I'm looking to maximize my damage on my summoner in End Game PvE. I will not PvP on this toon unless the situation requires it and its unavoidable.
My current setup is rather cheap because I'm only 97 Atm but here it is.
Pony Summoner.
+9 Top S80 Contristo Hammer Health SA = Roughly a +5 or 6 R95 in P-attack
Seraph Light all +3 < I'm Cheap
Crit Rate Hat
Jewels Don't Matter
+12 STR -6 Dex
Misc other good stuff. (nothing major)
100% Cost aside what would be the ultimate PvE setup that would stand up in future updates as well. I know they are making PvE/PvP sets transferable to pet stats so thats going to make a huge difference in choice of weapon.
What I'm thinking is:
+6 Elegia Light Set Without Leggings Adds 171 Crit rate to me 51 to pets.
+8 Blessed Immo Leather Leggings adds ? Crit Rate to me ? to pets. (Decent Amount though)
Weapon I'm still undecided on. I Wouldn't mind a R-99 Retributer but with the cost of OEing and putting PvE on it with a 58% success chance is it really worth it. So weapon is between a Bow/Retributer/2 Handed Tauti (loaned)
Upgrade Tats to +15 Str
+3 Fish Stew Str
As you can see I'm trying to maximize my Critical Rate to get at least 550 Crit Rate on my pets, but also trying to boost Pattack as well. Attack speed I don't care about since only 10% transfers to pets.
I use Transforms mostly Zaken and Navi for raids. Buffs are mostly standard except for one non standard one.
The health hammer is for right now, its what I have, it works very well. Why do I need a mage weapon when all of my marks are instant cast? It was cheaper to make than a mage weapon with the same P-attack stats and it helps with surviveability which isn't much of an issue anyways.
So OE bow is out of the question. What else does anyone see that would help boost this.
Edit:
Okay here I'll make this easy for everyone to understand what I'm trying to do. I want 55k P-Attack without BR or Transform, I want 550+ constant crit rate on pets, I want 150k crit damage from pets when in transform/br/everything else on things like Epic Tauti/Valakas/Traskin/Anthy.
Get a regular Istina's Ring if you are looking for p. critical rate, it gives 54 and if possible a Tauti Ring, if you use blunt type weapons it givs 54 p. critical rate too.
Also you can try to get some Rubies to increase the servitor's soulshot damage.
Not regular istina and octavis lol.
It doesn't matter if you're doing Lindvior or Zellaka. The Health Hammer is bad if you're trying to maximize PvE damage. And as laughable as it is, the Bow actually would do more damage overall than a health hammer. The P.Atk is better and the P.Crit is better. There's no excusable reason to use that hammer, unless you're PvPing and need the HP, and the OP isn't even asking about PvP - at all.
If you can get your Summoner's Crit Rate to 400+ with a Retributer, that's what the OP should be using. There is gear available to make that happen, and you can Augment 30+ Crit on a Retributer using Level 76-85 Lifestones.
After that, crit doesn't scale as well and you're better off focusing on P.Atk and Mage Stats to boost your summoner's damage. 30 P.Critical on the pets (the difference between 400 and 500 on your summoner) won't make a massive difference, and unless you're nicely geared out you will likely be making sacrifices in places that would net better benefits all-around to get there.
I'm numb to your trolling these days. Don't bother with it...
I have a Retributer, and a Buster, and Duals, and Dual Fists, and Dual Blunts, and a Caster, and a Bow.
What's your point? I've tried it, unless you are geared decently the bow is going to win every time. It's easy to prove this, and many people in these forums have come to that same conclusion. Again, stop trolling. It's not even amusing anymore... Just pathetic.
I'm looking to maximize my damage on my summoner in End Game PvE. I will not PvP on this toon unless the situation requires it and its unavoidable.
My current setup is rather cheap because I'm only 97 Atm but here it is.
Pony Summoner.
+9 Top S80 Contristo Hammer Health SA = Roughly a +5 or 6 R95 in P-attack
Seraph Light all +3 < I'm Cheap
Crit Rate Hat
Jewels Don't Matter
+12 STR -6 Dex
Misc other good stuff. (nothing major)
100% Cost aside what would be the ultimate PvE setup that would stand up in future updates as well. I know they are making PvE/PvP sets transferable to pet stats so thats going to make a huge difference in choice of weapon.
What I'm thinking is:
+6 Elegia Light Set Without Leggings Adds 171 Crit rate to me 51 to pets.
+8 Blessed Immo Leather Leggings adds ? Crit Rate to me ? to pets. (Decent Amount though)
Weapon I'm still undecided on. I Wouldn't mind a R-99 Retributer but with the cost of OEing and putting PvE on it with a 58% success chance is it really worth it. So weapon is between a Bow/Retributer/2 Handed Tauti (loaned)
Upgrade Tats to +15 Str
+3 Fish Stew Str
As you can see I'm trying to maximize my Critical Rate to get at least 550 Crit Rate on my pets, but also trying to boost Pattack as well. Attack speed I don't care about since only 10% transfers to pets.
I use Transforms mostly Zaken and Navi for raids. Buffs are mostly standard except for one non standard one.
Anyone have some constructive criticism to help?
No where in this post did I see the OP telling us what his P.Critical Rate was, and AFACT he didn't mention it after I replied. I was the first reply to this post, so don't tell me what he has for him. He should have put that in his post.
Secondly, getting 550+ P.Critical on the pets by pumping up your own Crit Rate is not a great way to gear up, especially since going from 400-500 will only add 30 P.Critical to your pets. If I have 500 P.Crit Rate my pets don't even have 520 P.Critical, so how does the OP think he can get his pets to a constant 550 P.Critical when his P.Critical is capped at a level that doesn't allow him to transfer enough to get them up there? At that point, you're depending on Synergy Buffs, Triggers, etc. to get the extra crit.
Next update I believe it will be easier to add some extra crit to the pets (via Rage), but not now, and all that trigger will do is decrease the amount of Crit that I gear for and allow me to take it off and replace it with things like M.Atk instead.
Once you get to 400 P.Critical on your summoner, P.Critical drops down in stat scaling for Wynn Summoners. Boosting other stats can benefit more than 30 P.Critical to the pets.
I've always, ALWAYS, stated that any summoner that can get to 400+ P.Critical with a Retributer should be using the Retributer including for PvE because at those level of crits the Bow has no huge advantage over the Retributer and the Retributer does make up for the loss of crit in other ways that helps the Summoner DPS better, if they aren't lazy.
This is with my gimpy 2 Handed Health Blunt. Crit Rate is pretty decent if you ask me. This is without BR or Transform at 97. I have rose, 14 day epic jewel set, standard buffs lvl 4, and elemental link up (the 2% proc thing). So your bow > my blunt, I'm not sure about that. You're base crit rate might be higher than mine with a bow but in transform your attack speed is cut in 1/2 at least in Navi although zaken If I remember correctly is still amazing. I don't remember what my toons crit rate stats are in this picture, I didn't really care at the time but If memory serves me there are somewhere around 370-380, so 600 crit rate on a pet is possible if only for 20 seconds or however long Elemental Link lasts.
I'll take another screenshot for you with my characters crit rate and my pets crit rate at the same time. Again if memory serves my standard crit rate with just lvl 2 buffs is mid 200s, my pets is 416. so boosting mine from say 265>500 would bring my pets up to roughly 480 which is still closer to where I want to be. And we all know that yes a Bow has more Pattack than a 2 handed blunt, but all summoners now have a passive that increases 2 handed pattack by 105%. Still I would like to see a +10 bow vs a +10 retributer Pattack showdown since the bow pattack scales differently than a retributer. I still think the Retributer would win in Pattack but prolly not by much, few 100.
^ this is the stuff I'm looking for, although I don't know the chances of getting the 2 Augments from that epicly Expensive life stone but the 5 people that I know that have used one 3 got the sleep skill, 1 got winter and 1 got celest. Does anyone know the cooldown time on Giant Critical Weakness? Has to be a fairly long reuse for such an epic skill.
Edit: All in all I think I'll just got with the Top Quality Antharas Thrower. :troll
This is with my gimpy 2 Handed Health Blunt. Crit Rate is pretty decent if you ask me. This is without BR or Transform at 97. I have rose, 14 day epic jewel set, standard buffs lvl 4, and elemental link up (the 2% proc thing). So your bow > my blunt, I'm not sure about that. You're base crit rate might be higher than mine with a bow but in transform your attack speed is cut in 1/2 at least in Navi although zaken If I remember correctly is still amazing. I don't remember what my toons crit rate stats are in this picture, I didn't really care at the time but If memory serves me there are somewhere around 370-380, so 600 crit rate on a pet is possible if only for 20 seconds or however long Elemental Link lasts.
I'll take another screenshot for you with my characters crit rate and my pets crit rate at the same time. Again if memory serves my standard crit rate with just lvl 2 buffs is mid 200s, my pets is 416. so boosting mine from say 265>500 would bring my pets up to roughly 480 which is still closer to where I want to be. And we all know that yes a Bow has more Pattack than a 2 handed blunt, but all summoners now have a passive that increases 2 handed pattack by 105%. Still I would like to see a +10 bow vs a +10 retributer Pattack showdown since the bow pattack scales differently than a retributer. I still think the Retributer would win in Pattack but prolly not by much, few 100.
^ this is the stuff I'm looking for, although I don't know the chances of getting the 2 Augments from that epicly Expensive life stone but the 5 people that I know that have used one 3 got the sleep skill, 1 got winter and 1 got celest. Does anyone know the cooldown time on Giant Critical Weakness? Has to be a fairly long reuse for such an epic skill.
Edit: All in all I think I'll just got with the Top Quality Antharas Thrower. :troll
BR doesn't add Crit Rate, and you have to show buffs. I have 500 Crit Rate on my Summoner right now but because I have solo buffs (level 2 Iss Buffs) they only have 482 P.Critical. I cannot add anymore Crit to my pets through gear or P.Critical to my character... The only other way they can get more Crit is via buffs (Higher Level Iss Buffs, WS Buff adds crit to Melee pets, Synergy Buffs and Toggles).
Even then, it's clear that you won't get to 550 from that, as you clearly have way superior buffs to what I have on my character right now, and you're only at 520. Good luck getting them to 550 like the OP wants. It's impossible to hit that amount of crit on pets constantly unless you can somehow raise the Crit Cap on your summoner to 600.
The issue with items that add to your character crit rate is that the overcap crit is functionally worthless and they won't magically make you start getting credit for overcapped crit. That's one of the big issues with the Summoner class. The scaling and itemization is wretched because of the damage distribution between the Summoner and Pet. At high P.Crit Levels (on the SUMMONER, since some people can't read), I'd focus on P.Atk > Mage Stats, and use Mage-oriented Epics since Melee Epic effects (other than P.Atk and P.Critical, the latter of which is very low weight at high P.Crit levels) do not affect the pets.
Are you not able to get 400+ crit on your pets then?
Never seen you not using your apo bow.
Unless ofc someone else is TrenSummon or TrenSummoner, with that purple tag.
I know the OP, this is how I know he already has 400+ crit rate on his pets.
And I have more than 400 crit rate on my pets using my retri, so why wouldnt everyone else have that?
I said 400 Crit Rate on his summoner, you ingrate.
Learn to read. God, you're such a bad troll. Ignoring you. Bye.
Last I checked, and I may be wrong (please correct me if so), Rose Buff didn't add P.Critical Rate. I'm well aware that Triggers and Procs can momentarily raise the pets' crit levels to absurd levels (I've seen it myself), but that's not what the OP is asking for (he's already getting that in a raid or party). He wants indefinite 550+ P.Critical rate on his pets.
By the time your pets are at 480+ P.Critical you're better off focusing on other buffs. The payout from the crit simply isn't good enough given what you're sacrificing to get it.
Of course, if the number can be bigger, some people assume they just have to have it that way.
That screenshot is severely cropped and really not very useful because it lacks the proper context - most notably showing what temporary buffs/procs are on the Pets.
Crit Cap on Servitors has been that way for a long time and hasn't been nerfed yet. I don't think the Devs think it's a problem largely because the Crit Scaling of Pets is largely kept in check by the Crit Cap on Wynn Summoners being locked at 500. Yes, you can get 570+ by stacking triggers and procs, but you're not going to sustain that for the duration of a raid, for example. Not even close.
Summoner Magic Damage is getting a boost to their magic damage as well next update, so that makes choice to concentrate so hard on Crit and use Melee Weapons even harder to make.
The OP said he wants to have 550+ P.Critical on his pets at all times. Well, good luck with that. And that extra Crit doesn't perform well enough to be worth the gear maneuvering he's currently doing to get it. He could do more overall damage output with a different setup, like using a Retributer instead of the Blunt he's currently using.
Retributer and Blunt are the transfer Pattack the same way, the passive says 2 handed blunt. It does not specify Magic blunt, so I OE'd the highest 2 handed blunt on the market and made it better than the current available gear to my level. So my +9 Blunt [Heath] > +4 R95 Retributer regardless of SA's available > Bow.
And I know that I have stated it before but the blunt is a just for now use thing, I know there are R99 weapons that are better than what I have and will EVENTUALLY be switching to one of them but for now Mine > What is available.
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a4d933b3127cc98d675e4f43a400000010O01IbNGLJy0Zg9 u3G4/cC/f%3D0/ls%3D00304092014620140712173843077.JPG/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/?tn=-1688578283
+9 S80 Blunt
Elegia Light 4 pieces, 1 Sereph Gloves (haven't gotten set done yet)
Zaken/Istina/Bauim/AQ/Frint
Level 2 buffs.
Elemental Link Up
No Forces.
No AP points
No Tranform
+3 STR stew
Turtle Buff
So I am able to add another 12 crit rate to my pets before I max my characters crit rate, putting them at 510(I rounded). With higher level buffs I'm guessing they will be roughly 515-520 with no elemental link, with that 2% chance skill (pfffff) they will be roughly 570-580ish.
If I'm able to get a 2 handed Tauti Blunt I will take off the Elegia and use a +6 R99 set to help make up for the little loss of crit rate from going from 171 > 150.
Which is my point. You're not doing what you want to do without that proc, my pets are already about where yours are without the proc. My point was that you will not be able to get them to a constant 550 crit rate at this point because there aren't enough constant buffs to give them to get them to that amount of sustained crit rate. The only way you can do that, is temporarily through triggers and procs.
Level 4 buffs won't add 20 P.Critical to your pets. You're overestimating the scaling of those buffs. However, they may (or rather, will) gain a few points on top of what the higher buffs add from Synergies and Toggles as well in a party.
Next update you will be able to maintain a higher P.Critical on the pets while in battle, due to the revamped Rage Proc, however the effect will be heavily nerfed compared to now. It won't add as much as it does now.
In the end, gear wont be the thing that makes you do more dmg, but rather playstyle.
Having seen how trensharo and his bow handles 7th stage Kartia 3rd room using lords, I think I just lost whatever faith I had in him knowing just about anything about how to play a summoner.
20 mobs rushing towards your party, single target pets? rofl.
Stop trolling summoner threads pls.
And stop making fun of the OPs 2handed blunt, it adds more dps to his pets than you apo bow does to your pets. Maybe if you had been sure about your bow > all theory, you would have upgraded to a specter bow. Or do you just fail that hard on playing summoner that you cant afford a new weapon, on the most inexpensive pve toon ever?
Which is my point. You're not doing what you want to do without that proc, my pets are already about where yours are without the proc. My point was that you will not be able to get them to a constant 550 crit rate at this point because there aren't enough constant buffs to give them to get them to that amount of sustained crit rate. The only way you can do that, is temporarily through triggers and procs.
So lemme get this straight your saying in your 2nd sentence that you're pets crit rate is about 549 without the proc? With just focus from an Apo Bow. I smell some serious BS here.
And please explain to me how you have 400+ crit rate on you're summoner. Focus weapon, +6 Leggins, Istina Ring +54 crit, ?. I added 171 Crit rate to my summoner with just a Elegia Light Armor set (now Complete BTW) and I noted an almost 1k improvement in damage over my sereph set. And I ran 25 tests with each set to normalize the fluctuations in damage.
All in all with Zaken Transform, my "special" buff, lvl 2 buffs, no proc, no br, no Rose, +3 str stew, +9 S80 health weapon, and elegia I was able to acheive over 25k DPS on The Punch Machine. If my estimations are correct, in full tilt mode, best of the best circumstances, 90-100k DPS is possible with BR, Rose, Lvl 4 Buffs, Navi Transform, and CC up, and prolly higher.
This is with all the same equipment as before. Zaken Transform, CC is up, NO BR, and the "Special Buff". Summons damage is 100k+ per crit, My damage is 150k+ Per hit, Thats some serious punishment with 499 crit rate on pets and 440 on Summoner. Even if it is for a rather short burst duration its still amounts to 2m+ damage in a matter of 10 seconds.
As per your question. Can't really answer it. You said you need a cheap setup but then started listing tauti blunts and rings and etc. So either there's a confusion here or I must be extremely poor if that's considered cheap.
So lemme get this straight your saying in your 2nd sentence that you're pets crit rate is about 549 without the proc? With just focus from an Apo Bow. I smell some serious BS here.
And please explain to me how you have 400+ crit rate on you're summoner. Focus weapon, +6 Leggins, Istina Ring +54 crit, ?. I added 171 Crit rate to my summoner with just a Elegia Light Armor set (now Complete BTW) and I noted an almost 1k improvement in damage over my sereph set. And I ran 25 tests with each set to normalize the fluctuations in damage.
All in all with Zaken Transform, my "special" buff, lvl 2 buffs, no proc, no br, no Rose, +3 str stew, +9 S80 health weapon, and elegia I was able to acheive over 25k DPS on The Punch Machine. If my estimations are correct, in full tilt mode, best of the best circumstances, 90-100k DPS is possible with BR, Rose, Lvl 4 Buffs, Navi Transform, and CC up, and prolly higher.
This is with all the same equipment as before. Zaken Transform, CC is up, NO BR, and the "Special Buff". Summons damage is 100k+ per crit, My damage is 150k+ Per hit, Thats some serious punishment with 499 crit rate on pets and 440 on Summoner. Even if it is for a rather short burst duration its still amounts to 2m+ damage in a matter of 10 seconds.
Where the hell is Ishmilia when you need em.
Reading: Apparently not fundamental.
No, my crit without the proc is about where yours is, and not terribly far behind, and that's without wearing S84 Gear and making a bunch of other changes to force it up that high. It just is, and always is if you itemize properly and doesn't require you to put that much thought into what gear you wear... ... It's not rocket science, and neither is figuring out that you cannot get to a constant 550 P.Critical on the pets given the current buffs in the game - period. At the end of the day, I'm ultimately addressing your question in the OP: It isn't possible.
Screenshot should be obvious (These are my solo buffs):
If I capped my Summoner's Crit Rate, then the pets would go to 510 P.Critical. If I equip an item that gives 50 P.Critical, then I'm basically only getting 22 P.Critical out of it, the rest is wasted. The summoner's ability to produce damage goes beyond their pets, think outside the box. I even removed the Augment on my Weapon, which was 30.1 P.Critical, so that I could use my Aeore's Wynn Dual to PL Dual Subs a while back. With that Augment, I was. That's with *no* transformation and Level 2 Iss Buffs.
In a party, I may gain (on the pets) like maybe 10 P.Critical from Synergies and Toggles (5% from Level 3, 1% from IIRC Tyrr Toggle).
In order to go above that, then I'd need Rage to Proc, because there are no other buffs that add enough to get the pets to 550. Going from Level 2 to level 4 Iss Buffs, you'd be lucky to gain more than 6 or so P.Critical on the pets, since the Summoner is capped and therefore you aren't transferring anything to them (they aren't double dipping).
^ That all puts it in line with the screenshot you linked of your Magnus' having 520 P.Critical. I've already done the math, it's why these things stood out to me like a sore thumb.
So I'll repeat myself... Crit Scaling goes to crap once your pets stop double dipping in Crit Rate Buffs. When you get at or very near that point, there are better stats to invest in than P.Critical.
If you can afford Tauti Blunts and Epics, then you should have two weapons, at the very least, so that you can switch depending on the situation. Contrary to what some trolls on this forum may say, I have both weapons and I do use my Retributer when I'm i.e. AoEing at Cemetary, where my reapers two shot everything and I can basically keep both sides clear.
As for the damage you linked:
1. Nagdu is one of the worse parse targets ever, as he takes disproportionate damage compared to the MOBs around him in EG. Damage on Nagdu is always [noticeably] higher than every other MOB in EG, except maybe those that are even lower level than he is.
2. The Damage Amount is unrelated to the P.Critical rate except for one Caveat, due to your class, which is
3. Your P.Critical Damage is bound to be higher than other Wynn Summoner Sub-Types because you get a buff that increases your pets' P.Critical damage by 15%, which an Arcana Lord and Spectral Master does not get. Spectral Master will eat into that due to the P.Atk debuff, and Arcana Lord with attack speed, but the Crit for Crit Damage of an Elemental Master will always be disproportionately higher due to the buff.
4. Any 95+ Summoner should be able to hig 100k Crits on Nagdu with even Immortal/Requiem Gear and Decent Buffs and Debuffs on him. I routinely hit 150k on him and with Rage up 200k+ Crits are common. Wynn Summoners do not scale with gear nearly as well as other DD classes - the pet damage especially. The only real advantage your pets have over mine is P.Atk, largely because we do not use the same Tat and Accessory setup.
As per your question. Can't really answer it. You said you need a cheap setup but then started listing tauti blunts and rings and etc. So either there's a confusion here or I must be extremely poor if that's considered cheap.
My CURRENT setup is cheap, my furture setup will not be.
Reading: Apparently not fundamental.
It just is, and always is if you itemize properly and doesn't require you to put that much thought into what gear you wear... ... It's not rocket science, and neither is figuring out that you cannot get to a constant 550 P.Critical on the pets given the current buffs in the game - period.
I've gotten to a constant 540 in a party before. And my summoners Crit rate was not capped, so I'm thinking it still is possible or at least VERY close to possible.
If you can afford Tauti Blunts and Epics, then you should have two weapons, at the very least, so that you can switch depending on the situation. Contrary to what some trolls on this forum may say, I have both weapons and I do use my Retributer when I'm i.e. AoEing at Cemetary, where my reapers two shot everything and I can basically keep both sides clear.
2. The Damage Amount is unrelated to the P.Critical rate except for one Caveat, due to your class, which is
Damage is unrealated to crit rate you are correct. I'm not trying to figure out how much damage I can do with one crit alone but increase my crit rate to raise my damage exponentially over time. Same principle when people xp, you go for the best xp over a period of time not which mob gives you the best xp for killing one.
3. Your P.Critical Damage is bound to be higher than other Wynn Summoner Sub-Types because you get a buff that increases your pets' P.Critical damage by 15%, which an Arcana Lord and Spectral Master does not get. Spectral Master will eat into that due to the P.Atk debuff, and Arcana Lord with attack speed, but the Crit for Crit Damage of an Elemental Master will always be disproportionately higher due to the buff.
Arcana Lord damage on crits will be lower than mine by ROUGHLY 15% (95 buff not 99 yet) but an Arcana Lords will only be 7ish% lower than mine due to pattack difference because 15% Pattack does not mean 15% crit damage.
4. Any 95+ Summoner should be able to hig 100k Crits on Nagdu with even Immortal/Requiem Gear and Decent Buffs and Debuffs on him. I routinely hit 150k on him and with Rage up 200k+ Crits are common. Wynn Summoners do not scale with gear nearly as well as other DD classes - the pet damage especially. The only real advantage your pets have over mine is P.Atk, largely because we do not use the same Tat and Accessory setup.
Maybe I forgot to mention this but that damage was 100% solo with 0 debuffs on the mobs becuase I was in transform, so that also means No Rage up as well because I can't toggle it, and no BR.
My pets P Attack is more than yours are? That doesn't make any since since you have a 15% P attack buff and I do not. And your using a R grade bow with 2 times the P attack that my S80 Blunt, almost exactly the same buff set. By your screen shot, your in robes, which is a viable option for summoners I admit, although I have always been the melee DD type of person so I steer clear of the robes.
All in all this is for END game Raid DPS where you bring your A game, Best of the Best, High P Attack + High Crit Rate = Huge DPS. I don't really care about the P Def, I'm not tanking Antharas, Lindvior, or Valakas, but I am dishing out one hell of a punishment.
Wow... I'm floored. You're not level 86, you should know better.
1. My P.Atk is lower because I don't run STR Tats, Accessories, and use STR Pot Buffs, like you do. I'm not sure if 18-21STR makes a factorable difference in P.Atk. Why don't you tell me???
2. Bow P.Atk equivalent to a Retributer of same level. Summoners have a passive that increases P.Atk by 105% if they have a 2H blunt equipped. That means that to match a Bow with 1k P.Atk, you only need a blunt with something like 495 P.Atk, to give an example. The reason for using a Bow over a Retributer is cause the Crit Mod on a Bow is 12 instead of 6 on a Blunt, and Bows can take Focus SA while Blunts generally cannot (2H Blunts/Retributers). It means my character has well over 100 more P.Critical with the bow than with the Retributer, and the bow still has an M.Atk approaching a Low R Grade 1H Mage Weapon so it's a suitable compromise given Summoners don't have many Long-Cast Time spells that are affected by the Casting Speed nerf from using a Bow.
3. I didn't say anything about P.Def. I'm not sure where you're getting that from. You know what they say about Assumptions.
4. There is a cap on how much you can lower MOB defenses so the Iss debuffs on top of my Weakness debuff isn't really that huge of a gain, not what I assume you would think it is. Like I said, the disparity is there because you geared for P.Atk and have a P.Crit Damage debuff. If I went and changed my Tats and Equipped my Light Armor, I'd get a factorable boost in damage as well, from the extra P.Atk.
5. I don't need a dissertation on how the three summoners scale damage-wise. We've already had long discussions about that before. Everyone with a clue knows how they stack up. I mentioned the damage because you're the one who said "look, over 100k!" not me. I'm letting you know, that you can do over 100k damage to that trash mob (which is the worst parse target ever, BTW, screenshots of damage on Nagdu are absolutely trash worthless) in Immortal Robes with a Requiem Retributer and other assorted Low R Grade Event equipment.
You do not get a constant 540 Crit Rate in a group. I really don't have anymore to add to that.
You can wear whatever you want. I'm not paying for your gear. Transformations are going to be a DPS loss next update and that hammer or whatever it is will not be so baller when the update rolls out. Me, I'll just equip my retributer and move on. I think what I've written thus far has been comprehensible and based on sound logic and infaliable mathematics. Good Luck with your future itemization decisions, and conversing with Smittie.
I'm not wasting my Adena on R95 weapons. 1-1.5+B for 500 P.Atk on my pets is not worth it. I rather wait for R99 and use the Adena I save on the way to Enchant Skills, etc. in addition to gearing up. It's called using your funds wisely. If I had bought the weapons I'd already be dealing with a loss of over 1B adena in resale value given how much they cost when I got to 95. Lol. They aren't worth it, not on a Summoner. Even a healer benefits more from the upgrade than a Summoner.
As per your question. Can't really answer it. You said you need a cheap setup but then started listing tauti blunts and rings and etc. So either there's a confusion here or I must be extremely poor if that's considered cheap.
/agree
To OP, if you really want to increase PvE damage end game, make 2 Wynn. Sinking billions into a wynn to get a few more % dps out of it... if you're bringing it to speed along clan raids, you'd get more damage out of 2 "cheap" wynns I believe.
It doesn't matter if you're doing Lindvior or Zellaka. The Health Hammer is bad if you're trying to maximize PvE damage. And as laughable as it is, the Bow actually would do more damage overall than a health hammer. The P.Atk is better and the P.Crit is better.
My health hammer is bad for Pattack yet my pattack is higher than yours with a bow? Okay yes I have STR tats and +3 str fish stew but the difference in 12 STR was only about 1k pattack on pets. So with 15 total + str I'm up what 1.3k Pattack
Reading: Apparently not fundamental.
No, my crit without the proc is about where yours is, and not terribly far behind, and that's without wearing S84 Gear and making a bunch of other changes to force it up that high. It just is, and always is if you itemize properly and doesn't require you to put that much thought into what gear you wear... ...
So from what I see I am itemizing properly, armor +171 crit rate = better than a bow [focus]. OE Bow = low pattack compaired to OE retributer or s80 blunt, decent crit rate but not close to 171.
4. Any 95+ Summoner should be able to hig 100k Crits on Nagdu with even Immortal/Requiem Gear and Decent Buffs and Debuffs on him. I routinely hit 150k on him and with Rage up 200k+ Crits are common. Wynn Summoners do not scale with gear nearly as well as other DD classes - the pet damage especially. The only real advantage your pets have over mine is P.Atk, largely because we do not use the same Tat and Accessory setup.
Please provite me a screenshot of you hitting Nagdu with your SUMMONER for 150k, not your pets, You, And please make it with your bow, no debuffs on mobs, use whatever transform you want. And then when you fail to hit it for that much use BR.
Wow... I'm floored. You're not level 86, you should know better.
2. Bow P.Atk equivalent to a Retributer of same level. Summoners have a passive that increases P.Atk by 105% if they have a 2H blunt equipped. That means that to match a Bow with 1k P.Atk, you only need a blunt with something like 495 P.Atk, to give an example. The reason for using a Bow over a Retributer is cause the Crit Mod on a Bow is 12 instead of 6 on a Blunt, and Bows can take Focus SA while Blunts generally cannot (2H Blunts/Retributers). It means my character has well over 100 more P.Critical with the bow than with the Retributer, and the bow still has an M.Atk approaching a Low R Grade 1H Mage Weapon so it's a suitable compromise given Summoners don't have many Long-Cast Time spells that are affected by the Casting Speed nerf from using a Bow.
What is nerfed with a bow is your attack speed in transform mode, every transform that is, its cut in 1/2. So my 622 P attack Blunt = a 1275 Pattack bow. With R99 and maybe r95 thats not that hard to achive but you still loose the attack speed in transform. While in transform IE Navi, your summoner does about 25-30% of the total DPS of your toons/summons, decent increase, with a bow I'm sure your pattack may be higher (I'm not sure if the 105% Passive works in trans or not, I'll look later) but your attack speed will be under 1k.
The Crit rate of the bow I will agree with you on, No my blunt cannot take focus. I countered that by getting the Elegia set, so my crit rate is WAY higher than using a focus bow all while saving my higher pattack. Casting speed argument is invalid for the reasons you state + I'm talking about being in transform melee style as well so no casting anyways.
3. I didn't say anything about P.Def. I'm not sure where you're getting that from. You know what they say about Assumptions.
Pdef was stated on what I compromised for the Crit Rate, more of a general discussion point.
4. There is a cap on how much you can lower MOB defenses so the Iss debuffs on top of my Weakness debuff isn't really that huge of a gain, not what I assume you would think it is. Like I said, the disparity is there because you geared for P.Atk and have a P.Crit Damage debuff. If I went and changed my Tats and Equipped my Light Armor, I'd get a factorable boost in damage as well, from the extra P.Atk.
50% Pdef debuff is the max yes. I do not have a P.Crit Damage debuff its a buff. But I knew what you meant.
5. I don't need a dissertation on how the three summoners scale damage-wise. We've already had long discussions about that before. Everyone with a clue knows how they stack up. I mentioned the damage because you're the one who said "look, over 100k!" not me. I'm letting you know, that you can do over 100k damage to that trash mob (which is the worst parse target ever, BTW, screenshots of damage on Nagdu are absolutely trash worthless) in Immortal Robes with a Requiem Retributer and other assorted Low R Grade Event equipment.
Lemme know where to send the Immo robes and Requiem Retributer so that you can test this theory, because like I said, the mob had 0 debuffs on it. Test it please, and screenshots when you get it.
You can wear whatever you want. I'm not paying for your gear. Transformations are going to be a DPS loss next update and that hammer or whatever it is will not be so baller when the update rolls out. Me, I'll just equip my retributer and move on. I think what I've written thus far has been comprehensible and based on sound logic and infaliable mathematics. Good Luck with your future itemization decisions, and conversing with Smittie.
I'm not wasting my Adena on R95 weapons. 1-1.5+B for 500 P.Atk on my pets is not worth it. I rather wait for R99 and use the Adena I save on the way to Enchant Skills, etc. in addition to gearing up. It's called using your funds wisely. If I had bought the weapons I'd already be dealing with a loss of over 1B adena in resale value given how much they cost when I got to 95. Lol. They aren't worth it, not on a Summoner. Even a healer benefits more from the upgrade than a Summoner.
Can you provide a link for the Transform info, I have yet to find anything about that one powerwiki or rochand. I know that they are comming out so that summons take advantage of PvP/PvE stuff but thats not the next update but the one after that.
I use my funds more wisely than most people I know. Doing raids with my ally and talking with other summoners, most of them have 2-4k more pattack than I due, mostly because NcCoin Buffs and 99 gear or 15% P Attack Racial Skill, but non of them come close to my crit rate, I can only think of 1 person in my ally who uses a bow and its because it is a +12 Blessed Specter (Also Shares with his main).
As far as the hammer goes, yes I understand that it might not be great in the next update (Its also for my 80 titan sub as well as the Elegia), hence why I was asking opinions on future gear, IE 99 stuff.
I didn't waist my adena on R95 either, Leather Set I got in a trade deal with my heavy from my main, Blunt I got cheap and OE'd myself, Elegia I think I paid 600-700 Mil for the set along with some trades of some of my old gear I didn't use anymore.
I agree with you, even though you didn't directly say it, but yes a summoner is the least gear dependent toon in the game right now, but also on the other hand with the right gear and play style it is the highest consistent DPS toon, there are others that do higher burst damage yes, but summoner is the most consistent.
Okay so any other constructive stuff to add? AP points choices, Sub Skills, Augments other than the Giants LS augs because those are ridiculously expensive, anything else I'm missing?
To OP, if you really want to increase PvE damage end game, make 2 Wynn. Sinking billions into a wynn to get a few more % dps out of it... if you're bringing it to speed along clan raids, you'd get more damage out of 2 "cheap" wynns I believe.
There are some raids that only allow a certain amount of people in CC, IE Epic Tauti and Earth Wyrm, so maximizing one toons DPS is key.
Most of the Gear I have on my summoner can also be used for my main/sub so its duel purpose.
The few more % DPS is debatable, in personal testing with the physical punch machine my base DPS was roughly 5.5k, with me "squeezing" out a few more DPS I was able to achieve well over 80k DPS, With just a few buff alterations (not BR) and a transform damage increases very quickly.
Yup I get it punch machine is not the "ideal" target for this either.
1. I can't get CC off it.
2. I can't debuff it.
3. Limited Time for DPS Measurement, Increases damage variations.
But doing 20+ runs under each circumstance you normalize the differences in damage and can come to a fairly safe conclusion.
It has come to my attention that some ppl have a very hard time making money in this game. I guess this could lead to some non-optimal itemizations. But please, dont pass those itemizations on as sound advice for ppl trying to achieve best dps.
Ppl will end up laughing at you. And your apo bows.
It has come to my attention that some ppl have a very hard time making money in this game. I guess this could lead to some non-optimal itemizations. But please, dont pass those itemizations on as sound advice for ppl trying to achieve best dps.
Ppl will end up laughing at you. And your apo bows.
I would be very interested to see if a Wynn with 100b invested into it could out-dps 2 Wynn with 5-10b invested each. The problem with Wynn is that they don't scale up like other classes. They start strong, but epics and such boost the summoner more than the summons. There is a point of diminishing returns is what I am saying, and it is a valid point as you all design your dream Wynns. Oh, and post this super-Wynn when you build it, since this is such a super-serious and totally realistic plan.
I would be very interested to see if a Wynn with 100b invested into it could out-dps 2 Wynn with 5-10b invested each. The problem with Wynn is that they don't scale up like other classes. They start strong, but epics and such boost the summoner more than the summons. There is a point of diminishing returns is what I am saying, and it is a valid point as you all design your dream Wynns. Oh, and post this super-Wynn when you build it, since this is such a super-serious and totally realistic plan.
I understand were you are comming from saying that Two Standard Wynns > Epic Wynn, and I get it. This is more to think of every possible way to boost one summoner so that people playing one can pick pieces of what they want and can afford to help themselves and their clans boost the DPS. I in no way plan on spending 100B on this toon 15-20B is reasonable to assume but also things will be transferring from my main to help as well so the cost will be highly debatable. As for cost factor EVERY Summoner can double its DPS for 100k for 30 minutes by using a transform.
The diminishing returns is a valid point and has already been proven with the critical rate. When the summoner reaches max and is no longer able to transfer Critical Rate to its pets via servitor share, those are diminished returns However in this case being in transform the Epics and such that are put on the summoner, because now the summoner has become a Melee DD are more apparent in the DPS of the Summoner itself, not just the summons. I'm looking for ways to help maximize both, summons and transformed summoner DPS.
The reason for the boost of one toon over bringing 2 was stated earlier, some instances only allow 35 toons in so maximizing the individual toons is more important because more cannot be brought in. Like Epic Tauti, this is the main raid that I speak of, I bet there are only 1 maybe 2 clans that can take this thing down per server right now, its the time factor/DPS that is important.
I would be very interested to see if a Wynn with 100b invested into it could out-dps 2 Wynn with 5-10b invested each. The problem with Wynn is that they don't scale up like other classes. They start strong, but epics and such boost the summoner more than the summons. There is a point of diminishing returns is what I am saying, and it is a valid point as you all design your dream Wynns. Oh, and post this super-Wynn when you build it, since this is such a super-serious and totally realistic plan.
The comment might have not been for you, but rathe someone who believes apo bows are the correct itemization for a wynn.
This person is able to equip specter bow without penalty, but sticks with apo bow. Must be some secret with the apo bow.
And KissThis is building the wynn you speak of. I play mine with mediocre gear. Not as mediocre as an apo bow, but no spectacular gear either, stuff anyone can get.
...
There is so much double talk in this post that it isn't even funny.
I didn't say anything about your P.Atk on your Weapon or character being bad or low. I simply stated that your P.Atk is not lower than mine by any appreciable level on the weapon because:
1. Your P.Atk is more than doubled if you use a 2H blunt, which means
2. You only need a weapon with about 500 P.Atk to get your P.Atk as high as I do with a 1k P.Atk bow
^- Fact. Your S80 is OE'd (+8?) and since I went and looked at the P.Atk on S80 blunts, I'm pretty sure you're rocking at least Apoc Retributer level P.Atk on that weapon, which means your P.Atk is going to be higher than mine, especially with +15 STR added to your character (and P.Atk bonuses from your Light Armor).
Secondly, I never said anything about P.Def. Don't attribute what was discussed and then use it as a means to disagree with me, when I didn't say it. If I didn't say it, I don't want to hear it :-) Your P.Critical is lower than me and your servitors P.Critical is lower than my servitors even with your Elegia gear. I posted the screenshot already, I was giving you more credit because it's been a while since I had actually looked at those stats on my gear, since they are high enough to the point that they are forgettable to me (I don't put in any effort to improve them further, since the benefit of that is too low for me to care about it).
Thirdly, summoners are wearing Immortal/Requiem gear and hitting crits that hard on the MOBs there. If I can hit 140-150k crits with my gear, I'm more than sure a summoner in low R gear can see 100k crits with that gear - the only thing different between a retributer and a bow is the Crit Rate. A Requiem Retributer gives a Summoner better P.Atk than if they used equivalently enchanted Requiem Thrower. Light Armor does not add enough P.Atk to the pets to matter - I know for a fact. If I put on my Retributer, I'd actually crit HARDER than with my bow. I use the bow because I keep the higher P.Critical Rate with similar (but lower) P.Atk levels, which more than makes up for the difference in P.Atk and gives me a higher damage output. The damage does not scale so heavily that the difference in P.Atk would drop them below the 100k mark on Nagdu, when I am hitting upwards of 150k if they throw Mark of Weakness on him, especially with Counter Critical procs which are up like 60-70% of the time when using melee pets on him.
Fourth, next update the Rage Nuke gets a Power Increase and the Proc becomes a 100% Proc that stacks up to 5x (IIRC), which means to maintain it you must be nuking, constantly. It's basically part of your DPS that requires you to be active and use your actual summoner's skills. It will be like the proc on the Feoh's Elemental Nuke (the Attribute Defense debuff), except way more critical to your output than it is to theirs.
If you go into Transformation, then you will only gain as much P.Atk as the trigger probably gives your pets, but you will lose all of the P.Critical damage and P.Critical Rate that the trigger gives your pets. It's going to be a solid DPS loss to XP or Raid in Transformation once the update goes live, and using a melee weapon is going to be a DPS loss on the Summoner end because your nukes will not hit as hard (and with multiple summoners in a raid, and full debuffs on the raid, you should be retrieving your marks anyways, since they it Out DPSes the DoTs and the debuffs add no rDPS).
Which is another reason why focusing so heavily on the pets without even giving thought to anything else is a bad idea, IMHO. M.Atk, M.Critical, M.Crit Damage are all going to rank higher on the Stat Scaling for summoners next update than they do now, because you will be doing more Magic Damage that isn't just DoTs. This means that when you get Epics and you have to decide whether you want to go Warrior (for the P.Atk, etc.) or Wizard (for the M.Crit/Crit Dmg/etc.), that will be something you have to take into consideration (especially as you look towards the future with Ability Points, etc. at 99).
I went back and reread this forum knowing some of the things that I know now and have further questions.
BR doesn't add Crit Rate, and you have to show buffs. I have 500 Crit Rate on my Summoner right now but because I have solo buffs (level 2 Iss Buffs) they only have 482 P.Critical. I cannot add anymore Crit to my pets through gear or P.Critical to my character... The only other way they can get more Crit is via buffs (Higher Level Iss Buffs, WS Buff adds crit to Melee pets, Synergy Buffs and Toggles).
If you have 500 crit rate on your summoner but only 482 on your pets why is it that I have 463 on my summoner but 499 on my pets with the same buffs? Racial Difference or pet base crit rate difference? IDK I'm -dex on my toon which I haven't really kept up on the Tat differences but last time I checked that was Physical Crit Rate, or did that one get changed to STR?
Reading: Apparently not fundamental.
It's not rocket science, and neither is figuring out that you cannot get to a constant 550 P.Critical on the pets given the current buffs in the game - period. At the end of the day, I'm ultimately addressing your question in the OP: It isn't possible.
In order to go above that, then I'd need Rage to Proc, because there are no other buffs that add enough to get the pets to 550. Going from Level 2 to level 4 Iss Buffs, you'd be lucky to gain more than 6 or so P.Critical on the pets, since the Summoner is capped and therefore you aren't transferring anything to them (they aren't double dipping).
These statements I would like to point out are now false, there are buffs in the game that will put your pets at a constant 550+ crit rate, I have done it now but because you refuse to open your eyes to new and OLD buffs, I'll just leave you with my pets new constant crit rate. 599.
Thirdly, summoners are wearing Immortal/Requiem gear and hitting crits that hard on the MOBs there. If I can hit 140-150k crits with my gear, I'm more than sure a summoner in low R gear can see 100k crits with that gear - the only thing different between a retributer and a bow is the Crit Rate. A Requiem Retributer gives a Summoner better P.Atk than if they used equivalently enchanted Requiem Thrower. Light Armor does not add enough P.Atk to the pets to matter - I know for a fact. If I put on my Retributer, I'd actually crit HARDER than with my bow. I use the bow because I keep the higher P.Critical Rate with similar (but lower) P.Atk levels, which more than makes up for the difference in P.Atk and gives me a higher damage output. The damage does not scale so heavily that the difference in P.Atk would drop them below the 100k mark on Nagdu, when I am hitting upwards of 150k if they throw Mark of Weakness on him, especially with Counter Critical procs which are up like 60-70% of the time when using melee pets on him.
I don't think I have ever seen a Summoner in EG with Immo/Requiem gear outside of a bot train so your number I couldn't verify.
One little thing that you might not know here is the crit damage scaling of different weapons. While bows do crit 2x damage as well as giving Appropriate crit rate due to SA Blunts work better at crit damage. I don't know the exact numbers but since Lindvior came out 2 handed Blunts critical damage are higher than most other weapons, they are not 2x like most of the other ones but much higher. I don't have GM powers to test the exact amount but I can tell you for a fact that its more than 2x the damage irregardless of buffs/debuffs.
Fourth, next update the Rage Nuke gets a Power Increase and the Proc becomes a 100% Proc that stacks up to 5x (IIRC), which means to maintain it you must be nuking, constantly. It's basically part of your DPS that requires you to be active and use your actual summoner's skills. It will be like the proc on the Feoh's Elemental Nuke (the Attribute Defense debuff), except way more critical to your output than it is to theirs.
Yes and I know about the 100% proc rate on the new buff however the stats even at its highest level are not going to be even close to what they are now. I don't remember exactly what they were but IIRC they are less than 1/2 of the current proc. While good that its 100% Proc, I'm not convinced that it would be able to out damage a summoner in Transform, that one would have to be tested.
Which is another reason why focusing so heavily on the pets without even giving thought to anything else is a bad idea, IMHO. M.Atk, M.Critical, M.Crit Damage are all going to rank higher on the Stat Scaling for summoners next update than they do now, because you will be doing more Magic Damage that isn't just DoTs. This means that when you get Epics and you have to decide whether you want to go Warrior (for the P.Atk, etc.) or Wizard (for the M.Crit/Crit Dmg/etc.), that will be something you have to take into consideration (especially as you look towards the future with Ability Points, etc. at 99).
Again patch notes that I haven't read or found yet, please provide a link.
^- Fact. Your S80 is OE'd (+8?) and since I went and looked at the P.Atk on S80 blunts, I'm pretty sure you're rocking at least Apoc Retributer level P.Atk on that weapon, which means your P.Atk is going to be higher than mine, especially with +15 STR added to your character (and P.Atk bonuses from your Light Armor).
+9 and it's Pattack is equal to a +0 R99 Retributer. 622 Pattack
+15% P.Atk, +30% P.Critical (Base P.Critical of Pets is 142 so that's +42.6 P.Critical), +15% P.Crit Damage
As for the weapon, that's exactly my point.
Sure, you have a 599 Constant Crit rate on your pets :-P
And my pets have 504 P.Critical, solo buffed (it's higher in a party, obviously). Did you seriously fail to read the text in the image I embedded in the post upthread?
Even if you did have 599 Constant Crit on the pets, it's a complete waste of item budget to have that much, especially with the changes coming in < 2 weeks.
+15% P.Atk, +30% P.Critical (Base P.Critical of Pets is 142 so that's +42.6 P.Critical), +15% P.Crit Damage
As for the weapon, that's exactly my point.
Sure, you have a 599 Constant Crit rate on your pets :-P
And my pets have 504 P.Critical, solo buffed (it's higher in a party, obviously). Did you seriously fail to read the text in the image I embedded in the post upthread?
Even if you did have 599 Constant Crit on the pets, it's a complete waste of item budget to have that much, especially with the changes coming in < 2 weeks.
1. Yup found out the buff thing, I'll test it in 2 weeks to see if Buff>Transform.
2. You said ditch the hammer, its got the same Pattack as a R99 +0. Just stating that 2 made 2 contradictory statements about my blunt. First saying it doesn't maximize damage, then saying its good.
3. 599 constant, you don't have to believe it, just like I don't believe an Apoc Bow > a Retributer in any situation either, the choice is yours. (I've tested it now)
4. Read yes, just generally not open to peoples pessimism.
5. And this is the part that I guess explaining 10 times just doesn't cut it so lemme BARNEY style it for you. Apo Bow = 100% garbage. I'm not saying my setup is perfect, but its was a fun little experiment that actually worked out for the better in 90% of the cases except Pdef reduction. I have lost 0 stats other than than that, gained a hell of a lot of DPS, lost very little time in the testing, and actually gained over 500M in this little endeavor.
In 2 weeks, Winter is Coming. I get it change is inevitable, I'll adapt and over come when it does, in the mean time I have a fun new armor set, a crazy looking weapon and a goal for the future. I bet even in the update my setup still remains fairly strong, if it doesn't, oh well no harm done.
Now, on with the discussion.
Is there any special things I should think about for Duel Class Skill, AP points, Sub skills or something else I missed to maximize all around DPS?
Well if you insist on making this super PVE summoner I would dump most resources into P.atk and anything else (attack speed, crit rate) is secondary. There's even summoners on russian innova that run around with 2-hand tauti blunts with zaken scrolls.
Is it worth it? Hell no. But you know that already. You're just having fun with your project and that's A-ok.
Yeah the P.atk is going to be something different, I would very much like to have a Tauti 2 handed blunt for play with, but alas I would rather not afford one, even though eventually I probably could. I'm looking at trying to get a +4 to +7 PVE R99 retributer because sometime in the not so near future the 15% damage is going to be able to transfer to pets, that should help boost it. A +7 Blessed/Dark/Bloody Retributer has more P.Atk than a 2 handed tauti anyways.
Attack speed on the other hand is another matter all together. Only 10% is shared through servitor share so that one is a harder to boost without dedicated buffs like BR that take effect on both the master and summons. Boosting the Summoner in this case wouldn't do much good. If I added 1k attack speed 100 would transfer, but I think melee Pets attack speed is close to 1200 anyways which is already pretty decent.
Since I have the critical rate that I was going for now its time to work on the p.atk, and getting 99... lol
I saw someone asking about str and summon damage, i ddint do the test but i had (in the time, now one still in 87 the other 99) a wynn kamael elemental summoner and a elf elemental summoner.
On pve the Kamael at lvl 85 did the same damage as the elf at 87 (i changed the gear from one to another). I didnt lvl the kamael because is good for pve, but landed low crits on marks for pve (yea i had the hope they will make a better wynn for pvp in the future, a hope crushed for all the updates haha)
The mobs you are showing the damage are really weak. The skill that trigger rage for my test landed more on rb than normal mobs (not a lot but more). In normal mobs i saw the skill triger only 2-3% of time or less. On rbs it spawn more than that, more close to 6%. Dont ask me why, idk, but i saw it, now i dont care because on etheria the skill change, trigger all time with 5 stages and the max increase on patak/crit damage is 15% i think, need to see the patch notes.
I keep reading about maximize the damage of the wynn spending lots of adena for epics rbs. My advice, just do the rbs with ppl that now what to do, that maximice the debuff on the raidboss for damage (having a feoh soultaker on the cc for gloom, a othel for critical wound) and you will save LOTS of adena, do amazing damage to the Rbs with less stats than yours and have a litle fun playing.
I saw a wynn with tauti 2h blunt and his damage is really good, but he didnt buy that weapon for the wynn, he did it for another class where is worth to expend adena. Is really good against rbs without dark element resistance because of the 450 attribute attack
About the crit rate of summons, i saw it 618 on my wynn to, but is hard to say that it work like it should (hard to keep trace of how many crits the summons do, and seeing that in feoh the mcrit rate stuck at 32% maybe on summons have a limit to in practice). I think anything close to 500 is good because most of the time your summons will do criticals.
And again to maximize damage on raids/epics just be smart on what class your party have. Allways have a othel for crit wound (and the really high dps), if you want get a feoh soultaker for gloom, and if you can enter with iss box for extra rhaps better, and cheaper
I have noticed this as well as far as the trigger rate on mobs. It's nearly impossible to trigger on open field mobs but when I do Epic Istina/Octavis it tends to proc about 2-3 times more often, and not just in one case either I have noticed this over the last few months. But its going to different now so it doesn't matter much anymore.
The issue with this is we have all the correct classes, we have the Dagger for Crit wound, we have the soul taker for Gloom, we have 1 tyrr for Armor destruction, tank for Shield charge, and the list goes on we don't bring in anything more than 2 nukers, 1-2 tyrrs 1-2 Daggers, a few archers and the rest is summoners, last raid I think we had 12 summoners in CC.
Raids like Epic Tauti cannot be taken lightly. My clan/ally does normal tauti in less than 20 minutes, Epic Istina in less than 9 minutes, But epic tauti, I think we got it to roughly 40% HP, or whenever the healers spawn. The issue is even when we bring the best of the best of what we have becuase we are limited to 5 parties we need to make our best better. Thats the whole reason for this thread, is to gather ideas on how to improve damage on the main DD's, the summoners. I know archers and daggers are good in this raid as well, but lets face it, summoners have overall more sustained damage over time than the burst damage of an Archer.
I'm not specifically buying the Tauti for my Duel class either, My main is a Tyrr so It could also be used on that, although not as helpful because I'm a Dreadnought. It's not all about the attack element either, 450 is great but I would have to guess that Tauti would have 300 elemental resist for everything, so the damage is mitigated. Its a HUGE Pattack on that blunt as well. I think in order to match it with a retributer you would have to get a +6 blessed if I remember correctly. Being a 2 handed blunt 105% transfer so its the same as using a retributer +++.
Crit rate on the summons is working as expected. :) I noticed WAY more crits going from mid 400 crit rate to going to 599 constant. Turn on your Crit Text in the options menu, you'll know what I'm talking about.
About debuff, i dont know if i am wrong but i think the max reduction you can do in pdef/mdef on a mob is 50%, so if you have a iss on pt and for example a healer you get all the reduction you need on pdef.
The stuff that one must take into account is the debuff that increase crit damage, decrease resist. I dont know if is worth to have armor destruction, maybe another wynn/othel in the spot of tyr, if the tyr ofc is not really well geared.
On the healers stage all the healers in the cc must sleep the healers that spawn and in case of fail the iss must petry. that is the way i did it when i played in a big clan, still that was months ago so maybe i am mixing boss. But if i am not mistaken just keep healer in sleep/binding/petri and nobody use skill that can awake them and you should be ok. ( I only did it 2 times, because i only wanted to have the 2 botles for improved haha)
In regards to the gear costs of a Tauti 2 hand blunt... You aren't talking that much in comparison to any other epic geared class. How much is Tauti ring earth warm ring bless anthy values and bless Zakens? Then still needing a weapon for classes like dagger or archer or anything. So the ~20BIL u spend on the Tauti weapon doesn't seem so high anymore.
In regards to the gear costs of a Tauti 2 hand blunt... You aren't talking that much in comparison to any other epic geared class. How much is Tauti ring earth warm ring bless anthy values and bless Zakens? Then still needing a weapon for classes like dagger or archer or anything. So the ~20BIL u spend on the Tauti weapon doesn't seem so high anymore.
This is true, because the having the 100b Crit Damage Rings don't do me very much good so dumping everything into a weapon would be a more viable option
if this was my main.