Recently, there has been more whine than I have ever seen in my life over something that has been a part of the game since the beginning. It is amazing to me, how people join a pvp game expecting sunshine and roses. Anyway the point of this thread is for you (the complainers) to take a moment and realize this game is not all about you.
1. A pk’er worked hard to get where he is, why is it fair for you (complainers) to suggest that the mechanics change in a way that it benefits noobs over the hardcore?
2. You hate being pk’ed? So do I, so does the pk’er but think about this, the pk’er is the one taking all the risk because at this point that character may not ever advance due to the current system. So what else is there to do?
3. This is Lineage 2, as I mentioned this game is a PVP game. It is not sunshine and flowers; that said, being pk’ed is a rite of passage welcome.
4. But but but I keep getting pk’ed over and over again! Well logic would dictate that rather than running to the forums to complain you ask a Clannie or two to bring their ***** down to <insert location> to clear house.
5. Finally, I cannot stress this enough this is a game take it at face value and relax. If you do not like an open pvp environment there are non pvp wow servers.
Recently, there has been more whine than I have ever seen in my life over something that has been a part of the game since the beginning. It is amazing to me, how people join a pvp game expecting sunshine and roses. Anyway the point of this thread is for you (the complainers) to take a moment and realize this game is not all about you.
1. A pk’er worked hard to get where he is, why is it fair for you (complainers) to suggest that the mechanics change in a way that it benefits noobs over the hardcore?
2. You hate being pk’ed? So do I, so does the pk’er but think about this, the pk’er is the one taking all the risk because at this point that character may not ever advance due to the current system. So what else is there to do?
3. This is Lineage 2, as I mentioned this game is a PVP game. It is not sunshine and flowers; that said, being pk’ed is a rite of passage welcome.
4. But but but I keep getting pk’ed over and over again! Well logic would dictate that rather than running to the forums to complain you ask a Clannie or two to bring their ***** down to <insert location> to clear house.
5. Finally, I cannot stress this enough this is a game take it at face value and relax. If you do not like an open pvp environment there are non pvp wow servers.
TL:DR
Quit complaining.
1. Thanks for making another post about people complaining about the new pk system, than making a post about those people.. I LOL HARD AT THAT.
2.It takes an average player around 1-2 weeks to get to 86 with mentor buffs and some adena to buy exp runes off characters, so a perm red awaken pker gets free gear also, and so does anyone that gets items from website, so I was confused on how it was hard to be a pker.
3. About the what else is there to do thing, sooner or later the progressing in games will cease, lineage 2 is a pvp game, but pking players black screen who can't defend themselves will discourage new players, bots won't care so it will in result back fire..
4.If there is something to fix players will speak up and that is why you see all these threads, usually when a person writes a post they hope it gets fixed or tries to see what the community thinks, it's pretty obvious the community thinks the pk system is messed up so deal with the idea people are going to speak their mind!
5. Last NOT EVERYONE is in a clan, a lot of people can't even get a clan until they are awakened, this goes back to the defending themselves crap again.
Recently, there has been more whine than I have ever seen in my life over something that has been a part of the game since the beginning. It is amazing to me, how people join a pvp game expecting sunshine and roses. Anyway the point of this thread is for you (the complainers) to take a moment and realize this game is not all about you.
1. A pk’er worked hard to get where he is, why is it fair for you (complainers) to suggest that the mechanics change in a way that it benefits noobs over the hardcore?
2. You hate being pk’ed? So do I, so does the pk’er but think about this, the pk’er is the one taking all the risk because at this point that character may not ever advance due to the current system. So what else is there to do?
3. This is Lineage 2, as I mentioned this game is a PVP game. It is not sunshine and flowers; that said, being pk’ed is a rite of passage welcome.
4. But but but I keep getting pk’ed over and over again! Well logic would dictate that rather than running to the forums to complain you ask a Clannie or two to bring their ***** down to <insert location> to clear house.
5. Finally, I cannot stress this enough this is a game take it at face value and relax. If you do not like an open pvp environment there are non pvp wow servers.
TL:DR
Quit complaining.
i totally agree with this. live with it
if you get PKed, make that as a motivation to level up faster and pund on those who PKed you before and not QQ here in the Forums and ask to bring back the old PK system
1. Thanks for making another post about people complaining about the new pk system, than making a post about those people.. I LOL HARD AT THAT.
2.It takes an average player around 1-2 weeks to get to 86 with mentor buffs and some adena to buy exp runes off characters, so a perm red awaken pker gets free gear also, and so does anyone that gets items from website, so I was confused on how it was hard to be a pker.
3. About the what else is there to do thing, sooner or later the progressing in games will cease, lineage 2 is a pvp game, but pking players black screen who can't defend themselves will discourage new players, bots won't care so it will in result back fire..
4.If there is something to fix players will speak up and that is why you see all these threads, usually when a person writes a post they hope it gets fixed or tries to see what the community thinks, it's pretty obvious the community thinks the pk system is messed up so deal with the idea people are going to speak their mind!
5. Last NOT EVERYONE is in a clan, a lot of people can't even get a clan until they are awakened, this goes back to the defending themselves crap again.
and i totally disagree with your reply
1. if it is not that hard to level up and be a PKer, then it is not also hard to level up as a PKer killer right? so instead of crying here, go level up and get back on those bullies. am i right or am i right?
2. i got PKed alot of times when my toon was low level.. it did not discourage me to play L2 at all, it even encouraged me to play more
3. you used the word "Fix". there is nothing to fix here, the PK system Works perfectly, when you kill somebody you get Red name and when you kill reds you get green name. so what is to fix when the system works fine?
those QQers only want to CHANGE not FIX the System. why? because they want to PK others and Remove the red name through an easy quest..
4. if you don't have a clan then go grind somewhere else. just live with it, the game, PK server works fine so if you don't like it, go to your Mom and Cry, "i got PKed in Lineage2.. i hate it! i hate it!"
and just to add..
PK and PVP are one and the same. it's true that it is counted differently in L2 but in essence they are the same.. so don't post any reply explaining your beliefs that they are not the same. don't don't don't
i have played this game since before C2, before sub classes, before sword of zariche, before nobless and heroes AND before the changes to the PK system and i will say this.
these noobs would have gotten PK'd a billion times more back then. it was c'mon place for ppl/clans to PK you in desired exp lvling zones due to the fact that they could easily work off the negative karama WHILE STILL gaining exp and sp from mobs before you even ran back to do anything about it.
OH and a Treasure Hunter mob training you (a really high chance of you dropping your precious gear because you were killed by a mob) only to watch as the TH waits for the mobs to run back to their location to get up and steal your equipment.
(of which was infinitely harder to get back then you had to craft it and didn't make millions of dollars off TI)
all these things have been changed over the years and the game in its present state is the most Carebear i've ever seen it,(all my friends have started playing again and said the same thing "this is official i feel like im playing on a high rate private server) yet without fail everyday another "admin plz ban this PK, PK lowbies, NOOBS PK" thread post.
like i've stated in the past "play something else if you dont like it" for people who started MMO's on L2 most of the games out today leave us wanting due to the strict PVP systems which are mainly optional "mini-games" which you choose to participate in. something that a lot of players who play this game dont like THUS we play L2.
Very one-sided point of view. Why not tell people about the other side of "pre-awakening" era.
How about mentioning that whenever a PKer was killed, he had a chance to lose items, as there was no "bound" stuff that makes current permareds totally immune to item-loss. This resulted in PKers usually using very cheap lowlevel armor and weapons and being MUCH weaker than any permared today.
Or that whenever a PKer was killed he lost a big amount of XP and gradually leveled backwards down, making him weaker and weaker over time. Oh, and there was no "awakened" healer to give him a free 100% res.
There was no issue at all with any perma-red PK characters rampaging high level xp zones without danger of losing their (highest grade) armor and weapon, being unkillable by anyone who had not reached their level yet.
Your picture of an evil and harsh past with PKs happening left and right just because someone came to a leveling spot is not an accurate retrospective. And yes, you were gaining XP while still red - but only to later NOT gain xp while doing the sin eater quest, because the sin eater took all the xp. Put off the rose-shaded "it was so easy to be a PKer back then" glasses. Today is heaven for anyone wanting to play a permared. Back then, it was not.
Oh and....where are all those "ban this pk" posts ? I don't see them and I read forums daily. Can it be that you just love to exaggerate?
On to the subject of past pk'er vs GOD pk'er.
first of all all a high level needed was to be geared better than you and have a buffer. Think about the days c2 cruma tower if you were on devianne. If it was not that god ****ed tyrant ****** your face "B" something or Danibis and his crew. I recall days when a properly buffed pker would walk into cruma and literally kill everyone there with little to no risk to his gear because they pick their fights. really not much has changed beyond the fact pk'ers are the threat they always should have been to open pvp.
Even with the lower risk associated with going red, I still haven't seen that many pk'ers. Haven't seen a red since level 20 or so actually. Doesn't it take a helluva lot longer to work off than it did back in the day anyway? My opinion: it's fine, don't discourage going red any more. Nothing adds fun to the game like catching that glimpse of a red name over a hill and going "OH SHI~" =D
Even with the lower risk associated with going red, I still haven't seen that many pk'ers. Haven't seen a red since level 20 or so actually. Doesn't it take a helluva lot longer to work off than it did back in the day anyway? My opinion: it's fine, don't discourage going red any more. Nothing adds fun to the game like catching that glimpse of a red name over a hill and going "OH SHI~" =D
the reason why you see less now is because yes it takes longer to work off the red but while you're working off the red you gain no XP/SP.
where as before you could still continue leveling while working off the negative karama.
Very one-sided point of view. Why not tell people about the other side of "pre-awakening" era.
How about mentioning that whenever a PKer was killed, he had a chance to lose items, as there was no "bound" stuff that makes current permareds totally immune to item-loss. This resulted in PKers usually using very cheap lowlevel armor and weapons and being MUCH weaker than any permared today.
Or that whenever a PKer was killed he lost a big amount of XP and gradually leveled backwards down, making him weaker and weaker over time. Oh, and there was no "awakened" healer to give him a free 100% res.
There was no issue at all with any perma-red PK characters rampaging high level xp zones without danger of losing their (highest grade) armor and weapon, being unkillable by anyone who had not reached their level yet.
Your picture of an evil and harsh past with PKs happening left and right just because someone came to a leveling spot is not an accurate retrospective. And yes, you were gaining XP while still red - but only to later NOT gain xp while doing the sin eater quest, because the sin eater took all the xp. Put off the rose-shaded "it was so easy to be a PKer back then" glasses. Today is heaven for anyone wanting to play a permared. Back then, it was not.
Oh and....where are all those "ban this pk" posts ? I don't see them and I read forums daily. Can it be that you just love to exaggerate?
Because fo people like Lichking who love pking and troll the forums looking for threads so they can compare what it was like" back in the day" while leaving out very important facts. Then they will try to make you believe pking is great for the game, pking has a time and place, that is why it was used only during extreme circumstances, and if not people would loose gear if they did it without thinking, right now there is no thought, just kill someone and nothing is bound to happen, even if you are hunted and end up dying you can go back to pking others.
PVP and pk are they one in the same? Is peanut butter and jelly the same? Peanut butter and jelly are both used to make on particular item a sandwich but they are not the same thing and neither is pking and pvp, PVPing and pking are situations where different circumstances need to happen for them to be called the names they are. If they were the same they would have the same meaning..
Thats "more whine that you ever saw in your life" ? Uhm. Ok.
Actually my question about exaggerating (as well as my whole post) was directed at the post directly before me, where the guy stated there was "yet without fail everyday another "admin plz ban this PK, PK lowbies, NOOBS PK" thread post". I thought it was pretty obvious.
Create a PK'r yourself and unleash your fury against NCsoft. When enough people quit because of the game they have created then maybe they will see the error of their ways and realize "hey would should have changed that when the players wanted it changed".
Recently, there has been more whine than I have ever seen in my life over something that has been a part of the game since the beginning. It is amazing to me, how people join a pvp game expecting sunshine and roses. Anyway the point of this thread is for you (the complainers) to take a moment and realize this game is not all about you.
1. A pk’er worked hard to get where he is, why is it fair for you (complainers) to suggest that the mechanics change in a way that it benefits noobs over the hardcore?
2. You hate being pk’ed? So do I, so does the pk’er but think about this, the pk’er is the one taking all the risk because at this point that character may not ever advance due to the current system. So what else is there to do?
3. This is Lineage 2, as I mentioned this game is a PVP game. It is not sunshine and flowers; that said, being pk’ed is a rite of passage welcome.
4. But but but I keep getting pk’ed over and over again! Well logic would dictate that rather than running to the forums to complain you ask a Clannie or two to bring their ***** down to <insert location> to clear house.
5. Finally, I cannot stress this enough this is a game take it at face value and relax. If you do not like an open pvp environment there are non pvp wow servers.
TL:DR
Quit complaining.
Just want to mention, there is a difference between a PvP game and a game with PvP functionality. People make the game what it is, not the other way around. A PvP game is Guild Wars, this is a RPG.
If you're going to try and develop an argument, make an intelligent point -- not a broken one.
Case and point is that Taiwan/Korean and other Asian servers clearly have a more PvE oriented and polite approach to PvP.
Just want to mention, there is a difference between a PvP game and a game with PvP functionality. People make the game what it is, not the other way around. A PvP game is Guild Wars, this is a RPG.
If you're going to try and develop an argument, make an intelligent point -- not a broken one.
Case and point is that Taiwan/Korean and other Asian servers clearly have a more PvE oriented and polite approach to PvP.
You're kidding right? From the start this game has been about PVP, more so than any MMO I have ever played. The only reason to level up in this game is to fight another player or clan, I have yet to meet a single person that plays this game for it's PVP aspects. Get your head out of your ***, you know what was on the cover of the Lineage 2 box when it was released? A freaking castle siege (still waiting on siege ladders!) if that does not say PVP game I don't know what does. As far as Koreans approaching pvp in a polite manner, I doubt the top clans in Korea will hesitate to pk if they want your spot.
Just want to mention, there is a difference between a PvP game and a game with PvP functionality. People make the game what it is, not the other way around. A PvP game is Guild Wars, this is a RPG.
If you're going to try and develop an argument, make an intelligent point -- not a broken one.
Case and point is that Taiwan/Korean and other Asian servers clearly have a more PvE oriented and polite approach to PvP.
i thought you might have something intellegent to say but i guess not.
This game was, is, and will always be a PVP oriented game.
1. Open World PVP
2. PK system
3. Clan wars
4. Dueling Arenas
5. Castle Sieges
6. God dam PK SWORDS that put u in INSTANT CHAOTIC state and require the blood of a fresh PK... FFS i mean what more do u need? NCSoft PUT AN ITEM INTO THE GAME TO ALLOW/ENCOURAGE THE VERY THING YOU DOLTS COMPLAIN ABOUT
like i've stated they're are other games that focus on PVE content. just because they're are some dailies and raid boss's in L2 doesn't mean its a PVE game.
"You can put lipstick on a horse but at the end of the day its still a horse"
no ones telling you not to play the game by all means, just don't think you're entitled to start playing after the games been out since early 2000's and complain about something that is so vital in making what L2 is known for, famous for, and loved for.. <--- thats not directed solely at you Narcilus thats for everyone who comes on these forums QQ'ing
i have played this game since before C2, before sub classes, before sword of zariche, before nobless and heroes AND before the changes to the PK system and i will say this.
these noobs would have gotten PK'd a billion times more back then. it was c'mon place for ppl/clans to PK you in desired exp lvling zones due to the fact that they could easily work off the negative karama WHILE STILL gaining exp and sp from mobs before you even ran back to do anything about it.
OH and a Treasure Hunter mob training you (a really high chance of you dropping your precious gear because you were killed by a mob) only to watch as the TH waits for the mobs to run back to their location to get up and steal your equipment.
(of which was infinitely harder to get back then you had to craft it and didn't make millions of dollars off TI)
i thought you might have something intellegent to say but i guess not.
This game was, is, and will always be a PVP oriented game.
1. Open World PVP
2. PK system
3. Clan wars
4. Dueling Arenas
5. Castle Sieges
6. God dam PK SWORDS that put u in INSTANT CHAOTIC state and require the blood of a fresh PK... FFS i mean what more do u need? NCSoft PUT AN ITEM INTO THE GAME TO ALLOW/ENCOURAGE THE VERY THING YOU DOLTS COMPLAIN ABOUT
like i've stated they're are other games that focus on PVE content. just because they're are some dailies and raid boss's in L2 doesn't mean its a PVE game.
"You can put lipstick on a horse but at the end of the day its still a horse"
no ones telling you not to play the game by all means, just don't think you're entitled to start playing after the games been out since early 2000's and complain about something that is so vital in making what L2 is known for, famous for, and loved for.. <--- thats not directed solely at you Narcilus thats for everyone who comes on these forums QQ'ing
i thought you might have something intellegent to say but i guess not.
This game was, is, and will always be a PVP oriented game.
1. Open World PVP
2. PK system
3. Clan wars
4. Dueling Arenas
5. Castle Sieges
6. God dam PK SWORDS that put u in INSTANT CHAOTIC state and require the blood of a fresh PK... FFS i mean what more do u need? NCSoft PUT AN ITEM INTO THE GAME TO ALLOW/ENCOURAGE THE VERY THING YOU DOLTS COMPLAIN ABOUT
like i've stated they're are other games that focus on PVE content. just because they're are some dailies and raid boss's in L2 doesn't mean its a PVE game.
"You can put lipstick on a horse but at the end of the day its still a horse"
no ones telling you not to play the game by all means, just don't think you're entitled to start playing after the games been out since early 2000's and complain about something that is so vital in making what L2 is known for, famous for, and loved for.. <--- thats not directed solely at you Narcilus thats for everyone who comes on these forums QQ'ing
I never stated it was a PvE game, nor that it didn't have PvP orientation -- but there is a clear difference between a game with PvP functionality and an actual PvP game.
The point was that people made the game into what it is today, NCSoft only provided us the means. The argument he should be holding is that people need to get used to the American/European play style here in Lineage 2, not that Lineage 2 is a PvP game -- because it is not a PvP game, even though it is arguably and factually a large portion of the game.
I've seen people play just for PvE, I've seen people play for PvP, I've seen people just roleplay (Which I do think is kind of out of place in this game, but to each their own), I've seen people do a mix, and so forth. They're many play styles that individuals may follow.
I don't care if I get PKed/griefed/ganked and so forth personally, but I still don't think people should delude fiction from fact. Granted I enjoy the PvP in this game more than any game, even more so than the ones that are in fact PvP games, but factually over the course of the history of this game -- there has been more people that played this game for PvE or the mixture (the largest player base, at least in the past -- with the recent push of private server players, I would say it is very much PvP focused), not solely just PvP. Undeniably though, it is revered for it's more hardcore, unforgiving PvP and rightfully so.
But like I said, the point he should be pushing should at least start with a firm basis and not on something that isn't true. I agree with his overall point that people need to not cry about getting PKed, given the game content, but I still defend the fact that there is very little reason to just randomly PK someone, especially to the extent of griefing.
The fact of the matter is he is only projecting his own views of what the game should be on others, and not what it factually is. The point is that the PvP players should be at least compassionate to the views of others, even if they disagree with them. He shouldn't be starting an "original" thread about people who cry about PvP -- when he knows it could spark a flame war and won't do any actual good.
His point #5, though, I honestly do agree with. If you're not up for Open-World PvP, then this isn't your game and you should absolutely not complain about that risk.
With #1 though -- there should be an equilibrium. I'm not sure exactly what he's directing his comments at though, but I'm guessing it's about R grade people griefing lower levels. Personally I think the simple solution would be to increase the Protection buff to a higher level, given the pace at which we level now. That way people can at least meet a reasonable number of people first, and can choose their play style.
With #2, someone already voiced a proper argument to it. Factually, the PK system isn't all that big of an issue once you understand it -- minus the item drop thing, but just using bound gear deals with that. (To my knowledge bound does NOT drop, despite claims otherwise). But he ignores this question: why the hell is someone even PKing that much?
With #3 -- this is what I was directly discussing. We made the game what it is, not the other way around -- we were only given the options.
With #4, he ignores the fact of why would anyone cause trouble for no reason on a repeated basis? Granted zone locking is fair play, but it has been openly been spoken AGAINST by Lineage 2 staff.
And yes -- I'm well aware of what the first box art looked like, I owned it.
Edit:
Bryce below pointed out and reminded me of some other issues too, that there are legitimate concerns voiced by people about some of the new mechanics (Which some were fixed in the past, but broken again with the update for one).
i thought you might have something intellegent to say but i guess not.
This game was, is, and will always be a PVP oriented game.
1. Open World PVP
2. PK system
3. Clan wars
4. Dueling Arenas
5. Castle Sieges
6. God dam PK SWORDS that put u in INSTANT CHAOTIC state and require the blood of a fresh PK... FFS i mean what more do u need? NCSoft PUT AN ITEM INTO THE GAME TO ALLOW/ENCOURAGE THE VERY THING YOU DOLTS COMPLAIN ABOUT
1. open world pvp, and this thread about pking and how the players are exploiting changes that were made recently not from 2003, changes from goddess update. irrelevant to topic.
2. Pk system is broken, for many reason, just read the other 100 threads about it.
3. clan wars have nothing to do with pking, if clans are actually in a war, irrelevant.
4 arena has nothing to do with pking. irrelevant
5. irrelavent nothing to do with pking.
6 out of the 6 points you have two have to do with pking this one is relevant but unlike a perm red character the cursed weapons can be dropped
1. open world pvp, and this thread about pking and how the players are exploiting changes that were made recently not from 2003, changes from goddess update. irrelevant to topic.
2. Pk system is broken, for many reason, just read the other 100 threads about it.
3. clan wars have nothing to do with pking, if clans are actually in a war, irrelevant.
4 arena has nothing to do with pking. irrelevant
5. irrelavent nothing to do with pking.
6 out of the 6 points you have two have to do with pking this one is relevant but unlike a perm red character the cursed weapons can be dropped
Does PKing not fall under PvP? I can't believe these discussions are still going on. Lineage 2 is not a PvE game. Why in hell would someone go through the pain of competing with the bots? To reach endgame and kill harder mobs?
Unless they're some kind of roleplayer (which adds a whole new level to the game) then I don't see how PvE could be entertaining in this game.
1. open world pvp, and this thread about pking and how the players are exploiting changes that were made recently not from 2003, changes from goddess update. irrelevant to topic.
2. Pk system is broken, for many reason, just read the other 100 threads about it.
3. clan wars have nothing to do with pking, if clans are actually in a war, irrelevant.
4 arena has nothing to do with pking. irrelevant
5. irrelavent nothing to do with pking.
6 out of the 6 points you have two have to do with pking this one is relevant but unlike a perm red character the cursed weapons can be dropped
I was simply stating all the PVP aspects of this game to point out that this is NOT A PVE game and people should stop complaining about PKers. I guess you have a hard time comprehending things you read.
P.S. answer this one question and i'll never ague with you again, ready here it is.
why would NCSoft put items into this game like the sword of Zariche, if PKing people (regardless of level) was an abuse of the NCSoft rules and agreement? and why do people think that by posting in these forums game Devs and GMs would ban people who PK when said items require/encurage said behavior?- answer those two.
and before you make yourself look silly i'll help you out.
1. because this game is a pvp based game and PKing is part of the game
2. they do nothing about it because ... ^
thus again, for the one hundredth time:
.:if you don't like it play something else:.