Mybe i think too much and mybe need to learn more about my class before i ask questions but i am new to game and to read all posts about this make it unusable info because game changed with every patch.
As you all suggested and i found it myself, nuke until 52 is prolly best option, not only fastiest than cheapeist too.
After 52 my 35 lvl nukes will be kinda redicilous, so with little searching on web i think this setup should work, as i said I am total noob and feel free to remined me of some foolish idea.
And lets asume money wont be problem becouse some nice friends from guild said they will give me whatever i need (one more reason i like this game :) :) )
If i took light armor and go dualwield, and take tatoo like this
1. Plated leather (STR+4 and CON-1)
2. tsu*tsu or tsu*sls (that if i read correctly give me 50+on crits) + enchant those weapon (mybe suggestion on some other combinations)
3. tatoo +4STR/-4CON
4. using shots on swords and pet
The way is how i see it, before i even try it is: everone said you as PS should never be target, so if am not trageted, my pet is, i should help DPS, but my nukes are so small so i should change gear complitly to DPS even light armor in exchange for csting speed, MR etc.
- This way i think my heals on pet wont be that much slower? or that can be problem ? (as i recall i will only use heal pet as spell most of the time)
- I think my dmg will be quite good at least for 10+ lvl's, correct me if i am wrong (+8 on STR + some crit chance)
- Leveling wont be that booring, at least i would like to think so :)
If i miss something or mybe misunderstood previous answeres to my post pls correct me, if this can work then i should start searching for items coz i think its much better fun then pet attack/pet attack/pet attack/heal pet/pet attack/pet attack/heal pet/loot/loop.
Mybe this can be done only to low lvl mobs coz all higher mobs to some aoe things or something and will dmg me alot.
Or mybe this dmg will be again so small compare to pet dmg, and money, trouble and other ppl jokes on me isnt worth it :)
Mybe i think too much and mybe need to learn more about my class before i ask questions but i am new to game and to read all posts about this make it unusable info because game changed with every patch.
As you all suggested and i found it myself, nuke until 52 is prolly best option, not only fastiest than cheapeist too.
After 52 my 35 lvl nukes will be kinda redicilous, so with little searching on web i think this setup should work, as i said I am total noob and feel free to remined me of some foolish idea.
And lets asume money wont be problem becouse some nice friends from guild said they will give me whatever i need (one more reason i like this game :) :) )
If i took light armor and go dualwield, and take tatoo like this
1. Plated leather (STR+4 and CON-1)
2. tsu*tsu or tsu*sls (that if i read correctly give me 50+on crits) + enchant those weapon (mybe suggestion on some other combinations)
3. tatoo +4STR/-4CON
4. using shots on swords and pet
The way is how i see it, before i even try it is: everone said you as PS should never be target, so if am not trageted, my pet is, i should help DPS, but my nukes are so small so i should change gear complitly to DPS even light armor in exchange for csting speed, MR etc.
- This way i think my heals on pet wont be that much slower? or that can be problem ? (as i recall i will only use heal pet as spell most of the time)
- I think my dmg will be quite good at least for 10+ lvl's, correct me if i am wrong (+8 on STR + some crit chance)
- Leveling wont be that booring, at least i would like to think so :)
If i miss something or mybe misunderstood previous answeres to my post pls correct me, if this can work then i should start searching for items coz i think its much better fun then pet attack/pet attack/pet attack/heal pet/pet attack/pet attack/heal pet/loot/loop.
Mybe this can be done only to low lvl mobs coz all higher mobs to some aoe things or something and will dmg me alot.
Or mybe this dmg will be again so small compare to pet dmg, and money, trouble and other ppl jokes on me isnt worth it :)
tnx again.
I dont think you missed any, it sounds pretty good to me. And you're right about the fun part. Eventually your damage becomes pretty worthless, but in the early lvls its kinda good. Just try to avoid places where you would have to heal much, because thats not what you want with this setup. Have fun!
This setup may give you results at early levels but eventually your own dps is small so I think you will have to change it at some time. If you want to try it out and you have access to that gear, by all means go ahead!
However, there is a very serious disadvantage with that setup that may or may not affect you, depending on your playstyle: you cannot carry a lot, because carrying capacity is based on con (http://www.lineage2.com/Knowledge/enhancements_2.html).
Dark Elves have low con, you put another -5 and then you have to carry loads of pet soulshots, some pet blessed shots (for healing with Shade), your own blessed shots and your own soulshots. Sounds a lot...
Dark Elves have low con, you put another -5 and then you have to carry loads of pet soulshots, some pet blessed shots (for healing with Shade), your own blessed shots and your own soulshots. Sounds a lot...
hmm yeah i didnt think about that, my carry capacity sux even now :)
Yes, melee is a smart idea for summoners after you cannot really nuke (5x-ish) all the way up to 76+ when you start putting element on an Arcana Mace. (element for pet > melee weapon)
I works out really well for the Phantom Summoner who has the phantom cubic and later on the nightshade's hex/gloom taunt and guidance/focus/deathwhisper.
Even in robes and just readying a pair of inexpensive crit duals or a greatsword w/focus you can do upwards of 20% more damage over and above your pet.
No, you aren't oudamaging your pet anytime soon, but an extra 20% damage is 20% more XP provided you have enough spawn.
Note that even if you are too poor to use shots on the summoner... its still 10% extra damage absolutely manaless and costless adena-wise.
Note remember this is IN ADDITION TO... you are a summoner, not a warrior... this is a perk you use when you aren't maintaining your pet.
I'd suggest BW light or Avadon robes honestly as having some snappiness to your heals is a good thing.
Well, I am a 75 PS on Aria. PS is a very dynamic class, you can really play however you like and however you want. I don’t think I am a good PS, I can share some of my past experience...Maybe you can learn something from the bad/good side ^^
C grade: I used +3 Raid*Raid that my friend gave me and a Theca Light Set, not exact remember what jewelry was using, but I believe is D grade set until I hit B grade (52). I didn't nuke after class change. I leveling with my summon since class change without pet shot at first and melee with the summon (can't afford shots XD). Back in the earlier C grade, Souless is just like a paper due to lack of p/m def and your heal is sux, I cant keep up with mp (souless drain mp back in those day) to keep souless alive. Therefore, I used Shadow instead cuz he has passive VR unless I have SE friend to party with. I alway leveling in cata (I found out later % per hour > xp per mob, so cata may not be a good xp spot if you want quick leveling), if you want leveling in cata avoid Branded, go to Worship (be careful, this cata has nuker mobs), less bot and PKer in my opinion. One of the downsize to melee with the summon is when I facing the stun mobs (DEs have low con), so sometime I have to stay back and only support my summon, because of that, I found out my casting speed is just a joke. However, I managed to use the same setup and style up to A grade ^^
B grade: I used BW light (still didn't noticed the light armor has slow casting speed XD), Kris and setup a macro to swap to Mysterious Sword with Acc SA when heal with cbsps and a BO set jewelry. I was still leveling in cata (apos), but a bit different than C grade, I always grouped with a glad/SEs, so I can use souless all the time. Since I always in cata, a lot of stun mobs there, more time I stay back and support my summon with heal and debuff, so I just use the Mysterious sword all the time.
A grade: I use Tallum robe set (because they are cheap ^^), still using Mysterious Sword until almost 70 (take me that long to craft a SOM) and update to Maj jewelry set, the first time I use heal on my summon in a Robe set, I found out how stupid I was to use a Light armor set, it is a lot faster, I mean really a lot. After A grade I changed myself from a cata rat to go out to see some sky, I run all over the map and leveling. Since last update, NC increase p. attack of Nightshade and added 3 buffs to him. So he is my main summon now.
Something I learn is really help is:
Buy compact package pet shot instead of pet shot only, you can carry a lot more.
Use Wind Shackle, it really help to decrease the need to heal your summon.
Use poison (Don’t think it is useless), it kills the mobs a lot faster if it landed. I am hunting in TOI all the time, 50% land rate on the angel. I am only use SOM without enchant (cant afford it XD).
If you or your summon attacked by multiple mobs and you think you cant handle it not more, cast servitor empower and couple heals, then run like a little chicken and SOE out, let your summon die for you. (I didn’t die from PVE except 1 time it is a big lag since A grade).
When go to some area you never hunt before, summon cubic until you have better understand about the area.
You can still melee with the summon, just avoid to melee with the stun mobs…(little damage is still a damage ^^)
Went XP with a friend who is a 64 PS (well, he dinged 65) and a level 60 Merrow was able to factorably outDPS a 64 Nightshade.
I thought the pet was uber, cause of it's real P.Def/M.Def and high HP, but it's damage output is quite deplorable compared to the 10% servitors.
I made him unsummon it and create a Soulless instead. Much better experience after that.
The Life Transfer on it is nice, though. I don't think I'd be able to solo with that thing instead of a Soulless, from what I've seen. The P.Atk difference between NS/Soulless isn't insane, but the killspeed difference is quite factorable.
Most new summoners will overheal their Soulless and Nightshade alike, anyways (something about people always wanting their servitors to be at 100% HP :P).
Servitors have such low Crit Rate that the buffs on Nightshade don't really seem to matter as much as I'd originally thought. I was hoping that it would make up for most of the difference and result in a better killspeed, but it didn't.
And when you have an OOP PP like he does you Soulless will have enough HP anyways.
If you're purely solo, then there is good reason to use Nightshade, of course... The extra "security buffer" is worth it, then.
I've always believed that Robes > Light Armor on a Summoner. Robes + Acumen Weapon and Learn the Tricks of your Trade (like pulling multiple mobs and using Corpse Burst, Hydro Screw, exploiting damage shield, etc.). I've always been able to get a good leveling speed on ES/Warlock that way, and once I showed my friend how to use Corpse Burst, I don't think he's gonna go back :P
Finding optimal leveling areas will benefit you more than your Summoner's melee damage :P
Dont go melee .. you get a new nuke "death spike", its not a cheap way to level but much faster then melee. With a decent mage-weapon you can move to Valley of the Saints at 52 (Angel are weak to dark magic) and assist your summon with nukes. Many mobs in Catas/Necros are Angel-type too. (Most of the high-pdef ones with low mdef that drop Seal-Stones)
PS have many tools... and using the right tool for the job is the best advice you can get.
-Nightshade is a great way to learn any area, but there are indeed places where Soulless is a better idea. Either works just fine, with Nightshade being more durable and less damage and Soulless being more damage and less durable. Shadow is a good middle ground but eats XP.
-Corpse explosion and the AoE poison are not efficient unless you can get more than 3 mobs in the radius or you get some cast speed and Matk buffs. (and even then the AoE poison will do like 50 damage before you kill everything) When you swing for 1100-1300 in PvE and you get three swings in the time to cast explosion for 700 for everything in the radius, it just not worth it unless you have more targets or much better caster buffs or both.
-Nerf Death Spike (NDS) is fine for pulling and does have some use in VoS. Its expensive, but useful... most of the time nuking with NDS just isn't worth the trouble. Using NDS against 4x mobs that do not drop herbs is a waste of mana.
-Melee is a smart way to squeeze more damage out of your summoner and NOT use mana or other resources. If you are skilled and attentive, it should cost you nothing and gain you a nice chunk of damage and thus XP.
-Honesty, equipment from 1-75 really isn't an issue... you should be able to easily level with no-grade epuipment, it just gives you more "whoops factor" and allows you to PvP better when the occasion arises. I found BW light to be an extremely nice set with no real issues and some nice extra protection when you need it. I really wish they would make another +cast speed light set.
That being said, B grade is so fast... it doesn't really matter.
I agree with the robes and acumen weapon being best set up, I don't care what damage set up with light armor you try and come up with in PVE and PVP it's going to be a total joke compared to your summons dps.
If you want to fight with a pet might as well might a melee class and get a wolf it would work out better
I agree with the robes and acumen weapon being best set up, I don't care what damage set up with light armor you try and come up with in PVE and PVP it's going to be a total joke compared to your summons dps.
If you want to fight with a pet might as well might a melee class and get a wolf it would work out better
An extra 10-20%+ damage is no joke.
The 10% can be accomplished with NO additional shot expenditure.
Seriously you'd rather just stand there than kill 10-20+% faster?
Yah, you can just stand there like a bot if you prefer... but its both more fun and better use of resources to melee with your pet.
I really don't understand how people can say "but if you don't cast fast enough you die"...
As a summoner you don't die in PvE unless you make SERIOUS mistakes. An attentive player behind a summoner might as well do SOMETHING other than stand there throwing heals from time to time and buff every 20 minutes.
By all means carry an acumen weapon, but you might as well bring a melee weapon as well.
Let's face it, you didn't exactly break the bank buying a Mysterious sword/acumen... a pair of top B common duals are very cheap and quite worth it. A mid-B dagger with focus, Great sword with focus, or +4tsu-SLS isn't really that hard to come by either.
An extra 10-20% dmg is not real though. My arcana lord does nowhere near that dmg to a mob, even 4-6x hp mobs. Sometimes I dont even get near the mob in time to hit it at all, coz of the cat critting it once or twice.
I repeat, smacking the mob is optional. If you think the actual summoner is making a difference in how fast the mob dies you are delusional.
An extra 10-20% dmg is not real though. My arcana lord does nowhere near that dmg to a mob, even 4-6x hp mobs. Sometimes I dont even get near the mob in time to hit it at all, coz of the cat critting it once or twice.
I repeat, smacking the mob is optional. If you think the actual summoner is making a difference in how fast the mob dies you are delusional.
Smittie, with all due respect you are wrong as you are outside the content of the post.
A level 78 AL wielding an elemented arcana mace (hopefully with a nuke aug) and a +CON -STR tat is indeed doing too little damage to be worth worrying about. (especially against 1x-2x mobs as your prophecied pet is just plain destroying anything it gets in front of) You are MUCH better throwing an augment nuke from time to time and melee is just because you can.
However, a 5x PS is a different story.
-Pet doesn't have insane patk at this point and doesn't have a self-buff prophecy
-PS has phantom cubic and later taunt/hex/gloom from Nightshade (if using nightshade)
-At 56, PS self-buffs Might1/Focus1/DW1/Guidance1 and thus should be wielding a sword or dagger with focus! Crit rates in excess of 15% are pretty easy with even just a great sword with focus.
-PS does not have pet windwalk without an outside buffer.
Level 56 PS damage output is actually decent at 5x in comparison to the pet he has.
This means you would be doing almost 40% more damage... note I didn't include haste1 which you can get from a cheap pot in every store, and nevermind clan hall buffs if available.
Let's redo it for a 74 PS and pet just for comparison:
74 PS Common Dama/Tal, +4CON-5STR,(assuming you toss it on at 7x for PvP) DC robes, might1, dw3, focus3, guidance3
patk 507, atkspd 334, acc 106 crit rate 10.7%
DPS = 103.3 using shots
Hey look, that's 24% more damage... even WITH a -5 STR tat... and using el-cheapo common weapons! AND not using clanhall buffs.
Lets do it again for 74PS using a +3 IM with focus without the CON tat, and clanhall buffs.
74 PS +3 IM/focus, DC robes, clanhall buffs and dw3, focus3 from NS.
patk 570, atkspd 384, acc 106 crit rate 16.8%
DPS = 145.5 using shots
Hey look! 34% more damage! even at 74...
and using a reasonable weapon that isn't even remotely hard to find and is safely enchanted.
Just for giggles, here's the 78 Spectral Master outcome:
78 SpecMaster +3 AM/acumen, +4CON-5STR, Arc Robes, might1, dw3, focus3, guidance3
patk 424, atkspd 390, acc 115 crit rate 5.3%
DPS = 96.1 using shots (let's face it you aren't gonna waste shots) so 48DPS is more real
78 Soulless (+1 summon) 78 SpecMaster buffs including Final Servitor
patk 2379, atkspd 444, acc 119, crit 5%
DPS = 615.4 using shots
Not even using shots, that's 7% more damage... but the output is so high 1x and even 2x mobs die too fast for you to worry about. Note that even 2x mobs you get a chance to hit a few times even in places like varkas.
Time to eat some crow people... you are just plain wrong.
I was dead on... 1-75 melee!
76+ when elemented, things change.
Thalenduros. Your argument assumes you and the pet is at the mob at the same time. 200 runspeed roughly on pet, and you have about 160. You dont reach the mob at the same time. So the dps that you calculated on a site that hasnt updated the info in ages, is still wrong.
Harkon can lol all he wants, telling a new player to nuke on ps is bs advice.
I think with many classes there are more then one way to play them and one of the things that make this game fun, that said I think everyone should enjoy summoner how they wan't to and not fight about which way is more effecient.
But summoners that choose robes/mage weapon do not stand around like "BOTS" as you say most throw wind shackle and maybe a overhit spell now and then. (wind shackle very underated spell IMO)
Some people play pet classes because they like a minion to do all the work. I have been guilty of sitting in the middle of a cata room and letting my pet just do the whole room by itself :P
ashaylia, lol i even invite lowbies in clan to come and pick up the loots for me most of the time :D
advice is advice though, they all should be taken as subjective as possible. there is no "end-all-be-all" thing to do. melee, which i personally think is dumb, is fine. nuking after 56, hell, 52, is fine.
i dont sit around and look like a "bot" because i spend my time CC, debuff, chatting, pick up loot (when im soloing), and toss a heal on the pet once a blue moon.
mobs have a fixed respawn time, the faster you kill them doesn't mean the faster the respawn, and it does NOT mean you gain X% more xp per hour, provide that you lvl in a closed environment, ie. catacombs.
Thank you all for answering.
Mybe little tensions about different view on meleeing but what i read so far i think ill made decision.
Until lvl 52 all i did was nuke, nuke, nuke, now many ppl said going melee is worth the effort (many tnx Thalenduros for compararion wich helped alot even consediring you are not at mob same time your pet is - speed difference).
Only info i need more is little more about armor. Is Plated leather (STR+4 and CON-1) worth those STR on it, or robe is still better (is that fast healing thing that important ? ). Can somone explain diff in numbers or % :)
btw, Thalenduros said at lvl 56 he took greatsword / focus .. isnt dualwield (dunno what combination) better option if u wanna go full DPS ?
Nice to have so many helpfull posts, this comunity shows again its something u can count on.
+4 strength isn't going to make or break your damage output. As a summoner your hitpoints are doubly effective as you level due to transfer pain being on constantly. (50% damage to you, 50% to your pet at 74, overenchantable at 76 even higher)
That said, a huge increase of casting speed can make or break you surviving until 56 and you get hacked-broken-easy-to-level-with Nightshade. After that point I stuck with Avadon Robes and a greatsword +7 focus. Crit duals are less soulshot efficient (you can miss with one swing, and hit with the next, and you still use a shot for "half damage" as if you hit the mob with both swings without shots) but will have higher patk at plus 4. With a kris you will rip through shots almost as fast as the duals due to the extremely high attack speed associated with daggers. Critical rate on it is very high also (focus sa), for maximum damage output (abusing focus, death whisper and guidance from pet). That said, having a 2 handed overenchanted weapon available to me, I went with the greatsword to be extremely adena-efficient (normal attack speed like the duals, but if you miss, you miss. With duals you have to miss both swings in a row to not use a shot, and the added patk per overenchant on 2 handed weapons sold me). A kris/focus +7(swap at mammon) would still deal more damage, but the difference between actual 19% and actual 21% damage wasn't worth the extra millions I'd have spent on B shots.
If you want to run light armor, I'd lean towards blue wolf light due to the mp regeneration bonus (which still isn't as fast as robes by the way) increased cast speed, and mdef. That said, Avadon robes are CHEAP and can make or break keeping your pet alive.
My suggestions?
Grab demon set and use a mage weapon (Inferno staff is quite good with 10 more matk than a homunkulus/club of nature alternative, yet still gets acumen SA) and nuke with your level 35 nuke till you get haste 2 for your pet at 52 at the basement of ivory tower to 46 ish, then pavel ruins to 52 (shuttgart).
52 I'd run Avadon or Blue Wolf robes with a great sword with focus or Kris with focus as a secondary weapon to add some hurt to the mobs, with your acumen weapon on a hot swap key in case your soulless gets pasted. 56+ is all gravy, you'll use your melee weapon often, especially in catacombs or other dungeon (4x hp) mobs.
61, Tallum or DC robes (If you want to use your nerfed death spike in VOS, DC will allow you to hit a little harder, tallum will make it a lot harder to drop you with it's great Mdef modifier), with a mage weapon. (SOM /acumen or BOMT acumen is ideal here). An Infernal Master /focus, bloody orchid/focus, or Tallum Blade/Damascus duals +4 is going to be your preferred melee weapon choices if you still wish to bonk.
76 Major Arcana set is the preferred option as you can add elemental resists more than anything else. Arcana mace/acumen with 150 element and your pet will tear things apart.
Hope that helps. Phantom Summoner's unique blend of phantom cubic, hex/gloom from nightshade allow their "tank" pet to hit nearly as hard as Merrow or Kai (I know this, i tanked my PS sub for an ES to level Kiralynn's first sub to 50s, and now I'm probably going back to PS after the pet timers didn't get adjusted on skill reuse, go figure :P). Nightshade is fire and forget, double the pdef of any other Servitor, double the mdef of any other servitor, it will serve you well until you get the alien pet at 79.
im not sure what can i say. OE weapon are overrated, especially when you can't afford 'em in the first place.
common dagger of your grade is the best dmg output you're gonna get without shots. if you use shots, then you're wasting your money in addition to time meleeing as a PS, but if you do, focus greatsword will be you moving. common if you can't afford SA and the real sword.
light armors are never worth it, not even with the bonuses. you slap on BW light (with its -wit -2int +3men) and see what's your cast spd. i'm using karmian/mysterious sword acu, and my cast spd is 710 with +4wit tattoo. no light armor is ever gonna touch that. let alone without an acumen SA weap.
as summoner, your summon = your life. it dies, you dies. simple as that. try to keep it alive with a dual sword and light armor, and you'll see what i mean.