I am very happy to see AH in l2, I am finally able to to sell stuff and turn my computer off.
Thank you for that :D
However with auction house we now face new fraud, and we need to be all aware of what exactly going on and protect ourselves.
Here is what i do:
Wind Crystal 4 Million 900 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 800 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Billion 400 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 700 Thousand
1. Arrange by price
2. Dont carry more than 20m on your designated AH buyer
you could always mail yourself more money, but make a habbit to browse AH on broke *** toon
if you have more examples of fraud - plz post them along with how to counter
Here is what i do:
Wind Crystal 4 Million 900 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 800 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Billion 400 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 700 Thousand
This!
Please understand that this is not fraud. All of the information on the item, its price and amount, and the explanations of the auction house fees are readily available. Mistakes can easily be avoided by simply taking an extra minute or two to look closely at the transaction and check that it's correct before making the purchase.
Please understand that this is not fraud. All of the information on the item, its price and amount, and the explanations of the auction house fees are readily available. Mistakes can easily be avoided by simply taking an extra minute or two to look closely at the transaction and check that it's correct before making the purchase.
Well, let's be honest here, it is an attempt to trick people into clicking on the wrong price in the hopes of cleaning out their adena. Fraud? Perhaps not, but it's dishonesty all the same. Also, some of the absurdly priced items are there for RMT purposes, as it avoids GM detection.
Everyone should try to read what they are buying before clicking confirm, that way they dont have to feel like a noob afterwards, when they lost all their adena...
Ya ppl do need to watch what they are doing. I sometimes sort by quantity when I'm buying stuff like life stones, but I still double/triple check the price before I click ok.
Still not seeing fraud. People are allowed to sell for whatever price they want.
YES, ppl are allowed to sell for w/e price they want, but i dont see ppl selling for 967 Million 469 Thousand 999 adena for Holy Stone.
What i see is "some" scammers trying to make a price look identical to the real market value with only ONE letter difference. Hoping and praying someone would not notice this tiny difference and buys it - resulting in a scam.
Yes, its a scam because it envolves trickery of someone who overlooks one letter. And in this case Scam can be seen as Fraud.
I wont be surprised to know that some or all ppl defending current AH functionality are the proud owners of such auctions.
What we need is some sort of differentiation such as "colors" what we already have on private stores
YES, ppl are allowed to sell for w/e price they want, but i dont see ppl selling for 967 Million 469 Thousand 999 adena for Holy Stone.
What i see is "some" scammers trying to make a price look identical to the real market value with only ONE letter difference. Hoping and praying someone would not notice this tiny difference and buys it - resulting in a scam.
Yes, its a scam because it envolves trickery of someone who overlooks one letter. And in this case Scam can be seen as Fraud.
I wont be surprised to know that some or all ppl defending current AH functionality are the proud owners of such auctions.
What we need is some sort of differentiation such as "colors" what we already have on private stores
There is a confirm window stating all the info one more time. Just read through it instead of clicking ok right away.
And no, I have never done a scam with AH. I still dont think there is a problem here though, ppl need to pay attention better. If a scam can make them pay more attention, why not let it happen?
Hmmm if a child want to play with "Matches" do i stop him/her or let them get burned once...which way do you think they learn their lesson better...i say let them burn themselves once and they NEVER do it again....same thing with the AH....if youR stupid enuff to buy without reading carefully...then well...you deserve what ya get and...like the child i spoke of earlier...they will NEVER fall for it again...Fraud, i think not!!!...Scam, i think not...Dishonest as all hell...yeah , indeed it is.....But remember this.....NO ONE CAN FIX STUPID, SO PAY ATTN TO WHAT YA BUYING B4 YA HIT OK
I got scammed, Im an above average IQ person WELL AWARE of whats going on in AH. I knew where to look and to to watch out for, and yet i got scammed.
How?
I was vent chat`ing with a girl with the awsomest voice, WHILE telling my dimwit brother where i left my car keys so he can get the food from the trunk, WHILE i was in party on my sub waiting to get in kama, and i needed 100 shots.
Well kudos to the scammer, shame on me...well hell it was worth it
Moral of the story?
Don`t take your brother as a roomate :)
I got scammed, Im an above average IQ person WELL AWARE of whats going on in AH. I knew where to look and to to watch out for, and yet i got scammed.
How?
I was vent chat`ing with a girl with the awsomest voice, WHILE telling my dimwit brother where i left my car keys so he can get the food from the trunk, WHILE i was in party on my sub waiting to get in kama, and i needed 100 shots.
Well kudos to the scammer, shame on me...well hell it was worth it
Moral of the story?
Don`t take your brother as a roomate :)
Hmmm this proves my point Ya Cant Fix Stupid....and obviously NOT "well aware"
No, you didn't. You paid more than you wanted to for an item but you did not get scammed.
This is what passes for intelligence these days...?
Hmmm...do they give out High School Diplomas to ppl like this nowadays?
It would really explain alot and cure my curiosity as i havent been in school since 1981
No, you didn't. You paid more than you wanted to for an item but you did not get scammed.
This is what passes for intelligence these days...?
Come on now, it's designed as a scam and we both know it. When someone goes to buy a lifestone, and for example, they sort by price and see 10 of them at 500 thousand adena each. Now when you buy that stone at 500 thousand the list automatically resets and is no longer sorted by price, but player xxPro100Rusxx has placed a lifestone in there for 500 million in the hopes that you mistakenly click it after the list resorts. It's designed to catch people off guard and to maliciously take their money, it's a scam, but like many scams it requires the other person to not be careful or to be caught unaware.
The guy posting it knows that it will never get sold through normal circumstance, in other words no one is going to want to pay 500 million for an item that sells for 500 thousand. They place it in there in the hopes that through human error and/or game design (the list resort) that a player clicks on it. Sounds like a scam to me.
Come on now, it's designed as a scam and we both know it. When someone goes to buy a lifestone, and for example, they sort by price and see 10 of them at 500 thousand adena each. Now when you buy that stone at 500 thousand the list automatically resets and is no longer sorted by price, but player xxPro100Rusxx has placed a lifestone in there for 500 million in the hopes that you mistakenly click it after the list resorts. It's designed to catch people off guard and to maliciously take their money, it's a scam, but like many scams it requires the other person to not be careful or to be caught unaware.
The guy posting it knows that it will never get sold through normal circumstance, in other words no one is going to want to pay 500 million for an item that sells for 500 thousand. They place it in there in the hopes that through human error and/or game design (the list resort) that a player clicks on it. Sounds like a scam to me.
No, it isn't. You are buying exactly what is posted and clearly labeled. The seller cannot misrepresent what is being sold. It very clearly states you are buying {item} for {price}. Buying an overpriced item is, in absolutely no way, a scam.
Yes someone obviously hopes others will mistakenly buy their item making them rich.
Who in their right mind carries 4 Billion in their pocket?
OMG How long one have to play to accumulate that much cash?
Some could be RMT's taking delivery of their cash through the auction system, after all they can't be banned for selling junk for high dollar through the auction.
No, it isn't. You are buying exactly what is posted and clearly labeled. The seller cannot misrepresent what is being sold. It very clearly states you are buying {item} for {price}. Buying an overpriced item is, in absolutely no way, a scam.
When people were selling those red event items in place of A Gems it was widely thought of as a scam. When people were selling S gems in place of Noble Stones most people as considered that a scam. Yet in both cases you could hover over the item and see what it was, regardless of what the store title said. The reason it was considered a scam is because people were posting things that they knew would never sell at that price normally but that if someone hastily brought it then they would still make a windfall profit. That is a scam and this is no different because it relies on human error and/or haste to bring about windfall profit on something they would otherwise never sell @ that price.
Now this doesn't mean I think the GMs should get involved or ban it, as for obvious reasons that wouldn't work out well, but I do think it's wrong that people come on here and bash others for calling this **** for what it is, a scam.
Yes someone obviously hopes others will mistakenly buy their item making them rich.
Who in their right mind carries 4 Billion in their pocket?
OMG How long one have to play to accumulate that much cash?
Some could be RMT's taking delivery of their cash through the auction system, after all they can't be banned for selling junk for high dollar through the auction.
I know people with 10+ billion adena, and yes most don't carry it all around, but many people do carry several hundred million adena at a time.
When people were selling those red event items in place of A Gems it was widely thought of as a scam. When people were selling S gems in place of Noble Stones most people as considered that a scam. Yet in both cases you could hover over the item and see what it was, regardless of what the store title said. The reason it was considered a scam is because people were posting things that they knew would never sell at that price normally but that if someone hastily brought it then they would still make a windfall profit. That is a scam and this is no different because it relies on human error and/or haste to bring about windfall profit on something they would otherwise never sell @ that price.
Now this doesn't mean I think the GMs should get involved or ban it, as for obvious reasons that wouldn't work out well, but I do think it's wrong that people come on here and bash others for calling this **** for what it is, a scam.
You cannot mislabel things in the auction house. You don't even get to change the description. Every item is what the description says it is. Every item has a price clearly displayed next to it. Every item has a total price (for multiple items) clear displayed next to it.
This is not a scam.
I sold an item on the AH once. I posted it as a lower price than the other items. Does that make the now more expensive ones a scam?
You cannot mislabel things in the auction house. You don't even get to change the description. Every item is what the description says it is. Every item has a price clearly displayed next to it. Every item has a total price (for multiple items) clear displayed next to it.
This is not a scam.
I sold an item on the AH once. I posted it as a lower price than the other items. Does that make the now more expensive ones a scam?
You clearly do not know what a scam is.
You can't mislabel an item in a private shop either, you can only mislabel the title above your head. Yet, everyone knows it's still a scam. I've already explained why the AH thing is also a scam, and if you don't agree then fine, but spare me the "you obviously don't know" or the "I'm so smart" ****.
You can't mislabel an item in a private shop either, you can only mislabel the title above your head. Yet, everyone knows it's still a scam. I've already explained why the AH thing is also a scam, and if you don't agree then fine, but spare me the "you obviously don't know" or the "I'm so smart" ****.
I never said I was so smart...
It's still not a scam. No way, no how. Show me where the fraud is (you still haven't) and I could change my mind. You posted the definition to back up your claim, now show me where the fraud is in the AH.
With a sell shop, you can change the title (like you said). That, at least, contains some level of fraud. So I agree that you can scam in a sell shop.
OP brought up a point that people can get victimized to unreasonably overpaying.
Regardless of how people want to call it;fraud, scam, swindle, abuse of AH features, etc, etc. Buyer should always check the items and prices.
This is very easy to avoid: simply take the time—a few extra seconds even—to mouseover the item and read its name and description. should add "and price."
I am very happy to see AH in l2, I am finally able to to sell stuff and turn my computer off.
Thank you for that :D
However with auction house we now face new fraud, and we need to be all aware of what exactly going on and protect ourselves.
Here is what i do:
Wind Crystal 4 Million 900 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 800 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Billion 400 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 700 Thousand
1. Arrange by price
2. Dont carry more than 20m on your designated AH buyer
you could always mail yourself more money, but make a habbit to browse AH on broke *** toon
if you have more examples of fraud - plz post them along with how to counter
LOL
i cant believe this works
and I can't see how it as a fraud when you receive the correct item you bought.
id understand if you wanted a Wind Crystal and yet in your inventory you receive a grade crystal,
That'd look more like a fraud to me.
I never got my diploma, actually paid for it,
I never knew a Diploma or GED of some sort was a certificate indicating you had common sense
how do some of you survive in this world :confused:
fraud
Noun:
1. Wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
stupidity
Noun:
1. the state, quality, or fact of being stupid.
Paying 1 billion for something that should be 1 million would fall under the stupidity definition. For all you know the seller was half asleep and put too many zeros, you wouldn't be complaining if they put too few and you got a bargain from them.
Any one selling anything can place any price they want on what they have to offer. You must be aware of what you are doing in real life and your virtual life.
P.S. If overpricing in an open market is fraud every business should be shut down.... large soda in a fast food joint $1:99 (cost 15 cents), furniture store has a sale on a sofa and love seat combo $1299 (cost to make $250), Auto dealers selling a 4 door family sedan $25,000(dealership cost $9,500). Yeah, the only one protecting your money is you so open your eyes and stop blaming the greedy, it is in their nature to be greed. Is it in your nature to be stupid?
fraud
Noun:
1. Wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
stupidity
Noun:
1. the state, quality, or fact of being stupid.
Paying 1 billion for something that should be 1 million would fall under the stupidity definition. For all you know the seller was half asleep and put too many zeros, you wouldn't be complaining if they put too few and you got a bargain from them.
Any one selling anything can place any price they want on what they have to offer. You must be aware of what you are doing in real life and your virtual life.
P.S. If overpricing in an open market is fraud every business should be shut down.... large soda in a fast food joint $1:99 (cost 15 cents), furniture store has a sale on a sofa and love seat combo $1299 (cost to make $250), Auto dealers selling a 4 door family sedan $25,000(dealership cost $9,500). Yeah, the only one protecting your money is you so open your eyes and stop blaming the greedy, it is in their nature to be greed. Is it in your nature to be stupid?
yup it's true. I worked retail and our mark up was OVER 100%. People can list their items at any price they want. It's not against the rules. Pay attention.
Well, the second half of this thread isn't about it being against the rules, it's about people acting as if this weren't an attempt to scam people. I've never been duped in game, but I've had a couple of times were I almost let myself get screwed. Pointing at people and talking about stupidity is fairly narrow minded.
These pathetic attempts will never work.
1st because no1 keeps 4 billions in his invetory. (WHs are meant for a reason)
and
2nd - if you even have 4 bills, the you'll for sure know all of the game's little secrets incl the scams.
And even by some miserable chance you really fall into that trap, you don't deserve your adenas at all :)
-Search the item you pretend
-Double click to sort the price from the lower to higher
-Done
Btw: If you think that doing that is a fraud, imagine when its the opposite for example: When you buy an item on the Auction House when u can sell it for more adena on the grocery, is that a fraud also? Please, its being dumb on both sides, just pay attention to what you are buying/selling
But i dont understand those peoples that are trying to defend them, try to prove us all the ways that those scammers dont do something illegal or unethical.
They are scammers clear and crystal, why are u so annoying when we call them with their real name?
if you have more examples of fraud - plz post them along with how to counter
This one isn't about the AH, but works for sure. Lvl-ing a new charr to lvl 85 and let's say 90%. After that shouding in Aden "wts mentee lvl 85 95% = 20kk". Plenty of ppl are rdy to pay that price for 2k mentee coins. Next step getting mentor invite > accept > making him give the money > leave. Repeat from step 1 again till the adena seems enough. Countering it, well don't take mantees. If you need coins, make a second charr and pwrlvl it with the main for 2 days and collect the coins :)
They are scammers clear and crystal, why are u so annoying when we call them with their real name?
Because you're calling a fish a duck. Scamming requires fraud (as per the definition already posted here by someone else). Since there is no fraud on the AH, it is not a scam.
Because you're calling a fish a duck. Scamming requires fraud (as per the definition already posted here by someone else). Since there is no fraud on the AH, it is not a scam.
Is it really that hard for you to understand?
So, im going for hunting.
Im setting up "traps" all over the place and manage to catch up some victims.
I'm not responsible for this catches, but the stupid animals that they didn't see the traps, this is what you're saying El.
The fact that they dont offend game rules doesnt make them innocent, they are scammers in my eyes.
and for topic, there's no scam related with AH, maybe a lack of patience and attention, but no scam for sure. Each and all items on the AH list are what they're supposed/intended to be, priced with the value that seller believes them worth, if you agree with him, buy them; if not, just move on another. simple.
So, im going for hunting.
Im setting up "traps" all over the place and manage to catch up some victims.
I'm not responsible for this catches, but the stupid animals that they didn't see the traps, this is what you're saying El.
Another example: I go to a store and buy a pencil for $1. I'm in a hurry and don't really check the price. Later, I go to another store and find pencils for 1 cent each. I could have purchases 100 pencils for what I paid at the first store! Was I scammed?
The fact that they dont offend game rules doesnt make them innocent, they are scammers in my eyes.
Doesn't really matter since scamming is legal here.
Another example: I go to a store and buy a pencil for $1. I'm in a hurry and don't really check the price. Later, I go to another store and find pencils for 1 cent each. I could have purchases 100 pencils for what I paid at the first store! Was I scammed?
Doesn't really matter since scamming is legal here.
I agree with your point.
Let's change up the magnitude, since most people won't cry over pocket change:
If you bought a car for $300,000 at a dealer and later found the same car at another dealer for $30,000. Now that is a price difference people will cry over. But if you were in a hurry and didn't check the prices, then shame on you. It wasn't illegal for the dealer to over price it. Maybe the dealer was attached to that car for what ever reason and was only willing to let it go for that price.
From the buyers point of view, yah you probably would feel like you got scammed. But the real questions is; did the seller do it with malicious intent? We'll never know.
On a different note, isn't this an auction house, where's the bidding?:D
I am very happy to see AH in l2, I am finally able to to sell stuff and turn my computer off.
Thank you for that :D
However with auction house we now face new fraud, and we need to be all aware of what exactly going on and protect ourselves.
Here is what i do:
Wind Crystal 4 Million 900 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 800 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Billion 400 Thousand
Wind Crystal 4 Million 700 Thousand
1. Arrange by price
2. Dont carry more than 20m on your designated AH buyer
you could always mail yourself more money, but make a habbit to browse AH on broke *** toon
if you have more examples of fraud - plz post them along with how to counter
U can just blame urself for falling into such a trap lol... Haste makes waste... Use ur eyes to check the price next time. It just takes u 1 second :)
Only stupid ppl would fall for those scams.
I dont see this as a big problem at all.
Agree!!!
Check carefully before buying. Scammers are everywhere.
Another example: I go to a store and buy a pencil for $1. I'm in a hurry and don't really check the price. Later, I go to another store and find pencils for 1 cent each. I could have purchases 100 pencils for what I paid at the first store! Was I scammed?
BAD example, what matters is intent.
AH in lineage2 is different, because your pocket shrinks by Billion(s) more than you intended to pay.
What i dont understand is why so many of you are unsupportive. I am here to spread awareness, and to get attention of ncsoft to introduce some sort of additional protection. Whats wrong with that?
BAD example, what matters is intent.
I would assume that the intent is to make money. Otherwise the person would just trashcan the item.
AH in lineage2 is different, because your pocket shrinks by Billion(s) more than you intended to pay.
Whether it's buying stems or an epic jewel for 100x what they're worth, the concept is exactly the same. only the scale is different.
What i dont understand is why so many of you are unsupportive. I am here to spread awareness, and to get attention of ncsoft to introduce some sort of additional protection. Whats wrong with that?
I have no problem with someone pointing out the obvious (check what you're paying before you buy). Just don't call it a scam. It's not.
Well, let's be honest here, it is an attempt to trick people into clicking on the wrong price in the hopes of cleaning out their adena. Fraud? Perhaps not, but it's dishonesty all the same. Also, some of the absurdly priced items are there for RMT purposes, as it avoids GM detection.
I couldn't agree more. It's a scam attempt plain and simple.
Two things that would make AH life a little bit easier:
A) Making it so you don't have to sort by price again after you purchase an item (if you purchase one Enchant scroll at a time, for example, you end up having to sort by price after each purchase).
B) Allow users to set a maximum price threshold, where if they purchase something above it, it will prompt them to enter their pin code to override it and purchase (in the case that the price is actually what they want to pay).
Also, people who try to scam people in this way are scum. And no, I've never been had; but it still annoys the crap out of me.
Everyone should try to read what they are buying before clicking confirm, that way they dont have to feel like a noob afterwards, when they lost all their adena...
Yeah, like buying a Water Stone Fragment instead of a Water Stone in a private store....
*sign...*
At least I don't lose so much, only 500k... this only happened once when I returned to play.
Word choice aside it's pretty obvious the intent, should something be done? Nope! It's what makes lineage 2 lineage 2. If I were to mislead you into spending extra money + 1 for me. In this game it's about hurting the other players wallet just as it is making their hp drop, your goal is to win, so if you devastate a player by making him poor the outcome can in return help you if he is not able to play later on.
Remember when people use to train you for gear, it has a similar principle. I have been mislead myself, with blank scrolls back in the day, but I mislead others to compensate for my loss as well, what comes around goes around. I did follow the rules and as far as I know this is not a rule as many other scams, misleading, tricks or whatever.
I do disagree with one part of this threads conversation and that is stupidity part, stuff happens, live and learn, or in this case play and learn.
It's no different than me buying a book off a sell shop for far below market value because the seller didn't know it's value,but I did and bought it and flipped it for double the price. Their mistake, my gain. Should I feel bad? No,anyone can charge what they want for an item it's up to you to understand the market and watch what you buy.