Well, I'm not Sigel Knight as main class, but now I could play with class, and I leave here my indignation.
Since the beginning of GoD, with the implements of awakened classes, become more attractive gameplay with classes that usually play little, for example tanker and healer.
Well, let the facts known
* NCWest servers are lacking healers and tanks. (Interestingly, although not new)
** It would be a consensus that most instances it is possible to do without tank, (being much more convenient to have 5 damage dealer's than 4 in a party) citing the instances of lvl 85 +, 90 +, and 95+ except for the instances of boss as eg (istina or octavis) or to power lvl as eg in gf (certainly here tank could spend your precious money to buy their runes and lvl up from there like a robot than spending your precious time to grind up the character). And what to speak of tanks in sieges? it is impossible to tell how many trees of lifes are planted during the siege by healers, but it's easy to do the math and add up how many tanks are contributing to a siege.
*** And lastly I have been noticed on the server where I play, with related dualclass, I see many doing to damage dealer, many x10 to healer, and tank? will that is so despicable?
I understand that with the implementation of Glory Days, came to give one cheer for healers and tankes, but since the beginning of Tauti, in my view, has become irrelevant to class Sigel Knight ...
Unless except for those who really like to play as tank, prays for oly, prays for ceremony of chaos, ... or other related fun.
the thing is that ppl adapt, we don't have enough tanks..we adapt... and found out to do stuff without them... with different buffs and/or roles in the party.
is not ncsoft's fault is the ppl who doesn't like to play tanks, or the ones playing the game are taken already in cp's
for me a party with a tank is always better than a party without one, in a pve and mostly in a pvp situation.
Relax. Every overpower is timelimited. Now healers and tanks are overpowerd more then anybody else, but with the next update, healers are getting armor penalty for not wearing their apropriate armor and the imba period for them ends. It;s just a matter of time for the tanks do reduce their skills' power to 1/10 of the current power. Classes somehow will be balanced out or closely matched, but the gear is what worries me. The new RB weapons are waaaaaaaaaaaaay to much imba and ofc, by the power provided by the 3rd pt programs, they'll be again in the hands of the few already much OPed bot charrs, thus making getting to top lvl pointless..
btw, tanks wont be nerfed because tanks can't be nerfed since tanks are a control class! where can you nerf a tank? in the def, in the ud times? lol, guess what, who plays a tank (like myself) knows the damage it throws away, and i don't kill in mass pvp, unless im a lil lucky... tanks are strong in oly, but guess what, they are a taking damage class in mass pvp... and they will be nerfed in that point in what comes to the hates, but trust me, tanks can't be nerfed, because there is nothing 2 nerf :P
btw, tanks wont be nerfed because tanks can't be nerfed since tanks are a control class! where can you nerf a tank? in the def, in the ud times? lol, guess what, who plays a tank (like myself) knows the damage it throws away, and i don't kill in mass pvp, unless im a lil lucky... tanks are strong in oly, but guess what, they are a taking damage class in mass pvp... and they will be nerfed in that point in what comes to the hates, but trust me, tanks can't be nerfed, because there is nothing 2 nerf :P
Are you on drugs? Iv been playing the tank class for 8 years. There are tons of ways to nerf a tank. Not just by nerfing the tanks own skills, but also to enchant other classes skills. Apparlantly you dont know the Lineage 2 tank history.
The major change that was done in the latest update, that was a big advantage to our class was the nerf of all VR related buffs and skills. The strong melee DDs could no longer stay alive tanking to rely on VR effects. The second was the increase of the power agression effect.
Before that the tank was nothing.. (no crowd control, no damage)
You can nerf a tank skills and stats easy. What about this:
- P.def and M.def has been decreased with 10%
- Hate Aura effect was decreased to land on a maximum of 5 targets.
- Agression now might fear the target instead of attracting it.
- Hate Aura reuse time has be increased to 30 seconds. (real life example)
- Ultimate defense duration was increased but consume 1000 personal fame points when used.
Man there is many ways to nerf a tank.
Still I love the class but think nothing of those who awakened to tank because of the promise of the tanks value in GoD.
Are you on drugs? Iv been playing the tank class for 8 years. There are tons of ways to nerf a tank. Not just by nerfing the tanks own skills, but also to enchant other classes skills. Apparlantly you dont know the Lineage 2 tank history.
The major change that was done in the latest update, that was a big advantage to our class was the nerf of all VR related buffs and skills. The strong melee DDs could no longer stay alive tanking to rely on VR effects. The second was the increase of the power agression effect.
Before that the tank was nothing.. (no crowd control, no damage)
You can nerf a tank skills and stats easy. What about this:
- P.def and M.def has been decreased with 10%
- Hate Aura effect was decreased to land on a maximum of 5 targets.
- Agression now might fear the target instead of attracting it.
- Hate Aura reuse time has be increased to 30 seconds. (real life example)
- Ultimate defense duration was increased but consume 1000 personal fame points when used.
Man there is many ways to nerf a tank.
Still I love the class but think nothing of those who awakened to tank because of the promise of the tanks value in GoD.
i have tanks since C2 and i do love it.... however, i dont think most of those will be done... 1 vs 1 confrontations tanks always been one of the most powerfull classes ingame and in the future they will still be... the real issue about the tank is that its gearing expensive, i can tell it because im not even 2 the half of it and it really blows all the ressources you have! anyway its just stuppid 2 nerf a class like a tank, and you speak as if a tank wasnt a controller... it always have been, less then now but always have been.... anyway no matter what, tank for life!
I don't think tanks are irrelevant at all. They rly mess up with your gameplay as long their debuffs land.
Sometimes i have 2 tanks on my pt, and while not as eficient as 2 healers, it's definitely takes a punch to get through them on mass pvp.
Every random pt wants tank, so you can keep lvling in a good pace without CP.:)
I don't think tanks are irrelevant at all. They rly mess up with your gameplay as long their debuffs land.
Sometimes i have 2 tanks on my pt, and while not as eficient as 2 healers, it's definitely takes a punch to get through them on mass pvp.
Every random pt wants tank, so you can keep lvling in a good pace without CP.:)
true.
But the problem is, that people still imagine the H5-Tank-Killing-Machine (AI, FI etc.)
Tanks arent as imba as they were any longer. At least in damage dealing aspects.
Tanks are now asked to do what their task is: to actually tank! :)
PVP
Pre God
Except for the joke ET the rest were doing pretty awesome in pvp solo and mass
After God
They are not so fun to play as they use to be...
For Example PK
Where are Angelic Icon/Flame Icon/Touch Of Life/Sacrifice/cancel stick/cp regen cutter/Strong DD Pet without penalty and with cleance skill/ Spammable Agression with - pdef route.
Knight Frenzy and Cubic do not in any case compenate for the losses mentioned above.
I hope Tanks will be fun to play again on next major update. I love to solo pvp vs 4-5 ppl and staying alive....Try to do that now....Now is that Tank are nerfed.
Maybe some feel they are still OP but compared to the past they have suffered huge nerf.
true.
But the problem is, that people still imagine the H5-Tank-Killing-Machine (AI, FI etc.)
Tanks arent as imba as they were any longer. At least in damage dealing aspects.
Tanks are now asked to do what their task is: to actually tank! :)
They are crowd control chars...Their task is to keep the party alive while being a pain in the ***** for the enemy party (mostly to the healer and to the highest dps enemy chars) with the means they have.
Maybe you never played a Tank before so you have limited imagination of what tanks are capable of.
They are crowd control chars...Their task is to keep the party alive while being a pain in the ***** for the enemy party (mostly to the healer and to the highest dps enemy chars) with the means they have.
Maybe you never played a Tank before so you have limited imagination of what tanks are capable of.
So a fullbuffed PK with FI on wasnt able to kill a robe char 2 shot, if he critted?
it all depends on gear & play style, it's how it used to be and it still is like that now..
if you are higher level and have better gear then the one you're fighting of course you will kill ppl.. that hasn't changed and got nada to do with the class..
a stacked tank then and now can easily kill ppl.. doesn't even need to use 3rd party soft for that either so in that sense it's an easier class to play then most of the others..
now we got that out of the way let's go back to the current update and the upcoming lindvior changes.
I got into this discussion with some clannies who said tanks were OP. My response was pretty simple; any, and I mean ANY of the classes in GoD can be "OP" if geared to the teeth.
For example, I am one of the strongest tanks on my server but in oly there are a few healers that can beat me almost everytime and there is one Tyrr and one Iss that can also win on occasion. Hell there are two stacked daggers that can beat me if the get lucky and crit their Hide skill.
Sure, in open PvP tanks are very hard to kill but they also don't put out alot of damage either. The Skill Power arguement is irrelevant as well. My Justice Punishment has 30k Skill power and it is +10 Dual but I only hit R99 Robe users for 4-6k. Compare that to a dagger/archer/tyrr who has the same skill power. At +10 on their skills they are hitting robe users for 10k+.
There is only one thing that needs to be nerfed on tanks and that is hate. Other than that they are fine. In fact, chain skills need a boost as the hardly ever land.
There is only one thing that needs to be nerfed on tanks and that is hate. Other than that they are fine. In fact, chain skills need a boost as the hardly ever land.
actually both will happen soon as that's part of the upcoming changes
I got into this discussion with some clannies who said tanks were OP. My response was pretty simple; any, and I mean ANY of the classes in GoD can be "OP" if geared to the teeth.
For example, I am one of the strongest tanks on my server but in oly there are a few healers that can beat me almost everytime and there is one Tyrr and one Iss that can also win on occasion. Hell there are two stacked daggers that can beat me if the get lucky and crit their Hide skill.
Sure, in open PvP tanks are very hard to kill but they also don't put out alot of damage either. The Skill Power arguement is irrelevant as well. My Justice Punishment has 30k Skill power and it is +10 Dual but I only hit R99 Robe users for 4-6k. Compare that to a dagger/archer/tyrr who has the same skill power. At +10 on their skills they are hitting robe users for 10k+.
There is only one thing that needs to be nerfed on tanks and that is hate. Other than that they are fine. In fact, chain skills need a boost as the hardly ever land.
this . +1
hate is getting nerfed with lindvior . chains get boosted.
lethalarcher has no say about tanks . he goes hunting immortal peopl on his 95+ yul to feel better lol
and about the other posts . umm Tanks were never created to be dealing dmg but to outlast and deal dmg in a long run.
Tanks are need somewhat no matter how you turn the table. you aint getting your Party solidarity lv3 buff without a Tank so your Feoh in pt misses like 15% extra Matk mate .... and theres more bonuses that comes along party solidarity lv3 ... u wont even get lv1 party solidarity without Tank... must say was a pretty smart move of ncsoft. :D
takeing a look in the past: back before GoD Tanks had big pdef and the shield block ... after God we have shield block and a Weak Pdef .. Tanks should be having bigger pdef then healers in hvy but their not. bigger pdef then tyrrs in ogre but their not ..
I wonder if anyone ever tried to put up a Tyrr warrior ogre with 1 handed weapon +shield vs Tank same setup and so forth.
i could bet that Tyrr would win this easy cause more pdef and maybe close to almost same shield block. but still having Tyrr skills with more power to easily outdps the tanks incoming attacks.
The only thing that makes tanks good in 1v1 is our Cubic. if as u guys talked about nerfs. nc decides to nerf the cubics healing or cleanse effect then we tanks are screwed.
as of seeing Eva templars getting a Heal cubic in lindvior. I guess we arent far off, of getting our cubic nerfed.. cuz really how long is Nc gona resist the QQ of players telling oh ya tanks unkillable cause double cubic heals.. and then 3 classes get screwed cuz eva temp has 2 heal cubic functions :P
hate is getting nerfed with lindvior . chains get boosted.
lethalarcher has no say about tanks . he goes hunting immortal peopl on his 95+ yul to feel better lol
and about the other posts . umm Tanks were never created to be dealing dmg but to outlast and deal dmg in a long run.
Tanks are need somewhat no matter how you turn the table. you aint getting your Party solidarity lv3 buff without a Tank so your Feoh in pt misses like 15% extra Matk mate .... and theres more bonuses that comes along party solidarity lv3 ... u wont even get lv1 party solidarity without Tank... must say was a pretty smart move of ncsoft. :D
takeing a look in the past: back before GoD Tanks had big pdef and the shield block ... after God we have shield block and a Weak Pdef .. Tanks should be having bigger pdef then healers in hvy but their not. bigger pdef then tyrrs in ogre but their not ..
I wonder if anyone ever tried to put up a Tyrr warrior ogre with 1 handed weapon +shield vs Tank same setup and so forth.
i could bet that Tyrr would win this easy cause more pdef and maybe close to almost same shield block. but still having Tyrr skills with more power to easily outdps the tanks incoming attacks.
The only thing that makes tanks good in 1v1 is our Cubic. if as u guys talked about nerfs. nc decides to nerf the cubics healing or cleanse effect then we tanks are screwed.
as of seeing Eva templars getting a Heal cubic in lindvior. I guess we arent far off, of getting our cubic nerfed.. cuz really how long is Nc gona resist the QQ of players telling oh ya tanks unkillable cause double cubic heals.. and then 3 classes get screwed cuz eva temp has 2 heal cubic functions :P
If we get Lindivor Knight Cubic is getting a nerf and I bet it will be no more healing.
While this will suck for the three other tanks I don't think it will be a huge shock outside of Olympiad.
If they give the old Sacrifice back I won't complain.
i am not good at calculating game stuff but skill says gives 1000 hp to target yet we dont know how much hp it takes from us.
now considering there are augments and talismans to increase healing amount. you can also heal for maybe up to 1400-1700 hp.
old sacrifice had like a 2-3 sec delay if i remember correctly.
if you mage crit upon skill you may get like 4k max hp back. Looking at what sort of dmg we have to take nowadays. so you heal yourself 6k hp up in that time u probly get like 9k dmg pulled upon you :) you just gona stand there and get outdmged and when your opponent has no mp he can run for last 2 mins of oly fight and win cuz he done 120k dmg on you and you done 20k cuz u were busy healing yourself . but thats just oly wise xD
I would rather keep healcubic over takeing fail low skilled Sacrifice for rookies.
@ Rodah. theres been nothing said about knights cubic getting nerfed, I was just thinking out loud. cause it seems kinda weird that ncsoft is giving L.Elf tanks their heal cubic back.
i am not good at calculating game stuff but skill says gives 1000 hp to target yet we dont know how much hp it takes from us.
now considering there are augments and talismans to increase healing amount. you can also heal for maybe up to 1400-1700 hp.
old sacrifice had like a 2-3 sec delay if i remember correctly.
if you mage crit upon skill you may get like 4k max hp back. Looking at what sort of dmg we have to take nowadays. so you heal yourself 6k hp up in that time u probly get like 9k dmg pulled upon you :) you just gona stand there and get outdmged and when your opponent has no mp he can run for last 2 mins of oly fight and win cuz he done 120k dmg on you and you done 20k cuz u were busy healing yourself . but thats just oly wise xD
I would rather keep healcubic over takeing fail low skilled Sacrifice for rookies.
@ Rodah. theres been nothing said about knights cubic getting nerfed, I was just thinking out loud. cause it seems kinda weird that ncsoft is giving L.Elf tanks their heal cubic back.
I thought I read that they were "decreasing" knight cubics effects but I could be wrong.
Still it makes sense doesn't it. They are removing tanks lion to make room for the new panther on Hell Knights so if they are giving Eva's Sigel a heal cubic it only seems logical that they would remove the heal from knight cubic (or reduce it's effect). Two healing cubics seems redundant and outside of oly the 10% is a non factor.
I predict that Knight cubic will be reduced to something like the old smart cubic. It cleanses debuffs and that's about it. This is certainly going to change things a lot, making Eva tanks pretty good in oly but who know. Shilen tanks para could be overpowered and the new panther may be a monster. As of right now it seems like the new Paladin will be the weakest unless the AOE root has a ridiculously high land rate.
as I see this coming lindvior update, it be 50/50 for eva/shilen tanks thats what most ppl will go to. some people might just go paladin/hell knight becuz of roleplay pet and or easier chance to get Hero cuz as said most hardcore players will go eva/shilen tank.