I just can't decide! I alredy have a dark elf Abyss walker and i'm in the process of creating an elf wizard-Spellsinger.My third character is a dark elf Mystic, 20 lvl, but i can't decide if i should make her into a Shillen Oracle or a dark wizard-Spellhowler(if that's th correct name)....
Both SE (Shillen Elder, 2nd class transfer for Shillen Oracles) and SH (SpellHowler) are great classes, useful and wanted in parties. But they are all different in everything.
SE's are SUPPORT toons that have some heal. Their most important skills are:
Recharge: Recharge some MP of the target. Can't be used on any class that can learn Recharge.
Stigma of Shillen: For some time, decreases the resistence to short-range (mostly meelee) atacks of the target.
Greater Heal, Battle Heal and Group Heal: Healing skills. The first heals Ok for low MP. The second Heals more and faster but cost high MP. The last one heals your party and has a bigger reuse time.
Empower: Buff that increases M.Atk.
Vampiric Rage: Buff the enables life leeching for physical meelee atacks (not physical skills, until GoD)
Inquisitor: Transformation that gives you some Nuke so you can solo and grind by yourself, at least to a level where you can find some party. You can't heal while in Inquisitor form.
SE mainly role is to provide SUPPORT to parties, debuff with Stigma or something else, buffing with non-prophet buffs (empower, vampiric rage), recharging the healer and maybe the nukes (if the healer don't need it) and healing if the healer can't manage it all or there's no healer available at the moment.
Now SH's can only fit as nukers and, as such, aren't that need to parties as Lineage 2 has lots of players playing lots of different nukers.
It's a Dark Elf, which means less speed and more damage per hit. In this case, poor casting speed (since you have a SpS, you'll notice that really clear) and huge M.Atk. Meaning less skills to kill mobs and less BSPS to use. Is really great soloing.
It has some interesting debuffs:
Slow: Slows your target. At high levels, this could be a life saver, if it lands.
Silence: Silences the target, disabling the use of magical skills. Last loooooong.
Chaos: Don't know if people use it a lot, but it dimishes your target's accuracy WAY down.
Fear: Imbues Fear into your target, making it lose control for a moment and run away for you.
Sleep: Immobilizes your target by making him sleep. Any kind of damage will awake it up. Was overpower before but now it's casting time is just too huge.
Surrender to Wind: Lowers Wind resistance and Rises Earth resistance of your target. Great for it makes you deal much more damage with you primary nuke.
Poison: Poisons your target. Great Damage per Second, if you manage to land it on the correct mob. Some may resist poison just too well.
Also has some great nukes and self-help skills:
Hurricane: Wind powered nuke. Your primary spell.
Vampiric Claw: Leech Life nuke. Consumes Lots of MP.
Death Spike: Dark powered nuke. Don't require cursed bones anymore.
Shadow Flare: Dark powered nuke. Stronger than the others. Overhits.
Body to Mind: Consumes HP to regenerate MP. It's not 1:1, it's more 1:0.6.
Corpse Drain Health: Drains HP from a corpse. Got the combo? BtM, kill, CDH, repeat...
Tempest: Wind AoE nuke. Does less damage than Hurricane, but AoE's great, if someone could hold the mobs for you...
SH's role is primary nuke, nuke and also nuke. Sometimes they may used for debuffs, but OL may be a lot better for this, as well as others.
As a final note, the choice depends on what you want to do. If you want another nuke (IMO better than your SpS), then go for SH. Else, in case you like to heal some, SUPPORT a lot and be wanted in most parties that can't afford / find a WC, then go for SE.
SH levels blazing fast from 1->76. Then it has some issues specially if you can't get a full party.
SE levels very slow from 1->76. Though Inq nukes help don't hope for good parties untill 78+. Then you will have PoW and many parties will need you. Though SE has so many abilities, can assist heal, can assist recharge, can bebuff, takes 4 skills from other bufers with holy pomanders, and lots of others be prepared for INSANE leveling speeds by just joining GC Lower parties that will happily take you just to Stigma mobs.
That skill is pretty OP in the sense that many people do not actually know that SE is a very userfull buffer / healer / recharge / de-buffer combo and just ask for Stigma, nothing else.
If I was to choose I would also take the SE. Handling 1->78 would not be a problem now with vita / nevits / double XP events. Then on things will change. Melee parties will want you (most of the times easy job, just stigma mobs and leech XP), Mage parties will want you (tough job, you must do a lot of things pretty fast and if the party is not good it won't worth the extra effort unlike melee in GC where any party gets some XP and no1 dies anyway), nukers may want you for duo (easy job, keep buffs up, pickup and some recharges / heals from time to time if needed)
pay 15 bucks more a month and play both, SH + SE , that way u are not dependant on groups and u will lvl alot faster ( better would be EE + SH )
About groups, people allways say u get better groups blah blah but in reality nobody will party u on either of both classes until ur atleast 76 ( well ull get a few random partys in which u will run around/die more then u exp prolly .. )
SH + SE , that way u are not dependant on groups and u will lvl alot faster ( better would be EE + SH )
Why would EE + SH would be better ? How would a mage level duo with no Empower ? 3 shooting dark blue mobs ?
On Topic ..
All classes have problems finding parties till at least 78+. Problem with Mage is that he keeps having problems finding parties regardless of levels. And that's because there are a lot of nukers compared to the available & willing support classes that are 100% needed to form a nice party.
I did almost all my leveling solo with the Storm Screamer .. On the contrary, I had no problems finding party every time at 78+ with my spoiler. Just watch Aden shouts and you will figure it out .. But that's for XP / PvE ..
It has some interesting debuffs:
Slow: Slows your target. At high levels, this could be a life saver, if it lands.
Silence: Silences the target, disabling the use of magical skills. Last loooooong.
Chaos: Don't know if people use it a lot, but it dimishes your target's accuracy WAY down.
Fear: Imbues Fear into your target, making it lose control for a moment and run away for you.
Sleep: Immobilizes your target by making him sleep. Any kind of damage will awake it up. Was overpower before but now it's casting time is just too huge.
Surrender to Wind: Lowers Wind resistance and Rises Earth resistance of your target. Great for it makes you deal much more damage with you primary nuke.
Poison: Poisons your target. Great Damage per Second, if you manage to land it on the correct mob. Some may resist poison just too well.
Also has some great nukes and self-help skills:
Hurricane: Wind powered nuke. Your primary spell.
Vampiric Claw: Leech Life nuke. Consumes Lots of MP.
Death Spike: Dark powered nuke. Don't require cursed bones anymore.
Shadow Flare: Dark powered nuke. Stronger than the others. Overhits.
Body to Mind: Consumes HP to regenerate MP. It's not 1:1, it's more 1:0.6.
Corpse Drain Health: Drains HP from a corpse. Got the combo? BtM, kill, CDH, repeat...
Tempest: Wind AoE nuke. Does less damage than Hurricane, but AoE's great, if someone could hold the mobs for you...
Hope I helped. :D
It took time to post that and its obvious you really want to help, I really appreciate that on ppl .. But (don't get me wrong) actually you don't .. You either have not StS at all or at least not recently.
Debuffs are almost worthless .. And I explain myself ..
Slow: Only for PvP maybe but low landing rate. No reason to use at mobs. By the time it would take to cast + land you should be able to kill mob. If you can't change spot. Or you should be in a high level spot / party where root / sleep / silence by buffers should take care of all that.
Silence: See above. Also does not land on casters due to their high m.def (like yours)
Chaos: Useless
Fear: Usefull only in high level PvP of Mage Parties to Fear opponents Cardinal and only if highly enchanted for time. If you need to use it on PvE you loose time and MP. Change spot / playing style. The only use of it was to exploit a "bug" at FoD. You could Fear the Behemoth Group to fall of the cliff and stay there so you could XP faster killing only Vampires.
Sleep: As poster said. Used to be OP. Useless now. It's casting time is huge.
Surrender to Wind: Useless. Time you loose to cast vs dps of spaming Hurricane is not worth it. At 79 you get Wind Vortex that does the job much better.
Poison: Useless
Also has some great nukes and self-help skills:
Hurricane: Wind powered nuke. Your primary spell.
Vampiric Claw: Useless from 60+
Death Spike: Useless from 60+
Shadow Flare: Useless from 60+
Body to Mind: Of some use when MP herbs don't like you. If you use to much change spot. You loose time.
Corpse Drain Health: Body to Mind + Corpse Drain is a combo from the past. Go to a herb spot and just spam Hurricane. You loose time. It was a neat tactic some years ago. Nowadays, it does not worth the effort. I tried so many times just because I liked the combo but does not pay off now. It's of some use only in some cases when something went really wrong and you need some fast HP. If it happens often change spot.
Tempest: Works only in AoE parties. You need a lot to use it, don't count on it. It works combined with Aura Flash / Aura Flare which need Spirit ore / get on higher level respectfully
The way to level an SH to 78 is pretty straight forward and dumb easy nowadays. At 80+ its much harder and needs some imagination / creativity / skill.
Till 75 get adventurer buffs, got to areas with MP herbs and 2 nuke white / lite yellow mobs. After 75 you will need Empower. You can;t do nothing without it. A wise choice would be to Level a Kookaburra so you can at least kill mobs alone. You will not get any good XP 78+ playing solo with kooka but at least you can do something ..
Unless you find a nice mage party, the drill is the same 78+. Stay in areas with MP herbs where you need 2 Hurricane's to kill mobs. Anything else is actually slower.
Why would EE + SH would be better ? How would a mage level duo with no Empower ? 3 shooting dark blue mobs ?
On Topic ..
All classes have problems finding parties till at least 78+. Problem with Mage is that he keeps having problems finding parties regardless of levels. And that's because there are a lot of nukers compared to the available & willing support classes that are 100% needed to form a nice party.
I did almost all my leveling solo with the Storm Screamer .. On the contrary, I had no problems finding party every time at 78+ with my spoiler. Just watch Aden shouts and you will figure it out .. But that's for XP / PvE ..
EE+SH would be better because of the EE's better abilities to keep up mp.
As for empower, that will probably never be a problem. Nuker could either use a kookaburra (or both chars could :D ), or hunt in fields, where herbs drop anyway.
As for it being harder to lvl a StS past 80 I disagree. 2 shoting dino is just as straightforward and mindnumbingly boring as all the other spots, you just make tons of money at the same time.
EE+SH would be better because of the EE's better abilities to keep up mp.
As for empower, that will probably never be a problem. Nuker could either use a kookaburra (or both chars could :D ), or hunt in fields, where herbs drop anyway.
As for it being harder to lvl a StS past 80 I disagree. 2 shoting dino is just as straightforward and mindnumbingly boring as all the other spots, you just make tons of money at the same time.
SE would be just fine doing some MP recharges for StS duo. Most solo / duo xp spots don't need recharger at all nowadays. Even kooka is not 100% needed if it was not for buffs.
StS + SE or StS + EE + Kooka buffing Emp every 2 min and leecehing XP ? For the pottential for some more MP that you don't need anyway for solo / duo spots.
As for Dino I agree partly. Not rocket science to execute some circles synced with respwan. Problem is not that. Problem is that base XP is about 13K and you have to do all the pickup also. Rest assured that making circles like crazy picking up everything is not the same as laying relaxed and comfortably on your back pressing F1 every 5-10 seconds for 100K+ base XP.
Dragon Valley solo spots is a nice solution, more XP, more drops, mobs more tightly packed, very good improvement. But again you have to solo like mad to get less XP than any random/casual/slow & very easy to make melee party at GC.
Leveled an StS at 85,100% and a dorf 83,15% and there is not assumtions any more. Done that experiment. Leveling dorf was faster, easier, cheaper, no strings attached or prerequisites. No need to sync countless revitas + nevits + timing different vit maintenace potions with nevits blessings etc etc.
No need to break your mind, being creative, searching hours for parties. Brainded XP, not the best but much better than breaking your nerves with StS.
Don't get me wrong, I really love the StS. It's just I don't get the unneeded - extra complexity in comparison to other classless. Imo, if a class is very hard to XP then it sould at least XP fast. If a class is easy to XP it should at least XP slow. Hard & slow I don't get it.
A noob dorf with 0 Element Gear should not be able to do what it does and level faster than a fully equipped and experienced (in comparison to dorf) mage.
I can play the dorf at GC to get pretty good XP.
I can play the dorf at DV (leeches / scorpions) for spoil, boost morale, XP
I can play the dorf ninja spoiling even Knoriks.
And all that with 0 element on armor. And leveling 58 -> 83 in a couple of months with 0 cost (hero box). And I consider myself casual / regular / non factor. If I did the effort I did with mage, dorf would be really close to 85 in a couple of months. Just by comparing what it took to do 82-84 on mage makes it me crazy.
So, its not the same, I always suspected it talking with friends. Now I have done it myself. And I have no reason to lie as I did the melee path also.
So this thread went from help with sts to melee is better?
/bai
No, you said that solo dino's is not slower / harder. Since GoD (free class change) will be here about the same time OP could be 85 in any easy-xp class a warning about picking class seemed to me appropriate. If any other question asked about SH we would be glad to help out.
He probably wanted to say that the best XP mobs for a 60+ nuker have dark resist, and that Hurricane is more useful on them.
I had no chance to compare Hurricane with Death Spike for the current resist system, so I don't know how much damage you lose on a dark resist mob now.
StS + SE or StS + EE + Kooka buffing Emp every 2 min and leecehing XP ? For the pottential for some more MP that you don't need anyway for solo / duo spots.
StS + Kooka + PoWater EE + Kooka should give you just enough MP for IT boss room at 79 :rolleyes: