please try not making this a flame post for "u suck at pvping yada yada yada"
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The new siege time zone had made it impossible for euro players to participate in sieges, the late one is in sunday 4am-6am GMT+2 (Monday actually)
now for some facts:
Lineage 2 was Released on April 27,2004
the first euro server was released on November 17, 2004
before that servers were introduced as international servers
A big portion of the ppl who play in NA servers are euros
euros playing in NA servers are paying in euros
now I really want to understand, when u moved siege times did you not have the euro players in mind at all?
iam not saying make the NA servers euro ones, but at least show some consideration for the euro community playing on NA servers - before it was 4-6am but on Saturday that did suck but at least we were able to play
it seems that u didnt have the euro players in mind at all, then why do we pay in euros? if we are on NA server and we are treated as NA why do we must pay in euros which has more value?
sieges are the end game pvp in this game, most fun stuff to do and something i look forward to every other week and you just took this aspect of the game in a heartbeat.
I really would like to get a reply for this post from the producer or a high rank GM.
and please, don't tell me to move to the euro servers, ive been playing on my server for 4 years, switching server is not something u can easily do - ive known my server community for too long to just leave it.
I honestly don't think asking for some consideration to the euros community playing in NA servers is too much to ask.
I guess there is nothing NC West can really do. The game (with the main target audience being Korea) is just not designed to handle the player bases spread over several time zones.
I guess there is nothing NC West can really do. The game (with the main target audience being Korea) is just not designed to handle the player bases spread over several time zones.
that is true,but before the last change things went well and i could play the sieges.
now really, asking for a little consideration is too much to ask?
and.. never say never, ive seen bigger things happen :)
idk, whats to be said really. They moved the times to be more convenient for 90% of the server population (or more), your argument that there was no euro server initially would be valid if they didnt allow server transfers at your whim.
server transfer service isn't "free" and you can not transfer everything you have, only what you can "carry/equip" nor is that simple to leave behind all the old friends/enemies that defined your play style for so long..
here's a good view on the whole thing:
Wow, the amount of flames in this thread is amazing. I'm pretty surprised at some of the responses I've seen here. Put aside personal gripes, server politics, etc., and concentrate on the main issue here. Siege times. If it was someone other than Maya making this thread, half the *******es wouldn't have even replied.
I don't care who you are, or where you're from, 2 sieges + prep time (6 hours) on a Sunday afternoon / evening - Monday morning is extremely inconvenient; for some, impossible. Divine's numbers weren't impacted too significantly, as we have a mix of NA and Euro, so as people passed out, others were coming online. I think we had around 55 - 60 in our CC for both sieges. From the general consensus, however, the Euros in clan will never be able to make a Sunday evening siege. Having to be at work the next day makes it impractical. Hell, even for a lot of NA players that have families to spend Sunday with it will be tough. That's a lot of end-game material that will be automatically unavailable for them. There was a reason that NCSoft chose to split siege days and times at Lineage 2 conception. Perhaps they should re-evaluate those reasons.
- NA vs Euro servers...
When Lineage 2 came out, there were no Euro servers.
- Go to a Euro server then ...
Lineage 2 is a game you play with friends. A lot of the Euros have been playing on this server with friends (both NA and Euro) for years. Telling them to drop clan, and pay for a server transfer, pick only a set of gear and weapons, "liquidate" everything else, is ignorant.
nevertheless this isn't going to change as Korea doesn't care about their NA/Euro player base and they will actually get money out of it from those who care enough to transfer away to a real Euro server..
as said before just have all euro's transfer off to teon/franz/luna or quit and watch all those so called NA servers die as that's what will happen
anything else is useless QQ as Korea doesn't give a **** either way
Sunday is usually family time especially in the evening. Then I like to prepare for the coming week starting around 5PM to 11PM. I'm in the eastern time zone and I have no more plans of watching or attending the 9-11PM siege times.
Two hours before for a Sunday siege was ok. But taking up the whole Sunday afternoon is just too much. This is a game. It's time to put it back where it belongs.
Posted the following in the other thread when I ment to post here...
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I like the idea of sieges one week and TW the next. I think there would be many more peeps taking part that way. Though I suspect that its all one weekend due to Seven Signs issues (makes the seal of strife a real thing).
I also like the idea of having all castles sieges at the exact same time. Your ally has more than 1 castle, defend them both or lose one to someone else. (Full disclosure: my ally has 3 on Sayha)
The experience with the entire world in siege at the same time was super fun in the TW wars last weekend, seems like this situation every week would be huge fun.
idk, whats to be said really. They moved the times to be more convenient for 90% of the server population (or more), your argument that there was no euro server initially would be valid if they didnt allow server transfers at your whim.
if you think 90% of the server population are NA u are greatly mistaken
I do not know about other servers, but on phoniex u can definitely see there are the same if not more euro players then actual NA - iam guessing its not so different on the other NAs servers
would be nice to get some statistics as to how many accounts are under "euro territory" and how many under "NA territory" but that probably wont happen
and my argument isnt that there wasnt any euro server before, my argument is that a very large player group are practically banned from sieges.
You can't pretend that all those Euro players don't exist in another time zone that is condusive to participating in a server wide event. It's just plain ignorant to your player base, one which you actively pursue.
The Olympiad is the same way. It is only possible to actively compete if you stay up all night for at least the last week of the Oly and/or have someone else be able to log your toon and play it for you, which I understand is a minor infraction of the EULA.
Need to get a grip on reality and stop living in a fantasy world where time zones aren't pertinent.
You keep sieges as they are (on east coast servers) you screw the Euros over
You move sieges earlier (on east coast servers) you screw the west-coasters
1- swap territory war dates with siege dates (have territories on sunday and sieges on Saturday)
Since sieges last longer, people could stay up late even people with families. Its a lot easier to stay up late on a Sunday night, than on a saturday night.
2- Make territory wars 1 hour earlier so its not THAT bad for Euros.
3- Reduce the "intermission" time of 2 hours between sieges to 1 hour. That way the total sieging time is 5 hours instead of 6.
Another thing I would suggest is that the days of sieges / territory there shouldn't be any Olympiad. It encourages point trading and it is unfair for the people that want to be on the siege.
I was just giving you the only alternative option you really have, they arent going to reswitch siege times unless NA players hate it as well. To me, I love it. Sundays are perfect for gaming and it allows you to not hog up your saturday night with sitting in front of the computer if you do not want. There will be some differing viewpoints on this surely.
Anyway, you can complain all you want but it probably wont be changed. Who knows, maybe NC is trying to get more Euro onto Euro servers and more NA to NA servers. To me in the states I cant even imagine starting a MMORPG that only has servers in France and then have the gall to get upset that they wanted to build it around the french timezone. Actually, when I think about it in that way it makes me think your arguments and points are absolutely ridiculous. You knew what you were getting into when you signed up so whats to complain about.
Jesus, it's not about setting sieges to a euro friendly (i.e. ten hours earlier or whatever), it is about putting sieges on a different DAY. Same time for US people, so no reason to complain, but euro players could sleep in on Sunday if sieges were on Saturday.
Telling euros to just move to a different server is just plain ignorant, since a.) it costs lots of money b.) you cannot transfer everything (clan and 90% of the stuff you have) and c.) you'd lose lots of friends. There just were no euro servers back when the game started (actually Hindemith WAS the "unofficial" euro server back then), and by the time Teon was started, it was already too late for people to start fresh on a new server (no server transfer back then either). And, most important of all, siege times were OK for euros up to now. Most people did not complain about them, so there was not even any reason to transfer. It's just now that things are seriously bad. So, one more time for emphasis: people are not complaining that Phoenix is using US times. They are just asking for using DIFFERENT US times (i.e. different day). It would not change anything for US players, in fact it would be better for them because there would be more people at sieges.
Euro servers exists for a reason. End of thread.
****. Xenophobic. <3 There is a reason Euros are on NA servers, as well. They make up more than half the population. They deserve consideration.
This issue (NA vs Euro timing on a server) was so bad in my last MMO that I quit playing it completely--but for a different reason.
"NA" server actually means something. It means "north American" (timing). That's what it is.
It is pretty typical for a game to list servers by geographic location. And when you start ignoring the meaning of wording, then you simply have chaos (which equals "nothing worthwhile").
I would expect an NA server to have significant events during times that people in NA would consider optimum.
I would expect a Euro server to have signficant events during times that people in Europe would consider optimum.
It is not reasonable to expect everyone who signed up appropriately (or transferred) to have to consider playing "their" server at off-peak times--regardless of the server tag/location.
In my last game there were port battles--which had windows that allowed a relatively small # of Euro players to throw the ports into contention (which set the timing for the eventual battle) during the middle of the night in America during the work week! It was typical to log on to find that your major/important ports were going to have a port battle at 3am Tuesday morning---on the NA servers! (and yes, there were Euro servers in that game as well).
Needless to say, 15 EU players able to come to the port battles decided the outcome against the 4-5 players from America who showed up at those times--even though the American players outnumbered the EU players by probably 6:1 on that "NA Server".
Eventually it wasn't worth yelling about and I unsubscribed.
I realize in L2 that Euro servers came late. I realize for the long term EU players on NA servers that it is hard.
At the same time, if I played on Teon I wouldn't come to these forums demanding that times be changed for me and my American pals, either.
Sorry. I'm going to say that NA servers should be timed for NA and Euro servers for EU. As players we should make our decisions accordingly.
The addition of territory wars seems to have changed seige days which pushed them into Monday a.m. (middle of the night) for EU players. That's regrettable--but it also reaffirms my often printed advice on these forums to "be careful what you demand"!
Many, many, many players constantly come here to these forums demanding more pvp, open pvp, additions to pvp that aren't just to benefit of big castle owners/clans, etc.---well, looks like the territory wars are going to provide some of that....on Saturdays.
****. Xenophobic. <3 There is a reason Euros are on NA servers, as well. They make up more than half the population. They deserve consideration.
I'm just trolling, relax :p.
Sorry. I'm going to say that NA servers should be timed for NA and Euro servers for EU. As players we should make our decisions accordingly.
The addition of territory wars seems to have changed seige days which pushed them into Monday a.m. (middle of the night) for EU players. That's regrettable--but it also reaffirms my often printed advice on these forums to "be careful what you demand"!
The point is that there was absolutely no reason to change the siege day so that both sieges are on Sunday, the old siege times were perfect. They could have made territory wars on Friday, or on the second week (so one week sieges, one week territory wars). I would say that for the overwhelming majority of NA players it does not make any difference if the sieges are on Sunday or on Saturday, in fact I would not be surprised if even many NA players do not like this new change which forces them to sit 6-7 hours nonstop in front of the computer without any real break. For many people, Sunday is "family" day.
NCSoft could fix this problem without going away from NA siege times, this (again) is not about euro players wishing Phoenix to be changed into a euro server or choosing new siege times which are inconvenient to NA players.
they could make all the sieges similar to territory wars have all the sieges at the same time and 1 hour earlier (that way i can go to the siege before going to work :p j/k), if is set in that way the EU ppl can be at the siege and the NA can enjoy the siege + some quality time with the family on sunday night after the siege
The point is that there was absolutely no reason to change the siege day so that both sieges are on Sunday, the old siege times were perfect. They could have made territory wars on Friday, or on the second week (so one week sieges, one week territory wars). I would say that for the overwhelming majority of NA players it does not make any difference if the sieges are on Sunday or on Saturday, in fact I would not be surprised if even many NA players do not like this new change which forces them to sit 6-7 hours nonstop in front of the computer without any real break. For many people, Sunday is "family" day.
NCSoft could fix this problem without going away from NA siege times, this (again) is not about euro players wishing Phoenix to be changed into a euro server or choosing new siege times which are inconvenient to NA players.
Trust me all my buddies here in Texas, will play for 6-7 hours not stop at sieges if the day in question is Sunday... however Saturday? errr not... Friday is party time and Saturday most of the time is the continuation hahahaha.
Family time? the avg American family spend few hours (1-2hrs) with family on weekends...
however a huge amount go to church at Sundays morning up to 12:00pm... those who dont play games, usually use Sunday to play sports after church time or watch sports on TV.
The new NA siege timings are perfect for a northern American avg guy considering the vast divergence of timing zones we have in USA, which some of you guys fail to understand, and believe the sieges times were just fine until now, which actually is not true at all, trying to adjust sieges times because of Euro players it will only screw up NA players, the new change is to benefit actual NA players playing a NA server and it was a necessary adjustment that finally has been done.
There is a solution that doesn't include transfers and reordering the days. It's just the one they have in place atm is not a good one for their playerbase. In that, it needs to be adjusted somehow...
But since the Oly has never been reworked to suit the playerbase, I have my doubts it will take place.
Being a NA player myself im perfectly fine with the idea of moving both seige times ahead 4 hrs to allow for more euro interaction wouldnt affect me in the least
The NCNA management *must* get their heads out of their arses and ponder over the fact that this game was designed IN and FOR Korea (located within just 1 time zone) while the so-called "NA servers" are in fact a home for the playerbase spread all over the world.
When they blindly transfer the Korean designs onto the world-wide playing grounds, it inevitably creates a lot of problems for the majority of players.
Suggestions (copied from another thread):
- switch territory wars and siege days (sieges on Saturday, TW on Sunday - Monday for EU players);
- restore former siege times (no both siege times in one day) and push territory wars or one of the siege time to Friday;
- move one siege time or territory wars to another weekend.
I kinda agree with ppl that are saying go to your time zone servers. However switching siege days with teritory war(sieges on saturday/ teritory wars on sunday) wouldn't hurt any1 also. To bad NCNA won't do anything...
As a wannabe game designer and a Player of Lineage 2 who has never had the opportunity to siege i will say this.
As a company offering a service to your customers you want to do what benefits the MOST of your customers. you want to please as many as possible to reward them for their patronage and hope they continue to stay with you throughout. This in mind the argument of North americans vs Europeans is Mute(moot? whatever). It SHOULDN't be about North American vs European players, but about how many customers you can please with the changes you propose.
I currently play in the UK. i used to live in florida, but i am English and i had to go from playing in the US to the UK, which means times changed. My sleep habbits make siege times even if i DID siege not a problem, as i am not working atm and i can sleep whenever i want. But with the understanding and knowledge of the time europeanservers WERE implemented, and others in my situation, Changing servers is not an option NOR is it fair with the limitations and price of the change (real money AND the cost of losing clan and friends) if what it sounds like is true and the majority of players at sieges ARE infact europeans, and the PREVIOUS siege times benefited MORE of its PLAYERBASE then as a professional standpoint i would choose to make more of my customers happy and not play favorites just because International servers became tagged with "North american" servers, the player base per server is just not big enough to warrent that NA vs EU argument unless L2 Only had 2 servers, 1 NA and 1 European.
really this changes was know for like 4 months and nobody ever say anything.
moment get implemented,ppl start complaining.
ur next complain gonna be that oly is unfair for euro players and as end game feature should be move to suit euro players.
You don't read the forum much, don't you?
Search is your friend then.
u have 2 choice
1-**** and play NA time event.
2-transfer to euro server.
Wrong.
Jesus, it's not about setting sieges to a euro friendly (i.e. ten hours earlier or whatever), it is about putting sieges on a different DAY. Same time for US people, so no reason to complain, but euro players could sleep in on Sunday if sieges were on Saturday.
Telling euros to just move to a different server is just plain ignorant, since a.) it costs lots of money b.) you cannot transfer everything (clan and 90% of the stuff you have) and c.) you'd lose lots of friends. There just were no euro servers back when the game started (actually Hindemith WAS the "unofficial" euro server back then), and by the time Teon was started, it was already too late for people to start fresh on a new server (no server transfer back then either). And, most important of all, siege times were OK for euros up to now. Most people did not complain about them, so there was not even any reason to transfer. It's just now that things are seriously bad. So, one more time for emphasis: people are not complaining that Phoenix is using US times. They are just asking for using DIFFERENT US times (i.e. different day). It would not change anything for US players, in fact it would be better for them because there would be more people at sieges.
Normally i agree with most of what you say...not in this case however.
I think NC West should have a relook at the seige days and times to accomodate the Euro/Russian players. I still think doing a seige at 4 am is crazy...even if you can sleep in the next day.
Like so many have said.
1) move the seige times and dates back to the way it was.
2) have TW on the off weekend
That is an easy fix...i'm sure it would suite everyone...and no one would be forced from our server.
Also i think a petition should be made for NC West to see.
You have the option to xfer. Everyone has to pay money for it, so you can stop telling everyone that it's "expensive". I paid $150 to xfer my toons to another server, and then $150 to bring them back when it turned out to be a failure. Your money is not worth any more than mine.
If you want better seige times. Move to a Euro Server.
NO one cares if there were no Euro Servers at the start of the game in NA region. The servers are all NA and most people call the game L2NA here for a reason. The times are balanced for US players on those servers, and you pretty much agreed to suck it up when you rolled a character there, and later refused to xfer to a server that is more balanced for players in your time zone.
We all know the reasons why someone wouldn't xfer (Friends, Clan, etc.), but that really doesn't change anything.
You have the option to xfer. Everyone has to pay money for it, so you can stop telling everyone that it's "expensive". I paid $150 to xfer my toons to another server, and then $150 to bring them back when it turned out to be a failure. Your money is not worth any more than mine.
If you want better seige times. Move to a Euro Server.
NO one cares if there were no Euro Servers at the start of the game in NA region. The servers are all NA and most people call the game L2NA here for a reason. The times are balanced for US players on those servers, and you pretty much agreed to suck it up when you rolled a character there, and later refused to xfer to a server that is more balanced for players in your time zone.
We all know the reasons why someone wouldn't xfer (Friends, Clan, etc.), but that really doesn't change anything.
Deal with it.
Tren....please....you don't even play on this server (that i know of). The game, as you may suspect, is dying. Why put another nail in the coffin.
If i was a Euro player i certainly wouldn't want to pay for a transfer...if i felt strong enough about this i would quit.
When the Euro players joined... the seiges were accessable to them....now NC in their infinite wisdom change the seige dates and times and basically took away a part of their end game. It's frickin stupid to seige at 4 am!11111111111!!!!!!!!!!
Nowhere could i find anything about Penix being a NA server.
To me this is just another senseless decision made by NC which doesn't take into consideration its players. I don't believe, as some do, that this was done on purpose so that the Euros would have to transfer and pay NC more money. I believe to be the normal NC cavalier attitude toward its customers.
Ahh, Tulp, now you have fallen into the trap. I guess it is the way things go... first people take u seriously.... now you are taking Trensharo seriously!
Like I said earlier in this thread. People should stop embracing the far right ideals.
This is not a corporate monster that tells you "Like it or Leave" "like it or transfer", those are death throttles to a game.
This is a game, and certain things have got to be plastic to suit the player base that the original developers were not wise enough to keep in mind. How about that?
Ahh, Tulp, now you have fallen into the trap. I guess it is the way things go... first people take u seriously.... now you are taking Trensharo seriously!
Like I said earlier in this thread. People should stop embracing the far right ideals.
This is not a corporate monster that tells you "Like it or Leave" "like it or transfer", those are death throttles to a game.
This is a game, and certain things have got to be plastic to suit the player base that the original developers were not wise enough to keep in mind. How about that?
Fair enough :)
I'm glad, if like you say, i misread Tren cause i like the guy (in a manly way of course:-p) He does get excited at times but he is like the delux version of a L2 guide.
I also liked your previous post...one of your better ones....i like it when you aren't uppity...
I am a NA player, and very please with the new siege times, because it shows NCWest understands how many **** vast time zones we have in Northern American... which people even from Canada fail to understand.
Moving 4 hrs up or below or to another day will just to please Euro playing a NA server, which is absolutely not the right thing to do at all.
Why such Euro hate? They are active and fun players in this game, and they make up more than half the population. If they are excluded from playing in sieges simply due to time zone failings, that would take away from the whole mass pvp thing the sieges are meant to be, and at this time of diminishing population, we need all the warriors we can get!
I am a NA player, and very please with the new siege times, because it shows NCWest understands how many **** vast time zones we have in Northern American... which people even from Canada fail to understand.
Moving 4 hrs up or below or to another day will just to please Euro playing a NA server, which is absolutely not the right thing to do at all.
I lol'd.
You either don't know the actual number of time zones in NA or you don't know what "vast" means.
A big LOL to anyone playing on half dead or dead NA servers and telling people to leave. NA players will end up having to play euro servers because the NA ones would get shut down if all the euros left lol.
It seems like a lot of NA players don't like competition.
Phoenix only hits "normal" status during euro prime time, it would be more convenient for the bulk of the playerbase on Phoenix to adjust the server time to be slightly more euro friendly and have any unhappy NA player transfer than to have all the euros leave.
As an NA player myself, I'd rather see earlier siege times with more people than stubbornly sticking to how it is set up for Korea(one time zone).
Why such Euro hate? They are active and fun players in this game, and they make up more than half the population. If they are excluded from playing in sieges simply due to time zone failings, that would take away from the whole mass pvp thing the sieges are meant to be, and at this time of diminishing population, we need all the warriors we can get!
I think its all the russians and greeks, cant trust em!!
I lol'd.
You either don't know the actual number of time zones in NA or you don't know what "vast" means.
A big LOL to anyone playing on half dead or dead NA servers and telling people to leave. NA players will end up having to play euro servers because the NA ones would get shut down if all the euros left lol.
It seems like a lot of NA players don't like competition.
Phoenix only hits "normal" status during euro prime time, it would be more convenient for the bulk of the playerbase on Phoenix to adjust the server time to be slightly more euro friendly and have any unhappy NA player transfer than to have all the euros leave.
As an NA player myself, I'd rather see earlier siege times with more people than stubbornly sticking to how it is set up for Korea(one time zone).
Hey, guess what the difference will be if NA players have to play on euro servers? We will know its a euro server and expect it to run around euro time zones ya dolt!
Please stop this nosense that if you all Euros leave server will die...
We dont need such pity like you are doing NA a favor by playing a NA server, stop fooling yourselfs and do us all NA a favor and transfer to a Euro Server or stop complaining about sieges times related to a NA server because is monday or whatever for you, I like euro people, but this cry baby stuff is beyond the point.
Angel, I bet you are a Patriot too, that there's no country better than the good ol' USA. The xenophobia doesn't work in a world that is like one small community separated by time zones.
I am a NA player, and very please with the new siege times, because it shows NCWest understands how many **** vast time zones we have in Northern American...
LOL how many time zones do you have in your relatively small country? Four?
Russia alone covers 11 time zones, now add Europe with its 3 zones... oh wait you probably don't even realize there is life outside Texas.
Let me break this down so that even an ignorant redneck like you could comprehend: there are lots of players from different parts of the world playing on the so-called "NA servers"; I've met people from Singapore, Turkey, Israel, UAE, etc etc... what other servers you think they should move to if the current siege times are not good for them? Euro? Chinese? (btw I doubt you can find UAE on the world map quickly enough).
Then, what about Australia? New Zealand?
Family time? the avg American family spend few hours (1-2hrs) with family on weekends...
however a huge amount go to church at Sundays morning up to 12:00pm... .
Wth is a "church" you are talking of, and why the hell the rest of the world should care of what you're doing there? And how this is relevant at all? I'm perplexed.
Actually the siege times changes are to benefit people from NA playing in a NA server which personally is the right thing to do
On Phoenix (which supposedly is a "NA server") approximately 70% of its total population is NOT from NA. I guess it's roughly the same on Devianne and maybe some other servers. The change that benefits the minority is not the right thing to do.
stop fooling yourselfs and do us all NA a favor and transfer to a Euro Server.
I take it, you are offering your money to pay for each and every forced transfer to Euro servers? How generous of you.
Just don't forget to open a couple more Euro servers (since you obviously can afford everything) and then feel free to stay on your precious "NA-only" deserted playground.
Angel, I bet you are a Patriot too, that there's no country better than the good ol' USA. The xenophobia doesn't work in a world that is like one small community separated by time zones.
Though it's off topic and doesn't explain my fond feelings for europeans--American exceptionalism is a vitally important concept in the world today. American's apologizing for being fundamentally different than everyone else is not something I'd like to see continue.
There is ONE place on the planet, in the entire history of Mankind, where people outline Rights granted from their CREATOR and reserved FROM the government.
This individualism is so monumentally critical for humanity that it literally cannot be over emphasized.
America is not 'better'--but it is uniquely different and absolutely required on this planet.
If refusing to hang my head over American exceptionalism makes me a "patriot" (that is a derogatory term to non-Americans)--then I will wear that tag with humble honor.
America is not perfect. It is unique among nations in its foundation. The solutions to the human condition on this planet do not lie in collectivism, gaia worship, socialism (or any other radical 'ism'), phony theories of environmentalism or anything ever demonstrated in any nation in Europe. The solutions to all issues confronting the human condition can be found in INDIVIDUAL LIBERTY. It is always the answer--for everything confronting us. It has always been the only demonstrable answer.
Individuals withhold their power from the state. All power taken by all states is by definition without limit and taken by force at the EXPENSE of the individual.
We in America have recently lost our way a bit. We've been diverted by internationalism and world politics. What we truly are is the only bastion for individual liberty. It is critical that we remain so--exceptional in this one thing.
America is not better. America is unique. That is American Exceptionalism--it's not xenophobic.
Sorry for the speech--but the concept is more important than the forum topic (and wasn't actually raised by me). :)
Please Euro people if you are going to complain about sieges times on a NA server do us a favor and transfer to a Euro Server hehehehehehe, no need for cry baby stuff, we have bigger problems that Euro people unhappy about sieges on a NA Server.
And whats wrong with been a redneck?? :*)
About 70% of its total population is NOT from NA on Pheonix??, care to give me how in earth you got that data rolf... do you work for NCSoft and check payments or something, or its a number you got from your *** to sound cool ;0....
Though it's off topic and doesn't explain my fond feelings for europeans--American exceptionalism is a vitally important concept in the world today. American's apologizing for being fundamentally different than everyone else is not something I'd like to see continue.
There is ONE place on the planet, in the entire history of Mankind, where people outline Rights granted from their CREATOR and reserved FROM the government.
This individualism is so monumentally critical for humanity that it literally cannot be over emphasized.
America is not 'better'--but it is uniquely different and absolutely required on this planet.
If refusing to hang my head over American exceptionalism makes me a "patriot" (that is a derogatory term to non-Americans)--then I will wear that tag with humble honor.
America is not perfect. It is unique among nations in its foundation. The solutions to the human condition on this planet do not lie in collectivism, gaia worship, socialism (or any other radical 'ism'), phony theories of environmentalism or anything ever demonstrated in any nation in Europe. The solutions to all issues confronting the human condition can be found in INDIVIDUAL LIBERTY. It is always the answer--for everything confronting us. It has always been the only demonstrable answer.
Individuals withhold their power from the state. All power taken by all states is by definition without limit and taken by force at the EXPENSE of the individual.
We in America have recently lost our way a bit. We've been diverted by internationalism and world politics. What we truly are is the only bastion for individual liberty. It is critical that we remain so--exceptional in this one thing.
America is not better. America is unique. That is American Exceptionalism--it's not xenophobic.
Sorry for the speech--but the concept is more important than the forum topic (and wasn't actually raised by me). :)
Nice thoughts and i would agree with you....about say 40 years ago.
:)
I think NC West should have a relook at the seige days and times to accomodate the Euro/Russian players. I still think doing a seige at 4 am is crazy...even if you can sleep in the next day.
Like so many have said.
1) move the seige times and dates back to the way it was.
2) have TW on the off weekend
True, that would be the best option (but you realize the old siege times WERE 3-5am on Sunday morning and 11pm to 1am on Sunday evening for euros?)
True, that would be the best option (but you realize the old siege times WERE 3-5am on Sunday morning and 11pm to 1m on Sunday evening for euros?)
No i didn't know that. However i think most Euros were fine with the seiges the old way. It was spread over the two days and you could get some sleep before Work/School.
Maybe you made a better point in your post.
Really...bottom line is whatever is best for all the community is what we, as a server populace, should be striving for. I enjoy this server, i enjoy the people (the most part) and i would like for all to stay.
And i think i may make an Archer so i can shoot Maya in the... :)
Though it's off topic and doesn't explain my fond feelings for europeans--American exceptionalism is a vitally important concept in the world today. American's apologizing for being fundamentally different than everyone else is not something I'd like to see continue.
There is ONE place on the planet, in the entire history of Mankind, where people outline Rights granted from their CREATOR and reserved FROM the government.
This individualism is so monumentally critical for humanity that it literally cannot be over emphasized.
America is not 'better'--but it is uniquely different and absolutely required on this planet.
If refusing to hang my head over American exceptionalism makes me a "patriot" (that is a derogatory term to non-Americans)--then I will wear that tag with humble honor.
America is not perfect. It is unique among nations in its foundation. The solutions to the human condition on this planet do not lie in collectivism, gaia worship, socialism (or any other radical 'ism'), phony theories of environmentalism or anything ever demonstrated in any nation in Europe. The solutions to all issues confronting the human condition can be found in INDIVIDUAL LIBERTY. It is always the answer--for everything confronting us. It has always been the only demonstrable answer.
Individuals withhold their power from the state. All power taken by all states is by definition without limit and taken by force at the EXPENSE of the individual.
We in America have recently lost our way a bit. We've been diverted by internationalism and world politics. What we truly are is the only bastion for individual liberty. It is critical that we remain so--exceptional in this one thing.
America is not better. America is unique. That is American Exceptionalism--it's not xenophobic.
Sorry for the speech--but the concept is more important than the forum topic (and wasn't actually raised by me). :)
I hope you were joking here...especially on the "individual liberty" part...
Though it's off topic and doesn't explain my fond feelings for europeans--American exceptionalism is a vitally important concept in the world today. American's apologizing for being fundamentally different than everyone else is not something I'd like to see continue.
There is ONE place on the planet, in the entire history of Mankind, where people outline Rights granted from their CREATOR and reserved FROM the government.
This individualism is so monumentally critical for humanity that it literally cannot be over emphasized.
If it were true, then it would mean that Lineage 2 (the game based on collectivistic principles) was not for U.S. of A. And no one should be caring if the times on the world servers were comfortable for U.S. players; those players would not be good customers for L2 anyway.
I am a NA player, and very please with the new siege times, because it shows NCWest understands how many **** vast time zones we have in Northern American... which people even from Canada fail to understand.
There was not a single change in siege times in this update that would be actually benefitting for a NA player... unless you think that more boring sieges with less participants benefit you somehow.
America is not 'better'--but it is uniquely different and absolutely required on this planet.
required for what?
u didnt sign the kyoto-protocol/agreement
u have the biggest co2 emissions all over the world
u start wars all over the world (iraq, afghanistan)
u crash the world economy
u support dictators (pakistan)
u try to destroy democratic governments (venezuela, iran)
u avoid democratic elections (iraq, afghanistan)
u had a president who destroyed most good relations with most other countries (bush)
u bring david hasselhoff in my TV
topic: i dont like the new siege times, but at least euros can still do the early siege (cause time is like before). i dont think NA servers should be for NA players only, i like the international atmosphere, its international, but FOR SURE ITS NO RUSSIAN SERVER!!!! so come over it, or transfer. for real euros the euro servers arent a solution, cause teon, franz and luna are crowded by russians, so i guess many prefer staying at servers with NA times, then transfering to a server where 50% of the ppl cant speak english and adena advertise is in white chat (in russian language)
required for what?
u didnt sign the kyoto-protocol/agreement (because it's a socialist scheme and anti-capitalism)
u have the biggest co2 emissions all over the world (good, C02 is PLANT FOOD)
u start wars all over the world (iraq, afghanistan) (we've stopped a couple for you all as well--as for Afghanistan, perhaps they should have reconsidered supporting terrorists who destroyed 2 buildings and killed 3,000 of our people in New York)
u crash the world economy (guilty--thank Bill Clinton)
u support dictators (pakistan) (how did that support of dictators work out for S. Hussein?)
u try to destroy democratic governments (venezuela, iran) (I don't believe we've done a **** thing to venezuela or Iran--but calling them Democratic is HYSTERICAL!)
u avoid democratic elections (iraq, afghanistan) (rewind the tape sport--democratic elections were HELD in both and for the first time ever, women could vote/participate)
u had a president who destroyed most good relations with most other countries (bush) (what country relations were destroyed by G. Bush that would matter to anyone? You can't say you hate another country and then whine that they aren't nice to you...)
u bring david hasselhoff in my TV (sorry about that--truly)
"u had a president who destroyed most good relations with most other countries (bush)"
what country relations were destroyed by G. Bush that would matter to anyone? You can't say you hate another country and then whine that they aren't nice to you...
Drakkos. OMG. Do you not pay attention? Well, probably not. I'm guessing you have never been outside of America, or have never watched the news from another country's perspective.
While our country has been a great country and was founded by geniuses who drew up a constitution that set of checks/balances/inalienable rights, in the 8 years that Bush and his crooneys were the protectors, so to speak, of these tenets, they managed to reason away almost all of them for almost everyone.
Spouting about the world the "greatness" of America, I can tell you, is not a wise thing to do. We are just one of the guys now... nothing special. That time is long gone.
+1 to change sieges and call Pheonix an Euro Server, and make the whole events euro time based.
One server is enough for NA people, and probably they still need Euro people to make the game fun and populated.
Personally NA people is a minority in every single server, and the only reason L2 is surviving is because of Euro people, L2 doesnt stand a chance in the NA market at all.
The current siege times are a way to disrespect the people who are supporting the game, is the lack of action and irresponsibility from NCSoft part, they should admit the true and give the people what they ask for it.
Relocated current Staff to Europe and promote the game more there, because Spam and Kilson will be busy doing that job here but for another game called Aion, so the few people who may actually join to play L2 will be busy with Aion propaganda.
I am not suggesting nothing, but will be fun if Euro people set a date to playing L2 that day alone and choose one guy to record the whole thing, post it here, since pictures are better than words.
Drakkos. OMG. Do you not pay attention? Well, probably not. I'm guessing you have never been outside of America, or have never watched the news from another country's perspective.
While our country has been a great country and was founded by geniuses who drew up a constitution that set of checks/balances/inalienable rights, in the 8 years that Bush and his crooneys were the protectors, so to speak, of these tenets, they managed to reason away almost all of them for almost everyone.
Spouting about the world the "greatness" of America, I can tell you, is not a wise thing to do. We are just one of the guys now... nothing special. That time is long gone.
Ah the common idiot response , the anti-Bush rants always let you know who doesn't have a clue how the world works.
And anyone who thinks Venezuela is a "democratic country" is a true ***inng idiot.
Wow, Trens. You were pretty fast at changing your post. And I didn't respond to it because it was pretty unimpressive to me.... a lot of dribble about how things should never change.
I didn't start the political discussion... just contributed to it. And, truth be told, it is a political thread....
The biggest misconception here, I think is that you all think that NA Servers means NA players. I am pretty sure it means the actual physical location of the servers and not the players. Obviously, because otherwise why are people from all over the world paying for the game and log in to the servers?
I'm pretty short-tempered about people who are so myopic to think that the USA is the center of the universe. I find the whole world to be valuable and interesting. I would never limit myself to one country alone.
And even though I know you were trying to insult me Trens, by calling me a Troll... sigh. But it doesn't matter.... since I don't know what it really means, except someone who reads forums and posts on them a lot. If so, that is who I am, so why deny it?
Anyway, still <3 u !!! hahaha.
PS Yes. This is my first, and probably my only, MMO.
You should have seen what he really said, but he changed the post pretty fast!!!!
I'm known for often changing my posts.
There was a huge thread about my editing prowess on another forum I post on (not related to video games). It turned into a huge flame war while I sat on the sidelines throwing popcorn emotes.
I changed what I said because it wasn't really worth the energy to have it up there, so I simplified it.
u didnt sign the kyoto-protocol/agreement (because it's a socialist scheme and anti-capitalism)
How is stabilisation of the greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere to prevent danger to the climate system by the United Nations a socialist scheme or anti-capitalism?
u have the biggest co2 emissions all over the world (good, C02 is PLANT FOOD)
Chemestry 101, yes it is a natural part of the world, but overproduction (+40% in the last 30 years) makes the gas go inside the atmosphere and contribute to the global warming.
u start wars all over the world (iraq, afghanistan) (we've stopped a couple for you all as well--as for Afghanistan, perhaps they should have reconsidered supporting terrorists who destroyed 2 buildings and killed 3,000 of our people in New York)
You mean the guy you trained to fight against Russia for you? 3000 innocent people, a tragedy, but how many innocent Iraquis/Afghanis did you kill with your invasions?
u crash the world economy (guilty--thank Bill Clinton)
Doesnt help to run against the wall for 8 years instead of actually changing stuff..
u support dictators (pakistan) (how did that support of dictators work out for S. Hussein?)
Pakistan got no oil, neither does Myanmar. You only put your noses where you smell profit.
u try to destroy democratic governments (venezuela, iran) (I don't believe we've done a **** thing to venezuela or Iran--but calling them Democratic is HYSTERICAL!)
As you maybe know (or probably dont..) the USA influenced most of the South American states over the last 30 years (when nesseccary with military force). As for Iran, its the new bad boi toying with nuclear knowledge, so its only a matter of time until some "very reasonable measurements" will be taken there
u avoid democratic elections (iraq, afghanistan) (rewind the tape sport--democratic elections were HELD in both and for the first time ever, women could vote/participate)
First of all democracy doesnt work like that, but you probably wont know.. You cant force a country to be "democratic" from one day to another. Afghanistan is still ruled by warlords, the people in their territories wont have a voice against them. And even the puppets you put inside their government wont change that. Hell they were not even able to held their elections at the good time due to the mess you let them in..3 month delayed cause of security reasons..
u had a president who destroyed most good relations with most other countries (bush) (what country relations were destroyed by G. Bush that would matter to anyone? You can't say you hate another country and then whine that they aren't nice to you...)
Noone said anything about hate, but Bush was black and white. Either you were with him or you were against him. That is not how world politics works. Even the leader of the USA cant just impose his opinion on other countries and think its right in any way. The UNO are supposed to be some kind of morale instance, giving a voice to 192 different states in the world. Mr. Bush however did not care a peanut about anything the UNO had to say during his 8 years..another example of a relation that doesnt matter to anyone?
for accuracy!
~D~
try +dex, not -dex next time ;)
I didnt wanna answer it before but here we go..
America is not perfect. It is unique among nations in its foundation. The solutions to the human condition on this planet do not lie in collectivism, gaia worship, socialism (or any other radical 'ism'), phony theories of environmentalism or anything ever demonstrated in any nation in Europe. The solutions to all issues confronting the human condition can be found in INDIVIDUAL LIBERTY. It is always the answer--for everything confronting us. It has always been the only demonstrable answer.
Your individual liberty is the base of the capitalism, a type of radicalism btw.
Your personal freedom should end when it would interfere with the freedom of your neighbour, what is clearly not the case in the USA.
And how exactly does your extreme christian RADICALSIM fit in?
Well I still hope you were drunk or high when you wrote all of that...
Yah, it has always amused me, this idea that we are bringing other countries into democracy. Just because we have found it to be the ideal government, doesn't mean we have the right to force anyone to establish it. You cannot force political ideals on people. If the drive for democracy was in those people, they would have already taken the steps towards it. Don't mind helping people achieve what they want. Don't find it dignified to make them want what I think they should have and force it on them.
I'm going to cry, and post the audio on this forum....
P.S. I don't think Democracy is something that has to be forced on people. Most people would welcome it and are actually being forced with other political ideas - indirectly - by not being given a choice...
think about that: u bring democracy to the ppl, fine! and they vote a socialistic or islamic leader who tells before the election starts that he dont want a democratic country, but an islamic country where their holy book is the main instance. and they still elect him!!! thats exactly what would happens in iraq when USA would allow 1 man/woman = 1 vote. so they dont allow it, same in afghanistan. so they bring marionettes into the government. sry but looks to me that u think democratic system is fine as long as your business isnt in trouble...
topic: open russian servers, FORCE all russians and former USSR ppl to transfer to russianserver, then FORCE all euros to transfer to euro servers and then close NA servers cause no1 plays there!!! /ironic off
In order to believe in the sham of "Climate Change" you have to believe that not only Man is the cause, but you have to believe that the only way to combat it is to cripple the world economy and hand vast amounts of cash and power to "The Government".
Yeah... that's a good idea.
Just speaking in terms of human emitted "greenhouse gas", why are China and India specifically excluded from the Kyoto Protocol? Kyoto is a dagger pointed at the heart of the world economy and specifically crafted to benefit the socialist parts of the world.
wait... WOO HOO! THat means we in the US are now on the gravy train!
Talking about politics and other irrelevant crap in a game forum.... I hope you guys copy paste that info from some homework you guys did when you were little... hahahahha.
Just make NA servers Euros Servers and all events euro based!