer either and I know many others feel the same. But they money is rolling in for them, what does NC and their pitiful staff care?. Who the hell is the community manager? I've been reading these forums for years and I know the name of 2 GMs who post rarely - and that's being nice, no joke. Pathetic. I've defended this game for years, even over WoW - I really don't know why.
Without meaning to diminish your rant but the new update is actually quite good for legits. It places high end items as rewards in instances (talking about Vesper armors/Icarus weapons) and encourages clan play and cooperation. A far cry from the current set up a group in IT/Ketra/Varka and get the recipes deal.
Without meaning to diminish your rant but the new update is actually quite good for legits. It places high end items as rewards in instances (talking about Vesper armors/Icarus weapons) and encourages clan play and cooperation. A far cry from the current set up a group in IT/Ketra/Varka and get the recipes deal.
Ty for the reply...
Rant, not really,,agree about the new items as rewards, but who will be able to get them? 4Years to 79....what level is needed to actually get new gear? I am quite interested in many of the aspects of Final but have no illusions that I will actually make 84 let alone 82.
Please consider that I did not attempt to rant; the whole Luna Bot incident merely made things worse but the post is not intended as a rant. I truly care for what this game had to offer but cannot honestly say that L2 is really worth playing any longer. When cheating > legit playing and the EULA is not enforced what is the purpose of an Open PVP game? There is in fact no competition and the effort does not support the goal: to compete...
Rant, not really,,agree about the new items as rewards, but who will be able to get them? 4Years to 79....what level is needed to actually get new gear? I am quite interested in many of the aspects of Final but have no illusions that I will actually make 84 let alone 82.
Please consider that I did not attempt to rant; the whole Luna Bot incident merely made things worse but the post is not intended as a rant. I truly care for what this game had to offer but cannot honestly say that L2 is really worth playing any longer. When cheating > legit playing and the EULA is not enforced what is the purpose of an Open PVP game? There is in fact no competition and the effort does not support the goal: to compete...
Peace
hey not really man. the birds gave me 125k exp and they were DARK BLUE to a level 83. i am positive that a level 76 players would earn easily double that. levelling in gracia is super fast and ultra rewarding, given the majority of it is instanced. 4 years to 79? nah, not unless you do it the classic way at IOP/HB/MOS/Varkas etc.
An hour ago I read the patch notes for Final; I got excited about the armor and weapons, about flying and new zones, skills, territories....5 minutes later I thought "It will literally take me more than a year to even begin thinking of the new gear, let alone attempt to craft or actually own any. As noted in last paragraph "rewards for efforts" just simply are not there any longer. How many people actually believe they can legitimately acquire these new items when so many I know still don't even have full S Grade now?
That's kind of my feeling right now as well. And that's why for now my account will expire on the 28th and will remain that way.
I might end up coming back, but in all honesty, I'm having a lot of fun with Assassin's Creed and surprisingly enough, Age of Conan. I might give AoC a month's worth to see if I enjoy it better.
But I'm not giving L2 my money this month. Which is a pity.
I share ValerieRose's concern. Is my effort to even reach 84 to wear half that crap worth it? Probably not.
It's all nice gear and all for botted toons.
As an aside Valerie just skip AoC, or play various toons through the first 20 levels then quit at the end of the month. Too many of us played the "pay us to play our flaming pile of poo beta". The underlying mechanics of the game were so poorly designed. We knew people who after 60 levels still could not complete their resource gathering quests and others who did managed to complete them quite quickly. Been that and still having armor from when you were level 10 be better than what you are finding at level 30....the game made no sense. I miss my sadomaschistic toon but alas...a waste of time.
I've been wanting to post something along these line for a while now. You pretty much covered 100% of what I wanted to say. The best game in a very long time, if not ever,now almost nothing because of who manages it.
I remember Spam saying something along the lines of "ripping the code out of his bare hands" if bots are ever favored over legits. Well, look at what happened in Luna. Look at the 200 posts the last of this game's community in the respective "Luna bot" thread, and the 1 meaningless GM response given. Giving bots time cards is favoring legits? Does everyone have to stage a mass petition/threaten to leave? Maybe we all should have, because asking nicely doesn't work and apparently that does.
Look at phoenix server, once full of fun, respectful, competitive PVP, now run by a group of rude, racist bots whom NCsoft allowed to bot for 6 months and then transfer to ruin the last great NA server. Teon I believe had a similar issue with an influx of bots from Luna and Franz.
Thanks a lot for ruining our enjoyment and all of our work.
You have to read this thoughly to be able to understand what i am about to say, no skimreading.
The largest problem we as NA players face is Korea!!!!
NCwest messed up by NOT purchasing complete and total rights to the game. As it stands ncwest is still under koreas rule on ALL game mechanics and policies.
Ncwest cannot even wipe there (u know what ) in game without koreas specfic approvial.
L2 na versus l2 kc should be so different for the populations playing both versions, but its not. Korea makes sure all the events and goodies are given to korean servers first and more often, ncwest is limited by korea. Yes alot of this has to do with translation timings but once the events and goodies are translated, still korea has those events more often. Even in current patch`s korea has more items ingame then are allowed to be released in NA servers, we have all seen that.
In korea all servers are in the same timezone
In korea all PLAYERS are in the same time zone
Those two points of interest mean a lot, they can easily work together in clans/alliances/parties then any of the na servers simply because of the fact all NA servers have player base timezone differences of upto 20+ hours.
If NCwest had total control over the NA servers there would be a vast change in the gameplay we would see, but they CANNOT due to lic rights they hold, again there fault.
I have played since C2 and to be totally blunt it has been downhill ever since. Back then the game was more balanced PvP wise, seige wise and there were few if any bots. It is a known fact the harder you make something the more people will strive to make it easier = bots.
L2 has become a longivity income producer, meaning income over a long period of time, that is why the end game lvl`s are so xp expensive. Taking one person 1-4 years to reach end game content is totally unrealistic. BUT if all players were in ONE timezone it would be easier ie: korea.
By being in ONE timezone it is easy for players to group together in max raid parties to take on ANY boss in the game, whereas in NA it can barely be done due to player timezone differences.
People complain about WoW, but it is that way for a reason. It is based on the fact that players are there from all timezones, NOT JUST ONE as l2korea is. So it is adjusted so single players can lvl fast so they can experience end game content, and face it that is what MOST players want, they do not want to be limited to content because they live in a timezone where it is hard to group together.
I am NOT saying wow is great, i have not played it, but if and i want to repeat IF L2NA were to adjust its specs and gameplay halfway towards the way wow is setup, then perhaps this game could improve, if not then it will contune to die out as it has over the past couple of years.
I litterly have known hundreds of players that played L2 for years leave, now thats just ME, 1 person that has known that many, multiple it by each and every one of you.
I am sure some of the hardcore players that live and eat and sleep L2 will come here and say "well its a hardcore game, if you don`t like it leave" well look around you see all that vacant space where it use to be full of players, guess what we have.
Thanks for the food for thought. I started playing a couple weeks after C2 came out. I really enjoy this game, and dislike it sometimes too. I like playing spoilers but I also like PvP - to me, BH and PvP don't go well together. Finally, after all of this time I've gotten my act together and have a PvP toon that I like (GK with SH sub) and have a PvE toon that I put alot of time into - bounty hunter.
I play the game for both PvP and PvE and I have a different toon that I use for each.
Bummer, my ramblings are not as good as the OP's :D
I plan on playing for many years to come thanks to the abililty to transfer toon from one server to another. ^^ In the past two months I've been able to transfer two of my favorite toons to a more populated server Pheonix - that's really a good server :-) and well worth spending $100 for the transferring of my two toons.
P.S. Don't worry about the "OMG Luna Bot Thread" Since you've been here for so many years you know of the peaks and valleys that all aspects of the game goes through. I'm nicely saying, get over it already and play the game for fun like you have always done. IMO, the game is only getting better.
Im feeling down about L2 myself lately, but I found an OMG empowering game, that must be like what L2 botters feel, its called FF12 LOL, instead of spoiling its stealing, instead of 'bots' its 'gambits'
my team is programmed exactly the way I want them, on autopilot. I romp through the game and WTF own anything that stands in my way on my journey for Ultima whatever, big shiny glowy epic... single player...
it feels GOOD TO ALWAYS WIN.
"Do whatever it takes to win" is a very American mindstate *cough* Hiroshima *cough*
not to mention we don't really give a **** about eachother(other players, outside your clan/circle), its just formalities.
Another area Korea has us beat, COMMUNISM, COMMUNITY!
I used to get thrills when I'd buy hundreds of millions of adena, and felt IMPORTANT in giran as ppl jumped over eachother to get me what I wanted, Because its all for profit. As the sharks (botted items) scout for their next mark. thats how the market ends up with 300m+ S grade items.
Communism = be good wait your turn, in time u will get it
Capitalism = Maybe open a 2nd credit card? so you can get it NOW!
hey not really man. the birds gave me 125k exp and they were DARK BLUE to a level 83. i am positive that a level 76 players would earn easily double that. levelling in gracia is super fast and ultra rewarding, given the majority of it is instanced. 4 years to 79? nah, not unless you do it the classic way at IOP/HB/MOS/Varkas etc.
did you forget that xp rates are 4x? let us see. 4x rates, full vitality, gets us 12x xp rate. so with no vit at 1x live rates, you'd get 10k xp for that bird. ok maybe it'd be 20k if it was white. is it any better than regular normal mob? i don't think so. in addition you can't use rechargers so you have to wait for mp or farm stones for mp pots which takes as much time. all this is not ever needed on mainland where you may have rechargers.
reality is that the new gracia continent is only good for star stones farming which is as boring as it could ever be... and instances doable with 40 people which are impossible to gather daily by most clans in the current state of lineage in NE/EU.
So Gracia continent is as a whole useless for 90% of current player base.
I haven't played the PTS so I can't judge Gracia Final. I'm hoping that the single party daily instance will be fun - the rest I dunno. I'm lucky enough to have a character high enough to go to gracia but I still feel sorry for those who are casual players as the new update adds absultely nothing for them.
Personally, I don't shiv a git about these new 83 items. As a legit player I have no desire to compete with botted up players in top gear using 3rd party asist software so I'm in no rush to get into this new stuff. The only people who need to be concerned with the new gear right now are botted PvPers keeping up with other botted PvPers - and its this demographic who NCsoft have aimed their last 2 expansions at.
I think one of the biggest problems with this game currently is that there is a severe lack of emphasis on quests. If you look at any other MMO on the market these days, questing is one of the most essential parts of the game.
Yes, there are class change quests and a few good quests that can be found in Lineage 2. But those good quests are few and far between. And the rewards for many of the quests that are littered all over the in-game map are sometimes laughable. Take for instance the level 46 quest "Pavel the Giant." The reward for the said quest is 76,960 experience points and 5,793 SP. Gee, thanks NCsoft. That's about 7 mobs worth of experience. If I wanted to get that as a reward, I would have killed 7 mobs. Even at level 46, that's hardly rewarding.
I'm not saying that every quest has absolute garbage for rewards. But the quests that offer experience as a reward, especially the quests that are aimed at lower level players (C and B grade mainly), the amount of experience gained from doing said quests needs a severe readjustment.
My $0.02.
EDIT: I just performed that quest on my SwS and it gave me a grand total of 1.5% at level 50. Thanks NC!
looks like a QQ thread so i'm gonna have a go
my main concern about the new chron was that i may be unable to get the required books for my 80+ skills but having seen how crap they are i really couldn't care less if i get them or not
i'm about ready for another year long sabbatical so noone be surprised if i stop showing up all of a sudden
EDIT:BTW /selflol at me expecting decent dorf skills ><
a great game, spoiled completely by mismanagement at its highest level. the gm staff is silent and conspiratorial at best when it comes to questions regarding the soulless population. there are so many bot programs for free out there now, that nearly anyone can go download one, read a very short tutorial and start lvling up. 100% of legitimate people can spot a bot 100 miles away, yet gm's have trouble finding them, and when they do, they arent sure/dont have enough evidence, and unban the bot hero parties/super farmers.
after reading the ridiculousness about luna, i think that pretty much seals this game's fate, as well as many other ncsoft games that may be supported for NA. this game truly shows the ludicrousness of the eula. it seems to be enforced maybe once every 3 months to show they care, and then its back to the same old botting.
new players should be aware that they will never compete with the majority of the player base here. getting 83/75/75/75 will take years and years to do. do you have the time or patience to do all the ******ed quests to get that? all a botter has to do is run a script to do entire quests. he goes to sleep every night and wakes up with another part of a quest completed. he wakes up with millions of adena he picked up, and mats and recipes to craft s80 gear and whatever else he wants. then he pvp's you. you're a legit 79 or so, and you fight, you do crap damage to him and notice he cp pots faster than lightspeed...htf does he do that!? then you're dead.
welcome to lineage 2. the most disenchanting experience you'll ever regret.
At this point in the game, I think i will remove all my stuff from my 5th account. It had my dorf seller. The toons were all in the 40-50's and i really don't see a point in continuing that account. They are a waste of time to play.
Main account and buffer will remain open at least for another month.
I am fairly certain a great deal of people are going to ask for my "gear" in this post but I do not plan on leaving l2, at least until Aion release in NA.
Peace
I loled...hard.
You write a post about how botting ruined this game and then say you are going to play it until Aion is available in NA.
Aion, bot wise , is worse than Lineage....read the reviews.
Why would you leave Bottage and go play Botaion.
Really... you make no sense.
And yes NC Soft don't care...how many times are they gonna have to prove it before you believe...i mean read Omega's responce...why did he just not write F... O.. Wait...he did!
You write a post about how botting ruined this game and then say you are going to play it until Aion is available in NA.
Aion, bot wise , is worse than Lineage....read the reviews.
Why would you leave Bottage and go play Botaion.
Really... you make no sense.
And yes NC Soft don't care...how many times are they gonna have to prove it before you believe...i mean read Omega's responce...why did he just not write F... O.. Wait...he did!
I agree. I've seen game play of Aion and the interface/controls remind me too much of World of Warcraft (which I was not a fan of by any means necessary). And as you mentioned....the game is already riddled with bots on the Korean servers and I highly doubt it will be much different here on NA Servers.
As much as the bot problem in L2 has gotten bad since the old days, like C1 and C2 when I played my original accounts, I think it could be much worse than it currently is.
But then again I'm pretty low level and I don't have to compete with the farmers for hunting spots very often.
C4/C5/IL/Kamael where the worst chronicles botwise, things are better nowadays, even farmers have given up on the game :)
Exactly. It could be far worse than it is.
I'm not justifying the people that are still botting but these days there isn't much to complain about. Except on Sayha, where the economy is still in shambles.
My apologies as I did not wish for this thread to turn into a "Bot" thread.
I suppose the main point I was trying to make reflects that fact I am less and less motivated to login to L2. While it may be true that Aion already has it's issues, at least it will offer a semi new experience that I, and many of my friends currently in L2, will try out together.
The fact is that in L2, on my main, a 79 MS, if I can manage 1.5 hrs per day, (which I currently cannot) I am gaining at most .25% in xp. 4 Killed Mobs solo in Ketra at 79 = .01....Before the flaming, understand that I realize there are better ways to gain xp, or go into different areas (although several of these areas are not so easily accessible, since I am "radar" detected almost instantly by other's 3rd party sofwares). BTW, I cancelled a support account several months ago and have no intention of reactivating it, the cost per month far outweighs the reward of having a buffer on hand. The fact remains that while I "grind" the same toons that are now challenging my area (i.e. pvp) have been botting that area for the last 18 hrs. As a legit, It becomes increasingly evident that the "effort vs rewards" for playing are just not there . I realise this is a personal thing; many others may love the grind at these levels, I, however, have no expectation of attaining Level 82 or beyond.
In Final, if the instances for both solo and parties are as other's have written, it will be most welcoming for the long time but now casual players. Territories also sound like there will be something for people to do other than engage in the "grind".
Finally, please believe that I have always cared for this game; how else could I and many others have stayed so long? But the truth is, even though many have stayed, most have left and/or given into the urge to bot or use 3rd party software to facilitate their grind. I am hopeful that Final will prove to be something I will feel that old need to login too; I will wait and see.
Lald it's not your fault, most people on these boards are so fed up with the issue that every thread eventually turns into a bot thread.
They use to lock every thread when it digressed into bot/cheating discussions just to keep what is happeneing from happening. Unfortunatly that has changed making it almost worthless to try and have any kind of conversation about anything on here anymore.
In a way I believe it's a good thing. If L2 wasn't such a good game all of us who are fed up with the automation would have left a long time ago. However we all really like this game and want it to be fixed. Even though we can't see anything happening for the better we still keep hoping and playing this game.
My apologies as I did not wish for this thread to turn into a "Bot" thread.
I suppose the main point I was trying to make reflects that fact I am less and less motivated to login to L2. While it may be true that Aion already has it's issues, at least it will offer a semi new experience that I, and many of my friends currently in L2, will try out together.
The fact is that in L2, on my main, a 79 MS, if I can manage 1.5 hrs per day, (which I currently cannot) I am gaining at most .25% in xp. 4 Killed Mobs solo in Ketra at 79 = .01....Before the flaming, understand that I realize there are better ways to gain xp, or go into different areas (although several of these areas are not so easily accessible, since I am "radar" detected almost instantly by other's 3rd party sofwares). BTW, I cancelled a support account several months ago and have no intention of reactivating it, the cost per month far outweighs the reward of having a buffer on hand. The fact remains that while I "grind" the same toons that are now challenging my area (i.e. pvp) have been botting that area for the last 18 hrs. As a legit, It becomes increasingly evident that the "effort vs rewards" for playing are just not there . I realise this is a personal thing; many others may love the grind at these levels, I, however, have no expectation of attaining Level 82 or beyond.
In Final, if the instances for both solo and parties are as other's have written, it will be most welcoming for the long time but now casual players. Territories also sound like there will be something for people to do other than engage in the "grind".
Finally, please believe that I have always cared for this game; how else could I and many others have stayed so long? But the truth is, even though many have stayed, most have left and/or given into the urge to bot or use 3rd party software to facilitate their grind. I am hopeful that Final will prove to be something I will feel that old need to login too; I will wait and see.
Peace
Laldaanstar
79MS/78BH
Sayha
I by no means intended to try and turn this thread into a "bot" thread. I'm in full agreement with you, however. I feel, even though I've only just recently reactivated my accounts, that my (the customer's) interest has never been a priority. I know the game has been around for 5 years, but for some of us, breaks get in the way of getting to end-game.
Yeah, it's great to give end-game people tons of new things to do but never forget about the lowbies. How else do you expect to get new players if there is no focus on them?
I'm just staying to see what the new update is like. The more I hear about it, the more useless it seems to me.
The $60/mo. I'm paying for Lineage II is already too much for an MMORPG when I can play any of the other I've played with 1 account with 2x the fun factor and 2x the progression in same span of time.
The hobbies I've picked up lately are very expensive. Hope they've done something E-MAZING in this update that it will draw my attention again. Game is more like a chore than fun-factor these days.
Bot are really the least of my worries. There are many horrible things about this game apart from Bots...
As a very long time player (been around since Prelude), just wanted to add another +1 to the OPs thoughts. Couldn't have said it better.
L2 is a beautiful game - great artwork, fantastic music and atmosphere. And it is an interesting game - an open, player driven economy, intricate game mechanics, and most of all, an open PvP world. When I say an open PvP world, this refers to not just standard PvP, but also the ability to compete via the economy, via competing for hunting grounds and bosses (not a fan of instancing), via manipulating your personal relationships with friends and enemies. The politics. The ability to influence the ownership of actual areas of the game world. It's a great concept.
I don't even mind the incredibly harsh leveling curve and masochistic crafting/enchanting system. I'm a firm believer that top, rare gear in a game should be TRULY rare (a handful of items per server).
But yeah ... to be 78 or 79 after years of playing and then get your *** whipped by a player who's botted his way up there in 6 months (and has uber ebayed 150 earth weapons and boss jewels) is just no fun. Why did I go to all that effort? A piece of automated software could have done that for me in 1/10th of the time, with apparently only a small risk of being banned.
NC: your long-term, legit player base in this game is going to reach a tipping point in the next 6-12 months. When bots were just farmers selling adena, they were annoying, but they didn't ruin actual game content. But bots that are instead focused on leveling up and dominating Olympiad and sieges etc? That's an entirely different thing. Once you deny your legit users the ability to compete fairly in the end game content, you will start losing them. And most of us have multiple accounts (I have three ... that's $540 a year).
As a very long time player (been around since Prelude), just wanted to add another +1 to the OPs thoughts. Couldn't have said it better.
L2 is a beautiful game - great artwork, fantastic music and atmosphere. And it is an interesting game - an open, player driven economy, intricate game mechanics, and most of all, an open PvP world. When I say an open PvP world, this refers to not just standard PvP, but also the ability to compete via the economy, via competing for hunting grounds and bosses (not a fan of instancing), via manipulating your personal relationships with friends and enemies. The politics. The ability to influence the ownership of actual areas of the game world. It's a great concept.
I don't even mind the incredibly harsh leveling curve and masochistic crafting/enchanting system. I'm a firm believer that top, rare gear in a game should be TRULY rare (a handful of items per server).
But yeah ... to be 78 or 79 after years of playing and then get your *** whipped by a player who's botted his way up there in 6 months (and has uber ebayed 150 earth weapons and boss jewels) is just no fun. Why did I go to all that effort? A piece of automated software could have done that for me in 1/10th of the time, with apparently only a small risk of being banned.
NC: your long-term, legit player base in this game is going to reach a tipping point in the next 6-12 months. When bots were just farmers selling adena, they were annoying, but they didn't ruin actual game content. But bots that are instead focused on leveling up and dominating Olympiad and sieges etc? That's an entirely different thing. Once you deny your legit users the ability to compete fairly in the end game content, you will start losing them. And most of us have multiple accounts (I have three ... that's $540 a year).
Very good post. I agree I think people kinda ignored bots/farmers when they were just collecting mats and selling them.
Then came the manor and a nerf to spoils and drops for materials. Not so bad until the manor became a joke for most players with tons of seeds they cant turn in. We became a little more irritated at the bots/farmers.
Then we get the cats/necs which quickly fill up with bots/farmers but thats ok because wew can train them and get nice little goodies when they die form the mobs. But what happens next? They remove drops from dieing to mobs. Now bot farmer trains show up everywhere. Everyone becomes even more annoid with bots farmers.
Next we get higher grade gear which is suppose to be really hard to get. within days the gear and parts are selling for rediculas prices in Giran. WE get even more anoid.
Heres my favorite. They add D, C and low B to stores and all mobs only drop common items. Now unless you are 70+ most of the drops you get and half the stuff you have savd in wairhouse to sell or for future use has now become vendor trash. Prices skyrocket for A grade and above. mid B grade and below pretty much become worthless in the market. Not to mention the market being flooded with enchants. Now the player/farmer driven market is out of control. We become even more frustrated with the bot/farmer issue.
Then they open new servers and within 6 months there are many many toons 80+ and everyone claims to be legit. Even though we all can see what is happening it is denied by the people doing it and the people that are suppose to stop it.
Now we are seeing these same bot/farmer parties in the olympiad, sieging and pvping. Oh no it's not the farmers it's the ready made uber toons that are being used at end game by people who bought thier way to the top. I have seen the same toons in olympiad and in sieges that I pettitioned in catacombs and hunting grounds for botting.
Where it goes form here I dont know, but I do know many players are getting closer and closer to the point of no return.
As L2 NA/EU is not its close to me wishing it went l2.ru style... free to play and register but they BAN ALL BOTS! Sell vitality **** for irl money and such but not gear. lol
Talked to a russian l2 player today he said it worked pretty well, at least its bot free. lol
Should have been like that from the start here to. T___T
I have this feeling that if they banned everyone that NEEDS to be banned, not only farmer bots but actually player bots, this server would be quite empty heh...
I have this feeling that if they banned everyone that NEEDS to be banned, not only farmer bots but actually player bots, this server would be quite empty heh...
That'd be great, we dont need any bots... theyr killing the game. **** bots and other 3rd party programs.
Oh I'm not saying it would be bad, much on the contrary, I'd love to see that. I'd love to have an opportunity of achieving stuff in game that aren't on lockdown by botting clans.
Peoples u talk now just about bots, but dont forget that a parts of bots made the players who buy adena from them. So i think if NCSoft can stop this than will fewer bots.
I have to say that much time i hate more stronger the ebayers who buy a lots of adena and after they cry: bots in the spots i cant xp, i hate the bots etc. Well at firstly these ppls mean the problem.
Anyway easy stop these problems, example if u see around on the l2goha.ru there u can see that which ppls try sell items, money and accounts on which servers. HGM Spam maybe lets see around there because this website maybe can help for you much that stop some ppls.
Well, i reada the posts and i was thinking in some way to answer it without guilt the bots but, im sorry, i didnt find it.
We could drop the guilt over the people that made buffer slaves to xp, we could drop the guilt in the people that are too selfish to help others and all these stuff but for real the NCSoft attitute about the bots makes me mad.
NCSoft could, since the beggining of the botting thing, stop the bots and keep the legit players in game, make updates for the players that are possible to reach and give some value to the legit people that still play the game, but the point some of us are missing, as i mentioned in lots of emails that i sent to this comapny that were answered with an automatic answer from a machine and not from a gm, there is a lot of money behind it.
So once NCBot, sorry, NCSoft, can take out our money without care with what we think about the game, they will do it, we like it or not.
The bots give a good ammount of money to NCSoft and thats why they are there, cause someone pays for like 25 accounts to run a bot party into pagans, dino island, even into helbound. But what about the real players (i wont even say about the 100% legit ones cause i know lots of people that simply gave up at the 7x cause they could not get xp), but what about the players that want to xp, have fun, go to epics.
To you guys to see, in the server i play, devianne, Queen Ant, Zaken and Core are controlled for farmres.
Is this the kind of game we want? and if we are the players, the people that pay for this game, why dont we make something to be heard? We talk a lot in the threads but they close them, we talk a lot in the game but they arent even there to us. I cant even remember the last time i saw some gm online in devianne.
And then sometimes they ban 1 or 2 bots here and there and say that their jobs are being done.
Personaly i think that NCSoft is missing with respect for the players. Bots arent players but they pay and thats why they are there, cause they pay more than people that play do.
Im sorry for screwing the topic but im not even a bit excited for the new update. After 3 years of lineage im lvl 79/76/51 with my toon and i dont see a way to go to 82 or 84 either like my friend that said that in the topic.
The mobs that were mentioned giving 125k xp cant count cause pts is 4x, right? it would make it be around 30k whats almost the same as varka or ketra, or to solo IT.
This patch isnt for us people, its for the over botted toons that rule the game we played once.
Sorry for screwing your topic bro but i just couldnt hold the feeling.
Oh I'm not saying it would be bad, much on the contrary, I'd love to see that. I'd love to have an opportunity of achieving stuff in game that aren't on lockdown by botting clans.
But it would be empty :D
If it happened though you would see alot of reactivated accounts from people who left because of them. Maybe not enough to offset them but alot of people would come back.
as for leaving for AoC. It has changed alot since launch, but the PvE gets warn out pretty fast and PvP is fast becoming a joke as hacks are more and more common daily. It is fun at times though. There is a MAJOR change coming that makes it just another gear based game with a clunky combat system.
I'm not leaving for AoC, at least not permanently. I'm testing that game for now and it was the first game that really captivated me enough to want to keep on playing it.
I don't care about PvP at all, and I've been playing on a PvE-RP server where 90% of the community is made of active RPers that do normal, legit PvP that are based on their storylines. Which would be PERFECT in L2 if it didn't have all those problems that we all know. Or if they had an RP server, of course.
People don't seem to get it. This game is boring. The the problem with it. 90% of the game is boring. Apart from seiges you do nothing but PvE, and getting ganked endlessly (or ganking endlessly) does nothing but make hte game frustrated for one or the other party, which eventually ends up in more boredome (they log out for hte night, or start logging out when they see you comign on spies/program, or quit, or server xfer, whatever).
The problem with this game is that the "fun" has been concentrated into primarily one part of the game that is withering away due to constant/lingering imbalances and simple game mechanics on top of a constantly decreasing player population.
Until they fix this the game will remain boring outside of seiges (if anyone seiges you, doesn't run away, whatever) and people will continue to either quit or cheat to rise to the top (hence the rampant botting and ebaying that people complain about - note it is getting worse as the game dies down/gets older and end-gamers gain a bigger advantage... It's not "just farmers anymore" and ebaying is no longer a quick way to progress to end-game as it was back in earlier chronicles when everyone was on a more even playing field).
If there was a factorable mid-level game in Lineage II, people would not cheat in these ways, because they would be able to have fun playing with and against players on their level. It's like a country with no Middle Class (think Mexico, GMs being the Government and Drug Cartels being the End-Game Clans with hoards of botters...).
Neutral clans also don't help this game. If there are two comparable Neutral clans, then they should be fighting for the things that Neutrals want, IMO, and not just at the moment they want it. This is supposed to be a dynamic PvP environment, not a neutral playground. And with about 600 non-top clan members on each server there is no way one clan should be running a server for 6 months to 1.5+ years on any server, unless those 600+ people are just horrible.
new players should be aware that they will never compete with the majority of the player base here. getting 83/75/75/75 will take years and years to do. do you have the time or patience to do all the ******ed quests to get that? all a botter has to do is run a script to do entire quests. he goes to sleep every night and wakes up with another part of a quest completed. he wakes up with millions of adena he picked up, and mats and recipes to craft s80 gear and whatever else he wants. then he pvp's you. you're a legit 79 or so, and you fight, you do crap damage to him and notice he cp pots faster than lightspeed...htf does he do that!? then you're dead.
welcome to lineage 2. the most disenchanting experience you'll ever regret.
EXACTLY ....end game pvp is pretty much one sided and ridiculous atm, barely worth it at all. sometimes we don't bother to siege and it ****** off our enemies but there is only so much we can do against thier numbers/gears/illegal programs.
The fact is that in L2, on my main, a 79 MS, if I can manage 1.5 hrs per day, (which I currently cannot) I am gaining at most .25% in xp. 4 Killed Mobs solo in Ketra at 79 = .01....Before the flaming, understand that I realize there are better ways to gain xp, or go into different areas (although several of these areas are not so easily accessible, since I am "radar" detected almost instantly by other's 3rd party sofwares). BTW, I cancelled a support account several months ago and have no intention of reactivating it, the cost per month far outweighs the reward of having a buffer on hand. The fact remains that while I "grind" the same toons that are now challenging my area (i.e. pvp) have been botting that area for the last 18 hrs. As a legit, It becomes increasingly evident that the "effort vs rewards" for playing are just not there . I realise this is a personal thing; many others may love the grind at these levels, I, however, have no expectation of attaining Level 82 or beyond.
Finally, please believe that I have always cared for this game; how else could I and many others have stayed so long?
/agree, grind at 79 is ******ed and if you are not a class the clan needs/wants for hellbound (or just not in a clan that can handle hellbound), just forget about getting better parties to level faster in.
it's nice to be hopeful but those gracia instances are for 83+ only I think. just lol.
If L2 wasn't such a good game all of us who are fed up with the automation would have left a long time ago. However we all really like this game and want it to be fixed.
it needs to be fixed but because it's tied to korea probably will never happen. and most of us stay not for love but for addication :/
I have this feeling that if they banned everyone that NEEDS to be banned, not only farmer bots but actually player bots, this server would be quite empty heh...
ALL the servers would be VERY empty. imo Aria is already relatively empty. yet I fear more server merges because that just means more unbeatable lvl 85s running the end game content and no hope for anyone else to ever see it. I know that some server, Sayha maybe, ALL the heroes were in one clan. That is just so sad. It's simply no longer possible to compete as a legit. So what is the point of even playing.