I was just wondering where the mass influx of Adena has come from on the servers (Chronos at least).
I've been logging in to sell in AH for months now, not playing... but in the past week or so the markets have gone insane.
Prices of almost everything have doubled, Dark stones up for 500m to 1.5b, +8 armor from 2-3b a piece to 4-7b a piece, Kelbim weapons doubled, normal weapons doubled... Venir 13 from 2b to 3.6b, basically all prices are through the roof.
Now people are buying and selling with the alien event but that doesn't add adena to the economy, it just moves it from one person to the other...
I've managed to make just over 40b in 2 days compared to 10b in a month.
Something is wrong for sure...tons of billions came from nowhere in chronos..or was hidden in bot toons which buying nc coins with adena...nc coin price is at least x2 now, highest price ever!
There are many reasons contributing prices going up.
1. Kelbim, Tauti, shadow weapons got the damage upgraded since the new 'underground' update, making them more powerful than ever before.
2. Some people were anticipating the release of new higher level gears than R99 with the update but that didn't happen. So the current R99 prices are going up again. Notice almost no1 is selling Bloody or Dark weapons now except a couple of ridiculous priced ones?
3. Major Ncoin spenders are kind of ******-off now with the Update and also after what they did with Maphr's scrolls. We've spent hundreds or Thousands of $$$ for Exp runes and maphr's scrolls(Carrot event) just so that we could reach LvL 99 faster. K95 Duo used to give 10B exp with Destinty pack 100% Exp rune + Vitality maintenance potion + 30% Exp potion + 200% Maphr's scrolls...
Now you can get the same Exp without any boost in a FULL PARTY K95! Not even DUO! They got rid of the Maphr's scrolls, just so that they can sell more vitality stuff and Runes with 11x Kartia Exp + 11 x Baylor Exp event.
What took Major Ncoin spenders Months to achieve, now you can do the same in 1 week. I had almost 1,000 Maphr's scrolls and they were gone, now I am buying Freya Scrolls for 20 Million Adena each...and you know what's funny? We know Freya event is coming after Halloween...
Conclusion? NC don't really care even for people who spend Thousands of dollars a month. If I was in charge of the Update, I probably would've included a reward for people who reached 99+ before the update and gave them something like Free +1 level Scroll as an achievement reward before the update.
Notice the lack of people selling Event items for Adena? That's cuz we Ncoiners are not buying Ncoins at the moment. Just ****** off...
4. Logging into different accounts are just a pain in the A S S now.
I, myself, have 8 accounts. Mainly because I have an ambition to play all 35 classes of Lineage2 for the full experience and I also enjoy duo or Trio box
Play. Since the update, I've abandoned 5 accounts simply because it's too much of a hassle to verify my email accounts every single time!
Ncoin spenders are serious HardCore Lineage2 enthusiasts and many of them enjoy Box play. Why can't we have multiple L2 game accounts under 1 single Email account? It will be so much convenient to verify once with 1 email account for all 8 x L2 accounts.
Prices are high cuz people with Ncoins and Gears are not logging in and they are not selling any stuff at the moment.
There are many reasons contributing prices going up.
1. Kelbim, Tauti, shadow weapons got the damage upgraded since the new 'underground' update, making them more powerful than ever before.
2. Some people were anticipating the release of new higher level gears than R99 with the update but that didn't happen. So the current R99 prices are going up again. Notice almost no1 is selling Bloody or Dark weapons now except a couple of ridiculous priced ones?
3. Major Ncoin spenders are kind of ******-off now with the Update and also after what they did with Maphr's scrolls. We've spent hundreds or Thousands of $$$ for Exp runes and maphr's scrolls(Carrot event) just so that we could reach LvL 99 faster. K95 Duo used to give 10B exp with Destinty pack 100% Exp rune + Vitality maintenance potion + 30% Exp potion + 200% Maphr's scrolls...
Now you can get the same Exp without any boost in a FULL PARTY K95! Not even DUO! They got rid of the Maphr's scrolls, just so that they can sell more vitality stuff and Runes with 11x Kartia Exp + 11 x Baylor Exp event.
What took Major Ncoin spenders Months to achieve, now you can do the same in 1 week. I had almost 1,000 Maphr's scrolls and they were gone, now I am buying Freya Scrolls for 20 Million Adena each...and you know what's funny? We know Freya event is coming after Halloween...
Conclusion? NC don't really care even for people who spend Thousands of dollars a month. If I was in charge of the Update, I probably would've included a reward for people who reached 99+ before the update and gave them something like Free +1 level Scroll as an achievement reward before the update.
Notice the lack of people selling Event items for Adena? That's cuz we Ncoiners are not buying Ncoins at the moment. Just ****** off...
4. Logging into different accounts are just a pain in the A S S now.
I, myself, have 8 accounts. Mainly because I have an ambition to play all 35 classes of Lineage2 for the full experience and I also enjoy duo or Trio box
Play. Since the update, I've abandoned 5 accounts simply because it's too much of a hassle to verify my email accounts every single time!
Ncoin spenders are serious HardCore Lineage2 enthusiasts and many of them enjoy Box play. Why can't we have multiple L2 game accounts under 1 single Email account? It will be so much convenient to verify once with 1 email account for all 8 x L2 accounts.
Prices are high cuz people with Ncoins and Gears are not logging in and they are not selling any stuff at the moment.
There are many reasons contributing prices going up.
Major Ncoin spenders
Major Ncoin spenders
people who spend Thousands of dollars a month
we Ncoiners are not buying Ncoins at the moment
Ncoin spenders are serious HardCore Lineage2 enthusiasts
Your tub-th|umping is pathetic and irrelevant as usual.
No matter how many NCoins you buy, this will not generate a single adena.
When you sell your NCoin items for adena it just means the adena (most likely, farmed by bots) changes hands yet its amount remains the same.
The abnormality of the current situation is not about the prices, it's about the fact the market is actually booming, i.e. some people are actually buying everything in bulks.
At the moment I've sold out all the junk I've been storing in wh for almost 10 years. You can talk about overpriced Dark/Bloody weapons, but how would you explain the fact that even A-grade enchant armor scrolls (the ones that you couldn't sell for 100k each because nobody needed them at all, just a month ago) now instantly sell for 500k?
So, it looks like an abnormal influx of adena is occuring, and some players are buying everything like there's no tomorrow.
I have a guess that may explain a little fragment of this puzzle:
Since the last update there is an option to trade your Daily coins for the scrolls of blessing (it takes thousands of coins and lots of regular enchant scrolls). I guess some people have found the way of collecting infinite numbers of daily coins, so now they are buying EAR to turn them in and then create tons of blessed gear.
I have another theory. It has to do with bot masters leaving this game. Since the email verification with each account log in started, I've noticed the disappearance of bots. I happened to level a toon for lvl 40-85 right after the update and to my surprise, I saw No bots in 'Wall of Argos,' No bots in 'Dragon Valley' and No bots at 'Altar of Evil!'
I think Bot masters got sick and tired of Logging in their every single toon(probably most of them didn't even bother to write down the password for email accounts hence forever lost) So, they are buying whatever they can and have as much fun as possible before leaving this game I think. For good OE stuff, probably selling them VIA amazon.com or Ebay.
Or I have another theory but I'd rather not talk about it here in detail....
Someone with infinite adena is buying stuff with the intention of not selling them back....A BLACK HOLE in the system....a conspiracy theory really... and I hope this is not the case. But if this is true then...all the Adena we have will become useless in the end...cuz there will be practically no gear to buy...Only Nstore shopping...in the end....
Funny, how they made an announcement this eve that the lottery system was disabled and a few hours before that the major factors were bragging in hero shout how they had an excess of 100b+! EXPLOIT.... BOOMMM!
Funny, how they made an announcement this eve that the lottery system was disabled and a few hours before that the major factors were bragging in hero shout how they had an excess of 100b+! EXPLOIT.... BOOMMM!
And players have shops up buying 40,000 monster research books for 650,000 a pop.
And players have shops up buying 40,000 monster research books for 650,000 a pop.
Yup! I kept wondering about that. Usually the third day of an event things settle down and buy shop prices drop. Not this time! As a matter of fact they kept going up, not down!
The thing I'm wondering about now is what's gonna happen.....
Many people have bought/sold items legitimately at market rate, any number of those transactions could now involve the exploited adena. The adena many players have earned is 100% legit as far as selling items at market rate is concerned, it's not their fault who bought it.
People have also been opening event items, adding items to the market. Personally I got a mystic soul crystal, which I sold (for what seems to be too cheap)... that was legitimate win and sale. Would that be destroyed even though I spent hard NCoin on it?
Now the extra adena needs to go, any enchanted/destroyed items need to come back into the market, but legitimate players shouldn't lose out....
The thing I'm wondering about now is what's gonna happen.....
Many people have bought/sold items legitimately at market rate, any number of those transactions could now involve the exploited adena. The adena many players have earned is 100% legit as far as selling items at market rate is concerned, it's not their fault who bought it.
People have also been opening event items, adding items to the market. Personally I got a mystic soul crystal, which I sold (for what seems to be too cheap)... that was legitimate win and sale. Would that be destroyed even though I spent hard NCoin on it?
Now the extra adena needs to go, any enchanted/destroyed items need to come back into the market, but legitimate players shouldn't lose out....
I wonder what'll happen.
Everything in the market economy is in Supply VS Demand relationship. I don't know if it's proper to make this analogy but in the case of L2, I think it's Adena vs items in the server that get to decide the market price.
As long as Adena inflation = item inflation, prices should remain the same.
Last similar event "Carrot" event is a good example. People bought carrots like crazy cuz it had good item drops like Tauti, Kelbim, Soul bottles...etc. but as we all know..it didn't do anything to increase the adena amount in the server. So, what happened next? Item prices just crashed. Tauti and Kelbim all used to be around 15B but after the event people where selling them at around 5B-9B. And I think this is why we have not as many Ncoiners participating in the event like they did during the "Carrot" event.
They expected to sell their Kelbim Dagger for over 10B but near the end they had to sell it for far less... like 3.5B for Kelbim Single dagger(the lowest I've seen)
To be honest, I don't know exactly why there is so much adena Influx in the server, only speculations, but I don't think it's really a bad thing after all....It will stabilize the prices. As long as Total adena in the server = Total items in the server, and they maintain the balance, the L2 market economy should remain healthy. Even after a lot of people have what they need, as long as there is an illusion of good investment, there still will be good item buy-and-sell activities happening. I have my suspicions on who's behind all this..But I am not gonna say it here.
It all start by baning main characters by GM's, ppl are scared for play so they keep mass quiting game, trying cash out items, and not sell them at AH beacuse price for adena is very low, like 40% less than 4 months ago, so for get same amount by sell X items, you need ask for double adena price...
About ncoins, nobody buying them, most of donators quited game. If low ppl buying ncoins automatic price for them is very high.
Ncsoft already see it all on their $ statistics from events, they lose 50% earning from events after their stupidy restrictions and baning main characters.
Bartz, magmeld, shilen, totally dead, there is maybe 20-30 members each server with gear and trying buy some items from l2store. The rest players transfering to chronos only for cash out.
Till ncsoft stop with they dumb politics and remove all restrictions, and ppl will back to game, nothing will change and soon prices for items by adena will be 2-3x more...
Also many ppl lost items by last launcher update, is less items, and the one what left on server, ppl asking high price for work out.
- All I know is that I never seen so people bragging about the 99+ Billion adena in world chat, and they were even linking their adena in world chat. There were SEVERAL people doing this.
- I never seen people offering to buy NC coins for 700,000-800,000 adena per ncoin, while the regular price has been 300,000-400,000 adena per ncoin. There were few selling for 250,000.
- I never seen so many people with golden armor running around (+8 full sets). You used to know who had a +8 set because they were few. But now, I have seen countless people with +8 sets. With that said.......
- They were several items in the auction hall that were there for weeks or even months that did not sell or the price was too high (dark/bloody weapons and armor). Most of them are gone now. There was 2 weapon enchant R scrolls 100% success for 5B adena each that were there for at least 3 months. It seems they will never sell, but they are gone too.
- I went to the monster race track with a clannie to test new enchanted skills in the arena, and they were a lot of people in the MRT playing lottery. But I never put 1 + 1 to find out what was going on.
*** By the way, this is in Chronos server**
Anyway, damage is done. I am sure people that "exploited" this bought top gear, top weapons. That explains why almost all enchanted and dark gear is gone from the Auction Hall, and why I see dozen of people with golden armor sets. Players started buying and people raised the price all the way up. I'll dare to say all the prices in the AH went up by at least x3 in average.
It is going to be hard to track down every single one that took advantage of this.
A roll back is going to be hard because a lot of people bought NCoins with this event. I, myself, spent few bucks buying passes from L2 WH to take advantage of this event.
If they rollback the game, then NCSoft needs to deal with people that spent buying ncoins - that is another headache.
I am a veteran player that returned to game about a year ago. I remember when I was in Devianne server back then, people found an "exploit" to enchant weapons. Same, people started bragging about their +15, +16 weapons. I think that was when the Kamael update came for the first time (not sure if some veteran player remembers that). NCsoft did an investigation and banned people. I remember Sace was the new GM/moderator back then.
I am not sure what is the "correct procedure here" now.
It all start by baning main characters by GM's, ppl are scared for play so they keep mass quiting game ...
Ncsoft already see it all on their $ statistics from events, they lose 50% earning from events after their stupidy restrictions and baning main characters.
Bartz, magmeld, shilen, totally dead, there is maybe 20-30 members each server with gear and trying buy some items from l2store. The rest players transfering to chronos only for cash out.
Till ncsoft stop with they dumb politics ...
Oh, I don't know. On Naia I suddenly see a lot of old Teon names again. Word seems to have gotten around that cheaters got banned and that the bots have vanished from the Wall of Argos. A clean gaming environment does attract players.
Insofar it would be good if the people who seemingly found a trick to generate adena had their accounts deleted, and above all the names be published. Executions must be public, blood must visibly flow, so that the law-abiding citizens can see that justice has been done.
Pretty sure most bots quit long time ago since its not profitable to even bot here anymore rofl. Probably nova cashed out and left diegovergas w/o a job
- people found an "exploit" to enchant weapons. Same, people started bragging about their +15, +16 weapons. NCsoft did an investigation and banned people.
Since the latest known enchant-related h4cks was done by the GM-protected clan (Renovatio), NCsoft did not ban anyone, just deleted the overenchanted weapons.
The cheaters then got pretty brazen as they realized the extent of their impunity, and only when they ventured way too far NCsoft finally banned a couple of them... a few years later.
Sace, the retired community manager, was personally responsible for glorifying and advertizing the biggest cheater of all times (banned in the end).
I guess the rest of the cheating crew got the message: "cheat smarter!"
I am not sure what is the "correct procedure here" now.
Same as usual: they will close the disposable accounts directly associated with the exploit and let the actual exploiters (i.e. those with trillions worth of end-game gear) be.
Juji, can you give us more info on whats going to happen next?
If the extra adena gets out of Chronos via transfers next wednsday it could corrupt all other servers so we would appreciate a close resolution on this issue.
@Juji players just saw their adena count reduced to 0 after selling their gear for outrageous prices, and their gear was NOT returned.
My question is: how is anyone supposed to know that the adena they are receiving in a trade are a product of an exploit?
I don't see how this situation can be salvaged at this point, other than restoring a database backup. I really hope you have a disaster recovery plan, and that the players won't suffer for your mistakes.
Pretty sure most bots quit long time ago since its not profitable to even bot here anymore rofl. Probably nova cashed out and left diegovergas w/o a job
@Juji players just saw their adena count reduced to 0 after selling their gear for outrageous prices, and their gear was NOT returned.
My question is: how is anyone supposed to know that the adena they are receiving in a trade are a product of an exploit?
I don't see how this situation can be salvaged at this point, other than restoring a database backup. I really hope you have a disaster recovery plan, and that the players won't suffer for your mistakes.
i was looking for rollback but i find this really funny :D
i was looking for rollback but i find this really funny :D
Better recalibrate your humor, this aint funny.
Lets say you own a Lindvior earring, trying to sell it for months. You then get an offer you can't refuse, lets say 90b, and you make the trade. 20 hours later, all adena are removed from your account, and the Lindvior is gone.
I just don't see the fun in it, wouldn't wish this to an enemy.
PS. I personally didn't lose anything. The above statement is an example to prove a point that should be self explanatory to anyone with half a brain.
so, this event gave out nice rewards, probably most people sold those items, and now they risk to have 0 adena and no item? cool story ncwest.
Anyway, if i recall right, we had an other money exploit long time ago, about fishing (can't really remember about what exactly was) and as far as i remember, they just banned the chars that used this exploit, but i dont remember anything about adena used for buy items.
Maybe someone remember better than me?
I sold my pair of +16 B. apoc dual daggers and now I don't have my money neither my daggers , dafuq? Not only that, all of my money was taken away (literally Im at 0) not only the amount I sold my weapon for. :confused: :mad:
Ticket was made right after I noticed a few hrs ago and hoping for an answer soon.
not only ppl figured out how to dupe infinite amount of adena (at least on chrono). Looks like all epics can now be duped - large amounts of anthars and valaks are on sale in ah and street, pushing price to just 3, 4 billion adena.
my pets only have 20 fingers!
i have a lot more comments, but i think i will just keep those to myself.
1. L2 has been around for years without any proven method of getting rid of adena, as you have in real world economies. As a consequence, we've all become adena horders in our own way. (What would be a good adena sink? Buffs. Eliminate Awakened buffing classes and set up NPC buffers that charge for daily buffs. Heck, the NPC could sell Daily Buff runes for R, R95 and R99 grades for all I care, but do something to get rid of all of the excess adena in the game.)
2. Player greed + emotional "gotta have it now" ignorant consumer base = capitalism run amok. When I realized that people are happily paying premium prices for items without questioning why, I tripled -- and in some cases quadrupled -- the prices of everything that I put in the AH. What do you know, other sellers are marking up their goods as well... and people are still paying those high *** prices. The consumer base needs to get some cajones and force sellers to lower prices...by not buying. Let the market correct itself.
3. Accelerant: an event with high reward rates, which encourages everyone to empty their coffers (i.e., reason #1) either to buy the event items, or prizes from the event. Note: we've had 4 events over the last few months of this nature. Want to slow down the market? Make events like this more infrequent.
4. The L2 Underground Update increased the number of consumers in the market, some old, some new. Between the two we see the impact of #1, plus the added factors of non-sanctioned RMT (i.e., illegal adena buyers), and sanctioned RMT (which is buying NCoin and then converting that NCoin into adena either by buying L2 store/event items and selling them for adena, or selling the NCoin to other market players directly).
No matter how you shake it, the current market crisis was unavoidable...and absolutely predictable.
It's not that epics are being duped it's the event that is popping them out pretty fast. I've spent probably 40b on this event and I've already received
B Zaken x2
Earth Worm Ring
Lindvior
Valakas x2
Antharas x3
Already under investigation. Will post an update shortly.
I definitely noticed something was up over the course of the week, same as Ferine. The market was going insane. I kept asking in Clan Chat "where is all this adena coming from", and everyone just said "people are selling NCOIN". I said, ok, but where is the ADENA coming from?
This is going to be so hard to investigate/resolve. I think economy might be completely crushed for casual/lowbie players. Their 100 million that they saved up after X years is now worth 10 million. How do you trace this? Money laundering is very complicated, and to trace it you will need hours of manual labor per incident . People seem to think you can just run a db query like "select exploiters from transactions" but, I can't imagine it being anywhere near that simple. Lets use the below example:
Alt Player X exploits lotto, gets 99 billion. (owned by really player Z, but no connection)
Player A buys ncoin, wins an insanity talisman, sells it for 99 billion in AH (yes this happened)
Alt player X buys the talisman then mails it to alt Y. Alt Y sells it to honest player B in sell shop for 50 billion. Alt Y buys +16 dark weapon in AH from honest player C for 45 billion. Alt Y puts it in AH for 5 billion and real player Z buys it immediately, the original exploiter. Alt Y tranfers rest of adena to some other alt, who buys NCOIN off of honest player D and gifts items to player Z.
This is a SIMPLIFIED scenario, and already it is hard to trace, and you have three "innocent" parties involved profiting. to restore above situation. GM would have to roll back like 6 transactions and technically "screw over" a few innocents. That will take hours of effort and testing, and it is only for one real transaction!
I think long story short, the economy is completely ***** :( I personally picked up an epic at about 25% of market rate in AH this week, and I feel pretty sure I stumbled into above scenario and am in possession of "stolen property". IRL police would just take my epic from me, and I would never get my money back unless they caught the person and then I would have to sue. (know someone this happened to buying a fake title stolen car on craigslist)
Yes something is wrong i been asking in clan etc and people saying its players buying ncoin and selling for adena, but were does these billions of adena come from and why is ncoin 1bil per on chronos and people paying that for like 4k coin at a time?
Hello! Yesterday, i was online with my toon "6PaTBa" and i had about 50m in my bag and 3bi 443m in wherehouse. I was in aden when i got Critical Error. 2-3 hours after i logged into game again and the adena (about 50m) that i had on my bag disappeared and disappeared 400m my wharehouse.
No one has my password. I never bet on lotteries in the game. I think it's a bug, because if it were a stealing would have stolen my whole adena. The fact is that disappeared 450m of my toon in total.
I hope this fact is resolved as quickly as possible, it is a very annoying situation.
Technically we (players) don't "own" anything in game. It's all property of NC, and we "use" it. We buy Ncoin to purchase items which are "services", meaning we use them then they're gone. So they could just wipe the whole **** game...adena...items...w/e and there ain't a thing we can do about it. But as for all this adena.....IDK and IDC, I never have much anyways. lol
I just recieved an answer to my ticket, adressing my account name with an email I dont even know or recognize or its even related to me, WTF? something must be wrong with L2´s accounts database and we are getting ripped off big time.
Ive never even changed my email adress in my acct since I created it and also I just get a response about terms of use and a link to them saying I violated them and that is all ? there is no explanation of anything about my inicial problem.
@Juji players just saw their adena count reduced to 0 after selling their gear for outrageous prices, and their gear was NOT returned.
My question is: how is anyone supposed to know that the adena they are receiving in a trade are a product of an exploit?
I don't see how this situation can be salvaged at this point, other than restoring a database backup. I really hope you have a disaster recovery plan, and that the players won't suffer for your mistakes.
Free cat buff for everyone! Also 30 day shadow gear!
It's not that epics are being duped it's the event that is popping them out pretty fast. I've spent probably 40b on this event and I've already received
B Zaken x2
Earth Worm Ring
Lindvior
Valakas x2
Antharas x3
as well as numerous other nice items.
Exactly. I won a Zaken and an Antharas so far after spending about $150 USD on ncoins to buy the event items. It probably means that at some point there will be new Boss jewels, making these relatively obsolete.
Now if only they'd have an event that dropped Infinity weapons. I like the look!
Free cat buff for everyone! Also 30 day shadow gear!
If there is truly something fishy going on, then they'll have to do much more than cat buffs and shadow gear... like a month of 500% vitality with 30-day Vitality maintenance pots for all.
All jokes aside, like someone else said, if someone hacked the system and started churning out fake adena... or fake event awards ... fixing it will tick off the innocent more than it will the guilty. Pretty much anyone that bought or sold anything since last week's update is benefiting the fruit from the poisoned tree. Scary. This really did turn into a Halloween event, eh?
@Juji players just saw their adena count reduced to 0 after selling their gear for outrageous prices, and their gear was NOT returned.
My question is: how is anyone supposed to know that the adena they are receiving in a trade are a product of an exploit?
I don't see how this situation can be salvaged at this point, other than restoring a database backup. I really hope you have a disaster recovery plan, and that the players won't suffer for your mistakes.
Here's a sit rep in case anyone is interested, NCWest partially restored the gear that was traded in at least one occasion.
So, the adena was not returned, but one of the original items that was traded was returned.
Here's a sit rep in case anyone is interested, NCWest partially restored the gear that was traded in at least one occasion.
So, the adena was not returned, but one of the original items that was traded was returned.
Yes, I got my weapon I sold that got me into this headache of a problem, but since I got all the adena erased it also erased the adena I already had with me... im back to 0 ZERO :confused: :( it could be worse I know, having no weapon and no money, but I need the money to do anything here
Yes, I got my weapon I sold that got me into this headache of a problem, but since I got all the adena erased it also erased the adena I already had with me... im back to 0 ZERO :confused: :( it could be worse I know, having no weapon and no money, but I need the money to do anything here
Most people I know are in a similar situation...
This is totally unheard of, I'm playing for 11 years now, never again have I witnessed NCWest deleting stuff from player accounts to clean up their own mess. At a very minimum I would expect an announcement regarding what's going on, who is to blame, how the database will be restored and what will prevent this from happening again in future. Instead people are logging in their accounts seeing 11 years of work has vanished, thinking they got scammed and what not. Some, issue support tickets, scared to death, and the support team partially restores their losses. To be honest, I'm not sure if that's a good thing or bad thing?
I expect a level of professionalism, you're running a business here gentlemen.
Exactly. I won a Zaken and an Antharas so far after spending about $150 USD on ncoins to buy the event items. It probably means that at some point there will be new Boss jewels, making these relatively obsolete.
This is totally unheard of, I'm playing for 11 years now, never again have I witnessed NCWest deleting stuff from player accounts to clean up their own mess. At a very minimum I would expect an announcement regarding what's going on, who is to blame, how the database will be restored and what will prevent this from happening again in future. Instead people are logging in their accounts seeing 11 years of work has vanished, thinking they got scammed and what not. Some, issue support tickets, scared to death, and the support team partially restores their losses. To be honest, I'm not sure if that's a good thing or bad thing?
I expect a level of professionalism, you're running a business here gentlemen.
Absolutely, I Still have my hopes I can get my previous Adena back, im not asking for anything extraordinary, just what I rightiously own.
The first guy who answered my ticket was completely rude and unhelpful in any way, even adressed my account with an email I dont even recognize as mine or related to me, not even trying to help at all, but I also have to say GM Raphael attended my case and he really was helpful and willing to do something about my case, +1 for him and im grateful for that.
Any word Juji about this? what actions are going to be made for the affected parts?
At a very minimum I would expect an announcement regarding what's going on, who is to blame, how the database will be restored and what will prevent this from happening again in future.
I definitely want to know who is responsible for these shenanigans so that I can blacklist them, their shops and their entire clan, if perma-bans haven't already been levied. I'd also like sa***uards imposed immediately. Granted, I wasn't one of the people affected, but I am very active in the market. Hell, I log on for months sometimes and don't even XP or PVP, just play the market. This can't happen again -- ever.
who ever discovered or took advantage of this exploit really messed up the economy by cleaning out the auction house with duped adena now items are worth 2/3 times its regular amount if theyre even there.
i thought the server was just getting richer but no way almost everyone even noobs are walking around with 20~100b adena some with r95 sets
As far as I know, most of the exploiters are already banned.
The real responsibility however, lies with the NCWest team, which didn't detect, patch or even report the exploit in the first place.
Moreover, I'd probably go ahead and say that a full rollback would have been the lesser of two evils. Let me explain:
Rolling back the server database to the date that the exploit was introduced would cause a loss for all players in many levels: XP, Adena, gear etc; but the balance of the server will be maintained, nobody would end up with a massive benefit or loss from this exploit. I guess that's a big no-no, since it would require the reimbursement of all NCoin spent during that period.
Instead NCWest decided to patch this manually, much like applying a Band-Aid on a 3rd degree burn victim. First they deleted (some of?) the exploited adena, even if it changed hands through legitimate trades (!!!). Then they waited for us to send (thousands of) support tickets, leading to a manual investigation of each case. I'll go out on a limb here and say mistakes will be made in this process, like.. A LOT. I'm confident people will end up losing not 1 week's xp, or yesterday's drop - but their entire 11 year fortunes.
I'm honestly dumbfounded, as a Lineage2 player but mostly as a software engineer.
Looking forward to some miracle to make sense of all this.
As far as I know, most of the exploiters are already banned.
The real responsibility however, lies with the NCWest team, which didn't detect, patch or even report the exploit in the first place.
Moreover, I'd probably go ahead and say that a full rollback would have been the lesser of two evils. Let me explain:
Rolling back the server database to the date that the exploit was introduced would cause a loss for all players in many levels: XP, Adena, gear etc; but the balance of the server will be maintained, nobody would end up with a massive benefit or loss from this exploit. I guess that's a big no-no, since it would require the reimbursement of all NCoin spent during that period.
Instead NCWest decided to patch this manually, much like applying a Band-Aid on a 3rd degree burn victim. First they deleted (some of?) the exploited adena, even if it changed hands through legitimate trades (!!!). Then they waited for us to send (thousands of) support tickets, leading to a manual investigation of each case. I'll go out on a limb here and say mistakes will be made in this process, like.. A LOT. I'm confident people will end up losing not 1 week's xp, or yesterday's drop - but their entire 11 year fortunes.
I'm honestly dumbfounded, as a Lineage2 player but mostly as a software engineer.
Looking forward to some miracle to make sense of all this.
I must say its a bit amusing seeing you talk about exploits and fairness. I have seen your videos, when did you do a 180?
The truth here also is, that not only the adena bug users destroyed the market, but also ppl who sold their items for crazy prices trying to make huge profit, by increasing the prices of all items in chronos and nc coin price too, such chances on items value aint coming from nowhere, some ppl already knew what was going on and was trying to earn as much as possible adena, so at least be happy for getting ur items back.
As far as I know, most of the exploiters are already banned.
The real responsibility however, lies with the NCWest team, which didn't detect, patch or even report the exploit in the first place.
Moreover, I'd probably go ahead and say that a full rollback would have been the lesser of two evils. Let me explain:
Rolling back the server database to the date that the exploit was introduced would cause a loss for all players in many levels: XP, Adena, gear etc; but the balance of the server will be maintained, nobody would end up with a massive benefit or loss from this exploit. I guess that's a big no-no, since it would require the reimbursement of all NCoin spent during that period.
Instead NCWest decided to patch this manually, much like applying a Band-Aid on a 3rd degree burn victim. First they deleted (some of?) the exploited adena, even if it changed hands through legitimate trades (!!!). Then they waited for us to send (thousands of) support tickets, leading to a manual investigation of each case. I'll go out on a limb here and say mistakes will be made in this process, like.. A LOT. I'm confident people will end up losing not 1 week's xp, or yesterday's drop - but their entire 11 year fortunes.
I'm honestly dumbfounded, as a Lineage2 player but mostly as a software engineer.
Looking forward to some miracle to make sense of all this.
Good luck putting that evil genii back in the bottle. Rolling back the servers means that they would ultimately have to refund everyone's NCoin purchases for the past week. If they failed to do that, Paypal and/or everyone's credit card issuer would have a field day of their own raiding NCSoft's coffers. I'm pretty sure if there is a fix, it will be one that doesn't affect their revenues.
The reality is, though, that there simply is no way to make everyone whole again. Let's say I used the proceeds from the sale of one of the Boss Jewels that I was awarded, plus a Heavenly Scroll and 3 DEWR that I owned previously to help make a +15 R95 Bow. I then sold that weapon for an obscene amount of adena. If we assume that the persons who bought my Boss Jewel and the +15 R95 bow were all using duped adena, then rolling back the server would theoretically wipe out my profits and restore either Ncoin or the unopened event bottles to my account -- not to mention the Hero coins for the Heavenly scroll -- but there is no guaranty that I'll have the same luck opening the bottles to receive a Boss jewel. (In fact, I just opened another 100 event bottles this morning and didn't win anything above a Spectrum Stormer in value.) Further, rolling back certainly doesn't assure me that I'll be able to enchant a +15 R95 bow again, no matter how many DEWRs they give me. In short, I'd be screwed in a way that would probably make me walk away from the game for a long, long time. Now imagine that en masse.
Good luck putting that evil genii back in the bottle. Rolling back the servers means that they would ultimately have to refund everyone's NCoin purchases for the past week. If they failed to do that, Paypal and/or everyone's credit card issuer would have a field day of their own raiding NCSoft's coffers. I'm pretty sure if there is a fix, it will be one that doesn't affect their revenues.
The reality is, though, that there simply is no way to make everyone whole again. Let's say I used the proceeds from the sale of one of the Boss Jewels that I was awarded, plus a Heavenly Scroll and 3 DEWR that I owned previously to help make a +15 R95 Bow. I then sold that weapon for an obscene amount of adena. If we assume that the persons who bought my Boss Jewel and the +15 R95 bow were all using duped adena, then rolling back the server would theoretically wipe out my profits and restore either Ncoin or the unopened event bottles to my account -- not to mention the Hero coins for the Heavenly scroll -- but there is no guaranty that I'll have the same luck opening the bottles to receive a Boss jewel. (In fact, I just opened another 100 event bottles this morning and didn't win anything above a Spectrum Stormer in value.) Further, rolling back certainly doesn't assure me that I'll be able to enchant a +15 R95 bow again, no matter how many DEWRs they give me. In short, I'd be screwed in a way that would probably make me walk away from the game for a long, long time. Now imagine that en masse.
Lets say the adena dupping never happened, you actually spent 17.5b aprox (chronos prices before dupping) in 3 DEWR and 1 Heavenly scroll for a weapon that can be sold for 17.5-20b tops?
Those items are for getting a +15 bloody and / or Dark weapon, not specter lol
Lets say the adena dupping never happened, you actually spent 17.5b aprox (chronos prices before dupping) in 3 DEWR and 1 Heavenly scroll for a weapon that can be sold for 17.5-20b tops?
Those items are for getting a +15 bloody and / or Dark weapon, not specter lol
The hypothetical still stands, although granted, the model assumes not all participants are rational actors. Ok, let's make it an R99 Bloody or Dark Weapon in that scenario. How does NCSoft make someone whole after the fact by rolling back?
The hypothetical still stands, although granted, the model assumes not all participants are rational actors. Ok, let's make it an R99 Bloody or Dark Weapon in that scenario. How does NCSoft make someone whole after the fact by rolling back?
yeah I get your point, no one is getting any1 a 100% success rate in whatever risk or chance they gambled in.
just was amazed why would someone spend 17.5b in scrolls going from 12 to 15 if the weapon itself will still cost 17.5b :p .... and MAYBE 10b being +12, so in the end you end up loosing 15B after succeding the DEWR´s if you actually made that lol
Thanks for the reply.
Will there be any limitations on tomorrows transfers from Chronos to avoid possible contagious of other server markets?
We already investigated the players who are transfering out of Chronos and recovered more Adena.
Now if you could just track the adena from all the bots in game to the main accounts that are spending the money that would be "One giant leap for L2 Kind."
Now if you could just track the adena from all the bots in game to the main accounts that are spending the money that would be "One giant leap for L2 Kind."
One small step at a time. I agree they must track Adena from banned bot accounts if it was mailed to another account without receiving something back in return and/or equal in its value.
1. L2 has been around for years without any proven method of getting rid of adena, as you have in real world economies. As a consequence, we've all become adena horders in our own way. (What would be a good adena sink? Buffs. Eliminate Awakened buffing classes and set up NPC buffers that charge for daily buffs. Heck, the NPC could sell Daily Buff runes for R, R95 and R99 grades for all I care, but do something to get rid of all of the excess adena in the game.)
Buffs won't help get rid of excessive adena. In fact NC implemented better system to sink adena: new items arrived in Auction Manager such as Blessed Valakas Necklace, Baium Soul Ring, Shadow Weapons- all expensive thingies. They will sink good amount of adena, just give some time.
Oh my. More adena nerfs incoming.
Insert "no no no cat" gif here.:eek: After Undergruand update some areas looks perfectly balanced adena wise ( Seal of Shillien, Nornils Cave ) and i hope they will find strenght to manually track down exloited adena instead instead of punishing whole community. But you never know...
You guys don't understand after all these years really, even if they wipe all your items, they didn't owe you anything. You don't have even a legal base to sue them, because you've accepted that everything is their property and you have the privilege to use it, which privilege can be revoked, modified at any time.
Why do you think that you buy virtual currency (ncoins), rather than using $ for example? Yea the ncoins are their property too.
Be thankful if you get your items back, but if you pull the short stick, oh well, bad luck.As we know ncsoft tends to not care about things, so you should be happy that they took bolder actions to try to compensate as much as possible.
You guys don't understand after all these years really, even if they wipe all your items, they didn't owe you anything. You don't have even a legal base to sue them, because you've accepted that everything is their property and you have the privilege to use it, which privilege can be revoked, modified at any time.
Why do you think that you buy virtual currency (ncoins), rather than using $ for example? Yea the ncoins are their property too.
Be thankful if you get your items back, but if you pull the short stick, oh well, bad luck.As we know ncsoft tends to not care about things, so you should be happy that they took bolder actions to try to compensate as much as possible.
Got my weapon back and later got a msg that I will get the adena I had before restored too, still waiting on the Adena though but seems to be official with me.
Is it safe to sell and buy expencive stuff now? Is the problem with adenas solved? I was very lucky yesterday and got some realy nice rewards from opening some capsules. Im going to try to sell a Lindvior earring and a longing talisman and buy a +8 armorset! but this is only if the previous adenaproblems are solved, i dont want to lose my stuff.