I guess this question is to HGMWill. I had a good relationship HGMSpam with these types of questions perhaps you can help the still legit players.
There are programs now that show our hp/cp level and gear.... Is there anything a legit player can do to combat these players? Since they are not botting cannot exactly report them from botting.
Good well of telling someone is using the program though is they will flag on someone and hit them till they are down to 200 - 400 hp, we all know this impossible to do unless you can see the other players hp/cp. Then they will try to make you die to mobs they do not have to go red but get the same satisfaction of killing you.
This is the same program people use to auto spam CP pots so they cannot be killed in pvp. I fought a dagger 2 levels above me as an archer and landed lethal on him 2 times and a tank was stunning him and he still wouldn't die but he had a orange perma ring around him. Now before you all say that is a macro you cannot spam pots and use skills at the same time, it breaks the macro.
So HGMWill any advice on what legit players should do because no matter what gear or level we get too we are never going to be faster then a computer program?
if don't pvp, also make sure not to be in a pvp clan.
just make sure to constantly fraps/record all activities of these individuals, and constantly report them as radar users...
hopefully eventually if enough people do it, they will get 90% of the server banned.
if don't pvp, also make sure not to be in a pvp clan.
just make sure to constantly fraps/record all activities of these individuals, and constantly report them as radar users...
hopefully eventually if enough people do it, they will get 90% of the server banned.
i doubt that NC would act on a petition by only 10% of the server.
What I do.. to annoy enemies.. and if you feel like it.
Go near their CH and make a macro with 2-3 names. Press it every 5 seconds. After a while you see them either delogging or they will eventually close the program. :P
The radar emits a beep, everytime they're targetted. :P
What I do.. to annoy enemies.. and if you feel like it.
Go near their CH and make a macro with 2-3 names. Press it every 5 seconds. After a while you see them either delogging or they will eventually close the program. :P
The radar emits a beep, everytime they're targetted. :P
When you, your friend, the friends of your friends and so on, quit this game due to cheaters, NC will realise that something is wrong and then maybe they will do something about it.
He was crying to me in PMs.. because I was targetting him and pressing ESC.. retarget - ESC... so he just pmed me and said "Stop it!".. I said no.. and continued. After I told him to disable sounds, he said he would lose the advantage of being warned when some1 targeted him.
This is the main reason why 99% of them have sounds on.
What I do.. to annoy enemies.. and if you feel like it.
Go near their CH and make a macro with 2-3 names. Press it every 5 seconds. After a while you see them either delogging or they will eventually close the program. :P
The radar emits a beep, everytime they're targetted. :P
Extremely smart - to bore himself to death just to annoy (possibly) someoen who doesn't care:rolleyes:
What I do.. to annoy enemies.. and if you feel like it.
Go near their CH and make a macro with 2-3 names. Press it every 5 seconds. After a while you see them either delogging or they will eventually close the program. :P
The radar emits a beep, everytime they're targetted. :P
Also depending on where they may be.... quite often plenty of wartags will force log the moment a war tag comes within their AFK location and relog in every minute through to 5 minutes.
This is great for say placing a nooby toon that is warred with them in a location within range of them and in a place that isn't easily reach and watching them waste away hours of not doing anything at all. Actually it's quite funny as sometimes they log in, get wacked by a monster a few times before force logging a few times, done enough times they have died to these mobs as the hp isn't regened while logged out. I would love to see these peoples faces when they wake up to a dead toon in their favorite afk spot
I guess this question is to HGMWill. I had a good relationship HGMSpam with these types of questions perhaps you can help the still legit players.
There are programs now that show our hp/cp level and gear.... Is there anything a legit player can do to combat these players? Since they are not botting cannot exactly report them from botting.
Good well of telling someone is using the program though is they will flag on someone and hit them till they are down to 200 - 400 hp, we all know this impossible to do unless you can see the other players hp/cp. Then they will try to make you die to mobs they do not have to go red but get the same satisfaction of killing you.
This is the same program people use to auto spam CP pots so they cannot be killed in pvp. I fought a dagger 2 levels above me as an archer and landed lethal on him 2 times and a tank was stunning him and he still wouldn't die but he had a orange perma ring around him. Now before you all say that is a macro you cannot spam pots and use skills at the same time, it breaks the macro.
So HGMWill any advice on what legit players should do because no matter what gear or level we get too we are never going to be faster then a computer program?
get 64 friends and take an hour to kill him when he finally runs out of CP pots?
take perma red toons and farm their academy until they have to allocate guards on their lowbies/sublcasses?
idk. If you deal with that one, you still won't have a plan for the other 6000 using the same program(s).
Extremely smart - to bore himself to death just to annoy (possibly) someoen who doesn't care:rolleyes:
That's what the NC West version of L2 is all about :D
I've also learned in pvp not to actually target them until you are right next to them. Most of them are so used to the program doing all the targetting they have no idea what do when you are right on their .
lol I like a couple of the ideas here, especially repeat targetting radar beep :)
For the cp thing it has a reuse time so is just a matter of out damage maximum cp restore rate, or stuns or another way to disable. Normal stuff really I usually assume people will spam cp no matter if they using something to do it for them or not.
Is more fun (satisfying) to beat people who use any advantage cheat, so if it takes more attempts or more people, its still worth it.
The hp down and die to mob thing is sucky though. Doubt that could ever be enforced, aside from detection of program.
The hp down and die to mob thing is sucky though. Doubt that could ever be enforced, aside from detection of program.
Not sending the client information it doesn't need (like the HP of people who aren't in your party) would be enough and save bandwidth if implemented correctly.
i believe the reason game guard doesn't work, is because both of those programs are directly linked to the l2 sub code which some how lets them get through.
the purpose of game guard is really to help prevent speed hacks and spoil hacks from getting through...
who cares if a few players get an advantage as long as their character has to put in the work...
what would you do if some dorf spoiler went out and spoiled a full set of Vesper armor off a gray wolf? then ran to giran in 30 seconds to sell it for seventy bazillion adena.
Last TWs were pretty sad on Teon, you could see on mdt one of the top clans entered the arena at start with 2 pts, then only 1 was left and you could see how the program targeted each and every other player as soon as he entered the combat zone and all the mages auto assisted (twas a mage pt), it was funny enough to be sad :P Ofc they got zerged by another big clan later on but this was enough to see what this game has become, nothing more than battle b/n programs. So yeah new players are welcome....
Yesterday I was at Aden siege, with small friends party (was buffer there rather as mascot ).
At siege were clashing big forces of DH and X.
We haven't have any aspiration at that siege, we were just fun and some fame.
Was very funny to see - we could run entire siege field without ANY attack from any of side - just one thing.
We couldn't target ANYONE from those sides.
If/when any of member target any DH/X get killed in 1 sec.
That make a conclusion, radar users so relay on stuff, that you can pass at front of them and till they not hear 'ding' they not react :p
P.S. That is lesson no 1 if you fight against such user. Even if he is botting, never target him unless you are sure you can stunt/silence/Para him and then kill in blink of eye.
Last sieges enemies had a few red guys, all was fine till I tgt one of the red guys lol Immediately got hit by at least 4 ppl, the second I click him two seconds later was down :D
what would you do if some dorf spoiler went out and spoiled a full set of Vesper armor off a gray wolf? then ran to giran in 30 seconds to sell it for seventy bazillion adena.
The most obvious way to combat it would be for a small group of GM's to sign for a seige and run onto various fields targeting players.....
Of course, when they checked the logs to see the instantaneous multiple targeting on themselves and perma-banned 2 or 3 top clans, these forums would be filled with ANOTHER round of "why did you ban xxdeathxx clan? they are completely legit!!", and "I quit! If NCSoft bans xxdeathxx with no reason at all--then I don't want to play!", and "game will disappear cause NCSoft banning top clans!!".....
Just LOL.
So yeah, 'someone' can combat the radar users. Unfortunately for us the force that can insta-ban them all are the GM's and none of us really believe they'll show up in-game to do that job.
Maybe the NCSoft programmers should just program a radar detector and have GM's run around with that......
Game Guard doesnt work cause people remove it to use they'r 3rd party programs. Ncsoft is to lazy to send a packet when people are logged to check if they'r GG are down or not, so GG its only usefull to make us get critical crashes when trying to load 2 clients, etc...
Hi Sly we were enemies when i was playing on Devianne.
No you cant combat Radar.Even if im always pvp using cp macros and relay on my targeting/assist to win,i know whats happening around.
During sieges when rushing into the castle with tonz of lags so you cant target anyone,the ones on autoprogram will keep killing while you will pray to start moving.
When you target their healer you' ll have a dagger pop out of nowhere to backstub you,no live player can act and protect his healer like that.The only times you can do something in on opened field with small lag.Nukers arent the ones to be afraid for autoassist,cause if u get hit by range you can always kite,if a dagger came on shadowstep or hide/backstub,you have no where to run.
When you xp you will be killed by an invisible dagger,while they are always warned even on afk mod about wartags coming.
I' ve wrote about daggers skills on another thread but since you brought an impossible to combat pvp tool-as radar is-, i want an answer for impossible to fight daggers skills also.
-hide
-Freya's dagger dublicating himself
Even if a dagger plays totally legit,these 2 skills force other people to use autoprograms cause they cant pvp on any other way.Only with sound alarm and name/class info you will know that a hide dagger will pop soon on you,only with program you can turn your body around so he misses on backstub you,only with autocp you can start drinking cps from his first hit so you dont die at once and will have the chances to fight.
For Freya daggers dublicating what can i say?What are these people in Nscoft trying to do?Give more stuff to auto programs developpers so they can sell their new improved autodetect dublicating daggers program?
I agree with the OP. It's impossible to compete against these guys.
So my question would be why try?
I think you exaggerating.
If you are similar level/gear(*) and have about 1,5:1 it is still doable.
Is hard but still doable.
Point is even if you fail you don't feel bad, but when you win you have x2 satisfaction :D
Ofc I'm not saying about PvP against guys in hide but about enemy who use 'normal' add-ons like auto-target/spam potion/re-target on healer attacking/etc.
(*) Ofc no seance to fight in A grade stuff against S 79+ or S grade against 83+. But bunch of 79 can do good fights against 80-81 and same applay 76 against 78 people.
Ofc I'm not saying about PvP against guys in hide but about enemy who use 'normal' add-ons like auto-target/spam potion/re-target on healer attacking/etc.
LOL @ "normal" add ons.
I get the feeling that soon someone will come on and start talking how the meek will inherit L2.
When you, your friend, the friends of your friends and so on, quit this game due to cheaters, NC will realise that something is wrong and then maybe they will do something about it.
I sill like the way you are a lvl 10 fighter with 700+ posts ... :)
I get the feeling that soon someone will come on and start talking how the meek will inherit L2.
OK I know that it can sound weird.
What I meant 'normal'?
Those are all actions done be 3rd program what are doable by very skilled PvP player/group.
As you can imagine one who is good:
- instead auto-potion can use macros almost same efficency.
- re-targeting to target after losing target upon skill (mirage/aura/etc) using keyboard
- don't need autotarget, good team can very fast concentrate attack on single target
- etc
Those action can be done by good team with good players and I called them 'normal' :cool:
Hide is impossible to get by any action.
Same apply to see hidden daggers etc...(if you don't have archers)
To sum up I don't think it is normal but I would say those automatic tools show edge of human possibilities - and if you win against such enemy you can call yourself good enough(*)
(*) Ofc if you are not cheat like them.
P.S. If anyone know me - I'm fully against people who use it. But I'm not going sit at corner and cry because they do.
If NC not cleaning servers from trash I'm not going be cleaner - I do play game :D
That is just silly, there is NO WAY even a VERY good non-cheating party can come even close to what these auto-targetting programs can do.
Just take the "automatically have everybody target the guy who is shooting at our healer" function. Normally the healer gets hit, has to check in his damage log WHO is hitting him tell that to the rest of his party on vent "hey, XXX is shooting at me!" and the rest of his party has to MANUALLY target that guy, which can be extremely hard if there is a pile of people around, e.g. at a siege. The programs do all that for you, healer gets hit, others switch target, 2 seconds later the guy who hit the healer is dead. And yes that's how it works, sometimes you do not even need to hit the healer, targetting him is enough to have the nukes flying at you one second later. Been there, done that, died.
And you really think that "everything these programs can do, a skilled player can do, too"? :D
There is no such thing as a "normal" addon. Everybody who uses them needs to be banned from the internet for the rest of his life.
That is just silly, there is NO WAY even a VERY good non-cheating party can come even close to what these auto-targetting programs can do.
Just take the "automatically have everybody target the guy who is shooting at our healer" function. Normally the healer gets hit, has to check in his damage log WHO is hitting him tell that to the rest of his party on vent "hey, XXX is shooting at me!" and the rest of his party has to MANUALLY target that guy, which can be extremely hard if there is a pile of people around, e.g. at a siege. The programs do all that for you, healer gets hit, others switch target, 2 seconds later the guy who hit the healer is dead. And yes that's how it works, sometimes you do not even need to hit the healer, targetting him is enough to have the nukes flying at you one second later. Been there, done that, died.
And you really think that "everything these programs can do, a skilled player can do, too"? :D
There is no such thing as a "normal" addon. Everybody who uses them needs to be banned from the internet for the rest of his life.
REALLY? REALLY? It isn't that hard.
BP = healing self/party, rezzing
EE = recharging,rezzing bp,healing self, mana burning enemy bp, ee, sws
DDs = killing enemy bp/ee..wc..sws..bd..dds, right clicking main assists name in party window.
SWS/BD = protecting bp/ee
OR... you can split your DDs, have 2 go for bp/ee and 2 go for dds going after your bp/ee.
BP = healing self/party, rezzing
EE = recharging,rezzing bp,healing self, mana burning enemy bp, ee, sws
DDs = killing enemy bp/ee..wc..sws..bd..dds, right clicking main assists name in party window.
SWS/BD = protecting bp/ee
OR... you can split your DDs, have 2 go for bp/ee and 2 go for dds going after your bp/ee.
All fine, but that still does not explain how the DD in a party all assist on the same enemy who just TARGETTED an enemy healer, one second after he did so, in the middle of a whole siege force. But I guess if you're really good, you can click every enemy, hit "assist" and see if he targets your healer. That was the point I was trying to make - some functionality of those programs can't be done by hand as well as the programs do it.
What I do.. to annoy enemies.. and if you feel like it.
Go near their CH and make a macro with 2-3 names. Press it every 5 seconds. After a while you see them either delogging or they will eventually close the program. :P
The radar emits a beep, everytime they're targetted. :P
All fine, but that still does not explain how the DD in a party all assist on the same enemy who just TARGETTED an enemy healer, one second after he did so, in the middle of a whole siege force. But I guess if you're really good, you can click every enemy, hit "assist" and see if he targets your healer. That was the point I was trying to make - some functionality of those programs can't be done by hand as well as the programs do it.
PvPin same ppl you tend to know who the healer is and macros are made.
BUT i will agree it is funny watching slinginspells creampie and the other legion morons bouncing around during TW's Sieges, and any other PvP there in when targeted ( and not taking damage yet). when they pvp that is
He was crying to me in PMs.. because I was targetting him and pressing ESC.. retarget - ESC... so he just pmed me and said "Stop it!".. I said no.. and continued. After I told him to disable sounds, he said he would lose the advantage of being warned when some1 targeted him.
This is the main reason why 99% of them have sounds on.
You are in a bicycle race. all the bikes are lined up. All of a sudden a guy in a motorcycle shows up.
I guess you could race him...and if you beat him i guess that would be something . But as far as i'm concerned i'd just leave him at the hole...you wanna win that bad buddy...have a ball...race yourself.
Oh and the judges...look the other way and give you a button to report him...cool!
You are in a bicycle race. all the bikes are lined up. All of a sudden a guy in a motorcycle shows up.
I guess you could race him...and if you beat him i guess that would be something . (...)
Oh and the judges...look the other way (...) cool!
Your example is almost good.
I have fixed it.
The way i look at it is:
You are in a bicycle race. all the riders are lined up, all of a sudden a you see almost none at bicycle between motorcycle.
You start race them... because you like riding on bicycle ..and if you beat them i guess that would be something . (...)
Oh and the judges...they looking at you and making jokes (...) cool!
lol HAHAHAHAH
:eek:You expect me to answer random questions from randoms? Until you have the guts to tell the forum who you are, none of your comments are creditable. Just a FYI; this is the first PvE clan I've joined since Beta.
Lol......i like your rendition a lot better than mine
+1
They are both missing one key element for accuracy....
You arrive at a bicycle race with a bicycle, there are 120 racers entered and you are one of three guys on a bicycle---the other 117 are on motorcycles......
Next siege run a zerg of lowbie healers into the Radar user's ranks, followed by your main force. The auto-targeters will be busy one-shotting the useless healers while you have a precious few seconds to take them out.
When you, your friend, the friends of your friends and so on, quit this game due to cheaters, NC will realise that something is wrong and then maybe they will do something about it.
They should put radar for everyone, then it is fair. And no loose of XP when you don't fight back. I mean 80+ were insta killing low levels, thats a problem also. Blessing of protection only works if they are red.
And on this quote: it is just a game after all and everyone knows that technology changed anyway. If you don't have fun then why play? I don't do much pvp and I have fun. If you want honest pvp then l2 has many problems...
Finally note on the quote: ncsoft has many problems, they focus on the things that do the most damage: RMT (they even put it as main subject on their website)
Then lower on their list is botting and the use of radar is really low on the list IMO of course...
You are in a bicycle race. all the bikes are lined up. All of a sudden a guy in a motorcycle shows up.
I guess you could race him...and if you beat him i guess that would be something . But as far as i'm concerned i'd just leave him at the hole...you wanna win that bad buddy...have a ball...race yourself.
Oh and the judges...look the other way and give you a button to report him...cool!
love your comparison...
another tactic you could use is go close and only when you close you target and attack. Have some lowbies perhaps target first or do the tactic of target ESC target ESC... confusion is a great tool in battle... ofc this is beyond the point and you should not race against the motorcycle or we should all have a motorcycle...
another tactic you could use is go close and only when you close you target and attack. Have some lowbies perhaps target first or do the tactic of target ESC target ESC... confusion is a great tool in battle... ofc this is beyond the point and you should not race against the motorcycle or we should all have a motorcycle...
Or use the terrain to your advantage.
You can target people without seeing them as long as you know the name.
They run to you, you say? Great. Do it on the bottom of steep cliffs then. Preferably with a few aggro mobs waiting for them on the bottom too.