Hi. In this post, I will get severely flamed. Here it goes:
Why is it that e-bayers insist upon ruining the game for the rest of us? I am being honest, I am afraid of S-grade. All of you people with plussed up Draconic Bows and what not have e-bayed. You will whole-heartedly deny it, but let's be frank. Let's say that the average SSA on Teon costs about 120 adena. Assuming you play a class such as a Treasure Hunter, or another DD, you will probably take on average 8-10 hits to kill a non-catacomb mob, and 15-20 hits for catacomb mobs. The total soul-shot cost for non-catacomb mobs comes to around 1,080 adena per mob, and catacomb mobs come to around 2,040 adena per mob. Let's be generous and say that catacomb mobs (where most people hunt) drop 7,500 adena. That comes to a profit of 5,460 per mob. Now let's look at the average clean Draconic Bow's cost of (on Teon) 950,000,000 adena. Making 7,500 per mob, you will need to kill almost 130,000 mobs without spending any additional adena. That's irrational, but let's say you somehow do this. I have seen +7 Draconic Bows go for around 2,000,000,000 adena. That means you have to kill almost 270,000 mobs. Again, this is illogical, you will reach S-grade long before this happens. I don't even want to know how much people spend on buying armor sets, also.
So, here is my point. Botters and E-bayers are controlling the market. If the first E-bayer never bought adena, the prices for S-grade weapons and armor sets would be drastically lower. You e-bayers have ruined the game for we legitimate players, who have to struggle just to keep up with the market. It's not fair. It really hurts the game. I think that something should seriously be done to stop this. Just to further my point, a google search for "Lineage 2 Adena" returns nearly 500,000 results. This is ruining the game. NCsoft, do something about it.
Hi. In this post, I will get severely flamed. Here it goes:
Why is it that e-bayers insist upon ruining the game for the rest of us? I am being honest, I am afraid of S-grade. All of you people with plussed up Draconic Bows and what not have e-bayed. You will whole-heartedly deny it, but let's be frank. Let's say that the average SSA on Teon costs about 120 adena. Assuming you play a class such as a Treasure Hunter, or another DD, you will probably take on average 8-10 hits to kill a non-catacomb mob, and 15-20 hits for catacomb mobs. The total soul-shot cost for non-catacomb mobs comes to around 1,080 adena per mob, and catacomb mobs come to around 2,040 adena per mob. Let's be generous and say that catacomb mobs (where most people hunt) drop 7,500 adena. That comes to a profit of 5,460 per mob. Now let's look at the average clean Draconic Bow's cost of (on Teon) 950,000,000 adena. Making 7,500 per mob, you will need to kill almost 130,000 mobs without spending any additional adena. That's irrational, but let's say you somehow do this. I have seen +7 Draconic Bows go for around 2,000,000,000 adena. That means you have to kill almost 270,000 mobs. Again, this is illogical, you will reach S-grade long before this happens. I don't even want to know how much people spend on buying armor sets, also.
So, here is my point. Botters and E-bayers are controlling the market. If the first E-bayer never bought adena, the prices for S-grade weapons and armor sets would be drastically lower. You e-bayers have ruined the game for we legitimate players, who have to struggle just to keep up with the market. It's not fair. It really hurts the game. I think that something should seriously be done to stop this. Just to further my point, a google search for "Lineage 2 Adena" returns nearly 500,000 results. This is ruining the game. NCsoft, do something about it.
-kick
You do realize that ebaying has nothing to do with prices? If you say it does 100% then you are a noob to the game and don't understand supply and demand along with that more draconic bows are bought from crafting then from raid drops. Which means do you think the average person farms materials to make draconic bow after draconic bow or do they buy materials from automated players? Automated Players control 100% of the market. If they want to horde the CBP like they are on Devianne or the Iron or it is driving the prices up 1 Iron Ore is going for 3.5k - 5k along with Animal Bones to be 2k - 2.5k per bone. So that is 25k per CBP when you need 300 CBP to make 100 Mithril Alloy and you need if I remember correct 354 Mithril Alloy to make a Draconic Bow. So 300 per 100 means something like 1240 CBP per Draconic Bow craft at 25k per. Not including other materials. That is 31m just in CBP not including the DMP which is pretty high at like 200k per and you need something like 304? So that is another 61m almost so your up to almost 100m just in 2 MATERIALS!!! not including S crystals or S gems.. Recs or Blades.. So please take your ebaying crap somewhere else yes it does inflate it alittle bit but no Supply and Demand will always inflate it more then Ebaying ever will. Learn the game a little bit and maybe you might know what your talking about.
I didn't say supply and demand weren't important. What I am saying is that the only reason people can afford billions of adena of gear is because they e-bay. Sellers know this. That's why they price things so high.
I didn't say supply and demand weren't important. What I am saying is that the only reason people can afford billions of adena of gear is because they e-bay. Sellers know this. That's why they price things so high.
Ummm, just a thought here, but what if you actually crafted your weapons and armour? Yes, you are dealing with Korean random in terms of the 60% success rate, but that is the risk you take. As well, there is the fact that many people get a lot of help through their clans. Lastly, as has been mentioned many thime before, there ar numerous ways to make good money in game. All those factors lead to people being able to afford equiping themselves in S Grade (and in past, A and B and C and so forth).
Now, that said, we do see a lot of WAY overpriced crap on the market. And the reason it is way over priced, because the seller knows there is someone out there who will most likely have bought in game currency and will spend it. Not every shop is like that though. You look around hard enough, you will find deals (like a +3 FB focus with 150 holy which I found the other day for 300 million).
Not saying that the instant gratification crowd out there have not messed things up a bit, but its not all doom and gloom.
While i whole heartedly agree that ebaing is through the roof, its not really at the the s gear lvl any more.
u can make billions. It will take some time but u can. I made 2 billion off of cubics in the last year. I took that 2 billion and made 4billion making dual Dam*Tal and selling em about 15% more than i made em. I made 400 mil in 1 week in Feb doing this.
U can do shots,i made 500m in 3 months doing that a couple of yrs ago.
the important thing is to know what ur real goal is. If ur goal is to pvp? yah then ur goinna be chasing the almighty adena always. My goal is 28 chars in a grade. Hence why i always have lotsa money.
U need to realize that there are 2 grinds. The xp grind and the money grind. If u xp 3 hrs a day then be prepared to also money grind 3 hrs a day to pay for ur xping:)
I didn't say supply and demand weren't important. What I am saying is that the only reason people can afford billions of adena of gear is because they e-bay. Sellers know this. That's why they price things so high.
You just conterdicted what you just said.. Only people that can afford gear worth billions is ebayers.. but sellers sell the billions in gear and in turn buy more billions in gear. So does that make the seller a ebayer for selling to a ebayer? Your logic is flawed but your to one sided to see it.
the last couple months i bought 7 S weapons for 170 mil or less and just instantly crystallized em and stuff like that is how you get money not by killing mobs (although i make 40 mil a day easy aoeing)
Hi. In this post, I will get severely flamed. Here it goes:
Why is it that e-bayers insist upon ruining the game for the rest of us? I am being honest, I am afraid of S-grade. All of you people with plussed up Draconic Bows and what not have e-bayed. You will whole-heartedly deny it, but let's be frank. Let's say that the average SSA on Teon costs about 120 adena. Assuming you play a class such as a Treasure Hunter, or another DD, you will probably take on average 8-10 hits to kill a non-catacomb mob, and 15-20 hits for catacomb mobs. The total soul-shot cost for non-catacomb mobs comes to around 1,080 adena per mob, and catacomb mobs come to around 2,040 adena per mob. Let's be generous and say that catacomb mobs (where most people hunt) drop 7,500 adena. That comes to a profit of 5,460 per mob. Now let's look at the average clean Draconic Bow's cost of (on Teon) 950,000,000 adena. Making 7,500 per mob, you will need to kill almost 130,000 mobs without spending any additional adena. That's irrational, but let's say you somehow do this. I have seen +7 Draconic Bows go for around 2,000,000,000 adena. That means you have to kill almost 270,000 mobs. Again, this is illogical, you will reach S-grade long before this happens. I don't even want to know how much people spend on buying armor sets, also.
So, here is my point. Botters and E-bayers are controlling the market. If the first E-bayer never bought adena, the prices for S-grade weapons and armor sets would be drastically lower. You e-bayers have ruined the game for we legitimate players, who have to struggle just to keep up with the market. It's not fair. It really hurts the game. I think that something should seriously be done to stop this. Just to further my point, a google search for "Lineage 2 Adena" returns nearly 500,000 results. This is ruining the game. NCsoft, do something about it.
-kick
DB on Teon roughly costs 295M.
And sorry but you are very clueless about anything in the game when it comes to erning adena atleast, Why?
Tinking that one earns there wealth from adena grinding is just silly.
I am not trying to say that adena sellers dont exist in L2 becuse they do very much, but saying that everyone that has full Sgrade at 76 is a Ebayer is just plain stupid on your part.
You knew that you would be flamed becuse you knew you were wrong.
You are looking at this in a way a level 19 person would think on how to afford Cgrade.
"OMG how will I get 8M for a wep when I get 120 adena a monster, everyone must be a Ebayer."
Stop wasting ur time, they not gonna do anything bout it. It's been the same more or less since l2 launch, what do u think is gonan happen, after 5 yrs they gonna say - oh yes this guy is right, let's change the foundation of the game....what u can do is adapt or play another game.
If you are having so much trouble making adena on your current character, then why don't you try another class? For example: I started on a surver with an Arbalester (Lost ME more money then it gained). What I did was make a War Lord. Never had adena troubles since :)
(Please note that at the time I did not know how to use manor system :()
Hi. In this post, I will get severely flamed. Here it goes:
Why is it that e-bayers insist upon ruining the game for the rest of us? I am being honest, I am afraid of S-grade. All of you people with plussed up Draconic Bows and what not have e-bayed. You will whole-heartedly deny it, but let's be frank. Let's say that the average SSA on Teon costs about 120 adena. Assuming you play a class such as a Treasure Hunter, or another DD, you will probably take on average 8-10 hits to kill a non-catacomb mob, and 15-20 hits for catacomb mobs. The total soul-shot cost for non-catacomb mobs comes to around 1,080 adena per mob, and catacomb mobs come to around 2,040 adena per mob. Let's be generous and say that catacomb mobs (where most people hunt) drop 7,500 adena. That comes to a profit of 5,460 per mob. Now let's look at the average clean Draconic Bow's cost of (on Teon) 950,000,000 adena. Making 7,500 per mob, you will need to kill almost 130,000 mobs without spending any additional adena. That's irrational, but let's say you somehow do this. I have seen +7 Draconic Bows go for around 2,000,000,000 adena. That means you have to kill almost 270,000 mobs. Again, this is illogical, you will reach S-grade long before this happens. I don't even want to know how much people spend on buying armor sets, also.
So, here is my point. Botters and E-bayers are controlling the market. If the first E-bayer never bought adena, the prices for S-grade weapons and armor sets would be drastically lower. You e-bayers have ruined the game for we legitimate players, who have to struggle just to keep up with the market. It's not fair. It really hurts the game. I think that something should seriously be done to stop this. Just to further my point, a google search for "Lineage 2 Adena" returns nearly 500,000 results. This is ruining the game. NCsoft, do something about it.
-kick
I m sorry but you 're clueless
A clean dracbow on Teon costs 250-280m NOT 950m
You can buy a +6 Dracbow Focus for around 900m
If you can't make 300m these days you really need to go back to the drawing board and figure out how to play this game
Let's be generous and say that catacomb mobs (where most people hunt) drop 7,500 adena.
In case you haven't got it from the previous replies, the way to make legit money is not through mob drops. These are just an added bonus while you grind.
You just conterdicted what you just said.. Only people that can afford gear worth billions is ebayers.. but sellers sell the billions in gear and in turn buy more billions in gear. So does that make the seller a ebayer for selling to a ebayer? Your logic is flawed but your to one sided to see it.
I almost thought that you had a point, but then you misspelled a word as simple as "contradicted".
when i read that people makes money by crafting and selling,i wonder if they know that
_most of their customers ebay to buy
_the people they r buying cheap mats from are farmers.
so even if they dont ebay-cheat,they use the ebay thing.
i doubt if we would wear s and dynasty gear if ebaying/botting didnt exist.
korean servers players may be legit but they have all kind of events with the right rewards for their lvl/chronicle.
instead of us that we take ead and crys 9 as rewards.......................
It only takes 1 S weapon, couple of EWS and a good portion of luck. You don't need to ebay for that. Beside the fact the game is ruined allready and not just by e-bay, why would someone "invest" r/l curency in a dead game anyways? Subscription fees are allready overpriced for what the game have to offer these days.
You do realize that ebaying has nothing to do with prices? If you say it does 100% then you are a noob to the game and don't understand supply and demand along with that more draconic bows are bought from crafting then from raid drops. Which means do you think the average person farms materials to make draconic bow after draconic bow or do they buy materials from automated players? Automated Players control 100% of the market. If they want to horde the CBP like they are on Devianne or the Iron or it is driving the prices up 1 Iron Ore is going for 3.5k - 5k along with Animal Bones to be 2k - 2.5k per bone. So that is 25k per CBP when you need 300 CBP to make 100 Mithril Alloy and you need if I remember correct 354 Mithril Alloy to make a Draconic Bow. So 300 per 100 means something like 1240 CBP per Draconic Bow craft at 25k per. Not including other materials. That is 31m just in CBP not including the DMP which is pretty high at like 200k per and you need something like 304? So that is another 61m almost so your up to almost 100m just in 2 MATERIALS!!! not including S crystals or S gems.. Recs or Blades.. So please take your ebaying crap somewhere else yes it does inflate it alittle bit but no Supply and Demand will always inflate it more then Ebaying ever will. Learn the game a little bit and maybe you might know what your talking about.
Yes it does. And I dont believe you just called the guy a noob. You honestly think people can legitematly afford S Grade prices people sell for? Please, tell me how. People sell at those prices cos adena is farmed in mass quantities by people in some far off country in a factory probably, over a long period of time, and know that they can ask those prices because they know stupid people buy adena. Im legit, 77 SD and just spent my entire adena stash (300 mil) on crafting a DLE for my S Duals. Tallum blade by sub quest. God knows how im supposed to keep paying for SSS but whatever... I still use the Dual kesh to save money sometimes. And I am not even contemplating S armor. Its just probably not going to be possible for me, unless I farm mats for a year or two.
E-Bayers do control the market, like it or not. And that includes prices for things. Its just happened over a long period of time. If ebaying was not possible in any form, things would be a lot lot cheaper. But, what can we do, the market is set now.
Ebaying is not the only way that people can afford S-grade.
A simple counter to that argument is to simply take a look at what a single raid boss can drop, and the argument should be settled.
Expanding the discussion, simply working off the adena drops from mobs (and the sale value of whatever else the mobs may drop) definitely is not a sustainable form of income generation in comparison to the costs of crafting anything S-grade and up.
For everyone except maybe nukers, hunting actually costs more money than is made by hunting after S-grade due to shot/consumable costs. For higher-damage classes (titans, archers, etc.), the threshold comes later than for lower-damage classes (tanks, summoners, etc.), but the point at which hunting becomes an unprofitable venture eventually comes for all.
Therefore, additional income streams must be used in order to supplement a character's growth, which is why most people generally figure out ways to make money aside from hunting.
However, this does not mean that the only way to gain additional funds is through eula-breaking means.
There are a lot of possibilities that anyone can use to generate substantially more income than simply hunting:
Start a Warsmith alt and have him sit with a craft shop up in town while you sleep.
Play the market - buy low, sell high while anticipating people's needs in relation to new content additions or changing market preferences.
Scam people.
Kill raid bosses and use the drops to craft things for sale, or just sell the drops.
Start a Bounty Hunter alt and sell your spoils.
Start Bounty Hunter and Warsmith alts and use spoils towards crafts to sell.
It's not like any of these suggestions are really groundbreakingly new or require much degree of imagination given the in-game functions available to us all. Nor are they the limit to the possible methods of income generation available within the confines of the eula.
So, the next time a wall appears, it might be a good idea to step back and take a good look at what's possible before denouncing those who have managed to overcome that wall as ebayers.
Hi. In this post, I will get severely flamed. Here it goes:
(....)Let's say that the average SSA on Teon costs about 120 adena. (...) Now let's look at the average clean Draconic Bow's cost of (on Teon) 950,000,000 adena. Making 7,500 per mob, you will need to kill almost 130,000 mobs without spending any additional adena.
-kick
So You just proof that killing mobs to gain money is useless :)
That calculation is really 'stupid' - if you want money you do different things then exp :)
But If you REALLY want kill something to gain adena I can suggest :
- Kill NPC at Fortress to get KE (each around 50 k )
one fort farm 100 - 200 KE
- Do Fort Dungeon - Quest 152 KE + almost 100 % probable A/S grade drops
- Join Kama 7x / 81 - for full drops to get share part
- Join SoI/SoD for full drops to get share part
- Kill mobs in IoP/HB for element stones
If you don't want kill mobs - play on market, wait events, make cubics, farm in SoI 150+ crystals, etc.
Believe me you don't need e-bay to afford S grade.
P.S. I'm not saying that you earn money for full Vesper set in 1 month :)
Maybe someone said something like that,but I didn't read the entire topic...
How the hell possesing an S grade weapon or armor is considered an E-buying?
If you rarely play,or started to play a few month ago and you are in A-C grade and bellow lvl 75 (A.K.A,a noob) doesnt mean that the people that are better geared/leveled than you are cheaters,just maybe they play the game more than you do or they know how to play the market.
I imagine myself a 67 lvl noob dressed in common A see's a 78+ lvl player dressed in S grade and think's that this player must be a cheater because the level of equipment seems unachievable to a so called "noob" (although is extremly easy to achieve playing the market or hunting in specific area's)
and immediately calle's that person an "E-buyer".
i was afraid too and when i hit 76 i had about 10kk inmy wh. i am a nuker btw. what did i do?
i went to IOP to farm fire stones! on Phoenis they were going for 8 mill each at the time and i would get a min of 1 per day, and 2-3 when id stay online for a long time. i farmed there for about 1 month and was able to buy a clean arcana mace for 80 mill. farmed there more, sold my A weapon and bough the SA enchant, along with some wind stones (the wind is still work in progress :P) i was also able to buy an IC shield for 40 mill (that was the price at the time)
now, my BF is TH, as a melee class he can use manor system easily. he was using tha manor system for the mats, and crafted himself a S dagger for 40 mill. sold more manor mats, raid drops and some A and B enchanted weapons, with the enchants he got from cubics quest and was able to buy fire stones from me and allies for a good price, as well as the SA.
see? its not as bad as you think you just need to use the resources the game is giving you. let alone buy low/sell high in giran.
ive been playing for less then a year, and having a 150 elem weapon and perfect gear is not supposed to be instant, you gotta work for it.
You honestly think people can legitematly afford S Grade prices people sell for?
Yes, because YOU can also sell stuff at those prices, it's the beauty of the free market.
For example a year ago I made tons of money by reselling animal bone for 100% profit, so I know for a fact that anybody could have done the same.
What usually people whine about is that they are unable to get their S grade NOW, so it comes as no surprise that they join the ebay crowd...
My 2 adenas.
I have seen several stupid and several wise posts.
1. Claiming that person wearing top A, S or even S80 equipment is e-bayer is stupid.
2. Claiming that e-baying have impact on in-game market is correct.
For #1 you just need to know how to get wealth and have patience.
I have top A grade gear, IC set (some parts +4, one rare +4), s duals +4 150attr, rare Drac bow, part of Drac set, cash ~300mil, about 500mil on sell/buy stuff. And it is only some things on one char. Any GM can seek logs from the very beginning of mine l2 play - I am clean as spring water.
For #2. Yes, e-bay impacts on market. It is seen right now, because it was a wave of bans for e-bayer and I believe that now persons afraid to buy e-bay adenas because of ban. Some market prices shacked a lot (some peoples lost income). Some prices left stable and now market is not balance (that should auto fix in 1-2 weeks). I see some business opportunities here ;)
And for clean drac bow 900mil...how long ago this post have been done? 8 months? Just yesterday I have seen sell shop in Giran for clean DB for 265mil.
Action of course @Teon.
Im legit, 77 SD and just spent my entire adena stash (300 mil) on crafting a DLE for my S Duals.
I can earn over 100kk a day (if SOD is open and noone PK me there).
Personally I don't spend much time on adena making and I barely make it to survive (90% of time in game for me is just leveling) so how did I got my stuff? (and I got my S-grade stuff back when prices on Teon were skyrocketing and everything was 3-4 times as expensive as now )
Bow:
Crafted myself (using mats that I farmed since level 1)
Then slowly gatherd adena for SA crystal. After that I could go to HB parties so i got 150 element from drops in there.
Armor set:
Lucky draconic leather drop from kama, that party sold to me for 60% of market price
Boots got from clan.
Helmet and gloves crafted by myself with money from HB drops (yes I was going to HB in majestic set)
I still have majestic earring, and my majestic necklace was just recently replaced by tateosian drop from SOI.
ATM i was in process of crafting S80 set (which, for specific reason I will not finish, or will finish and sell for adena). All recipes, parts and orichalcum I got came from oldschool farming on HB, and basic mats at this point I could afford.
And this is just an example of a VERY bad adena maker, which am I :)
Of course boss jewels and some really shiny stuff are out of my range, but I can live with it:)
Imo bigger problem than getting gear is leveling (as long as you refuse to pay for more than one account, and don't use army of OOP boxes to level yourself :) ) But this still can be only my point of view.
+1 the OP is either a board troll, or a bored troll...
My main has S grade gear, and 2 S grade Weapons (1 with SA and +3, the other is +2)
I won't ever be going +4 as I can't afford to break it.
where did i get my money? before the shops started to sell D and C grade, I crafted Brig helms, and made a lot of over enchanted D grade weapons. (on my worst week I made 100,000 D crystals (about 50 weapons))
I understand your frustration. It is a sad thing that this game degenerated into the bloody mess it is right now. The worse thing is that (although the farmers started the problem) the unenlightened masses have perpetuated it ad naseum. I laugh when I see supply and demand being cited as a reason for charging insane prices for anything, because it has absolutely nothing to do with "supply and demand", "what the market will bear" or any of the bs reasons people throw up. The real skinny is that the vast majority of people on this game are followers and the ones that aren't are completely paranoid idiots, plain and simple.
There are no good guys in L2, just the same r-tards over and over again with different clan tags. This applies to all aspects of the game but the market is very special. You will find that most people don't really know prices in this game. They walk through town and see what other people are selling for or they go to websites that list ebay prices and use this information to set their price point. Until they buy into the madness, there is no real price other than what the store buys for or that imaginary price the buy window warns you of when you're about to overpay for an item.
People try to measure their prices in blood, sweat, and tears, but that is an old and tired farmer's excuse. Back when adena selling first got started, people used to say that they weren't selling the actual adena, they were selling the time they took to get it. Unfortunately this pitiful line caught on and the market you've come to hate was born. People fail to remember that this is an electronic game filled with imaginary items with very low pre-determined prices (especially on basic mats). The time spent in game is meant to be for your personal entertainment. How do you charge someone for time spent entertaining yourself? The short answer is, you can't or at least you shouldn't be able to. The only way it makes sense to charge for time spent is if you're getting a tangible reward for that time...in other words RL money.
I'm not going to act like I'm superior here, I've bought into this idiotic behavior myself. I remember when I first got a level 5 alliance in varka and started working on my S-grade, I got an Arcana Sigil Rec on my first trade in. I'm a TH so this has no use to me, but I thought I'd check to see what it was worth. I asked a clanmate and found that it was supposedly worth 100m because of the randomness it took to get the item. I sold the item at this ridiculous price and then afterwards I had to look at myself and laugh at what I'd just done. I've since gotten 3 more arcana sigil recs as a by-product of leveling and, as an act of contrition, I've just given them away.
I no longer see the point of perpetuating these inflationary practices in-game. The top clans cannot go any further up so there truly is no need for large amounts of adena. They only use it to trade for RL money nowadays. People have gotten so bloated with cash they spend it on plussing up weapons to the nth degree and the sad part is that no matter what gear you have it won't save you from a fully stacked party that's focus firing on individual targets. The only gain for this market is the RL one that is farmed from it. I say we need to get back to basics.
I beleive that many people fail to grasp the concept of how money can flow when they are not in a good clan. Just exping using ss/sps obviously gets you nowhere in terms of affording gear. Clan is a major contributor and comes into play when it helps in 2 main ways:
1) Being in a clan that constantly does raids/dungeons/kamaloka and lets people get drops, helps greatly in a financial way (epic raids usually are clan drops so they don't count). Imagine having once a month a good drop. You can easily finance your equipment.
2) Being in a clan that helps their members equip. Some clans gather equipment and mats as a clan effort and help their (loayal) members as time goes by.
If you find a clan that offers any of these 2 options (both of course is great), I am sure that you will revise your options about getting gear.
PS: Of course there is e-bay in the game, but accusing all S-graders as e-bayers doesn't really help in making a point.
Yes it does. And I dont believe you just called the guy a noob. You honestly think people can legitematly afford S Grade prices people sell for? Please, tell me how. People sell at those prices cos adena is farmed in mass quantities by people in some far off country in a factory probably, over a long period of time, and know that they can ask those prices because they know stupid people buy adena. Im legit, 77 SD and just spent my entire adena stash (300 mil) on crafting a DLE for my S Duals. Tallum blade by sub quest. God knows how im supposed to keep paying for SSS but whatever... I still use the Dual kesh to save money sometimes. And I am not even contemplating S armor. Its just probably not going to be possible for me, unless I farm mats for a year or two.
E-Bayers do control the market, like it or not. And that includes prices for things. Its just happened over a long period of time. If ebaying was not possible in any form, things would be a lot lot cheaper. But, what can we do, the market is set now.
You sir are ******ed!! If you buy SS then you need to be shot. I was going over this with a SPS friend yesterday. Common Items drop like there is no tomorrow.. THAT IS FREE ADENA. Crush them and use the crystals to make SS or SPS. If she has 2 A cry and 46 Spirit ore or w/e it takes to make 1 Click at A BSPS and the Crystals were FREE from grinding. It takes 164 adena PER A BSPS while in shops on my server they sell for 450a - 550a PER you are saving almost 350 - 450a PER SHOT SAVED. So if you use 2 shots to kill a mob in FoTD *Like we were yesterday* that is 328a per mob while the mob drops 1.5k-2k. You are making a easy 1k per mob. Not including matz. DMP is going for 200k per when I can buy the matz to craft for around 75k Take some time to craft and make 125k per selling to some idiot that is to lazy to craft it or manor it. Making money is easy I can go on and on about making money. If you are 77 with A armor and just got +0 S duals you don't know how to play the game and you should learn it or quit. Yes i'm being mean because i'm tired of seeing lvl 78 - 80's whine that ebaying IS THE ONLY WAY TO HAVE S GEAR!!! My God its STUPIDLY EASY to make money use some freaking common sense.
True but it works for D/C/B/A and alot of people don't realize when they buy from a shop how much money they are making. If I have 1,400k Crystals and I can click 700 times at 200 A BSPS per click means 140k A BSPS made. with a profit of 300a per means 42m profit just in spare time which can probabl sell within a couple days and in that time can probably get another couple hundred A cry from drops again. Rinse and repeat so no if you do that say 2 times a week that is almost 100m easy just from that. so in 2 weeks on Devianne I could almost buy S weapon right there not including what you get from Mat drops etc. 200m I can easily spend to try and craft 2 full S weapons buying the matz out right. So please this Ebaying is hte only way is BS and I'm tired of hearing it.
yesterday I sold 127 Synth Cokes for 200k each when normal price is 58k just because the person didn't want to wait a couple hours till normal people logged in there selling account. sold Mold Lub for 750k to the same person because they wanted to craft now. I him and I told him I was doing so because he was being impacient and rude to me.
Adena is not difficult to make... and save... and then with help from friends get yourself geared out.
S-Duals: Got DLE recs and parts from friends... crafted with my mats. Tallum blade from subclass quest. Got lucky with getting 2 ew-s from pagans quest and bought the other two EW-S (spent all my adena) and it went +4 first try.
Then I farmed IOP with a titan friend in chromatic (before they nerfed firestone drop rate) and would get 10 firestones a good grind session. 150'd my duals, and started selling the rest (when they were still 10mil ea). Two months of saving I could afford an IC set. Sold my tallum heavy, and saved some more adena and bought a drac bow focus for like 220mil.
Then hit 78 and went to HB. Changed my duals to holy, and 150'd my drac bow. Took about 6 months of saving and I was able to afford an aq and zaken from selling my split of divine stones.
Got Baium & Frint from clan.
Then my group pooled our ori and got s80 recs from clan members. Cost me about 150mil in mats to craft my s80 heavy set. Another 4months of saving adena and bought ada from town, and got s80 sword rec for 1/4th market price from clannie crafted my s80 sword. Got DLE from clan. With a little encouragement to make crystals +4'd my duals. Sold my old duals.. and 150'd my s80 duals. All in all cost me about 450mil to get in full s80. +3 the entire set from MOS quest.
From the money of selling my sduals and ic heavy bought an angel slayer and 150'd it, and elemented my s80 set. Got drac set from clan for my subclass.
Obviously... if I met the OP in game he'd automatically assume I was an ebayer from my appearence. However, its taken me over 2 years since I've hit s-grade of saving adena and farming the correct items/quests to get my gear.
I don't understand why someone will be frustrated over the price of the S stuff right now. With +6 Drac bow Focus +150 water for 900kk and less then 250kk for clean Drac bow the S gear (besides the epic jewels of course) is a joke. There was time when the prices were several times higher because the game was badly balanced when S80 was introduced (no one really expects NCSoft to make something balanced, right? They always make the game to swing like pendulum back and forth from extreme plus to extreme minus). I mean besides some 20-30 top botters no one else could afford s80 gear so the S stuff was in high demand.
So now the prices dropped (especially with many S graders which were disappointed and moved to Aion) and at the same time with not that much efforts you can easily make 20-30kk at day. This may not seems like a lot but it is up to 1b per month.
And of course it is not serious what some posters tried to explain about how the market is not working in the game etc... the market is always working. It incorporates every change and every factor no matter if those factors are called e-bayers, botters or what ever else.
adena is not difficult to make... And save... And then with help from friends get yourself geared out.
S-duals: Got dle recs and parts from friends... Crafted with my mats. Tallum blade from subclass quest. Got lucky with getting 2 ew-s from pagans quest and bought the other two ew-s (spent all my adena) and it went +4 first try.
Then i farmed iop with a titan friend in chromatic (before they nerfed firestone drop rate) and would get 10 firestones a good grind session. 150'd my duals, and started selling the rest (when they were still 10mil ea). Two months of saving i could afford an ic set. Sold my tallum heavy, and saved some more adena and bought a drac bow focus for like 220mil.
Then hit 78 and went to hb. Changed my duals to holy, and 150'd my drac bow. Took about 6 months of saving and i was able to afford an aq and zaken from selling my split of divine stones.
Got baium & frint from clan.
Then my group pooled our ori and got s80 recs from clan members. Cost me about 150mil in mats to craft my s80 heavy set. Another 4months of saving adena and bought ada from town, and got s80 sword rec for 1/4th market price from clannie crafted my s80 sword. Got dle from clan. With a little encouragement to make crystals +4'd my duals. Sold my old duals.. And 150'd my s80 duals. All in all cost me about 450mil to get in full s80. +3 the entire set from mos quest.
From the money of selling my sduals and ic heavy bought an angel slayer and 150'd it, and elemented my s80 set. Got drac set from clan for my subclass.
Obviously... If i met the op in game he'd automatically assume i was an ebayer from my appearence. However, its taken me over 2 years since i've hit s-grade of saving adena and farming the correct items/quests to get my gear.
I don't understand why someone will be frustrated over the price of the S stuff right now. With +6 Drac bow Focus +150 water for 900kk and less then 250kk for clean Drac bow the S gear (besides the epic jewels of course) is a joke. There was time when the prices were several times higher because the game was badly balanced when S80 was introduced (no one really expects NCSoft to make something balanced, right? They always make the game to swing like pendulum back and forth from extreme plus to extreme minus). I mean besides some 20-30 top botters no one else could afford s80 gear so the S stuff was in high demand.
So now the prices dropped (especially with many S graders which were disappointed and moved to Aion) and at the same time with not that much efforts you can easily make 20-30kk at day. This may not seems like a lot but it is up to 1b per month.
And of course it is not serious what some posters tried to explain about how the market is not working in the game etc... the market is always working. It incorporates every change and every factor no matter if those factors are called e-bayers, botters or what ever else.
The price of s grade has dropped because people finally figured out that s80 is extremely easy to get with the introduction of the reduce craft amounts, the SOI to farm ada/ori, and the reduction in the amount of quest items need to get the 3rd rec. So people are upgrading to s80 and dumping their old s grade on the market. That include with the number of people quitting game and selling their gear off drops the price even further.
The price of s grade has dropped because people finally figured out that s80 is extremely easy to get with the introduction of the reduce craft amounts, the SOI to farm ada/ori, and the reduction in the amount of quest items need to get the 3rd rec. So people are upgrading to s80 and dumping their old s grade on the market. That include with the number of people quitting game and selling their gear off drops the price even further.
I didn't say supply and demand weren't important. What I am saying is that the only reason people can afford billions of adena of gear is because they e-bay. Sellers know this. That's why they price things so high.
That is absolutely no true!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You, my friend, are like the blind person who says "There is no daylight, I just can't see it so it doesn't exist"
My point is - this that you don't know how to play doesn't make a cheater out of everybody else.
There are tons of methods of making a lot of adena from level 1 to level 85!!!. I have never ebayed for 3 straight years and I not only have S, I got full S80 weapons, armors, jewels plus boosted equipment for a number of lower chars.
I can point out to you several ways to make tons of money:
1. Pay for 3 accounts. That will give you a self buffing party.
2. Make your own clan and level 3x7=21 chars in it from 1 to 40 and get 650 CRP per char.
3. Find a level 9 clan which needs to get to level 10 and sell your crp to the clan leader.
4. Gratz you got over 1bil and it took you only a month.
5. In the mean time (while leveling your chars from 1 to 40) use the manor system actively. Here you go, gratz, you just made all the materials you need to craft your S equipment.
This is just one of the many ways to make adena inside Lineage 2 besides the higher you become, the more adena you make.
You can start trading from the very beginning.
Six months ago a friend started to play. I showed him another way of making adena - by buying and reselling stuff. He made 2.5 bil during the last 6 months by only doing this while he is afk.
I can give you a lot more examples ... like fishing for example. By fishing you can make the same amount of adena in the same time.
During my 3+ years experience in this game I noticed that all the methods of making adena are giving almost the same result for a given period of time. And it is a good result.
I am not saying that there are no e-bayers. On the contrary, most of the players are e-bayers but actually I will be really sad if they go away. Because of them I am selling my stuff every day and I am making adena from their stupidity.
God bless the stupid and RL rich e-bayers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Having 3 accounts is not that much. Everyone can afford it - at least everyone who can affor a decent PC and non-stop Inet connection. Not to mention is cheaper then buyng adena or botting.
The basic rule in this game is adena = time. For example you can easily make 150-200kk for about 3 hours (Teon prices) if you get up early before the server gets overcrowded and make some energy stones. But again if you have proper buffer and good melee char you can make 50kk for 1 hour from KE; We play with 2 acc - my wife and I; and we made about 1 bil from the cubics only; even if you are low level - around 45 you can try and assemble a party to kill lvl 40 RB for eggs (and fun).
But do not expect to make *huge* money just by playing - making serious money requires time and dedication.
It is true - many players can play only several hours per week. But it should be obvious they cannot earn the adena a dedicated player can earn. And they should not complain. This may be a game but it is like the real life - who works only several hours weekly rarely can earn big money... if you are not Paris Hilton of course:-)
anyone that says ebaying or people that have purchased adena doesn't equate to either 100% or close to it, of the entire setup of the market is a complete idiot.
You inject money into the system, sellers find out they can sell things for several times it's worthwhile value because SOME idiot will oventually pull out his real wallet to buy it..
In turn you end up with multiple people working this system to no end, people that never ebayed or anything will have played with a good amount of luck and right place right now purchasing and reselling. Getting started is almost impossible, but if your smart enough and patient, and spend your adena wisely, you can start the ball rolling once you get enough to propetuate an ever increasing amount of adena.
And that's how the current system turns round...
a VERY large number of people bot...... even more people purchase adena.... Billions of adena have been purchase..... if not in the several trillions.
And i laugh at anyone that keeps suggesting "ever heard of crafting...blah blah blah"
Tell that to someone that has FAILED several billion worth of crafts with nothing to show for it.
Work a month to build up and purchase necessary components just to see it disappear in a blink of the eye. Rince and repeat and suddenly your failing craft after craft after craft.
I've since now just in the last 4 months failed 3 drac bows, 2 ic breastplates, 2 ic gaiters, an unfathomable amount of various Tat jewelery (with only 2 successful rings).
Actually since 3 years ago, i've yet to successed a single 60% craft. And people wonder why i won't bother taking the chance to +4 my S duals.
Best of it all, someone tells me to grow some balls, should be shot on the spot.
I know of a few people that have yet to fail a 60% craft, and have multiple s weapons and armor.
It's a gamble, the entire games system is based on gambling, your lucky your not not, and sometimes your situated in the middle. You get people that inject and inflate prices to rediculious highs, and only NCsoft is able to curb the inflation by introducing the weapons and armor themselves as a npcable item.
Look at B weapons, the Dama was situated at over 200mil at one point, and while i think it's still high, due to the the system in place now, they've dropped alot.
I know of a few people that have yet to fail a 60% craft, and have multiple s weapons and armor.
Unless someone shows a video from the official server with 15+ successful 60% crafts in a row, I don't believe that.
And i laugh at anyone that keeps suggesting "ever heard of crafting...blah blah blah"
Tell that to someone that has FAILED several billion worth of crafts with nothing to show for it.
Work a month to build up and purchase necessary components just to see it disappear in a blink of the eye. Rince and repeat and suddenly your failing craft after craft after craft.
I've since now just in the last 4 months failed 3 drac bows, 2 ic breastplates, 2 ic gaiters, an unfathomable amount of various Tat jewelery (with only 2 successful rings).
Actually since 3 years ago, i've yet to successed a single 60% craft. And people wonder why i won't bother taking the chance to +4 my S duals.
Best of it all, someone tells me to grow some balls, should be shot on the spot.
I know of a few people that have yet to fail a 60% craft, and have multiple s weapons and armor.
It's a gamble, the entire games system is based on gambling, your lucky your not not, and sometimes your situated in the middle. You get people that inject and inflate prices to rediculious highs, and only NCsoft is able to curb the inflation by introducing the weapons and armor themselves as a npcable item.
So what you are trying to say is because you have horrible luck at attempting to craft 60% recs, and cannot make money off of it that EVERYONE has horrible luck at crafting 60% recs and cannot make money off of it.
Do you see the HUGE FAILURE in your logic? So I guess all those dwarves in town with every s weapon, or sealed s80 sets are just a bunch of ebayers! HOW DARE THEM I SAY HOW DARE THEM!!!!!!!!!!! MOTHERLOVIN EBAYERS BREATHIN UP ALL THE LEGIT MANS CRAFTING AIR!
So what you are trying to say is because you have horrible luck at attempting to craft 60% recs, and cannot make money off of it that EVERYONE has horrible luck at crafting 60% recs and cannot make money off of it.
Do you see the HUGE FAILURE in your logic? So I guess all those dwarves in town with every s weapon, or sealed s80 sets are just a bunch of ebayers! HOW DARE THEM I SAY HOW DARE THEM!!!!!!!!!!! MOTHERLOVIN EBAYERS BREATHIN UP ALL THE LEGIT MANS CRAFTING AIR!
Do you see the huge failure in your assumption..
did i say at any point that everyone has the same amount of luck...
What is wrong with your logic.. i don't even see where your pulling that out of. I clearly stated that there were few that have massive failures and a few that have massive success rates.
The sprectrum is vast, and there will always BE people at either end with the majority in the middle...
Your logic is the one that is seriously flawed, as i know plenty of people/dwarves that play legitimately as far as i know that have all the armor/sets... But still, you cannot deny that even in the c2/c3 era, just about anything you sold, the adena is likely dirty....
did i say at any point that everyone has the same amount of luck...
What is wrong with your logic.. i don't even see where your pulling that out of. I clearly stated that there were few that have massive failures and a few that have massive success rates.
The sprectrum is vast, and there will always BE people at either end with the majority in the middle...
Your logic is the one that is seriously flawed, as i know plenty of people/dwarves that play legitimately as far as i know that have all the armor/sets... But still, you cannot deny that even in the c2/c3 era, just about anything you sold, the adena is likely dirty....
See below for you crying about crafting...
And i laugh at anyone that keeps suggesting "ever heard of crafting...blah blah blah"
Tell that to someone that has FAILED several billion worth of crafts with nothing to show for it.
anyone that says ebaying or people that have purchased adena doesn't equate to either 100% or close to it, of the entire setup of the market is a complete idiot.
I see Judas has no idea how the market works, nether has the smallest idea about the craft.
It is simply of no use to explain what is "green" to a blind.
Peace.
Most of it is a money sink....agreed, all the stones, crafts, oes(gear, skills), basically it's all just 1 big gamble :) And sometimes it's interesting too :D
Most of it is a money sink....agreed, all the stones, crafts, oes(gear, skills), basically it's all just 1 big gamble :) And sometimes it's interesting too :D
What you wrote is true only about 1 type of the crafting; but there are 3 types of crafting.
1. The gample (your type). This should be made if you simply has no choice and must gample. When I had to make my 1st blue wolf set I had to gample for the helmet simply because I had no choice. It was either gamble for a chance to have BW set or have no set. Gambling when this is not the case is stupid.
2. Craft for adena. Nothing to gamble here. It is pure mathematics. I have spreadsheets with all the costs and mats and I know with 1 adena punctuality how much each craft costs. Whan I was playing actively (now I only sit in shop mode) I was crafting up to 40 S grade armors plus about 10 weapons for S cry per every two weeks (this was before the upgrade so no S80 craft at those times). But it is tiresome and is extremely time consuming.
3. Craft for your own needs. It may seem it is just the 1st type (gambling) but it is not because there is risk management. You must be aware about the crafting costs of each item and to decide to what to buy ready made and what to craft. For the purpose of this calculation it is normal to accept the chance 1:2 - as if the recipes are 50%, not for 60% and 70%. The main difference between this craft and the gambling is you can afford the failures and you can afford to buy ready made things and when you calculate you simply put the double price of the craft as a cost. If your final result is within this amount you are ok. The difference between the 1st type is when you are forced to gamble you cannot afford this double price so it is either all or nothing. If you can afford with risk management you are almost sure the cost will be in certain borders even with bad luck.
3rd way is my way, mostly craft/oe if I can afford failure...but that's not gonna get u to epics (well unless u in a clan that farms them). Even if u do that, can take u awful long time to buy oe weps/epics, considering there's always smthg new coming out in every chronicle....like the elem. stones in this chronicle. I know some ppl that invested a lot in smthg, like oe a db to +9/10, if one is lucky to do that, u got urself an epic or 2 but....ofc mostly it all breaks. And another thing is if u put a lot of time in making adena u won't have time to exp :) I know there are tons different stories out there but sometimes this game can be soooo frustrating, heck some ppl failed most their dynasty crafts...go tell em crafting rox man......
I see Judas has no idea how the market works, nether has the smallest idea about the craft.
It is simply of no use to explain what is "green" to a blind.
Peace.
your making the suggestion that i was clearly making a point about the specifics of the market itself..
I was pointing out the facts of the matter of various ends of the market and the gambling/Chance/evens/odds of the OE/Crafting markets.....
100% craft is an easy matter, but anything lower then 100% will always have it's winners and losers and a pile of people in the middle.
the 5%-95%-5% is what i'm pointing out as being the result as a general overall point..... there HAS to be people at either end, it just rare, and unfortunately i fall into the 5% loss area. And there will be people at the other end..
I really don't see why i have to make myself that much clearer.... I know and understand the internal workings from various points of view...
3rd way is my way, mostly craft/oe if I can afford failure...but that's not gonna get u to epics
Absolutely true. That's why I call this "craft for your own needs". If you craft for real money you have to "mass-craft" stuff. It is rewarding but it is time consuming and can be extremely boring if you are not into it. When I was crafting armors I was preparing batches of ten units expecting to get 6/10. With 20% profit you can afford to succeed in only 4/10 and still get even. I had only once very bad stream of luck and got 440 kk on red from the batch, but I had 9/10 too (only once). Anyway I never had more then 5 fails in a row.
Ok i have a question about ur guys math....... Why would u waste money after the 2nd fail? fail 1 still have 2/3 odds, fail twice ur odds suck so u buy the third one......
why go 0/6 means u wasted at least 3 or 4 full crafts. u cant tell me it costs 30 mil to craft a drac bow.........
30mil x 6 crafts fail = 180 m failed. If after 2nd fail (only used 60 mil craft) u bought a 180m drac bow (current price on phoenix) u would only have lost 60m and have a drac bow.
at ur guys math u lost 180m and have nothing............
i doubt that random crafters can do it for that cheap. such ppl mostly buy alloy, syn cokes, s-crys and gems from sellshops. in that case its more 80-90m per bow and their loss is way higher.
i also met once guy who asked me why ppl craft at all. he bought everything needed for a AM (costed 200m) and sell price was at 190m^^
Ok i have a question about ur guys math....... Why would u waste money after the 2nd fail? fail 1 still have 2/3 odds, fail twice ur odds suck so u buy the third one......
Ye, what nanashi said, u don't think u gonna fail all the crafts, u know it's possible but u dont think it'll happen to u untill it does xD Also there's always a chance to get a rare thing, if the thing u're crafting is also rare, it could bring u nice profit. Like once failed 3 dc boots crafts (when prices were bit higher than now, besides I needed for myself) so I fail 3 in a row and next time rare on the first craft, I know this doesnt happen too often but still, theres a chance and since I farmed most mats myself, was ok. But meh dynasty weapon fails, that kinda sux :P I try to farm at least the AA for it and buy the rest. But I'll say again that crafting can be very painful :/ that's why imo u should consider failure as possibility. Make AQ instance too so I can get one! >.<
30mil x 6 crafts fail = 180 m failed. If after 2nd fail (only used 60 mil craft) u bought a 180m drac bow (current price on phoenix) u would only have lost 60m and have a drac bow.
at ur guys math u lost 180m and have nothing............
this is what i dont understand.....
This is what I called "risk management" when you craft for yourselves. Usually most of the ready made stuff (don't discuss the OE items) can be bought for slightly more then the double price of one craft pack (all the mats+recipe+keyparts). So the smart aproach is to make calculations and decide what you will craft (risking the fails) and what you will buy. Because when I craft 40 pieces once after another (and they all have almost the same crafting cost) I don't care if I fail 5 or even 6 times in a row. Because I know for all the 40 crafts I will succeed 21-27 times nevertheless. Which in the worse scenario will leave me with at least 5 items pure profit (you need only 16 items to get even).
The truth is most of the people who craft for themselves don't have the slightest idea how much the craft pack costs. They see the some mats costing 1000-2000a and think "Wow! How cheap is if I craft it! And those filthy dwarves how much they charge! I will craft it myself and will spare a fortune!" But if they calculated how much mats they need and how much the craft costs them they will be terrified. Because they are casual crafters and as such usually are buyng the mats even more expensive then those who sell and buy all the time. And even the mats you have in the WH are not free either (although they consider them to be "free"). They have a cost too and you can sell them for adena.
yes but 6/40 is still only 15% fail . what im talking about is if u are planning to craft 40, as soon as u fail the 24th time, u should then just buy the rest. Instead ppl still craft and fail, and lose more. u should never craft more if uv just blown more than 60%. Then ur working against the odds. Its called cutting ur losses.
But also travversly as soon as uve crafted 16 don care about blowing them either. Because its pure profit.
yes but 6/40 is still only 15% fail . what im talking about is if u are planning to craft 40, as soon as u fail the 24th time, u should then just buy the rest. Instead ppl still craft and fail, and lose more. u should never craft more if uv just blown more than 60%. Then ur working against the odds. Its called cutting ur losses.
But also travversly as soon as uve crafted 16 don care about blowing them either. Because its pure profit.
Previously I explained about the difference between crafting for profit and crafting for "own needs". The example is real and is what I was doing when several months was craftting for profit. But I stopped after several months because this is extremely time consuming. For those several months (not more then 4) I crafted more then 250 items (60% and 70%) for profit and I profitted lots of billions. But I got tired and stopped:-)
So in this game ADENA = TIME. This is true even if you are botting for adena.
wow i think we are passing each other in diff directions... my comment is about the math not about the time lol u want time consuming u aughta try and sell 2mil shots a day for 3 months lol 24 hrs a day, 4 accts in dif places, 3 hrs crafting, 12hrs watching the store, 8 hrs sleep every day for 3months lol
wow i think we are passing each other in diff directions... my comment is about the math not about the time lol u want time consuming u aughta try and sell 2mil shots a day for 3 months lol 24 hrs a day, 4 accts in dif places, 3 hrs crafting, 12hrs watching the store, 8 hrs sleep every day for 3months lol
Basicly the topic was about the adena making. Yours is a good way to make adena too and it too needs MUCH time. It is like in the real life - you cannot work only 3-4 hours per week and want to get rich.
The example I gave was because of some people says "Craft, blah, blah, blah... I never really crafted for serious but I know you cannot earn serious money by crafting! How do I know? I don't know but I hope if I repeat this mantra many times it will become truth"
There are people that are lucky.... Crafting anything below 100% is a gamble. You could craft 20 items all at once and still fail every single one. Months spent collecting such materials is basically waisted and you've lost all that possible revenue from selling the mats.
SO:
Crafting is still a gamble, Some are lucky some arn't. If your lucky your can make some serious coin very quickly, if your average, you'll usually make a little more then what you lose, and if your in the unlucky group that i am in, it's 100% failure and the growing thought that "this isn't possible, statistically speaking, the next one is so highly unlikely to fail, i have to at least give it another try", but unfortunately fails yet again.
I've now reached the point of so many failures in a row, on just about anything out there, it's gotten so frustrating that I and I know others will just try to craft just to see if that craft happens to be the one. How many people do you know that have failed 20-30+ S grade crafts back to back..... not many, and it's funny as hell when an entire alliance starts cheering you on and giving you hope that there is NO way your next one won't craft successfully, and when you try and it fails again, they are utterly dumbfounded and don't beleive it. Even more halarious is when you get a bunch of ally members to go with you to craft all at the same time, and say out of 4 people, 3 suceed, and ironically the one that doesn't is... me (or the person that has the worst luck ever).
This goes with Enchanting to.
Crafting and OE are the biggest money makers, OE typically is far more high risk, but those are the facts of the matter.
The only option available is to start playing a dwarf full time and spoil basic mats and whatnot till your blind to resell.
Another is lvling soul crystals, but the chances of suceeding in anything above stage 10 is rare. Stage 13's have little value now, either lvling a 10 through to 12 which is worth about 60mil on the server, or buy one (much quicker) only to turn around and sell for 80-90mil. Might take a few weeks to get it from 12 to 13..... but it's better then 10 to 12 in half a year.
Actually what seems to be the best money maker is scamming, people making millions daily off others that make a quick honest mistake, or aren't paying attention at all.
the thing you fail to realize when saying something should be done about the ebayers is that there are more of them then non ebayers, get rid of all the bots and asian farmers and who is going to be left to gather materials and sell stuff in giran? Not to mention 95% of people w ** play do buy adena, and when you take the ability to do that away from them they'll lose interest and move on to something easier to play with less of a money grind like warcraft. Thereby Leaving you all alone on a dead server and in the same situation you were in before you complained.
Having 3 accounts is not that much. Everyone can afford it - at least everyone who can affor a decent PC and non-stop Inet connection. Not to mention is cheaper then buyng adena or botting.
People are too cheap to realize this. They complain about not being able to afford a second account. If that's the case, you should not be paying for the one you do have.
The basic rule in this game is adena = time.
Where can I find these rules?
That is not a rule, that's a justification that people invented to explain the ridiculousness of that aspect of the game.
It's just as ridiculous as the crap about there are two grinds, one for adena and one for XP.
That is pure justification, and that's the only way it makes any lick of sense.
The game was balanced with Dwarves in mind, but the fundamental design of the economic system in this game is flawed beyond repair. It's broken, and that's why people eBuy stuff.
Instead of fixing the issue, they decided to put more money sinks in the game. In the end, this heavily penalyzes the legit playerbase. They egg the issue on, and they don't mind egging the issue on because they are less naive than 99% of the people who post on these forums.
eBayers are usually your most loyal customers, because they have more skin in the game than a legit player. All you have are pixels, but they have a substantial RL monetary investment in Lineage II. That is why the cheaters usually aren't the first players to quit when the game goes to . It's like throwing money down the drain for them (they will usually try to cash out instead, and the game's design should be such that this isn't possible - but that's for another thread).
I didn't have any problems deactivating my accounts with 3B+ worth of gear on them because I didn't use my CC to buy it, so it means -literally- nothing to me.
People are too cheap to realize this. They complain about not being able to afford a second account. If that's the case, you should not be paying for the one you do have.
this is the most idiotic thing i've read so far in this thread i think..
Why in the hell should anyone NEED more then one account...
you shouldn't NEED to have more then one account to do anything, most people started with one account, and the only reason they got a 2nd typically is to have a boxed buffer when ncsoft basically rolled the buffers into being the most boring class to play/useless for anyone to play full time.
Now it's gotten to the point where people are now expecting someone to have multiple accounts?
it's one thing to pay 15 bucks a month for a game.... it's completely another to start double/tripling that expense.
Anyone that thinks having to accounts or more is normal and that anyone that only has one account and cannot justify/afford any more then 1 shouldn't be playing should be full on shot.
I agree, u should not need to have multiple accts. But then u should not need to party either. many ppl have said "why play a MMORPG solo?" because ppl only want their own agenda.
In asia most ppl work together for a common goal. Its in politics, its in business, its in their fundamental belief system. In NA we beleive in individuality. Its in our politics, our busines, our fundamental belief system.
The only work around for this to keep the NA population happy was to cater to our philosophy. Therefore, more solo spots, noob buffs, and making it easier to have multiple accts.
The question of being able to afford multiple accts is simple. Its a matter of importance. This game is made for males 16-25 generally( not have any real stats but just look at DE females and u get the idea lol) Males 16-25 spend more on throw away income than any orther age range. This is an actual fact. Think this way. How much do they spend on cigarettes, alchohol, their cars, sports and such. Most guys spend hundreds of dollars a month on these products. I work as an auditor in a hotel. The average alchohol consumed on a normal weekday is about $2000. On a week end? $10000. A day.
So who pays for mutiple accts? Guys like myself who dont smoke, dont drink, dont drive, dont have a house. I spend $100/ month on this game and its only about 1/4 of the money i have to spend on throw away items.
So while i agree that the original poster who said ne one who cant afford to pay for multiple accts is a bit off base, it would be better to say those who dont choose to pay for mutiple accts have different priorites for their throw away money:)
Could I afford multiple accounts? Yes.
Would my system be able to handle 3 accounts running? Yes.
Should I be required to have multiple accounts to enjoy the game? Heck NO!
this is the most idiotic thing i've read so far in this thread i think..
Why in the hell should anyone NEED more then one account...
you shouldn't NEED to have more then one account to do anything, most people started with one account, and the only reason they got a 2nd typically is to have a boxed buffer when ncsoft basically rolled the buffers into being the most boring class to play/useless for anyone to play full time.
Now it's gotten to the point where people are now expecting someone to have multiple accounts?
it's one thing to pay 15 bucks a month for a game.... it's completely another to start double/tripling that expense.
Anyone that thinks having to accounts or more is normal and that anyone that only has one account and cannot justify/afford any more then 1 shouldn't be playing should be full on shot.
I have three accounts.. main, se, pp. I got tired of shouting LF party on lowbie sub, or getting in a group and having it swell to 9 people in a catacomb. Not to mention it is a LOT quicker to solo yourself.. then rely on people to randomly be on and be kind enough to group you from lvls 1 to 78. Once you get into HB.. 9 man parties because a lot easier... especially if you are a support class and not one of 50 DDs spamming for group.
and i'm trying to craft for just myself......
If you suspect that you're a statistical abnormality you can easily test it out. Log on to PTS and try a 500 crafts or a 500 OEs. You may not like what you find though. I seem to have a success rate of 41%. But I guess I'm just "unlucky".
Having 3 accounts is not that much. Everyone can afford it - at least everyone who can affor a decent PC and non-stop Inet connection. Not to mention is cheaper then buyng adena or botting.
The basic rule in this game is adena = time. For example you can easily make 150-200kk for about 3 hours (Teon prices) if you get up early before the server gets overcrowded and make some energy stones. But again if you have proper buffer and good melee char you can make 50kk for 1 hour from KE; We play with 2 acc - my wife and I; and we made about 1 bil from the cubics only; even if you are low level - around 45 you can try and assemble a party to kill lvl 40 RB for eggs (and fun).
But do not expect to make *huge* money just by playing - making serious money requires time and dedication.
It is true - many players can play only several hours per week. But it should be obvious they cannot earn the adena a dedicated player can earn. And they should not complain. This may be a game but it is like the real life - who works only several hours weekly rarely can earn big money... if you are not Paris Hilton of course:-)
Absolutely my point. You invest some of your intelligence and life experience and you will always get results.
I just gave the guy an idea how to make adena fast. There are a lot of ways of making adena they only differ on the time vs. result ratio.
I neve said you can't make adena if you have only one account. Of course you can make a lot of adena if you have just one account but it will probably take you more time. Maybe if you are a resourcefull person you won't need more time. It actually depends on your own abilities :):):)
this is the most idiotic thing i've read so far in this thread i think..
Why in the hell should anyone NEED more then one account...
you shouldn't NEED to have more then one account to do anything, most people started with one account, and the only reason they got a 2nd typically is to have a boxed buffer when ncsoft basically rolled the buffers into being the most boring class to play/useless for anyone to play full time.
Now it's gotten to the point where people are now expecting someone to have multiple accounts?
it's one thing to pay 15 bucks a month for a game.... it's completely another to start double/tripling that expense.
Anyone that thinks having to accounts or more is normal and that anyone that only has one account and cannot justify/afford any more then 1 shouldn't be playing should be full on shot.
First of all I never said that anyone "SHOULD" need 3 or more accounts.
I just made a suggestion to the OP to use a well known effective scheme for fast leveling and fast making of adena. As you may know the word "fast" is a relative concept. For me fast making of adena is making 1bil adena per week. I know of people who are making 5bil adena per week and my concept of "fast" is actually a "slow" concept for them. On the other hand I know of people who can't even make 100 millions of adena per month so I assume that my concept of "fast" is an "extremely or impossibly fast" for them.
At the time I originally suggested to the OP to make 3 accounts and use the manor system I just finished leveling a character from 55 to 65 and another one from 40 to 60 and I just made the calculations of the income I got from those two characters. So when I suggested it I was 100% sure that the method is as effective as it was 1 year ago when I last did it and as effective as it was 2 years ago when I first did it.
The point is - don't blame everyone that they are ebayers, botters, etc. but read some, think some and act some. You may get surprized when you take a look at the results :)
I am not expecting people to have multiple accounts. I just pointed out the benefit of having multiple accounts. NOTHING ELSE!
Everyone is free to play the way they want to as far as they don't brake the EULA.
If you want to play with one account it's fine with me. If somebody wants to play with half account it's fine with me again. But don't come to the forum and say "OMG, I am playing with only one account, I spend 5 hours a week for this game, I don't read, I don't learn but I still want be as effective as those who play 50+ hours a week and I want to have more adena than they do, so if anyone has more adena than me, should 100% be either botter or ebayer or both!"
That's another point of mine.
The original point was a suggestion meant to help the guy. You on the contrary are not trying to help anybody. You are just flaming back and forth because obviously you have nothing better to do.