With the recent launch of Goddess of Destruction, a new Reputation System was implemented to replace the old Karma system for player killing. If you PK another player, you will receive negative reputation points. In order to reduce your negative reputation, you need to kill mobs equivalent to your level or higher to get back to 0. While you have negative reputation, you cannot gain XP or SP.
Players may see this as a daunting task with the amount of negative reputation points they receive for PKing another player, but the Reputation System is currently working as intended; to prevent griefing between players.
We understand that this can be extremely frustrating. We'll be forwarding all the feedback we received to the Dev team. However, at this time there is no current plan to adjust the Reputation System, but we will keep you informed if anything does immediately change.
Ok, just want to say that it would be great to have a place for pkers.. i mean.. it's own city.. (like Floran but with more features..) it would be nice to have some gaining reputation quests starting in there.. difficult quests ofc.
Also this could be related in some grade make a new faction.. smth like shilen followers.. (red name = shillen followers, white name = neutrals, green name = epic heroes of light? lol)
+1 to Berukan. That is a great suggestion and I would really like to see it implemented in near future. I'm not so fond of PK-ing, nor do I like PK-ers much but I agree that they should also have their place in this world of L2 ;)
So, I accidentaly killed a person (for me it showed that the person was flaged, but w/e), ofcourse i got -720 rep. 1 same level mob give you 1 rep and you don't gain any by dying, WTF ? its impossible to kill 720 mobs with no buffs, heals and when every1 is hunting you. well it is possible, but mosachistic. I got -300 karma in what ? The whole day. My char is lvl 41 and if u pk some1, you might aswell roll a new char, i'm almost out of suplies and so on. 41 might not be that bad, but what if your char is over 70 ? You know what I we'll see soon ? 4k NC coin to gain positive rep.
I WAS JUST LIKE A LITTLE KID FARMING IN RUINS OF AGONY... i saw a flagged mage running, i follow himfor kill him and earn my 1st pvp so i try and try to attack him, he is going to unflagg when i finaly hit him, he is not flagged and i pk that little mage :(
BUT NOW I HAVE 720 KARMA AND I CANT SLOW THIS WITH JKILL 700 MOPB WITOUT GAINING EXP!!!!
I do understand why they made this, but I don't understand why so harsh.. At least 5-7 times bigger rep gain from mobs and everyone would be perfectly happy and as well wouldn't pk as it would take a great deal of time to take it off as well.
At this very moment, if you get PK, you'll be doomed if you have no friends to help you. You won't be able to get into the town, you can't do nothing, except to waste 1 day of your life for pointless grinding. This is too much, NC Soft, you have to do something about that.
I'm also going to have to agree that PKers really need a place in L2; that is half the appeal of the game the fact that you have a chance of being PKed/Ganked at any given moment.
I probably should point out that I'm probably one of the biggest carebears to play MMOs, but I do enjoy the danger aspect that the PKers can introduce to the game.
One PK city!? for what!? Red cant gain XP or SP, so in fact u are one dead char until can raise again ur rep to 0,
Nothing to say, saddly move from NC transforming L2 in just another carebear game, like many others in the market now, u have the chance of be braves and try to catch one great group of players boring of themeparks, bee diferents and remain in the path of one game more hardcore and sandbox, but well, these dont happen.
WoW just score another shadow more to his list, :(
1 thing ppl seems to forget is that **** happens!! You know when you do next target in a pool of mobs and players, that you target a blinking purple guy by accident, then kill him and go RED.
What that on purpose?, was my intend to piss someone off?, being abusive?? NO!
I think thats what NCSoft and all their followers seems to forget. The system is way to harsh for nothing. Under 5 pks, you should be able to manage your karma easier, above that, well **** happens but not that often.
And to all those "Lol to you, just dont go around PKing ppl you meanie" guys. I cant wait to say your face when you'll go red in TW or clanwars, cause some random naked dwarf stood in the middle of the fight and you accidentally hit him. Ppl will abuse this issue. Hope someone will take a looking in that. Cause now its all happy and fun, the servers are buzzing, but a bit like in the earlier years of L2, I dont think it will last.
To NC Soft:
If you wanted to actually remove PKing from the game, you could've just removed it instead of making people to spend their time without any reason or quit their game. It would've made more sense. Now instead, you made it 'possible' to remove the negative reputation, but just so so if you only kill one man and only if you have a friend to help you, otherwise it's just GG for the char. I think it's gonna get worse at the end of the week as people are going to get this more and they'll realize how **** the system is, most of them might quit disappointed. So good job NC Soft dev team.
Ok, just want to say that it would be great to have a place for pkers.. i mean.. it's own city.. (like Floran but with more features..) it would be nice to have some gaining reputation quests starting in there.. difficult quests ofc.
Also this could be related in some grade make a new faction.. smth like shilen followers.. (red name = shillen followers, white name = neutrals, green name = epic heroes of light? lol)
**** it! that would make some cheesy fun at l2..!
Yeah, I agree.
I PK'd a bot that was interrupting my grinding, and instantly -720 rep. Which is fine, I guess, except with how many mobs I have to kill to work it off, my buffs run out by then which makes killing a problem.
Reputation should also go down over time as well honestly, -720 is quite a bit, especially for people who have to deal with densely populated areas.
While I understand you guys want to discourage griefing, you also need to remember some of us need or want to kill bots that are disrupting our gameplay.
You might want to make it so that reputation changes by more tha 2 points per kill...
I really enjoyed the old system, I don't see why we had to have it changed.
EDIT:As a LV48 Blade Dancer, it took me two hours to work off -720 Reputation.
Got to agree with StN on that one, if PK was such a problem, just removing it from the game would of probably been a better idea then this new system. Something like If you attack a toon and he doesn't fight back you can pass his CP but cant hit his HP.
Got to agree with StN on that one, if PK was such a problem, just removing it from the game would of probably been a better idea then this new system. Something like If you attack a toon and he doesn't fight back you can pass his CP but cant hit his HP.
One of the things that made this game different than most others, and now they want to get rid of it.
So, I accidentaly killed a person (for me it showed that the person was flaged, but w/e), ofcourse i got -720 rep. 1 same level mob give you 1 rep and you don't gain any by dying, WTF ? its impossible to kill 720 mobs with no buffs, heals and when every1 is hunting you. well it is possible, but mosachistic. I got -300 karma in what ? The whole day. My char is lvl 41 and if u pk some1, you might aswell roll a new char, i'm almost out of suplies and so on. 41 might not be that bad, but what if your char is over 70 ? You know what I we'll see soon ? 4k NC coin to gain positive rep.
Using an SoE took me to a good place to grind off my -rep. :/
But yeah, no buffs or heals IS an issue. I had to pop one of my Fresh Milk items because my buffs ran out.
One of the things that made this game different than most others, and now they want to get rid of it.
That's my point. They didn't remove because they know it's important and it makes the game special. But they overdid it with the penalty. 7 times less penalty should be just around enough. 100 mobs to kill, not fun, but possible and not as requiring, but still you can't go on a rampage with this, unless you want to delete your char.
That's my point. They didn't remove because they know it's important and it makes the game special. But they overdid it with the penalty. 7 times less penalty should be just around enough. 100 mobs to kill, not fun, but possible and not as requiring, but still you can't go on a rampage with this, unless you want to delete your char.
I'm getting 2 pts redux every kill currently, so thats 360 monsters that need to die.
However, if you're in a group, you only get 1 pts redux.
If you're purple and kill someone else who is purple, do you still get a **** ton of -rep?
i have -2000 rep points tell me how to clean that .... do i have to grind 8 hours ? withouth soulshot cos i cant buy it or withouth buff? its really easier to make another char to lvl 40 to clean this .....
i have -2000 rep points tell me how to clean that .... do i have to grind 8 hours ? withouth soulshot cos i cant buy it or withouth buff? its really easier to make another char to lvl 40 to clean this .....
You're not playing this game alone - ask your friends and clannies for buffs and shots, and to rez you if you get killed too.
My new character on Shilen server is 54, I just killed a mage that was KSing me all the time, he didn't turn purple cos he knew I would get perma red with this new system, now I have no buffs, running out of shots and I have to kill over 400 mobs with no exp/sp just to clean my reputation points... so I have to let all the mages steal my mobs cos I can't do anything about it.
Two of my friends had to start over again with new characters cos they can't clean their rep. points with such a number of ppl running around on the new servers.
Thanks NCsoft we cant make justice by our own hands now.
This is really one of the good things Lineage II had. Chaotic Players.
That was something that NONE of the other MMORPG games have out there.
Punishing chaotic players and trying to force the last 7 years of unbiased leveling, playing, and fighting to a more "friendly and peacefully" world just dont cut it.
I really hope that somehow chaotic players (PKs) could stand a chance to reverse karma. Specially now that thousands of new players are logging in to play.
Last night some dude made a player called just like a quest mob and sitted right next to where it should spawn.:eek:
Everybody had macros to get it first, so the only result was a PK running scared for 3 inches till someone blast it off. That dude had no intention of killing someone else, but had to run and try to counter the karma between 5000 other guys, while the troll player did the same thing over and over again.:mad:
PLEASE HAVE MERCY WITH PK (CHAOTIC PLAYERS) THEY ARE THE SOUL OF THE GAME!!!! WITHOUT THEM IT'S JUST ANOTHER SIMS-KINDA-GAME:(
Don't go red so casually, and personally, its nice to see the end of killing off your red. In the future you'll know the highlevel reds are serious people.
Don't go red so casually, and personally, its nice to see the end of killing off your red. In the future you'll know the highlevel reds are serious people.
Actually for me it kinda sucks.
I'm making a treasure hunter. But every new quest for the path of awakening has to be done by every player. So, i'm the right place, target the MOB, start runing and bang. A wizzard stole it. Nevermind.
Again
Again
again
again
then my patience goes down. A little backstab as a warning.
he goes, and someone else with the same strategy
and again
again
again
again.
backstab, bang bang, PK. And keep on my quest. Trying to fix the bad karma.
(old days)
Now i have over six thousand players logged. and over one hundred killing the same mob for the quest. And the only solution is to make a new pj cause lowering 720 it is almost impossible.
i think the PK system is fine now, as Sent said dont be so casual about it anymore.
what annoys me is that i just got pk'ed by some dwarf (im lvl 43) i was white the whole time and he didnt go red, nor did he have to through my CP first?! then i go back to find him and hes white? looks like its not that difficult to lose your red?
i think the PK system is fine now, as Sent said dont be so casual about it anymore.
what annoys me is that i just got pk'ed by some dwarf (im lvl 43) i was white the whole time and he didnt go red, nor did he have to through my CP first?! then i go back to find him and hes white? looks like its not that difficult to lose your red?
If you have Fame points, you can spend them to get rid of your chaotic status.
This is lame, hate this system, i haven't pked but **** can happens, don't tell me i'll have to kill 700 mobs in a crowded server... thats bs, it should be 10x, 10 reps back when you die, 10 back when you kill a mob. But that way it's ******ed.
This is lame, hate this system, i haven't pked but **** can happens, don't tell me i'll have to kill 700 mobs in a crowded server... thats bs, it should be 10x, 10 reps back when you die, 10 back when you kill a mob. But that way it's ******ed.
Its only 360 mobs, if you're solo.
But thats per PK you've done.
You regain 2 positive reputation every time you kill something ~Your LVL or higher.
In true life if i hit a man, maybe cops get me and throw me into jail.
if i can get away with it, i have 2 choices. Keep doing it or don't and ask for forgiveness
In Lineage II the thing WAS the same.
If a GM caught a chaotic player, it got canned.
if someone else got him, Piñata time!:D
and if you managed to get away, hardly but not impossible, you could get your karma down in an hour or two, loose (or keep) some exp and move on.
If the chaotic player was hard to catch, you make a good search party and started hunting. Not a quest related type of gaming, but fun as hell.
if the chaotic player beats all of you , you level up harder, try to get all the better skills and items. You work it up. Train with your clan buddies and have a "plan b" in case of PK.
Now, the story changes completely.
if you kill a player, and become chaotic, a GM may catch you and force you to some jail time.
if you kill a player, you WON'T BE ABLE TO RECOVER REPUTATION POINTS, unless you have a mega party of friends guarding you up. And all of them should be of higher levels, 'cause you can't get buffs, quests or anything else from towns or villages.
if you run to the guards to loose exp and regain "your freedom", it won't matter, because you must kill mobs to add points.
and you have to kill mobs, being mobbed by green labeled players.
If this new karma system keeps up, the hole esence of the game goes down the toilet. 7 years of freedom wasted down in order to make the biggest MMORPG game like a carebear quest game.
We don't like this. (Only girls do)
This is a battle-rpg-pvp game. Like Nature, the power of the fittest and more prepared.
PLEASE TURN THIS THING OFF. STOP KILLING THE GAME!
Btw: Everything else is wonderful. I'm flying. (when im not frustrated with this)
The reason I quit Aion was because the overal pvp and pk sucked hard with every patch ncsoft made. We once went with a full group to the other saction just to see our selves hit 0 and 1 on a player of our level purely because "rifting got nerfed" whilst rifting really was all the reason to play the game, just like pvp/pk is the reason to play Lineage. I wouldn't think twice about leaving Lineage as well as soon as it gets just as carebear as Aion.
Pvp, pk is the appealing part of Lineage, taking that away would be nothing but stupid. It would only benefit the few which play the game with certain motivation and thoughts far from what Lineage has been seen c1.
The reason I quit Aion was because the overal pvp and pk sucked hard with every patch ncsoft made. We once went with a full group to the other saction just to see our selves hit 0 and 1 on a player of our level purely because "rifting got nerfed" whilst rifting really was all the reason to play the game, just like pvp/pk is the reason to play Lineage. I wouldn't think twice about leaving Lineage as well as soon as it gets just as carebear as Aion.
Pvp, pk is the appealing part of Lineage, taking that away would be nothing but stupid. It would only benefit the few which play the game with certain motivation and thoughts far from what Lineage has been seen c1.
I played C1 to C4 with a friend a long time ago. We got out because of work and family. Since then a lot of things have changed. Some i liked, some don't.
But this is by far the worst thing that has ever received this magnificent piece of software. I really hope NCsoft come to senses and do a rollback.
I would gladly re-do all the quests and leveling with the old karma system. (in Shilen server tho) :)
I played C1 to C4 with a friend a long time ago. We got out because of work and family. Since then a lot of things have changed. Some i liked, some don't.
But this is by far the worst thing that has ever received this magnificent piece of software. I really hope NCsoft come to senses and do a rollback.
I would gladly re-do all the quests and leveling with the old karma system. (in Shilen server tho) :)
I can't really understand the logic behind all this anyway. Their, to be said, stolen project Tera isn't far from being launched, there will be many other games comming out in 2012 yet they only try to pleasure the "carebear" population which to my believes isn't even 10% of the population playing this game.
The worst part is, just as you said, they change a project that exists for years into another project just for the shake of "being new" and other behind lying motivations.
The reason Lineage II was low on population and even the worse private servers had more population then retail was because they did little changes to the system which slowly notified the players of the bigger mistakes just like this update. Therefor it means nothing that Lineage went F2p, if the system is going to change this much players will seek for the real Lineage II and end up at private servers anyway.
I can't really understand the logic behind all this anyway. Their, to be said, stolen project Tera isn't far from being launched, there will be many other games comming out in 2012 yet they only try to pleasure the "carebear" population which to my believes isn't even 10% of the population playing this game.
The worst part is, just as you said, they change a project that exists for years into another project just for the shake of "being new" and other behind lying motivations.
The reason Lineage II was low on population and even the worse private servers had more population then retail was because they did little changes to the system which slowly notified the players of the bigger mistakes just like this update. Therefor it means nothing that Lineage went F2p, if the system is going to change this much players will seek for the real Lineage II and end up at private servers anyway.
NCSoft must stop thinking the "Microsoft" way, and start thinking the "Linux" way.
"If it ain't broken, why fix it?" Seven years with chaotic players, and now, the change?? Why now?? The only reason everyone stayed here was the option to be "A BAD PLAYER". Every other game is very restrictive. If you try to go left, it turns you right.
This is a very sad time for L2. I was hoping to get back in. I haven't slept in 2 days leveling up a TH from ground up. With all the extra thousand players, the oversaturated quests. It has been a pain... but i've managed to get lvl 45 in 36 hours more or less.
I dont know why so much QQ about this...
When it was first announced there will be free PKs in so called "clan wars" inposed by the bots on the legits, every1 was so excited (except the legits, of course, but they designed ways to avoid the griefing), now you want free PK WITHOUT the "wars" ?
I mean how lazy can you be if you think that you should have instant gratification at killing those pesky legits ? You cant be bothered to have perma reds ? To make special clans to PK all over the place in "wars" ?
Afraid ppl will stay out of clans ? It wont happen, the clan skills and leveling are so easy these days that clan skills really come handy, it is worth a PK now and then when you have your rezzer close.
Get to work ppl, want to Pwn ? Then take all the necessary steps (special chars, special clans, special reds to kill and gain rep, etc).
Good luck and cut the QQ.
I dont know why so much QQ about this...
When it was first announced there will be free PKs in so called "clan wars" inposed by the bots on the legits, every1 was so excited (except the legits, of course, but they designed ways to avoid the griefing), now you want free PK WITHOUT the "wars" ?
I mean how lazy can you be if you think that you should have instant gratification at killing those pesky legits ? You cant be bothered to have perma reds ? To make special clans to PK all over the place in "wars" ?
Afraid ppl will stay out of clans ? It wont happen, the clan skills and leveling are so easy these days that clan skills really come handy, it is worth a PK now and then when you have your rezzer close.
Get to work ppl, want to Pwn ? Then take all the necessary steps (special chars, special clans, special reds to kill and gain rep, etc).
Good luck and cut the QQ.
The risc of losing equipment you worked hard for is enough of punishment or grief when one decides to go red. Making a new character for the purpose you could, and intended to, do on your pvp character is nothing but unrealistic.
In true life if i hit a man, maybe cops get me and throw me into jail.
if i can get away with it, i have 2 choices. Keep doing it or don't and ask for forgiveness
In Lineage II the thing WAS the same.
If a GM caught a chaotic player, it got canned.
if someone else got him, Piñata time!:D
and if you managed to get away, hardly but not impossible, you could get your karma down in an hour or two, loose (or keep) some exp and move on.
If the chaotic player was hard to catch, you make a good search party and started hunting. Not a quest related type of gaming, but fun as hell.
if the chaotic player beats all of you , you level up harder, try to get all the better skills and items. You work it up. Train with your clan buddies and have a "plan b" in case of PK.
Now, the story changes completely.
if you kill a player, and become chaotic, a GM may catch you and force you to some jail time.
if you kill a player, you WON'T BE ABLE TO RECOVER REPUTATION POINTS, unless you have a mega party of friends guarding you up. And all of them should be of higher levels, 'cause you can't get buffs, quests or anything else from towns or villages.
if you run to the guards to loose exp and regain "your freedom", it won't matter, because you must kill mobs to add points.
and you have to kill mobs, being mobbed by green labeled players.
If this new karma system keeps up, the hole esence of the game goes down the toilet. 7 years of freedom wasted down in order to make the biggest MMORPG game like a carebear quest game.
We don't like this. (Only girls do)
This is a battle-rpg-pvp game. Like Nature, the power of the fittest and more prepared.
PLEASE TURN THIS THING OFF. STOP KILLING THE GAME!
Btw: Everything else is wonderful. I'm flying. (when im not frustrated with this)
Wrong. If you hit a man on the street; you WILL be arrested and thrown to jail, then depending on th einjueries that person sustained, you will get a fine, jail time and you will have to pay his medical bills.
If you randomly kill a man in most countries, you will go to jail, no questions asked, with a permanent record that you are a killer.
Kill more than one, and on top of the above, you get harsher and harsher penalties and a longer jail sentence.
L2 karma system was NOT the same when you could wash off karma in a matter of minutes at high levels, and reduce your PK counts so they might as well never happenned.
It brought us to this: people asking for the free for all easy peasy ok I will just kill this guy who is mildly annoying me; instead of it being, you know; an act that should have heavy consequences.
Before it was: bwaaaaa someone is ksing me, KILL. even at low levels you could somewhat wash karma off quickly. At high levels you only end up permared if you CHOOSE TO. moderate grinding at your local spot with some friends and one PK is out in a couple minutes. You can come in and be white again before the killed can return with friends.
On this new system, you will think more than twice to do it. 720 mobs go by fast, but not THAT fast; you can't resort anymore to option 1: KILL.
I don't like this system.
My suggestion would be to increase the multiplier of the reputation points/ mob. At this point the measure taken is too drastic, from 5-6 mobs killed in the past we went to 800 mobs to get rid of 1 pk. I suggest it should increase to something like 50 per mob.
Another option would be something like jailing. You have to stay in game for a day/pk..
And the last option.. Do some quests..
I am not a player that gives pk usually. What happened in my case, I was doing my 2nd class transfer quest and everyone was staying in a line.. Then comes someone who would not let us get the quest item.. So everybody started hitting him.. I was the one to get the last hit and get the PK.
Wrong. If you hit a man on the street; you WILL be arrested and thrown to jail, then depending on th einjueries that person sustained, you will get a fine, jail time and you will have to pay his medical bills.
If you randomly kill a man in most countries, you will go to jail, no questions asked, with a permanent record that you are a killer.
Kill more than one, and on top of the above, you get harsher and harsher penalties and a longer jail sentence.
L2 karma system was NOT the same when you could wash off karma in a matter of minutes at high levels, and reduce your PK counts so they might as well never happenned.
It brought us to this: people asking for the free for all easy peasy ok I will just kill this guy who is mildly annoying me; instead of it being, you know; an act that should have heavy consequences.
Before it was: bwaaaaa someone is ksing me, KILL. even at low levels you could somewhat wash karma off quickly. At high levels you only end up permared if you CHOOSE TO. moderate grinding at your local spot with some friends and one PK is out in a couple minutes. You can come in and be white again before the killed can return with friends.
On this new system, you will think more than twice to do it. 720 mobs go by fast, but not THAT fast; you can't resort anymore to option 1: KILL.
The risc of losing equipment is enough of "heavy" consequenses. Please don't confuse a game with reality and also please do understand that the whole karma system besides siege and hero system is the only thing that makes Lineage II unique compared to other games. Might as well just close Lineage II and move everyone to Aion as soon as they also change things about siege.
Every act has consequenses, so if you annoy someone, trash talk etc. it's only normal to be killed. If you can't stand it, call your mates and kill the one that killed you. But don't leave acts such as annoying people, ksing mobs without consequenses. The whole "freedom" of actually making choices is what seperates Lineage II, with the few unique game mechanics gone this freedom will be lost.
I love how people think to make a point and actually stand behind their point and believe in it whilst they really just view the story from one side, their own favored side.
This is really one of the good things Lineage II had. Chaotic Players.
That was something that NONE of the other MMORPG games have out there.
Punishing chaotic players and trying to force the last 7 years of unbiased leveling, playing, and fighting to a more "friendly and peacefully" world just dont cut it.
I really hope that somehow chaotic players (PKs) could stand a chance to reverse karma. Specially now that thousands of new players are logging in to play.
Last night some dude made a player called just like a quest mob and sitted right next to where it should spawn.:eek:
Everybody had macros to get it first, so the only result was a PK running scared for 3 inches till someone blast it off. That dude had no intention of killing someone else, but had to run and try to counter the karma between 5000 other guys, while the troll player did the same thing over and over again.:mad:
PLEASE HAVE MERCY WITH PK (CHAOTIC PLAYERS) THEY ARE THE SOUL OF THE GAME!!!! WITHOUT THEM IT'S JUST ANOTHER SIMS-KINDA-GAME:(
And that's why you don't use force attack unless you want to PvP.
I have never accidentally PK'ed anyone simply because I don't use /attackforce ingame, if I want to attack someone that is white then I need to hold Ctrl down before starting the attack and every time I want to use skills.
The new systems does stop PKers in the sense of people who used to gear a char then just go PvPing if they went red no worries just keep going. So I guess in that way the system works!
People used to do this because they enjoyed the PvP the excitement the rush of being red people chasing/hunting, defending yourself as you burn off karma etc this was the old way...
I thought one of the reasons for CP when it was implemented back in what C3? C4? Was to give people a chance to turn around in open PvP to react/retaliate if they didn’t see there attacker coming etc gave them a bit of a 'buffer' before they lost HP also stopped people trying to lowering your HP while fighting mobs then letting mob kill you.
This didn't stop but helped prevent griefers in that sense and help give payers chance to like i say... react (if that be run fight hide bsoe etc)
Now to further protect the lowbies they implemented the newbie buff which stopped higher level players attacking them... this worked higher level players could no longer camp lowbys and kill them off. Job done lowbys protected from higher levels.
I lot of the time i used to go red was on bot trains in catacombs, when you had to kill off a party or 2 in order to get a room so you could exp, when you only had 2 hours or so to play once or twice a week this was rather annoying but still part of L2 so just do it crack on. For the most part people used to see you red see the dead bots just "lol" and run on. no to much fear of getting killed why working off your karma unless the bot owner came down with a higher level char.
So down to some more key points, why do people PK? Some for the hell of it some, because they enjoy the rush, some cause they just want to PvP and if u don’t defend or evade then oops your problem. Others because of clan wars, if the other side doesn’t accept the war Flag and PK if you desire.(that was part of the PvP aspect that L2 offered which other MMO's don’t)
Other people Pk'd because of grifers yes the people who come try and steal your drops as your surrounded by a bunch of mobs, players that come kill steal, or when your poling people they come mess with your trains which makes life harder for you, also if your exp-ing large area and have the spawn under your control and someone comes in to the same area. These are the people that don’t flag because they know they will loose in PvP these are the people that harass via PvE, making trains and "Fake Death" on you, healing mob when your on low health etc etc
The latter are reasons I believe most people "pk" in the game... now that points out the 2 different types of griefers the ones that attack you and the ones that mess with you. Now with the old system you had chance to react to both and do something about it, if you went RED because of that back to the grind and work it off.
This gives the impression it was easy to PK greifers and just grind it off, job done, in that sense i guess it was provided they didn’t come back with friends or re log to higher level char etc.. not to mention risk of dropping items & equipment and the fact that the more you PK the more karma you go so the longer it took to work off.
Okay new system, I haven’t PK'd anyone yet, but seems like people who go RED from messing about with friends (we all hit each other in game its fun, for instance having a laugh while chatting some one makes a joke you turn round slap them etc all fun part of L2) or people willing to defend there area from people messing/griefing with there exp are now being crucified for it.
This stops griefers in the sense of high level players or people that just want to kill players with no regards yes this tells them to think twice about PKing aimlessly. However for the players that grief without flagging... how do we defend against them just there same tactics back at them? (if we do that we just all end up in one big circle of harassment) we could just stop Exp so they cant harass us...? Swap areas I’m open to suggestions here?
Yes use fame to remove PK's but highly unlikely your going to survive to get into town to do so then there is also the fact a chatoic person can interact with a NPC, So unless you have a clan or a group of friends that are willing to stop there grind/raid/pvp
of there own to come help looks like you on your own, no buffs limited stock etc etc...
So this begs the question do people stop going red and we loose a part of L2 or do NCWest tweak the system... how to tweak? I’m not sure I’m not a game developer and have any experience in balancing... i just play games. (Casual player few hours a week)
What i do know is, with all the influx of players from other servers and the completely new players etc you going to see an increase in frustrated players, because they will be harassed by people kill stealing, drop robbing and messing leaching off your grind areas. (Technically no area is yours but its one of them unwritten rules of L2 you see some one exp u either pk take there spot or move on to another) and with all this griefing and harassment they will not be able to do anything without big consequences... So do we PK and prepare to take the rap because of over crowded areas at the start of a new server or because of influx of players. Do we defend our exp area which have just spent a hour grinding in or do we just move on and give up when some one starts this type of harassment, letting the PvP aspect die.
Overall this new PK system stops people outright killing you without regard but in other areas it hurts...
Please don’t let this game turn in other MMo's such as WoW (most pvp is instanced*yawn*), Open PvP is a very big part of L2 (its a key point that kept me playing for so long and brought me back after years off playing other MMO's) if some player is "annoying" you for whatever reason you can do something about it! (not just out right PK but you can talk to them negotiate warn them threaten them or PK) I’m just hoping this new system doesn’t loose that part of L2.
For now happy hunting and only go red if its the only solution available to the problem, griefers of whatever type beware your safe for now. But when people start to figure out what areas are quick kills for there levels so they can clean negative rep quickly beware as I’m sure we will see big clans lock down these areas while they clean members (higher levels). I have a feeling people will start poleing a lot more 2x rep loss per mob, 20 mobs a train = 9 trains 360 rep cleaned 1pk clean.
I’m also wondering if people are going to use PK status to there benefit probably BH how? Why? Simple… to farm items/adena as they don’t gain exp in chaotic state.... they can stay at set level to get optimum drop rate or stay within level range to spoil etc
This new system does have its flaws every system does but lets do it the old Official L2 way and figure out the best way to use this to our advantage (set the example to these new players). Not what seems to be the "private server way" of "omg gatekeeper rammed I cant click" (gm spawns 5 more GK) omg I cant level up areas to busy (gm increase exp/sp rate inserts custom level areas). This is official NCwest L2 not a back alley service from someone looking to get money by renting a server out every month.
Also as a note to previous posters, don’t whine to NCwest give a explanation of your situation/views and they are 100% more likely to listen. Remember this is a free game now so you can’t put out the I’m paying for this game card anymore.
what if the player was messing around witha friend and a new guy runs in middle and dies in 1 hit and ur stuck red because NO npc will talk too you. what do we do now do we quit the game and never play or fix the PK system where you lose karma by being on not only killing mobs. becuase i am STUCK in noob area thanks too this ****
Its bull**** and you know it we came to do pvp/pk not pve! who say that was great Idea about rep system go play WOW or something like that....
THere is no point to play lineage If I can't pk player and clean it in some minutes on mobs or by dead...Now who got karma in 20lvl probably they gonna creat new chars because to clean karma there isn't chance
Do something about PK fast because its makes players to delete Client.
this new system of PK is invented by 1 poor idiot that played a long in the unofficial server and he was pked everytime and now he got his revenge...THE NEW PK SYSTEM....THE CAREBEAR SYSTEM....SOON IN YOUR L2 WORLD!!...i really don't understand every f*king player of L2 (from c1 to god) choose L2 instead of WOW coz of the PK system!!you can't let ppl leave L2 for WOW(the worst game in the world!!!!)worst decision ever!!!....now i have to remake a char coz i didn't knew this!!and for a PK lover like me it's ****** hard to deal with!!.....last thing I LOVE TO SEE THE PPL SAYING :"OOOOOOO FINALLY THE PPL WON'T DO PK LIKE ALWAYS...WE ARE FREE TO PVE!!!"....REMEMBER I USED TO SAW RED PPL AROUND THE L2 WORLD THE FIRST THING I THOUGHT WAS:" OH YES!!!A ****** PK NOW I'LL TAKE HIS EQUIP!!!!" (MAYBE a lot of you forgot that a pk can drop his thing!!IDIOTS!!!!)...and no :"OH **** A PK!!!NOW HE'S GONNA **** ME AND I ONLY WANT TO PVEEEEEE NOOOOOOOOOOOOO PLEASE LET ME LIVE NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO"....WELCOME TO THE NEW WORLD OF LINEA.....nonononon WELCOME TO THE NEW World of Warcraft goddess of destruction!...lol...INTERLUDE 4EVER!!!L2 WAS GREAT TILL INTERLUDE!
Its bull**** and you know it we came to do pvp/pk not pve! who say that was great Idea about rep system go play WOW or something like that....
THere is no point to play lineage If I can't pk player and clean it in some minutes on mobs or by dead...Now who got karma in 20lvl probably they gonna creat new chars because to clean karma there isn't chance
Do something about PK fast because its makes players to delete Client.
almost allready did it still have 1500 from 2000 rep just becose i went to " help" somebody
The severity of the new reputation system is certainly debatable. In my personal opinion, 360 mobs to regain rep from a single PK is a bit extreme. A sliding scale of say 50 mobs w/1 PK, increasing with each PK would seem better.
I hold hope that the penalty may be reduced in a future update, but in the mean time there are plenty of ways to live in the current system. If you want a bot dead, there are plenty of solutions. Heal the mobs, run trains, etc.
But please, can we stop pretending that accidental PKs are a problem? In seven years of play, I've never "accidentally" PKed anyone, unless I was goofing around or took an unwise risk. Flashing name? Don't attack.
One of the core fun elements of L2 was the PK. that ability to kill anybody just because of KS or because he looked you the wrong way was awsome.
yes there were consecuences. loosing a piece of your equip? getting formed like a pinata?
but now with the karma penalty. it makes just no sense to pk. ( unless your 99 and everything maxed out.)
So please for the love of GoD make the penalty more lenient. ( you still get xp/drops or higher karma recuperation. special quest.)
i have already 2 mates how pk's to help a couple of clannies that were trying to lvl and they have sooo much karma that rerolling is the only option. they were low level still so rerolling its possible. but the thought that they might get PK higher in the game is making them quit. before the loose way more time :(
This new system is ****, only being able to lose gain rep from killing mobs, and you don't gain it from being killed why red. this does ruin the PK/PVP Aspect of the game badly. I dunno what NCSoft is thinking on this but I will tell you this I came back cause the game went free to play and I had been playing another Free MMO if they are going to keep this new system I'll take my cash shop money back to the other MMO.
I made a PK (-720) at lvl 24.. then i just tried to kill mobs (mobs at my lvl = no rep, a llitle high lvl = 1 or 2 rep, a lvl kinda hard (red name) = no rep)
i also tried to do some quests (which is nonsense because u cannot take any quest at cities cuz u cannot go inside) and when i finished one.. i only got 20 reputation points.. (for a quest that was supposed to give me 250k exp!!)
So till now.. killing mobs is useless.. ok
making quests is useless... ok
let's see other ways to get reputati...OH WAIT, no moar ways to get it. (well yea, at a reputation manager.. like 5k to get 1 rep point or sth like that, sure)
So i tried to kill mobs.. but suddenly some chars attacked me.. what i am supposed to do? let em kill me? Even when i die i dont get any rep points.. so i defended myself.. and i killed em cuz they were a bunch of noobs.. the result.. -61k reputation lol
i mean.. how i am supposed to get rid of that? x)
I insist... a new faction for PK chars (red name = shilen followers, white name neutrals, green name = **** hero's of light?) u choose ur path! (ofc this would involve that red name char can gain exp/sp)
Not being able to die off your negative Reputation. In the past, being able to pk people, SoEing to Castle/Hall/Fortress and having clan mates kill off your Karma and then being Rezed by Bishop was terribly broken. There was no real penalty for PKing.
No Xp/Sp while chaotic.
Things I don't like about the new system:
The difficulty of working off your negative reputation seems to have been raised to an extreme. 360+ mobs to work off a single PK, all while other characters can freely kill you can be seen as a difficulty wall that is more easily surmounted by re-rolling.
Suggestions:
Chaotic friendly villages in all Territories, instead of just around Dion. These villages would provide chaotic related quests to earn reputation, access to warehouse, and a method of teleporting around to other chaotic villages.
Non-chaotic characters attacking a chaotic character should flag purple. The flagging system denotes a desire to participate in PvP, hunting chaotic players is participating in a PvP activity. There's no reason why a chaotic character should have to continue to stack up PK penalties to protect themselves from other players. Earning negative reputation should be limited to when you kill a character that does not demonstrate desire to participate in PvP.
Chaotic friendly villages in all Territories, instead of just around Dion. These villages would provide chaotic related quests to earn reputation, access to warehouse, and a method of teleporting around to other chaotic villages.
Non-chaotic characters attacking a chaotic character should flag purple. The flagging system denotes a desire to participate in PvP, hunting chaotic players is participating in a PvP activity. There's no reason why a chaotic character should have to continue to stack up PK penalties to protect themselves from other players. Earning negative reputation should be limited to when you kill a character that does not demonstrate desire to participate in PvP.
+1
THAT'S IT! :D
Dude all u say it is! That's exactly what i'm thinking of!
Love the new system, but first some things need to be clarified:
PK is NOT PvP, PK is you killing a player that does not fight back, that has always been considered bad in L2.
PvP is when the other player flags after you hit him/her or during TW/Fortress/Siege. This is for the so called PvPers in the game.
That being cleared, the new system is super Hardcore, you have to choose to turn red AND actively deal with the consequences of your actions, the old system was actually very carebear in that regard, not anymore.
Some of you wanted a HARDCORE PK game, you got it, but like everything else, there are serious consequences.
So .... there was this player last hitting the mobs i had so much trouble trying to kill them, i was building up tiredness out of him doing that then i got really mad and killed him and got red, now i can't even run 10meters away to try find good place to kill mobs (and even more without buffs) so now i'll mostly do new char. Thank you GM's for your mass spawn and what more, i gave all my stuff to my bf and going to reroll. Free 2 Play = bad idea.
Hello everyone,
my character's name is also TsEv and today a 10 years old **** was constantly
taking my mobs by last hitting them.So as you propably understand i killed him.
After that, i travelled a ,longed distance w/o buffs to find some mobs.
I got -800 points and will i hit "White" mobs (at my level) i get 1 reput point
slightly red give me 2 .
IS THAT NORMAL?
I have to kill 800 mobs to get at 0 reput points?
Are you guys crazy?
At older chronicles u got 240 karma and with 1 mob the job was done.
What am i supposed to do?
Delete char and create another?If that is a solution then why we werenot informed about all the situation with Pk/karma.
this is insane people...rly insane
So i tried to kill mobs.. but suddenly some chars attacked me.. what i am supposed to do? let em kill me? Even when i die i dont get any rep points.. so i defended myself.. and i killed em cuz they were a bunch of noobs.. the result.. -61k reputation lol
Fix this ******* system, It not ******* fun to reroll always when you PK someone. THATS ******* ********!!!!! Just give us to lose 5-10 rep points per mob!!!
This is why people wants to go russian server instead of this ****.
Sorry for my english its bad, ok i open this thread for the pk, because its out of logical ;we have to kill 725 mob!!!!! for remove the first pk status. its crazy!!!, the mob only remove 1 point of karma, when other player kill you the karma dont remove any point, when the guard kill you its the same, you can only remove it if you kill 725 mob , its tooo much.
Fix this ******* system, It not ******* fun to reroll always when you PK someone. THATS ******* ********!!!!! Just give us to lose 5-10 rep points per mob!!!
This is why people wants to go russian server instead of this ****.
The number of people that only communicate being ignorant and swearing increased a lot after F2P.
This System is like this in every offcial server that runs GoD.
Stop being idiots: Koreans made this System and we aren't getting a different onejust because some players can't hold their anger and feel in need to kill people that won't retaliate.
You can cry the much you want, but this thread states cleary that the system isn't going to change. Deal with it or break with it and move along with your gaming life.
Spare us your blind rage that only knows how to complain but is too much lazy to understand how things REALLY work...
Sorry for my english its bad, ok i open this thread for the pk, because its out of logical ;we have to kill 725 mob!!!!! for remove the first pk status. its crazy!!!, the mob only remove 1 point of karma, when other player kill you the karma dont remove any point, when the guard kill you its the same, you can only remove it if you kill 725 mob , its tooo much.
thx
Yes, they made it really bad. I am not sure (i don't like Pk) but i thing there's a quest to clear your karma/PK count.
Is there a cap on how much negative reputation you can gain?
Suggestions:
-Add a +/- reputation cap if it doesnt already exists.
-Allow red players to gain XP/SP but with no VP/item XP bonus applied
-Allow rep to increase passively over time up to a maximum value equivalent to 1 PK
So. Seems like NCsoft really wants to get rid of PKs but they dont mind the fact that for example mages and archers can KS daggers forever. And if that dagger decides to PK those **** KSers he gets punished even more. And you dont consider KSing as griefing?
Nice move NCsoft.
You made a carebear game from what used to be a true hardcore pvp game.
If you hate PKs so much just disable the open pvp and be done with it, because you've just disabled the option that lineage2 thrived on for so many years.
Hello, basically my problem is that I have a character lvl 33, which I grew in arround 8 hours of non-stop playing, then during one quest arround ruins of despair i did the fatal mistake of PK-ing one player who did a KS (kill steal) from me. You see, I had to wait for a quest monster to spawn, and after waiting in cue-line like everybody else, there comes this guy that just stole my kill. Of course I got ******, but I didn't intent to pk him, I just hit him a couple of times, did a crit and a bleed, and bam. The guy is dead. Problem is that the reputation system is so unfair: I have only one pk, but my rep went down -700 or something. So I have to kill 700 mobs my lvl (that would take a whole day, maybe two of serious gameplay), and all this without buffs, without soulshots, with all players hunting me. Should I delete char and start all over again? Should I quit the game? More questions raised on Cartoon Network...
Hope they fix this in a fair way.
This "new" PK system is the most dumb thing You've done here, unless You've done that just for fun, so You could laugh Your face off ppl who get frustrated. Making Floran a default village for PK's wasn't a very good idea in the end... why? Because now all "wannabe smart" players camp there to kill every single PK who leaves peace zone. The only reasonable thing You can do fast is increase the reputation rate getting from mobs (~50 would be good). That would solve the problem for ppl who are stuck in Floran Village with xxx karma and who can't play anymore, because they are buffless, they have to kill ~600+ mobs, and there are a lot of "pro" players camping around just to get easy kills on unbuffed pk. Leaving Peace Zone = fast death. I dunno if those ppl don't have better things to do, like exping themselves, but this is just ridicolous that ppl with karma are not able to play anymore.
Hello, basically my problem is that I have a character lvl 33, which I grew in arround 8 hours of non-stop playing, then during one quest arround ruins of despair i did the fatal mistake of PK-ing one player who did a KS (kill steal) from me. You see, I had to wait for a quest monster to spawn, and after waiting in cue-line like everybody else, there comes this guy that just stole my kill. Of course I got ******, but I didn't intent to pk him, I just hit him a couple of times, did a crit and a bleed, and bam. The guy is dead. Problem is that the reputation system is so unfair: I have only one pk, but my rep went down -700 or something. So I have to kill 700 mobs my lvl (that would take a whole day, maybe two of serious gameplay), and all this without buffs, without soulshots, with all players hunting me. Should I delete char and start all over again? Should I quit the game? More questions raised on Cartoon Network...
Hope they fix this in a fair way.
You should delete the character, b/c it will be impossible to kill 700 mobs, killing 700 mobs would get your new char maybe to lvl 45-52...
About quiting the game, you decide.
I am a 32 level Trooper ( kamael male )
i kill some1.
I got -800 reputation points and after several minutes somebody will kill me as the sever is full of people wherever you go to.
The moment you die you are teleported near gludio.
Now, me and everyone else is expected to find mobs at your level ,make a long long distance and it is more likely to die not even before meeting the monsters you're searchin.
Imagine that you finally find a place after travelling half the map.
HOW POSSIBLY COULD I KILL 800 MOBS W/O BUFFS?
Even though i had buffs, how could i get soulshots?
My weapon and as most of D grade need 3 soulshots.
Mobs are 6 hits w/o buffs.
So 6x3= 18 soulshot per mob.
800x18=14.000
Please tell me that when some1 is going to farm/exp/complete quest is aquired with 15k ss?Rediculous....
Moreover, you will certainly gonna need some healing pots.Or you are playing with 500 healing on your char at lvl 30 ?
I though this was a bug and monsters should give more than 25 reputation points,so when i came here I was just shocked.
As you saw many people joined L2...but sooner or later they will leave.
Because it won't take long untill they will pk some1.
And by the time they realise what changes you have made....ALT+X+CONFIRM+UNINSTALL L2.
so what happend is i got a pk cause 1 player ****** me off and i get 700 karma its my 1st time so from mobs i get -1 from killing nothing just - 10% and is there any way i can reduse it
Ah well im just walking arround killing some lowbies, just to prove my point about how stupid this idea was. NCsoft calims they made this decision to stop the griefing, but acutally they made twice as much griefing.
Theres nothing else i can do with this karma other than killing lowbies. No way i can kill a mob my level or finish a quest.
LoL this is amazing de pk system ... hahaha i was hunting and start getting ksed so i got mad i kill the guy that was doing it... and my journey start ! traveled like 1283123871624814 miles to find a place to get off the bad karma. HOLY MOTHER OF GOD only 1 less point every mob im getting GEZZZZZZZZ this will take all life i have 700 karma at this point ... well np i can do it ... like half hour later guess what ? a human daggers apears and starts hunting me... i do not want to kill this one ... imagine having 1702 karma ??? then i start running to see if he gest tired of chasing me .. hes not getting tired GOD stop chasing meee ... like 10 mins of running i stop running and I start attacking him to see is he gets scared or anything .. well he doesnt... he continues .. the thing is im doing like 200 dmg to him and he is just doing like 30 on each hit to me .. so wtf noobie get lost !!! ... well he doesnt and i killed him !!! NOW I HAVE 1700 KARMA POINTS !!!! now i tried to kill some RED mobs guess what ? they dont help with my karma ? WTF ! if white mobs takes 1 karma point away red mobs should take at least 3 points !!! BUT THEYY DONT EVEN TAKE 1 !!!!!! HOW CAN THIS BE POSSIBLEEEEE ??? !!!!!! GEZZZZZZZZZZZ this is so mess up... at least there should be like an reward to get more than lets say 2000 karma points like SUPER HASTE ! ahahahaha ... who says that killers dont get rewards ??? who says al capone wasnt at least rich for beeing a killer ? ahahahaha at least mobs should drop more adena or something like that... if not this game will become so lame... everybody is nice and everybody is good and everybody is an angel bahhhhh theres no fun in that ... :mad::mad::mad:
It unfair the system is now used, it may be that one wants to take revenge for any event and having to delete the hero, just because they do not like the pk. I think the old system was right, these pk, that you drop everything if you get killed, but this can not get it off with nothing is not ethical. I killed a kookoburra, and losing a pj for that? Who came up with this system?
Furthermore, none page and / or advanced super goddness system, it is reported that if you're pk, hero lose, or that can be recovered somehow. According to the help of Lineage II says and explains that if you are with red name, you must kill a certain amount of mobs, now I have good reputation and -90 for 2 h followed Matt and I to -90 besides that receives no or exp or sp or anything ..... this sucks
Sorry my english is bad :D but i think all can understandme
Hope ncsoft knows top clans already found a way to exploit the system.
They purposely turned a high level buffer red at 86 and 0.00% xp.
They all take turns killing the buffer to turn green.
Can't delevel buffer loses no xp. They party the buffer and works it karma down to 1. So during sieges they can turn green on a buffer that is barely red.
Green pkers don't turn red and grats your system is exploited by the top players.
I saw bring back the old system and just remove you can die off karma. THAT WAS THE ONLY PROBLEM WITH THE SYSTEM. Is people could die off the karma and be brez and lose no xp.
Now if the karma actually had to be worked off system would of worked fine. Sometimes if something is not broke DONT FIX IT.
I added some links to the first topic of this thread for reference. I would like to keep most of the discussion here, instead of players creating new threads all over the place. So you may see a lot of merged posts.
Also please do not derail this thread with flaming or off-topic posts.
The first time I ever played L2 was on a private server. This was about 6 years ago. Although pking can be hella fun, I remember the pkers always being the ******** who just wanted to **** with you for no reason, and you were almost half their level. I played on, if I remember correctly, a 15x exp server, so it would suck to die...but it would be sofun to clan up and chase them down. ANYWAY what I'm saying is, this system is awesome....because if you manned up and duked it out in a pvp match thats one thing....just blatently killing someone who you knew wouldn't have a chance or fight back would be pointless and not worth it anyway. Lineage 2 should be about true pvp and organizing good clans.
The first time I ever played L2 was on a private server. This was about 6 years ago. Although pking can be hella fun, I remember the pkers always being the ******** who just wanted to **** with you for no reason, and you were almost half their level. I played on, if I remember correctly, a 15x exp server, so it would suck to die...but it would be sofun to clan up and chase them down. ANYWAY what I'm saying is, this system is awesome....because if you manned up and duked it out in a pvp match thats one thing....just blatently killing someone who you knew wouldn't have a chance or fight back would be pointless and not worth it anyway. Lineage 2 should be about true pvp and organizing good clans.
In a x1 pking puts you on the line, you will probablly die, since if people attacks you there are no penalties and if you attack back you will have less rep, and every point of exp is harder to get.
I miss the old pk system, but i am not saying it should be exactly the same, but it should be possible to come back, beacause it is not, also pking is part of the game(Was actually) and many people just don't attack back to haunt you with the pk system. and yes there are reason to pk people who piss you off.
I know that some people like to kill and grief others. But I don't enjoy that sort of thing.
As a player who likes to PVE, I appreciate the new system. It does not prevent PKers from PKing... but I appreciate that they are not encouraged to grief others.
I dont like anything about this new pk system.. I was doing my quests with a friend of mine and someone was disturbing and killing our mobs , she didnt want to stop doing that so we just killed her. Like the old system we tried killing mobs to get the karma down but it didnt work now my friend is stuck with his karma and we are not being able to lvl up anymore because there is ppl all around the place killing us. Killing all those mobs i mean like 800 mobs just to get to reputation 0 would be impossible at least in the new server shilien where there is people everywhere.
I know they have to punish pks but sometimes there are good reasons of gettting pk and this is also a part of the game that have been going for years with no problem. I dont see any reason of changing the old system to a patetic one in which someone kill a player and is not able to play anymore.
The old pk system was a lot better than this but it was not perfect.
Yet nothing is in place to prevent griefing via KS'ing which is the biggest issue right now when 90% of quests run off last hit.
Smart setup. Some real thought was put into that.
Yet nothing is in place to prevent griefing via KS'ing which is the biggest issue right now when 90% of quests run off last hit.
Smart setup. Some real thought was put into that.
I've been a casual PvE player since the open beta of L2, and I've always loved the PvP system of L2, even when you were losing equipped items at any death, including dying against a mob without any karma. For me L2 has always been a PvP game, and playing only PvE on this game was a choice I made because I didn't have enough time to be strong enough to PvP. But I Liked this game enough to accept that I was missing 3/4 of the game.
I cumulate 4 years on Lineage II, I've been PKed without reason only 4 or 5 times. The other PK were part of the game (war, helping the enemy of a guy, error from someone who become your friend later...).
And even beeing a PvE playing, being able to kill a bot or a grieffer has always be a pleasure. Now it's impossible. When you play only 5 or 6 hours a WEEK (don't get old if you like to play), beeing forced to stop getting XP for 2 or 3 hours mean that you can not PK anyone. That's not the spirit of Lineage II.
If there was something to change in this game, it would have been the ability of defeating a level 85 with 2 or 3 level 76. Not the PK system. If two level 76 can defeat a level 85 PK, the levels 76 could defend themselves against PK. It would have allow "low" player to get involved in the PvP and the politic.
Lineage II has always been a PvP game. Every PvE feature leads to a PvP situation, if you're clever enough to think about it (not enough mob, not enough room, not enough mats, not enough boss... fight to get them!).
And I see no difference between PK and PvP for they are both part of the game, a game where the main goal is the domination of the server. And PvP "for a political reason" was why L2 was a good PvP game. "PvP fo fun", well, why? Why should I fight someone if his death (or mine) doesn't affect the history of the server?
I'm a PvE player, I have less than 10 PvP count on my main char, but if you don't accept the idea of beeing PKed in Lineage II, try an other game. And bring back the oportunity to anyone to kill someone that harass you without being force to create a new char.
I am a hardcore PvE player and even I do not agree with this pk system.
It is broken at best. Some one was using this as a tool to grief me. I was minding my own busy in a very small area working on one of the new fantastic quests. Some guy came buy and started ks'ing my mobs. Ok fine I moved to another spot and he followed. Then another 2 friends of his (i guess) show up. He then flags on me. I go to try and pvp but he runs at his friends and since I suck at PvP, I miss target and kill one of his friends.
I basically turned perma red. I could no longer level. Not only do I suck at pvp but Now I am one of the main targets. I was level 37 after 3 hours of questing. I had to make a new character and start all over again.
All I have to say is thank goodness NCsoft did a fantastic job with the new quests and leveling system. It is much player friendly.
But, on the bad side, I am glad I was only lvl 37. Imagine if I got to level 85 and then accidentally hit someone that purposely tricks me into targeting them. I will have to start all over again. I can not survive in a PK rule set such as this. It is very poorly done.
Please make a PvE server and a separate PvP server. I think that would be a simple solution.
I've been a casual PvE player since the open beta of L2, and I've always loved the PvP system of L2, even when you were losing equipped items at any death, including dying against a mob without any karma. For me L2 has always been a PvP game, and playing only PvE on this game was a choice I made because I didn't have enough time to be strong enough to PvP. But I Liked this game enough to accept that I was missing 3/4 of the game.
I cumulate 4 years on Lineage II, I've been PKed without reason only 4 or 5 times. The other PK were part of the game (war, helping the enemy of a guy, error from someone who become your friend later...).
And even beeing a PvE playing, being able to kill a bot or a grieffer has always be a pleasure. Now it's impossible. When you play only 5 or 6 hours a WEEK (don't get old if you like to play), beeing forced to stop getting XP for 2 or 3 hours mean that you can not PK anyone. That's not the spirit of Lineage II.
If there was something to change in this game, it would have been the ability of defeating a level 85 with 2 or 3 level 76. Not the PK system. If two level 76 can defeat a level 85 PK, the levels 76 could defend themselves against PK. It would have allow "low" player to get involved in the PvP and the politic.
Lineage II has always been a PvP game. Every PvE feature leads to a PvP situation, if you're clever enough to think about it (not enough mob, not enough room, not enough mats, not enough boss... fight to get them!).
And I see no difference between PK and PvP for they are both part of the game, a game where the main goal is the domination of the server. And PvP "for a political reason" was why L2 was a good PvP game. "PvP fo fun", well, why? Why should I fight someone if his death (or mine) doesn't affect the history of the server?
I'm a PvE player, I have less than 10 PvP count on my main char, but if you don't accept the idea of beeing PKed in Lineage II, try an other game. And bring back the oportunity to anyone to kill someone that harass you without being force to create a new char.
But i dont have much reputation - only 700 but this is sick. I Play on Lineage 2 becaus i loved PvP. I Loved becaus now i hate this system. If i want worst pvp and casual game would play in World of Warcraft. I kill some ppl becaus it helped my enemy. And? I must kill 350 mobs without exp/sp. If i lose my soulshot i'll have to kill mobs using my head?
I hope ncsoft fast FIX this PK system. I want old PvP and Mass PvP. No more casual pvp this is Lineage 2 no ****** WoW.
so, i got a lvl 37 human knight atm, wanted to give this game a try again after a long (really long) break, and getting to 37 was quite easy with all the quests and changes ofcourse.
however, there was a guy constantly ksing me like a little ***** while there were actually alot of mobs around to kill for the quest, he just KSd me to piss me off it would seem. so, naturally, i PKd him, not knowing that the pk system had changed since i left the game.
so here i am, stuck at -720 reputation, gaining only 1 reputation per killed mob. so you really want to tell me i have to kill 720 mobs because i wanted to get rid of an idiot who kept KSing me? why is this game even open PVP anymore then, making a new character is most likely ALOT faster than working off that karma...
One the one hand, I only PVE so I like the new PK system. On the other hand, I do understand when one of my friends wants to kill a BOT train.
How is this as an idea?
Let players of any level go to the Newbie Guide to get a "Blessing of Protection"-ish buff that gives 20 minute protection from being PKed. Let this buff go away if the protected player tries to PK another person.
BOT trains would probably not get this buff, because it means that they would have to return to town every 20 minutes and it interferes greatly with their whole botting routine. So, it makes them free game for PKers.
This suggestion puts the responsibility of being a PVE-only player on the player. If you don't want to be PKed, you have to run to town every 20 minutes and back.
If such a system were in place, then if I got PKed by someone, it was my own fault for not watching my buffs. Also, if such a system were in place, I would feel more inclined to say that PKers should not be penalized for PKing. Anyone who is not protected by the buff is considered a PVPer.
It puts the effort/responsiblity on the PVE-er to stay PVE only, rather than currently on the PVPer/PKer who has to work off Karma/Reputation
One the one hand, I only PVE so I like the new PK system. On the other hand, I do understand when one of my friends wants to kill a BOT train.
How is this as an idea?
Let players of any level go to the Newbie Guide to get a "Blessing of Protection"-ish buff that gives 20 minute protection from being PKed. Let this buff go away if the protected player tries to PK another person.
BOT trains would probably not get this buff, because it means that they would have to return to town every 20 minutes and it interferes greatly with their whole botting routine. So, it makes them free game for PKers.
This suggestion puts the responsibility of being a PVE-only player on the player. If you don't want to be PKed, you have to run to town every 20 minutes and back.
If such a system were in place, then if I got PKed by someone, it was my own fault for not watching my buffs. Also, if such a system were in place, I would feel more included to say that PKers should not be penalized for PKing. Anyone who is not protected by the buff is considered a PVPer.
It puts the effort/responsiblity on the PVE-er to stay PVE only, rather than currently on the PVPer/PKer who has to work off Karma/Reputation
How do you want to play non-pvp, got Runes of Magic or World of Worcraft. A game of men leave for a man. By accidental victims some one lose much time from game.
Yet nothing is in place to prevent griefing via KS'ing which is the biggest issue right now when 90% of quests run off last hit.
Smart setup. Some real thought was put into that.
Finally someone said it. Ty Suffer.
Why does everyone think that the only way to grief is via PK, but when it comes to KS everything is fine?
Everyone that thinks KS is fine roll a dagger and try to get quest kills while mages steal all your kills from infront of your nose. And then we'll also see how long you will last without PKing someone that has been doing that to you for 30 minutes. Its how it should be. Its how it always was in L2. If someone was bothering you, you had the choice to remove him by PKing him. You risked. But now its not even worth the risk. The only thing they did now was prevent some ppl griefing via PK but gave even more power to those that grief VIA KS.
Let the people sort their disputes the way they want. But current PK system prevents that. There is NO WAY to sort things out right now. Ranged classes can just run arround and grief via KS all they want....
Personally, so would I. However, I can see BOT trains running rampant on a PVE-only server, so I am trying to find a compromise solution that does not penalize PVP/PKers.
I honestly do not mind there being PVP/PKing in L2, so long as there is a means by which a person like myself can play L2 while being able to opt out of the whole PVP/PK scene.
And, if it means that I have to run to town to get a buff every 20 minutes, that is fine by me.
It let's PVP/PK folk play. It let's PVE folk like me play. It will inconvenience BOT trains a little, especially if there is no longer any penalty to PK as an end result of my suggested buff system.
today in rod i pk one guy for non stop killing my mobs ( when i take them 80% HP ) ...
i tring lose status pk ( -693 REP ) i killed mobse ( blue , green , white , yellow , red ) NOTHING -693 , i walk to guard to die (17 times ) -693 rep
i call ppl to kill me oposite Gludio ( they kill me many many many times ) still -693
when i try look for help in game HELP / WAR SYSTEM i write only some code on chat ... when i writed petition ( bug) i get canceled , i writed again and im waitng now ....
I have been a longtime PVE player. I for the longest time wanted to learn how to PvP. I did not want to be the best or anything like that, but I just wanted to be able to hold my own in equal level battles. For the longest time my friends tried to get me to come to Lineage 2. Well since Lineage 2 went Free 2 play I decided to get my toes wet.
Here is my first night, last night, on my personally highly anticipated Lineage 2 experience.
1. I started my quest line by speaking with the NPC Pantheon. I was amazed to see how many people were playing this game. The other amazing thing was the graphical beauty of this game. It really is one of the most beautiful games I have ever seen.
2. Anyway, I grabbed my quest line and started my Lineage II adventure.
3. After 3 hours of play, I was in love with the master piece of a game. I did see a little pvp, but not much throughout my leveling experience. I had just finished my Second class transfer and I was now an official Level 40 Orc Destroyer. I felt like a real bad ***, pardon my French.
4. I decided to get a little "Grind" Xp before I went to bed. I went down into the Ivory tower crater. It was breath taking. Did I mention how beautiful the game is ??? :) . Anyway, I was almost level 41 until a party of 4 characters started to kill steal my mobs. I was becoming irritated and excited at the same time. I decided this was going to be my first pvp battle.
I would like to say first, I am an awfull pvp player and really really really bad at targeting. So, I asked my friend how to target and he most of not been listening or misunderstood what I was saying on vent, but he told me to drop the next target icon to my hotbar. I got my bar setup with next target , that cool rush skill and a really hard hitting skill called Fatal Strike.
5. OK it is game on, I am holding down my Control button because that is the button I use for ventrilo talking. I start mashing my buttons, next target, rush, fatal strike and guess what I am winning my first pvp. I am super excited I am spamming this cool rush skill, I am sliding all over the screen swinging my big *** sword and spamming next target.Targets are dropping and I am turning BLOOD RED. I ended up pking 4 people. Things happened so fast and they were all dead before I noticed they did not hit me back. I have over 3000+ negative reputation and I have to make a new character. It is impossible for me to work the negative rep off.
Thank you for a beautiful game NCsoft, and I curse you for one of the worst PK systems ever. It makes no sense even to me, a PvE player at heart.
I killed all 4 players. But, one problem, they did not fight back. How can Lineage 2 be called a "PvP" game if it is designed to prevent PvP?
I don't know how L2 became a carebear haven so fast....
Seriously a few days ago you could kill as many players as you wanted for sport. And now, an accidental PK can cost you insane exp loss along with a huge waste of time you spend on removing the negative reputation. It's terrible.
With the influx of private server players, you know that people are anxious to gain high level and PvP. And personally, I'd rather get griefed from level 1-99 than have to spend an hour+ removing my rep every time I PK someone by accident.
I didnt accidentaly PK anyone. I killed him because i decided it has to be done because he was KSing me and i couldnt finish my quest because of him, while he was getting cheap kills on the mobs!
What im wondering is why such a PK should be so severely punsihed that you basicaly cant even play you character anymore!?
Old PK system was NOT a problem. It was NOT abused for griefing. And it ALLOWED people to sort their problems the way they wanted to sort them out.
If the PK system stays that way just make L2 a PvE MMORPG and there wont be any problems anymore. Or make PvP and PvE seperated servers. People that wanna have fun will join PvP server, trust me on that.
today in rod i pk one guy for non stop killing my mobs ( when i take them 80% HP ) ...
i tring lose status pk ( -693 REP ) i killed mobse ( blue , green , white , yellow , red ) NOTHING -693 , i walk to guard to die (17 times ) -693 rep
i call ppl to kill me oposite Gludio ( they kill me many many many times ) still -693
when i try look for help in game HELP / WAR SYSTEM i write only some code on chat ... when i writed petition ( bug) i get canceled , i writed again and im waitng now ....
HOW TO LOSE this status ? -693 rep ...
same problem here. No panishment for KS'ing mobs becaus u make MOAR PROBLEMS!
OMG!!! I am new to the game. I was told that using a pole to level is the best way to go. So as I started leveling up on the new server Shilen, I got a pole with my C grade courage certificates.
I found a spot that I thought would be good for pole leveling. Some other player kept up coming up to me and flagging on me. I chose to ignore him at first. I thought he got bored and left because I would not respond to him.
He came back a few laters with 2 other toons following closely behind him.
He started to flag on me, and my hp was getting lower and lower. I got fed up, I targeted him and held my cntl button down. In 2 swings I killed the 2 toons that must have been lowbie toons and went RED. To add insult to the situation he killed me. I was so angry I logged out.
I logged back in this morning to try and remove the red and all that has happened to me is death upon death. It is literally impossible for me to work this negative reputation off.
Please fix this system. Why not make one of the new servers a PvE server and the other a true PvP server??? I think people would like that.
lose 2-3 h and find red mob or yellow (names) then you lose 2point per mob .... no buffs , players willl kill you many times .... then sry not 2-3h 7-8h
lose 2-3 h and find red mob or yellow (names) then you lose 2point per mob .... no buffs , players willl kill you many times .... then sry not 2-3h 7-8h
Exactly, this ******* system is the worse. And this post is like rubbing it in our faces.
Hello
I need help I'm talkin island and I can not get pk. I'm lv 27 and I can not teleport or lower the pk.tambien I've killed all monsters and not removed. Please any solution. I'm stuck.:(:(
Please make one of the New Servers a True PvP server and the other new server a carebear....I mean pve server.
Is there a possibility that the programmer/developer that was working on this pk system accidentally mistyped the PK algorithm. Maybe a decimal was put in the wrong place when calculating reputation. One pk should= -6 Rep not -600+ Rep.
Do the devs know how much server space will be gobbled up by lowbie perma red toons that are no longer being played due to the broken PK system?
A simple solution:
1. Make a PvP Server. Remove the PK RULE SET. Make the server a true 100% pure PvP server.
2. The other server will be kept as is, it will be the PvE server.
Hello, Juji. First and foremost, thank you for taking the time to actually test this, but I have to state my distaste for you writing it's "working as intended" and you understanding that it "is frustrating" in the same reply. If it's working as intended and it's frustrating, wouldn't you agree that it's hindering the game and should be modified accordingly?
The current system as it stands, I feel, may be alright, but it's simply too harsh. People who want the old system have to realize that back in the old days, all people did was go red name then promptly BSOE (Blessed Scroll of Escape, which is nearly an instant SoE) back to their Clan Hall and clean there from dying over and over. However, while I can see this is one reason as to why NCSoft decided to make it so that being killed no longer helps your situation, it is the biggest part of what is hurting the system as it stands.
This is a double-edged sword, because while you helped prevent the exploit of people killing other people, using a BSOE to Clan Hall, then getting cleaned off of friends, what you did in return is much worse than that could have ever been. Now what happens is that the person becomes an immediate target for every passerby, they are promptly killed and this is promoted more-so by how people gain reputation and a cool green name for killing someone who is in red name.
While this is going on, the person who is red name respawns in Floran Village, where nine times out of ten green named people are waiting to spawn-kill them to get free rep., maybe sometimes this isn't the case, but it's becoming more and more of a popular concept and the people who chose to go red name are quitting over the frustration. This applies doubly so to new people, who were not quite aware that the system would be this punishing, and are now simply incapable of recovering from it. In short, it's flawed by design. Let me explain...
If your only method of getting rid of your red name is to go kill mobs that are your level or higher (but not red named mobs because they're too high level) then you are by default limiting where people can go. Depending on the red name's level, this can be very problematic as it basically means that they may very well end up needing to run to the other side of the map to even attempt to clean, and to expect them to avoid encountering anyone who'd gladly kill them along the way is absurdity. Even if they do make it, they are expected to kill hundreds of mobs and STILL expect not to be killed. What happens if they are killed? Back to Floran.
Juji, I must ask you personally. Does this sound enjoyable? Even remotely. Keeping in mind that you can't go back to town for Newbie Buffs (applies to people who could get them in the first place, of course) and if nobody is around to help you out, you're doing this practically buffless as well.
All this pain and frustration plus more, all because you decided to kill someone who was not flagged. This isn't fair, nor is it realistic to expect people to actually endure this and say "yep I deserved that lol". The biggest problem is a wombo-combo of numerous things I'll attempt to list below;
* Firstly, the penalty for killing someone doesn't scale properly 720 Karma for your first kill? Over 1000 for your second. This is absolute absurdity. If the first kill was somewhere around 50 Karma, then the second maybe 150, then third 300, or something along those lines, then I feel this would all meld together better. Remember; most of the people who are complaining have done the first PK accidentally and didn't realize the penalty would be THIS ridiculous. Of course, it wouldn't be this crazy if the Karma amount you inherit wasn't such a huge wall to climb from the get-go. Come on, guys. You've got tons of NEW players joining the game. They had NO IDEA what to really expect.
* The methods of reducing your Karma are too far and inbetween. What am I saying? You only have ONE way of doing it. People should be able to lose Karma by dying, simply because dying is something they're going to be doing a lot of when they're red name. Don't forget; people love to kill red named people because it means +Rep for them. Also, I just noticed; I've been saying "Karma" this whole time. I hope you know what I mean. This whole...reputation system. Anyway, if people lost some Karma for dying, this whole thing would make a lot more sense. Each time you die, you're losing EXP. Isn't that punishment enough for going red name? The current system is extreme overkill and too much of a radical transition from the old system. You've given players 0 time to adjust, you did not test the waters, you jumped right into the ocean and now you're drowning people. Please come back onto the beach where it's nice and sunny, NCSoft.
* I understand you don't want people to grief, but players who PK are being griefed themselves for the reasons mentioned above. Are they suddenly exempt from your proposal of helping reduce griefing because they killed someone in an arguably very PVP/PK orientated game? I'm not saying the old system is perfect, but this new system has people outright quitting. NCSoft, it's time for change. You see the topics, you see the replies, please make it happen.
Lastly, I have to ask. Juji, on behalf of NCSoft, are you guys even capable of making these changes, or does it have to go through the Korean side of things first? Do we even have any dev's left?
Well, 80% of the post I see here is from PvE bots.
People who know to take pvp when the real pvp ends and the winner is still standing. They go from behind, 1 shot and ''QQ NAB''.
From the other view, real botters will be happy. None will PK them. ( Mhm, shall I start botting? -Nah).
Anyways, we're wasting our time here as I've seen. ( In the forums ).
Not that I'm saying something against NCsoft's workers, but the people we're talking to in this forum, don't have the powers we think they have.
My advice :
Don't pk if you don't have a reason.
After we get clan/CPs we'll be able to get that reputation easier.
For now, BE A * the female organ *.
well as I read in another thread, there is always "have your friendly 86+ buffer at 0% exp that goes red that you keep killing over and over to reduce your own bad rep. Since he doesnt delevel when dieing you dont loose anything. Seams like the top clans already know how to jump over this PK problems the rest of the server have.
well as I read in another thread, there is always "have your friendly 86+ buffer at 0% exp that goes red that you keep killing over and over to reduce your own bad rep. Since he doesnt delevel when dieing you dont loose anything. Seams like the top clans already know how to jump over this PK problems the rest of the server have.
That is so lame. Beyond lame. This system is soooo flawed. I think GMs should log in game and see the high level ******** circling Floran and wiping out the lowbies who are trying to get rid of the Negative Rep.
I had a reason to PK... a stupid noob KSing all my mobs and fu.... my quest. I said 100x "plz, dont ks me.. go kill another mob". He just ignored me and stood killing my mobs. So I PKed him and now.. I cant play anymore..
This new system is a peace of shi....
Devs transformed Lineage II in HELLO KITTY ONLINE... what a fail....
so lame.. omg... my favorite game over 10 years playing MMO now is the worst...
- There's not such thing as a unintended pk. Period. There's always a motive, reason or mood for killing another player. Bad habits, bad language, lag, macro issues, anger, real clan wars, etc etc.
- There will always be nice and bad people.
Nice people like quests, exploring areas, the glitter of the sun as it appears from the mountains in the change of day/night light, collecting items in events that makes them shine over the rest carebears, talk pretty about the wonders of the lands they try to conquer and receive after some hard work the prizes and treasures the hole real has for them.
In the other hand there's the bad guys. Those who stay long nights leveling and mobbing to get high level fast. They usually have the best guides 'cause most of them are written by them. They take a lot of risks playing in dangerous areas. They have clan wars more even than normal or "nice" players. They enjoy the luxury of having pvp without the safety of the "pvp the games offers". They fight for "Pink slips" They fight for their lives (EXP) Winner takes all. Fame, glory and exp. The looser awaits silent and prepare to a payback.
Right between this two "Factions" lives an unadjusted, awfully and disrespected kind of people. The ones who don't like the system. The ones who like to be free of boring quests. Those who like to wander around having the law by their grasp. Their own hand. Those are Chaotic Players.
Nobody likes to be a "Perma-Red" But sometimes going Red its just the right answer to solve a problem. And this works for EVERYONE. Nicer and Badass. Everyone has to be at least one time, RED.
The old system allowed the reds. And it was harsh on those who tried to live the life of a perma-red. Piñata mode, always looking over the shoulder, loose exp, and forced to live like an outcast. Even if you do it once, you had the choice of making it right again.
The new system punishes, condemns, and vanishes you to the inner circle of hell if you do kill someone. It is a forced Perma-Red to everyone. And the only way of getting off that hell, is to DIE and start again. That is the truth. And it sux.
I really hope that NCsoft hold off the foot of the pedal this time and lower the punishment on chaotic players.
Sincerely.
ps: I hope there's not bad words or language. I see a lot of movies using some slang and I really have no idea if some are inappropriate or not.:o
This is ridiculous. How anyone can't see so is beyond me. (Great post, Crysillion - if there was a + system, you'd be one up now for it) There's been a blind launch of a drastically altered system that's left players with little experience of the game to begin with, finding themselves used as guinea pigs and enduring unforseen consequences. No-one thought to run this through test sessions, sat down and considered possible repurcussions? Absolutely, the likening to being dropped in the ocean, abandoned at sea is apt, here.
I wouldn't want to explore this side of the game at all. It just seems horrible. That by the way's a terrible thing, that a part of accepted play has now been disincentivised to the degree that it's essentially not feasible to take pleasurable part in, for the majority.
you would think that after so many updates to this old game there would be at least 1 guy who would have enough brain 2 set up a little button that could toggle ur attitude towards pvp/pk.... i mean just as simple as that.. no need 2 punish pkers or pvpers... just let them enable or disable how they want to play.It's sad to see ncsoft be so dumb after so many years in the mmo market, can't have any succesefull mmo... Aion failed Lineage failed CoH failed... wtf, is it so hard to read the forums and tell the developers "do this and this in the game" so it will not fail ? anyway gz for another fail. Sry for any english mistakes i may have made.
PS : ncsoft games are the least fun i have ever played... u feel like ur working not playing cuz all the intended frustration mechanics that they put in.
Let me give you a brief demonstration of the problem. In Naia earlier I was bored so I went around Gludio to see what's what with the new players and everything. In the ruins where the one quest mob spawns the newbies had formed a line and they were orderly going in turn to kill the single mob they needed for their quest.
Then random people started coming over, jumping the line and KSing the mob. And taunting the "idiots" that were doing it the right way ie waiting their turns. Problem is nobody could really do anything about the idiots. Any of those newbies PKed anybody they might as well delete their toon and start over cause there is no way for them to wash that pk. Hence the issue with the rep system. You can argue the previous system was too easy on the pker but this one is DEFINITELY too easy on the lower quality of players, the ones that don't respect the other people playing around them. So all that changed was from a system that benefited those that were quick to pk to a system that benefits those that lack any sense fairplay. I am not seeing the "improvement".
Then I brought an old 68lvl permared of mine over, who had lost all his karma thanks to the GOD upgrade. Now he's -28000 rep. And for some reason my mother was mentioned very often and in not particularly good light when I was cleaning up the scrubs.
Everyone Relax. I bring good news. The PK system will change.
With this many complaints NCsoft will change it so just chill. Keep posting and complaining but don't uninstall the game. When L2 came out there were many problems with the PK system. Healers could heal and not even flag. For now just keep leveling the new toons on Shilien server.
The new system is bad for many reasons. Making it too difficult to pk someone discourages pking. This is catering to the carebear. The clan war system is also stupid by limiting it to 1 week a month max. This makes it great to be a carebear. Stop marketing this game to the carebear. Every other game out there is marketed to carebears and you're not going to compete with them. From a marketing point of view there is a huge demand for a game with good pvp. That has always been L2, but it wasn't free and leveling was horrific. Now you fixed all that, but your pulling back from the pvp. You see how this is a bad strategy. You're never going to get the WoW players. L2 will never be what they're looking for in a game. But you already have the reputation of being a strong pvp oriented game. You should be using that to your advantage, play on it and tell the pvpers that have left or who are shopping that you fixed the problems and you're a great pvp game.
Also keep in mind it's different in South Korea and this could be one of those things that wasn't changed and should have been, coming to the US. In South Korea it's a much more role-playing atmosphere. In the past, many things have changed in translation and I am sure in the next update this will as well.
Please NCsoft,
Change it back or to something better. Currently numbers are 3:1 against the current system.
There was nothing wrong with the old system, you rarely saw a red character and when you did everyone tried their best to kill it.
This Reputation System is horrible. Go back to the old one.
The root of the problem is understanding the difference between Player Killing and preventing griefing between players. If you really want to prevent greifing you could have just blocked the repeated killing of the same character. Basically, NCSoft cut off the foot because there was a hang nail on the big toe.
It seems the pk system was changed as in it seems impossible to actually work off a red status. Is this working as intended? only 1 'karma' lost per death? only 1 'karma' per mob kill? are they trying to eliminate the best aspect of lineage 2 ?
I'm playing Lineage 2 for almost 7 years already. I used to play the offi server for 2 or 3 years. But i got tired. Moved to few pirate servers, get back to the offi and things like that. I enjoy pvp and I really do hate pk. BUT ! I'm playing while elf tank since c4, if I remember correctly. This tank lack damage. It takes time to kill a monster and its a slow process. I've always played with friends and usually partying. But now with this quests, easy leveling and stuff we are shattared around the map (i'm playing Shilien server atm). I went to wasteland and start hunting mobs. Quite a difficult process for a lowbie tank. So i found a spot with just 2 or 3 mobs that are spawning and I have the time to kill them. Here is this mage who came and start chatting with me. When the mob reaches less than 50% he ksed it. Ok i thought he need 2-3 mobs, whatever let him kill them. I asked him, he sayd that he will ks me because he CAN ! Well he ksed few more mobs, i wanted to change spot and he follows me. Now i changed spot, he continue ksed and i pked him (i had no idea that this pk system is so f1cked up)... What was i suppose to do ? Because of this system, everywhere you see people running and ksing without even care about that. Rarely someone is flagged and even if he is, some 2-3 friends party kills him and nobody dare to attack them. Okay I dont mind if pkers get harsh punishmend but i think this is way too hard especially how many people are playing Shilien and how zones lack monsters. I wanted to suggest this no idea if someone will even read it but still i want to post it. For example if you kill someone you'll get the -720 reputation points. That's okay but lets say you'll loose about 20-50 per monster. THat's ok right ? BUT ! Everytime you pk someone you receive DOUBLED the last negative reputation points. So for 2 pks you'll get -1400, for 3 pks you'll get 2800, and so on. And for every new PK you make you also loose 1 reputation point gaining. If you are gaining 20 reputation points from a monster when you have 1 pk, if you have 2pks you'll gain only 19 points per monster and so on. This will give some opportunity to pk players but also consider not to go too far. And final, you can always remove the PK cleanning quest.
It is good to have pkers around you, it teaches you to look behind your shoulder more often :) I have learned alot for defending my self only because of the pkers :)
Previous PK system was awesome, but too easy for PKers.
New system not bad, but too hard for PKers ... Anyway, I like it ;)
NCSoft always run to extremes ...
And you just showed what a carebear you are. Enjoy your wow.
Who enjoys when killing lower lvls? L2 is pvp game 2 side wars, cs, tw, not by killing low lvl or not equal players.
For PK'ing you can make pk char if you get satisfied by that.
Well, I dont know... People used to say to me that they quit l2 because they get pked at first, so this might actually stop but I dont know...
I wont PK for sure...
Everyone Relax. I bring good news. The PK system will change.
With this many complaints NCsoft will change it so just chill. Keep posting and complaining but don't uninstall the game. When L2 came out there were many problems with the PK system. Healers could heal and not even flag. For now just keep leveling the new toons on Shilien server.
The new system is bad for many reasons. Making it too difficult to pk someone discourages pking. This is catering to the carebear. The clan war system is also stupid by limiting it to 1 week a month max. This makes it great to be a carebear. Stop marketing this game to the carebear. Every other game out there is marketed to carebears and you're not going to compete with them. From a marketing point of view there is a huge demand for a game with good pvp. That has always been L2, but it wasn't free and leveling was horrific. Now you fixed all that, but your pulling back from the pvp. You see how this is a bad strategy. You're never going to get the WoW players. L2 will never be what they're looking for in a game. But you already have the reputation of being a strong pvp oriented game. You should be using that to your advantage, play on it and tell the pvpers that have left or who are shopping that you fixed the problems and you're a great pvp game.
Also keep in mind it's different in South Korea and this could be one of those things that wasn't changed and should have been, coming to the US. In South Korea it's a much more role-playing atmosphere. In the past, many things have changed in translation and I am sure in the next update this will as well.
Please NCsoft,
Change it back or to something better. Currently numbers are 3:1 against the current system.
You talking about pvp, thread about pk ...
L2 still pvp game.
Free servers can't be good servers without strong punish for PK.
This is probably the dumbest change ive ever seen. Please revert this change as this makes the game incredibly boring. Please. Change it back. Or atleast make it so reds can actually work it off. Words cannot express my disappointment..
I'm going to assume the system is tailor made to prevent any higher levels (9 or less because of a buff you *Sometimes* get from Newbie Helpers if you go see them) from killing lower levels and getting away with it without ruining their character.
I think it will go back to this old one mainly because of people not liking the new one. Most of the time anyways when people PK it's because some stupid BR that barely speaks English is kill stealing and hunting quest mobs they don't even need, so somebody gets tired of it and kills them. And now they have to pay the price.
On the other hand, if people want to be d!cks and just random PK somebody while they're trying to PvE, then they get what they deserve
How about working on a channel system. In a different PvP based mmo i played they simply had a PvP channel with higher exp etc and a PvE channel. Although the PvE channel did get bot flooded in the end..... I'm sure there are a dozen ways to balance pk system instead of such extremes, here's hoping they acknowledge our displeasure
Actually i like the new System but Pk is still a part of L2.
To clear 800 Karma u need arround 8 hours +/- (ofc it depends on the person and how lucky u are) and much patience.
Specially for me it would be enough to lower it a bit.
Karma shall be a punishment but atm it's a bit to harsh..
To give them a place and some chances to clear it with Quests could be a good idea too
seriously all those new players should stop talking (i'm being polite) and carry on their game...this is a thread about us who love pvp and are from the old school l2. take your kind face outta here. And yes i want this pk syster turned back to the old again
Did you intend to piss off the majority of your player base? Seriously post a poll to see who is happy. If it's dead even maybe you should look into making a PVE server for those who agree and offer free character transfers with this PK system. You need to modify the system the current system to better fit the players. I play this game for fun and it's not fun to constantly try to work hours of Reputation up for a simple error or some fun. Who says its always griefing? That's hardly the case. If people are going to grief they will do it regardless because they don't plan to work off the red. If people plan to work off karma then they aren't really griefers. This system is horrible and will eventually make players leave the game, especially after leveling is all done and endgame is achieved.
Call the Koreans and fix our beloved pvp/pk system. I don't know if they were all dropping X or some other feel good drug when they came up with this redesign, but it sucks. I haven't even PK'd yet (somehow I've controlled myself), but my friends have experienced the nightmare. It's a pvp game and this is a real debbie downer. Plus, it encourages people to be ***** because they know others will not want to PK them.
New Pk System... Yeah . **** It... So Dumb ...
I killed a bot with my friend because somehow that didn't find a detection system yet... and what do u know -700Rep. 1 hour later.. -630Rep.. either there is a better way to get rid of rep.. or wow.. lame.
Plus, it encourages people to be ***** because they know others will not want to PK them.
This.
This new broken system encourage people to behave like idiots. Try to farm a place and not be ksed to death, or leave your loot unpicked for a few seconds to see what happens. Your try to end "grief" by making people grief even more?
Revert back, lower the penalty, i dont care, just change it. I deeply regret having spent a 100 bucks here.
This system is beyond r3tarded, if you get karma around lv30-50 you might as well reroll, since it takes as much exp to level up a new toon.
L2 used to be a great pvp game, especially at early game in dion/eg, but right now it's outright pathetic, which is sad, because NCSoft did a good move making it F2P, they gained a lot of new players (servers are incredibly crowded) and they're gonna lose most of them because of this.. unnecessary change.
I know that at least me and a few friends are not coming back until this is changed (it took us a while to level up to 50, we are not rerolling at this point).
I don't speak for everyone though, some people might like it, others might not even care, but the fact is, a big porcentage is really p1ssed about it, your call NC.
I see a ton of newly created accounts posting they want to PK.
All of them saying they can't work off reputation before FIRST CLASS CHANGE.
Do you see what's wrong with this?
so I went and created new chars in Shillien, Chronos and the other new server.
I am not seeing the "problem" with levelling up, finished two first class change quests on different servers; I am trying on a different time later another couple of toons.
So what I see is newly created accounts, who came here to grief and kill just for fun, not to "pvp"; but just because before this update, they could.
To the couple misguided guys who think in Korea it's more of a roleplaying thing. It's not, it's documented that since most of the playtime is done from webcafes, the size of wich you have not seen in your country probably, that very few players dare to random PK outside of clan wars and sieges.
Why? because if you are being a donkey over there, then they find out who the heck is p laying where and they go and punch them in the face in person; that's right, they don't have the luxury ofplaying from their mother's basement in complete anonimity.
I don't know if you know, but Korea has competitive L2 tournaments; you just CANT hide yourself if you are actually somebody over there.
so it's not like over there they don't harass players either; it's precisely because over there it is SERIOUSBUSINESS that they have been revamping the PK system, please don't act like the US and rest of the world has any say on the design of L2.
and if you come from private servers... guess what, jump up and down and all around baby, cos this is not going to change the way you like it, we are going to get a couple modifications vastly depending on what Korea decides is the best course of action and you roll with it.
the fact this update and the next one didn't kill L2 is up there in the korean webpage for the game; see the ammount of servers available, check how many we have over here and in russia and we are still way too short.
This system is beyond r3tarded, if you get karma around lv30-50 you might as well reroll, since it takes as much exp to level up a new toon.
L2 used to be a great pvp game, especially at early game in dion/eg, but right now it's outright pathetic, which is sad, because NCSoft did a good move making it F2P, they gained a lot of new players (servers are incredibly crowded) and they're gonna lose most of them because of this.. unnecessary change.
I know that at least me and a few friends are not coming back until this is changed (it took us a while to level up to 50, we are not rerolling at this point).
I don't speak for everyone though, some people might like it, others might not even care, but the fact is, a big porcentage is really p1ssed about it, your call NC.
Peace.
Don't let the door hit you; they are not changing it to fit your wants; thi sgame is still PvP heavy, it's just not PK friendly anymore.
I see a ton of newly created accounts posting they want to PK.
All of them saying they can't work off reputation before FIRST CLASS CHANGE.
Do you see what's wrong with this?
so I went and created new chars in Shillien, Chronos and the other new server.
I am not seeing the "problem" with levelling up, finished two first class change quests on different servers; I am trying on a different time later another couple of toons.
So what I see is newly created accounts, who came here to grief and kill just for fun, not to "pvp"; but just because before this update, they could.
To the couple misguided guys who think in Korea it's more of a roleplaying thing. It's not, it's documented that since most of the playtime is done from webcafes, the size of wich you have not seen in your country probably, that very few players dare to random PK outside of clan wars and sieges.
Why? because if you are being a donkey over there, then they find out who the heck is p laying where and they go and punch them in the face in person; that's right, they don't have the luxury ofplaying from their mother's basement in complete anonimity.
I don't know if you know, but Korea has competitive L2 tournaments; you just CANT hide yourself if you are actually somebody over there.
so it's not like over there they don't harass players either; it's precisely because over there it is SERIOUSBUSINESS that they have been revamping the PK system, please don't act like the US and rest of the world has any say on the design of L2.
and if you come from private servers... guess what, jump up and down and all around baby, cos this is not going to change the way you like it, we are going to get a couple modifications vastly depending on what Korea decides is the best course of action and you roll with it.
the fact this update and the next one didn't kill L2 is up there in the korean webpage for the game; see the ammount of servers available, check how many we have over here and in russia and we are still way too short.
PKing is part of the game, at least it was. I could still grief people if I wanted to now, just make a throw away toon, but the point is that this system will allow people to grief by kill stealing w/o any real chance of retribution. I'm sure the carebears love it, but this is going to be a deal breaker for a lot of people.
I see a ton of newly created accounts posting they want to PK.
All of them saying they can't work off reputation before FIRST CLASS CHANGE.
Do you see what's wrong with this?
so I went and created new chars in Shillien, Chronos and the other new server.
I am not seeing the "problem" with levelling up, finished two first class change quests on different servers; I am trying on a different time later another couple of toons.
So what I see is newly created accounts, who came here to grief and kill just for fun, not to "pvp"; but just because before this update, they could.
To the couple misguided guys who think in Korea it's more of a roleplaying thing. It's not, it's documented that since most of the playtime is done from webcafes, the size of wich you have not seen in your country probably, that very few players dare to random PK outside of clan wars and sieges.
Why? because if you are being a donkey over there, then they find out who the heck is p laying where and they go and punch them in the face in person; that's right, they don't have the luxury ofplaying from their mother's basement in complete anonimity.
I don't know if you know, but Korea has competitive L2 tournaments; you just CANT hide yourself if you are actually somebody over there.
so it's not like over there they don't harass players either; it's precisely because over there it is SERIOUSBUSINESS that they have been revamping the PK system, please don't act like the US and rest of the world has any say on the design of L2.
and if you come from private servers... guess what, jump up and down and all around baby, cos this is not going to change the way you like it, we are going to get a couple modifications vastly depending on what Korea decides is the best course of action and you roll with it.
the fact this update and the next one didn't kill L2 is up there in the korean webpage for the game; see the ammount of servers available, check how many we have over here and in russia and we are still way too short.
You like to play the game in a certain way, I do not share that opinion.
Of course there's a ton of new accounts, the servers just went f2p you *******, and NCSoft has to see what's better for them monetarily. So yes, it does matter what people think.
Just for future reference, I see a lot of oldies complaining about the new system too, so your argument is meaningless.
You like to play the game in a certain way, I do not share that opinion.
Of course there's a ton of new accounts, the servers just went f2p you *******, and NCSoft has to see what's better for them monetarily. So yes, it does matter what people think.
Just for future reference, I see a lot of oldies complaining about the new system too, so your argument is meaningless.
Thank you NC! The new reputation system is wonderful!
The old system did not dissuade PKers enough.
There are some mean PKers out there who love to bring misery to other players. I have known a lot of players who left Lineage 2 because some jerk would PK them without provocation.
Getting unjustifiably PKed sucks. It is like you are being harassed by some anonymous bully. Giving jerks less incentive to harass others is a good thing.
I am sure some PKers will complain, and say that I am some care bear. Of course they will complain. Bullies give little regard for the welfare of others. They prioritize fulfillment of their sadistic fantasies.
Now, I do not have any problem with PVP, such as castle sieges and clan wars. And I think there are times when PK might be justified. But, for the "I get my willies killing random noob" PKers out there, I am glad NC inconvenienced them slightly.
Thank you NC! A whole bunch of my friends have already returned to Lineage 2 because of this change.... including myself. GoD rocks!
Thank you NC! The new reputation system is wonderful!
The old system did not dissuade PKers enough.
There are some mean PKers out there who love to bring misery to other players. I have known a lot of players who left Lineage 2 because some jerk would PK them without provocation.
Getting unjustifiably PKed sucks. It is like you are being harassed by some anonymous bully. Giving jerks less incentive to harass others is a good thing.
I am sure some PKers will complain, and say that I am some care bear. Of course they will complain. Bullies give little regard for the welfare of others. They prioritize fulfillment of their sadistic fantasies.
Now, I do not have any problem with PVP, such as castle sieges and clan wars. And I think there are times when PK might be justified. But, for the "I get my willies killing random noob" PKers out there, I am glad NC inconvenienced them slightly.
Thank you NC! A whole bunch of my friends have already returned to Lineage 2 because of this change.... including myself. GoD rocks!
Let me explain what this new system will do to you:
Pre-update: I wanted your xp spot, so I either kill mobs and you flag/pk me or come back with more people to kill me.
Post-update: I walk into the room/area, start killing everything in site. You flag me, I refuse to flag back, and as long as my kill speed is faster, I will basically keep you from leveling there. Or you PK me, and now I just come back and farm you. It will take you forever to clear, so basically your xp time is all but gone for the night.
So yea, be happy until you find out that we're still able to grief the **** out of you, we just do it in a way that leaves you little to no recourse.
In the old days, if someone was kill stealing off me (especially when they could easily move somewhere else for the same mobs with no other players around) I would just kill them. Now, I won't because it's such a monumental waste of time.
This game is becoming more and more anti-pvp. It's a shame.
A mage was last hitting all my mobs and then i left my spot.
After 10 mins i meet him again and he continues to just last hit.
As i were in an extremely simple quest for an HOUR due to the fact that all the places ( particularly those with quest mobs ) are too crowded and that little mage was following me all the time.
I'VE RUN OUT OF PATIENCE. I warned him 3 times.
I was in a good mood and had no porpose to kill someone in front of 1k people.
However,that bastard left me no choice so i Pked him at Ruins Of Despair!
yes at rod with all those people around.
And here comes the pain.
I only had to go to Wastelands ( FROM THE FAKING RoD ). -10 mins
Then i discovered that mobs gave me only 1 rep. point. -5 mins
So i went to killmyself. -1 min
After 10 minutes of trying to get out of gludio territory with 31243424 pkers near me and 2343535345 players killing the pkers i managed to leave the area. -10 min as said already ;d
I've gone to Cruma Tower, -10mins
found a place with no other PCs and stayed there for a while. -45 mins
Then i saw some people coming and i couldnt take the risk of dying again and do the whole rout again -10 mins for logging out/in to avoid pcs
So i went to Partisan's Hideway where i stayed till my soulshots and healing run out. 1 hour
At this point,i decided to make a dwarf and as the reward of completing test of fate (transfer) i would have the SS needed.
I made an email,made an acc,log in,create char,level up to 20 with quests and then finally gave soulshots and potions to my player. -2 hours
At last,when i had the ss and healing i stayed there for -3 hours ( 550 rep to 0 cuz w/o buffs )
How much time would it be to complete the quest with that little mage ksing me?
Half an hour.
How much time it took me to kill him,recover reputation,complete the quest?
It took me overall 8hours ....but i did a faking rest so 10 hours!
TEN FAKIN HOURS FOR A PK!
I will start laughing when people at lvl 52 or higher pk some!MuHAHAHAHAH
The moment they realise this system they will come to forum , say nice pk system but i have to unins l2.!bb
One peace of advise, no matter how angry are you, how much of your time ******** KSers are spending do not ever,ever pk some1!
Believe you will regret it one hundred times.
-A zone for Player Killers with quest or lose when die karma -like it's been hitherto- to remove faster his negative reputation (not killing mobs during hours over and over and avoiding thousands of player who can kill them easily).
-Uninstall L2 GoD when you kill a little kid/carebear/bot-player.
Everyones who's agree with this new system we all know that they're a big troll/botters. If you don't like to be PKed, L2 ain't your game, so GTHO to your: "please, gimme duel in order to kill you, please, I need duel to kill you or I won't can >.< game"
L2 was the best MMO in his gender because of the PVP/PVE and free PK system, if it weren't that much, they just should not implement this nomenclature or other kind of system related to kill anyone w/o restriction.
Ok, just want to say that it would be great to have a place for pkers.. i mean.. it's own city.. (like Floran but with more features..) it would be nice to have some gaining reputation quests starting in there.. difficult quests ofc.
Also this could be related in some grade make a new faction.. smth like shilen followers.. (red name = shillen followers, white name = neutrals, green name = epic heroes of light? lol)
**** it! that would make some cheesy fun at l2..!
This suggestion is critical.
Let me just say I'm not a random PKr but the fact is, people turn red through no fault of their own. One PK should not make a player red. That's unreasonable.
In addition, there are plenty of folks who deserve to be attacked and this is a PvP game; albeit a clan war and siege one for the most part.
Prior to turning RED a player should be allowed a certain number of kills and while not claiming to know what that number is, 1 (one) is certainly not the correct setting.
ah,and another thing to all the stupids carebares with an BIG opinion about l2 with an account created in nov 2011 :
go die and keep ur finger away of this post,u don't even have a clue about what is this game,return to your stupid pve games and let us our only good pvp one.
Family (4people) stopped playing after 1day retail L2GOD.
PK=RR, KSing/new PK system Made me quit L2.
Whats up with the newbie 1mob advance scripting ?
Family (4people) stopped playing after 1day retail L2GOD.
PK=RR, KSing/new PK system Made me quit L2.
Whats up with the newbie 1mob advance scripting ?
most of people thinks this system sux and i agree with them .
im a tank and i kill much slower than almost any other char in the game i get constantly ks'ed and there was 1 orc extremely annoying ks'ing all my mobs so the only thing i can do is let him ks me?? and u say that's not griefing? so they get no punishment for their acts and i , that i was just defending my rights , have to grind 4 hours without any goal more than getting rid of my rep...nice job guys ...
i got rid of that rep though(lvl 58 tank..) and guess what another ks'ed appeared what do i do? as u can guess i didnt want to pk again and have more hours of pointless grind coz some idiot is ks'ing me so i attacked him a little bit with my panther, then some other guy starts attacking me ,so i go to attack him(forgot bout panther) the dorf gets his clothes out and boom my panther kills her and i get -1k rep so what do i do know kill 500 mobs for killing some griefing ********?
this system sux hard and u know it i dont know what u r w8ing for to change it , as for me i have to lose my lvl 6x char or grind 5-6hrs (finding spot ,getting out of ss-buff , and killing **** loads of mobs for nothing) or the last choice leave this **** till u fix this lolpksystem coz im not lvling another char to 6x and wasting my time and getting ks'ed.
or.. maybe i should make a mage now and ks the *** out of every1 though its not considered griefing :D.
1pk = -20 rep = (20 mobs with lvl -5+ like me, without exp/sp)
2pk = -30 rep = (30 mobs with lvl -5+ like me, without exp/sp)
3pk = -40 rep = same script like up
4pk = -50 rep
5pk = -60 rep
.....
10pk = -110 rep and BONUS drop items when have Karma
We all hopefully stood in a line waiting to be our turn for that single questmob in ruins of agony. Kilianova or so. Someone thought he doesn't need to wait even after we told him. So we all raided him for good. I got last hit and the karma.
Ok lesson learned.
I am rerolling a mystic muse. If someone really annoys you don't pk them. Annoy them until they pk you.
Perhaps camping Killianova a few hours would create enough frustrated of players to make nc soft do something about their new justice prevention system. (alias known as new reputation system)
I am in no way into pk and making other people miserable so i won't do that. However sometimes justice have to be dealt by a 10 pound hammer to the head, which was possible in the past. Not anymore :-(
Where are the old glorious fights for the best hunting spots? Best taktic is not to fight back. Let them destroy their reputation. They will love it.
My claining story for killing one guy, unattended.
First i talked with some fellow pk'rs in floran what to do... i came to the conclusion that i have to do a quest or kill 500 mobs around my lvl..
Well i needed lvl 50 mobs so i went on a quest for my own to find them. First i tried to walk from floran to devil isle, when i came there i killed 4 mobs which gave me -4 rep! which was awsome, but then some guy came and killed me, i was back at giran.
Then i walked on to oren and later till aden! ofcourse all this accured after getting killed quite a lot along the way.. which cost me a keyboard i broke. Anyways when i was finally in Aden after 6 hours of walking and getting killed i could start the cleaining... because when i die i can press go to village and ill spawn at the mobs outside aden again which are lvl 50! ..... so 2,5 hours later I cleaned all my karma!
In total it took me 8,5 hours to clean the karma of (not even on purpose) killing 1 single guy. So i say please get back to the old system or smth simmilar like that!
I honestly think that the system needed to be changed a little bit, but not like this. Why would anyone in the right mind want to go red now?
PKing in the past was about taking a risk, if the other player didnt want to fight back and you decided you dont like him and kill him, you run the risk of being red and possibly being hunted and drop items.
PKing now in GoD is instantly 800 karma with a cap on reducing only karma by 2 a kill. When red you share the same penalties as before except now you dont earn exp or sp while working it off.
Lineage 2 was amazing in the aspect that no other game had a unique and fun system like this where players could choose to risk their belonging to smite others.
I think they need to spend a little more time on the PK system and revert it back to the way it used to be a change it a little bit so people can go on massive pk sprees and not worry about it. The change in GoD was a terrible change.
The system sux atm, the whole point of a pvp game is taking the risk of getting pk but if the punishment is this high (2-3 hrs of killing high lvl mobs in a server full of players like Shilen) then the game becomes just pve and boring. When you are at clan war is normal to kill support chars that are not in the war clan and become pker its stupid to let them keep ressing or summoning.
Plz change the system, less kills or lower the karma when die.
Let me explain what this new system will do to you:
Pre-update: I wanted your xp spot, so I either kill mobs and you flag/pk me or come back with more people to kill me.
Post-update: I walk into the room/area, start killing everything in site. You flag me, I refuse to flag back, and as long as my kill speed is faster, I will basically keep you from leveling there. Or you PK me, and now I just come back and farm you. It will take you forever to clear, so basically your xp time is all but gone for the night.
So yea, be happy until you find out that we're still able to grief the **** out of you, we just do it in a way that leaves you little to no recourse.
Actually, what usually happened was that the person would just kill me outright. I don't flag on people, ever.
I have never PKed someone. Being terrorized by PKers... that has happened all the time.
Everyones who's agree with this new system we all know that they're a big troll/botters. If you don't like to be PKed, L2 ain't your game, so GTHO to your: "please, gimme duel in order to kill you, please, I need duel to kill you or I won't can >.< game"
Greetings. ;)
First of all, you're wrong. There are people out there who enjoy Lineage 2 who do not enjoy PKing. The world design, the character design, the armor and weapon design, the skills and powers, the look of various monsters, and so on, can be quite appealing to PVE players. I found the look and feel of the Lineage 2 world was far better done than WoW or Aion.
And considering a complaint I have heard from people who have tried PVP was that some PKers auto bot their consumption of CP and heal pots, calling a person who agrees with the new reputation system a botter is hilariously hypocritical.
They are trying to make a deterrent to PKing.
Killing 20 mobs to wash off 1 pk is hardly a deterrent at all.
Obviously, the new reputation system is working as intended.... it is actually functioning as the deterrent that NC wanted it to be.
My nick in Magmelt KochamLagi
My sugesstion:
System PK/Rep is ok with some FIX, I'm mean:
One mob = +1 rep
1pk = -20 rep = (20 mobs with lvl -5+ like me, without exp/sp)
2pk = -30 rep = (30 mobs with lvl -5+ like me, without exp/sp)
3pk = -40 rep = same script like up
4pk = -50 rep
5pk = -60 rep
.....
10pk = -110 rep and BONUS drop items when have Karma
Totally agree, took me two days to work off my 800 karma from my FIRST (Accident) Pk. Feels good to be white again but PKing used to be a big part of my game and how I enjoyed it, can't see me pking anyone again. Sad :(
This new pk system is ****, lets say you are killing rb whit party and other party come to kill same rb. So what you do??? Just kill rb and hope for last hit?
I personaly think is a little too hard to take your karma off too.. Is good to be hard but not so hard like this.. if u make more than 1 pk u can delete your char. At least if they give us a chance by implementing an quest or smth to get rid of karma/negativ reputation ! :rolleyes:
it's hard if you're a newbie and you 're playing in zones with 6000 other newbies. When you get higher and the population spreads out it's not THAT hard to wash your pk
What can I say- ITS HORRIBLE. I hope at least Innova will be smarter and leaves old pk system. If they do, I will leave this farm land with pleasure and wont regret spending her week to lvl up my char.
it's hard if you're a newbie and you 're playing in zones with 6000 other newbies. When you get higher and the population spreads out it's not THAT hard to wash your pk
I disagree, even when u spread out you need to find a place where u find mobs from ur own lvl or higher.. all the "good areas" will be occupied still. since you get 750 karma for 1 pk and counting and mobs give only -1 or -2 chances are big ppl will still see you and hunt you down, so you have to find another spot... and so on.
What can I say- ITS HORRIBLE. I hope at least Innova will be smarter and leaves old pk system. If they do, I will leave this farm land with pleasure and wont regret spending her week to lvl up my char.
It's impossible that Innova change that, bcuz it's an implementation of the Korean Client.
I'm already uninstalling Lineage II Goddess of Destruction bcuz I can't advance in the game with my hero lvl. 26 by a mistake I commited Pking some1 who was stealing me mobs...
That's what you wanted, NCsoft/Plaync Team, to kill L2. You've got it. Be proud.
More than 9 years of project transformated onto "Happy world for bots and wizard classes". Thanks for this craaapped expansion to put in rubbish L2.
1pk = -20 rep = (20 mobs with lvl -5+ like me, without exp/sp)
2pk = -30 rep = (30 mobs with lvl -5+ like me, without exp/sp)
3pk = -40 rep = same script like up
4pk = -50 rep
5pk = -60 rep
.....
10pk = -110 rep and BONUS drop items when have Karma
simple:
amount pk score - x
const - 10
(10*X)+10
if enemy is -5+ lvl
(20*X)+20
if enemy got lower lvl -6<
const= 20
Number 1 Line.. Copy Paste it Shove it in Admin/Gm/Dev Face
YOU DON'T FIX SOMETHING THAT IS NOT BROKEN...
Ive Played since c1.. i wanna quit l2 bcuz of this. Rep System.. FAIL
This new fail PK system... I do not recommend even my worst enemy. It's just a hell to go on playing it, giving you just 2 ways: Delete your toon or try to resist almost 3k ppl pursuing you when you're killing 720 mobs.
L2 will be dead in some months thanks to this epic fail protocol of PK. Barely you can get some places to kill 1 mob for 5 minutes with more than 3000 players on... and they think we are able to kill between 360-720 for 1 pk we commit w/o positive reputation at lvl 1-50? Good luck then, I've just uninstalled L2 client. To do this crappy things, I'll be better in Aion killing Asmos/Elyos and, of course, I'll enjoy it so much.
Completely agree, this new update was great in many aspects, but in regards to the changes made to PKing, it's an absolute desecration of an important aspect of what made Lineage 2 fun in the past.
In my opinion, the best Lineage 2 is when player's could train other's and actually get their items from doing so. That was real risk, and a very fun time around C3 and prior.
******* PVErs go back to Farm Frenzy, here in L2 we kill 1 million mobs so we crush each other's skulls in a continuous attempt to be the best PVP-er. PK and XP loss on dying is what distinguished Lineage as a hardcore game from the other Kebab-Brain Games out there, topping with the Godlike Shaorma Player Game, World of Warcraft. The IDIOT who thought this new system to be VIABLE in a game like this should be fired and sent to the salt mines on forced labour.
*Think about it, the idiot who concieved this system couldn't actually figure out that you can actually **** up your char in a simple mass pvp by a late arrow on a deflagging guy. But what the heck, they brought some stupid **** who got fired from WoW while he was designing pansies and mushrooms and put him in charge of the PVP system.
I'm 100% sure it was a woman. As for "PVE-rs", do you know why people kill each other in games? Cause in real life we can't do that, we have laws.
But why are you potato farmers doing this in game when you can just go farm something in real life so we have enough food while we crush each others skulls, ******* zen piece of *****.
Current PK system is horrendous and need to be re-think ASAP. At lower level, if you PK someone you might as well just start another character and that's some extremely poor game design right there.
No EXP, no SP? What the hell now? Honestly, their new system is atrocious and need to be changed ASAP.
Ah, to be perfectly clear, the number of mobs is not a problem, who gives a **** if i'm red or white, i'll find a way to farm with a party of friends or in an isolated place. THE PART WITH NO XP/SP WHILE KILLING HUGE AMOUnTS OF MOBS IS THE STATUE OF IDIOTISM RIGHT THERE. Either put few mobs to clear off karma with no xp/sp gain or put xp/sp gain and 1 trillion mobs to farm (since i'm gonna farm them anyway) but don't block off a char in the game because what do you know, he killed some pansie who still has his tutorial book and sit hotkeys in his quickbar.
Also, whoever say this is a good system need to think again. What if someone start to KS you, and grief you to no end? That griefer refuse to flag? What are you going to do? That's right, there is nothing you can do now. You either PK him and waste 8 hours+ of your time (without exp or sp mind you), or log off.
If it was the old system, you could have killed him, worked off your karma (while still getting some exp/sp). It was still a very harsh penalty.
Also, whoever say this is a good system need to think again. What if someone start to KS you, and grief you to no end? That griefer refuse to flag? What are you going to do? That's right, there is nothing you can do now. You either PK him and waste 8 hours+ of your time (without exp or sp mind you), or log off.
If it was the old system, you could have killed him, worked off your karma (while still getting some exp/sp). It was still a very harsh penalty.
No really, their new system is simply horrendous.
I pked an anoying kamael ksing mobs, now im at floran loged out till the system change. Is just imposible to get to lvl 48+ areas to clean rep. because with a 6k players i die more times than the mobs i kill. Is Over for me atm.
Maybe this is an idea... the guy who attack a PK char goes purple... so you can atleast farm off the karma with friends without them watching you die from some guy.
The more I think about their new reputation mechanic, the more baffled I am at NCSOFT. For both play style (carebear or griefer), this system doesn't work . It's abusive and extremely dumb.
I'm sorry, but this is just plain bad game design...
I understand that the dev team wanted to make ppl think twice before pking protecting newbies etc.
But this system is really harsh even masochistic...1st pk ~700 mobs to clear,no xp/sp upon killing a mob and no reputation reduction after being killed.I mean if i wanted to torture my worst enemy i couldnt even figure such a system.Plz NCSoft consider changing at least a part of it.
PKing is part of the game, at least it was. I could still grief people if I wanted to now, just make a throw away toon, but the point is that this system will allow people to grief by kill stealing w/o any real chance of retribution. I'm sure the carebears love it, but this is going to be a deal breaker for a lot of people.
Andi f you read my posts on the other threads regarding PKers, I already told you that whatever system NCsoft puts in, the people who want to live permarred will continue to do it; and abuse the system.
And that going for a red PK is always a conscious choice, you try to talk to me like I have never killed a bot; but bots is one thing, PK is or should be a last resort solution, not the number one option to solving problems.
What your kind is used to is "PK now, worry never" at any level in the game; washing karma was hard pre-40 in the old system, and only if you didn't have any twinked gear.
It's just that you want your cake and eat it too: free to PK, wash off karma, still level up while doing it. I sincerely don't get your types, because it's meaningless "PvP" to jump on people who are hunting.
I have never gone off "pvping" while hunting because there is nothing to gain for it; and I have never felt inclined to spend my leveling time washing karma off. I don't regret killing farmers, but it did slow me down in the end to erase the PK count to 0 again when we had the sin eater quest.
You are all coming off as guys who want to play solo to grief; because a player with a guild can and will be able to PK and get his 360 mobs alone with guildies taking care of them; what is gone is the lone wolf PKer who now has to deal with the consequences of living on the edge.
If anything, now it really does mean something to be permared. If the developer intended for PKers to thrive in the game and for PK to be a number one solution, there wouldn't be a karma system in the first place and you would get prizes for PvP and PK counts. you don't, deal with it. It's hard now.
Andi f you read my posts on the other threads regarding PKers, I already told you that whatever system NCsoft puts in, the people who want to live permarred will continue to do it; and abuse the system.
And that going for a red PK is always a conscious choice, you try to talk to me like I have never killed a bot; but bots is one thing, PK is or should be a last resort solution, not the number one option to solving problems.
What your kind is used to is "PK now, worry never" at any level in the game; washing karma was hard pre-40 in the old system, and only if you didn't have any twinked gear.
It's just that you want your cake and eat it too: free to PK, wash off karma, still level up while doing it. I sincerely don't get your types, because it's meaningless "PvP" to jump on people who are hunting.
I have never gone off "pvping" while hunting because there is nothing to gain for it; and I have never felt inclined to spend my leveling time washing karma off. I don't regret killing farmers, but it did slow me down in the end to erase the PK count to 0 again when we had the sin eater quest.
You are all coming off as guys who want to play solo to grief; because a player with a guild can and will be able to PK and get his 360 mobs alone with guildies taking care of them; what is gone is the lone wolf PKer who now has to deal with the consequences of living on the edge.
If anything, now it really does mean something to be permared. If the developer intended for PKers to thrive in the game and for PK to be a number one solution, there wouldn't be a karma system in the first place and you would get prizes for PvP and PK counts. you don't, deal with it. It's hard now.
Is not about being permared, is about the whole PvP system, figure this up: you in clan war with other clan, they have 1 or 2 non clan warcryers in the spot, you kill them they come back over and over again cos you cant pk the wc, cos with this system if you chose to pk you will need hours and hours to get rid of it.
Ksers are game now because you cant do a thing to them.
Here are a couple of things you are not considering:
In the very beginning; if you wanted to PvP at low levels, you risked your leveling time, we are talking back when getting to 20 took the better part of a month, getting to 40 was a 3 to 5 month affair depending on wether or not you got whole item drops or saved enough to get top D stuff from Giran, C grade was craft only.
Now you get top gear at 20, when back then at 40 you were barely starting to get top D grade. Now you can go top C grade the second you get to 40.
We didn't need another deterrent aside from the fact you could drop gear that was equipped EVEN WHILE WHITE. Turning red just increased the chances. And it was still tough to wash karma before level 40.
then we discovered AoE hunting with poles, wich back then ANY toon could do; PK then go to Cruma or another dungeon, wash Karma off in a single pull.
So they nerfed pole hunting a whole lot.
and people started to twink toons, wich happens naturally as higher level toons earn so much more money; then we started seeing PvP at mid level with twinked toons.
and now that up until level 76 you get basically top grade whatever for your toon, it is easy to really damage lower level toons; after second class change its again open PvP without level restriction.
Now imagine what happens after second class change when you start facing toons that are overgeared for their level. Are you starting to see the problem with unrestricted PvP in the current conditions?
so again WHY THE HELL ARE YOU PKING UNDER LEVEL 40 NOWADAYS.
Here are a couple of things you are not considering:
In the very beginning; if you wanted to PvP at low levels, you risked your leveling time, we are talking back when getting to 20 took the better part of a month, getting to 40 was a 3 to 5 month affair depending on wether or not you got whole item drops or saved enough to get top D stuff from Giran, C grade was craft only.
Now you get top gear at 20, when back then at 40 you were barely starting to get top D grade. Now you can go top C grade the second you get to 40.
We didn't need another deterrent aside from the fact you could drop gear that was equipped EVEN WHILE WHITE. Turning red just increased the chances. And it was still tough to wash karma before level 40.
then we discovered AoE hunting with poles, wich back then ANY toon could do; PK then go to Cruma or another dungeon, wash Karma off in a single pull.
So they nerfed pole hunting a whole lot.
and people started to twink toons, wich happens naturally as higher level toons earn so much more money; then we started seeing PvP at mid level with twinked toons.
and now that up until level 76 you get basically top grade whatever for your toon, it is easy to really damage lower level toons; after second class change its again open PvP without level restriction.
Now imagine what happens after second class change when you start facing toons that are overgeared for their level. Are you starting to see the problem with unrestricted PvP in the current conditions?
so again WHY THE HELL ARE YOU PKING UNDER LEVEL 40 NOWADAYS.
In the first place, we don't like kser. In the second place we don't like carebears like you. All the reasons to pk, it was fun before... now we have to let people like you live >:
Ok so i was making a quest at westerlands and some cheeky mage was KS'ing my kills and getting all the quest kills, so i went mad and throw a double Thrust on him and wopps killed him...
Now i have -720 rep and it gets lower b1 when i kill i mob...
so i am lvl 35 and i have to kill 700 mobs to get my karma down ?
WTH ?
Same problem here...
i was in Sea of spores and a sph ks my mob... so i pk him... and when i opened the window i saw -700+ karma... i killed 1 mob and low me only 1 LOL...! the sph come again and i pk him AGAIN and now i have 1.700+ karma... OMG hmm 1.700 mobs?... :S
Same problem here...
i was in Sea of spores and a sph ks my mob... so i pk him... and when i opened the window i saw -700+ karma... i killed 1 mob and low me only 1 LOL...! the sph come again and i pk him AGAIN and now i have 1.700+ karma... OMG hmm 1.700 mobs?... :S
Same problem here...
i was in Sea of spores and a sph ks my mob... so i pk him... and when i opened the window i saw -700+ karma... i killed 1 mob and low me only 1 LOL...! the sph come again and i pk him AGAIN and now i have 1.700+ karma... OMG hmm 1.700 mobs?... :S
lol thats low karma... i have -3218 for 3 PK
after almost all day trying to take of -703 ... and after a big hours trying to farm and a lot of guys killing me... return trying to farm... and die again... and all this all the same time i piss off and kill everyone around me who try to kill me while im farming... about 15 guys... and get more 2 pk
now im playing another char waiting for this people solve this stupid PK system cause i cant play my char lvl 77 :mad:
If you 're 77 and don't know where to wash your karma safely without anybody bothering you you fail at this game.
Go Monas or Varka, m3n. You should be able to clear your karma there, oh.. wait. Server's overfilled, you cannot... :(
Sorry, now it's called "lineage 2: Goddess of Anihilation PVP players and swapped to Hello Kitty and Barbie Girls World for Bots an happy ppl"
GL, L2, you've just dead for the ppl who were enjoying a different and unique MMO for this free system to be a bad or good player or justly defend your rights Ingame when someone's annoying you. Thanks for all NCsoft Co. for killing it.
Go Monas or Varka, m3n. You should be able to clear your karma there, oh.. wait. Server's overfilled, you cannot... :(
Sorry, now it's called "lineage 2: Goddess of Anihilation PVP players and swapped to Hello Kitty and Barbie Girls World for Bots an happy ppl"
GL, L2, you've just dead for the ppl who were enjoying a different and unique MMO for this free system to be a bad or good player or justly defend your rights Ingame when someone's annoying you. Thanks for all NCsoft Co. for killing it.
You know... Me and 2 of my friends played Lineage 2 together since 2004. We spent ALOT of our free time grinding mobs in this game and it was fun. But like 2 years ago i guess we kinda decided that we're done with all the grind and it was time to move on, altho we loved L2. But we just didn't have that much time or the enthusiasm to play it anymore.
So when i saw GoD going F2P and all the quests system and stuff i kinda thought to myself: "heck why not give it a try...", and my friends said to me:"tell us how it is and we'll join you if its ok."
So everything was pretty cool and all, alot of people, the game isn't as time consuming as it was, so i was thinking to myself: "this could actually be some fun for a year or so..."
And yes, Lineage 2 has evolved to some point, when it comes to quests and some other stuff. Altho i do miss the old Lineage2 abit, but i guess the new quest system is something i can live with, its ok.
However...... The PK system has DEVOLVED into the biggest pile of **** i have ever seen. You know... all other MMORPGs out there on the market have a pathetic open pvp system, or they don't even have one. Thats why i never bothered to play any of those games for very long. And if NCsoft thought that making the pvp system the way that new MMOs have is EVOLUTION they were sadly really really WRONG. They killed the essence of Lineage2, they killed a mechanic that made L2 BETTER than all the carebear **** out there. And now... There is nothing to distinguish Lineage 2 from all the other **** MMOs out there anymore. Its just another drop into the ocean of MMORPGs. Just because of the simple fact that someone was too lazy to think twice about what he's doing to the pvp system. And seriously i don't understand that. You launch the game with new servers, biggest content update and alot of hipe about it. But with an idea SO SLOPPY!!!??? How is that even possible, is this a joke?
8 years!!! 8 years of evolution in this game, 8 years of observing the pvp system, and 8 years of time that you had to rethink it, make a new one, a better one. And after 8 years, this is what you come up with? :eek: :eek: :eek: