Anyone messed with any alternative pvp setups endgame on healer? IE not all AP/Dual skills into HP with Health weapon and Robes? I'm wondering how light works, but don't have a comparable robe setup or adena to compare alternatives.
I know HP setup and robes makes sense, but I'm looking for a way to be able to outheal damage and get out of range rather than just soak more. In pvp Healer is basically just like a squishy tank that doesn't want aggro but gets it anyway.
Currently I run about 6k p.def/8.2k m.def with equivalent of a +6 eternal robe set (but with better bonuses), have dual skills for HP, sub skills p,mdef/mcrit/cspeed and when 99 will have enough AP for +22% hp from those skills. P.def mask, pvp def belt etc.
I can take a decent amount of damage, but still a 1 shot vs any decent toons, AP will only delay it to a 2-shot.
I'm wondering if any alternative setup actually works, will AP past HP change much? (I know dark armor will help, but I don't have that kind of $$$).
for pve, my +8 twilight light set works fine, but its only pve. for pvp, and if I dont heal myself or use skills, it took a nuker from FS 8 attacks to kill me...so it might have potential depending on your gear. my cast speed was like 1780 with no wit dies or bonuses...just a rudolph.
As crazy as it sounds I am still rolling around in Heavy on my healer (Tyrr Main).
I use a +7 Seraph Hvy set and with lv.4 Iss Buffs, Rose, no Daring, Armor Maintenance, Iron, and pdef acc I have slightly more than 10k pdef with knights, 7k with Wiz (roughly). MDef takes a hit though; I usually only have between 5-6k but I also have crappy jewels. I only have 2 AP on healer but I have all dual class skills into HP. I have around 45k HP with this setup (acumen weap).
Because I am a dwarf (absolute lowest base wit of any class) and I use heavy I simply can't use an HP weap. I barely hit max cast speed in wizard and in knights I have around 1750.
I know a +7 Robe set would be better but I don't want to make a new set so w/e. Also the +7 Hvy bonus is simply OP. I NEVER run out of MP; PvP or PvE and the crit reduction from OE hvy does make a difference.
MP regen of +6 heavy is awesome, I tend to keep a +6 immo set in my inventory for that reason. It's been transferred to my ISS now though since it only ever is needed for occasional single party raids. +8 light does sound interesting, but the bonuses suck and no crit reduce like +4 robe top. :(
I've never been a fan of knights though to be honest, the Mcrit rate and re-use are essential for keeping people alive. Even a HP weapon loses quite a lot from healing power compared to a retributer or buster, but it's benefits outweigh the negatives.
Currently I'm 50% from 99 so have 0 AP, 3 dual class skills for HP, a +7/8 seraph robe set, HP weapon and I have ~42k HP with standard buffs+rose.
I wonder what +6 Eternal Heavy or Light would be like compared to Robe? When AP kicks in the 5k HP from passives won't make that much of an impact. Though with my terrible WIT as an Orc I'll struggle for cast speed with an HP weapon, even at +20 WIT orso when all dyes/items are taken into account.
I dont really see the reason to play in light unless it is +8 set. I do believe that robe set is better than light (except condition mentioned before).
In light with HP weapon you will need 15 WIT dyes and other cast affecting items (longing, pendant, rudolf, etc etc etc) because without daring you will not be on 1999 cast speed. You should be around 1850 (+-) in full buff without daring. I am not sure now if it is with or without rudolf.
I dont really see the reason to play in light unless it is +8 set. I do believe that robe set is better than light (except condition mentioned before).
In light with HP weapon you will need 15 WIT dyes and other cast affecting items (longing, pendant, rudolf, etc etc etc) because without daring you will not be on 1999 cast speed. You should be around 1850 (+-) in full buff without daring. I am not sure now if it is with or without rudolf.
You're pretty spot on with the cast speed in robes with HP weapon I have about 1970/1820 no daring +15 WIT.
The idea would be a +8 light set if any. The main thing about heavy and light is the higher base p.def from the main part and pants (helm/boot/glove is the same for all), this stacks with buffs, whilst the passive boosts don't. Light will allow you to keep the passive m.def and hp boost, heavy will just give p.def.
There will be a breakpoint somewhere where the ++ p.def from robe passives is far outweighed by the ++ p.def from base armour stats and bonuses. That's why I was always in heavy pre-glory days and had a nightmare re-gearing myself when I came back in Etheria.
As I said earlier going the HP route makes complete sense, but it does nerf healing power quite a bit and only protects burst damage, not sustained damage. This is where defense/crit resist come in.
Party wise using a +4 Apoc HP weapon compared to a +4 R95 Retributer loses about 500/1k a heal/crit, which is quite a lot when added up. I don't really have the budget for a spare +8 or higher Bloody cutter, lol. On the self healing side though Progressive heal would be boosted from HP, healing %%% of a much higher base HP, but without good p/m.def it's harder to out-heal sustained attack.
Dont worry blueeyes, when you get to the lvl where you will need to gear correctly, you will already have learned how to do it.
Learning comes from experimentation and failure.... it's a hell of a lot more efficient and cheaper to let other people fail for you than to do all the failing yourself. :P
Back in GoD "Common knowledge" was that healers should all wear robes... I questioned that, researched, tested and wore heavy, that was the best setup for healers until Glory Days....
I've tested R95 robes vs heavy vs light, but it'd cost a stupdily high amount to test that in R99+6 or higher and test different AP paths.
How do these healers get to 99 and wanna do pvp without even having a clue about how to gear?
because FB and many other web page are full with this tape of advertise ...
WTS healer EE lvl 99 / dual feoh Storm Screamer lvl 91
all skills +7 or more
And NCFail not care for any black market and punishment to ppl who make that ...
They get money from server transfer and name change, not care if you have in pt 99/99 char who not know how to enter in SOH or where is Baylor...
Dont worry blueeyes, when you get to the lvl where you will need to gear correctly, you will already have learned how to do it.
Well...I was reacting on what MartelX said.
Everybody can say: doesn't matter what you wear on healer as long as you can keep your pdef/mdef/hp/cast speed high.
It is the same as: doesn't matter what study you had as long as you are the CEO of an international company.
Everyone knows that knowledge must come from somewhere, nobody is born with ton of knowledge.
How do these healers get to 99 and wanna do pvp without even having a clue about how to gear?
If that's aimed at me then I don't know what the hell you're on about.
Asking if people have tested alternative setups has nothing to do with knowing what most people do. It's about getting the optimal setup possible rather than just assuming everything everyone else says is correct.
I came back to the game about 6 weeks ago after a 2 year break, read up on all the patch notes I'd missed, checked the gear... Yeah it's easy to just follow what 'common knowledge' is and wear robes, do cast/p.def/m.crit on sub skills, put all dual skills into HP, put AP into HP and use a ++Cutter in PvP.
Any idiot can blindly follow the norm, it is often the best way to go, but how can you tell unless you try the alternatives.
There's far too many people about who just read passives and stats, take one setup without testing alternatives then go talking like the know it all....
One good example is all these people banging on about how you MUST have 1999 cast speed. Last time I tested it the only difference between 1999 and 1500 cast on the slowest casting skills (recharge/group heal) was 0.3s per cast, common use skill cast had a negligible difference. "Common Knowledge" would have people piling dyes into WIT if they had anything less than 1999 cast when in practise for any cast speed 1800+ Con would probably work better for them (with full HP setup).
To be honest when I've got enough adena, none of this will matter.... ++Dark Robe set > all. For now my ++Seraph >>> +6 Standard Eternal.
I know how to gear my healer for pvp, my clan has ton of wars, but I'm still wondering: are there better alternative setups?
One thing I am sure about: shorter skills reuse time is very important on pvp.
After all it's about purge, purge more, purge harder on pvp :-)
but to get 2nd healer or even iss who no get attack of panic in PVP situation is pure lucky :)
Just finding a second healer seems lucky these days. I've not had a 2nd healer in party since I got back (apart from one leeching in an AOE grp) it's horrible. :P
If that's aimed at me then I don't know what the hell you're on about.
Asking if people have tested alternative setups has nothing to do with knowing what most people do. It's about getting the optimal setup possible rather than just assuming everything everyone else says is correct.
I came back to the game about 6 weeks ago after a 2 year break, read up on all the patch notes I'd missed, checked the gear... Yeah it's easy to just follow what 'common knowledge' is and wear robes, do cast/p.def/m.crit on sub skills, put all dual skills into HP, put AP into HP and use a ++Cutter in PvP.
Any idiot can blindly follow the norm, it is often the best way to go, but how can you tell unless you try the alternatives.
There's far too many people about who just read passives and stats, take one setup without testing alternatives then go talking like the know it all....
One good example is all these people banging on about how you MUST have 1999 cast speed. Last time I tested it the only difference between 1999 and 1500 cast on the slowest casting skills (recharge/group heal) was 0.3s per cast, common use skill cast had a negligible difference. "Common Knowledge" would have people piling dyes into WIT if they had anything less than 1999 cast when in practise for any cast speed 1800+ Con would probably work better for them (with full HP setup).
To be honest when I've got enough adena, none of this will matter.... ++Dark Robe set > all. For now my ++Seraph >>> +6 Standard Eternal.
If you think I called you a botter, you are a moron.
But no, ofc ppl want to try different setups. And guess what? Most probably have done so, in your absence. Sometimes the most logical way, is the optimal one as well.
Why do you assume noone tested anything else? There are ppl out there who pvped every day while you were gone, why would they wanna run around in non-optimal gear?
I applaud you for doing your research, but sometimes, just sometimes, ppl are already doing it right.
If you think I called you a botter, you are a moron.
But no, ofc ppl want to try different setups. And guess what? Most probably have done so, in your absence. Sometimes the most logical way, is the optimal one as well.
Why do you assume noone tested anything else? There are ppl out there who pvped every day while you were gone, why would they wanna run around in non-optimal gear?
I applaud you for doing your research, but sometimes, just sometimes, ppl are already doing it right.
How do I assume no ones tested anything and people aren't getting it right? If assumed that then I wouldn't be on here asking what their results were, lol.
To be honest the more I look into it the more everything points to needing a +6 or higher Dark Robe set (maybe I'll afford it in 2 years).
Blueeyes:
there is no alternative set up.
a) nobody wears heavy because set bonuses from robe and light cannot be beaten
b) nobody uses light unless it is +8 set because robe bonuses are simply better
c) most of PvP healers wear HP weapon. Those who dont have so strong enemies can wear acu weapon
d) cast speed matters. 0,3 s is pretty long time to get skill interrupted. Skill interrupted in wrong moment means that the party can be wipped. Therefor I would go to WIT dyes for light set. For robe you can use CON dyes but I think the benefit of CON dyes is marginal.
Blueeyes:
there is no alternative set up.
a) nobody wears heavy because set bonuses from robe and light cannot be beaten
b) nobody uses light unless it is +8 set because robe bonuses are simply better
c) most of PvP healers wear HP weapon. Those who dont have so strong enemies can wear acu weapon
d) cast speed matters. 0,3 s is pretty long time to get skill interrupted. Skill interrupted in wrong moment means that the party can be wipped. Therefor I would go to WIT dyes for light set. For robe you can use CON dyes but I think the benefit of CON dyes is marginal.
What else do you want to know?
Well...my healer uses robe with R99 Cutter Health. She has max casting speed, skill reuse time is -35%, decent HP and pdef/mdef.
And she is doing well on pvp. Despite all the knowledge I have, I am open-minded for any other alternative set up.
That is why I am interested in Ferine's question about alternative set up.
Your anwsers are very helpful. Thanks you for your constructive answers, contrary to others who posted here for their own post count.
Blueeyes:
there is no alternative set up.
a) nobody wears heavy because set bonuses from robe and light cannot be beaten
b) nobody uses light unless it is +8 set because robe bonuses are simply better
c) most of PvP healers wear HP weapon. Those who dont have so strong enemies can wear acu weapon
d) cast speed matters. 0,3 s is pretty long time to get skill interrupted. Skill interrupted in wrong moment means that the party can be wipped. Therefor I would go to WIT dyes for light set. For robe you can use CON dyes but I think the benefit of CON dyes is marginal.
What else do you want to know?
Thanks, a bit more constructive than others.
On the cast speed thing I did say it was only recharge/brilliant heal that takes the 0.3s hit, not really skills that save your butt in heated pvp. The rest of skills are like < 100ms difference with 1500 vs 1999 cast speed. Most of it is just psychological since your toon animates faster. I'd still recommend at least 1750+ cast though.
With full AP, HP weapon and buffs I hear +1 CON can be about 800 HP making +15 a 12,000 HP difference, which is quite a lot. I can't confirm or deny that yet though.
I think I've found a good alternative to the standard +p.def/+C.speed/+m.crit from sub skills though... I just need to test properly then weigh up what to drop out of c.speed and p.def, probably gonna drop the 4% c.speed.
All depends on ur play style,ur budget and eventually who u are fighting(top clans,mid clans and so on.)
Best for a huge budget healer should be something like:
Pvp robe set+7 or+(hp bonus after +7 is 5k),Pve weapon(buster,caster or even retri should do the work 15% more hp,cp,mp,A bloody cuter will also give u another 25% hp).Jewels theres a lot of factors and all can use different types depending on what u want stack ie stun,mental or w/e.
For a mid healer any robe set+7 would do the work(have better stats than stdr eternal+6),hp weapon r95 or better ++ is a good call aswell.Jewels at ur choise.
Ap build is all about ur gear and ur goals. I dont regreat my Built atm : http://oi59.tinypic.com/qoh8py.jpg
A friend got this : http://oi62.tinypic.com/21kyty0.jpg
Side note hes on knight,with santa blessing and daring no pve weapon at all.
What do you mean by "Pve weapon(buster,caster or even retri should do the work 15% more hp,cp,mp,A bloody cuter will also give u another 25% hp)"?
I always thought that a bloody (or dark) cutter is a pvp weapon, you use it on pvp. And other buster/caster/retri are pve weapons, you use them while hunting mobs/raids.
In other words, I do not understand you well, please enlighten me.
I recognise only Valliant buff scroll, what are other 2 buffs you had on?
What do you mean by "Pve weapon(buster,caster or even retri should do the work 15% more hp,cp,mp,A bloody cuter will also give u another 25% hp)"?
I always thought that a bloody (or dark) cutter is a pvp weapon, you use it on pvp. And other buster/caster/retri are pve weapons, you use them while hunting mobs/raids.
In other words, I do not understand you well, please enlighten me.
I recognise only Valliant buff scroll, what are other 2 buffs you had on?
The difference for a healer on pve/pvp weapon is 0(outside of oly) cuz the hp,mp,cp bonus should be the same(higher m attack aswell) so having a mage weapon pve will give u the cast/mana,m attack and the bonus from pve option making u losing only 10% hp if u compare it with cutter hp.
Valiant,weaver agathion,fish stew.
P.def/M.def etc I guess is your gear, but **** your CON/WIT etc are high!
ATM I've got a WIT Eyepatch (usually use p.def, but was testing to see which bracelet to get), +1 all stat Agathion, +7 Maphyr and +7/8 Seraph Robe set for +3 WIT and still 20 off your CON, 6 off your WIT with +15 WIT.
I know the WIT is due to me being an Orc, but I'd still be 10 off your CON even with Castle Cloak, +5 Dye and Stew. At the minute only having +10 WIT (plus eyepath or bracelet) I'd only have 1600 cast with PvP buffs (Wiz, no Daring, HP weapon).
I'll probably have to keep +15 WIT with no CON dye until at least 99 dual and 8 AP into HP, where CON will make a bigger difference. :(